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List of issues with endings (BioWare) (was:Michael Gamble)


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#126
Hobbes83

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Completely agree with the OP's post

#127
bpzrn

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"It’s kinda letdown that readiness has so little visible impact. Unlike
upgrades to Normandy from ME2. I really expected little scenes showing
some of key assets fighting. Little snippet showing Krogan making ground
fight easier, or part where we see orbital fight with Turians, and
depending on how strong they were they’d either get pounded totally, or
just a little. It could also impact on scenes involving clash with
Harbringer. Right now it really doesn’t feel much connected to outcome."



Well said

#128
Hunter_Wolf

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ME wasn't Dark though. Who says that? It's as cliche and happy-ending as any other good sci-fi flick. Just because he dies at the beginning of ME2 and brought back now helping terrorists while colonies get abducted by genetically altered Protheans to be processed into gray liquid? Crap happens, yeah it sucks. But nothing made ME feel like it was ever dark. It was seemingly one man vs an unknown threat of unknown proportion.

#129
d1ta

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Bump

#130
d1ta

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<_ *grumbles a internet onnection 

Modifié par d1ta, 12 mars 2012 - 01:23 .


#131
logan23tom78

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Great post and thread!

#132
GreyhameBioware

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Excellent post. I agree with it and many of the post made within it. Especially the ones that say the ending seemed to come from another game.

For me, it's like adding the end of 2001: A Space Odyssey to Star Wars as another example. Great ending, doesn't fit with the rest of it though.

#133
Zyrious

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Hunter_Wolf wrote...

ME wasn't Dark though. Who says that? It's as cliche and happy-ending as any other good sci-fi flick. Just because he dies at the beginning of ME2 and brought back now helping terrorists while colonies get abducted by genetically altered Protheans to be processed into gray liquid? Crap happens, yeah it sucks. But nothing made ME feel like it was ever dark. It was seemingly one man vs an unknown threat of unknown proportion.


ME2 starts bleak, but you can end the suicide mission with everyone still alive and a heroic sendoff just before the credits, so it ends with the same tone of hope, faith in the galaxy and the future, and a sight of what's to come. Roll credits.

ME 3 does none of that, and the ending is effected lightly by your choices. Sure, in all ME 2 endings the collector base is destroyed or saved, but who's still alive? Are you even still alive? How well does the normandy fair? This is all effected. Nothing except the initial fleet encounter whe entering sol, and wether earth is destroyed or not is effected by anything you do. And you don't get a solid epilogue to show the the aftermath of everything, which REALLY shouldve been seen as necessary after ending the trilogy, showing the results of our actions over 3 games. Hell, DA:O was 1 game and had the most satisfactory epilogue and ending i've ever witnessed.

#134
hckf2

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Bump

#135
darkshadow136

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Issues with Ending

1. God-Child reaper creator as catylyst, come on whoever wrote that must have been on a acid trip.
2. ending choices are all the same with same cutscenes dark, darker,and darkest
3. ending has many holes explains really nothing, and no real feal of tru closure to the series.
4.3 people excaping on the Normandy 1 of which died during the citidel ruch on earth, and the other Liara was on Earth tending to the wounded. Plus it made no sense that Joker would be trying to escape the fighting if nothing else he would have just landed on Earth.
5. Epilogue cutscene with child and old man was not only lame but  utterly stupid, and by far all together the worst ending I have seen in a game series of this calibar since 1977
6. Also our ME1/ME2 AND ME3 choices were supposed to have some real impact on story and gameplay. Well I destroyed the collectors base in ME2 well Cerberus was still able to get reaper tech and make Husks, well I guess that decision made no difference, and by the end of the game no Paragon decisions I made throughout the series made a difference in the ending
7. I played a Paragon Sheppard throughout the series, made all the right decisions and so on. But in the end I was faced with three choices to end the game that would kill just about as many lives as the Reapers would. Where is there a victory, where is there any variety between endings, and where is there a choice that would trully fit a Paragon Sheppard there is none.

if you want your voice heard louder got to my blog which I have a link too in my Sig , click on my ME3 review and click on the links to my polls.

