490 réponses à ce sujet

[GreyhameBioware]

killnoob wrote...

GreyhameBioware wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

They also need access to the resourses to make fuel (they dont have it), they still use fuel depots when they can, and they barely have the processing power for their fleet, much less the armada in Sol. And the quarians get whiped out in some people's playthroughs

Why wouldn't they have access to the resources to make fuel? And I simply used the Quarians as an example of how it can be done, I doubt there is no longer any tech for making fuel.

Which is great and all.  Buit the Quarians are probably the only race there with the resources to stay alive during teir trips home due to the fact that they had to live in space.  Everyone else who can't eat Earth food is pretty much doomed to have to live on what Earth might have left for them in ships that are not designed for long term space travel without the ability for a fast resupply.

As I said, taking out the mass relays would be like society today if all of a suddent we have to revert back to using horse and buggy, with most of the world's population centered in one area.  Sure the world would still go on, but it's certainly not going to be nice.

By your logic, no aliens have ever visited earth because:

(A) Other species can't bring their food along for some reason
( Earth didn't stockpile alien food because they thought aliens won't do the economic any good

Both of these assumptions are fail.

Now you're gonna bring the reapers into this.

And I'm gonna tell you Anderson stayed alive this whole time and never mentioned once about ration problems so yea there are still food on earth.

I'm actually not going to being the Reapers into it at all.  Other than the Quarians (and the Geth who don't need food) you have Earth surround by warships from various different races.  Warships are not desinged to go on huge long trips without the ability to resupply somewhere, which is what the mass relay system allowed them do do.  Now you've cut that off.  Do you seriously think that things not designed for long distance space travel without the mass relays are going to do well travelling pretty slowly via what FTL they have back to their home planets?

As for A, I'm sure they did.  Btu with the mass relay system, they would not have needed to store months (possibly years) worth of it.  As for B, no I don't think that Earth stocpiled enough food to get all the races home, especially races that may not visit Sol very often just because since the mass relays would have allowed then to bring in food for them (especially those who could not eat anything grown on Earth).

[clonedoriginzero]

eddieoctane wrote...

Again, the energy released by the relays was substantial enough to overtake an FTL-speed Normandy (one of the fastest ships in universe). The energy was strong enough to cripple the ship. Any damage received by the Normandy would have been more intense closer to the detonating relay. If you inhabited the same system as a relay, you are out of luck.

I'm not saying that the relays detonated with the force of a supernova, but a significant amount of energy was released from the relays. There were thousands of ships in orbit over Earth when the relays went off. While no damage was shown being passed along to the fleets, it's foolish to assume that the Normandy was the only ship to suffer any ill effects of the pulse from the Crucible. The facts just don't bode well for earth.

im almost positive that it wasn't the signal wave that crippled the normandy.

watch the scene again. the normandy is in a mass effect corridor. theres a dark hole in the "shockwave" thats "chasing" them. that is the mass effect corridor collasping behind them. joker is frantically trying to finish the jump before they fallout of it causing damage to the ship.

why do i think that? because that "shockwave" is the same one that hits earth leaving everyone perfectly fine. it shows them falling into the "hole" which is actually normal space without the mass effect corridor. the damage they recieve is from extreme decelleration not being hit with a shockwave. if it was a shockwave the whole ship would be damaged, not isolated to the tail engines.

[Mahrac]

[quote]killnoob wrote...

[quote]Mahrac wrote...

[quote]

killnoob wrote...

I'm sorry, are the reapers conquering civilizations? or are they targetting fuels?

So do they like, scan the galaxy for fuel and go around destroying them all?

And if that's the case, how come there's still fuels in ME3?

Something doesn't add up......

Hurrr..

[/quote]


They are conquoring civilization, and one way to speed that up is to target industrial centers, communications, and, wait for it, supply posts including, wait for it, fuel depots. As I stated, there are fuel posts in systems the Reapers don't have full control over - like systems with homeworlds.

