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To Those Saying Not to Expect A "Disney" Ending


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#51
FunstuffofDoom

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askanec wrote...

There are good endings. All 3 are good endings, just not the kind of classic Hollywood good endings you are used to.

Shepard can live, depending on your choice. His story is remembered and passed down the generations. His crew and the Normandy survived the battle. The Reaper threat is no more. Even better, the Catalyst who controlled the Reapers had agreed to a new solution (which means no more future cycle of destruction).

Best of all, the mass relays are gone, which means the galaxy is free to advance in their own way. Some players mourned the loss of the mass relays, but that is short-sighted. As Legion mentioned in ME2, using such technology only serves to put the users on the path of advancement the Reapers wanted them to.

By selecting the synthesis ending, alien races don't even need the mass relays anymore. They can go on years, even centuries of space voyage. Synthetics don't need food for the long journey and they don't die from aging.



I've got six pages on why that doesn't hold up. The link's in my signature, if you're curious. I'd love to see a counterpoint to it. But, quickly:

There isn't a choice for Shepard to live. As in, there is no amount of prepardedness or not that allows Shepard to walk out of the Catalyst alive. The choice is, you either kill off the Geth and EDI, or you die. And then, it's simply a matter of what you chose to die for.

The idea that Shepard is immortalized because she hasn't died the second death yet (Second death: the death of the memories of a person that continue on after they, the person, dies) is... well it's a consolation statement. You know how else Shepard could have lived on past the events in the Catalyst? By not dying a first time. Or, well, a second time, if you count that Lazarus thing. Seriously, at this point, Shepard's actions have immortalized her, no matter what.

The penultimate statement, about how without the mass relays, society can advance on its own merits, is, well, it's the best defense the current endings are ever going to get, I think. Thing is, the point about withholding technology isn't so people don't have the tech, it's so people aren't aware of the idea behind the tech. Society may not have mass relays, any more, but they've got most of the galaxy's smartest people and most of the galaxy's tech all in one place, and you can be damn sure they're going to try and find a way to reconnect with the rest of the galaxy. Mass relays may not be the only method they try. It may not be the method they settle on, since you still need to get one to wherever you're going, but they're demonstably effective and demonstrably efficient. They're going to get made again, in the future.

And that last bit, about synthetics not need food, and being able to wait forever: Possibly true. Now if only BioWare had actually said something to that effect. All we know for sure is that Joker's eyes changed color.

Modifié par FunstuffofDoom, 11 mars 2012 - 01:54 .


#52
The Angry One

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A Golden Dragon wrote...

Disney ending?  No need.  This also isn't BSN's story.  Bioware told it as they wished.

That the realistic aftermath of a war for survival was shown instead of parties (see Star Wars Return of the Jedi) seems to have gotten many upset may have been intended.  I'm not saying it couldn't have been done better (it definitely could have) but really?

Normandy crash?  Bioware promised only an end to SHEPARD'S story, not Mass Effect.


Mass Effect 4:  500 years ago, Commander Shepard destroyed the Reapers, saving galactic society.  As a side effect, all mass relays were also destroyed.  A Salarian team, field testing a new Long-Distance FTL drive core, has a mistake in Navigation, and has to land on an unknown planet to pick up some fuel for the trip back to Sur'Kesh.  While exploring, they come across the remains of the SSV Normandy.  Suddenly, an Asari appears, calling herself Liara T'Soni, and this meeting proves to be just the tip of the iceberg that brings new dangers, new allies, and a whole new experience as a galaxy continues to rebuild after the Reaper War.

Why wouldn't Bioware leave us hanging with a "preview" of a planned new game?  It's not like THAT hasn't happened before....

:wizard:


Because the Salarians would totally take only 500 years to make something the Protheans never could (it took them thousands of years to make a RELAY).

#53
Robob_2005

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I just finished my first playthrough this morning and here's what I thought:
(~6100 War Assets score and 97% Galactic Readiness if that even matters)

Okay I'm just going to drag myself straight up the middle...... I watch the cutscene.
"No, no no, that can't be right."  
Reload the last checkpoint then choose the *blue option on the left: "Mehh, that can't be right either." 
 Still dissatisfied choose the *red option on the right. "Ugh..."  

"Wow, just wow....." :(

Well now I have zero motivation to play through with my other Shepards.

**My Shepard's final thoughts: "Mordin, Thane, Kaidan, we will be together again my friends... Geronimo!!!"


---"I tried so hard, and got so far, but in the end, it doesn't even matter."---

#54
Umbrellamage

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An acceptable "happy" ending: The crucible works as intended, no deus ex machina bull. The reapers are destroyed. Cut to Shepard and his team landing on earth helping with search and rescue, pan out to survey the devastation and ship wreckage burning up in the atmosphere. Black screen, credits.

