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#101
Storenumber9

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Biotic Sage wrote...

mickeymacattack wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

In the context of when I made those decisions.  You make the best decisions you can based on the information you have at the time.

And yes people are mad at the destruction of the Mass Effect universe, i.e. the Mass Relays.  But don't say it's not appropriate to the story.  It was completely appropriate because they are the legacy of the Reapers and the Cycle.  The status quo needed to be disrupted.  That's what the entire trilogy was about: Shepard trying to break the Cycle.  People have a hard time with letting go of things they have become familiar with and have come to love.  It was a good choice storywise and for the franchise; the franchise needed to move forward and so do the fans.  Look back fondly on Shepard's story, but understand that it's over.  All of it mattered though.  Saying that it didn't is like saying no life matters just because all life ends.


What happened to the other races?  What happened to earth?  The choices you made, curing the genophage, uniting the geth and quarians, your love interest (if you had one).  I'm not even concerned with plot holes at this point but I think its rather weak to simply kill off the main character and leave no explaination of his legacy other than a crashed ship on an unknown world and later implying that "life goes on".


What you're asking about is the future of the franchise.  The Reaper/Shepard story was resolved.  His legacy was that he was a legend who broke the Cycle and destroyed the Reapers.  That's called wrapping it up.  As for the questions of what happened to everyone else and society afterwards...that is for the future of the Mass Effect franchise to answer.  We will see what has become of the descendants of these civilizations.  There will be new mystery and intrigue in rediscovering the Mass Effect universe in light of the Mass Relays being destroyed.  We will get to see what time has brought and how we have rebuilt from the bottom up.


See, the thing is, there shouldn't be this big mystery about what happens in the Mass Effect universe until the new game. Especially since Shepard's actions directly affect just about everyone (literally) in the galaxy.

There's two levels of closure that need to be achieved here, considering it is a trilogy, and we have been following this trilogy for years.  

You have the closure on the personal level, with the characters, who you've been actively engaged with over three games - You don't know what they think about what happened to Shepard, or what happened in general. All you know is that they're alive and probably stranded (My only guess to have them stranded is to have add more Bitter to the sweet ending. Bioware knew if they killed off your entire squad regardless of action would ****** off fans more, so they decided to maroon them on some planet ), and that's it.

You're especially unclear about how your LI feels, or even how some of your better friends feel (Joker, Garrus). 

Then you have the Galaxy wide closure needed, especially in this game. Remember at the end of Lord of The Rings, after three movies, they gave huge explanations on what happened after the Ring was thrown into the volcano? Or at the end of Jedi, we're shown planets celebrating the fall of the empire? That's giving closure to the world in general.

That's not acheived in ME3 either. All you know is that the reapers are controled/destroyed, and you break the cycle. You have no idea what the affect of your "ultimate" choice was, nor do you know how much weight you carried with the people of the Milky Way.

It's simply sloppy story telling, especially when you consider that, again, this is a trilogy.  That alone makes it far different from most games out there. If this were just a game that had just came out (assume that Mass Effect 3 was the first Mass Effect), people wouldn't have cared as much, because we didn't spend as much time with the characters or the world. Sure, people might have still hated the endings, but not to the scale of what you see now.

When you engage people in a long term relationship with a story, people expect more to wrap up the story. Look at TV shows like Firefly, or Farscape. Both of those were canceled before an appropriate ending was thought up, and it left a sour note with fans until movies were released to wrap things up. (Though, the terms were different regarding these shows, as it wasn't due to the people making the shows.)

In short, you can end a single tale with an ending like Mass Effect 3 and for the most part, get away with it. You can't end a story that's been told for 3 games, many books and comics, and a few Ipod games like this, though. 

There's also the gameplay perspective of it being a bad idea to have no other option than to just kill off a character in a series. That was experienced in Fallout 3, and Bethesda had to go back and change it. Now, I'm not saying that they should allow Shepard to live, but to have the chances restricted to a "secret" ending is kind of a slap in the face to some of the fans as well. 

#102
Storenumber9

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Another big problem I see with the ending to Mass Effect 3 is Arrival.

I don't know how many people have realized this, I'm only just realizing it now. Don't the Relays explode and take out whatever system they're in?

That happened in Arrival, why didn't it happen here?

#103
aderynbrea

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Storenumber9 wrote...

Another big problem I see with the ending to Mass Effect 3 is Arrival.

