7876 réponses à ce sujet

[Shepard-Commander-2]

as MaleShep, I liked Thane's Final Showdown with Kai Leng. Even as deathly ill as he was, he managed to hold himself against him.

Shepard WISHES he was as badass as that.

[Aello89]

mccool78 wrote...

I somehow like how the romance with Thane ends. We knew from the beginning he would die soon (a magic cure was unlikely), so it was only a temporary thing.
He died as hero after saving the councillor. He fights hard despite he was really weakened by his illness at this time.

We were being lead on, they gave us so much hope about being able to save him as well. Mr. Weeks posted on tweeter about Kahje mission, hints towards lung transplant being possible for Thane,  BioWares "Cure for Thane" on facebook and few other things.... 
Magic cure? No one wanted that.

Besides bringing Shepard back is...not magical? Mording making a cure for Genophage in such a short amount of time is not ....magical? Really?
 
Not even one of Thane fans that I know wanted for people who wished him dead to be stripped of that choice.

But somehow when Thanemancers wished for prolonging his life, to be given another alternative choice to do so, we are being denied. Stripped of an option that every other LI in this game gets.
No even one Thanemancer wished saving him is the ONLY option. We simply wished for another one - another option -  besides the impending death scene we actually get.

Really is it so hard to see that one option has nothing to do with the other. It's the player that decides what he/she finds more fitting for Thane. But to be stripped of choice and then also witness how the writes dropped the ball with him is just insulting and direspectful.

It was not bad storytelling imho because his death induced feelings of sadness and at the same time it arouses burning hate at Kai Leng and Cerberus.
Now I will go Rambo on them if I see this scum again. They will pay for it. Just wait!.

This could be applied to any character. Killing off Tali would make us more inclined towards destroying the Reapers, killing Miranda more inclined to hunt down Leng or Illusive man....etc.

There's no need in denying that you wouldn't feel as we do in case your LI or favourite character was treated in such way as some ME2 LI's was. 

Modifié par Aello89, 12 mars 2012 - 01:23 .

[lalaquen]

So many posts since I commented last that I won't even try to quote them all. But basically, I'll say this - I can see where you're all coming from, and to a certain extent I agree with you. But I still don't think anything is character-breakingly wrong with it. Shepard didn't have any way of knowing what would happen if she brought it up, so she didn't. Maybe things would've been fine - maybe they wouldn't - so, she made the executive decision to put someone else's needs first, whether it was necessary or not. If you take the paragon responses to the VS on Horizon as an example, at least, it's in character for Shepard - she talks about not trying to contact because she worried that it would do more harm than good for them. She made the choice that she felt was right at the time, whether it was actually right or necessary or not. Is that as emotionally satisfying as a tear-filled goodbye and obvious statement of her love? No, of course not. But it does make some amount of sense for the character from a certain perspective. If you didn't play a paragon Shep, then sure - it makes a lot less sense, and that sucks. I agree with you completely there.

As for no one else acknowledging his death... again. For me, at least, it sucks and it doesn't. Except for a handful of people, no one who's definitely on your ship now even knew who Thane was. I would personally have found it strange if suddenly everyone DID come up to me and want to talk about it. And (for me, at least) Garrus' romance shows just how awkward he finds talking about/dealing with relationship things in general... so while it would've been nice for him to acknowledge Thane's death more if he knew that Shepard and Thane had had a more intimate relationship, I can kind of see where he just might not know what to say to her about it. Those kinds of conversations are always awkward... so he went with the safer choice and acknowledged Shepard's loss obliquely using a more emotionally neutral subject in the squadmate who died on Virmire. Your surviving human squad memeber met him in the hospital, and Thane even tried to protect them to a certain extent, so it would make sense in some ways for them to talk about him... but there are also circumstances in which that would be completely inappropriate, like if Kaidan is the surviving squadmate - because he obviously has feelings of his own for Shepard whether she reciprocates them or not by virtue of the fact that he's a potential LI. Again, maybe it's just my opinion, but I feel like it would be really disingenuous of him to try and comfort you over the loss of your lover when he has feelings for you himself. Tali wasn't with you yet when he died, and consiering the fact that you could (theoretically) pick her up last in ME2, it isn't certain that she knew him much better than any of your current crew - so again, I can see her not saying anything.

But that's just my opinion. As I said - everyone is entitled to have their own, and I can even agree with most of them to a point.

