57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Daryslash]

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

[SS2Dante]

Daryslash wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Daryslash wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Daryslash wrote...
 And who said this is a symptom of indoctrination? 

The codex for indoctrination.

http://i.imgur.com/DkXPT.jpg 

 

The codex talks about buzzing or ringing, not clear and spaced engine-like noises that sound exactly as "hum", a grave sound, that repeats infinitely and sounds like coming from some place far, in the background, not instantaneously in your ears.

Also, there was never headache involved.

Headaches aren't always involved, look it's clear that you haven't been here very long if you didn't know humming was a symptom, read the OP or something.

BYNE, you seriously need to update that BTW.

Why, I know headaches aren't always involved, it's just something else to consider. And I read the OP.

I just asked you where it was mentioned the "hum" was a symptom, in the game. The screenshot you provided failed to give that information.

It absolutely did give you that information. Buzzing and humming are hardly worlds apart. http://thesaurus.com/browse/buzz?s=t 

[SS2Dante]

Daryslash wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

...if you can think of an engine noise that DOESN'T sound like a hum be my guest.

[SS2Dante]

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Valve definitely hire psychologists. It's rather important to the gaming industry

[ExtendedCut]

Daryslash wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

I could very well be wrong about this, but isn't the current IT thought about the hum is that it's not a sign of indoctrination, but a sign that one of the Reaper tech pieces on-board is humming - as in it's actively working as an indoctrination device.  Again, it seems like that is the opinion of some posters on this thread, but I might be mis-remembering.

[Rosewind]

SS2Dante wrote...

Daryslash wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

...if you can think of an engine noise that DOESN'T sound like a hum be my guest.

Doesnt  the engine make a pulsating noise not a continues hum?

[MaximizedAction]

TSA_383 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Daryslash wrote...
 And who said this is a symptom of indoctrination? 

The codex for indoctrination.

http://i.imgur.com/DkXPT.jpg 

*snip*

By the by, when I analysed the normandy's background noise, there's a bass peak at ~45Hz, and two more at ~15Hz and ~5Hz (Using a hanning window).
ie, there's two major peaks of infrasonic. I doubt this would be something bioware would put in as a clue, but I thought I'd mention it on the off-chance.

At this point we've found so much stuff, that one simply won't notice ingame and if so wouldn't have the chance to analyze it to a sufficient extend.

And as much as we've had (possible) visual clues, there still might be just as much hidden in the sound. After all, ME3 is known to have a very extensive sound design.

I also have wondered whether there might be some peaks at certain frequencies, maybe even at frequencies outside of the human hearing range. Is it possible for you to figure out the exact frequency of where the peaks are at?

I ask, because I just figured out yesterday that the Reaper growl is a clear E note.

As a sidenote: Leaving Earth is in the key of E minor, just as the Mass Effect theme from ME1 (it's hinted during And End Once...).

[Rosewind]

SS2Dante wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Valve definitely hire psychologists. It's rather important to the gaming industry

Oh god don't mention Valve, I am still upset at them for not making Episode3  or even half life 3

[MaximizedAction]

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is...wow! I didn't know that. This is just wonderful, this little fact helps explain quite a lot.

Take that, "Bioware could never do IT"-people.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 11 mai 2012 - 06:32 .

[balance5050]

Rosewind wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Valve definitely hire psychologists. It's rather important to the gaming industry

Oh god don't mention Valve, I am still upset at them for not making Episode3  or even half life 3

They decided to abandon the episodes idea and just make HL3. There was a 6 year gap between HL1 and 2, so that means we should only have to wait like 1 or 2 more years until HL3

Modifié par balance5050, 11 mai 2012 - 06:32 .

[ghostz82]

ghostz82 wrote...

Why is everyone so crazy it's not a hallucination or indoctrination either it simply Is what you see an ending you don't wanna see or believe it's that simple. When you destroy the reapers it shows shepard all burnt and banged up on earth taking a breath since he was just in front if something that exploded in his face launching him down below onto earth why can't that just be what you see why does it have to be more. Well the answer is because you don't like the ending and are hoping there's more to it then just that. Well I think a lot of people might still be disappointed when the new ending comes out this summer because it will only explain the ovious and not what people are hoping for or wanted in the first place the fact is you can't please everyone and the truth is no one wants mass effect to end and judging by that one scene where Shepard takes a breath don't worry because there will be a mass effect 4 and that's what I got from what I saw not a final ending but an ending that tells me the game will be continued.

gunslinger_rulz wrote......

So...who wants this one? I could try the whole logic thing but I'm a little burnt out. If no one else pokes some holes in his questioning and he's still around in a bit I'll give it a shot with all those lovely screenshots.

