57139 réponses à ce sujet

[DirtyPhoenix]

bigstig wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

whateverman7 wrote...

bigstig wrote...

 they also said to keep your DA:O save which had next to zero impact on DA:2 other than a few comments or reoccurrin characters  

not up on the terminology, not sure what DA:O nor DA:2 means

Dragon Age: Origins and Dragon Age 2. (there shouldn't be a colon in the second one)

I know it's a different side of Bioware but the original context was something along the lines of why would we be asked to keep our saves if there was nothing else coming.  I just wanted to point out that just because we may be able to import saves into whatever follows doesn't mean that Shepard will be involved in Mass Effect 4 etc

Maybe they'll show Shepard as an admiral, or show his/her memorial depending on whether Shep lived or died in your game, also take into account things like genophage cure, or geth-quarian peace. These are big events, any future ME would be sure to include them, whether Shepard is in it or not.

Coming to think of it, I'd totally LOVE Shepard replacing Hackett's role in future ME's with the custom face you made, adding some wrinkles and stuff.

Modifié par pirate1802, 08 mai 2012 - 05:39 .

[RealStyli]

RealStyli wrote...

 Regarding TIM's eyes, according to "The Art of the Mass Effect Universe" book:

"A lot of attention was paid to the implants in his eyes, the intent being to give him a subtly inhuman look"

I was also of the belief that he was indoctrinated via exposure to the Reaper artifact in ME:Evolution but this quote from the book would indicate that it was an augmentation. Then again, that quote appears in the Mass Effect 2 section of the book so it may have been intended originally as an implant during the concept stage for TIM but, after Evolution, retroactively explained with indoctrination.

By the way, I'm not debating whether or not TIM was ever indoctrinated but when he was indoctrinated or, more importantly, whether TIM's glowing eyes are indicative of that indoctrination or self-imposed.

[Earthborn_Shepard]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

I don't know if it will help anything, or if I'm reposting a version of something people have already posted, but I took this shot that kinda encapsulates the game's concrete idea of "rebar".

Whoa! That seems like a pretty important find to me! Good catch!

But that looks nothing like this:

...yes it does. Pretty much, actually.

[Unschuld]

EpyonX3 wrote...

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

But why no "easter egg" for dedicated fans who picked the other two options? Doesn't have to be another "shepard lives" sequence, but some other suitable snippet flavoured to the other choices?

[DirtyPhoenix]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

I don't know if it will help anything, or if I'm reposting a version of something people have already posted, but I took this shot that kinda encapsulates the game's concrete idea of "rebar".

Whoa! That seems like a pretty important find to me! Good catch!

But that looks nothing like this:

Don't they look like reaper cables?

[ExtendedCut]

pirate1802 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...


It can represent Shepard's physical body being destroy while his mind being preserved as an AI-type entity? But then starkid says "you will lose everything you have", so... I dont know, his mind is a part of him inst it? To quote Wrex: "This whole control option smells wrong".

Yeah, you may be right, but I can't think of any point in ME where this actually happens.  Maybe I'm just forgetting something...

To me, it seems like Control would have two results, neither of which are satisfactory wihtout IT or major plot holes:

1) Like you said, Shepard's mind somehow becomes "uploaded" into the Citadel or into the Catalyst and continues to control the Reapers by essentially becoming the new Starbrat.  If that's the case, what does the new-and-improved-Shepard/Starbrat-hybrid do with the Reapers under his Control?  Does he just start the cycles over again?  Or does he send the Reapers back to Dark Space to hang out forever?  Or does shepard turn Harbie into his own personal butler?

2) Shepard really does die, there is no space-magic-brain/AI-linkage and the Reapers win because Shepard didn't Control them (because he's dead) or Destroy them (because he made the wrong choice).

True and True. That is why I cannot think of control being a good option no matter what anyone says. There is no reference anywhere in the game for this to be believed, infact we see the opposite. Reapers let TIM believe he can control them while actually controlling him, and the same reapers are being completely honest to SHepard, their biggest obstacle.. because?