[Melanie24]

Same here, glad more people think this way.
I'm so disappointed in the thane romance part of me3. Just finished the mission where he dies and I really feel like I don't even want to play me3 anymore now.
I was hoping someone might say there was a way to save him or that you would see a vision of him at the end of the game, but I guess thats out of the question?

[FlyinElk212]

Melanie24 wrote...

Same here, glad more people think this way.
I'm so disappointed in the thane romance part of me3. Just finished the mission where he dies and I really feel like I don't even want to play me3 anymore now. 

But don't you guys think that's sort of the point?

Look at yourselves. You love Thane so much that when he dies, you can't even bring yourself to finish the game you've been waiting for 5 years to play. Clearly they struck a right chord in you if you guys love Thane that much. I think Bioware might be onto something here.

[Visii]

FlyinElk212 wrote...

Melanie24 wrote...

Same here, glad more people think this way.
I'm so disappointed in the thane romance part of me3. Just finished the mission where he dies and I really feel like I don't even want to play me3 anymore now. 

But don't you guys think that's sort of the point?

Look at yourselves. You love Thane so much that when he dies, you can't even bring yourself to finish the game you've been waiting for 5 years to play. Clearly they struck a right chord in you if you guys love Thane that much. I think Bioware might be onto something here.

I hope you're joking.

The only reason they would kill Thane is because they thought that they could make the death scene (and everything after) powerful and moving and worth it and bittersweet.

They failed because we barely had any time or conversation with him beforehand, because Shepard acted like a friend as he was dying instead of someone in a relationship with him, and then everyone forgot he had ever existed afterwards.

We should be sad but satisfied, not angry, bitter and disgusted.

[Cosmochyck]

Seriously - my Shepard was more concerned with Kaidan's injuries on Mars, then Thane, whom she loved! The dialogue was pathetic, and the outcome after was even worse. He's been gone for 2 seconds before Kaidan is hitting on her?? And no one even MENTIONS his death?
This is why Life Support is empty - My Shep goes in there to weep.

[Little Vixen]

lalaquen wrote...

As for no one else acknowledging his death... again. For me, at least, it sucks and it doesn't. Except for a handful of people, no one who's definitely on your ship now even knew who Thane was.

Ummmm.....Garrus, Tali, Joker, EDI, Dr. Chawkwas (if you pick this doctor) are all still around and on board the Normandy and knew Thane....and Liara helps you find him in ME2. Even the ever compasionate Liara couldn't mention him? She mentions him in the Shadowbroker DLC if Thane is your Shepard's love interest. It isn't like she didn't know he existed or that Shepard was in love with him. Joker seems to comment on everyone after your Shepard meets up with them on a mission. Why can't he at least mention Thane?

I am still pained by the fact that no one mentions him.

I am also still heartbroken that Shepard didn't get to spend any time with him and that LI Shepard never got the chance to say she loved him.

Why couldn't we have even had a dream sequence where Shepard and Thane are reunited and at least say their goodbyes and their "I love you"s? I am still crying over the fact that nothing about their love passed between them. How can you ignore Thane? He was the love of my Shepard's life.  (And one of the most amazing characters in the Mass Effect universe.)

Modifié par Little Vixen, 12 mars 2012 - 03:02 .

[Visii]

lalaquen wrote...

So many posts since I commented last that I won't even try to quote them all. But basically, I'll say this - I can see where you're all coming from, and to a certain extent I agree with you. But I still don't think anything is character-breakingly wrong with it. Shepard didn't have any way of knowing what would happen if she brought it up, so she didn't. Maybe things would've been fine - maybe they wouldn't - so, she made the executive decision to put someone else's needs first, whether it was necessary or not. If you take the paragon responses to the VS on Horizon as an example, at least, it's in character for Shepard - she talks about not trying to contact because she worried that it would do more harm than good for them. She made the choice that she felt was right at the time, whether it was actually right or necessary or not. Is that as emotionally satisfying as a tear-filled goodbye and obvious statement of her love? No, of course not. But it does make some amount of sense for the character from a certain perspective. If you didn't play a paragon Shep, then sure - it makes a lot less sense, and that sucks. I agree with you completely there.