But let me ask this. How did Shepard survive this explosion?

That is one thing on a very long list of things Shepard needs to survive in order to have a body capable of taking a breath.


First off that breathe could be one last breathe doesnt mean hes alive and as far as the explosion he could have fell down to earth when he destroyed the reaper console and console and it explodes right towards him before the citadel fully explodes showing that bigger explosion that you are showing. By the way he isnt fully human he is synthetic also remember the little boy mentions that to you when he explains the sythensis choice to you. So he would be able to survive or maybe like i said take a last breath. Also about the mass relays being destroyed and not killing everyone not making sense rememeber the reapers did invent the mass relays so if anyone would know how to destroy them without taking out a whole galaxy it would be the reapers or their creator dont you think.

Modifié par ghostz82, 11 mai 2012 - 06:35 .

[Rosewind]

balance5050 wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Valve definitely hire psychologists. It's rather important to the gaming industry

Oh god don't mention Valve, I am still upset at them for not making Episode3  or even half life 3

The decided to abandon the episodes idea and just make HL3. There was a 6 year gap between HL1 and 2, so that means we should only have to wait like 1 or 2 more years until HL3

I heard they in talks with Apple to release a new console and the first game to be released on the console going to be half life 3, I really wish it not going to be console only cause I hate apple with a passion and I dont own any other consoles.

[SolidisusSnake1]

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Yeah I mean its intresting to me but really just because he has the degree doesnt mean he is going to shoe horn it into the game. A lot of writers of psychology degrees or even law degrees but that doesnt mean they are going to force those concepts into their writing. But like I said it is still interesting nonetheless.

As far as I'm concerned I dont believe in IT simply because we would have heard way eariler on hints from the devs and writers that the ending was "fake", rather than taking the immense amount of heat and loss of sales, etc.

The only thing that still peaks my interest is:
-Oily Shadows
-Fear filled voices in the dreams
-Gun shot to the gut (though I have an alternate explantion for that)
-Anderson telling us not to listen to TIM (Why would we ever listen to him in the first place?)
-Shepard lives scene

Modifié par SolidisusSnake1, 11 mai 2012 - 06:33 .

[Cecilia L]

I want IT to be true so bad!

PLEASE BIOWARE!!!

It would be so awesome and I would worship you forever for this fantastic plot twist of the century!

[arc_gabriel_]

Rosewind wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Daryslash wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

...if you can think of an engine noise that DOESN'T sound like a hum be my guest.

Doesnt  the engine make a pulsating noise not a continues hum?

By the way of him saying 'hum' instead of pronouncing 'humming' means it was just once not on going. So it could of been James hearing a single hum sound in the room. 

[EpyonX3]

SS2Dante wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Ok, another hahahah moment. Guys, load up your citadel return restart file. And start pulling the trigger while the woman/coats is talking

MAGIC GUN THAT YOU SHOOT WITH MIND POWERS BEFORE YOU EVEN PICK IT UP!!!!!!

I like how when you go farther up the citadel (deeper in the hallucination) the focus on your gun is diminished.

On Earth they focus the camera in on your gun before you get control, and you magic shoot it BEFORE you get control.

In the collector halls, they show you picking it up again and Shepard looks at it strangly, then continues on.

In the end it just appears in your hands nonchalantly after the catalyst talk.

Probably nothing to see here, but it's still seems to stick out for me.

It sticks out just like all the other cases where your squad randomly uses the default assault rifle or default Carnifex.

No, you misunderstand. You can fire the gun. In the cutscene. Before Shep has picked it up.

I just tried it and it didn't work. Maybe a glitch? Have you updated your copy?

:S done it on both 360 and PC. I think balance did it too?

I'll double check in a moment, currently checking to see if shooting TIM alters my ending dialogue at all.

HAHAHA I did it wrong. I just got it to work. But come one that's an obvious glitch.

[ArthurVon]

Can someone answer to my question?
If the IT is true, if Shepard was "fighting" with his will to win indoctrination, well, what really happened in the real world? That is the question to understand how the game ends, even if it says: "Commander Shepard has become a legend by ending the reaper...blabla" yeah but how? if all the "end video" was just a "mind fight" in Shepard's head??
Anyway every game I did buy already had an end in it.

[balance5050]

ghostz82 wrote...
First off that breathe could be one last breathe doesnt mean hes alive and as far as the explosion he could have fell down to earth when he destroyed the reaper console and console and it explodes right towards him before the citadel fully explodes showing that bigger explosion that you are showing. By the way he isnt fully human he is synthetic also remember the little boy mentions that to you when he explains the sythensis choice to you. So he would be able to survive or maybe like i said take a last breath. Also about the mass relays being destroyed and not killing everyone not making sense rememeber the reapers did invent the mass relays so if anyone would know how to destroy them without taking out a whole galaxy it would be the reapers or their creator dont you think.

