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Why I LOVE the Mass Effect 3 ending.


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#76
refuse81

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Having to force yourself to accept the ending and then be content with it seems a bit much right?
I tried too but was just dismayed during the stargazer sequence. As I was recovering from the shock of the ending where the mass relays were turning star systems to ashes and synthetics were destroyed all over the galaxy I noticed that the "child" standing near his grandpa was actually just a small version of a grown man. How lazy is that? They even had a child model in the game in the first place! I then realized I didn't want to touch anything Bioware again. Spending time on these forums for a while will probably soothe my griefing since I realize I'm not alone.

Modifié par refuse81, 11 mars 2012 - 03:18 .


#77
goatman42

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Rafe34 wrote...

goatman42 wrote...

Kloborgg711 wrote...

Are you serious right now? The largest fleet ever assembled in galactic history is now stuck in the S.O.L. system. The Quarians JUST got their planet back after a centuries-old war, and they were even fed the promise of eventually developing a proper immune system. If you went destroy, EDI is murdered, as is every single Geth you JUST gave freedom to. The galaxy is down a dark shell, thousands of years behind what it used to be. Every world is a lonely isolated heap of ashes. Thessia is now a shattered wasteland with the few Asari who aren't trapped back on Earth left to clean up. The Krogan, who finally got cured of their genophage, now have most of their men stuck to rot and die on Earth. The Turian and Quarian will probably starve due to needing dextro-based food. Basically, every single victory you won in this war leading up the end was for absolutely nothing. I'm not even talking about the fact that the Mass Relays releasing their energy is supposed to vaporize systems. Oh, and don't forget that no one even knows what happened, since no one witnessed your decision. Sure, most people on Earth will probably reason what happened, but what about the scattered groups of colonists all over the galaxy?
Also, did you ever stop to think what happened to the billions of citizens and refugees living on the Citadel? Conrad Verner and Jenna, Kelly Chambers and Aria, everyone you spend the game meeting was probably murdered, if not when the Reapers took over the citadel then when Shepard blows the whole thing up.

Sorry I agree with what your saying I just want to let you know that Kelly Chambers dies half way though the game. Cerberus finds her and shoots her in the head when they attack the Citadel.


You can save Kelly.

WHAT?! HOW? TELL ME!

#78
adamtheclark

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Mike Vas Normandy wrote...

You see Liara instead of your LI in the flashback.


Really? Ashley was my LI in 1 and 3 and she was the one I saw in the end. 


miranda was mine in 2 and 3 and i saw liara

#79
adamtheclark

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goatman42 wrote...

Rafe34 wrote...

goatman42 wrote...

Kloborgg711 wrote...

Are you serious right now? The largest fleet ever assembled in galactic history is now stuck in the S.O.L. system. The Quarians JUST got their planet back after a centuries-old war, and they were even fed the promise of eventually developing a proper immune system. If you went destroy, EDI is murdered, as is every single Geth you JUST gave freedom to. The galaxy is down a dark shell, thousands of years behind what it used to be. Every world is a lonely isolated heap of ashes. Thessia is now a shattered wasteland with the few Asari who aren't trapped back on Earth left to clean up. The Krogan, who finally got cured of their genophage, now have most of their men stuck to rot and die on Earth. The Turian and Quarian will probably starve due to needing dextro-based food. Basically, every single victory you won in this war leading up the end was for absolutely nothing. I'm not even talking about the fact that the Mass Relays releasing their energy is supposed to vaporize systems. Oh, and don't forget that no one even knows what happened, since no one witnessed your decision. Sure, most people on Earth will probably reason what happened, but what about the scattered groups of colonists all over the galaxy?
Also, did you ever stop to think what happened to the billions of citizens and refugees living on the Citadel? Conrad Verner and Jenna, Kelly Chambers and Aria, everyone you spend the game meeting was probably murdered, if not when the Reapers took over the citadel then when Shepard blows the whole thing up.

Sorry I agree with what your saying I just want to let you know that Kelly Chambers dies half way though the game. Cerberus finds her and shoots her in the head when they attack the Citadel.


You can save Kelly.

WHAT?! HOW? TELL ME!


the first time you meet her, talk about cerberus and convince her to changer her identity

#80
Jaron Oberyn

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I think its only for ME2 LIs, apparently its a bug. Ashley/Liara work properly depending on who you romanced.


