158 réponses à ce sujet

[didymos1120]

Can't agree with the thesis of this topic.  Don't really feel like articulating why at length, but my experience throughout the game was "OK, that was cool.  Ooh, interesting.  Uh....wait...what?  Why the hell did that just happen?  Gonna explain that at all? Oh, guess not. Just moving on to the next plot point I guess."  One example being Legion: why the hell was he plugged into the Reaper device in the dreadnaught?  How was it he was independent enough to have a little chat while still plugged in?  Then, on Rannoch, why was "personality dispersal" required exactly?  Couldn't Legion have just transmitted a copy of his runtimes to the consensus?  Geth are software.  The platform doesn't matter.  But no, we had to have a death there, so we got one.

Additionally, there were a lot of annoying little continuity errors.  For instance, the M-920 Cain suddenly went back to using the old, cut codex entry which is completely different from how its described to work in ME2.

The big advantage of all this, however, is that the endings weren't as big a deal to me personally because I'd long since stopped expecting the plot developments to be, well, properly developed. And make sense. 

Modifié par didymos1120, 10 mars 2012 - 11:05 .

[epjm]

Agreed. Mass Effect 3 was my favorite in the series, quite possibly my favorite game ever. But the ending killed it for me, it killed the entire series. I'll admit, I was hoping for a happy ending with Shepard alive. I guess as happy as it could be.. friends and allies are dead, entire civilizations shattered.

[goose2989]

 I absolutely agree with you, Spectre_Shepard. The ENTIRE game, up until your confrontation with the child AI, was absolutely breathtaking. Obviously I can be nitpicky of certain things (I romance Tali always, and was hoping for some more ineraction, and the chance to invite her up to my cabin at any time, just to cuddle like in ME2) but in general, my complaints are inconsequential. 

EVERYTHING about this game was brilliant... besides the endings. As many others have stated, I am having trouble even trying a second playthrough because of the excessively depressing endings choices. I personally want the textbook happily ever after ending, but just having an actual sense of closure would satisfy many of us. If Shepard really needs to die, let us see the Normandy and everyone else survive without losing the Mass Relays, or BEING STRANDED ON A JUNGLE PLANET! I was happy to see Tali and Garrus make it, but what kind of food is on that planet? Will they starve? Or will Joker starve?

While it may not make complete sense to have new endings in DLC, the current options MAKE NO SENSE! 

Please Bioware, with sincerest respect and admiration, give us the chance to live happily every after.

And anyone reading this, please add my signature links in your own box. Make our voices heard

RETAKE MASS EFFECT 3!!!!

[TuringPoint]

Small point.
How is anyone able to say what is right or wrong in art? Can you really critique art without resorting to somewhat inadequate descriptions of whatever is bugging you, or creating it yourself? Doesn't it intrude on the integrity of art to make it however you wish in spite of the original creation, whether in optimism or pessimism?

What I'm seeing is people wanted Bioware to make an ending that met their exacting specifications, which doesn't sound right if we're going for good criticism.

Modifié par Alocormin, 10 mars 2012 - 11:16 .

[Jonathan Shepard]

aim1essgun wrote...

I was literally tearing up from the final scene with Anderson. I was thinking "my god this is the greatest game of all time". And then the god-child showed up.

The crazy thing is, the rest of the game being so good sort of overrode any anger I had initially. I was just...numbed. Until I started thinking about it.

Everything after Anderson dies and Shepard falls down, eyes closed is simply his near-death experience. That's how I've head-cannoned it.

But yeah, most of the rest of the game was beautiful. There's another thread about what non-ending things you din't like, and I've got quite a list, but most of them are quite minor compared to the suckishness that is the last 5ish minutes.

Modifié par Jonathan Shepard, 10 mars 2012 - 11:14 .

[ambroseaz]

I agree, with two exceptions. There was a moment on Rannoch where Shepard and Tali meet and discuss the emotional impact of Quarians returning to their home world for the first time in over 300 years. Tali slowly reaches to remove her mask so she can look at the Rannoch landscape with her own eyes. As the camera slowly pans across her face, we see her expression is filled with mixed elation and sorrow as she feels the warm sunlight on her skin for the first time... Only this didn't happen. Nope. Instead, you took an opportunity to reveal one of the greatest mysteries of the Mass Effect universe, and chucked it out the airlock. Oh but thanks for the crappy photoshopped stock photo.. really.. thanks, it was very emotional the way you did it. Good job.

