57139 réponses à ce sujet

[IronSabbath88]

Why is it that every person going against this theory just points to the fact that BioWare are either stupid, not that clever, or just flat out dumb?

That's kind of a convulted argument. I could easily say the same about you, but I won't, because I don't have the proof to back that up.

[killnoob]

Lost Cipher wrote...

Lemondish wrote...

Zaknaberrnon wrote...

moar info on the 1m1 thing, quoting form another thread and adding my own bit after:

F3Zero wrote...

TIMIRIEL sent this to me, anyone want to have at it?

Might help make sense of what BIOWARE wants us to think.

1M1 - i think that's a more inconspicuous way of writing this 1*(M^(-1))

(the formula is used in optics, it actually stands for inverse of focal length, or dioptry,
or convergence...

In Logic, convergence is also the notion that a sequence of transformations come to the same conclusion, no matter what order they are performed in...

maybe it's too far fetched, i don't know
sadly, it fits to well with the "multiple" endings

And heres the clip:


 

my part:

I looked up the definitions for 'convergence' on wikidictionary to see if there were any other interesting meanings, and came across something familiar:

"convergence (countable and uncountable; plural convergences)

   1: The act of moving toward union or uniformity.
        A meeting place.

   2: The intersection of three electron beams for red, green and blue onto a single pixel in a CRT.
    3: (mathematics) The process of approaching some limiting value.
  4:   (physiology) The coordinated focusing of the eyes, especially at short range.
    5: (biology) The evolution of similar structures or traits in unrelated species in similar environments; convergent      evolution.
   6: The merging of distinct technologies, industries, or devices into a unified whole.
"
hmm three different colored explosions for three different choices...

http://en.wiktionary...iki/convergence

That is brilliant. Now...what does it MEAN?!

I understand that we all want the ending to make sense. But do not do this, they are not that clever. And when it comes out that this hallucination theory was wrong and the endings just suck... Everyone is going to be more upset.

I understand that in this thread I am in the minority, but it makes logically more sense that they just screwed up. And that by not talking about it, people will still buy their game. Tomorrow is going to come and go, and so will April... and then May and the rest of the year.

Its over...

You're actually not the minority. A lot of people believe the indoctrination theory, and you know what, I understand why.

The endings suck so bad they have to create something in order for everything to make sense.

But can't you see this is doing more harm than good?

You've given bioware an excuse to their horrible writing.

You basically helped them complete the game and fill in the blanks.

And are you gonna do that with every game they ever produce from now on?

Everytime they create something ****, you're just gonna say everything's hallucinations?

[WizenSlinky0]

erlind0186 wrote...

This has been previously stated but to some of us, the 1M1 thing is a clue as to when the real ending comes out. M is the 13th letter in the alphabet. 1+13+1=15. It's speculated that due to the script leaks and what not that on the 15th, the release date for the Asian version of the game, is when they'll release the real ending. That way the real ending is out at the same time for everyone.

Oh come on! I will be the first one to call Bioware out for being bloody brilliant if they thought that far into it but...really? 

We're using bloody numerical representations of the alphabet now? I thought I overanalyze things...

I can understand wanting to have faith but I cannot shut off my rationality and believe that suddenly, out of no where, Bioware decided to be one of the very VERY few companies that goes through INSANE pains to hide evidence.

[Delular]

Again, I have loved BioWare since Shatter Steel and only love them more for this.
OP brilliant job on collecting all this info, now try to make the dimwits on youtube understand.


ACtually don't, probably as useful as throwing a bucket of fresh water into the ocean to clean the salt out.

Modifié par Delular, 14 mars 2012 - 06:13 .

[inFam0us]

I'm done with Bioware if this was the real ending.

[killnoob]

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Why is it that every person going against this theory just points to the fact that BioWare are either stupid, not that clever, or just flat out dumb?

That's kind of a convulted argument. I could easily say the same about you, but I won't, because I don't have the proof to back that up.

Biowares are not stupid.

They made the rest of the game enjoyable.

