216 réponses à ce sujet

[Gigamantis]

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

What they are depends entirely on their intent, which is something that can't be determined and precisely why arguing the semantics of their label is a pointless diversion.  I wouldn't put it past these people to be be spoiling things intentionally out of general anger towards the game and their registration woe's.  In that sense I have little problem with my characterizing them as trolls. 

Like I already said, though, trying to make this discussion about the appropriate labels is just a weak strawman.  You should know better. 

Excluding of course that by characterizing as trolls merely due to lack of knowledge, you open yourself up to accusations of being a troll. Argument from ignorance is logic 101. Shall I report you now?

Any characterization on a forum is going to be almost entirely based on your interactions on the forum.  Since those characterizations will always be based on incomplete information it's just rhetoric.  You wanting to shift focus onto it is likely because you're more comfortable conversing about language than about the actual subject, so it's your attempt to gain the upper hand. 

A tactic like that could only work on a forum. 

[SolidBeast]

Gigamantis wrote...
You wanting to shift focus onto it is likely because you're more comfortable conversing about language than about the actual subject, so it's your attempt to gain the upper hand. 

Except you're doing the exact same thing by focusing on labeling people as trolls and ignoring the real point of the discussion (one that doesn't concern you at all).

[The Big Nothing]

Gigamantis wrote...

The Big Nothing wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Does it really matter?  Am I offending all the selfish people here by calling them trolls?  The definitions overlap enough for me to not care about semantic differences. 

Considering language is the basis for any form of conversation or argumentation, yes. You're not calling him inconsiderate. You're essentially calling him a sadist. If you don't care about your own words, why should anyone
else?

It's important to know when semantics matter and when they're just a strawman.  What you're doing is a fairly common internet discussion tactic; ignore the content of the discussion and create an unrelated semantics argument around a single word. 

Friendly advice, don't make a weak diversionary tactic like that the entirety of your response. 

I bet your excellent debate skills get you laid all the time when you aren't eating lunch alone in the school bathroom.

Troll says what?  

Seriously, though, at least you've all but accepted and embraced what I've said you were.  You still shouldn't be allowed on the forums, but at least you're direct and unapologetic in your childish nature. 

I try to be consistent.

And it seems you've fully embraced your true calling as a vigilante moderator; unfortunately, you're dull and meticulous in your autistic nature.

[Gigamantis]

SolidBeast wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

It's important to know when semantics matter and when they're just a strawman.  What you're doing is a fairly common internet discussion tactic; ignore the content of the discussion and create an unrelated semantics argument around a single word. 

Friendly advice, don't make a weak diversionary tactic like that the entirety of your response. 

Friendly advice: don't openly admit to not caring about what you say. It tends to make your every word worthless in the eyes of others.

Call them what they are, not what you imagine them to be in that mind of yours, oh chicken of "objectivity". 

What they are depends entirely on their intent, which is something that can't be determined and precisely why arguing the semantics of their label is a pointless diversion.

Yet your whole point of arguing with me is to insist on labeling me as a troll and basically ignoring the glaring issues here. Good job.

@Selene - I replied and asked you a question, in case you didn't notice.

I characterize you as a troll because posting spoilers in a forum that clearly states "no-spoilers" is a clear indicator.  With no insight into your mental process it's the most accurate characterization I can give, but all forum interactions are prefaced by the obvious fact that I don't actually know you.

[jbadm04]

The Big Nothing wrote...

Someguy81 wrote...

You shouldn't have to worry about spoilers on a NON SPOILER forum.
And nobody says you should leave just keep spoilers to your self.
Dont make others pay for something that's not their fault.

I agree. Normally, you shouldn't. It's unfortunate. But some people who have beaten the game and want to discuss it don't have access to the spoiler section.

people dont have access to gameplay/mp/tech forums when they didnt register ME3 and the only reason not to do so is when they pirated their copy. yet they keep bickerng about the game here. I wish BW would restrict all ME3 forums to registered people.

[The Big Nothing]

jbadm04 wrote...

The Big Nothing wrote...

Someguy81 wrote...