I just wrote a better ending than bioware did.

Modifié par Umbrellamage, 11 mars 2012 - 02:10 .


#55
Deztyn

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I'm not opposed to the Disney ending. I'd probably take the option of letting my paragon shep run off and make babies with Alenko if it was there.

I'm actually more bummed that there's no failure ending. Leave behind something that lets the next cycle win but have the Reapers win this one. Basically, I wish there was a Prothean ending.

And of course that the endings we got were nonsensical and involved a random Glowy God Child, whose existence was never even remotely hinted at in the previous two games, and his magical colored lights.

#56
The Angry One

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Yeah no failure ending is a real oversight too.
Then again I consider the actual endings failure endings. Because despite what some people say, you fail. You did not prevail against the Reapers. You did exactly what the Reaper boss allowed you to do. You. Failed.

#57
Deztyn

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Shhh...

I was trying to be nice.

#58
DarkSpider88

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Umbrellamage wrote...

An acceptable "happy" ending: The crucible works as intended, no deus ex machina bull. The reapers are destroyed. Cut to Shepard and his team landing on earth helping with search and rescue, pan out to survey the devastation and ship wreckage burning up in the atmosphere. Black screen, credits.

I just wrote a better ending than bioware did.


Again a happy medium, not an overly happy ending but one that gives hope. It would have been heartwarming to see Shepard and his squad doing a search and rescue in the aftermath. Just give me some hope that the universe and characters I have grown to love come out scathed but alive, and not synthesized.

#59
bro_9009

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*deleted* sorry about that, wont happen again =(

Modifié par bro_9009, 11 mars 2012 - 02:52 .


#60
DarkSpider88

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bro_9009 wrote...

*deleted* sorry about that, wont happen again =(


confused what did you do?

#61
Ambelie

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Personally, I wasn't expecting a "disney ending" but in a game that so heavily emphasized the decisions that you have made previously, to have none of them matter felt like a huge let down. I fully expected there was a strong likelihood of Shepard dying, but I thought there'd be a chance to save him/her.

#62
bro_9009

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DarkSpider88 wrote...

bro_9009 wrote...

*deleted* sorry about that, wont happen again =(


confused what did you do?


I posted about metacritic scores in a couple of threads, sorry. Checked the rules to be sure - apparently that was spam =) Won't happen again as I promised =)

#63
DarkSpider88

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Ambelie wrote...

Personally, I wasn't expecting a "disney ending" but in a game that so heavily emphasized the decisions that you have made previously, to have none of them matter felt like a huge let down. I fully expected there was a strong likelihood of Shepard dying, but I thought there'd be a chance to save him/her.


I am not asking for a full on "Disney" ending. I am just asking for an ending where Commander Shepard can achieve some measurable piece of victory. In all endings he is conforming to a choice laid out by the Reapers. Heck it would have been nice to see Shepard stuck with the Normandy on that forsaken world.

#64
HrzRanok

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A rainbow vanilla disney ending would have meant the end of all the universe entirely including the galaxy, earth and everything. maybe not initially but eventually. This disney ending is impossible given the facts about the story, the reapers, and shepherd.

This is a fact that many people are missing. Lets say an ending existed so that shephard lives, the reapers, destroyed, mass relays left in place, etc...
With no cycle in place to keep a tab on organics, eventually they would create a synthetic life form that would destroy everything. maybe not right away, but eventually.

So an ending like your describing would be the end of all things as we know it. Not a very good ending to ME3 IMO.

#65
HrzRanok

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Shephard had to die.
And by the way Shephard is still alive everyone. Just not in human form.

#66
bro_9009

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HrzRanok wrote...

A rainbow vanilla disney ending would have meant the end of all the universe entirely including the galaxy, earth and everything. maybe not initially but eventually. This disney ending is impossible given the facts about the story, the reapers, and shepherd.

This is a fact that many people are missing. Lets say an ending existed so that shephard lives, the reapers, destroyed, mass relays left in place, etc...
With no cycle in place to keep a tab on organics, eventually they would create a synthetic life form that would destroy everything. maybe not right away, but eventually.

So an ending like your describing would be the end of all things as we know it. Not a very good ending to ME3 IMO.


But that is only if you accept this kind of logic from an AI that is harvesting organics. That's like saying that humanity will destroy itself eventually, it's like fatalism. What about geth/quarians alliance? Doesn't it prove something in your opinion?