Actually I heard this before even starting the game, that the options are killing the reapers; become an AI; or being disintegrated and broadcasted XD lol. I thought back then how can Shep become an AI, now I know..


Also, assuming they are being honest, and Shep becomes the new starbrat, how do we know that after losing everything she has (in starbrat's words), she will be the same Shepard we know of, that she would not restart the cycle sometime later?

Yep.  I totally agree, especially the bolded part above.  Shepard KNOWS that TIM has been duped and was then controlled by the Reapers, and that TIM never really had any kind of ability to control the Reapers.  So why would Shepard suddenly believe that Control is a good idea, just because some creepy little energy-kid (who Shepard knows nothing about) tries to tell him it's a good idea?

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

1) Shepard graps his abdomen if you don't walk for a bit. He also grabs it when TIM first walks in. His wound was already there and possibly bleeding already.

2) Because the catalyst wants to live and tries to relate to shepard so he doesn't always pick destroy. We don't know what the Catalyst is, but if he came in looking like a reaper, Shepard would start blasting him on sight.

3) Can't say why, this is similar to asking how green waves turn you into a hybrid.

4) Again, I can't fight this one. There are some suggestions about the eyes being synthetic and all but I don't know.

5) We don't see SHepard after the tube blows up. He could have those eyes or he probably won't. We don't know.

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

1) Shepard is still profusly bleeding when Anderson seems clean, you can't even see a wound on him. Also, one doesn't just "wake up" after loosing blood like that.

2) Either way, the Catalyst looking like the boy from Earth and your dreams is proof that he's "in your head".

5) They specifically show his TIM eyes in control and synthesis, if it happened in destroy it would show it.

6) This shows that it was always meant to be more than an "easter egg". It says "Shepard Alive" on top and all the rammifications that are supposed to come from this scene underneath that:


 

Modifié par balance5050, 08 mai 2012 - 05:42 .

[Unschuld]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

I don't know if it will help anything, or if I'm reposting a version of something people have already posted, but I took this shot that kinda encapsulates the game's concrete idea of "rebar".

*snip*

Whoa! That seems like a pretty important find to me! Good catch!

But that looks nothing like this:

*snip*

Yeah, I'd have to agree with you on that one. The "rebar" does look a lot closer to cables.

[MaximizedAction]

Unschuld wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

But why no "easter egg" for dedicated fans who picked the other two options? Doesn't have to be another "shepard lives" sequence, but some other suitable snippet flavoured to the other choices?

Maybe there's something really cool in store for people who chose C or S? Wake up as a husk or even Reaper and do some crazy sh*t? Would be actually the only reason for me to chose one of these endings.

[Dwailing]

pirate1802 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

I don't know if it will help anything, or if I'm reposting a version of something people have already posted, but I took this shot that kinda encapsulates the game's concrete idea of "rebar".

Whoa! That seems like a pretty important find to me! Good catch!

But that looks nothing like this:

Don't they look like reaper cables?

That's what I thought.  They remind me of the cables on the Geth Dreadnought.  I should point out that the same cables are found on the Citadel in the end chamber, so I don't know.

[EpyonX3]

Unschuld wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

But why no "easter egg" for dedicated fans who picked the other two options? Doesn't have to be another "shepard lives" sequence, but some other suitable snippet flavoured to the other choices?

That's a good question. Perhaps EC might include one.

[ExtendedCut]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Thorn Harvestar wrote...

 My personal biggest red flags that make me lean towards IT:

• Why do they only show Shepard profusely bleeding from the side after he shoots Anderson in the same location? That's a lot of blood to have not been noticable before the TIM showdown...
• Why does the Catalyst appear as a figure obviously taken from Shepard's subconscious?
• Why does Shepard have to disintegrate in order to achieve Control or Synthesis? The Catalyst said that Synthesis required him (Reapers) as well. I didn't see him jumping in the beam.
• Why do Shepard's eyes turn to the signature Husk design if you pick Control or Synthesis?
• Why do Shepard's eyes stay normal if you pick Destroy?
• Why show Shepard barely alive in rubble with no context of his condition/location, unless more was planned?

1) Shepard graps his abdomen if you don't walk for a bit. He also grabs it when TIM first walks in. His wound was already there and possibly bleeding already.