In summary, destroying fuel depots is a part of destroying civilization. [/quote]

That explains why people couldn't find a fuel depot to get back home.
Because Reaper has control over the entire galaxy except the ones that has fuel depot in ME3.
Because it took them only 1 century to conquer the protheans and that's when they were taken by surprise.
And because the entire ME3 has spanned over 1 century, and when we finally get back to earth, Shepard is 100 years old.

Roll eyes.

For cry out loud...
[/quote]

Actually, it does.
Explore the map, that's how it's set up
They also had control of the relay network, so they could take their time
No, but they are compleatly eradicating civilization, so it's the clean up that takes so long, not the occupation part[/quote]

Urgghhhhh....

There are fuel depots in the star system occpuied by reapers.
There are also broken wreckage you can salvage for fuels, and there are pretty much everywhere.
Sometimes I find 2 wreckage in 1 system.

God damn have you even played the game?
[/quote]

I mentioned the destroyed depots in the (long) text pyramid - page 6 or 7. And those depots don't have enough fuel for one frigate, much less a fleet.

Edit: extrenuous thread deleted

Modifié par Mahrac, 12 mars 2012 - 04:13 .

[Kloborgg711]

Rocktel wrote...

The Relay was destroyed in a different way in Arrival, they crashed an asteroid into it which made the core unstable. In the ending the core just shut down and the relay collapsed.

That's not how energy works. Though I certainly agree coming up with an explanation for the Relays is a lot easier than trying to justify Synthesis.

[majormajormmajor]

Rocktel wrote...
They're probably boned. But they aren't most of the galaxy.

Keep pretending that they're not. The homeworlds, for example Earth and Tuchanka, contain the majority of population for some species. Earth only has a population of 11 billion- that's overwhelmingly the bulk of humanity, since the biggest extrasolar colonies have only a few mio each- pre-Invasion because agriculture out-of-system sustains it at that levels. While the Reaper invasion has no doubt trimmed it down to more manageble levels, we have to factor in corresponding damage to agricultural capacity- and lack of labour to work it.

Massive depopulation, hurrah!

[Rocktel]

The Angry One wrote...

There is no difference between Geth and VIs.
GETH ARE VIs. Specifically, Geth are multple VIs networked together to the point that they achieve sentience.

That's an important difference. If you're going to say all the base comonents are also destroyed then did the destroy ending also purge the galaxy of silicon?

[Nefelius]

Rocktel wrote...

Nefelius wrote...
Arrival - we see a Relay falling apart and exploding. Given the evidence - when a Relay falls apart it causes the energy stored in it go loose. When the energy go loose - everything near the Relay dies. This has nothing to do with the asteroid. It was not the asteroid that destroyed the system. The asteroid was nothing but a "tool" to release the energy.
 Period.
ME3 - we a netwrok of relays fall apart and a massive shockwaves. Given the evidence (which is Arrival) every system having a relay in it dies.

Like I said energy can be loosed in many non destructive ways. Destroying a relay in a different way would mean the energy would be released in a different way.
Period.
Arrival proves Asteroid+Relay=Supernova and nothing else.

This is only your speculations, which have no evidence - thus no logic behind it.
All i said has the evidence and the logic behin it.

Relay fell apart in the Arrival? - yes.
Relays fell apart in ME3? - yes.
Released energy from a destroyed Relay kills the system? - yes.

Do we see another ways of loosing the enegry throughout the games? - no.
Are hey even mentioned? - no.

The only logical conclusion is the default one. Whic is based on Arrival DLC.

The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

[mad825]

....I was think about putting a saddle on the rachni, feeding and watering them is much more effective than mining high grade fuel.

[killnoob]

The Angry One wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Kandon Arc wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Kandon Arc wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Kandon Arc wrote...

Do we even know if that's possible? Not to mention that in the destroy ending, all ship board VI's will be toast, making the fleets rather useless. We just can't predict how the citadel will behave though. It could hang in orbit for centuries, or it could immiediatly come crashing down. I think falling to Earth is much more likely, and I think expecting the fleet to destroy it all is unlikely, but we don't have much evidence to go on.

I could point out that EDI is still alive and Shepard can be alive in the Destroy ending as evidence that it didn't destroy all organic. But instead I'll point out that VI's are not synthetic life.

