1634 réponses à ce sujet

[viggorrah]

makenzieshepard wrote...

I love this. So much.

[CDRSkyShepard]

yoshibb wrote...

Thanks so much for taking the time to do this SkyShepard. We were really in need of a unified thread like this.

Anytime. 

[Avarenda]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

Avarenda wrote...

On a side note, who is MiracleofSound and why is it amazing that he/she is siding with those of us that disliked the endings?

Miracle of Sound is a one-man-band that does songs about all the geeky stuff we love. He is associated with The Escapist and even debuted his song Take it Back for ME3's launch day, and did an interview-type thing with BioWare for it.

You might have heard Commander Shepard, which is one of his works.

Alright, thanks for the info. I'll prolly go check out his stuff now. =)

[Fallen Insanity]

Just wanted to share these two links. And if they have been shared here, then i guess i missed them.
http://www.gamefaqs....fect-3/62230265
http://www.me3finalhours.com
Hope this helps.

Modifié par Fallen Insanity, 13 mars 2012 - 10:50 .

[tornblade]

d(^-^)b

Good read, and definitely describes my feelings on the subject.

[mopotter]

Great job. It has so many good stories and moments, but until the fix the problems with the endings, I can't bring myself to play it again.

[Shelpa]

Excellent post, summarizes well what the community is attempting to achieve ! Keep it going !

[Sett101]

Not sure BiowarEA is doing themselves a lot of favors not saying something now. Do they think the internet stops at the US border? With the price of the game dropping in the US already how long can they wait before someone sees they can cancel preorder reorder from Amazon and save money? As a bonus you get time to see if it will even be worth it at a lower price. As it stands now it's worth nothing but heartbreak and WTFs.

[thepringle]

 Brilliantly written and certainly showcases the way I feel. I'm glad that so many people feel the same way we do.

[Moirai]

Something that has just crossed my mind (not sure why it didn't earlier) is the issue with the relays being destroyed.

Given that it was established in the Arrival DLC that the destruction of a relay destroys everything in its local system, shouldn't that mean that any option that Shepard chooses results in the deaths of everyone within range of all those relays...?

I suppose it could be some kind of 'controlled' self destruct, true. But it's just another unknown unexplained issue with the ending that leaves me a bit confused as to why Shepard would have accepted any of the options, knowing first hand what can happen when a relay is destroyed...

Shepard should have questioned that point, in my mind. Otherwise, the result could have been death to all in the Sol system except the strangely fleeing Joker...

[I Tsunayoshi I]

Moirai wrote...

Something that has just crossed my mind (not sure why it didn't earlier) is the issue with the relays being destroyed.

Given that it was established in the Arrival DLC that the destruction of a relay destroys everything in its local system, shouldn't that mean that any option that Shepard chooses results in the deaths of everyone within range of all those relays...?

I suppose it could be some kind of 'controlled' self destruct, true. But it's just another unknown unexplained issue with the ending that leaves me a bit confused as to why Shepard would have accepted any of the options, knowing first hand what can happen when a relay is destroyed...

Shepard should have questioned that point, in my mind. Otherwise, the result could have been death to all in the Sol system except the strangely fleeing Joker...

The relays were effectively tearing themselves a part to make sure the Crucible beam was transmitted across the galaxy. They were not being bombarded/bombed with asteroids with unknown levels of explosives littered over them/inside them as the Alpha Relay had been.

CVG and Forbes are making the point the way it should be made. All of the anger and rage that I have seen being leveled towards the lack of effect of choice in the ending is hidiously misguided, being as choice has never had an effect in both the ME endings for 1 and 2, and the Dragon Age series itself also kept player choice from having an effect on how the end comes about. I have already commented on what CDR has said about the endings, mostly in pointing out that Control and Destroy endings are not so much choices to begin with but forgone conclusions based on how you guide your version of Commander Shepard through the series.

My issue in how the ending came about is how they made the forced results of the end of the Shepard/Reaper arc of the story, if in the off chance that we do see more Mass Effect games with new characters taking the spotlight in the future, is that instead of how we were guided into them through story events and engrossing gameplay, we were quite literally guided by a force in the Guardian to do something that it was too weak minded to do on its own.. When players lead the charge to stop Saren, it always felt like we had an effect on how the ending came about, even if we as players did nothing to change the over all end to ME1. The same could be said for ME2 as it felt like that we did have an effect on the end, even though once everything was said and done the player still arrived at the same generic end. With Mass Effect 3, I cant say that it felt like I had an effect on the ending or did anything to make it feel like I had done something to aid in making the ending come to pass in any of its forms.

If anyone still feels like they have the urge or need to vent their rage about the endings, they should do so over the fact that the devs decided to throw it in our face this time around that we did nothing and could do nothing to bring about a satisfying ending that would give closure to Commander Shepard's story. Not at the fact that the player never had a choice in how the story would end.

[nytraven]

bump since this isn't on first page right now.

[Zirobo]

"Hold the line." said Zirobo

[Moirai]

Sora Kitano wrote...

Moirai wrote...

Something that has just crossed my mind (not sure why it didn't earlier) is the issue with the relays being destroyed.

Given that it was established in the Arrival DLC that the destruction of a relay destroys everything in its local system, shouldn't that mean that any option that Shepard chooses results in the deaths of everyone within range of all those relays...?

I suppose it could be some kind of 'controlled' self destruct, true. But it's just another unknown unexplained issue with the ending that leaves me a bit confused as to why Shepard would have accepted any of the options, knowing first hand what can happen when a relay is destroyed...

Shepard should have questioned that point, in my mind. Otherwise, the result could have been death to all in the Sol system except the strangely fleeing Joker...