But that doesn't change the fact that they screw up the ending.

And people srsly have to stop trying to help them complete it until they do it themselves.

[AxisEvolve]

Eirzara wrote...

AxisEvolve wrote...

HAHA, brilliant!

I know.



I want this to be true.

[crimsontotem]

N3vDawg wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/tQlte.jpg

woah what? lol that mean Shepard was transporte dot Medical camp in London

[Capeo]

JulienJaden wrote...

Capeo wrote...

JulienJaden wrote...

killnoob wrote...

Fledgey wrote...
Scripts can change, and things can be leaked on purpose to create a false expectation.

And Bioware did WTC.

Seriously, listen to yourself.

Don't be ridiculous. The US government did that.


Anyway, alright, let's start at zero: If every ending is real, how can Shepard survive the station exploding around him, shields failing (thus, no atmosphere), and, if we assume that this scene takes place on Earth, re-entry into the planet's atmosphere?
If you can give me a satisfying answer based on what we see in the current endings that doesn't involve teleportation or space magic, I'm willing to accept it as a valid point.
Just don't go around trolling everyone when there's plotholes the size of Nevada.

You answered your own question.  Plot hole.  The game is rife with ridiculous plotholes yet people on this thread seem to think that right at the zero hour BW suddenly pulled their crap together and got clever on the endings that have been the same for 8 months in the very least.

You're talking about a game series where the antagonist has already been brought back from the dead and that in which the entire trilogy is resolved using space magic.  ME is extraordininarly soft sci-fi and has always been full of space magic and incongruities. 

As for that one scene specifically?  It's tossing fans a bone because they were afraid everyone would complain if there was no way to have Shep survive and Destroy is the ONLY ending that allows for that.  That's all it means.  Nothing more.  The other two endings consume Shep.  Everyone on here is using circular logic and putting the cart before the horse.  The simple answer is that Shep got back to the teleportation beam somehow.  The same kind of somehow that allowed the citadel to suddenly get to earth or the same somehow that allows the engineering impossibility of building the Crucible or the same kind of somehow that stops the Reapers from simply taking the Citadel from the start as has been their plan millions of times before or the same kind of somehow that allows the Reapers to simply ignore the incoming Crucible instead of destroying it.

Which antagonist was brought back from the dead? Saren never died. TIM never died (as far as I know).
Yes, the protagonist gets resurrected, but at incredible financial costs, because of some lucky coincidences and so much technology to repair him/her that it's a miracle none of Shepard's enemies just uses a magnet to incapacitate him/her.
However, within the game's lore, it makes sense. It's borderline, granted, but it made sense.

Also, we don't understand what the Citadel is, exactly. Who says it can't move? Who says it can't jump?
And who said the Crucible was impossible to build? The plans were hard to decipher and it took thousands of engineers and scientists and huge amounts of raw materials and production facilities, but those you partially gather during your campaign. That's why none of us complain about it. Everything is relatively sound up to those final minutes.

Now, the plotholes make no sense, and with Bioware being the company it is, I don't think they'd intentionally mess this up for no reason whatsoever. With EA calling the shots, it seems plausible they were under time pressure and put together a sloppy ending so they could ship in time. They didn't do anything they promised and, up until now, they haven't really told us anything definite about it. They just continue playing coy, with Hudson announcing there will be DLC in the future.


I just don't think they'd finish the trilogy with something so badly written and put together that several dozen people could come up with something better in a matter of hours after they finished the game (and I'm not only talking about the indoctrination theory; Arkis' alternative ending was very well put together, too) without having a reason for it and possibly working on a significant improvement. They just can't afford doing that. I mean, you guys disagree with us, but you're pissed about the plotholes too, right? How many customers would Bioware lose because of this? How many don't speak up but actually finish the game and think that this was absolutely horrible (not because of the endings themselves but because of everything that is just plain wrong)?

Sorry I meant protaganist.  Too late to go back an edit it now.

