154 réponses à ce sujet

[Spiffy McBang]

Sarah1281 wrote...

To be fair, I think the reason they shafted the Jacob romance was because so many female players complained his romance was boring.

So they gave the female fans what they thought they wanted, I think.

This pleases no one. Fans don't like the romance then they don't play it. Who is honestly happy that they did that to Jacob fans? I could see them catering maybe if they turned Jacob into a terrible person full stop but as it is he's got a great life and is doing great if you don't romance him and he's only awful if he was romanced. Or they could have killed him off or something if they were trying to cater to anti-Jacob fans. They way they did it makes no sense.

If fan complaints that the Jacob romance was boring factored into the decision-making process, it should have pushed them to make it less boring, not to eliminate it completely.

That said, even though for better balance it should have happened to one of ManShep's options, I'm glad they had someone who moved on from Shepard and found someone new.  That's entirely plausible, even given how amazing all Shepards inherently are, and a nod towards the reality of human relationships that they included such a situation.

What I really think they should have done, however, was kept the scenario the same, but given a super-renegade FemShep the option to woo him away from his happy, pregnant girlfriend.  That would have been effing amazing.

[taloris]

22percent wrote...

Shepard: The bed’s a lot harder than it looks.
James: Are you flirting with me, Lola?
Me: YES!
Shepard: >=(
James: Okay, okay, I’m going.
Me: Wha-?

I had the exact same reaction. Was not amused when all that fun dialogue accumulated to absolutely nothing in the end<_<

[CheeseEnchilada]

Spiffy McBang wrote...

That said, even though for better balance it should have happened to one of ManShep's options, I'm glad they had someone who moved on from Shepard and found someone new.  That's entirely plausible, even given how amazing all Shepards inherently are, and a nod towards the reality of human relationships that they included such a situation.

What I really think they should have done, however, was kept the scenario the same, but given a super-renegade FemShep the option to woo him away from his happy, pregnant girlfriend.  That would have been effing amazing.

The thing that stings about this is that they picked who I assume is the least popular romance to do this to. For me, that says less about the writers trying to do something new, and more that they didn't particularly care to finish the romance and didn't think putting resources into it was worth it. Then they threw salt in the wound by having no one care when Thane died and not adding him as a Paramour, taking away another FemShep option. 

I'm trying to think of a comparison for ManShep's options, and it's not happening. If Tali shacked up with Kal'Reegar or if Liara decided Feron was the man for her, the outrage would be incredible. I just can't see them even mulling the idea over. 

[gearseffect]

I'm sensing a lot of female energy in here and I'm just one guy.... So please one at a time

I just thought I'd drop in a see how it's all going lot's of upset people in here about Thane and Jacob.

After typing that I started to laugh to myself Cortez DIES! So Gay Shep has no one at the end of the game.

[sojourner77]

This issue doesn't affect me directly - FemShep 1 stayed loyal to Liara, which I thought played as an incredibly satisfying, romantic relationship even working around non-recognition of the DLC romance content. FemShep 2 romanced Garrus, which I haven't played yet, but seems awesome from the non-romance stuff I have played. (hoping that picnic basket has more in it than guns!)

From a story standpoint, I really liked the end of Jacob's story, seemed a real coming-of-age story to me that suited the character. I also like the inclusion of actual gay and lesbian characters (as opposed to bisexual) - makes the universe seem more real. In fact, I'm definitely doing a run through with my maleShep including the Cortez romance, even if I have to play through the whole of ME2 again. I really like Cortez as a character.

I reckon that having Vega romanceable would have solved the problem without taking anything away from anyone else, combined with more Thane content - doomed romance and all. (I couldn't stand Thane, so not my cup of tea, but I can't see why it couldn't have had more romance in that story without major changes).

I also don't think all romances have to end well - if Garrus had been scripted to dump FemShep bc of alien distaste, that'd be fine if it was well-scripted. I liked the Jacob stuff in these terms too. Mass Effect is the Bioware franchise with the strongest stories to date, even the dark ones. I never thought it was just a wish fulfillment vehicle, that's not what I want from it. (But I haven't got to the ending yet, nor do I know what it is - might change my mind when I get there!!!).

[Sarah1281]

That said, even though for better balance it should have happened to one of ManShep's options, I'm glad they had someone who moved on from Shepard and found someone new. That's entirely plausible, even given how amazing all Shepards inherently are, and a nod towards the reality of human relationships that they included such a situation.