I don't know how many people have realized this, I'm only just realizing it now. Don't the Relays explode and take out whatever system they're in?

That happened in Arrival, why didn't it happen here?


I thought the same thing. Yet another plot hole. <_<

#104
Xellith

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Storenumber9 wrote...

Another big problem I see with the ending to Mass Effect 3 is Arrival.

I don't know how many people have realized this, I'm only just realizing it now. Don't the Relays explode and take out whatever system they're in?

That happened in Arrival, why didn't it happen here?


Im going to asume that it was because the majority of the relay energy was expelled in a beam to another relay and also expelled in the huge energy shockwave.  In arrival its like a bomb.  This is more like a gun going off.  Least my imagination told me this.

#105
LordHelfort

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Xellith wrote...

Storenumber9 wrote...

Another big problem I see with the ending to Mass Effect 3 is Arrival.

I don't know how many people have realized this, I'm only just realizing it now. Don't the Relays explode and take out whatever system they're in?

That happened in Arrival, why didn't it happen here?


Im going to asume that it was because the majority of the relay energy was expelled in a beam to another relay and also expelled in the huge energy shockwave.  In arrival its like a bomb.  This is more like a gun going off.  Least my imagination told me this.


Which is the problem, you shouldnt have to do Bioware's work for them. It's lazy story telling.

#106
askanec

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I'm kinda curious. In the OP, you mentioned some kind of official response in BSN. Tell me, what do you want Bioware to say that will assuage your concerns over the ending?

#107
Trishot

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As a European I can tell you the reactions will be exactly the same.

#108
LordHelfort

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Trishot wrote...

As a European I can tell you the reactions will be exactly the same.


Trishot can you tell us what the general reaction is on the European forums? I can understand French, but Spanish, German etc. are beyond me.

#109
FuzzyFreaks

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Greed1914 wrote...

LordHelfort wrote...

Biotic Sage wrote...

Also maybe people should take a bit more time to reflect and meditate on the ending instead of just being reactionary.


Why? This isn't an issue of comprhenesion or differing philosophies, this is a matter of broken promises and rushed delivery.


I don't see how letting it sink in will help at all.  I get the endings, I just think they were poorly done.  No amount of time is going to erase seeing Tali walk off the Normandy on some random planet even though she finally had her home planet to go to.  I don't see any amount of reflection changing how the choices I made relating to my crew members don't matter.  Yeah, the Quarians could get back to Rannoch, but Tali will probably never see it again. 


Ultimately, the saddest part is knowing that we're stuck with this.  They won't change the ending because then it would be seen as letting players have too much control over development.  Admittedly, there is something to that, but it's just so hard for me to believe that they thought we'd have a better reaction.  Really. Somebody wrote the endings and somebody approved them, and apparently this was what was considered good?

Personally, I wasn't sure what to expect, but I sure didn't want my choices not to count in the end or for my options to be equally lousy.  Normally, I'm inclined to give devs the benefit of the doubt, and I certainly expected to see plenty of complaining regardless of what we got since there was so much build up to this, but I didn't expect to feel completely let down by the ending.  Conclusions are tough, no doubt, but they aren't impossible, and they certainly could be better than this. 


I'll still keep supporting Bioware, but it's hard not to be upset by the ability of the last 10 minutes to tarnish three games like it did.


Don't forget the whole "Any dextro crew will probably starve to death" problem.
Including the Turian fleet unless you brought the Quarians along, and even then the liveships probably can't feed everyone.

#110
Jackal7713

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Storenumber9 wrote...

Another big problem I see with the ending to Mass Effect 3 is Arrival.

I don't know how many people have realized this, I'm only just realizing it now. Don't the Relays explode and take out whatever system they're in?

That happened in Arrival, why didn't it happen here?

Yea this is a major plot hole. Its up there with synthetics killing organics to save them from synthetics. Talk about a paradox. I really don't understand the lack of creative endings. Some people say that the grim dark endings are creative, however, I don't think so. Its not hard to write something were everyone ends up dead or stuck like "Lost".

#111
Xellith

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I want the reapers to come and destroy me ; ;

#112
JustOneGuy

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I am from Germany and I have the exact feelings towards the endings as most here on BSN!

#113
MaxQuartiroli

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JustOneGuy wrote...

I am from Germany and I have the exact feelings towards the endings as most here on BSN!