-Polite

#81
Greed1914

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Karrie788 wrote...

I see your point. But again. Nobody is asking for a happy ending. I admit I wanted one, but if I can't have it, so be it. If the ending is good I can swallow it. But it wasn't.

We want an ending in which our choices actually matter and which does not contain more plot holes itself than the rest of the game.


Right there with you.  I was hoping for a happy ending but I didn't expect that it would necessarily be there.  I did think maybe I could paragon my way out like I did so many other times, but it wasn't required.  The big problem is not that we didn't get the nice, happy ending, it's that we didn't get what we were led to believe we'd get.  I thought with all their talk of 1000 variables and multiple endings I'd actually see those variables at work, either in the options laid before me or in and epilogue, and that each ending would be substantially different.  None of that happened.  

That doesn't even factor in the things that don't make sense logically.

#82
Dreogan

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Most people are furious that Bioware put the wrong ending in the game, not necessarily because they put a "bad" ending in. We see people rejecting the current ending, even replacing it with one of their own, because it is wrong. In a trilogy that's all about player choice, it's taken as a slap in the face when we can't get any sort of closure on how our decisions impact the survivors or even our squad. It's an additional punch in the gut when we can't even change the ending beyond a colored flash of light and possibly a techy overlay with our one universe-shattering decision. In short, the "point" of the entire trilogy shifts from "your choices" to "Shepard dies! *slams book closed*"

This goes back to the reader-writer contract. Here's another short source. The fact that Bioware went three games strengthening their base formula makes the ending asinine: With their railroaded death of Shepard, the nonsense with the star-god-child, the absurdity of teleporting squadmates to the Normandy, and the laziness of recolored assets, it's no wonder people feel no reason to play the trilogy again or even NG+. This points directly to the following violations (from source #1). Keep in mind this is not an exhaustive list, and the source itself goes on to state the more works created by an author "the more complex the contract, for the reader builds expectations of what that author will or will not do—better known as a brand.":

-That the rules will not change and the author will play by the rules he sets up. If in the world created birds can swing but not fly, we better not see flying birds halfway through.

The first rule broken is the character of Shepard simply would not take the star-god-child's words at face value. S/He has been in similar situations in the past, and has always had the chance to find his/her own path. What we get is blind acceptance; completely out of character.

The Reapers change throughout the story. They are never depicted as the big machines that see themselves doing the "right" thing. In their own words, humans are nothing more than an insect-- trivial, meaningless, easily crushed. 

The worst rule broken, however, is everything with the exception of eezo has a solid basis on possible existant tech or tech theories. Synthesis is space magic. Full stop.

-That there’ll be good ending, a primarily source for an emotionally satisfying experience. A multitude of errors will be forgiven if a great ending is provided. And what qualifies as a great ending? The release of tension that come from the sense of rightness, the feeling that this is the way things should—had—to be, whether bittersweet or happily-ever-after.

There is absolutely no sense of rightness; the ending doesn't even bother to explain how things are "right." It just shows explosion, generic combat scene, colored lights in relays, then (if you're really lucky!) Shepard taking a breath before we see a scene at Asspull Island. We see no resolution in characters' stories, in the LI, or even back on Earth aside for the color-shifted light as it goes through. 

"But wait!" you might say, " They wanted the player to reach their own conclusions!" 
This is a violation of point #1. Even in the abysmal end of Mass Effect 2, we got another conversation with The Illusive Man for closure. At the end of the trilogy we get a man that says "the Shepard" is a legend. Another writing adage: SHOW, DON'T MOTHER****ING TELL. We expect to see Shepard a legend, through the eyes of the people he saved. Not from some anonymous grandpa ten generations removed simply "saying" he's a legend.

-That the author will not deceive the reader. An author can mislead a character and therefore the reader, but the truth must be there and twists properly foreshadowed so that a reader can look back and say, “Duh! Of course, that’s what had to happen. Why didn’t I see that coming?"

The Catalyst Star-God-Child. The options open to Shepard. The Normandy on Asspull Island. There is no foreshadowed reason for any of these to exist; they're simply trash thrown together at the last second in a desperate attempt to ship on time.

-That the flip-side of that will be true—all foreshadowing will be fulfilled. Or as is talked about in playwriting, if there’s a gun on the wall, it’d better be fired before the end of the act.