I'm fine with him moving on. It's sad but I get it. I wouldn't have any real complaints if he would have broken up with you either before meeting Brynn or after realizing that he has feelings for her but before doing anything. Even if he only lets you know after the two of them made out or had sex or something it would have been better than him only bothering to tell you once you track him down and he doesn't really have a choice.

[venusara]

I like the fact that Jacob moves on, it does lend to realism. I do wish it were equal though. Many of the female LI's have strong enough characters to move on from MaleShep, but sadly they all seem to live and die for him. FemSheps LI options are far less committed, Jacob runs to chase the next skirt in front of him. Is FemShep's that much less desirable?

Modifié par venusara, 08 avril 2012 - 09:58 .

[LaurenShepard-N7]

Don't you know straight female gamers don't exist, and anyone who plays femshep must be a dude in real life. <_< I feel sorry for the straight femsheps who aren't into Kaidan or Garrus. I don't get why BW devoted time to 3(!) non squad mate LIs while Vega doesn't even get a romance, despite all the flirting?? It's almost like they were half-way through writing one for him then ran out of time. He's not my type personally but he's exactly the kind of guy my friends would date, what a missed opportunity.

[FRANCESCO84Inn]

Hi, i'm a man, but i like play ME only whit Female Shepard, and my only Li for  all my Famele Shepard is Liara,

for any personal motivation,

but i like have more option to loak male charecter,

because i not like another romance,

my only romance is for Liara.

Modifié par FRANCESCO84Inn, 08 avril 2012 - 10:29 .

[Jadebaby]

Spiffy McBang wrote...

I agree that Garrus is a phenomenal romantic character. He was in ME2, and everyone says he is here too (somehow it got fubared for me so it never clicked in after their initial meeting- SAD). But, y'know, some ladies aren't into spikes and mandibles, no matter how wonderful the guy is. So if you've got a dead Kaidan... whoops! Three trillion ****s in the galaxy and you can't have any of them. So sorry.

Plus I always saw Garrus as a bff.

I agree with this though. Considering they knew Thane would die, it seems REAL harsh to turn Jacob into a ****. I liked his romance in me2 as well. Such a shame.

[Jadebaby]

LaurenShepard-N7 wrote...

Don't you know straight female gamers don't exist, and anyone who plays femshep must be a dude in real life. <_< I feel sorry for the straight femsheps who aren't into Kaidan or Garrus. I don't get why BW devoted time to 3(!) non squad mate LIs while Vega doesn't even get a romance, despite all the flirting?? It's almost like they were half-way through writing one for him then ran out of time. He's not my type personally but he's exactly the kind of guy my friends would date, what a missed opportunity.

Jersey shore guys? lol

[Thrazesul]

venusara wrote...

I like the fact that Jacob moves on, it does lend to realism. I do wish it were equal though. Many of the female LI's have strong enough characters to move on from MaleShep, but sadly they all seem to live and die for him. FemSheps LI options are far less committed, Jacob runs to chase the next skirt in front of him. Is FemShep's that much less desirable?

It's funny how none of the female LI's cheat on Maleshep... but then it'd cause a rage if anyone did because guys playing Mshep is simply the majority.

Luckily, I am already used to be seen as less important in games due to being a female player so. I guess Bioware's gone down that slope as well now.

Sorry, I'm a bit peeved at the moment.

[venusara]

I just want one female LI to turn ManShep down as harshly as Jacob does to FemShep: "You're not woth waiting for, I fell in love, and it's not with you." Ouch!

[Jadebaby]

venusara wrote...

I just want one female LI to turn ManShep down as harshly as Jacob does to FemShep: "You're not woth waiting for, I fell in love, and it's not with you." Ouch!

And then she home-wrecking **** has the nerve to say she wants their baby to be named after you. Salt in the wound....

[Daennikus]

Nerana wrote...

It's funny how none of the female LI's cheat on Maleshep... but then it'd cause a rage if anyone did because guys playing Mshep is simply the majority.

Would be a rightful consequence to a Renegade Broshep! 6 months is a lonnng time. A self-respecting woman wouldn't be fawning over a guy for more than a couple of weeks without contact.

Soma Holiday wrote...

Lianaar wrote...

I just wish they did one less lesbian option and invested that energy and time into one more hetero option. My husband had to listen to my rant about this too. I am particularly irked about male Shepard having more male choices then female Shepards. That's just so very odd for me.