The boy mentioned those synthetics implying that they would be destroyed. This page implies that the "Shepard_Alive" scene actually means more than what you think, it was written by Mac Walters, specifically handed to Geoff Keighly for the public to see.

http://i.imgur.com/oY36A.jpg 

 

Modifié par balance5050, 11 mai 2012 - 06:42 .

[TSA_383]

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

Interesting...
This lends a little more authority to what I was saying the other day:
http://social.biowar.../index/11929257

The fact that he says he was inspired by "Brave New World" and "The Matrix" certainly shows you that he was thinking about the possibilities of control and suggestion...

ghostz82 wrote...First off that breathe could be one last breathe
doesnt mean hes alive and as far as the explosion he could have fell
down to earth when he destroyed the reaper console and console and it
explodes right towards him before the citadel fully explodes showing
that bigger explosion that you are showing. By the way he isnt fully
human he is synthetic also remember the little boy mentions that to you
when he explains the sythensis choice to you. So he would be able to
survive or maybe like i said take a last breath. Also about the mass
relays being destroyed and not killing everyone not making sense
rememeber the reapers did invent the mass relays so if anyone would know
how to destroy them without taking out a whole galaxy it would be the
reapers or their creator dont you think.

We covered this already. Check out the last page, it's simply not possible, even with mass effect logic, to survive a fall like that.
Whereas indoctrination is a central theme of much of the series.....

ArthurVon wrote...

Can someone answer to my question?
If
the IT is true, if Shepard was "fighting" with his will to win
indoctrination, well, what really happened in the real world? That is
the question to understand how the game ends, even if it says:
"Commander Shepard has become a legend by ending the reaper...blabla"
yeah but how? if all the "end video" was just a "mind fight" in
Shepard's head??
Anyway every game I did buy already had an end in it.

We don't know. Presumably he was unconscious since being hit by the beam, and we'll find out how the fight ends later...

MaximizedAction wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Daryslash wrote...
 And who said this is a symptom of indoctrination? 

The codex for indoctrination.

http://i.imgur.com/DkXPT.jpg 

*snip*

By
the by, when I analysed the normandy's background noise, there's a bass
peak at ~45Hz, and two more at ~15Hz and ~5Hz (Using a hanning window).
ie,
there's two major peaks of infrasonic. I doubt this would be something
bioware would put in as a clue, but I thought I'd mention it on the
off-chance.

At this point we've found so much stuff,
that one simply won't notice ingame and if so wouldn't have the chance
to analyze it to a sufficient extend.

And as much as we've had
(possible) visual clues, there still might be just as much hidden in the
sound. After all, ME3 is known to have a very extensive sound design.

I
also have wondered whether there might be some peaks at certain
frequencies, maybe even at frequencies outside of the human hearing
range. Is it possible for you to figure out the exact frequency of where
the peaks are at?

I ask, because I just figured out yesterday that the Reaper growl is a clear E note.

As
a sidenote: Leaving Earth is in the key of E minor, just as the Mass
Effect theme from ME1 (it's hinted during And End Once...).

Yes, I can lock down exact frequencies more or less, but I can't pitch shift it to an audible frequency without screwing up the sound entirely.

I only mention it because there's no reason to include infrasonic noise on a track like that and it's considered poor practice to do so. But indoctrination is supposed to use ultrasonic (which you couldn't put into the noise due to the 32Khz sampling rate although the noise goes as high as the sample rate allows) and infrasonic noise.

And yes, ME3's sound design is rather epic.
For example:
-That angelic choir vocal synth I mentioned, it appears:
*very lightly amongst the background noise of the dream sequences
*when you approach the child in the dream (moreso in each successive dream)
*when you get hit by Harbinger's laser
*when you're making the final choice

Modifié par TSA_383, 11 mai 2012 - 06:46 .

[balance5050]

ArthurVon wrote...

Can someone answer to my question?
If the IT is true, if Shepard was "fighting" with his will to win indoctrination, well, what really happened in the real world? That is the question to understand how the game ends, even if it says: "Commander Shepard has become a legend by ending the reaper...blabla" yeah but how? if all the "end video" was just a "mind fight" in Shepard's head??
Anyway every game I did buy already had an end in it.

That's what the EC is for; to add "clarity and insight into the conclusion of Commander Shepard"

[NeoDobby]

Wow, I missed 30 pages? I was here not 20 hours ago. How did that happen? Anyway, not gonna reread all of that, anything new?