And yes we don't know what the citadel will do, therefore it does not mean the earth is destroyed. It means it could be destroyed.

How are VIs not synthetic? They sure as hell ain't organic.

Guns are synthetic. Ships are synthetic. They're not alive.

Fine then what is the fundamental difference between the geth and VI that means one will be destroyed and one will survive.

No idea, ask the Catalyst.

There is no difference between Geth and VIs.
GETH ARE VIs. Specifically, Geth are multple VIs networked together to the point that they achieve sentience.

Well at least now we know who actually played the game here and who didn't.

[Rocktel]

majormajormmajor wrote...

Rocktel wrote...
They're probably boned. But they aren't most of the galaxy.

Keep pretending that they're not. The homeworlds, for example Earth and Tuchanka, contain the majority of population for some species. Earth only has a population of 11 billion- that's overwhelmingly the bulk of humanity, since the biggest extrasolar colonies have only a few mio each- pre-Invasion because agriculture out-of-system sustains it at that levels. While the Reaper invasion has no doubt trimmed it down to more manageble levels, we have to factor in corresponding damage to agricultural capacity- and lack of labour to work it.

Massive depopulation, hurrah!

Earth is fully capable of supporting 11 billion. It dosn't require dail imports. I don't think palaven does either.

Modifié par Rocktel, 12 mars 2012 - 04:14 .

[clonedoriginzero]

GreyhameBioware wrote...

killnoob wrote...

GreyhameBioware wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

They also need access to the resourses to make fuel (they dont have it), they still use fuel depots when they can, and they barely have the processing power for their fleet, much less the armada in Sol. And the quarians get whiped out in some people's playthroughs

Why wouldn't they have access to the resources to make fuel? And I simply used the Quarians as an example of how it can be done, I doubt there is no longer any tech for making fuel.

Which is great and all.  Buit the Quarians are probably the only race there with the resources to stay alive during teir trips home due to the fact that they had to live in space.  Everyone else who can't eat Earth food is pretty much doomed to have to live on what Earth might have left for them in ships that are not designed for long term space travel without the ability for a fast resupply.

As I said, taking out the mass relays would be like society today if all of a suddent we have to revert back to using horse and buggy, with most of the world's population centered in one area.  Sure the world would still go on, but it's certainly not going to be nice.

By your logic, no aliens have ever visited earth because:

(A) Other species can't bring their food along for some reason
( Earth didn't stockpile alien food because they thought aliens won't do the economic any good

Both of these assumptions are fail.

Now you're gonna bring the reapers into this.

And I'm gonna tell you Anderson stayed alive this whole time and never mentioned once about ration problems so yea there are still food on earth.

I'm actually not going to being the Reapers into it at all.  Other than the Quarians (and the Geth who don't need food) you have Earth surround by warships from various different races.  Warships are not desinged to go on huge long trips without the ability to resupply somewhere, which is what the mass relay system allowed them do do.  Now you've cut that off.  Do you seriously think that things not designed for long distance space travel without the mass relays are going to do well travelling pretty slowly via what FTL they have back to their home planets?

As for A, I'm sure they did.  Btu with the mass relay system, they would not have needed to store months (possibly years) worth of it.  As for B, no I don't think that Earth stocpiled enough food to get all the races home, especially races that may not visit Sol very often just because since the mass relays would have allowed then to bring in food for them (especially those who could not eat anything grown on Earth).

im pretty sure anyone designing a warship in space would foresee the possiblity of having engine failure, or being stranded in space, or any number of other possiblities and would have stores of supplys to at least last awhile.

i mean it'd be pretty dumb to go into SPACE without supplies incase your ship breaks lol

[The Angry One]

Youmu wrote...

It's silly to assume that the relays "blow up" the same way they did in Arrival.

You can knock down a skyscraper in a way that it will collapse on itself. It can also be made to crash down in a way that it knocks down the neighboring block.

In one instance, the relay is doing it's thing, and someone tosses a giant rock on it. The thing blows up catastrophically. In the other instance, the Relay Daddy calls them all and says "sup, time to close down shop".