Are you saying that the only option to prevent this is to go Synthesis? But that is kind of like forcing a will of one man upon all of the sentient organics/geth. Doesn't seem right to me.

#67
Fiannawolf

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YAY!!! HUMOR HELPS!!

#68
gmboy902

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 I understand that there isn't always a happy ending, but I would like some resolution to the plot.

What are we going to do with thousands of destroyed ships' worth of space debris floating outside Earth? How about all of the surviving races who are stuck in the Local cluster because all of the relays are gone? It seems like the end of the galaxy will come not by Reapers, but by the loss of the relays - families are torn up forever, Earth will probably find itself torn apart by destruction and competing factions, the Citadel is completely gone, colonies around the galaxy will die out due to a lack of resources, etc.

You'd like to think that after beating the Reapers, something good would come out of it. Even if Sheperd dies, even if Joker and your squadmates get transported to some sci-fi heaven. The ending is too surreal and unimaginable to be a real ending - I want an ending that shows some progress being made towards fixing society, not some stargazer and his annoying son.

As for the Overlord/God child/Borg at the end of the game, I don't know. It was a little odd to accept, but it did bring resolution as to why the Reapers existed and why they cleansed the galaxy every so often.

I don't mind that Sheperd died. I don't that Joker and Garrus and James (my squad-mates) died. I don't mind that Anderson died. I just mind that it doesn't seem like civilization can resume (unless they find some way to recreate the relays, which would be difficult)

#69
gmboy902

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HrzRanok wrote...

Shephard had to die.
And by the way Shephard is still alive everyone. Just not in human form.


That's only true for one ending. I chose to destroy all of the synthetics and saw Sheperd blown aside by the explosion at the Citadel.

#70
deathscythe517

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....Hrz, just, my lord, you've literally hurt my brain with your post. You're actually believing the bull**** the omnipotent plot device said?

#71
bro_9009

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deathscythe517 wrote...

....Hrz, just, my lord, you've literally hurt my brain with your post. You're actually believing the bull**** the omnipotent plot device said?


Maybe he's just trolling or being sarcastic =) No offence, Hrz. Haven't seen this kind of total agreement with AI kid logic on the forums before.

#72
DarkSpider88

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HrzRanok wrote...

A rainbow vanilla disney ending would have meant the end of all the universe entirely including the galaxy, earth and everything. maybe not initially but eventually. This disney ending is impossible given the facts about the story, the reapers, and shepherd.

This is a fact that many people are missing. Lets say an ending existed so that shephard lives, the reapers, destroyed, mass relays left in place, etc...
With no cycle in place to keep a tab on organics, eventually they would create a synthetic life form that would destroy everything. maybe not right away, but eventually.

So an ending like your describing would be the end of all things as we know it. Not a very good ending to ME3 IMO.


I disagree with your ideas. Throughout the series Shepard has always had the choice to try make peace between the species. There is no proof that synthetics will kill organics just some AI God Child saying so. In my ideal ending my shepard points out that the Geth and Quarian conflict had been worked out. That if galaxy tries hard enough they can overcome the obstacles, or they should at least be afforded the chance to try.

#73
Tartilus

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HrzRanok wrote...

A rainbow vanilla disney ending would have meant the end of all the universe entirely including the galaxy, earth and everything. maybe not initially but eventually. This disney ending is impossible given the facts about the story, the reapers, and shepherd.

This is a fact that many people are missing. Lets say an ending existed so that shephard lives, the reapers, destroyed, mass relays left in place, etc...
With no cycle in place to keep a tab on organics, eventually they would create a synthetic life form that would destroy everything. maybe not right away, but eventually.

So an ending like your describing would be the end of all things as we know it. Not a very good ending to ME3 IMO.


Even if we were to posit that this is correct, which is quite a stretch, that does not excuse them from providing closure to those characters. Shepherd does not have to survive, and things do not have to be happy, for me to know who lived, who died, and have even the vaguest notion as regards the future of the characters and places we've come to know and love.

#74
FoxShadowblade

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Hrz, even if organic life does eventually create something that leads to their demise, they should be allowed to do so. It's what both paragon and renegade shepards stood for: self-determinism. And then he just swallows space kid logic and agrees.

No matter how much you,like the endings, they don't fit ME and they are poorly done.

#75
DarkSpider88

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FoxShadowblade wrote...

Hrz, even if organic life does eventually create something that leads to their demise, they should be allowed to do so. It's what both paragon and renegade shepards stood for: self-determinism. And then he just swallows space kid logic and agrees.

No matter how much you,like the endings, they don't fit ME and they are poorly done.


Thank you that is what I found wrong with all the endings they are all Reaper decisions noit Shepard's!