You shouldn't have to worry about spoilers on a NON SPOILER forum.
And nobody says you should leave just keep spoilers to your self.
Dont make others pay for something that's not their fault.

I agree. Normally, you shouldn't. It's unfortunate. But some people who have beaten the game and want to discuss it don't have access to the spoiler section.

people dont have access to gameplay/mp/tech forums when they didnt register ME3 and the only reason not to do so is when they pirated their copy. yet they keep bickerng about the game here. I wish BW would restrict all ME3 forums to registered people.

I have the Collector's Edition for Xbox and cannot register my copy. You are wrong.

[Il Divo]

Gigamantis wrote...

Any characterization on a forum is going to be almost entirely based on your interactions on the forum.  Since those characterizations will always be based on incomplete information it's just rhetoric.  You wanting to shift focus onto it is likely because you're more comfortable conversing about language than about the actual subject, so it's your attempt to gain the upper hand. 

A tactic like that could only work on a forum. 

Any characterization on a forum should be based on evidence to support it, not based on imagination. Again, I suggest you look into the argument from ignorance. It's pretty straightforward. All your "logic" would result in is everyone characterizing each other as trolls, based on disagreement and lack of knowledge regarding intent...which (hilariously) is exactly where we're at now.

Modifié par Il Divo, 11 mars 2012 - 05:58 .

[Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut]

jbadm04 wrote...

and the only reason not to do so is when they pirated their copy

Or they can't get their copy to work, or they can't get the registration process to work, or they'd rather not link their forum account to their main Origin account, or they're considering purchasing the game in the future and would like to discuss it, or...

[suliabryon]

Reorte wrote...

When is a spoiler a spoiler? A lot of people are taking mention of the endings, even without any details whatsoever, as spoilers. Would the same apply to the entire game? (e.g. and purely for the sake of argument "I found the whole game depressing?") There's a good chunk of grey area and if you're going to make sure that you're not crossing into that there's probably nothing at all left to talk about. Even technical issues can be spoilers ("My game always crashes on the mission on planet X" - thanks for telling me there's a mission on planet X) - and yes, I know there's a technical issues forum too, I was just using that as an example.

On the ending, while this might be true of some people, an awful lot of them post "just enough" to spoil - ie, referencing the ending of a popular TV series for comparison, making comments just vague enough not to be direct, yet anyone with half a brain cell can extrapolate what they're referring to - and they do this half the time in the TITLE of the post, making it impossible to avoid. I've avoided the threads about the ending like the plague, and yet I am pretty sure I've got the ending mostly figured out, thanks to these people.

Seriously, it's rude, it's selfish, and "not having access to post in the spoiler forum" is just an excuse. While that is unfortunate, it doesn't give them the "right" to post spoilers on the spoiler forums. That's just entitled BS. People shouldn't have to avoid the non-spoiler forum just to avoid being spoiled because someone else thinks they have the right to air their grievances even though it specifically breaks the rules and ruins it for everyone trying to stay spoiler free.

Modifié par suliabryon, 11 mars 2012 - 06:00 .

[SolidBeast]

Gigamantis wrote...

SolidBeast wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

It's important to know when semantics matter and when they're just a strawman.  What you're doing is a fairly common internet discussion tactic; ignore the content of the discussion and create an unrelated semantics argument around a single word. 

Friendly advice, don't make a weak diversionary tactic like that the entirety of your response. 

Friendly advice: don't openly admit to not caring about what you say. It tends to make your every word worthless in the eyes of others.

Call them what they are, not what you imagine them to be in that mind of yours, oh chicken of "objectivity". 

What they are depends entirely on their intent, which is something that can't be determined and precisely why arguing the semantics of their label is a pointless diversion.

Yet your whole point of arguing with me is to insist on labeling me as a troll and basically ignoring the glaring issues here. Good job.

@Selene - I replied and asked you a question, in case you didn't notice.

I characterize you as a troll because posting spoilers in a forum that clearly states "no-spoilers" is a clear indicator.  With no insight into your mental process it's the most accurate characterization I can give, but all forum interactions are prefaced by the obvious fact that I don't actually know you.