Same here from an Italian player..

#114
fish of doom

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norway-based, and protesting the current endings.

#115
Trishot

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LordHelfort wrote...

Trishot wrote...

As a European I can tell you the reactions will be exactly the same.


Trishot can you tell us what the general reaction is on the European forums? I can understand French, but Spanish, German etc. are beyond me.

In all fairness, I never visited the forums of BioWare, this is just where Origin took me. I wanted to write my review and keep my eye out on a possible DLC with endings that at least to some degree reflect the choices I have made.

I can however tell you that most of my class mates agree with the general concensus here. Which is the endings are lacking. A few of my X-Fire friends from around Europe are also starting to agree, mind you not everyone finished the game.

I believe after having heard/seen the responses of friends and collegeagues the respones will be the same. Although none of them (as far as I know) are part of these forums.

PS: I only understand German out of the languages you named too. I speak no Spanish at all and very little French.

#116
focusright

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LordHelfort wrote...

Trishot wrote...

As a European I can tell you the reactions will be exactly the same.


Trishot can you tell us what the general reaction is on the European forums? I can understand French, but Spanish, German etc. are beyond me.


Similar to the us forums, a german game magazine even published an article about the ending

http://www.gamestar....51,2565679.html

#117
GreenSoda

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kiiiiii wrote...

Similar to the us forums, a german game magazine even published an article about the ending

http://www.gamestar....51,2565679.html

Yupp -so far the reactions are pretty similar to what's going on here on BSN. Many praise the game but are deeply disappointed with the endings. Reading through that thread is kind of funny, because it's almost an exact mirror to the threads in this forum here.

#118
MordiMoro

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"There are many different endings. We wouldn’t do it any other way. How could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets?"

"A lot of the satisfaction comes out of the choices you've made. When a story concludes a certain way, the way it concluded was in part because of the choices you made. And that kind of ups the replayability."

Michael Gamble

Ps: i am Italian, Me and my friends are disappointed as you are.

#119
Archer

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kiiiiii wrote...

LordHelfort wrote...

Trishot wrote...

As a European I can tell you the reactions will be exactly the same.


Trishot can you tell us what the general reaction is on the European forums? I can understand French, but Spanish, German etc. are beyond me.


Similar to the us forums, a german game magazine even published an article about the ending

http://www.gamestar....51,2565679.html




Just read that although my German is a bit rusty. They actually mention the poll thats floating around here at the moment. The poll that over 8000 people have voted on. The poll that says 83% of voters were unhappy with the end.

Some of you may or may not be aware of this but the Old Republic team made changes to the games UI based on feedback from a poll about 4000 (ish) players voted in. They specificly said this gave them a fairly statistical average of what the player base in general felt at the time. Thats a game with 1.7 million players.

Not trying to inflame the issue or slate them but those poll numbers alone should give them cause for concern.

Im fairly sure we will get some kind of a response at some point but i do agree its going to be after the game is released in all zones

But thats a hell of a backlash after just four days from the first release date.

#120
fooknar

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I never post on these forums and just play the games and even I have to say ( I'm from the UK) the ending's are possibly the worst I have ever seen. For a story that spans three games I honestly expected better but like SWTOR it felt half assed to me personally.

#121
MordiMoro

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the future for me:

Casual Gamers tps > Old Gamers love ME = All is well, Bioware develop DLC for multiplayer
Old Gamers love ME > Casual Gamers tps = hope for fix/Story DLC

Image IPB

Modifié par MordiMoro, 10 mars 2012 - 03:02 .


#122
LilyasAvalon

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We actually have to wait until at least the 15th it sounds now, because that's when the Japanese get it.

#123
ratzerman

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I feel bad for Jessica. She didn't create this mess, and now she has to clean it up.

Mac just gets to sit back and watch.

It's not fair. :-(

#124
tausra

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The Japanese really don't care either way about Western RPGs, so I don't expect too much of an uproar in Japan.

#125
jdecker

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I cant wait to see what happens lol, anyway i spent $199.99 on Mass Effect 3, i got ce game and ce guide on XBOX and i also got PS3 version for my brother. I will not do this again i will rent game from GF so if Im not happy i send it back. And i will not buy BioWare games in the future nor will i play them, there are a lot of great games i would rather play. They dissapointed me with Dragon age 2 now this, I wasted enough of my money No More.