171 réponses à ce sujet

[GuardianAngel470]

Archereon wrote...

Lexagg wrote...

Archereon wrote...

Even if we do not consider people voting in more than one poll, the total number of votes is less than 1% of Mass Effect's total purchasing base.

Which is a statistically significant sample size. So no, we aren't.

This is not a statistically significant forum. Hell, I'd rate this forum worse than /v/ in terms of its credibility and how representitive it is of the overall consumer base.

I'd estimate less than .05% of the acutal consumer base is represnted in these polls (and that said .05% is the most fanatical and arguably unreasonable demograph in the consumer base), considering double voting and voting on multiple polls.

Considering the fact that your throwing around baseless statistics, I'm having a hard time agreeing with you. You state a statistic and expect us to take it as fact.

Considering the fact that this poll has over ten thousand people voting against the current endings, which is in fact at most .0035% of the total purchase base, you statistics ring really, really hollow.

Besides, 10,000 dissenters is a statistically significant amount and can relatively accurately be calculated to represent the overall population.

So no, I don't think we are the vocal minority. I think we are the vocal majority. We're the people actually on the internet making a fuss while others wallow in misery in silence.

Modifié par GuardianAngel470, 11 mars 2012 - 02:53 .

[Ariaya]

Archereon wrote...



Then we're on the same page. I'm really just hoping for people to stop talking about the endings endlessly, and stop asking for post catalyst DLC. The former is unconstructive, and the latter is exceedingly unlikely.

You can "hope for people to stop talking about the endings endlessly."  But you do realize that this thread is not going to just suddenly silence people who feel the need to vent/ and or voice their opinion?  Just as you feel that people asking for post catalyst DLC is unconstructive (because you feel that there is no chance that this will happen) can you not also see how unconstructive it is for you come in and demand that people stop discussing the endings?  Just as you feel that people asking for DLC will accomplish nothing--don't you see that you are doing the exact same thing with your "hopes" for this thread?  Wouldn't it be simpler and more logical to simply avoid engaging in threads and discussions that involve discourse about the endings?

Without getting into my own personal feelings about the endings--as it's irrelevant here--I really do not understand what you think you will accomplish with your judgmental and unfair generalizations about the people who post on these forums.

Your actions are just as unreasonable and illogical as your unfounded criticisms about a whole bunch of people that you do not know.

Modifié par Ariaya, 11 mars 2012 - 02:55 .

[dkear1]

What is truly funny is the metacritic score. The PC version has the lowest (around 3.4/10) and the xbox the highest (5/10) with the PS3 in the middle. Sure the game is in reality an 8 or even a 9 without the crappy endings, but to discount the whole thing, or to "assume" that this is a temporary fad from a tiny fraction of spoiled kids is ludicrous. Besides you know what happens when you "assume"........

Modifié par dkear1, 11 mars 2012 - 02:57 .

[LadyoftheLake]

Go to gopetition.com their are over 2000 votes for a change last I checked . So tell me are all 2000 people on there from here too? Or could it be that us on here are just the loudest?

[Bendok]

Joe Sixpack player hasn't beaten the game yet, and most of them won't beat it period. It's shocking how few people finish games.

But yes only a minority will be vocal about it. The people who were very attached to the series. Only reason we're upset. If we thought the games were mediocre we wouldn't care.

[Draco2fox]

Gigerstreak wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch

I hate agreeing with Hitler

[SandTrout]

Draco2fox wrote...

Gigerstreak wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch

I hate agreeing with Hitler

Me too, but when he's right, he's right....

[raeting]

AlexMBrennan wrote...

Archereon wrote...
Even if we do not consider people voting in more than one poll, the total number of votes is less than 1% of Mass Effect's total purchasing base.

That's not how statistics work.

That's exactly how statistics work. Assuming it's a representative sample, which it isn't, more votes mean smaller confidence intervals.

Don't think you read the rest of my comment.

The assertion that the respondants to the polls is less than 1% of the purchase base as a bad thing is disingenuous. That's plenty of information to get some idea of the overall player base's opinion. If the stats were a good sample, which they aren't, and I stated as much.

Argue against the polls based on their sample, not the number of people who responded. 

[dkear1]

LadyoftheLake wrote...

Go to gopetition.com their are over 2000 votes for a change last I checked . So tell me are all 2000 people on there from here too? Or could it be that us on here are just the loudest?

I just went to the site and signed the petition becoming the 2,226th signer asking for Bioware to change the endings.

I noticed there is also a poll to leave the endings as they are.....it has 3 signers..........ROFL!!!!

[golyoscsapagy]

This thread pretty well sums up why BW forums are considered rude, full of self-entitled childish people. Seeing the downright hostile posts I do wonder: you really think if you behave the same way with devs do they have the slightest intention to help you?

About statistics: forum polls never worth a crap. It's not about sample size. The whole point most of you conveniently miss when you compare this sample size with exit polls is randomness. Polls here are not voted on by random people unlike an exit poll and this heavily influences the outcome. If BW would send out idk, 100k emails about the endings and sum up the answers that would be an unbiased and pretty much reliable result. This? Don't make me laugh. This poll only shows that from 3 million game owners 10k doesn't like the ending.