1. would you Boycott Bioware if they don't fix the endings
2. do you believe Multiplayer should have no impact on the single player campaign
3. Facebook Campaign demand better endings for ME3

#136
Aligalipe

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Actually the endings themselves -in core- good. I mean Shepard has 3 options to choose. I won't bother to tell them everyone knows them. But the problem lies in how we get these endings and how they were presented to us. A kid comes and tells us in a 2 minute dialogue what the reapers are, and tells us to choose one of these options. Then the mass relays color changes and explode. Normandy crashes in every ending. If those 3 options were presented better, it would be cool. Our choices and assets should have an effect on them.

#137
Tony_Knightcrawler

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Why not just use the Conduit to get into the Citadel? It's on Ilos, which AFAIK is still perfectly intact except for Vigil being inactive. The Reapers probably didn't have much, or any forces there. They could have easily sent in as many troops as they needed.

Thanks for emasculating my Shepard. Yeah, you see that beam coming right at you? The one you could dodge by doing two side-rolls? Yeah, just panic for a while, then try to run backward to outrun it. Yeah, you can totally outrun it, dude... Flailing helps, too.

Uh... THIS is the end of the Reaper beam?! Just a room? This is where they sent all those humans? How does this make sense? What killed the humans there? Why are there no enemies? Why is there nothing there to process the dead? I don't think the reprogrammed Keepers are going to be doing that stuff, and if they were, they sure failed because that one just ignored Shepard.

Wait... Shepard, YOUR HAND! You are on a platform being levitated into the air, probably through a hole matching the dimensions of the platform, like every other elevator. If you leave your hand hanging off the edge, it'll get cut off! This is going to get messy...!

Wait what? Where's the platform now?

Why is Joker trying to get away from the shockwave?! He has no idea that the red blast will kill EDI. None at all! If he magically knows what the red shockwave does, then he should know the blue shockwave will simply let Shepard control EDI - at which point, he'll probably give her her free will back. And the green shockwave is no threat to EDI at all.

How did Joker manage to get to another solar system so quickly?! If he was using traditional FTL, that would have taken quite a while. If he was using the Mass Relay, he'd have to do it before the beam hit (which destroyed all the Relays), which is silly because that's not the order the events are presented in. It clearly shows Joker trying to escape AFTER the Sol Relay is destroyed.

How did ANY squad members get onto the Normandy? Cortez' transport was shot down and needed repairs. The Normandy was probably in the middle of some very fast and very agile fighting against the Reapers in space. After all, it's the best frigate in the fleet. There'd be no way to safely dock a transport in that battle. And nobody had the time to do it. Nobody should have had any desire to leave Earth, either.

Dick move killing off Shepard's squad. That's almost on the level of "Hey, you aren't wearing a full helmet, so your face melts in the Reaper beam."

Wait, they're not dead?! How are they not dead?! If Shepard's squad lived, as seen in the ending, why didn't they follow him through the teleporty-beam?

Why did Shepard's suit not even staunch his bleeding with Medi-gel? Shepard wasn't even all that badly injured. Now don't get me wrong, I don't wanna ever get in that shape, but his armor's healing systems should have mostly taken care of that.

Where did Commander Shepard's other Medi-gel supplies go?

Okay so... if the Catalyst is a... thing someplace in the Citadel where nobody has ever been before, using an aspect of the station nobody could understand because again, nobody's ever been there... then how did ANY race design a device to take advantage of them? This is some serious WTF stuff right here. And even if we say the Catalyst leaked the first version of the Crucible, what "improvements" did the other cycles make? What do even the upgrades from this cycle do, if they in no way alter the Crucible's functionality? The first functional version of the Crucible would have to at least be able to be used once, so if the Catalyst did leak its design, the other races (and your own) did jack and sh!t. You'd think the Crucible/Citadel and Shepard would survive if he had all the upgrades, at the very least.

"All synthetics will rebel against their creators?" I think not...

Kill ALL synthetic life in the galaxy...? Well, that's balls. I'd have chosen destroy without hesistation if it weren't for that. But all the crazy renegade people get a perfection option for them.

The "conspiracy theory" that the ending is an indoctrination-induced illusion makes more sense than taking the ending literally. This is a problem. And it means the game is incomplete. Are you gonna sell another game with the next 30 minutes of real-world time, where Shepard wakes up and actually uses the Crucible?



Space and ground battle inadequacies:

Normandy is seen in action at all. I wanted to see some Thanix Cannons and torpedoes. It should even still have the normal guns, too.

Where is Aria and her mercenaries?

Where are the Geth?

Where are the Batarians?