In this case, the "loaded gun" is dark energy. It is never properly explained or resolved. Considering how just about everything isn't resolved after the star-god-child, you can add just about anything in any of the three games here.



So yes, while the valiant sacrifice of Shepard makes perfect sense for the trilogy (in theory), but the fact that it is presented in a bubble without character choice, reason, or visible reaction (showing not telling), damns this ending. There's absolutely nothing wrong with a tragedy-- that's why that genre has survived thousands of years. What is wrong, however, is they essentially decided to duct tape the ending of Star Wars to the ending of The Lord of the Rings. It's the wrong ending for the trilogy. They quite literally ripped the writer-reader contract in half, which is the holiest of holies to an author.

It's not bad writing, it's bad storytelling-- a much more severe offense.

I'm not trying to tell you you're "wrong" in liking the ending. On its own, I suppose it stands as a somewhat cliche soldiery scifi thing endy. I'm sure you'd agree with me when I say that it's not the right ending, though, especially for this trilogy.

Modifié par Dreogan, 11 mars 2012 - 08:55 .


#83
GodChildInTheMachine

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So far everyone who is taking a supportive stance toward the ending is really missing the point in why it is being met with so much criticism. I personally would not mind a "dark" ending, where everyone dies, Shepard fails, or the monkeys from the Wizard of Oz suddenly burst out of London Tower and poop in everybody's faces (as long as that was properly explained in some way). I just wish it made ANY kind of sense at all.

I know this has been said over and over, but the singular ending in three different colors comes completely out of left field and turns the whole story before it on its head. Good writing makes a conclusion that follows the rules that were established in the preceding story. By violating those rules, the reader/player is forced into an uncomfortable state of disbelief, and the trust that it takes for the audience to spend their time involved in the story is completely trashed. The ending is a very clear display of horrible writing - it is a deus ex machina plot device, which is almost universally held in disdain from a critical perspective. I feel exactly the same way about this ending as I did about the Matrix trilogy. Maybe that's because it is in fact THE EXACT SAME ENDING as you find in the Matrix.

That's just from a writing perspective. You also have the fact that it is a complete failure in logic. Everyone knows what I mean... The Reapers destroy life in order to save it; the Citadel was the Reaper Overmind all along; the entire combined military force of the galaxy is now stranded at Earth; and somehow your crew ends up lightyears away from where they were literally minutes before even though some of them may have been on the ground with you when you were knocked out by the Reaper.

Then there is the question of mechanics. After coming the whole way through 3 different games, making a unique story path, you are forced into a false "choice" that has absolutely NO relationship with the decisions you've made before. You get exactly the same ending as everyone else, with the only deciding factor in how much "choice" you get being your effective military power.

Please note that none of the things I've mentioned are subjective or emotional. I can see how the ending can be effective emotionally, but that is in the eye of the beholder. I am NOT saying I want a happy-ever-after ending, just one that is consistent with the content and quality of the rest of the series up to the very last part. If you like the ending I am happy for you, but so far no one has been able to defend them from a critical point of view. I don't think that's their fault, more that there is no logical defense for them to be had. Even I have to admit that I was emotionally struck by the first ending I got, which was the synthesis one, and I was kind of confounded by it but willing to accept it under the assumption that it was merely one of several possible outcomes. Imagine how distraught I was when I found out that they are all the same.

Now there are a lot of people suggesting the idea that the ending we have isn't the complete one, and that it is an illusion created by some kind of Reaper mind rape. This takes a heavy amount of rationalisation but there are some decent points to be made. I personally do not hold out hope at this point that Bioware is pulling some kind of sadistic practical joke on us in a brilliantly concieved but commercially detrimental last minute plot twist. I think they honestly harbor the delusion that what they wrote and executed is some kind of excuse for good story telling. In my opinion they are raising their faces to the sky right now, asking themselves, "WHY GOD don't they understand our brilliant and artistically majestic masterpiece of science fiction divinity!"

However if they truly did cook this all up, for whatever backward reason, and they release ANYTHING that just makes some GOD DAMN SENSE... I would probably bow at their feet and submit my broken eternal soul to their bidding.

#84
CitizenSnips

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I liked the ending before it was cool.

Hating the ending is so cliche.