As for no one else acknowledging his death... again. For me, at least, it sucks and it doesn't. Except for a handful of people, no one who's definitely on your ship now even knew who Thane was. I would personally have found it strange if suddenly everyone DID come up to me and want to talk about it. And (for me, at least) Garrus' romance shows just how awkward he finds talking about/dealing with relationship things in general... so while it would've been nice for him to acknowledge Thane's death more if he knew that Shepard and Thane had had a more intimate relationship, I can kind of see where he just might not know what to say to her about it. Those kinds of conversations are always awkward... so he went with the safer choice and acknowledged Shepard's loss obliquely using a more emotionally neutral subject in the squadmate who died on Virmire. Your surviving human squad memeber met him in the hospital, and Thane even tried to protect them to a certain extent, so it would make sense in some ways for them to talk about him... but there are also circumstances in which that would be completely inappropriate, like if Kaidan is the surviving squadmate - because he obviously has feelings of his own for Shepard whether she reciprocates them or not by virtue of the fact that he's a potential LI. Again, maybe it's just my opinion, but I feel like it would be really disingenuous of him to try and comfort you over the loss of your lover when he has feelings for you himself. Tali wasn't with you yet when he died, and consiering the fact that you could (theoretically) pick her up last in ME2, it isn't certain that she knew him much better than any of your current crew - so again, I can see her not saying anything.

But that's just my opinion. As I said - everyone is entitled to have their own, and I can even agree with most of them to a point.

It's not that EVERYONE should have come up to ask how Shepard was doing. It was that NO one did. The problem is the only reason this death scenario came up was because it was SUPPOSED to be emotionally satisfying as a tear-filled goodbye and obvious statement of her love. Shepard depending, it should have been an option, at least.

If Kaidan somehow knows that Shepard was with Thane ("I heard about you and some assassin") it wouldn't kill him to say "Sorry for your loss". Liara, Chakwas, someone, anyone could have said something. Someone even could have asked how Shepard is holding up, like Liara from Lair of the Shadow Broker, or Jacob's romance and Shepard could talk about Thane, there. There were a ton of opportunities to do something like this, and they failed.

Modifié par Visii, 12 mars 2012 - 05:07 .

[utaker1988]

Not one person mentioning his death is painful, even more painful that Leng remembers and likes to shove it in your face. I know that people knew about Shep and Thane, it was obvious in 2. Mordin gives you advice, Kasumi mentions it twice (before and after the Omega 4), Liara knew, Garrus and Jacob will both know if you have been keeping your options open before choosing, and since I'm inclined to believe that too many people knew on that ship because they have nothing better to do than to talk about Shep's love life that more than those mentioned knew. Which means that in the end Tali, Garrus, Joker, Chakwas, Ken and Gabby, EDI, and Liara at the very least knew and not ONE of them says anything but some of them have no issues wanting to talk about themselves. Actually, I'm more disappointed in Liara, she seemed concerned in 2 and yet after Thane dies, I get some convo with her where she talks about her dead mother. I didn't need a parade of "sorry for your loss" but at the very least one of my "friends" remembering.

[Aeyl]

I'm curious as to how the whole, "Cure for Thane" campaign turned out. What was the point of it if Thane dies no matter what?

[Visii]

Aeyl wrote...

I'm curious as to how the whole, "Cure for Thane" campaign turned out. What was the point of it if Thane dies no matter what?

Also, what was the point of the in-game mention of the Hanar cure, of Thane's transplant candidacy in LotSB, or the medigel for the lungs from the CDN? The last is particularly stunning, because it could only be of interest to Thane fans, the rest of the fanbase would have no reason to take notice of it.

[Aello89]

Visii wrote...

Aeyl wrote...

I'm curious as to how the whole, "Cure for Thane" campaign turned out. What was the point of it if Thane dies no matter what?

Also, what was the point of the in-game mention of the Hanar cure, of Thane's transplant candidacy in LotSB, or the medigel for the lungs from the CDN? The last is particularly stunning, because it could only be of interest to Thane fans, the rest of the fanbase would have no reason to take notice of it.

There was a lot of hints and tidbits now and there, the facebook campain probably the most public of them all, that proved themselves to be completely irrelavent. They simply existed but didn't end up bearing any other purpose apparently. And that's a low blow.
Mr. Weeks even tweeted at some point something about a mission on Kahje. Ends up this mission is non-existent.

Agreed Visii, the lung medigel from CDN was another hint thrown at us that again proved to serve no purpose. I mean BW was no doubt aware what kind of effects this type of informations are going to have with Thane fans.
Alas...

EDIT: Asenza? How silly of me to notice just now Visii Thank you for creating this thread with JECW. Much much appriciated. It's comforting to know there's more people out there who are just baffled over how Thane's romance was threated. So thanks you again.

