57139 réponses à ce sujet

[Rahabzu]

bool.exe wrote...

Well, really there is no point in further discussion. It's indoctrination or this is absurd. First of all, Shepard waking up in a pile of rubble when Citadel has blown up. Next - that moment with fleeing Normandy and our squadmates SUDDENLY appearing onboard. This is indoctrinationhallucinationdreametc. No need for another proof.

This is true all we can do is wait and hope Bioware aren't complete failures at making an ending.

[wickermoon]

Interesting. This is a direct quote from an interview with Casey Hudson "on the future of Mass Effect" postet on the 17th of February 2012:

Are there alternative endings depending on what you do in the game?
"[...] - it really does layer in many, many different choices, up to the final moments, where it's going to be different for everyone who plays it."

http://www.computera...ly-good/?page=2

If what Casey said is true, then what we saw actually wasn't the ending and I am SO pissed (how pissed I am depends on if the DLC is going to be free or not).

Modifié par wickermoon, 13 mars 2012 - 07:36 .

[mmL]

Everyone in this thread should start tweeting ambiguous messages ala "wink wink nudge nudge" to @masseffect, perhaps we can get some new hints

[jackncoke28]

jackncoke28 wrote...

k8ee wrote...

jackncoke28 wrote...

Just wanted to comment about the argument on why would reapers give you the option to destroy them. The indoctrination argument stipulates that shepard never actually got to the citadel, the choices are in your head. I would argue that the choices aren't really between controling, synthesizing, or destroying. They are basically
1. Giving in to reaper idiology while maintaining some of who you are (control)
2. Completely giving in to reaper ideology (synthesis)
3. Not giving in, and continuing to fight. (Destroy)
And by reaper idiology I mean there idea about the need for order in the universe (put forth by the "catalyst") and the inevitability of the organic's destruction by the harbingers of that synthetic order, the catalyst uses this argument to creat a sense of how useless it will be to keep fighting, and using the image of the boy has the added effect of reminding Shepard that he won't be able to save every one if he does continue to fight, an attempt to break his will. The first 2 choices, IMO, are shepard giving in to the arguments the reapers have made in ME1,2,and most of 3, via indoctrinated Saren, Sovereign, Harbinger, and indoctrinated TIM.

The reason for the indoctrination I believe, is to break the resistance of the allied forces. Shepard represents their hope, their belief that they can win this fight. We learned from javik that the prothean reaper war lasted his entire life, and the major disadvantage was that they were a homogeneous empire. So even with that disadvantage the held out for at least a couple decades. This cycle has multiple races fighting in tandem, and it has the catalyst weapon. This cycle has the best chance of defeating them and they know it. Martyring Shepard does not help their cause, they need him broken.
Wow, I didn't intend to go this far lol, I guess that's what great stories do to someone

Beautifully put.

Thank You

Also to add to argument against synthesis, wasnt synthesing and evolving into perfect being promised to the geth heratics by the reapers?

Self bump

[Lurchibald]

so wait, how did the reapers move the citadel to Earth again? The citadel doesn't have any propulsion of its own, I don't know, I just can't see them being able to use the mass relay to move it (Though I'm not an expert on what the mass relays can actually do lol)

[seph22]

This video made me realize it's probably  true

Mass Effect 3 ending explained in 3mins

Modifié par seph22, 13 mars 2012 - 07:37 .

[VironZ]

Ending looked quite rushed imo (well the final hurdle with the choices)

Modifié par VironZ, 13 mars 2012 - 07:37 .

[Deitylink]

Again. The reversed 1M1 could just be a warning/sign. Everything is reversed. Destroy is seen as renegade and made to believe thats it's the wrong option.

[BlackDragonBane]

luukee wrote...

BlackDragonBane wrote...

iSpitfireee wrote...

Guys think back to how Harbinger controlled the collector general.... Harby was in dark space while the general was in the galactic core. Thats some serious idoc skills by Harby. Now imagine how effective it must be if Harby is literally feet away from Shepard.

You know... I never thought of that and that brings up a VERY interesting point.

