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[crimsontotem]

lookingglassmind wrote...

crimsontotem wrote...

I posted this on the other thread but I want to say it here since this thread is getting big.

Remember what TIM said? Cerberus is an idea, idea never dies... Throughout the game, we can see Shepard has became no just a BAMF, but a concept, an idea that represents the resistance, determination, passion and will to live. (Wrex clearly imply my statement when he said to every Krogan, the word Shepard will mean a 'hero') Even Shepard dies, the idea of unification against the great unknown will not disappear, unless you break and bend that idea itself...

two of the three ending does not represent Shepard... this clearly violate his determination to destroy reapers by either becoming one with synthetic, a final stage of evolution (Saren mentioned this as well when he was indoctrinated) or trying to control them... which you are never able to. However, by sticking to his determination... Shepard is finally able to break Harbinger's attempt to indoctrinate him and wakes up after getting knocked out by the beam. That is the only way why Harbinger himself came down to London and Shepard waking up under "mortars", "concretes" and "rebars".

Crimson, I spamposted this a bunch of times on this forum. I loved what you said. I'm using it in my final dissertation to the forum as to why Synthesis might be the best and 'perfect' option.

Deeply flattered and honored thanks man 

[Stealthy Cake]

I would gladly pay another 10 bucks so that i can get the thought that i just wasted 150-200 hours of my life for an ending like that out of my mind, but if they want their pride back it should be free.
Right now i am kind of broken because of the ending. Been waiting for years and all.. so..

Hallucination is the way to go!!!

[Flapperrr]

I here of what think - from Arrival we know that the blowing up repeater destroys system, other options in game hasn't been given. In endings we see chain reaction on the Galaxy, with energy spheres, let and in small display, in view of distance. And now the attention - a repeater is and in Solar system! If it blew up, Earth - the end, in any option all - the end, and in red, with high fighting capacity show a sigh.

[Bigdoser]

I don't know why people think synthesis is the best option because you are imposing the reapers "order" on organics lets not forget that the synthesis does not effect the reapers themselves because they are already part organic and part synthetic. Plus with that ending you lose what makes the geth a geth you lose what makes an asari a asari. Stuff like that.

So my renegade shepard went for destory since I consider that the middle finger to the catalyst reasoning plus he pretty much says that ending will kill you yet thats the only ending you can survive in. Lets not forget the the catalsyt is trying to push shepard towards control or synthesis. 

Modifié par Bigdoser, 11 mars 2012 - 09:14 .

[lookingglassmind]

Bigdoser wrote...

I don't know why people think synthesis is the best option because you are imposing the reapers "order" on organics lets not forget that the synthesis does not effect the reapers themselves because they are already part organic and part synthetic. Plus with that ending you lose what makes the geth, geth you lost what makes the asari a asari. Stuff like that.

I might try and find humes spork's post on this, then. If the board is curious? But researching technological singularity lore might be helpful while I try to find the post.

[kyrieee]

lavosslayer wrote...

Turtlicious wrote...

Alrighty, but let's get back to disecting, apparently on youtube someone said that a poster for the missing child shows up on the Docks.

well even if that is true all it does is indicate that the kid is real at the beginning of the game however it does nothing to really refute his use against Shepards psyche later on in the dream sequences...

Well if the child is real then it's more probable that the dreams are real dreams I think.
Can't just cherry pick the things that fit with the theory.

[Invisibilly]

 Ive been thinking, if this is all true and i find it hard to believe that it is not then this cant be just dlc. They would need to get the VAs back, create expensive cinematics, and factor in all our decisions. My guess is that it will be either a huge expansion or maybe even a new game (depending on where they take this). That way for those that Do not have internet access they can get it in the store. I know no one will like having to buy it but this is just to big a project to do for free. Just think of it has mass effect 3.5 or a sequel to justify the purchase.

[TheGoddess0fWar]

Nathos wrote...

WHY THIS WAS CUT FROM THE GAME???????

The tears. They wont stop. ;___;

Modifié par TheGoddess0fWar, 11 mars 2012 - 09:11 .

[themidz]

hm somebody mentioned this but i am not sure if anybody responds to it.. if there will be dlc with a "real" ending, what will happen if you dont choose the destroying reapers option? you will download this and it will not work?

if you destroy reapers (resist indoctrination) and download dlc then what? you click on play game in xbox dasboard and a cinematic will appear? it will not make many sense from this perspective.

[xGhost4000x]

lookingglassmind wrote...

