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Was the ending a hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory


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#16176
Baihu1983

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Martukis wrote...

Looking through the game files, a lot of them have logical names - I think most of the BioA_CerJcb files relate to Jacob's optional mission. But there are some I do not know if I've seen, like the BioA_Cat002_Cathederal, or Stalingrad. I also see some ProEar files referring to a trial, and possible escape... strange...


Would that be the last part of the Thessia mission?

#16177
undyinghunter

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Ok Then if the real ending isn't on the disk the is has to be an up coming free DLC. Bioware is too smart to try and make people pay for the real ending.

#16178
beyzend

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Baihu1983 wrote...

Martukis wrote...

Looking through the game files, a lot of them have logical names - I think most of the BioA_CerJcb files relate to Jacob's optional mission. But there are some I do not know if I've seen, like the BioA_Cat002_Cathederal, or Stalingrad. I also see some ProEar files referring to a trial, and possible escape... strange...


Would that be the last part of the Thessia mission?


I don't think there is anything hidden in the PC version. I just unpacked those end**.afc files. Nothing hidden.

#16179
arkhine

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Rifneno wrote...

It's hope crushing to see the notes reference a movie where the main character is in a virtual reality and can only get out of it by taking the red option? ... I guess it's hope crushing if you're hoping that IT isn't true. But that's about it.


It's hope crushing when they start defending their endings and we see proof they cut out a lot of good stuff (Garrus falling over and Liara helping him up, Anderson and Shepard's longer dialogue, etc.). Wasn't the Matrix thing just a draft? There is nothing in the leaked script like that.

#16180
arkhine

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undyinghunter wrote...

Ok Then if the real ending isn't on the disk the is has to be an up coming free DLC. Bioware is too smart to try and make people pay for the real ending.


I wouldn't put it past them...

#16181
AdmiralsJack

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Blubox wrote...

CptData wrote...

DangerSandler wrote...

Well whatever happens really, I'm proud to have took part of the "Hold the Line" movement. I've never really seen the gaming community ban together against something so passionately before. It's pretty incredible to be honest.


Pretty much. It's incredible the normally divided fandom (Liara-fans, Tali-fans, Garrus-fans, Ashley-fans, Cerberus-fans, ...) finally fight for the same cause: convincing BW to change the endings / create real endings.


fîghting together to "take back earth"...that reminds me of something ^^


signed we are all together in this and we will hold the line!

#16182
Elscotto1989

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AdmiralsJack wrote...

Blubox wrote...

CptData wrote...

DangerSandler wrote...

Well whatever happens really, I'm proud to have took part of the "Hold the Line" movement. I've never really seen the gaming community ban together against something so passionately before. It's pretty incredible to be honest.


Pretty much. It's incredible the normally divided fandom (Liara-fans, Tali-fans, Garrus-fans, Ashley-fans, Cerberus-fans, ...) finally fight for the same cause: convincing BW to change the endings / create real endings.


fîghting together to "take back earth"...that reminds me of something ^^


signed we are all together in this and we will hold the line!

though some of us are a bit more outspoken about how we feel, some of us even coming across as hotheaded or angry, they have every right to be, and whether your civil and biding your time or tweeting up a storm as fast as your keyboard will allow. i am honored to be a part of a community that is capable of coming together in such a manner fighting for the greater good of us all as mass effect fans. i look forward to spending the following days, weeks or even months if need be holding the line with each of you. Keelah Se'lai.

#16183
lex0r11

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on a completely different sidenote:
everyone who has a ps3 should play Journey. just to take the mind off of this whole thing for awhile.

youtu.be/1IrLprAS5FU

surprising take on multiplayer interaction too.

#16184
Arphee

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Having just beaten the game earlier today after my copy
arriving in the mail Tuesday, having avoided all spoilers until POST-ending, i
have to say I’ve been expecting this since the demo; the child just didn't sit
right with me.

 

I played the game doing all side quests, Resolving the
Turian/Krogan conflict as well as the Geth/Quarian conflict, unable to get the
perfect ending due to lack of 8000 TMS even being available, i scoured every
map as much as possible as well, though there weren't many hidden things of any
value aside from possibly the Kai Ling terminal showing the illusive man
telling Kai Ling to avoid killing Sheppard as he may still be 'Useful" as
well as the terminal with data on the illusive man having the doctor install
the reaper implants in him.