Because you have been following me around the forum, saw me spreading spoilers with malicious intent (known as "trolling") and thus have any basis to assume this?

[Gigamantis]

The Big Nothing wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

The Big Nothing wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Does it really matter?  Am I offending all the selfish people here by calling them trolls?  The definitions overlap enough for me to not care about semantic differences. 

Considering language is the basis for any form of conversation or argumentation, yes. You're not calling him inconsiderate. You're essentially calling him a sadist. If you don't care about your own words, why should anyone
else?

It's important to know when semantics matter and when they're just a strawman.  What you're doing is a fairly common internet discussion tactic; ignore the content of the discussion and create an unrelated semantics argument around a single word. 

Friendly advice, don't make a weak diversionary tactic like that the entirety of your response. 

I bet your excellent debate skills get you laid all the time when you aren't eating lunch alone in the school bathroom.

Troll says what?  

Seriously, though, at least you've all but accepted and embraced what I've said you were.  You still shouldn't be allowed on the forums, but at least you're direct and unapologetic in your childish nature. 

I try to be consistent.

And it seems you've fully embraced your true calling as a vigilante moderator; unfortunately, you're dull and meticulous in your autistic nature.

I've never reported anyone; i'm more interested in clarifying the nature of what you're doing to you, just in case you were confused.  Most people in this thread don't seem to realize how detrimentally anti-social they are.  I like you because you self-admit that you're a mess. 

[Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut]

suliabryon wrote...

People shouldn't have to avoid the non-spoiler forum just to avoid being spoiled because someone else thinks they have the right to air their grievances even though it specifically breaks the rules and ruins it for everyone trying to stay spoiler free.

I strongly agree with this. That's why there should be a spoiler forum for non-registrants.

[Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut]

Gigamantis wrote...

Most people in this thread don't seem to realize how detrimentally anti-social they are. 

[Gigamantis]

Il Divo wrote...

Gigamantis wrote...

Any characterization on a forum is going to be almost entirely based on your interactions on the forum.  Since those characterizations will always be based on incomplete information it's just rhetoric.  You wanting to shift focus onto it is likely because you're more comfortable conversing about language than about the actual subject, so it's your attempt to gain the upper hand. 

A tactic like that could only work on a forum. 

Any characterization on a forum should be based on evidence to support it, not based on imagination. Again, I suggest you look into the argument from ignorance. It's pretty straightforward. All your "logic" would result in is everyone characterizing each other as trolls, based on disagreement and lack of knowledge regarding intent...which (hilariously) is exactly where we're at now.

I'm not arguing that people are trolls; that characterization is just rhetoric and an aside.  I'm just making people aware of their fault in their intentional spoiling of this game, and pointing out that none of the blame belongs with Bioware or people who "visit the forums before finishing the game."  

Trying to deflect blame for your choices is childish. 

[Selene Moonsong]

SolidBeast wrote...

That is a good reason? People with the registered game are bigger fans? More worthy? Us dirty non-registers are tainting their forums?

1. A good reason? Yes, a good incentive to register your game for the added priviledge of discussing a registered game.

2. Registered member bigger and better fans? No, they are registered game owners granted additional privileges of access to post in topics limited to registered players.

3. More worthy yadda, yadda, yadda? No, see 2 above.

It has nothing to do with trolling, but it serves to keep the spammers and trolls out of the registered game forums?
This is not true. Registered game users can whine / **** / insult other people just as much. They simply aren't restricted from doing so. Yet everyone else is restricted from access on the assumption that they might be "trolls"?

Yet another misunderstanding. it is an incentive to register your game. If you don't register, or use an account not associated with your registered account, then you don't get the privilegdes afforded those who post from registered accounts.

Just because it is an old practice does not mean it should always remain a practice. Old =/= good.
Can you name one reason why it doesn't make sense to do so? People would vent there and there would be no rule-breaking, which is encouraged by this baffling practice anyway.

Why provide a separate forum granting un-registered users the same kind of privilidges as registered game users? 