And making a dlc in hopes that this poll shows anything is not really a sound business stategy. Let's say the DLC would cost USD 20. Half of the people would fly into rage because they would feel entitled to get it for free. Other half would probably buy it. The rest? Noone knows - as this DLC wouldn't give any additional content I presume it would be less attractive to the regular customer who doesn't have a solid oppinion about the endings. So yeah, you have then 100-200k revenue. Lol. Don't see it happening.

And about 'But BW should do just as I want because I paid 200 dollars to them and I absolutely feel I OWN the whole bunch for this money'. Actually giving in to the vocal playerbase is the worst thing a company can do. Most of them will forget their grief as soon as the next part comes out and as people have a nasty habit of asking more and more for less and less this would result in bankruptcy soon.

So no, if I would have to bet I would say no ending DLC would come. BW sits out the storm. Most of the angry fanbois will leave. And this culling of the playerbase is not neccessarly a bad thing.

[Greed1914]

Bendok wrote...

Joe Sixpack player hasn't beaten the game yet, and most of them won't beat it period. It's shocking how few people finish games.

But yes only a minority will be vocal about it. The people who were very attached to the series. Only reason we're upset. If we thought the games were mediocre we wouldn't care.

Very true.  Bioware shared it's data showing that only about half of the people that playe ME2 saw it to the end.  The same is likely to happen here. 

Most might not be upset enough to try to do something about it, but I'm willing to bet that many of those people would gladly accept a better ending. 

[SpiritualOdyssey]

Archereon wrote...

Indeed, and that's why it won't be changed.

Trying to convince the posters of BSN to stop collective bargaining is like trying to convince the Illusive Man that controlling the Reapers is a bad idea.

... Wait, I've got it. We just need to COMMIT SUICIDE EN MASSE.

[Foehamer1]

Yes we are the vocal minority. In fact its only 10 of us who actually voted on the petition. We kind of each created 1000 accounts to do so.

[Dragoni89]

We were right about DAII ( looks at the sales). We are going to be right about this one too.

[Kloborgg711]

 I'm not even basing the assumption that I'm in the majority off of the number of people posting here... though it is a helluva lot. I'm basing it on the fact that I simply cannot imagine most people walking away from Bioware's ending and feeling in any way satisfied. It doesn't even seem controversial... it just seems really bad and poorly done. Honestly, it's not that hard to satisfy most people. Give us a generic ending or pull a twist, but just about every person who plays Mass Effect wants one thing in common: closure. We don't get closure.

[FoxShadowblade]

Honestly it shoulb be our duty as loyal fans of both Mass Effect and Bioware, and as consumers, to say "No, your product is unacceptable, change it." Most of us here put our faith in Bioware, setting down money for pre orders, attending the launches, buying other merchandise... Loyal consumers, treated with a poor product by a team that had to have known these endings would cause uproar because they knew we had emotionally invested in their series.

Seriously, who sat down and thought this would be a really good idea?

[RetrousseRaptor]

I thought the ending was the best of any game let alone trilogy to date. It ended an era of storytelling Bioware should be proud of.

[Morladin]

Archereon wrote...

I've been seeing all this talk on these forums about how everyone's united in hatred of Mass Effect 3's endings, not just BSN, but a lot of other communities as well...

But I'm afraid that's simply not true.

All those polls and petitions that people have been holding up as evidence for this?

Even if we do not consider people voting in more than one poll, the total number of votes is less than 1% of Mass Effect's total purchasing base.

The ending will NOT be changed for our sake I'm afraid, though I wouldn't be surprised if it gets retconned or hand waved to make room for ME4; EA milks games until they're no longer profitable, and prequels really don't have much room to manuever with the endings being the way they are.

To the rest of the world, the people asking for the endings to be changed are a bunch of sad, basement dwelling, arrogant, entitled fanchildren riding on a mile high horse.

So that's it, the endings are here to stay until ME4 gets greenlit. Can we please move on to complaining about something else?

Edit: I do believe I was a bit unclear about this thread. I meant to say that the people actually calling for the ending to be changed by DLC/patch/retcon are the vocal minority, most players have simply accepted the endings and moved on, and are unlikely to purchase DLC that changes those endings simply because it offers them better endings.

Millions of people vote in Presidential elections. Polls that predict the outcome usually have a 95% level of confidence, meaning there is a margin of error of + or - 3%. Only 2,000 people are needed to conduct an accurate poll to gaguge the opinions of millions of people. Here it is estimated that a little under 4 million people have bought the game. Your argument doesn't hold up.

[translationninja]

Archereon wrote...

^^^ Here we have the Internet Tough Guy in his natural environment.

Okay sorry for that, but please, no need to swear and threaten.

^ I have taken a course in statistics, and I've come to the conclusion that these Internet based polls are far too subject to external influences and personal bias (multiple voting, crossover between different polls, and the fact that the majority of consumers seem not to be up in arms, given the lack of polls with signatures in the hundreds of thousands) to be accepted as a credible source.