My biggest disappointment wasn't part of the game at all. It was the ten-penny hustling to get every last dime you could from a project with a built-in fan base. Despite being in the worst economy in fifty years, raising the price of video games another $15.00 usd wasn't enough. You felt it necessary to charge even more on release for a character who, while not integral to the plot, was clearly more than just a passing garnish. One of the most emotional scenes in the game was an animated dialogue between Liara and Javick after the fall of Tessia. You really want me to believe this wasn't part of the plot?

Really, Bioware stood on the threshold. You were just inches away from creating the Return of the Jedi of interactive entertainment.. but you raced for a quick-fix, one-size-fits-all ending with no real epilogue, and you charged extra for Boba Fett.

Modifié par ambroseaz, 10 mars 2012 - 11:27 .

[novaseeker]

Jonathan Shepard wrote...
Everything after Anderson dies and Shepard falls down, eyes closed is simply his near-death experience. That's how I've head-cannoned it.

That's my, ahem, "interpretation" as well.

[AtreiyaN7]

I loved the whole thing - including the bittersweet ending. I realize this runs contrary to most views about the ending and went into a detailed analysis/explanation of why I felt the synthesis ending that I chose actually felt apropos in my blog. The short version is that I thought it was the culmination of Shepard's arc as a character with her being called upon to make the ultimate sacrifice for what she believed in. In my case, her belief was that AIs are as alive as we are and deserved to live because a person is defined by their mind, not the material they're made out of. Thus, I was putting my money where my mouth was and took the next step in joining organics and synthetics together into a new form. *shrug*

And it did end on a hopeful note for me - not only with the Normandy's survival (I was glad that they survived even though I do have questions about that) but because the grandfather and grandson in the coda show that we survived. Yeah, the galaxy isn't the same - the relays are presumably gone - but we'll still be there and reach the stars again in our own time.

[zerebul]

goose2989 wrote...

 I absolutely agree with you, Spectre_Shepard. The ENTIRE game, up until your confrontation with the child AI, was absolutely breathtaking. Obviously I can be nitpicky of certain things (I romance Tali always, and was hoping for some more ineraction, and the chance to invite her up to my cabin at any time, just to cuddle like in ME2) but in general, my complaints are inconsequential. 

EVERYTHING about this game was brilliant... besides the endings. As many others have stated, I am having trouble even trying a second playthrough because of the excessively depressing endings choices. I personally want the textbook happily ever after ending, but just having an actual sense of closure would satisfy many of us. If Shepard really needs to die, let us see the Normandy and everyone else survive without losing the Mass Relays, or BEING STRANDED ON A JUNGLE PLANET! I was happy to see Tali and Garrus make it, but what kind of food is on that planet? Will they starve? Or will Joker starve?

While it may not make complete sense to have new endings in DLC, the current options MAKE NO SENSE! 

Please Bioware, with sincerest respect and admiration, give us the chance to live happily every after.

And anyone reading this, please add my signature links in your own box. Make our voices heard

RETAKE MASS EFFECT 3!!!!

While I agree with OP, I would rather them not add endings than give some fufu everyone goes home happy crap ending. We need an ending that provides clorsure to the choices you made throughout the game, such as killing / saving geth, backstabbing krogan, what happens to salarians if krogan are saved and they dont help, what happens to all your former crew members that you give pep talks to during / after the battle. Beyond that they need to not retcon themselves - I had Liara with me when i  got pewpewed by the reaper in london. She was either in london, or followed up behind me to the citadel, NOT IN THE NORMANDY GOING TO SOME MAGICAL JUNGLE LAND. There is also the fact that blowing up a relay in ME2 DLC caused the entire solar system to burn. You really thought blowing up all the relays in existence made sense.....at all? Shouldnt all civilizations in the known galaxy be gone as a result? Better yet we have the Citadel, the mother of all relays, in earths orbit while it explodes. How that is not supposed to destory everything in its vicinity when it gets destroyed is beyond me. Even bettter yet - If the boss of all Reapers is a beam of light on the citadel then prothean virus (that you learn about in ME1) that they put onto the keepers would have done absolutely nothing. >< Sorry....i didnt mean to rant...

Modifié par zerebul, 11 mars 2012 - 12:14 .

