57139 réponses à ce sujet

[waldstr18]

you gotta be kidding me?

out of spite or fun? we are talking about the reapers, arent we? yeah, they seem like a fun bunch of guys. im so looking forward to the dlc, in which, when you made the wrong choice, the reapers are going a river dance like victory dance on earth, just out of spite ... or fun...

[Erethrian]

waldstr18 wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Vahilor wrote...


The illussion is given by Harbinger and Harbinger is in controll of the illusion, created it and it is more Harbinger who is annoyed and that influences the illusion.

Thats my thought on the low EMS part as well. Harbinger realizes that the Reapers are already winning and dont need Shepard and as such pretty much pulls a "Lets just end this dream and finish it" and as such only one choice because it dosent matter if Shepard gets turned or not, its allready over.

then why is he even trying to indoctrinate in the first place? practice for the next cycle? makes sense, cause the next indoctrination wont be for another 50k years.

From another post:

Gernbuster  said: "The Reapers think they might lose this time. Javik says the Protheans lost, because they had only one strategie and one culture, this time the galaxy gets united with all its different species and weapons. In the words of a Reaper: The strength of all, the weakness of none"

Shepard is the person the whole galaxy is trusting. If he would get indoctrinated the Reapers would definitly win."

I think they could want to win without a single loss, or completely demoralize the enemy (the fleet) by turning Shepard against them.

Modifié par Erethrian, 27 mars 2012 - 11:06 .

[Vahilor]

.

Ad_Hoc wrote...

Movies you mentioned, though ive seen neither of them, informed that its a part
1 of 2, so its very different from what we have here if IDT is true.

The prinicipal remains the same though it is still only "half" a story whether they tell you that or not is irrelevent. Would it have been any better if Bioware launched Mass Effect Part 1 and Mass Effect Part 2 a year later? However bad the fan uproar is now it would be much worse.

It is not the same :
a) They told you that they need to make 2 parts cause they have to scrap down to much if they only make one part.
Nobody is expecting a ending for the first part cause they told you it will be continued in a second one.

Edit:
And if they would have told us, they need to make two parts cause of time and complexibility of the Story, that would have been much better like the endings we have now.

Modifié par Vahilor, 27 mars 2012 - 11:07 .

[JustAidan]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

Mbednar wrote...

3:We have no idea yet about the cost, if any. Bare in mind that the 360 and PS3 install sizes are gigabytes bigger than the PC install size, given how PC people tear into game assests and the cost  from SONY/Microsoft to put DLC on their servers this may suggest that 360/PS3 players already have the ending installed while PC player will download it from Origin (which EA controls).

Thats actually interesting. I mean us PC user are pretty garantued to have an Internet connection for downloading the update since we had to activate the game on Origin.

Yep, I can confirm the PC version is just under 10gbs, other players have reported that the 360/PS3 version is 15gbs (!!)

[waldstr18]

then again, why give you only one choice at the end or have an annoyed star child waiting if they still want to indoctrinate you to get a flawless victory announcment at the end? doesnt that contradict itself?

[JustAidan]

Vahilor wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

tobito113 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

tobito113 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Two things occured to me while reading this thread.

One, in over 900 pages, 20,000 post or more, I have yet to see one mod appear/and or make a statement of any kind, even the "keep it polite" kind (which, don't get me wrong, we seem to be doing an excellent job policing ourselves)

That fact alone says something. I'm not sure what, but moderators specifically avoiding this thread? Veeeeeeeery interesting.

Indeed, plus someone pointed out earlier that this thread hasn't been moved to fan fiction
Also, Jessica Merizan has linked to this thread twice from her twitter, once before and once after the ending outrage.

Right now she is pulling the "multiple interpretations" idea on us. She is talking like the end of ME3 could be seen like the end of Inception (you didnt know if what happened was a dream or reality at the end)

Maybe thas just her way of "speculating" so she might not know anything 

I don't think she is speculating, some of her twitter feeds were practially bouncing like someone who is dying to tell people the twist. She has even said as much.