You can disagree all you like in the General Forums as long as you do so in accordance with the Site Rules and Policies for these forums as provided by BioWare in the Site Rules to which all of us Community members must agree to when creating an account to use these forums. 

Modifié par Selene Moonsong, 11 mars 2012 - 06:06 .

[AJRimmsey]

Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut wrote...

suliabryon wrote...

People shouldn't have to avoid the non-spoiler forum just to avoid being spoiled because someone else thinks they have the right to air their grievances even though it specifically breaks the rules and ruins it for everyone trying to stay spoiler free.

I strongly agree with this. That's why there should be a spoiler forum for non-registrants.

excellent idea...in theory

but as this thread shows the spoilers are doing it for kicks and arguements.
any subject that angers people attracts these morons,as provoking is so much easier.

maybe a reg-free spoiler section with a 0% tolerance 1 month ban hammer threat might work

[Cuthlan]

I'm amazed that there is anything to argue here.

Don't post spoilers. It says no spoilers, so people come here thinking they are safe from spoilers.

So you can't or don't want to register your account to the forums. Okay... why does that mean you need to post spoilers in the No Spoilers section?

And ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO post them, you know your thread is gonna get locked anyway... so why not be a decent person and put a spoiler warning tag in your thread title?

Anyone that is trying to argue that it is at all acceptable to post spoilers here is a... something that will get me banned.

[Gigamantis]

ause you have been following me around the forum, saw me spreading spoilers with malicious intent (known as "trolling") and thus have any basis to assume this?

Knowingly posting spoilers in a place you know is non-spoiler is malicious, and while your intent can't be read without some form of ESP it doesn't preclude the use of the word troll in characterizing you or your actions.

Modifié par Gigamantis, 11 mars 2012 - 06:07 .

[SolidBeast]

Gigamantis wrote...
I'm not arguing that people are trolls;

Yeah, about that...

Gigamantis wrote...
Like I said, Bioware dropped the ball by allowing you trolls post anywhere without being registered. 

Gigamantis wrote...
Restricting a troll like you to the non-spoiler forums was obviously a mistake by Bioware

Gigamantis wrote...
People who purposely break forums
rules to spoil the game for unsuspecting ME fans are obviously trolls. 
Sorry if that realization upsets you. 

Consistency: you lack it.

[Sundance31us]

Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut wrote...
*image removed per Site Rule #6*

Yeah, just about all my D&D characters are LN.

Modifié par Selene Moonsong, 11 mars 2012 - 06:13 .

[Whybother]

Don't blame the posters. Blame Bioware for making a bad game.

[suliabryon]

Cuthlan wrote...

I'm amazed that there is anything to argue here.

Don't post spoilers. It says no spoilers, so people come here thinking they are safe from spoilers.

And ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO post them, you know your thread is gonna get locked anyway... so why not be a decent person and put a spoiler warning tag in your thread title?

Yes, this! I mean, don't post them at all, but if you're going to be selfish and do it anyway, don't be a [censored] about it.

[G3rman]

Ha!

My origin account is a bunch of bull, can't even get it to register with my xbox gamertag let alone work for this forum account.

I don't really care if my talk is close to spoiling things for you, I'll say what I want when it comes to the topic at hand. The game has been out for almost a week, most people should have it by now. Even if you haven't reached the ending the endings themselves are rarely spoiled in conversation, they are comments on how bad it is.

Stop clicking on threads that are obviously about spoilers.  Use your head.

Modifié par G3rman, 11 mars 2012 - 06:11 .

[Dave Exclamation Mark Yognaut]

Selene Moonsong wrote...

1. A good reason? Yes, a good incentive to register your game for the added priviledge of discussing a registered game.

 

I'd rather have Zaeed 

Selene Moonsong wrote... 

2. Registered member bigger and better fans? No, they are registered game owners granted additional privileges of access to post in topics limited to registered players.

This does raise an interesting question - is having the right to post on the BSN about ME3 spoiler topics as an incentive for registering the game worth denying all players, registrants and non-registrants, a genuinely spoiler-free forum?

[BounceDK]

OP; How about playing the game and not reading forum posts? Maybe that's too much to ask lmfao.