[Spectre_Shepard]

Supersomething wrote...

aim1essgun wrote...

I was literally tearing up from the final scene with Anderson. I was thinking "my god this is the greatest game of all time". And then the god-child showed up.

The crazy thing is, the rest of the game being so good sort of overrode any anger I had initially. I was just...numbed. Until I started thinking about it.

Had the same exact reaction myself.

me too actually. i think i went into mild shock. the awesomeness of the rest of the game just slammed into the terribleness of the ending. it was weird.

[Kuolonen]

After some reflection, I think this would have made the ending better, for me atleast. I am invested in the control ending. After Shepard becomes the reaper overlord, the trusty old moral choice wheel would pop-up with three choices as shepards reaper fleet policy:

Upper-right(paragon): I shall exile myself and the reapers into the dark space forever.
middle-right(neutral): I remain in this galaxy to ensure peace.
bottom-right(renegade): Milky way now belongs to humans. All other races shall bow before us or die.

Now if you'll excuse me, Ill be headcanoning that renegade option as my choice ending. And forget about that completely out of place asspull normandy crashing -thing.

edit: typos

Modifié par Kuolonen, 11 mars 2012 - 12:02 .

[Horacio Zhao]

 Totally agree. I was so moved by the game story before the ending(right until Anderson died alongside Shepard), and then the stupid kid showed up and ruin everything

[Consequator]

It kinda felt like a marketing pushed rush job..

[Greed1914]

Alocormin wrote...

Small point.
How is anyone able to say what is right or wrong in art? Can you really critique art without resorting to somewhat inadequate descriptions of whatever is bugging you, or creating it yourself? Doesn't it intrude on the integrity of art to make it however you wish in spite of the original creation, whether in optimism or pessimism?

What I'm seeing is people wanted Bioware to make an ending that met their exacting specifications, which doesn't sound right if we're going for good criticism.

Actually, what you've described is the reaction I thought I would see.  However, the reaction is actually reasonable when you consider that what we were given makes little sense, and is totally disconnected, not only from the rest of the game, but from what we were led to believe it would be. 

I wouldn't say it intrudes on the integrity of art to let the audience have some sort of say, at least in an active medium like games.  Roger Ebert has flat out said that he doesn't consider games to be art like movies are because they are active rather than passive.  Games expect constant player interaction, so divorcing the end of a game from everything else the player did doesn't makes sense. 

If anything, I'd say the integrity of the art would be compromised by what we were given.  The whole time, they said that we'd see the final results of our choices in a series based on player decision.  We were told that ME3 would consider 1000 variables and have numerous endings, only to have none of those variables matter and be left with 16 versions of the same ending.

[Spectre_Shepard]

Greed1914 wrote...

Alocormin wrote...

Small point.
How is anyone able to say what is right or wrong in art? Can you really critique art without resorting to somewhat inadequate descriptions of whatever is bugging you, or creating it yourself? Doesn't it intrude on the integrity of art to make it however you wish in spite of the original creation, whether in optimism or pessimism?

What I'm seeing is people wanted Bioware to make an ending that met their exacting specifications, which doesn't sound right if we're going for good criticism.

Actually, what you've described is the reaction I thought I would see.  However, the reaction is actually reasonable when you consider that what we were given makes little sense, and is totally disconnected, not only from the rest of the game, but from what we were led to believe it would be. 

I wouldn't say it intrudes on the integrity of art to let the audience have some sort of say, at least in an active medium like games.  Roger Ebert has flat out said that he doesn't consider games to be art like movies are because they are active rather than passive.  Games expect constant player interaction, so divorcing the end of a game from everything else the player did doesn't makes sense. 

If anything, I'd say the integrity of the art would be compromised by what we were given.  The whole time, they said that we'd see the final results of our choices in a series based on player decision.  We were told that ME3 would consider 1000 variables and have numerous endings, only to have none of those variables matter and be left with 16 versions of the same ending.

Yes.

Look, I have no problem with Bioware coming up with its own ending for its series. Thats cool.

I'm not asking them to give ME the ending I happened to want.

I just think that the endings we WERE given are actually unfair to the series as a whole. What was promised was not delivered.

If I got an ending where things didnt work out, but was still logical and well thought out, I would have no problem. I would have respected it entirely. Much like ME2, if you get the everyone dies ending. I get that. It makes sense.