That was before people started flooding her tweet thinking she was hiding something. Now she using the "art has many interpretations" argument. I think she is just letting people speculate (since Indoc theory is a good way to deflate the anger over the endings)

Yeah, she took a lot of flak from upset players as she was the only one from the PR department really talking to players.

Remember she was hinting at the indoc theory BEFORE people got angry, that suggests that the indoc is intended.

The longer we speculate the more PR exposure this thing gets, also consider that Bioware know exactly how much their playerbase cares about the ME setting as can be seen from that badly written ME novel fiasco awhile back.

And is it not a god thing that a lot of fans care so much about the game ? Cause so much people caring about shows BW that a lot of people really love a lot about ME and the characters, that the games were able to make people really get involved into the storys and somhow emotional involved into the whole story...
and im pretty convinced most people really liked all about the games, except of the endings =)

You may have misunderstood my meaning, I just meant she took the brunt of players concerns, got stressed out/overburdened, clamed up for awhile and then started being a tease again.

Though you have to admit, some of the players' responses have been less than civilised if not outright aggressive.

[Denvian]

I think in april if IT turns out to NOT be Bio-ware's plan all along (something I have believed and argued for like 2 weeks) I think Bio-ware should give us a T-Shirt that says:

I believed in the artistic integrity of Bio-ware
And all I got was this T-Shirt

If it does turn out to be their plan all along I will not need a T-Shirt because that would be AWESOME!!!

Modifié par Denvian, 27 mars 2012 - 11:13 .

[Hy0ga]

I have a question. I do believe Shep is indoctrinated, there's just too much evidence. But somewhat, the Reapers seems to do things in a different way with him/her.

I mean, they had a lot of chances to kill Shepard. In the Arrival, for instance, they caged Shep and the indoctrinated doctor said to keep him alive. Why? And when they actually killed him/her, they hired the Shadow Broker to recover and deliver the body, not to destroy it. Again, why?

Looks like they NEED Shes for some ungodly reason. Any thoughts?

[Vahilor]

waldstr18 wrote...

then again, why give you only one choice at the end or have an annoyed star child waiting if they still want to indoctrinate you to get a flawless victory announcment at the end? doesnt that contradict itself?

Cause Sheps mind is so weakend you don't need to put much effort into indictrinate him anymore.

[kj0600]

[EDIT: Confirmed FAKE]

Modifié par kj0600, 27 mars 2012 - 11:46 .

[Vahilor]

JustAidan wrote...

Vahilor wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

tobito113 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

tobito113 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Two things occured to me while reading this thread.

One, in over 900 pages, 20,000 post or more, I have yet to see one mod appear/and or make a statement of any kind, even the "keep it polite" kind (which, don't get me wrong, we seem to be doing an excellent job policing ourselves)

That fact alone says something. I'm not sure what, but moderators specifically avoiding this thread? Veeeeeeeery interesting.

Indeed, plus someone pointed out earlier that this thread hasn't been moved to fan fiction
Also, Jessica Merizan has linked to this thread twice from her twitter, once before and once after the ending outrage.

Right now she is pulling the "multiple interpretations" idea on us. She is talking like the end of ME3 could be seen like the end of Inception (you didnt know if what happened was a dream or reality at the end)

Maybe thas just her way of "speculating" so she might not know anything 

I don't think she is speculating, some of her twitter feeds were practially bouncing like someone who is dying to tell people the twist. She has even said as much.

That was before people started flooding her tweet thinking she was hiding something. Now she using the "art has many interpretations" argument. I think she is just letting people speculate (since Indoc theory is a good way to deflate the anger over the endings)

Yeah, she took a lot of flak from upset players as she was the only one from the PR department really talking to players.

Remember she was hinting at the indoc theory BEFORE people got angry, that suggests that the indoc is intended.

The longer we speculate the more PR exposure this thing gets, also consider that Bioware know exactly how much their playerbase cares about the ME setting as can be seen from that badly written ME novel fiasco awhile back.