Even if they in both instances released the equal, massive amounts of energy, maybe it simply is shot through the relay, and a much less harmless pulse is released.

Except the pulse spreading process requires the relays to build up as much energy as possible to send the pulse to the next relay. They are specifically creating a condition where their cores will melt down and explode.

I don't see why Reapers would devastate the entire galaxy just because their AI controlling method failed.

Yeah why would the genocidal murderers ever come up with a plan to kill everyone? 

Geth probably are much, much more than that after Legion uploads his stuff, tho.

They've always been. It's not as simple as my explanation but on a basic technological level, they are VIs.
Granted the Crucible isn't technology, but space magic.

[Mahrac]

Nefelius wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Nefelius wrote...
Arrival - we see a Relay falling apart and exploding. Given the evidence - when a Relay falls apart it causes the energy stored in it go loose. When the energy go loose - everything near the Relay dies. This has nothing to do with the asteroid. It was not the asteroid that destroyed the system. The asteroid was nothing but a "tool" to release the energy.
 Period.
ME3 - we a netwrok of relays fall apart and a massive shockwaves. Given the evidence (which is Arrival) every system having a relay in it dies.

Like I said energy can be loosed in many non destructive ways. Destroying a relay in a different way would mean the energy would be released in a different way.
Period.
Arrival proves Asteroid+Relay=Supernova and nothing else.

This is only your speculations, which have no evidence - thus no logic behind it.
All i said has the evidence and the logic behin it.

Relay fell apart in the Arrival? - yes.
Relays fell apart in ME3? - yes.
Released energy from a destroyed Relay kills the system? - yes.

Do we see another ways of loosing the enegry throughout the games? - no.
Are hey even mentioned? - no.

The only logical conclusion is the default one. Whic is based on Arrival DLC.

The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

Life lesson: In arguements women are always right. In debates, gender doesn't matter

[killnoob]

Nefelius wrote...

Rocktel wrote...

Nefelius wrote...
Arrival - we see a Relay falling apart and exploding. Given the evidence - when a Relay falls apart it causes the energy stored in it go loose. When the energy go loose - everything near the Relay dies. This has nothing to do with the asteroid. It was not the asteroid that destroyed the system. The asteroid was nothing but a "tool" to release the energy.
 Period.
ME3 - we a netwrok of relays fall apart and a massive shockwaves. Given the evidence (which is Arrival) every system having a relay in it dies.

Like I said energy can be loosed in many non destructive ways. Destroying a relay in a different way would mean the energy would be released in a different way.
Period.
Arrival proves Asteroid+Relay=Supernova and nothing else.

This is only your speculations, which have no evidence - thus no logic behind it.
All i said has the evidence and the logic behin it.

Relay fell apart in the Arrival? - yes.
Relays fell apart in ME3? - yes.
Released energy from a destroyed Relay kills the system? - yes.

Do we see another ways of loosing the enegry throughout the games? - no.
Are hey even mentioned? - no.

The only logical conclusion is the default one. Whic is based on Arrival DLC.

The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

Epic trolling is epic.

But I've spotted you now.

Your trolling spree ends today!

[815Sox]

clonedoriginzero wrote...

also, its suggested that the asari know how to build relays, so they could in theory begin rebuilding the relay network, obviously focusing on citadel space first

Correct. I do not understand why this isn't mentioned more. The Asari were hiding technology and that is now known. The Asari have a lot of explaining and thought to do. They are easily the most advanced and politcally progressive civiization (they are basically a working direct democratic eglatarian empire, something we are still trying to achieve)... yet they were hiding technology that could have had a huge impact on all people of the galaxy. We do know that they are now going to have to share that information.
 
I brought Liara and Javik on that mission... very intersting.

[AartB]

the claim that the explosions of the mass relays where different then the one we seen in arrival is bullcrap. nothing hinted towards this all the proof we have is seeing a mass relay destroy an entire system when it blew up. people who claim the mass relays didnt kill everything simply WANT to believe this. there is no canon for it.