And you clearly have far more faith in BW than you should.  Their stories were never that good and always full of plotholes.  What makes their games good is the ability to have some control over the events, not the events themselves. 

The fact that these exact endings were taken from a script datamined from the leaked demo shows BW has thought these endings were great for a substantial period of time.  They were just wrong.

[MrAtomica]

Whispers: "Shepard-Commander, the geth only acted in defense after the creators attacked. Do we deserve death?"

Just saw this, it happens in the dream just before the assault to retake Earth. Could this perhaps be an indication of the Reapers trying to subtly steer you away from choosing destroy? Notice how Legion's question is posed as something which has not happened yet, but will...

[Auresta]

crimsontotem wrote...

N3vDawg wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/tQlte.jpg

woah what? lol that mean Shepard was transporte dot Medical camp in London

Please, question evidence. Some people have pointed out that not everyone gets this message, that it might have been sent at the wrong time, etc. A nice piece of evidence but don't invest your faith entirely in each piece.

[knilchibus]

JulienJaden wrote...

Capeo wrote...

JulienJaden wrote...

killnoob wrote...

Fledgey wrote...
Scripts can change, and things can be leaked on purpose to create a false expectation.

And Bioware did WTC.

Seriously, listen to yourself.

Don't be ridiculous. The US government did that.


Anyway, alright, let's start at zero: If every ending is real, how can Shepard survive the station exploding around him, shields failing (thus, no atmosphere), and, if we assume that this scene takes place on Earth, re-entry into the planet's atmosphere?
If you can give me a satisfying answer based on what we see in the current endings that doesn't involve teleportation or space magic, I'm willing to accept it as a valid point.
Just don't go around trolling everyone when there's plotholes the size of Nevada.

You answered your own question.  Plot hole.  The game is rife with ridiculous plotholes yet people on this thread seem to think that right at the zero hour BW suddenly pulled their crap together and got clever on the endings that have been the same for 8 months in the very least.

You're talking about a game series where the antagonist has already been brought back from the dead and that in which the entire trilogy is resolved using space magic.  ME is extraordininarly soft sci-fi and has always been full of space magic and incongruities. 

As for that one scene specifically?  It's tossing fans a bone because they were afraid everyone would complain if there was no way to have Shep survive and Destroy is the ONLY ending that allows for that.  That's all it means.  Nothing more.  The other two endings consume Shep.  Everyone on here is using circular logic and putting the cart before the horse.  The simple answer is that Shep got back to the teleportation beam somehow.  The same kind of somehow that allowed the citadel to suddenly get to earth or the same somehow that allows the engineering impossibility of building the Crucible or the same kind of somehow that stops the Reapers from simply taking the Citadel from the start as has been their plan millions of times before or the same kind of somehow that allows the Reapers to simply ignore the incoming Crucible instead of destroying it.

Which antagonist was brought back from the dead? Saren never died. TIM never died (as far as I know).
Yes, the protagonist gets resurrected, but at incredible financial costs, because of some lucky coincidences and so much technology to repair him/her that it's a miracle none of Shepard's enemies just uses a magnet to incapacitate him/her.
However, within the game's lore, it makes sense. It's borderline, granted, but it made sense.

Also, we don't understand what the Citadel is, exactly. Who says it can't move? Who says it can't jump?
And who said the Crucible was impossible to build? The plans were hard to decipher and it took thousands of engineers and scientists and huge amounts of raw materials and production facilities, but those you partially gather during your campaign. That's why none of us complain about it. Everything is relatively sound up to those final minutes.

Now, the plotholes make no sense, and with Bioware being the company it is, I don't think they'd intentionally mess this up for no reason whatsoever. With EA calling the shots, it seems plausible they were under time pressure and put together a sloppy ending so they could ship in time. They didn't do anything they promised and, up until now, they haven't really told us anything definite about it. They just continue playing coy, with Hudson announcing there will be DLC in the future.