Where are the Hanar?

Where are the Drell?

Where are the Elcor?

Where are the Volus?

Where are any special ops? We don't get to see any other Spectres, the Salarian STG, or other special ops do anything cool, or even hear about it.

Where are the Salarians? I mean heck, they've got a seat on the council!

Where are the Rachni? And why did I only get Rachni Workers? Seriously, f' some **** up, Rachni Queen!

At least we see the Quarians and Krogans, but just barely!



Wait, wait, wait... the Reapers learned just hours before the counterattack for Earth that the Catalyst is The Citadel, right...? So they took it over and moved it. I guess I can buy that, but what I CAN'T buy is that they already had a magic teleporty-beam ready. That is a simply massive structure, and you expect me to believe ANYTHING built it in a few hours? How is it standard operating procedure to build one of those on every heavily populated world? They processed the Batarian homeworld just fine without it. The Protheans never mentioned it. I... what...? One MIGHT guess that Reapers put these teleporty-beams on highly populated worlds of those they wish to make into Capital Ship Reapers, but then, what are the Processor Ships for if not for doing just that? Why send them to the Citadel?



Can you really get the best ending without Readiness-boosting multiplayer, DLC, or Mass Effect: Infiltrator? No, you can't. Below 4,000 Readiness, Anderson dies earlier, right? I did everything in the game, and only lost a few readiness for my decisions. I lost probably less than 100. And you know what? My War Assets when 100% ready are 7,218. Divide that by 2, and you get something below 4,000.



Most importantly, your decisions have virtually no impact on the ending at all!

Modifié par Tony_Knightcrawler, 12 mars 2012 - 03:08 .


#138
Rocktel

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Have to say I have no problem with your team that was with you for the charge being on the Normandy. You don't see their bodies, they probably just had to retreat and assumed Shepard was dead.

#139
Tony_Knightcrawler

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But they wouldn't have given up. They would have gone to support Shepard. They knew everything depended on getting in there. No Crucible = no victoly.

Modifié par Tony_Knightcrawler, 12 mars 2012 - 02:44 .


#140
Ivanssaran

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Since the sqaud members were running with Shepard, and Anderson says he 'followed' Shepard to the beam, so............ I think the chance they thought it was too late for Shepard is slim.

#141
Aramina

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Rocktel wrote...

Have to say I have no problem with your team that was with you for the charge being on the Normandy. You don't see their bodies, they probably just had to retreat and assumed Shepard was dead.


Which wold be completely out of their character based on everything we know about them. Hardcore soldiers had the energy to retreat, but not to keep going to the objective? And abandoning their commanding officer? Adding the possibility of your LI into the mix makes the logical fallacies even worse.

Not slamming your ideas, just pointing out that everything after waking up from the beam attack makes less and less sense. I doubt I was the only one who was looking around thinking "where did my squad go?!"

#142
Ivanssaran

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Aramina wrote...

 I doubt I was the only one who was looking around thinking "where did my squad go?!"


That's exactly what I did!
I looked around, but they were nowhere to be found.
I thought to myself, "maybe they melted away in the laser! How horrible! I'll avenge them, Harbinger! Just you watch!"
And when they stepped out of the normandy......................

Posted Image

EDIT: Quotation box fixed

Modifié par Ivanssaran, 12 mars 2012 - 03:16 .


#143
allentrill

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Not gonna go to long but here it is. I am tired of all the sacrifice endings in games nowadays. The hero doesn't always have to die to win. That's like telling your kids don't be a hero you will probably have to die to be one. I grew up thinking hero's were the ones you looked up to, and if they sacrificed themselves they didn't always die. But now its like in order for someone to be a hero they have to die. Not every hero i grew up wanting to be like died. We all die, why does my game make it seem like there is no good way anymore?

#144
Tispower

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Totally agree with the OP. Seriously let down by lack of ME2 style ending, or even ME1. Why didn't we see the Normandy shooting the hell out of Harbinger?!

#145
knightnblu

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"ME3 without last 5 minutes is absolutely best part of trilogy and that’s an incredible thing to achieve."

Couldn't agree more.

"But I hope you understand how it feels if after nearly 150 hours (whole trilogy, without replays) of awesome, immersive gameplay finale is disappointing."

My thoughts exactly.