This didn't. This didn't fit. Don't give me what I want just because I want it. I'm not a spoiled child. Just give me something I can RESPECT.

[Memphis Rhodes]

Well I guess all of our grief shows what happens when Karpyshyn leaves a project. We get a terrible excuse for a book, numerous continuity problems, and a mediocre finish to a great trilogy. Obviously he alone couldn't have saved the whole franchise, but when one of the chief minds (and lead writers) behind the series from its origin leaves the project, something is bound to happen. Look at KOTOR, the Bane Trilogy, ME1, and the first three ME novels. All of those stories were great, and in my opinion, this was largely due to the simplicity of the ideas and the execution of those ideas within the stories. I’m not privy to what happened to the ME writing team* when Karpyshyn moved to Austin to work on SWTOR, but regrettably ME3’s ending seems to be the result (along with the other problems listed above). A simple ending was replaced with a convoluted, illogical disappointment. I still love this series and the universe Bioware created, but the ending has left much to be wanted.

*I’m aware that other key writers left the project earlier on. I simply wanted to highlight Drew’s talent as a writer and consistent story teller as well has his significant contributions to the Mass Effect Universe.

Modifié par Memphis Rhodes, 11 mars 2012 - 12:24 .

[BigGuy28]

I haven't finished it yet, very near the end, and it has been one of the best games I've played. Been amazing in so many ways, I've laughed and cried many times, it's a wonderful game. But the endings just ruin the whole experience for me, I'll probably do this one play through and that's it.

After Dragon Age 2 and these crappy endings I'm done with Bioware. I'll only consider playing any of their future games if they get amazing reviews by players and then, if I do get them, I will get them used.

[ambroseaz]

I'm really curious to know what Bioware thinks of this outpouring from fans.

[shnellegaming]

/totally agree

Except for a few small bugs the rest of the game was THE best narrative and gameplay experience Bioware has ever created.

[Spectre_Shepard]

BigGuy28 wrote...

I haven't finished it yet, very near the end, and it has been one of the best games I've played. Been amazing in so many ways, I've laughed and cried many times, it's a wonderful game. But the endings just ruin the whole experience for me, I'll probably do this one play through and that's it.

After Dragon Age 2 and these crappy endings I'm done with Bioware. I'll only consider playing any of their future games if they get amazing reviews by players and then, if I do get them, I will get them used.

you and i were in the same boat buddy.

[Spectre_Shepard]

http://social.biowar...5/index/9755204

just some of my thoughts on why the ending deserves a change.

[zr0iq]

The catalyst plot is flawed. Flawed like hell. Everything before reaching the temple in thessia is really awesome and good.

Maybe the Krogans reconstruct Mordin in Project Krogarok.
Anyways, why doesn't the alliance use reaper tech? Most species have these tons of reapers on their homeworlds. Use it,
They can actually travel very quickly even without relays. Everything would be fine, mentioning this at the end or something something that makes you feel like you have succeeded.

[BHynes92]

Probably not the best way to make a reply, 5 pages in like this but here we go:
This is in direct response to the OP:

I agree completely. I have been posting that in various threads around the forums. Even the ending in and of itself isn't too bad, if a bit deux ex machina-y. The problem is that We have spent the last 5 years and about 100 hours per Shepard learning to love these characters, and at the end of this epic sci-fi series they receive no closure.

[Spectre_Shepard]

BHynes92 wrote...

Probably not the best way to make a reply, 5 pages in like this but here we go:
This is in direct response to the OP:

I agree completely. I have been posting that in various threads around the forums. Even the ending in and of itself isn't too bad, if a bit deux ex machina-y. The problem is that We have spent the last 5 years and about 100 hours per Shepard learning to love these characters, and at the end of this epic sci-fi series they receive no closure.

indeed. solidarity, brother. stay strong.

[Memphis Rhodes]

BHynes92 wrote...

Probably not the best way to make a reply, 5 pages in like this but here we go:
This is in direct response to the OP:

I agree completely. I have been posting that in various threads around the forums. Even the ending in and of itself isn't too bad, if a bit deux ex machina-y. The problem is that We have spent the last 5 years and about 100 hours per Shepard learning to love these characters, and at the end of this epic sci-fi series they receive no closure.

I agree, invested time and the resulting lack of closure and sense of accomplishment due to a silly ending is the main contention.