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Was the ending a hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory


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#53701
Tirian Thorn

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Slow day today. 

So enjoy this clip. 

http://desmond.image...gif&res=landing

#53702
Rosewind

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lol yeah fighting the erge to go crazy as usual.

#53703
Uncle Jo

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MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...

#53704
paxxton

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One of the funniest moments in ME3 was to find Ashley drunk. Traynor says she wants to speak with me, I go to the Observation Deck, where is she? I searched the whole ship just to find her lying on the floor behind a bench on the OD.

Modifié par paxxton, 09 mai 2012 - 08:31 .


#53705
DJBare

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Where did the two Mako's come from after Shepard is hit by the beam?, and what happened to the armored personnel vehicle that was hit and overturned?, when you look back it's gone.

#53706
Bm Fahrtz

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[quote]EpyonX3 wrote...

[

[/quote]

Posted Image

[/quote]

You are now my favorite person in this thread. Tim and Eric are my heroes.

#53707
lex0r11

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Rosewind wrote...

lol yeah fighting the erge to go crazy as usual.



Posted Image

:lol:

#53708
EpyonX3

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[quote]Bm Fahrtz wrote...

[quote]EpyonX3 wrote...

[

[/quote]

Posted Image

[/quote]

You are now my favorite person in this thread. Tim and Eric are my heroes.

[/quote]

^_^

#53709
Tirian Thorn

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paxxton wrote...

One of the funniest moments in ME3 was to find Ashley drunk. Traynor says she wants to speak with me, I go to the Observation Deck, where is she? I searched the whole ship just to find her on the OD lying on the floor behind a bench .


I laughed at that moment too.  I'm looking at the map and it says she should be there and I don't see her sitting so I look everywhere else and then find her laying on the floor.  LOL.  Great moment! 

#53710
gunslinger_ruiz

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Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...



I'm almost positive those are sounds of a building settling, they don't quite seem loud enough to be a Reaper call but  it's possible it's a reaper howl in the distance. If you listen close with max volume you can also hear some kind of....thudding or...not sure how to describe it; it's a few beats in rapid sucession.

#53711
MegumiAzusa

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EpyonX3 wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.


Where the hell was I when those were posted. I've never seen those before. Gonna have to replay the london again.

Still doesn't explain the reaper cables though. And the blue highlights to his armor are an effect of making the scene brighter.

Nope, the blue is already there. As is the red from the wounds. The armor is tinted blue or blue/white camo.

#53712
EpyonX3

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Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...



The blocks on earth matching the pattern in the breathe scene got me thinking again. We still need the cables explained and then I'll be 100% convinced it is on earth.

In the meantime, I'm preparing additional possibilities, some that can be explained through EC.

One that I can come up with other than the Citated falling back to earth while shepard is on it is that Shepard managed to limp back or was blown back into, the control panel room while everything was blowing up. There he got back to the hallway he came through and took the beam back down just in time before the Citadel itself blew up.

Debris from the Citadel would explain the cables and other hard to distinguish parts in the final scene.

Of course, I'm still open to the possibility that he never left, though I'm not too sure about it given the consequences of this being true.

#53713
MegumiAzusa

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Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...

Sounds to me like metal beams under stress.

#53714
EpyonX3

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MegumiAzusa wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.


Where the hell was I when those were posted. I've never seen those before. Gonna have to replay the london again.

Still doesn't explain the reaper cables though. And the blue highlights to his armor are an effect of making the scene brighter.

Nope, the blue is already there. As is the red from the wounds. The armor is tinted blue or blue/white camo.


Being a CG scene, it's possible that they picked these highlights as a standard. They can't really account for every armor type. I mean, has anyone wore any other type of armor, like inferno or dragon age, and came out looking like charred versions of those? Or do they always default to the burnt N7 armor?

#53715
EpyonX3

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MegumiAzusa wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...

Sounds to me like metal beams under stress.


Oh I forgot to include that in my response to him. I agree with you. It sounds like stuff breaking as opposed to battle sounds.

I maintain my position that if Shepard never made it to the beam, then the beam should still be on and bright as hell, since the reapers stopped the threat and still need it on for transporting people.

#53716
Uncle Jo

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gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...


By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...




I'm almost positive those are sounds of a building settling, they don't quite seem loud enough to be a Reaper call but  it's possible it's a reaper howl in the distance. If you listen close with max volume you can also hear some kind of....thudding or...not sure how to describe it; it's a few beats in rapid sucession.