Harbinger can control the Collectoer Leader all the way from Dark Space... being Harbinger's avatar and all but that is a REALLY long distance to maintain a connection. Maybe it has something to do with the heavy genetic modification and Repear-tech retrofitting of the Collectors? I remember that the Collector leader appears very weak after Habinger relinquishes control

But then when I think of Sovereign and Saren, the two were NEVER far from each other. Saren was always within range of Sovereign and Sovereign never took full control of Saren until after he recieved Reaper tech implants and was killed, reanimiating the corpse to be his avatar/vanguard. Saren mentions that his relationship with Sovereign is symbiotic on Virmire and when Saren is destroyed at the end of ME1, Sovereign suffers some kind of overload that stuns it.

Jeez, talking about overlooking a huge detail and it could possibly explain how being in close proximity of Harbinger during the run and after the attack would certainly trigger and much faster rate and attempt at complete indoctrination of Shepard. Just might in theory...

I think this is a very interesting point actually. Sorry if it's been brought up before but we know that Shepard did infact die at the beginning of ME2, but was brought back to life again through technology. Forgive me if I am very clueless, but do we know that actual technology allowed him to come back? It must be something very powerful and advanced, and that makes me think of the reapers. We know Cerberus have been messing around with reaper technology, so could it be possible that in the way that Harbinger can control, or even influence, Shepard through his/her small implants in the same way the Collector General is near-possesed by Harbinger? 

It might be nothing, but it got me thinking.

When assaulting the Cerebrus base, you'll find a console with 3 vids in relation to the beginning of the Lazerus Project. One of the scientists protests that reviving Shepard is nigh-impossible, but the Illusive Man insists they find a way to do, eventually putting Miranda on the lead.

If you read the comic that explains how Cerebrus got Shepard's body and not the Collectors, even Miranda comments that it may be too late to revive Shepard because of the condition of the body. I think this alone would suggest that perhaps Reaper tech was used to rebuild what they couldn't regrow or repair from Shepard's body. It would make sense considering what Sovereign did to Saren when he died because of his implants and all the tech present on the Reaper troops (like Brutes, which are Turian heads mounted on a modified Krogan body)

[RobT2012]

lavosslayer wrote...

RobT2012 wrote...

lavosslayer wrote...

Dessalines wrote...

GreenSoda wrote...

mmL wrote...

HallucinationEnd wrote...

Hmm foud this :

http://s3.amazonaws....res=1331651551

Holy ****.

This means the sequence with the normandy fleeing from the blast and landing on a tropical vacation island might have been real. Which would not contradict our indoctrination/hallucination theory, as the real ending could still happen inbetween!

The source is 4chan.

4chan.

Better to simply pay no attention to it.

Anonymous is a liar.  Aria is taking back Omega.  From who? Cerebus is wiped out or turned in huskified humans without someone controlling them. How can the Alliance be coming for him,  when he is not on the ship? Did the beam transport him back with his friends?  Even if the endings are real, those dlc do not make any sense.

The take back omega one is the only one there that seems 100% certain...even when you talk to her in Purgatory she says thats what she is planning on doing....since this DLC takes place before the events on earth it is totally plausible....the rescue shepard one sounds like he makes it onto the normandy and crashlands on the tropical planet like the others...definitely missing some key details to make that happen...

How so? Aria was on the citadel before i departed to Cronos station, TIM apparently head over to the citadel causing the reapers to move it and lock it up. This station then explodes if the game is to be believed as it is, how the **** is she suriving that? Also Omega is a station built into an asteroid, it would be considered advanced technology and be destroyed no matter which ending you choose.

There was a tweet by Mac walters the lead writer that said some people escaped before TIM closed the arms on the citadel...that being said it would be the most foolish thing in the world to think Aria T'Loak would not be among those who escaped....

regardless I guarentee you will have access to this mission before the events of the citadel moving occur

Thanks didnt see that tweet.

Anways point still stands, Omega is a spacestation, any ending we choose means it going to be destroyed so it would have to take place before citadel movement, which is still problematic didnt see she commit all her merc forces to the alliance (so would already be with the fleet prior to cronos station?). Even if its proposed she does it singlehandedly, anyone want to go through fighting for control of something that will be destroyed moments later according to the ME3's current endings ? There would be no real fan desire for this, unless the endings currently are teasers to wind us up.