Turt: I am watching your video. You have done an EXCELLENT job of pulling together all of the graphical evidence we have! I only wish it was narrated!

Can you send this to Byne to be used as a guide for her layout on page 1?

Can you link the video? I must have missed it, this thread moves so fast. 

[lavosslayer]

Bigdoser wrote...

I don't know why people think synthesis is the best option because you are imposing the reapers "order" on organics lets not forget that the synthesis does not effect the reapers themselves because they are already part organic and part synthetic. Plus with that ending you lose what makes the geth, geth you lost what makes the asari a asari. Stuff like that.

So my renegade shepard went for destory since I consider that the middle finger to the gurdian reasoning plus he pretty much says that ending will kill you yet thats the only ending you can survive in. 

I agree I know I"ve stated this several times already (although it seemed to go without response) but synthesis is basically making the galaxy into a bunch of collectors for the next cycle...just remember what mordin said about the collector body he was examining...that is maintained its organic shell but everyhing else was replaced with tech...seems to me that that's truly what synthesis would do...

[SinisterSpindle]

Gam3Ov3r wrote...

 Ive been thinking, if this is all true and i find it hard to believe that it is not then this cant be just dlc. They would need to get the VAs back, create expensive cinematics, and factor in all our decisions. My guess is that it will be either a huge expansion or maybe even a new game (depending on where they take this). That way for those that Do not have internet access they can get it in the store. I know no one will like having to buy it but this is just to big a project to do for free. Just think of it has mass effect 3.5 or a sequel to justify the purchase.

Agreed  but this is assuming it is done right.....

[FERMi27]

So, um, guys... Don't want to create another thread so I'll ask here.

If your assumptions are right and Shepard was indoctrinated, all the endings, aside from Destroy, lead to the Reaper's victory. Basically, Shep is out of the game and they win by destroying the cycle again. Does this mean that the Stargazer reflects the next cycle's knowledge, gathered from Liara's time capsules? If so, wouldn't it be logical for this scene to be absent, if you choose Destroy? Since Reapers die anyway and the current cycle lives.

[Drake_1000]

Stealthy Cake wrote...

I would gladly pay another 10 bucks so that i can get the thought that i just wasted 150-200 hours of my life for an ending like that out of my mind, but if they want their pride back it should be free.
Right now i am kind of broken because of the ending. Been waiting for years and all.. so..

Hallucination is the way to go!!!

I will not pay for a Ending DLC if the indoctrination is true and not a "ending-fan-fix". I pay for a whole game. Not part of.

[Kabraxal]

kyrieee wrote...

lavosslayer wrote...

Turtlicious wrote...

Alrighty, but let's get back to disecting, apparently on youtube someone said that a poster for the missing child shows up on the Docks.

well even if that is true all it does is indicate that the kid is real at the beginning of the game however it does nothing to really refute his use against Shepards psyche later on in the dream sequences...

Well if the child is real then it's more probable that the dreams are real dreams I think.
Can't just cherry pick the things that fit with the theory.

Not necessarily... some have already said they believe the first instance with the kid playing is real and every instance there after (once Shepard takes a knock on the head and the reapers are around) is using that kid as the bait to slowly lure Shepard.  

[MissMaster_2]

What is this "time capsule" we are talking about?

[Flapperrr]

@ themidz
In the PC version there is a kickback for a moment when the decision can be changed, it isn't simple so.

[Turtlicious]

xGhost4000x wrote...

lookingglassmind wrote...

Turt: I am watching your video. You have done an EXCELLENT job of pulling together all of the graphical evidence we have! I only wish it was narrated!

Can you send this to Byne to be used as a guide for her layout on page 1?

Can you link the video? I must have missed it, this thread moves so fast. 

FERMi27 wrote...

So, um, guys... Don't want to create another thread so I'll ask here.

If
your assumptions are right and Shepard was indoctrinated, all the
endings, aside from Destroy, lead to the Reaper's victory. Basically,
Shep is out of the game and they win by destroying the cycle again. Does
this mean that the Stargazer reflects the next cycle's knowledge,
gathered from Liara's time capsules? If so, wouldn't it be logical for
this scene to be absent, if you choose Destroy? Since Reapers die anyway
and the current cycle lives.

We believe that it doesn't matter, since "The Shepard," Is just a legen, we're not sure how far it is in the future or what is even going on, so we're just... Ignoring for now.

[RussianOrc]

100 pages thread lol...and bioware still ignoring it.