Thanks for the hints ! I'm going to hear it again right now.

Modifié par Uncle Jo, 09 mai 2012 - 08:37 .


#53717
MegumiAzusa

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EpyonX3 wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.


Where the hell was I when those were posted. I've never seen those before. Gonna have to replay the london again.

Still doesn't explain the reaper cables though. And the blue highlights to his armor are an effect of making the scene brighter.

Nope, the blue is already there. As is the red from the wounds. The armor is tinted blue or blue/white camo.


Being a CG scene, it's possible that they picked these highlights as a standard. They can't really account for every armor type. I mean, has anyone wore any other type of armor, like inferno or dragon age, and came out looking like charred versions of those? Or do they always default to the burnt N7 armor?

There is only the N7 armor.

#53718
llbountyhunter

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EpyonX3 wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...



The blocks on earth matching the pattern in the breathe scene got me thinking again. We still need the cables explained and then I'll be 100% convinced it is on earth.

In the meantime, I'm preparing additional possibilities, some that can be explained through EC.

One that I can come up with other than the Citated falling back to earth while shepard is on it is that Shepard managed to limp back or was blown back into, the control panel room while everything was blowing up. There he got back to the hallway he came through and took the beam back down just in time before the Citadel itself blew up.

Debris from the Citadel would explain the cables and other hard to distinguish parts in the final scene.

Of course, I'm still open to the possibility that he never left, though I'm not too sure about it given the consequences of this being true.


Ithought the cables were determined to be generic, and the shiny object seems to be part of the beam structure

#53719
johnj1979

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Rosewind wrote...

NoSpin wrote...

johnj1979 wrote...

If all of this is happening inside Shepard's head where is the start of the hallucination because that child is in through out the game which must mean that London is the start of the game and not the end. Which would then lead to the question how did Shepard get to that point????
Also then what is the point of the Old man telling Shepards story.


Shepard has been exposed to Reaper tech throughout the series, but Bioware most likely intended it during the ME2 Arrival DLC. The full on indoctrination "attempt" occurs after Shep is hit by Harbinger's beam in London.

The old man sequence could be "real", and with the "one more story" bit could hint at indoctrination. But nobody knows.


There's also a theory that says the full process starts on the shuttle ride with coates.


Yeah but in the previous games the person who is being indoctrinated takes along time and in ME 1 & 2 they have been inside a Reaper and the Alliance team ( ME2 DLC Arrival) where exposed to an artifact as far as we know this does not happen in ME3 and the shuttle ride takes moments.

If it Reaper tech then why isn't Tali and Garrus killing for the Reapers because like Shepard they are there from day one.

As for the Old Man telling the story how would he know what is happening in London when Liara hadn't finished the time capule or how would she the time capule out there without the mass relay. There are just too many unknowns in the story.

#53720
EpyonX3

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llbountyhunter wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...



The blocks on earth matching the pattern in the breathe scene got me thinking again. We still need the cables explained and then I'll be 100% convinced it is on earth.

In the meantime, I'm preparing additional possibilities, some that can be explained through EC.

One that I can come up with other than the Citated falling back to earth while shepard is on it is that Shepard managed to limp back or was blown back into, the control panel room while everything was blowing up. There he got back to the hallway he came through and took the beam back down just in time before the Citadel itself blew up.

Debris from the Citadel would explain the cables and other hard to distinguish parts in the final scene.

Of course, I'm still open to the possibility that he never left, though I'm not too sure about it given the consequences of this being true.


Ithought the cables were determined to be generic, and the shiny object seems to be part of the beam structure


Generic or not, they weren't around in that level. Or at least they haven't been found. That I can't say for sure. But if it was there is still room for wiggling for literists and IT, if my assumption above is plausible.

#53721
byne

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EpyonX3 wrote...


The blocks on earth matching the pattern in the breathe scene got me thinking again. We still need the cables explained and then I'll be 100% convinced it is on earth.

In the meantime, I'm preparing additional possibilities, some that can be explained through EC.

One that I can come up with other than the Citated falling back to earth while shepard is on it is that Shepard managed to limp back or was blown back into, the control panel room while everything was blowing up. There he got back to the hallway he came through and took the beam back down just in time before the Citadel itself blew up.