Yet you take the liberty of considering your "statistical variance" as the more likely one, which basically contradicts everything you so elaborately hypothesized before. I call BS....

[Kloborgg711]

golyoscsapagy wrote...

This thread pretty well sums up why BW forums are considered rude, full of self-entitled childish people. Seeing the downright hostile posts I do wonder: you really think if you behave the same way with devs do they have the slightest intention to help you?

About statistics: forum polls never worth a crap. It's not about sample size. The whole point most of you conveniently miss when you compare this sample size with exit polls is randomness. Polls here are not voted on by random people unlike an exit poll and this heavily influences the outcome. If BW would send out idk, 100k emails about the endings and sum up the answers that would be an unbiased and pretty much reliable result. This? Don't make me laugh. This poll only shows that from 3 million game owners 10k doesn't like the ending.

And making a dlc in hopes that this poll shows anything is not really a sound business stategy. Let's say the DLC would cost USD 20. Half of the people would fly into rage because they would feel entitled to get it for free. Other half would probably buy it. The rest? Noone knows - as this DLC wouldn't give any additional content I presume it would be less attractive to the regular customer who doesn't have a solid oppinion about the endings. So yeah, you have then 100-200k revenue. Lol. Don't see it happening.

And about 'But BW should do just as I want because I paid 200 dollars to them and I absolutely feel I OWN the whole bunch for this money'. Actually giving in to the vocal playerbase is the worst thing a company can do. Most of them will forget their grief as soon as the next part comes out and as people have a nasty habit of asking more and more for less and less this would result in bankruptcy soon.

So no, if I would have to bet I would say no ending DLC would come. BW sits out the storm. Most of the angry fanbois will leave. And this culling of the playerbase is not neccessarly a bad thing.

These forums hold the highest concentration of the most civil, thought-out, polite comments I've ever seen from any gaming forum. You keep telling me that people here are immature children, but I'm really not seeing it. I see a lot more:

"Bioware, I'm a huge fan and ME is my favorite story
This is my opinion on the ending:
*a few paragraphs of explanation*
As a valued customer I'd really love an alternative ending DLC, and I'd like to cast my vote in with everyone else"

than I see

"LOL BIOWAER U SUK, NEVR BUYING FRO U AGEN, U RUINED ME GUD JOB LOL"


But hey, if BW is really an immature forum overall for you, could you please direct me to a gaming forum you consider civil and intellectual in comparison?

[lasertank]

It's clearly we are the majority. I had never seen BSN united ever since. This union is even stronger than the DA2 riot.

[Goose1004]

Hey guys, what's going on in this thread?

[Spatchmo]

This is one of those, "I am superior to everyone else, I am going to complain about people complaining" threads. Why is the 3% of the BSN that enjoyed the endings so offended that 97% hated the endings?

[LadyoftheLake]

dkear1 wrote...

LadyoftheLake wrote...

Go to gopetition.com their are over 2000 votes for a change last I checked . So tell me are all 2000 people on there from here too? Or could it be that us on here are just the loudest?

I just went to the site and signed the petition becoming the 2,226th signer asking for Bioware to change the endings.

I noticed there is also a poll to leave the endings as they are.....it has 3 signers..........ROFL!!!!

So 2226 vs 3... huh... that's funny as hell! Lmao 3 that actually made me feel a bit better.

[eldiabs]

I never posted in this forum or complained about something in a game until this ending BS. I've always been part of the passive majority that just shrugs it off and moves on. But this was ridiculous. They took one of the coolest game trilogies of this decade and ruined it in the last 5 minutes. Those that invested time and emotion into the first two games most likely feel the same way. Not just some whining minority.

I said this before in another thread, but it's like if Lord of the Rings ended after Frodo lost his finger. Instead of the epic conclusion and wrapping up of all the different stories. What if tolkein just decided to have the volcano explode...the end. How would those books be remembered? What about the armies, the other characters, sauron himself? It would leave people with an empty feeling after investing so much time reading the books only to have the author kick you in the goose eggs at the end. That's what they did with ME3. Kicked all of the players square in the nuts, and took our money. Not only that, they leave a nice little message at the end, continue the journey, buy dlc. I think not.

If they sold the dlc to fix the ending, I would not buy it. The whole series was ruined for me by that crap they came up with, leaving everything you worked on the first two games as pointless banter. It revealed the wizard behind the oz, showed the cracks in the walls, destroyed the illusion..however you want to put it. Sure the journey was a blast, but replay value is now lost completely. If they patch it or give new endings away for free, I may try, but I'm doubting that more and more.

I really don't care anymore if they fix this, as I doubt they will anyway. If they were like Bethesda they might, but not Bioware or EA. At the very least they'll try and profit from it by selling all the suckers 10 dollar dlc for new endings...genius marketing. But they've lost my business for good. You can't undo what has already been seen. And to try and cover it up with oh you had a dream would be such a joke.

Modifié par eldiabs, 11 mars 2012 - 03:31 .