[AscendBaldur]

Since we can do nothing but wait at this point (we've discovered as many clues as I think we can) and I really truly believes this is true, I'm going back to start FemShep back in ME1. Hoping that something comes to fruition by the time I'm done the three games lol. See you on the other side guys

[Vlta]

If this theory or the indoctrination proves true I doubt it would be because it was Bioware's plan all along. It would probably be more likely that they just used this idea to appease the masses and the three half baked endings really were their endings.

(If the theory really is their idea then after I get my real ending I'm done with Bioware, getting trolled is bad enough, being forced to purchase the real ending for a game is ridiculous)

[luukee]

Lurchibald wrote...

so wait, how did the reapers move the citadel to Earth again? The citadel doesn't have any propulsion of its own, I don't know, I just can't see them being able to use the mass relay to move it (Though I'm not an expert on what the mass relays can actually do lol)

The Citadel is a mass relay I believe although it only goes to dark space. Like you I don't know how it got around but I can assume the relays might be able to move themselves around in a way that it can move ships?

[BlackDragonBane]

Lurchibald wrote...

so wait, how did the reapers move the citadel to Earth again? The citadel doesn't have any propulsion of its own, I don't know, I just can't see them being able to use the mass relay to move it (Though I'm not an expert on what the mass relays can actually do lol)

Pushed it or tow ropes/tractor beams.

Nothing in game actually explains how they moved the darn thing through the relays to reach Sol.

[G0thicRhino]

Fledgey wrote...

I was catching up too and I had like 30 pages to go. I realized I was just reading the same things over and over so I skipped to the end.

Same, 70 page increase since I went to sleep. Too much being repeated. Soooooo, I may have skipped ahead a smidge. 

[AikoTM]

OMG! You are so awesome <.< and your facts.. i think you're right.

[Lurchibald]

jackncoke28 wrote...

k8ee wrote...

jackncoke28 wrote...

Just wanted to comment about the argument on why would reapers give you the option to destroy them. The indoctrination argument stipulates that shepard never actually got to the citadel, the choices are in your head. I would argue that the choices aren't really between controling, synthesizing, or destroying. They are basically
1. Giving in to reaper idiology while maintaining some of who you are (control)
2. Completely giving in to reaper ideology (synthesis)
3. Not giving in, and continuing to fight. (Destroy)
And by reaper idiology I mean there idea about the need for order in the universe (put forth by the "catalyst") and the inevitability of the organic's destruction by the harbingers of that synthetic order, the catalyst uses this argument to creat a sense of how useless it will be to keep fighting, and using the image of the boy has the added effect of reminding Shepard that he won't be able to save every one if he does continue to fight, an attempt to break his will. The first 2 choices, IMO, are shepard giving in to the arguments the reapers have made in ME1,2,and most of 3, via indoctrinated Saren, Sovereign, Harbinger, and indoctrinated TIM.

The reason for the indoctrination I believe, is to break the resistance of the allied forces. Shepard represents their hope, their belief that they can win this fight. We learned from javik that the prothean reaper war lasted his entire life, and the major disadvantage was that they were a homogeneous empire. So even with that disadvantage the held out for at least a couple decades. This cycle has multiple races fighting in tandem, and it has the catalyst weapon. This cycle has the best chance of defeating them and they know it. Martyring Shepard does not help their cause, they need him broken.
Wow, I didn't intend to go this far lol, I guess that's what great stories do to someone

Beautifully put.

Thank You

Also to add to argument against synthesis, wasnt synthesing and evolving into perfect being promised to the geth heratics by the reapers?

Nope, The geth saw the Reapers as 'gods' the ultimate 'evolution' of machines, however, I don't think it was mentioned that it told the geth that he was made of organics and machine. I believe the geth saw them as machines only.

[rockman0]

ArkkAngel007 wrote...

BeardedPuma wrote...

Michael Gamble ‏ @GambleMike
those of you who have played infiltrator and/or the datapad - send me your honest opinions. Do you like these sorts of metagame experiences?

metagame? hint?

or am I really reaching for induction ports here...
I think I may be reaching.

In Gamble's context, I'd say reaching.

And I wouldn't know if I should be enjoying Datapad or not.  I can't play it, since EA didn't put down which generations of the devices it would work with.  Shame too, as it would have been a fun thing to have around.

if it shows up in the app store on your device, it should work. I think devices that can't runa  certain app don't have it in the search results.