Debris from the Citadel would explain the cables and other hard to distinguish parts in the final scene.

Of course, I'm still open to the possibility that he never left, though I'm not too sure about it given the consequences of this being true.


Posted Image

The circled thing kinda looks like one of those cables.

#53722
gunslinger_ruiz

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EpyonX3 wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...


The flashing was already there?

Dig this: so earlier today(dep. on your region) there were high res screenshots posted of the breath scene (Link & Link, thx Megumi and gunslinger!).
Three notable things now:

- Shep's default N7 armor had a blue tan. One guess was: the beam's reflection.
- No flashing lightening anymore.
- A shiny thing in the background that is still a mystery.

Since there's no flashing anymore, one can assume that the conduit is deactivated. It might even be destroyed, because this shiny thing looks like a part of the conduit construction. But since it's lying around, one can assume that it's broken, hence destroyed.

Interesting, so it seems that either Shepard or someone else destroyed it. (only speculation, of course)

BTW, notice that you can hear distant noises (still a battle going on?) www.youtube.com/watch while the camera flies over that shiny thing.

By the way, could you guys tell me what are your thoughts about the sound at the beginning of the breath scene ? While I completely agree that it took place on Earth and very likely near the beam, this sound in the background doesn't seem to match with it (it sounds more like a metallic structure about to collapse)... Maybe I'm wrong but it's still bugging me a little...



The blocks on earth matching the pattern in the breathe scene got me thinking again. We still need the cables explained and then I'll be 100% convinced it is on earth.

In the meantime, I'm preparing additional possibilities, some that can be explained through EC.

One that I can come up with other than the Citated falling back to earth while shepard is on it is that Shepard managed to limp back or was blown back into, the control panel room while everything was blowing up. There he got back to the hallway he came through and took the beam back down just in time before the Citadel itself blew up.

Debris from the Citadel would explain the cables and other hard to distinguish parts in the final scene.

Of course, I'm still open to the possibility that he never left, though I'm not too sure about it given the consequences of this being true.


Check my sig for a comparison of Reaper cable in the breath scene. Interesting wrinkle, I went all through London and didn't find one Reaper cable but found plenty of breath scene rubble. Now, if we assume the rubble means the scene takes place on Earth then it can't take place on the Citadel. If we assume the cables are from the Citadel, then the breath scene can't take place on Earth....

They cannot take place on each other mostly because of this:


Posted Image

Shepard is ground zero for that explosion, it's large enough to knock the Citadel apart. There would be nothing left of Shepard to Get knocked back into the elavator or the beam or to ride out Citadel wreckage back to Earth. Not only that, there isn't anything I would call "Citadel tech" in the Breath scene. Everything identifiable is either Earth in origin or has Reaper-tech trademarks.

Now, it's possible the Beam itself had these Reaper cables, but we cannot see where from Shepard's perspective and believe me I've tried.

#53723
byne

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EpyonX3 wrote...

I maintain my position that if Shepard never made it to the beam, then the beam should still be on and bright as hell, since the reapers stopped the threat and still need it on for transporting people.


The Reapers literally never eeded the beam to transport anyone.

From the Reaper Variants codex entry...

* TROOP TRANSPORTS carry husks to unconquered planets and bring victims of the harvest to Reaper processing centers. They vary in length from 200 meters to one kilometer, but, unlike capital ships and destroyers, do not appear to be self-aware. Instead, other Reapers operate troop transports remotely.

* PROCESSORS, also called "slaughter ships," are mobile centers for mass DNA harvesting. Like troop transports, processors appear to be remotely operated by sapient Reapers.


The beam being used to transport people really doesnt make any sense, unless the Reapers wanted to use it to lure Shepard into a trap.

#53724
gunslinger_ruiz

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byne wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

*snip*


Posted Image

The circled thing kinda looks like one of those cables.


I thought it could be at first too, but that looks liek part of a human building or structure so it would more than likely be Rebar of some kind. I'll check my own screens to see if I got a close up of this structure. And if it is Reaper cable it's the wrong type, this kind stops while other Reaper cable seems to go on until it's attached to something or snakes along the ground at length.

#53725
Tr0n01d

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2149 : congrats, humanity discovered mass effects physics !
Discovery of first mass relay at pluto's moon Cahron.

2150 : miranda lawson is born !

Modifié par Tr0n01d, 09 mai 2012 - 08:44 .