THIS! Thank you all for this thread!  I am only about 15 hours into the game and I just found out that I won't be able to romance Thane and I am BEYOND pissed off.  I would have been fine with it if it wasn't for the fact that ALL of maleshep romances from 2 crossed over, and only ONE for femshep. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/surprised.png[/smilie]  How dare they?!  Seriously, how could they be okay with screwing over so many devoted fans, and for what?  New lame same-sex relationship choices?  I cant believe how little effort was put into the game to make female players happy.  Its like they really don't care, or assume only men play the game therefore want to see lesbian choices.  It is disgusting and I am appalled at this decision.  Only 2 out of the 10 options are practical for straight femsheps.  I had defended bioware from a lot of sexist accusations over the years, but this, toppled with edi's design, toppled with the lack of a larger female model in TOR, makes me see this company for what it really is, just another masogynistic developer that knows absolutely nothing about women nor aspires to know anything about them, and who continue to support sexist ideals.  I am beyond disgusted right now and don't even feel like playing this game anymore.

I have been thoroughly disappointed with the game so far anyway, but after hearing this I almost don't want to finish it.  I can't even fathom why they would do this, let alone think it was a good idea.  

geez i am so fricken angry right now I need to stop...

Just want to stress this honest reaction that is shared among gaming women. Is Bioware that conservative that they don't wish to see females exploring their options as non-homosexual partners? Do they have be either "faithful" or single? Is it some kind of conspiracy to enforce celibacy for women in position of power?

I know what it feels like to be unable to get close to someone who works with you, because of company policies on relationships in the workplace, and being reminded of that in a game is just pouring salt in the wound. 

This game and TOR aren't perfect, because our society is messed up. If a new ME is to be released, I sure hope they address this issue.

Modifié par Daennikus, 08 avril 2012 - 11:43 .

[Yuqi]

Uhm I think it's obvious what the fav in-house romance is for fshep...the hints are there..in ME3

The Human female soldier that talks about sending her daughter to her family on thessia.
The human female talking about telling her husband about her Asari Mistress.
The fact Kaidan was not included in the trailer..

[Sialater]

Spiffy McBang wrote...

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

Yeah, it's a problem on a military vessel. Fraternization with officers and stuff. What rank was James? Non-comm? Problem. 

This is another reason why, in a vacuum, I have no issue with James not being a LI option.  But in the scheme of the game, that only makes sense if there's a sufficient number of other potential suitors.  Since there's no one else guaranteed to be available, they should have made use of him in that role.

Besides, he's buff as hell and could win someone over just on the basis of his banter with Cortez, and Shepard is the hero of the galaxy.  You think people are going to call her out on digging into his BDUs on the basis of regulations?

James is a Lieutenant, IIRC.

Modifié par Sialater, 08 avril 2012 - 03:19 .

[DiabolicReality]

I saw someone complain about this, and the reply she got was basically 'well Liara isn't really a woman so there you go!'.

Man, I'm not even straight and even I see the flaws in that. Liara has boobs, a very feminine voice, a very feminine body and her personality quite clearly is female.
This basically means that a straight woman sitting behind the screen is not going to be attracted to her. The asari are basically "that hot odd colored alien chick" species. So it would make a lot of sense that straight girl gamers might not want to romance her, unless they do it as a run where their Shep is of a different orientation or they just are curious about the character development in the romance.

I found it a little strange too that straight FemShep is forgotten like that. What I seem to remember is that Thane actually had quite a few fans in ME2. So he gets killed off and...what then? Well, Kaidan. Here again assuming that every girl gamer would save Kaidan (I sure didn't) and want to romance him in ME3.

I wouldn't personally change the fact that you can't initiate a relationship with Garrus in ME3 without starting it in ME2, knowing how "WUT" he is the first time FemShep basically throws herself at him. But I can't figure out what were they thinking when they decided that Vega wasn't a romance option. The guy seriously doesn't open his mouth if he isn't going to flirt. FemShep gets basically bombarded by suggestive lines from the guy. It is so ridiculously obvious that I almost wanted to kick him in the nuts at times. Hey sure it is cool to have friends that you can jokeflirt with, but come on. Either give us the option to invite him over for another type of dance, or the option to tell him to cool his engines a bit because he's just trying too damn hard.

tl;dr FemShep is apparently destined to not be straight in ME3.

[Daennikus]

DiabolicReality wrote...

I saw someone complain about this, and the reply she got was basically 'well Liara isn't really a woman so there you go!'.