I just don't think they'd finish the trilogy with something so badly written and put together that several dozen people could come up with something better in a matter of hours after they finished the game (and I'm not only talking about the indoctrination theory; Arkis' alternative ending was very well put together, too) without having a reason for it and possibly working on a significant improvement. They just can't afford doing that. I mean, you guys disagree with us, but you're pissed about the plotholes too, right? How many customers would Bioware lose because of this? How many don't speak up but actually finish the game and think that this was absolutely horrible (not because of the endings themselves but because of everything that is just plain wrong)?

I don't know. I think you should see Mass Effect rather as an Harry Potter-like franchise. I dont believe that they would allow an accurate ending to be leaked. After all the Mass Effect franchise probably generates an enormous stream of revenue. So either they didn't care at that point since they were changing the ending anyways, an important thing wasn't leaked or they leaked it by themselves.

[Auresta]

MrAtomica wrote...

Whispers: "Shepard-Commander, the geth only acted in defense after the creators attacked. Do we deserve death?"

Just saw this, it happens in the dream just before the assault to retake Earth. Could this perhaps be an indication of the Reapers trying to subtly steer you away from choosing destroy? Notice how Legion's question is posed as something which has not happened yet, but will...

Doesn't he say this during the Geth-Quarian encounter? Maybe the reapers brought it up to instill guilt in Shepard but I wouldn't read too far into it.

[HairyMadDog1010]

crimsontotem wrote...

N3vDawg wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/tQlte.jpg

woah what? lol that mean Shepard was transporte dot Medical camp in London

And there we go we were right all along.

[Psyro]

Anyone see a similiar to matrix?

red pill: U wake up and realisize that you lived in a dream world.
red choice: Destroy Reaper won the fight of indoctrination. wake up at the end(breathing scene with the rubble) so Illusion is over



blue pill: don´t wake up u live in an illusion. matrix controll you but u don´t know it.
blue choice: controlling the reaper. You don´t controll them. The Reaper controll you.

green choice: maybe 70/30 ? Green = Blue/Yellow maybe some middle thing don´t know.

Just my 2 cents

It was a tought.

[Delular]

MrAtomica wrote...

Whispers: "Shepard-Commander, the geth only acted in defense after the creators attacked. Do we deserve death?"

Just saw this, it happens in the dream just before the assault to retake Earth. Could this perhaps be an indication of the Reapers trying to subtly steer you away from choosing destroy? Notice how Legion's question is posed as something which has not happened yet, but will...

did the OP mention that people should listen to the 'Indoctrination' codex as is explains the dreams, sounds and ghosts???

[FrostByte-GER]

orionshield wrote...

FrostByte-GER wrote...

orionshield wrote...

ALSO IN THE BEGINNING THE LITTLE BOY WITH THE ALLIANCE FIGHTER IN HIS HAND HAS NO SHADOW BUT WHEN THE SCENE CUTS TO SHEPARD YOU IMMEDIATELY SEE SHEPARDS HAND MAKE SHADOW OVER HIS FACE,,,.......THE LITTLE BOY ISN'T REAL AND THE AI AS WELL, WHEN TIM USED INDOCTRINATION ON SHEPARD, LATER SHEPARD WAS DREAMING THE LAST TEN MINIUTES OF THE GAME, HE ACTUALLY PASSED OUT NEXT TO ANDERSON AND WHEN HE HAD A LOSS OF BLOOD, ONE PASSES OUT RIGHT AWAY,,,,THE ENDING IS STILL NOT COMPLETE!

He has a Shadow....

but never when shepard sees him when the camera is behind shepard

Ah saw it now...but I think thats because the visibility of the details. Its like Skyrim. The shadows of far trees isn't visible to improve the performance...

But you could be right. Nice find

Modifié par FrostByte-GER, 14 mars 2012 - 06:19 .

[JulienJaden]

usmack5 wrote...

I have nothing to add to that.

[crimsontotem]

Auresta wrote...

crimsontotem wrote...