[Nefelius]

AartB wrote...

the claim that the explosions of the mass relays where different then the one we seen in arrival is bullcrap. nothing hinted towards this all the proof we have is seeing a mass relay destroy an entire system when it blew up. people who claim the mass relays didnt kill everything simply WANT to believe this. there is no canon for it.

finally someone who can accept the facts and find the LOGIC behind them.

[The Angry One]

Nefelius wrote...
The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

Really? Really? Way to torpedo your own argument with such an idiotic statement.

[Kmead15]

The Angry One wrote...

Kmead15 wrote...
The Normandy ends up wrecked on a random planet with minor surface damage and the pilot with brittle bone disease entirely unharmed. That barely even counts as a crash.

Minor damage? It's wrecked.
As for Joker.. are you really going to use bad writing to defend this?

You're using Arrival, only seems fair.

And yeah, it's wrecked, but the doesn't look to be all that hurt. Heck, most of the damage we see could have easily occurred in the crash, not the blast that caused it.

[Rocktel]

Nefelius wrote...
This is only your speculations, which have no evidence - thus no logic behind it.
All i said has the evidence and the logic behin it.

Relay fell apart in the Arrival? - yes.
Relays fell apart in ME3? - yes.
Released energy from a destroyed Relay kills the system? - yes.

Do we see another ways of loosing the enegry throughout the games? - no.
Are hey even mentioned? - no.

The only logical conclusion is the default one. Whic is based on Arrival DLC.

The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

No it isn't speculation to say Arrival didn't prove that all possible ways for a relay to be destroyed means a supernova,

And guess what, we do see that the relays fall apart are noticably different. In fact we see that the relay seems devoid of energy when it falls apart.

[betd2]

my 2 cents.
Assuming the relays didn't wipe out all life by exploding, the worlds would be okay except.
The krogan homeworld has little to no plant life left so the probably got all their food shipped through the relay. whoops dead Krogan. and I'm sure all those worlds devastated by the reapers still have all their food and weren't in need of relief supplies delivered through a mass relay. so scratch Thessa and Palaven (and Earth BTW). So yeah ME3's real ending. "and they all died starving and sick, laying in the ashes of their homes." Tell the kid about that part Buzz.

[JeffZero]

Yeah, okay, sure, because a bunch of happy soldiers logically precludes a star system's annihilation in Western cinematic convention.

Constructivist Montage flicks have got some people in a weird mental state.

[GreyhameBioware]

clonedoriginzero wrote...
im pretty sure anyone designing a warship in space would foresee the possiblity of having engine failure, or being stranded in space, or any number of other possiblities and would have stores of supplys to at least last awhile.

i mean it'd be pretty dumb to go into SPACE without supplies incase your ship breaks lol

Yes, and you will have supplies to last some of that time, possibly a few weeks or a month depending on how long the ship was designed to go without needing to go back for resupplies.  Not the amount of time it's going to take most to get back home for most of the races.

[Youmu]

If the relays blew up like a supernova, instead of just being harmless pixie dust (that it is), the synthesis ending makes no sense. Why would Joker's eyes be green, the plants have circuitry and stuff? Obviously they were touched by the blast given off from the relays, yet they are okay.

[Nefelius]

Rocktel wrote...

Nefelius wrote...
This is only your speculations, which have no evidence - thus no logic behind it.
All i said has the evidence and the logic behin it.

Relay fell apart in the Arrival? - yes.
Relays fell apart in ME3? - yes.
Released energy from a destroyed Relay kills the system? - yes.

Do we see another ways of loosing the enegry throughout the games? - no.
Are hey even mentioned? - no.

The only logical conclusion is the default one. Whic is based on Arrival DLC.

The only reason why don't you understan it is if are you opposing the facts just to oppose them, or you are a woman, thus you can't think logically.

No it isn't speculation to say Arrival didn't prove that all possible ways for a relay to be destroyed means a supernova,

And guess what, we do see that the relays fall apart are noticably different. In fact we see that the relay seems devoid of energy when it falls apart.

That's not quite what i've meant.
Speculation is assuming there are some other mystical ways. We simply lack the facts that indicate that.