 

The game was near perfect until the ending, at least
story-wise all the way up until the final charge, i noticed most of the things
listed within this topic, the lack of squad following, the change of the games
atmosphere, the inaccuracies, the sudden warped graphics detail, the
similarities between the charge site and the crucible connection, but what
bothered me the most was parts after the encounter with TIM.

 

See the whole illusive man scene had inaccuracies but it
made sense, despite the robo-maniquin corpses and the low-res human corpses
with the same copy pasted face, and the keepers being detailed wrong, even the
blood dripping from the ceiling and Anderson magically getting ahead of you
despite it being the only path to the terminal.

 

TIM pops up using is new reaper implants to forcibly control
Sheppard and Anderson, and as the scene goes on you can see TIM become
increasingly reaper-like that with the vast and diverse dialogue options leads
me to believe this was most certainly meant to be there, that it was extremely
integral, Sheppard then sits down with Anderson.

 

At this point i was confused, having ignored the child in my
dreams for quite a bit in the first two to check out each group of floating
black specters i noticed him calling in harbingers, as well as people that had
already died calling to me, even people that died in the previous games, one of
the groups actually gave me an audio from Kelly chambers from ME2, everything
lead to me believe there would be some kind of plot twist like this.

 

But at that final scene it seemed like it made sense,
Sheppard one, crisis averted, until admiral Hackett radios and Sheppard
stumbled forward collapses and ascends to the star child scene. where the child
explains itself and awe inspired Sheppard just listens to what he is told,
completely out of character, to which i then notice the most confusing thing of
all, the inversion of paragon/renegade between Anderson and TIM, what’s more is
why is that child being used as the avatar for what is presumably to be a
Reaper AI projection, why doesn't Sheppard say anything about it referring to
the reapers by saying "we" looking out the windows gazing at the
fight still going on in full force, why doesn't anyone radio Sheppard? his com
is still working, but after a few minutes i realize nothing special is going to
happen I'm in one hell of a predicament, distracted i forget Paragon is now the
control option and walk up to it Sheppard, he gets huskified while the AI
interface stares smirking, Sheppard reminisces about his comrades, but instead
of their faces being happy they seem concerned.

 

A beam shoots out the reapers up and leave earth, but the
mass relays are now destroyed they have nowhere to go, I'm ****ting bricks, the
entire mass effect universe is now defunct as every relay gets destroyed
ruining the entire mass effect universe permanently, rendering any chance of
the mass effect series continuing in any medium besides prequels as the reapers
now supposedly under Sheppard control, and an unfathomable number of soldiers
from every race is now marooned on the sol system if it isn't destroyed by the
relay destruction.

 

now joker is flying the Normandy in front of the blast,
another bout of confusion washed over me, the blast is damaging the SR-2's
thrusters, how did he get here what in gods name is going on, he’s panicking
hitting every button on the console, he gets blown away- I'm worried, no idea
what’s happening the Normandy is crashed surprisingly well off on some planets
moon, did joke make it? why is the Normandy
here, how did this happen? why did joker run, he emerges dazed by the light,
soon after Edi and Tali walk out with him, how did they get there, didn't  they die when harbinger attacked while we
were rushing? how did they wind up here, they wind up there, is this
indoctrination? no, reapers unsympathetic, wouldn't appease Sheppard, dream? no
illusive man had to be real, what is happening?

 

credits roll i roll it over in my head speaking to myself
like Morin, the music of the credits play, minutes pass by, then finally, the
planet where the Normandy landed now seemingly in winter, small child talking
to an adult, "Did all of that really happen" "Yeah, some was lot
to time though" "Tell me another story about the Sheppard"
"its getting late, but okay, One More Story" not the last story of
the Sheppard, series continuity in tact some how?

 

Must have missed something, told child story form mass
effect 1 to the end of 3 "All of that" planet is where Normandy landed
apparently, descendents of former human crew, new games? trilogy, not end of
Sheppard? Now child needs to rest soon, short story....Post ending DLC...But
how

 

Click confirmation box load up before Cerberus base,
re-listen to entire codex re-read secondary codex entries, still doesn't make
sense, plot hole makes indoctrination theory improbable, must be within close
proximity to reaper technology while it attempts to break targets willpower.