And is it not a god thing that a lot of fans care so much about the game ? Cause so much people caring about shows BW that a lot of people really love a lot about ME and the characters, that the games were able to make people really get involved into the storys and somhow emotional involved into the whole story...
and im pretty convinced most people really liked all about the games, except of the endings =)

You may have misunderstood my meaning, I just meant she took the brunt of players concerns, got stressed out/overburdened, clamed up for awhile and then started being a tease again.

Though you have to admit, some of the players' responses have been less than civilised if not outright aggressive.

Yeah but people caring are normaly the more reasonable persons in my little pony world and not the haters or flamers =).

[Hy0ga]

kj0600 wrote...


I really hope this is real.

where did you found it? '-'

[HellishFiend]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

JustAidan wrote...

Mbednar wrote...

3:We have no idea yet about the cost, if any. Bare in mind that the 360 and PS3 install sizes are gigabytes bigger than the PC install size, given how PC people tear into game assests and the cost  from SONY/Microsoft to put DLC on their servers this may suggest that 360/PS3 players already have the ending installed while PC player will download it from Origin (which EA controls).

Thats actually interesting. I mean us PC user are pretty garantued to have an Internet connection for downloading the update since we had to activate the game on Origin.

Has no one hacked the assets on the console versions to see if there is any "locked" or hidden content on there? 

[Earthborn_Shepard]

kj0600 wrote...


I really hope this is real.

I doubt it.. the "postit" is clearly photoshopped, it looks way too unreal

also this would be today.. so we'll know soon

[Skillz1986]

My take on the "why offer destroy option with low ems" question:
Harbinger knows, Shepard has messed up. He did not manage to bring enough firepower to defeat the reapers, gives him the illusion that he still can achieve victory, although in real life the fleets are being decimated.
Whereas with a high ems rating, Harbinger knows, that shepard and the rest of the gang have a real shot at beating them. thats why he offers him the other options..so shepard does not wake up..willing to kick some ancient synthetic ass.
Just like edi said :reapers are all about self preservation

[kj0600]

Hy0ga wrote...

kj0600 wrote...

*image removed*
I really hope this is real.

where did you found it? '-'

Floating around on BSN not sure of its origin though.
I really hope it isn't fake though, anyone else know where this image might have come from?

Modifié par kj0600, 27 mars 2012 - 11:18 .

[David Bergsma]

kj0600 wrote...


I really hope this is real.

How about this? Is this a fake?

[waldstr18]

Vahilor wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

then again, why give you only one choice at the end or have an annoyed star child waiting if they still want to indoctrinate you to get a flawless victory announcment at the end? doesnt that contradict itself?

Cause Sheps mind is so weakend you don't need to put much effort into indictrinate him anymore.

so why can i only choose the "right" color of explosion. usually when my mind is too weak (pragon/renegade) for something the right options are grayed out and i can only take the bad ones.

[Erethrian]

Vahilor wrote...

waldstr18 wrote...

then again, why give you only one choice at the end or have an annoyed star child waiting if they still want to indoctrinate you to get a flawless victory announcment at the end? doesnt that contradict itself?

Cause Sheps mind is so weakend you don't need to put much effort into indictrinate him anymore.

So maybe it doesn't matter what you choose...

I mean, the reapers know that your main motivation is to destroy them, then they say " Go ahead, we've won already". I think that way.

About the child saying "Why are you here?", well, as I saw in Retribution, the indoctrination is not just one reaper trying to gain control over you. That "attempt of indoctrination" is mostly inside your own mind, so the thing is, why the kid has to be the reapers? He may be both, you and the reapers. I don't know. IT is just a theory, let's hope it's the right one.

[Denvian]

kj0600 wrote...


I really hope this is real.

In the words of Jack Sparrow.... Where did you get that?

[K2daE]

JustAidan wrote...

Mbednar wrote...

1:But I think the reason the current ending is terrible is just because they were scrapped for time after the Dark Energy Ending was leaked. They probably let someone with a wild imagination get all creative and this was the result... crap.