N3vDawg wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/tQlte.jpg

woah what? lol that mean Shepard was transporte dot Medical camp in London

Please, question evidence. Some people have pointed out that not everyone gets this message, that it might have been sent at the wrong time, etc. A nice piece of evidence but don't invest your faith entirely in each piece.

maybe people who only chose "Destroy" ending? can anyone confirm that?

[byne]

Auresta wrote...

crimsontotem wrote...

N3vDawg wrote...

http://i.imgur.com/tQlte.jpg

woah what? lol that mean Shepard was transporte dot Medical camp in London

Please, question evidence. Some people have pointed out that not everyone gets this message, that it might have been sent at the wrong time, etc. A nice piece of evidence but don't invest your faith entirely in each piece.

Even supposing its its a message sent at the wrong time, when would that be?

If its supposed to be Ash in the hospital, it'd make more sense to say 'They might let you see me today'.

Also, they let you see her even before she wakes up, so why would she be telling you that you might be able to see her sometime soon?

Also, why tell Shepard to hang in there? Ash is the one who is hurt, not Shep.

[Rhod747]

Not sure if this has been posted.

I feel strongly about the indoctrination theory, but something that occured to me was the ending scene after the credits with the adult and the child, where the man supposedly was telling the story to the child, you can notice that the planet they are on has 2 moons which look exactly the same as in scene where the Normandy crashes. I find it odd that apparently a civilization has been made out of around 20 people who seem to have advanced to the point where space flight is seeable but not achievable. That could have seriouse effects on the indoctrination theory.

Also, I did a second playthrough of Mass Effect 3 yesterday (started anyway). Again, I'm not sure if anybody has said this before, but in the begining where you first encounter husks, the child which you couldn't 'save' beleived to be part of the indoctrination theory, was standing right where the husks were coming from (he then runs into the building where Shepard sees him in the vent) but why didn't the husks attack him, and why didn't Anderson say anything about him (he was obviously in plain site) I found this as more evidence to suggest that it's Shepard imagining him, because if you notice the building where he's on, he's NOWHERE NEAR a highrise building with a nice little garden on the top where Shepard saw him playing with a toy fighter, and it must have only been around 10 minutes since Shepard saw him first. BioWare were either planting that as evidence to us or are seriously overestimating children..

[killnoob]

Capeo wrote...



Sorry I meant protaganist.  Too late to go back an edit it now.

And you clearly have far more faith in BW than you should.  Their stories were never that good and always full of plotholes.  What makes their games good is the ability to have some control over the events, not the events themselves. 

The fact that these exact endings were taken from a script datamined from the leaked demo shows BW has thought these endings were great for a substantial period of time.  They were just wrong.

I agree, but even so, they've managed to make ME3 fun for the most part.

At least for me.

But they really did screw up the ending, and I hate seeing how desparately people are trying to fill the blank themselves, when Bioware are the ones who should come forward and say

Yeah we messed up. This is supposed to be blah blah blah

Nevertheless, people will never stop anyway.
Conspiracy theories always have their audience.

And if we're seriously coming up with all these ridiculous theories to justify their crappy ending,

then we've done EXACTLY what they wanted us to do.

Fill in the blanks.

[Capeo]

IronSabbath88 wrote...

Why is it that every person going against this theory just points to the fact that BioWare are either stupid, not that clever, or just flat out dumb?

That's kind of a convulted argument. I could easily say the same about you, but I won't, because I don't have the proof to back that up.

Because we do have proof that BW has never been particularly good writers.  Every game has huge plot holes and they get worse with each game.

[monrapias]

There are alot of interesting factions going on here.

I'm still not quite sure about all of this, but I sure hope that there are some truth to it.

But seeing as harbringer wants you alive, what if, the lazer just passes you out, and in the dlc, (if there are any to come) you wake up inside harbringer, and have to destroy it from the inside, before using the conduit.

[Moirai]

Little Lummo wrote...

If only these were options...

http://www.tumblr.co...v2e1CxZd1qh43rr

Thank you for making me laugh.

Modifié par Moirai, 14 mars 2012 - 06:18 .