Modifié par Aello89, 12 mars 2012 - 04:21 .

[Visii]

Aello89 wrote...


EDIT: Asenza? How silly of me to notice just now Visii Thank you for creating this thread with JECW. Much much appriciated. It's comforting to know there's more people out there who are just baffled over how Thane's romance was threated. So thanks you again.

Hey. Yeah, messed around with Ea and Origin CS livechat for about 2 hours trying to get my accounts linked so I could register my game and post on the forums, then decided, screw it. Had JECW post in the meantime. Suppose I could have added a few numbers to Asenza, but... >_<.

[Aello89]

FlyinElk212 wrote...

Melanie24 wrote...

Same here, glad more people think this way.
I'm so disappointed in the thane romance part of me3. Just finished the mission where he dies and I really feel like I don't even want to play me3 anymore now. 

But don't you guys think that's sort of the point?

Look at yourselves. You love Thane so much that when he dies, you can't even bring yourself to finish the game you've been waiting for 5 years to play. Clearly they struck a right chord in you if you guys love Thane that much. I think Bioware might be onto something here.

Come on, there's no need to deny that any fan of this or that character wouldn't be feeling the same as we do, wouldn't react in the same manner as we did.  I don't think that's even a question.
There's a thread out there in this very romance section where someone is asking how to save Miranda. I can only imagine what fury would have been unleashed if someone said that there's no way to prevent her death.

I agree with Visii reply on that matter.

Modifié par Aello89, 12 mars 2012 - 04:33 .

[JGO1013]

 I'm glad you guys mention Thane like honestly if we weren't going to get a cure then why not let commander shep. have a bit more time with him. Made the mistake of thinking once the ending happen I would see him again after death.... boy I wish that was the case I would have been a bit more happy with dying:crying:.

[Sarah1281]

One thing I would like to add o all the other hints that Thane should have a chance to be cured or simply to be in good condition in ME 3 is this: In ME 2 he tells Shepard, that for the next 9-12 months he will be fine and his illness will not affect his performance. So, if ME 3 is taking place only 6 months after ME 3 - why is the Kepral syndrome now in the final state? There should be at least 3 months until the Kepral syndrome becomes worse or worst. Even the dossier in the LotS tells us, that Thane's condition is not too bad.

When does he say that he has 9-12 months? If it's any point in time before the final love scene then you have to assume that time has passed between him saying it and the end of the game. And then there's six months between destroying the Collector base and/or blowing up that Mass Relay and the start of the game and then there's more time that passes before you meet up with Thane again.

If you didn't play a paragon Shep, then sure - it makes a lot less sense, and that sucks.

I play as a Paragon Shepard...just not one to the point of stupidity. Playing as a complete Paragon, Shepard is determined to sacrifice herself and her happiness at the drop of a hat for completely unnecessary reasons. I'm only willing to do that if it makes any sense at all to do so. A fear that maybe Kolyat (who is devastated at losing his father and immediately came to the Citadel to give blood) will suddenly be a huge bastard about his father finding love again does not really strike me as a reasonable thing to sacrifice yourself for.

[Sealy]

The part I really didn't like was that even though she was with Thane she seemed very keen on Liara and even Kaidan still. I know that Liara is Biowares precious, but she wasn't mine and I was starting to look at her more and more as ME2's Jacob which sucks cause I like Liara.

I didn't think we get a cure, I don't even want to demand one. I would have just appreciated him not getting lost in the jumble of LI's. I do understand a bit though, they seemed to have bit off more then they could chew regarding how many LI's and squaddies they had to account for, and they had to account for most of them because of fan demand. we have only ourselves to blame *sob* No wait, we can blame the Tali and Garrus fans... they weren't supposed to be romances anyways, we can blame the Liara and VS fans for holding the majority as fanbases go... and blame the non romancable squaddie fans for distacting the writers for their need to see Legion, Grunt, Mordin and Wrex, we could blame Jacob fans but I think they're already suffering enough. *sigh* I think BW got a little overwhelmed with the amount of sidekicks we didn't kill off on the SM but since I adore all my ME1 and ME2 squaddies I can't blame anyone but me for the glue and glitter rush job they found themselves doing for anyone not part of the core four... errr core five, aka: the ME2 squadmembers

[Julia_xo]

Sarah1281 wrote...

I know I, as a person, wouldn't want to risk making the final moments between a father and son tense or awkward just because of how I felt, and (accordingly) I can see my Shepard feeling the same.