Man, I'm not even straight and even I see the flaws in that. Liara has boobs, a very feminine voice, a very feminine body and her personality quite clearly is female.
This basically means that a straight woman sitting behind the screen is not going to be attracted to her. The asari are basically "that hot odd colored alien chick" species. So it would make a lot of sense that straight girl gamers might not want to romance her, unless they do it as a run where their Shep is of a different orientation or they just are curious about the character development in the romance.

I found it a little strange too that straight FemShep is forgotten like that. What I seem to remember is that Thane actually had quite a few fans in ME2. So he gets killed off and...what then? Well, Kaidan. Here again assuming that every girl gamer would save Kaidan (I sure didn't) and want to romance him in ME3.

I wouldn't personally change the fact that you can't initiate a relationship with Garrus in ME3 without starting it in ME2, knowing how "WUT" he is the first time FemShep basically throws herself at him. But I can't figure out what were they thinking when they decided that Vega wasn't a romance option. The guy seriously doesn't open his mouth if he isn't going to flirt. FemShep gets basically bombarded by suggestive lines from the guy. It is so ridiculously obvious that I almost wanted to kick him in the nuts at times. Hey sure it is cool to have friends that you can jokeflirt with, but come on. Either give us the option to invite him over for another type of dance, or the option to tell him to cool his engines a bit because he's just trying too damn hard.

tl;dr FemShep is apparently destined to not be straight in ME3.

As a female gamer I found Vega to be extremely annoying and would have bought a jar like this for every time he opens his mouth.



And, coercing LadyShep into xeno-****** romance is sickening and reminiscent of a mysogynistic attitude going around the internet. 

Showing off a picture of "default femshep" before release was a wrong move. The fans focused to much on her appearance, her hair and makeup, that they completely overlooked the fact that Shepard is and always will be a man after all...

(because the majority of gamers have a penis)

[lazuli]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

venusara wrote...

I just want one female LI to turn ManShep down as harshly as Jacob does to FemShep: "You're not woth waiting for, I fell in love, and it's not with you." Ouch!

And then she home-wrecking **** has the nerve to say she wants their baby to be named after you. Salt in the wound....

The Jacob mess just reeks of laziness.  A few more "plot flags" or whatever they're called would have helped.  The dialogue should have been more responsive to what you did in ME2.

[BrowncoatN7]

I wish they would have added Joker and Vega as romance options </3 Especially Joker. I played through ME1 and 2 with a Shepard I was saving for Joker, I guess she'll stay Forever Alone

[lunamoondragon]

 I know this is kind of a silly thought, but I'm wondering if they'll have any romanceable DLC squadmates. They did it with Sebastian in DAII, so I could see it happening in ME3. 
It'd be nice to have the field evened out a little bit, even though my heart will always belong to Garrus. ;3

[lunamoondragon]

lament.ballad wrote...

I wish they would have added Joker and Vega as romance options </3 Especially Joker. I played through ME1 and 2 with a Shepard I was saving for Joker, I guess she'll stay Forever Alone

This. I guess the EDI romance is cute, but you even get the option to tell Joker you're interested in him and it doesn't work. D< 
I would've even been able to settle for a silly love triangle situation. There are plenty of Joker fangirls who would've loved to finally get their chance. But nooope. XD

[Ottemis]

Give him to me! *stomps feet*

ps: WTF Thane, Jacob.

Daennikus wrote...

Showing off a picture of "default femshep" before release was a wrong move. The fans focused to much on her appearance, her hair and makeup, that they completely overlooked the fact that Shepard is and always will be a man after all...

(because the majority of gamers have a penis)

I hope that's a joke. Otherwise i'll inform you that half the vocal femshep fanbase in the ME3 and ME2 threads is Male.

Modifié par Ottemis, 08 avril 2012 - 09:22 .

[SugarChic]

LinaMeta wrote...

Wait what? Vega can't be romanced? o_O And i thought he was just being shy because i was to far along in my Garrus romance. That means i can scrap my second playthough (Kaidan dead, Thane romanced) right now? Well glad i found i out so soon, now i just have to find a ME2 save with Kaidan alive ...

Yeah! That's what I thought too! Like, on the part in Shep's cabin where she says the bed is harder than it looks and Vega says, 'Are you flirting with me, Lola?", he just leaves. I also thought it was because I locked in the romance with Garrus, so he leaves by default.

Utter rage when I found out he wasn't romanceable, because I would have considered it in a future playthrough.