2) Because the catalyst wants to live and tries to relate to shepard so he doesn't always pick destroy. We don't know what the Catalyst is, but if he came in looking like a reaper, Shepard would start blasting him on sight.

3) Can't say why, this is similar to asking how green waves turn you into a hybrid.

4) Again, I can't fight this one. There are some suggestions about the eyes being synthetic and all but I don't know.

5) We don't see SHepard after the tube blows up. He could have those eyes or he probably won't. We don't know.

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

To me, number 2 above is the single best point (out of many) that support IT.  Unless the Reapers can shape-shift (yet another aspect that we have never seen before in ME), then it proves that at least SOME part of the starkid/catalyst is in Shepard's mind and/or not completely literal.  Correct?

[Simon_Says]

RealStyli wrote...

RealStyli wrote...

 Regarding TIM's eyes, according to "The Art of the Mass Effect Universe" book:

"A lot of attention was paid to the implants in his eyes, the intent being to give him a subtly inhuman look"

I was also of the belief that he was indoctrinated via exposure to the Reaper artifact in ME:Evolution but this quote from the book would indicate that it was an augmentation. Then again, that quote appears in the Mass Effect 2 section of the book so it may have been intended originally as an implant during the concept stage for TIM but, after Evolution, retroactively explained with indoctrination.

By the way, I'm not debating whether or not TIM was ever indoctrinated but when he was indoctrinated or, more importantly, whether TIM's glowing eyes are indicative of that indoctrination or self-imposed.

The events o Evolution began his indoctrination, but he was still ultimately on humanity's side right up to the end of ME2. But bringing in the proto-reaper into his own base probably accelerated the indoctrination and make him the psychotic madman he is in 3.

[Rolenka]

Connecting the dots in that way certainly appears to form a picture, but I have a hard time believing Bioware made the whole thing a hallucination without actually making that fact known in some way or saying what happened in the real world.

Yes, even after this, I give them that much credit. Barely. I think.

[Dwailing]

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

1) Shepard graps his abdomen if you don't walk for a bit. He also grabs it when TIM first walks in. His wound was already there and possibly bleeding already.

2) Because the catalyst wants to live and tries to relate to shepard so he doesn't always pick destroy. We don't know what the Catalyst is, but if he came in looking like a reaper, Shepard would start blasting him on sight.

3) Can't say why, this is similar to asking how green waves turn you into a hybrid.

4) Again, I can't fight this one. There are some suggestions about the eyes being synthetic and all but I don't know.

5) We don't see SHepard after the tube blows up. He could have those eyes or he probably won't. We don't know.

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

1) Shepard is still profusly bleeding when Anderson seems clean, you can't even see a wound on him. Also, one doesn't just "wake up" after loosing blood like that.

2) Either way, the Catalyst looking like the boy from Earth and your dreams is proof that he's "in your head".

5) They specifically show his TIM eyes in control and synthesis, if it happened in destroy it would show it.

6) This shows that it was always meant to be more than an "easter egg". It says "Shepard Alive" on top and all the rammifications that are supposed to come from this scene underneath that:


 

What I find interesting about this is the line about the end of the first Matrix.  'Cause I've seen the first Matrix, and the ending there is not like the ending of ME3 at all, if you ask me.  I would actually compare it to the end of the Matrix Revolutions, based on what I've seen of it.

[Dwailing]

ExtendedCut wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Thorn Harvestar wrote...

 My personal biggest red flags that make me lean towards IT:

• Why do they only show Shepard profusely bleeding from the side after he shoots Anderson in the same location? That's a lot of blood to have not been noticable before the TIM showdown...
• Why does the Catalyst appear as a figure obviously taken from Shepard's subconscious?
• Why does Shepard have to disintegrate in order to achieve Control or Synthesis? The Catalyst said that Synthesis required him (Reapers) as well. I didn't see him jumping in the beam.
• Why do Shepard's eyes turn to the signature Husk design if you pick Control or Synthesis?
• Why do Shepard's eyes stay normal if you pick Destroy?
• Why show Shepard barely alive in rubble with no context of his condition/location, unless more was planned?