 

Indoctrination works like decryption, all organics have will
power, able to resist with precaution if you know what effects are, long-term
indoctrination process like skilled hacker slowly disseminating data, brain
stays in tact very long time- short term equal to brute-force exhaustive key
search.

 

 Sheppard's dreams all
take place on the Normandy...no
proximity to access Sheppard through reaper technology...

 

Normandy
housing reaper technology? No....Cant be, alliance gutted Normandy for re-fitting, though... James
hears hum in cargo bay...Can it be...No....Reaper IFF indoctrinating Sheppard
as he sleeps?

 

Catalyst "Starchild" refers to itself as a reaper,
final indoctrination attempt likely- use of brute force organic equivalent of a
brute force exhaustive key search as last ditch effort to stop Sheppard, side
effects unsurprising, pass out possible, Sheppard most vulnerable physically
and mentally after events on Thessia and seeing homeland destroyed.

 

Possible, most logical conclusion as harbinger lands he
begins using signal to attack Sheppard, Sheppard gets hit, goes down, harbinger
makes major break throughs on accessing Sheppard main functionality, Sheppard
presses on, as scene progresses things become more and more distorted as
harbinger gets closer and closer to assuming control!

 

Sheppard reaches platform and encounters TIM this is real,
Sheppard opens the citadel sits with Anderson then talks before Anderson passes
out/dies Sheppard gets a comm call form Anderson and he stumbles, from here
forth did not happen.

 

Finally harbinger cracks Sheppard this is embodied by the
stargazer scene where Sheppard has three options while his mind is quickly
deteriorating being damaged by the reaper presence, everything is distorted, he
is essentially on the verge of being completely controlled by the reapers, even
his views of morality are skewed by reaper influence, even this thread touches
on  that simple fact.

 

The "Paragon" and "Neutral" options are
traps and trick Sheppard's self defense, as in his organic programming in this
case being will power to use its resources to attempt to CO-opt the reaper
signal to try and take harbinger / star child over causing him to loose and be
indoctrinated, or to surrender via synergy and also causes Sheppard to become
indoctrinated.

 

I’ve seen the perfect ending includes Sheppard taking a
single breath in London's rubble, i believe future DLC will bridge this gap, as
you can imagine, this means the RED option frees Sheppard from indoctrination,
now, what I'm about to say form here on is speculation in regards to the future
of the series AE the post-completion DLC on its way soon.

 

Sheppard Becoming indoctrinated or freeing himself plays a
significant role in the next DLC however I don’t think Sheppard will be
playable in it, after sustaining heavy blood loss and narrowly fending off the
reapers attack on his mind, its a miracle hes even alive, but the crucible
hasn't fired, remember, the starchild scene was an hallucination, and very
likely the end of Sheppard if you don’t get the perfect ending.

 

The game will pick up outside of the citadel beam mere
minutes after harbinger decimates the initial rush squad and Sheppard and
Andersen went to the citadel, a barely surviving wave of hammer troops push
through (Including your remaining squad members) being chased towards harbinger
by the remainder of the reaper ground forces, Hackett now worried orders joker and
the SR2 along with a small group of assorted war assets to provide air support
against harbinger so hammer can make one final push.

 

The "Suicide" mission of sorts will be headed by
Major Coats, this was my gut instinct, he will assume the role of whatever Sheppard’s
class using stats from the multilayer portion of the game like a typical
alliance marine, this will give the game the ability to give a real ending,
showcase the war assets, insure the continuity of the series as a whole, and
give people the real endings they deserved with the consequences we wanted.

 

essentially the game will assumptively check for major
forces, for instance GETH / QUARIAN forces, some of the more notable side
quests like Dekuna TURIAN / GETH and will run sword and hammer checks for
unique assets to create a scene similar to the ME2 suicide mission, however,
while  scenes will be played for several
unique Sword and Hammer assets the main functionality of these checks will be
to determine the success of activating the real crucible, recovering OR saving
Sheppard and Anderson, recovering the two crew-mates brought with Sheppard for
the final run.

 

If Sheppard didn't get the bets ending, he will be a final
boss, similar to saren before activating the crucible, this is essentially the
largest difference, if Sheppard has the perfect ending instead of this boss
fight Coats and the remainder of the people with him (Dependent on Hammer and
Sword scores) will instead help Anderson and Sheppard's Unconscious bodies /
corpses escape the facility.