[JFedora]

Moreover, in the Cerberus base, you can listen to the audio logs about the scientists putting Shepard back together, and s/he has a moment of doubt, asking "who or what am i?" Tali was there for my Shepard, insisting that everything was fine, but that's been bugging me for a while. We don't know anything about how they brought Shepard back to life - Reaper tech would be another way to impose indoctrination. So, Shepard is experiencing the dreams and stuff as Harbinger tries to indoctrinate him from a distance, but when Harby realizes that Shepard is almost to the conduit, he comes down to bring an all-out assault on Shepard's mind.

[Golferguy758]

To the person thinking synthesis was good. You know you are agreeing with harbinger, right? Achieve the apex of our evolution by combining with synthetics.

[Leafs43]

Deitylink wrote...

Again. The reversed 1M1 could just be a warning/sign. Everything is reversed. Destroy is seen as renegade and made to believe thats it's the wrong option.

1M1 even being there in the first place makes no sense.

No human or organic has ever been there.  So how do human based figures appear where no human has never been?


Either its a dream, space magic, or serious oversight by the developers.

[Noob451]

DifferentD17 wrote...

I don't know if this was brought up but, EDI says there are pieces of Sovereign on the Normandy.

I mentioned it earlier, would this make the normandy some type of indoctrination device? James even mentions that he hears "humming" similar to kaiden on the citadel next to the mass relay statue.

[Davies993]

crimsontotem wrote...

For all ye new comers



3:55-56 when kid says "Choose" listen to the third echo...

Harbinger?

I personally can't hear that, but do you notice sheps eyes when he is getting assimilated? They turn into a purple version of Saren/TIM's eyes. Same thing happens for control, but not for destroy.

(5:36 in that video)

Exactly 0:53 in this video;

[Tallis Lucienis]

RobT2012 wrote...

lavosslayer wrote...

RobT2012 wrote...

lavosslayer wrote...

Dessalines wrote...

GreenSoda wrote...

mmL wrote...

HallucinationEnd wrote...

Hmm foud this :

http://s3.amazonaws....res=1331651551

Holy ****.

This means the sequence with the normandy fleeing from the blast and landing on a tropical vacation island might have been real. Which would not contradict our indoctrination/hallucination theory, as the real ending could still happen inbetween!

The source is 4chan.

4chan.

Better to simply pay no attention to it.

Anonymous is a liar.  Aria is taking back Omega.  From who? Cerebus is wiped out or turned in huskified humans without someone controlling them. How can the Alliance be coming for him,  when he is not on the ship? Did the beam transport him back with his friends?  Even if the endings are real, those dlc do not make any sense.

The take back omega one is the only one there that seems 100% certain...even when you talk to her in Purgatory she says thats what she is planning on doing....since this DLC takes place before the events on earth it is totally plausible....the rescue shepard one sounds like he makes it onto the normandy and crashlands on the tropical planet like the others...definitely missing some key details to make that happen...

How so? Aria was on the citadel before i departed to Cronos station, TIM apparently head over to the citadel causing the reapers to move it and lock it up. This station then explodes if the game is to be believed as it is, how the **** is she suriving that? Also Omega is a station built into an asteroid, it would be considered advanced technology and be destroyed no matter which ending you choose.

There was a tweet by Mac walters the lead writer that said some people escaped before TIM closed the arms on the citadel...that being said it would be the most foolish thing in the world to think Aria T'Loak would not be among those who escaped....

regardless I guarentee you will have access to this mission before the events of the citadel moving occur

Thanks didnt see that tweet.

Anways point still stands, Omega is a spacestation, any ending we choose means it going to be destroyed so it would have to take place before citadel movement, which is still problematic didnt see she commit all her merc forces to the alliance (so would already be with the fleet prior to cronos station?). Even if its proposed she does it singlehandedly, anyone want to go through fighting for control of something that will be destroyed moments later according to the ME3's current endings ? There would be no real fan desire for this, unless the endings currently are teasers to wind us up.

Dont sure what to think of the Rescue DLC....

[Descedent]

seph22 wrote...

This video made me realize it's probably  true

Mass Effect 3 ending explained in 3mins

I can agree with that, but possible that the indoctrination started after the lazer beams, the whole magical anderson getting to citadel and beating shep to console still makes no sense.

Modifié par Descedent, 13 mars 2012 - 07:45 .