[Daryslash]

SS2Dante wrote...

It absolutely did give you that information. Buzzing and humming are hardly worlds apart. http://thesaurus.com/browse/buzz?s=t 

This isn't only about the meaning of words, it's about context.

Like I said, the Normandy sound is an infinitely repeated, spaced and grave "hum" that comes from the background, while the codex simply talks about a buzzing or ringing (which implies similarity to these two and also that this indoctrination sound is more acute, because of the "ringing") that sounds right in your ears.

This is not as simple as dictionary definitions.

SS2Dante wrote...

Daryslash wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

You're assuming that the engine hum is the hum he's hearing.

Hmm, maybe, but why wouldn't it be?

Why woult they make James mention a hum and then make an engine sound exactly like hum? That's messed up.

Like I said, yeah, the hum in James head could be some reaper indoctrination going on, but while I find the indoctrination theory a good one in general, I find it very unlikely that the "hum" is involved, with this lack of evidence.

...if you can think of an engine noise that DOESN'T sound like a hum be my guest.

Yeah, then why would you be surprised that James asks about some hum?

Plus, if every engine noise sound like hum, there is less reason for James to think the hum he is hearing is something abnormal, since he is supposedly familiar to engine sounds, therefore familiar to "hums", right?

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

SS2Dante wrote...

Ok, another hahahah moment. Guys, load up your citadel return restart file. And start pulling the trigger while the woman/coats is talking

MAGIC GUN THAT YOU SHOOT WITH MIND POWERS BEFORE YOU EVEN PICK IT UP!!!!!!

I like how when you go farther up the citadel (deeper in the hallucination) the focus on your gun is diminished.

On Earth they focus the camera in on your gun before you get control, and you magic shoot it BEFORE you get control.

In the collector halls, they show you picking it up again and Shepard looks at it strangly, then continues on.

In the end it just appears in your hands nonchalantly after the catalyst talk.

Probably nothing to see here, but it's still seems to stick out for me.

It sticks out just like all the other cases where your squad randomly uses the default assault rifle or default Carnifex.

No, you misunderstand. You can fire the gun. In the cutscene. Before Shep has picked it up.

I just tried it and it didn't work. Maybe a glitch? Have you updated your copy?

:S done it on both 360 and PC. I think balance did it too?

I'll double check in a moment, currently checking to see if shooting TIM alters my ending dialogue at all.

HAHAHA I did it wrong. I just got it to work. But come one that's an obvious glitch.

Could be, but Bioware has stated before that sometimes, they leave glitches in for effect;)

Modifié par balance5050, 11 mai 2012 - 06:45 .

[ExtendedCut]

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

SolidisusSnake1 wrote...

I made a thread yesterday that quickly turned ugly but I'll state it again Mac Walters (Lead Writer) has a Degree in Psychology.

So the whole Shepard is actually exploring his own mind and talking to parts of his sub-conscience does have some weight to it when you consider that one fact. I still dont believe in the theory but the fact is interesting nonetheless.

That is interesting.  And at least you didn't come in here and start bashing us randomly like certain others. <_<  Also, I think this would at least add some credence to IT since Mac would probably know about most of this stuff thanks to the aforementioned degree.

Yeah I mean its intresting to me but really just because he has the degree doesnt mean he is going to shoe horn it into the game. A lot of writers of psychology degrees or even law degrees but that doesnt mean they are going to force those concepts into their writing. But like I said it is still interesting nonetheless.

As far as I'm concerned I dont believe in IT simply because we would have heard way eariler on hints from the devs and writers that the ending was "fake", rather than taking the immense amount of heat and loss of sales, etc.

The only thing that still peaks my interest is:
-Oily Shadows
-Fear filled voices in the dreams
-Gun shot to the gut (though I have an alternate explantion for that)
-Anderson telling us not to listen to TIM (Why would we ever listen to him in the first place?)
-Shepard lives scene

Everything that you mention is completely logical.  I fall in the category of "hopeful skepticism" when it comes to IT - I hope it's true because I can't see BW successfully concluding this ending any other way.  At the same time, though, there's a little voice in my head that says IT is just wishful thinking.

And If IT is not true, then many of the points your list above make no sense at all, and it's going to require a lot of 'splainin' by Bioware.

[balance5050]

Daryslash wrote...

Yeah, then why would you be surprised that James asks about some hum?

Plus, if every engine noise sound like hum, there is less reason for James to think the hum he is hearing is something abnormal, since he is supposedly familiar to engine sounds, therefore familiar to "hums", right?

Right, so it makes no sense for him to say "Do you hear that hum? Must be me" unless it was an "abnormal" hum.