2:The only reasons that I don't think Bioware is going to release a IT DLC is because they'd basically be shooting themselves in the foot HARD.

3:Even IGN would bash them if they found out that the game was released without the actual ending, and that you had to PAY to finish the story.

4:Also, the other half of the fan base (those that like the endings) would be up in arms because the endings that they liked, wouldn't be "real". Their endings would be invalidated.

1: Of course now they have an extra period of time to work on the ending/s.

2:Yeah, I think this idea is gold either way, still conveniced it was their idea all along.

3:We have no idea yet about the cost, if any. Bare in mind that the 360 and PS3 install sizes are gigabytes bigger than the PC install size, given how PC people tear into game assests and the cost  from SONY/Microsoft to put DLC on their servers this may suggest that 360/PS3 players already have the ending installed while PC player will download it from Origin (which EA controls).

4: They've been indoctrinated, we can only hope they do the Galaxy a favour and put a bullet in their heads:D

Was thinking about this earlier as dlc. I know alot of the dlc rumours have been debunked but I still feel this will be added to an existing dlc that was planned for release in April/May, most likely the MP extra characters that were hinted at. If they wanted to preserve the existing endings for those who liked them and to hold "artistic integrity", could they not make the ending part be a toggle option like helmets that is set to off as standard and needs to be turned on. Thats assuming this is not a full blown dlc with gameplay and is just added cutscenes and "closure".

Anyway...love the Indoctrination Theory as it gives me some sense and purpose to the ending.

[Turbotanden]

waldstr18 wrote...

then again, why give you only one choice at the end or have an annoyed star child waiting if they still want to indoctrinate you to get a flawless victory announcment at the end? doesnt that contradict itself?

You ignored my answer. While Shepard is down and hallucinating Harbinger is evaluating her usefullness. It makes perfect sense that without need for an indoctrinated Shepard (low ems) Harbinger makes Shepard kill herself with the "destroy" ending.

[Mike Aus]

I personally think that everything beyond the part where Shepard falls is a metaphor and in his mind. Relays don't really blow up and the Normandy doesn't land on any planet.

The relays are a metaphor for the death of technology while the landing is a metaphor for a new beginning.

[Rifneno]

leewells wrote...

I truely hope it was indeed a hallucination -- but if so, it sucks that you couldn't break free of it, especially if you have been a paragon the entire time because this is something that someone whom is saint-like would be immune to because of their purity and stand against corruption.

By the theory, you do break free if you choose destroy. We just haven't seen the rest. Anyway, it's just as easy to manipulate people who are too good for their own good. That's why scumbags use innocent people as human shields when they're trying to get away.

SauliusL wrote...

Don't know if this was mentioned before, but after Romance night with Ashley and the last dream after it, Ashley asks if everything is ok, and Shepard answers something like "Just jitters I guess". Since i am not native english speaker, I wanted to be sure what jitters means exactly, so I checked Wiki and the first sentence goes like this : "Jitter is the undesired deviation from true periodicity of an assumed periodic signal in electronics and telecommunications." It made me think - isnt it one more hint by the writers that it's the harbinger trying to invade Shepard's head by sending signals as described in the codex?

Wow. They gave you a hell of an overcomplicated definition. Usually it just means "very nervous to the point of having minor twitching or shaking". Many people would say they had the jitters before a major event like wedding, first day at a new job, prom, ect.

I'm going to regret saying this because I think people read too much into the whole adrenaline thing, but the minor shaking from jitters is caused by adrenaline. Make of that what you will guys.

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

I have noticed how some naysayers to the IT like to hold up the entire Quarian/Geth conflict and its peaceful resolution as well as the Joker/EDI relationship as examples as to why Synthesis is the prefered ending (not really looking at the entire it is physically impossible part) and it is no lie that EDI and the Geth are the primary reason many choose Synthesis over Destruction.