1) Shepard graps his abdomen if you don't walk for a bit. He also grabs it when TIM first walks in. His wound was already there and possibly bleeding already.

2) Because the catalyst wants to live and tries to relate to shepard so he doesn't always pick destroy. We don't know what the Catalyst is, but if he came in looking like a reaper, Shepard would start blasting him on sight.

3) Can't say why, this is similar to asking how green waves turn you into a hybrid.

4) Again, I can't fight this one. There are some suggestions about the eyes being synthetic and all but I don't know.

5) We don't see SHepard after the tube blows up. He could have those eyes or he probably won't. We don't know.

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

To me, number 2 above is the single best point (out of many) that support IT.  Unless the Reapers can shape-shift (yet another aspect that we have never seen before in ME), then it proves that at least SOME part of the starkid/catalyst is in Shepard's mind and/or not completely literal.  Correct?

Nail on the head.  Out of everything else, that seems like the biggest indicator that something is up.

[DirtyPhoenix]

Dwailing wrote...

That's what I thought.  They remind me of the cables on the Geth Dreadnought.  I should point out that the same cables are found on the Citadel in the end chamber, so I don't know.

Geth dreadnought, Rachni chanber.. where a team member specifically draws your attention to them. That and the fact that these cables featured at the shepard_lives scene, makes me think Bioware wants us to conect the dots, whatever may they lead to.

[cyrexwingblade]

I'll admit this theory has a lot of merit, especially based on what some people have caught in the images.

However, I will also say that if this IS the case, it's a cruel way to end this story. Clever... but cruel.

If the DLC clarifies that only Reapers *actually* die from destruction, then hell yes, burn those suckers.

I chose Synthesis based on the in-game information. If the 'more detailed' ending they eventually wish to release shows that the Geth and Edi won't die for from destruction, I will savor the death of those gut-sucking exagerrated space-janitors over and over and over. I will replay the entire game just to kill them all again.

But not at the price of my friends.

[Simon_Says]

Rolenka wrote...

Connecting the dots in that way certainly appears to form a picture, but I have a hard time believing Bioware made the whole thing a hallucination without actually making that fact known in some way or saying what happened in the real world.

Yes, even after this, I give them that much credit. Barely. I think.

Examine the arcing in the section right before the control panel and the confronation with TIM. The electrical sounds actually sound much like sniper rifle fire, and there are noises that sound like husk screeches.

Also, linkage once more of a video that demonstrates the tree reflections in the cruciible area. They're hard to notice when you regain control of Shepard for the final choice but they are certainly there, and they're even plainly obvious during certain camera shots during the dialogue. This is not something I think that would have easily been forgotten if it was just something they had intended to remove earlier.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 08 mai 2012 - 05:50 .

[MegumiAzusa]

paxxton wrote...

Obitim wrote...

 Seeing as Bioware/EA can collect stats regarding our classes and saves and the like, perhaps there is a masive experiment to see which ending we go for before we know that we can have any further effect on the story?

This is exactly what I thought after I finished the game for the first time and learnt about IT.

It'd be very interesting to get to know those stats.

Then they better not do specific stats for the first ending chosen. About half the people I know just ran straight into green as they didn't see the ramps on the sides the first time (me included).

[MaximizedAction]

Dwailing wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

1) Shepard graps his abdomen if you don't walk for a bit. He also grabs it when TIM first walks in. His wound was already there and possibly bleeding already.

2) Because the catalyst wants to live and tries to relate to shepard so he doesn't always pick destroy. We don't know what the Catalyst is, but if he came in looking like a reaper, Shepard would start blasting him on sight.

3) Can't say why, this is similar to asking how green waves turn you into a hybrid.

4) Again, I can't fight this one. There are some suggestions about the eyes being synthetic and all but I don't know.

5) We don't see SHepard after the tube blows up. He could have those eyes or he probably won't. We don't know.

6) An easter egg for dedicated fans who will play the game as much as possible to get this ending.

1) Shepard is still profusly bleeding when Anderson seems clean, you can't even see a wound on him. Also, one doesn't just "wake up" after loosing blood like that.