I just can't seem Kolyat deciding to get tense or awkward about the fact his father was dating someone on his father's deathbed. It just seems so very petty and like Shepard is trying to protect a grown-up man from something he doesn't actually need protecting from.

I agree. Besides, Thane freely calls Shepard 'Siha' right in front of Kolyat who is completely nonplussed by it. I imagine Thane has spoken to him about it.

Modifié par Julia_xo, 12 mars 2012 - 05:29 .

[Sarah1281]

I know that Liara is Biowares precious, but she wasn't mine and I was starting to look at her more and more as ME2's Jacob which sucks cause I like Liara.

I wish I understood what Bioware sees in her. She was just too eager and awkward in ME1 and then dead inside in ME2 and in ME3 she's kind of clingy with her constant need to show up in your room in the middle of the night. And still kind of dead inside. I was nice to her but I always got the impression that I was humoring her rather than actually wanting her around which was too bad since she was such a huge part of the game.

[coldwetn0se]

FlyinElk212 wrote...

Melanie24 wrote...

Same here, glad more people think this way.
I'm so disappointed in the thane romance part of me3. Just finished the mission where he dies and I really feel like I don't even want to play me3 anymore now. 

But don't you guys think that's sort of the point?

Look at yourselves. You love Thane so much that when he dies, you can't even bring yourself to finish the game you've been waiting for 5 years to play. Clearly they struck a right chord in you if you guys love Thane that much. I think Bioware might be onto something here.

I think I know where you are going with this, but for me at least, it did exactly the OPPOSITE.  All of my ME games are packed up on the shelf.  I stopped playing the game on the evening of the 7th.  I even had a "from scratch" new M!Shep that I was using as a guineau pig (no Thane in the default background); couldn't even finish him.  Can't seem to "unsee" what I have seen.  I don't do this out of protest, nor as emotional blackmail (complete waste of time and wouldn't work.)

I do this for my own mental health.  Plenty of things to feel bad about; don't need to add my entertainment to that list.  Those that do like the game, should continue to play, but those that don't for WHATEVER their reasons are, should do what they need to do to feel better.  For some, it is posting on these forums about their feelings and thoughts on the game, for other's just leaving it all behind and moving forward will be their course of action.

I will not feel embarrassed in anyway for feeling like I do.  Thane as a character in a RPG game (lite version or not....still technically an RPG), was railroaded into a single path, and lines were written, IMO, for a Shepard I did NOT know.  It's unfortunate that I can't even seem to use my imagination to come up with SOME satisfactory story line for Thane, knowing what they did with his character arc.

So, since I have zero belief or even expectation (since I am a bit of a realist) that a DLC will be provided that would offer me a more satisfying story line with MY chosen LI, I will not be buying any DLC's for this game.  

*Should be noted: I am NOT writing BW off in the slightest.  I still play DA and look forward to new games in that universe, and potentially new IP's that BW may create.  Might be more inclined to wait to buy a new IP; read reviews and player feedback first.... 

[Lucky Thirteen]

Julia_xo wrote...

Sarah1281 wrote...

I know I, as a person, wouldn't want to risk making the final moments between a father and son tense or awkward just because of how I felt, and (accordingly) I can see my Shepard feeling the same.

I just can't seem Kolyat deciding to get tense or awkward about the fact his father was dating someone on his father's deathbed. It just seems so very petty and like Shepard is trying to protect a grown-up man from something he doesn't actually need protecting from.

I agree. Besides, Thane freely calls Shepard 'Siha' right in front of Kolyat who is completely nonplussed by it. I imagine Thane has spoken to him about it.

When I reviewed that last scene, I came to this realization that it can be seen that Kolyat is encoraging things, knows fully well of the relationship. By pulling that prayer book out and encoraging Shepard to join, it can be seen as his way of trying to comfort Shepard.

[Isis 524]

I don’t understand all the negativity surrounding Thane’s death. His romance with Shepard was beautiful, and both knew it couldn’t last, but they chose each other anyways. For him to die from wounds that he received helping his love is really a noble thing. It’s heartbreaking to watch him die, but even his last words were for his siha. That is love.
Thane preferred to die fighting for the good of the galaxy than from a disease.
I don’t see anything wrong with that.

[Sarah1281]

I don’t understand all the negativity surrounding Thane’s death.

I think one of the biggest problems is that it's too similar to a platonic Shepard's scene. Well, that and a feeling of being given false hope.