It isn't that I mind Shepard dying, hell I pretty much knew that I was a goner when I got matched up with the Reapers. But that I have to die in vain, that grates. Shepard, the man who stopped the Reapers at the Citadel, stopped them at the Alpha relay, stopped them on Rannoch, ground Cerberus into a fine powder, and fought his way every step back to the Citadel only to die as a pawn of the Reaper's master leaves a bitter taste in the mouth.

Your only choice is to die and there are three ways to do it because the AI wants to be a little b@#$h about it. Aside from the ethical implications of the choices imposed on Shepard, there was the fact that it could have pulled the plug on the death and destruction at any time, but didn't. He already admitted that his plan had failed and was no longer workable and that Shepard's presence was the proof of that. Did he stop? Nope, he chose to leave it in Shepard's lap so that he could at least get the satisfaction of killing him for the temerity.

As I said before, it was an awesome game right up until the end and then it all fell apart. There wasn't even a epilogue to tell you the outcome of your actions. Just pull the switch and bam...done. If I were to shed any tears as BioWare promised, it would have been for their mistake at the very end and the absolute waste they made of it.

#146
jcmccorm

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darkshadow136 wrote...
1. would you Boycott Bioware if they don't fix the endings

Right idea, wrong question. I won't boycott Bioware if they don't fix the endings. 

What happened is that they removed my emotional investment in the Mass Effect universe. I really don't want to play any more DLC or purchase any additional merchandise when this is how everything ends. Everything up until that point totally sold me on the Mass Effect franchise. Somehow, they managed to create an ending which not only didn't maintain the excitment, but one that actually unsold EVERYTHING.

I no longer am attached to the Mass Effect universe. I won't be boycotting. I'm simply not interested in putting anything more into it. Bummer. I was captivated up until the end.

Modifié par jcmccorm, 12 mars 2012 - 03:30 .


#147
Andur4

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Fully agree. The endings should have been decided based on your choices throughout the entire series, so that you actually feel like you had an influence on the galaxy. As it stands, well technically you did have a big influence, based on your singular choice. An epilogue would have helped at least.

Also, I felt the ending was pretty dark, like center-of-a-black-hole dark. Doesn't quite fit the universe, given the previous two games. And then you also got the massive number of plot-holes a continuity contradictions but, that's another story.

#148
TurambarEA

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Biggest complaint: lack of choice.

ME1: save/kill Wrex, save/kill Council, choose Anderson/Udina, who to romance.

ME2: wow, choices matter HEAPS, who lives, who dies depends on loyalty/upgrades/choices, keep/delete genophage data, Samara/Morinth, keep/destroy Collector base.

ME3: all roads lead to the same three endings, all of which are bad and none of which can be changed no matter what you did in the first two games (or in ME3) ...

... what was the point? Of any of it? All those choices, all those important, galaxy changing decisions ... count for nothing.

Edit: Also want to agree with the poster who said that 'dark' story doesn't have to = player character dying and certainly doesn't automatically = a good game. A 'pick your method of death' ending is as lame duck as they get.

Modifié par TurambarEA, 12 mars 2012 - 03:37 .


#149
Scott Sion

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Not happy with the endings in Mass Effect 3? Did you think there was too may plot holes? Hoping Shepard might have a chance at happiness? This is the group for you. Support portal page below.

The #RetakeMassEffect movement does not in anyway condone attacks or insults on Bioware, EA, Bioware employees, or anyone associated with them. We are not here to make enemies. We are here to show a company that their devoted fanbase has been hurt, and alienated with some of their actions, and to ask for an explanation, and hopefully a solution.

Several members of the ME team are suffering from attacks on their Twitter and social networking sites. Rude, and inflammatory remarks are UNACCEPTABLE. Anyone found to be contributing to such activities will be removed from the #RetakeMassEffect movement without warning.

Remember, we aren't going to use threats and unlawful acts to get are point across. Threats only ruin our cause.

HOLD THE LINE!

Group link: http://social.bioware.com/group/7047/

Support page portal: http://social.biowar...scussion/20518/

Social Networks to follow:

https://twitter.com/#!/RetakeME3
https://www.facebook...ngToMassEffect3
http://retakemasseffect.tumblr.com/

#150
uDoh

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darkshadow136 wrote...
I no longer am attached to the Mass Effect universe. I won't be boycotting. I'm simply not interested in putting anything more into it. Bummer. I was captivated up until the end.


I agree 100%. I feel very sad that I feel this way.