 

Since there is no way DOWN from the teleporter the final act
of the game will now begin with either Coat, two squadmates, and AI support alliance
and hammer troops fighting through hordes of reaper troops panicking within the
citadel (Its common sense to assume there would be husks etc on the citadel
fighting C-sec, Which would also make a lot of sense that this is planned due
to the fact C-sec troops had no way of being deployed during the last mission)



So after breaking through reaper forces saving civilians an C-sec officers
along the way you must then make your escape before the crucible fires, using
the entire Citadels power sources and destroying the CITADEL in the process
(ONLY THE CITADEL unless bioware is clever enough to include a “Brain” Check
with Hammer and Shield to determine if the science efforts were enough to set
the weapon up properly, then there may be collateral damage to the relay
network)



In any case kicking ass and taking names like the true replacement for Sheppard
he loads off civilians into shuttles, if your hammer / sword scores were high
enough the ground team for Sheppard is already loaded onto the Normandy, this
would give reason to Sheppard’s last scene that doesn’t make sense, it could be
his final premonition, throughout the series Sheppard has seemingly known when
things are right or wrong, like him not even questioning the reaper existence
from the beginning of the game, this may be his final premonition before
becoming indoctrinated, dying, or In the best case scenario just passing out.

No matter what the scene was a part of his indoctrination or
hallucination, however, the fact it remains STATIC throughout all three ending
even if Sheppard lives or dies, the entire Normandy crew may still get stranded
on a random planet, for instance, while attempting to pick up the last Shuttle
filled with presumably Coats squad members borrowed off the Normandy roster and
an injured Sheppard and Anderson  a  reaper destroyer attacks the SR2 trying to do
as much damage as possible before the reapers are destroyed, while evading the
Destroyer he is forced to take evasive maneuvers into the atmosphere while Cortez,
(if he survived if not a random alliance soldier) is flying the civilian
shuttle that the crew is on, as coats and the last remaining Civilians evacuate
the citadel the crucible can be heard whirring up to fire.



The crucible fires off a pale blue beam straight into the blackness of space
wit ha hard wave pulsating out of it shaking the earth to its foundations,  the reapers overload one in the background as
Joker attempts to go after the shuttle with 
Sheppard’s corpse/body onboard getting caught in the initial blast, the
Normandy disappears, seemingly leaving people at another cliff hanger until a
re shaded, in the light blue scene takes place of joker fiddling with the
controls while trying to out run the blast with his FTL drives, this time EDI
can be heard bickering with him through the ships intercom (No matter what her
body is on earth unless used by Sheppard for the mission, in which case her
body will be in the seat next to him)



They wind up marooned on the same planet that Sheppard eerily
dreamed/hallucinated while under indoctrination / the attempted indoctrination.
Sheppard’s shuttle gets hit by a shockwave causing it to crash (With the crew
chosen by kites, survival also calculated by war assets)



the very last cut scene will be a cascading view of the Sword forces doing a
victory lap before panning over to hammer forces celebrating as all reaper
ground forces collapse due to loss of reaper signal, and then finally down to
the crashed shuttle with the survivors calculated crawling out form the
shuttle, FINALLY, it ends with Sheppard’s breath.

 

Fading into the new credits, 
the game show the current galactic year as the mass effect 3 Codex voice
begins talking, it appears to be a documentary about the events of ME3 stating
the outcome for the major galactic players (Asari Turian Salarian Krogan
Quarian Geth and Rachni) he will essentially report  a lot of major information, alternatively
they could use Allers  if she were
recruited, but it wouldn’t feel right, in any case, after the documentary scene
is complete they would turn to a Memorial, OR a muted speech being given by
commander Sheppard.



The new ending equal to the people on the moon will instead be an older man and
his son in a civilian car with the ending of the documentary speech playing on
a console in the car, the child then asks the man about commander Sheppard, I’m
not the writer for the game so I don’t know what will be said, but I’m sure its
along the lines of a modified version of the originals dialogue, instead of
asking about the stars hell probably ask about joining the alliance, and
instead of one more story hell ask to see one more vid.