2) Either way, the Catalyst looking like the boy from Earth and your dreams is proof that he's "in your head".

5) They specifically show his TIM eyes in control and synthesis, if it happened in destroy it would show it.

6) This shows that it was always meant to be more than an "easter egg". It says "Shepard Alive" on top and all the rammifications that are supposed to come from this scene underneath that:


 

What I find interesting about this is the line about the end of the first Matrix.  'Cause I've seen the first Matrix, and the ending there is not like the ending of ME3 at all, if you ask me.  I would actually compare it to the end of the Matrix Revolutions, based on what I've seen of it.

A few pages back @MegumiAzusa suggested that he might've meant the end to the first Matrix, the simulation. The one that was rejected by the people because it was a utopia...

That one I find easier to compare with: The utopia maybe being what Shepard (or we) see during the ending sequences up to the Normandy crash.

[ExtendedCut]

Dwailing wrote...

pirate1802 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

I don't know if it will help anything, or if I'm reposting a version of something people have already posted, but I took this shot that kinda encapsulates the game's concrete idea of "rebar".

Whoa! That seems like a pretty important find to me! Good catch!

But that looks nothing like this:

Don't they look like reaper cables?

That's what I thought.  They remind me of the cables on the Geth Dreadnought.  I should point out that the same cables are found on the Citadel in the end chamber, so I don't know.

I don't think they look similar, either.  But I do think that they look similar enough that it still can't be totally dismissed one way or the other.  Maybe BW wanted these things to be ambiguously similar?

[Dwailing]

pirate1802 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

That's what I thought.  They remind me of the cables on the Geth Dreadnought.  I should point out that the same cables are found on the Citadel in the end chamber, so I don't know.

Geth dreadnought, Rachni chanber.. where a team member specifically draws your attention to them. That and the fact that these cables featured at the shepard_lives scene, makes me think Bioware wants us to conect the dots, whatever may they lead to.

So you're suggesting that the Reaper cables in the Shep alive scene actually SUPPORT IT?  I like that thought, but I would like to hear more about your reasoning, if you don't mind.

[Stigweird85]

pirate1802 wrote...

bigstig wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

whateverman7 wrote...

bigstig wrote...

 they also said to keep your DA:O save which had next to zero impact on DA:2 other than a few comments or reoccurrin characters  

not up on the terminology, not sure what DA:O nor DA:2 means

Dragon Age: Origins and Dragon Age 2. (there shouldn't be a colon in the second one)

I know it's a different side of Bioware but the original context was something along the lines of why would we be asked to keep our saves if there was nothing else coming.  I just wanted to point out that just because we may be able to import saves into whatever follows doesn't mean that Shepard will be involved in Mass Effect 4 etc

Maybe they'll show Shepard as an admiral, or show his/her memorial depending on whether Shep lived or died in your game, also take into account things like genophage cure, or geth-quarian peace. These are big events, any future ME would be sure to include them, whether Shepard is in it or not.

Coming to think of it, I'd totally LOVE Shepard replacing Hackett's role in future ME's with the custom face you made, adding some wrinkles and stuff.
Sold

Trying to edit on my iPad is difficult as I can't see what I am typing brilliant idea though

Modifié par bigstig, 08 mai 2012 - 05:53 .

[MegumiAzusa]

Dwailing wrote...

What I find interesting about this is the line about the end of the first Matrix.  'Cause I've seen the first Matrix, and the ending there is not like the ending of ME3 at all, if you ask me.  I would actually compare it to the end of the Matrix Revolutions, based on what I've seen of it.

MaximizedAction wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

You know, it doesn't say if it meant the first movie or the first matrix in the movies, you know, the utopia?

Haven't thought about it this way!
Shepard waking up is like rejecting the utopia that was created for her, where e.g. her Normandy just crashed down and even the ones that probably died (deleted scene) besides you seem to live happily(smile, Liara!) ever after.

That puzzle piece, to me, seems to fit here more natural. Otherwise, the end of the first Matrix movie? Are we then supposed to be Trinity who wakes us up from our death?