Physically impossible is putting it mildly. It's not just brainmeltingly stupid from a scientific standpoint (and ME has tried to stay as scientifically reasonable as possible in the past), they go out of their way to show you how asinine it is by giving you an ending where leaves and Joker's skin has printed circuitry in it. That... I like to be creative with my analogies but I can't think of anything to compare that violent assault against the very concept of common sense to.
Moreover, how can ghostkid accomplish this? Changing the very of the DNA of every form of life that exists or will exists. That's not a matter of technology. In order for that ending to not be a hallucination of some kind, the kid would have to actually be God. Himself. That's not an advanced technology, it's changing the fabric of reality!

Vahilor wrote...

I needed to destroy the Geth cause I was not able to pick the peace option (must have left anything out or was not full paragon) so in the end, the only KI known to my Shep would be EDI. I really felt sad for EDI but the Destroy option was the only one that felt "right" for me.

Hmm. Really? Big Tali fan? I can't think of any reason besides personal attachment to side with the quarians. I'm not being argumentative, I'm really just curious. Pragmatically, upgraded Geth would be a bigger asset I'd think. Morally, the quarians are and always have been the aggressors. Though it does make me glad I was able to save them both.

Tawg wrote...

I'm curious, if someone who actually believes this could answer, and I dunno if it's been brought up already or not (Obviously not reading this entire thread): If you were to believe this theory, why would the cut-scenes include views and action from a perspective not of Shepard's? AkA when the Relays blow up, or the Citadel, or the 'Color explosion' on Earth.

Doesn't that kinda crap on this theory, no offense?

No, I think it's a good question actually. The reason (as I see it anyway) is because this whole thing is a stunt to involve the player in the indoctrination attempt rather than just Shepard. The goal isn't just to make Shepard believe it's real, it's to make us believe it's real while still providing us enough clues that we could reasonably figure it out. In this sense, it's kind of like the scene at the end of ME2 where we see the Reapers out beyond the galaxy.

wheelierdan wrote...

in all seriousness what is going to happen to this massive segment of the fanbase that believes the endings didnt happen and some secret dlc is the real ending never happens?

This:

bigstig wrote...

I am getting a little tired with the "it's not a complete game argument coming back again"

Amen. You'd think these people have never had a TV show end with a "To be continued..."
And no, cheapskates that are already typing "but we don't have to pay $5 $10 $20 $500 to watch the rest of the show like EA will charge us for the DLC!", they haven't said that it's going to cost money. Considering the backlash from this, I'd be shocked if it wasn't free. It's just bad business sense. If you go to a restaurant and they overcook your food, they apologize and make you another one on their buck. I doubt they legally have to do that. But every manager with a higher IQ than your average doorstop knows that they make more money in the long run by sacrificing a minor profit in there here and now in order to satisfy the customer so the customer will keep coming back. No, this ending isn't a burnt steak and the analogy isn't perfect, but the basic concept remains the same.

[Gernbuster]

waldstr18 wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Vahilor wrote...


The illussion is given by Harbinger and Harbinger is in controll of the illusion, created it and it is more Harbinger who is annoyed and that influences the illusion.

Thats my thought on the low EMS part as well. Harbinger realizes that the Reapers are already winning and dont need Shepard and as such pretty much pulls a "Lets just end this dream and finish it" and as such only one choice because it dosent matter if Shepard gets turned or not, its allready over.

then why is he even trying to indoctrinate in the first place? practice for the next cycle? makes sense, cause the next indoctrination wont be for another 50k years.

I guess indoctrination is always happening, its like reading for us. If we see words its impossible NOT to read them. Remember even a dead Reaper in ME2 is still indoctrinating, same as most other Reaper tech.
I think Reaper can influence it if the person is important enough. It may work like an antivirus-program. It is always scaning and if it finds something it consideres if its really dangerous and how to proceed with it. Harbinger is simply answering, isolate him, or delete him, or rewrite him.
on low EMS Shepard is already nearly broken, and the Reaper doesn't need to invent the complex system of indoctrination, destroy, synthesis, because he is no longer neccessary, but even if they could not indoctrinate him, Shep could still get back on his feed and reach the beam. It is a good way to keep him busy by telling him this crapy story.