And as such ME3 would effectively be saved, more Post-ending
DLC would be added in a similar format to how the Dragon Age ORIGINS dlc worked
(Lilianas song, etc etc) this would be pretty large add on in and of itself,
almost as noteworthy as Awakening  in my
book, they could do more to sweeten the pot since it will probably be  a PAY dlc, but they can add a multiplayer add
on segment to it and one post new-ending DLC featuring going with Sheppard if
he survived or Coats to pick up the Normandy crew  as well as some minor other quests nothing
too significant, aboard a normal alliance frigate for travel..



But yeah, that’s what I assumed within the last 10 minutes of the game, took
much longer to write all of this then it did to predict what was going to
happen. Thoughts opinions anyone, Am I crazy, or just Too speculative? Wish
bioware would use the material if they don’t already have plans?



All I know is something /will/ be done, otherwise the ending wouldn’t be the
way it is, that’s just my take on what the solution may be.

#16185
thePredator50

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Probably fake but still:

Posted Image

#16186
wicked_being

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You know what, I hope you guys are right about this whole indoctrination theory. Anything is better than the ending we have now.

Modifié par wicked_being, 17 mars 2012 - 01:06 .


#16187
arkhine

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thePredator50 wrote...

Probably fake but still:


Those could be rennamed ME3 files?

#16188
Pathero

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Couple Questions:

1. Someone in another thread said the indoctrination theory was toast. Say it ain't so.

2. So Godchild, Mass Relays getting nuked after sending out the wave do they?


about 2:11
Several times we can see a single relay pass the message on, but it does this sequentially.
Why is dat?

Godchild LIES is why.

#16189
MatthewGold

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Pathero wrote...

Couple Questions:

1. Someone in another thread said the indoctrination theory was toast. Say it ain't so.

It ain't so.

Modifié par MatthewGold, 17 mars 2012 - 01:21 .


#16190
Pathero

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[quote]MatthewGold wrote...

[quote]Pathero wrote...

Couple Questions:

1. Someone in another thread said the indoctrination theory was toast. Say it ain't so.
[/quoteIt ain't so.[/quote]

:D

#16191
AdmiralsJack

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[quote]Pathero wrote...

[quote]MatthewGold wrote...

[quote]Pathero wrote...

Couple Questions:

1. Someone in another thread said the indoctrination theory was toast. Say it ain't so.
[/quoteIt ain't so.[/quote]

:D

[/quote]

it is better than any other theory I heard/read till now so... :)

#16192
Lugaidster

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This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.

#16193
AdmiralsJack

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Lugaidster wrote...

This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.


i cant see it in my country :(

#16194
mutermath

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Lugaidster wrote...

This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.

-________-

#16195
Lugaidster

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AdmiralsJack wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.


i cant see it in my country :(


 

#16196
AdmiralsJack

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Lugaidster wrote...

AdmiralsJack wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.


i cant see it in my country :(


 


thx :) lol :-D

Modifié par AdmiralsJack, 17 mars 2012 - 01:32 .


#16197
Raze4573

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We have enough BS with the endings. Stop posting fake pics or 4chan "evidence" or a stupid rick roll movie. Hold the line!

#16198
Lugaidster

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AdmiralsJack wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

AdmiralsJack wrote...

Lugaidster wrote...

This video here:



Summarizes what Bioware intended to provoke on us with the ending. I'm pretty sure you will see we were indoctrinized.


i cant see it in my country :(


 


lol :-D


I really enjoy that video. It always brightens my day. :wizard:

#16199
Red Starblazer

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Terran235 wrote...

KujaTheDarkOne2 wrote...

Red Starblazer wrote...

beyzend wrote...

what? I only lost Jack. Not sure how that happened tho. I did the loyalty mission with her, maybe it's because I didn't do a whole lot with her because I was planning to do another run.


I actually teared up when I lost Mordin and Legion...:crying:


Mordin in particular got me. It was when he started singing his song. :crying:


I was sad for that same reason, got teary eyed. But lets not forget when LEGION asks "Do "i" have a soul" Adorable and sad at the same time.


*group hug*

Modifié par Red Starblazer, 17 mars 2012 - 01:36 .


#16200
Lugaidster

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Raze4573 wrote...

We have enough BS with the endings. Stop posting fake pics or 4chan "evidence" or a stupid rick roll movie. Hold the line!


Don't take it like that man. I'm trying to lighten the mood. I'm with you on this, but you can't always be so serious, you'll burn out. And trust me, I've been here for at least 9 days, so yeah, a chuckle every once in a while goes a long way in maintaining morale.