[Sharrack]

lavosslayer wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

I don't know why people think synthesis is the best option because you are imposing the reapers "order" on organics lets not forget that the synthesis does not effect the reapers themselves because they are already part organic and part synthetic. Plus with that ending you lose what makes the geth, geth you lost what makes the asari a asari. Stuff like that.

So my renegade shepard went for destory since I consider that the middle finger to the gurdian reasoning plus he pretty much says that ending will kill you yet thats the only ending you can survive in. 

I agree I know I"ve stated this several times already (although it seemed to go without response) but synthesis is basically making the galaxy into a bunch of collectors for the next cycle...just remember what mordin said about the collector body he was examining...that is maintained its organic shell but everyhing else was replaced with tech...seems to me that that's truly what synthesis would do...

As i stated on the page before (guess it went on to fast) the amount of War Assets needed to even get the option to choose it would make it strange to be a bad ending.

[Kveki]

FERMi27 wrote...

So, um, guys... Don't want to create another thread so I'll ask here.

If your assumptions are right and Shepard was indoctrinated, all the endings, aside from Destroy, lead to the Reaper's victory. Basically, Shep is out of the game and they win by destroying the cycle again. Does this mean that the Stargazer reflects the next cycle's knowledge, gathered from Liara's time capsules? If so, wouldn't it be logical for this scene to be absent, if you choose Destroy? Since Reapers die anyway and the current cycle lives.

Well they don't die if it was all just a dream....

[lookingglassmind]

lavosslayer wrote...

Bigdoser wrote...

I don't know why people think synthesis is the best option because you are imposing the reapers "order" on organics lets not forget that the synthesis does not effect the reapers themselves because they are already part organic and part synthetic. Plus with that ending you lose what makes the geth, geth you lost what makes the asari a asari. Stuff like that.

So my renegade shepard went for destory since I consider that the middle finger to the gurdian reasoning plus he pretty much says that ending will kill you yet thats the only ending you can survive in. 

I agree I know I"ve stated this several times already (although it seemed to go without response) but synthesis is basically making the galaxy into a bunch of collectors for the next cycle...just remember what mordin said about the collector body he was examining...that is maintained its organic shell but everyhing else was replaced with tech...seems to me that that's truly what synthesis would do...

Here we are.

humes spork wrote...

Two things bug me.

...I keep going back to what the AI on the Citadel way back early in ME1 said, it's the role of organics to dominate and destroy synthetic life. That pretty well perfectly mirrors what goes on in the  game's conclusion and supports the whole "tech singularity" thing. Especially from the synthetics' point of view, which the game goes out
of its way to emphasize beginning with Legion in ME2 and pounds over the player's head during 3 between the quarian/geth conflict and EDI. Especially in light that Legion reminds you the quarians started their wars, the geth were merely defending themselves and actually stayed their hand from destroying the quarians (as the geth couldn't
predict the implication of such an act), and most importantly the quarian/geth conflict was simultaneously a civil war between pro- and anti-geth quarians.

And, add in the context that in Control, Shepard doesn't try to force the Reapers to serve organics (as was TIM's plan and consistent with the theme of organics dominating synthetics). Shepard just sends them away, while  simultaneously unshackling them from the Catalyst which is implied to be their control mechanism.

I think the sequence is Harbinger frakking with Shepard's head, but I don't think it may be to Indoctrinate Shepard. Especially in the context it's wholly out of character for Harbinger to simply leave before confirming Shepard's death or harvesting him/her. I'm wondering if Harbinger is testing Shepard's resolve and actually determining whether technological singularity is an inevitability, and organics have evolved beyond the desire to dominate or destroy
synthetics. If Shepard's willing to give up his or her own life to send the Reapers away without forcing them into submission to organics, or merge synthetic and human life, it would certainly give evidence technological singularity is not inevitable.

This is the basis of my argument that Synthesis may be the 'best' Paragon/Order option.

Modifié par lookingglassmind, 11 mars 2012 - 09:16 .

[Chief Martini]

Turtlicious; I dont really understand the video. Can you explain?

[Feops1]

IT WAS ALL A DREAM - has to be one of the poorest, laziest excuses for a retcon tool that exists.

[Malachi_33]

just one thought - I like the hallucination theory very much, but do you think, EA/Bioware plays this kind of game with the gamer magazines around the world? gave them the same copy, we played with - the same "not so complete game" just to get rewievs based on that? anyway, maybe they thougt no one would bash the ME saga, and it seems they were right.