The relays were effectively tearing themselves a part to make sure the Crucible beam was transmitted across the galaxy. They were not being bombarded/bombed with asteroids with unknown levels of explosives littered over them/inside them as the Alpha Relay had been.

CVG and Forbes are making the point the way it should be made. All of the anger and rage that I have seen being leveled towards the lack of effect of choice in the ending is hidiously misguided, being as choice has never had an effect in both the ME endings for 1 and 2, and the Dragon Age series itself also kept player choice from having an effect on how the end comes about. I have already commented on what CDR has said about the endings, mostly in pointing out that Control and Destroy endings are not so much choices to begin with but forgone conclusions based on how you guide your version of Commander Shepard through the series.

My issue in how the ending came about is how they made the forced results of the end of the Shepard/Reaper arc of the story, if in the off chance that we do see more Mass Effect games with new characters taking the spotlight in the future, is that instead of how we were guided into them through story events and engrossing gameplay, we were quite literally guided by a force in the Guardian to do something that it was too weak minded to do on its own.. When players lead the charge to stop Saren, it always felt like we had an effect on how the ending came about, even if we as players did nothing to change the over all end to ME1. The same could be said for ME2 as it felt like that we did have an effect on the end, even though once everything was said and done the player still arrived at the same generic end. With Mass Effect 3, I cant say that it felt like I had an effect on the ending or did anything to make it feel like I had done something to aid in making the ending come to pass in any of its forms.

If anyone still feels like they have the urge or need to vent their rage about the endings, they should do so over the fact that the devs decided to throw it in our face this time around that we did nothing and could do nothing to bring about a satisfying ending that would give closure to Commander Shepard's story. Not at the fact that the player never had a choice in how the story would end.

?

I'm confused. Are you assuming I'm 'raging' on this point? I'm certainly not, I assure you.

It was simply pointing out what I felt was a rather glaring plothole, especially given what was shown in Arrival. Assuming that the destruction of the relays was very localised explosion is just that at present, assumption, since we don't know enough about them.

Anyway, we should not be getting into any heated discussions with each other here. A united front is what we need.

[EvelinShepard]

Let's get this back on the front page

[bleetman]

I'd generally assumed that the Alpha relay destroyed everything in the system because crashing an asteroid into it caused it to fracture and discharge whatever reserves of energy/FTL juice/space mana it had to function with. The relays destroyed by the crucible's signal expended everything they had just to pass it along to the next relay.

That said, I've no idea why Shepard wouldn't ask about that, or why they'd decide to have the relays blow up in the first place, other than out of a desire to destroy the setting they'd painstakingly created. I don't expect 'does this make sense?' was part of the equation.

Modifié par bleetman, 14 mars 2012 - 12:15 .

[CDRSkyShepard]

Spread the word on this thread, guys! Let it make multiple rounds on facebook, twitter, other places here on the BSN, etc. Whatever you can do, do it!

[CDRSkyShepard]

bleetman wrote...

I'd generally assumed that the Alpha relay destroyed everything in the system because crashing an asteroid into it caused it to fracture and discharge whatever reserves of energy/FTL juice/space mana it had to function with. The relays destroyed by the crucible's signal expended everything they had just to pass it along to the next relay.

That said, I've no idea why Shepard wouldn't ask about that, or why they'd decide to have the relays blow up in the first place, other than out of a desire to destroy the setting they'd painstakingly created. I don't expect 'does this make sense?' was part of the equation.

I'm inclined to agree with you. Though, the universe was going to have to become independent of the relays somehow...build their own, or something. I'm not sure this was the way to do it, though.

[I Tsunayoshi I]

Moirai wrote...
?

I'm confused. Are you assuming I'm 'raging' on this point? I'm certainly not, I assure you.

It was simply pointing out what I felt was a rather glaring plothole, especially given what was shown in Arrival. Assuming that the destruction of the relays was very localised explosion is just that at present, assumption, since we don't know enough about them.

Anyway, we should not be getting into any heated discussions with each other here. A united front is what we need.

Only the first portion of that post was directed to you as you were the one to bring up the Relays not going nuclear. I have seen a discussion on that subject before and also well thought out reasoning for why the Crucible'd relays did not do the same. Like I pointed out in that part of the post that was directed to you, the relays looked like they were tearing themselves apart, leading to their destruction through overwhelming kinetic forces and possible technical overloads causing the localized explosions. The Alpha Relay was destroyed due to being struck by an asteroid used like a planitoid scale mass driver round. It is possible that there was something inside of the asteroid, due to Object Rho being rooted to the asteroid, leading me to believe that it may have been a power source of unknown means keeping Object Rho functional that added to the overall destructive force that was used to destroy the Alpha Relay and the surrounding star system.

The rest was a more generally aimed statement towards those that have been venting rage indiscriminantly over the endings and pointing out the real reason to be wrong instead of the more commonly appearing reason that people have been raging over. I have had to fend off people on other sites that have been using the more common reason to rage due to their use of the common excuse to be angry and being blind to something that has been a common Bioware trend for a long time now in their two triple A series.

[Moirai]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

bleetman wrote...

I'd generally assumed that the Alpha relay destroyed everything in the system because crashing an asteroid into it caused it to fracture and discharge whatever reserves of energy/FTL juice/space mana it had to function with. The relays destroyed by the crucible's signal expended everything they had just to pass it along to the next relay.

That said, I've no idea why Shepard wouldn't ask about that, or why they'd decide to have the relays blow up in the first place, other than out of a desire to destroy the setting they'd painstakingly created. I don't expect 'does this make sense?' was part of the equation.

I'm inclined to agree with you. Though, the universe was going to have to become independent of the relays somehow...build their own, or something. I'm not sure this was the way to do it, though.

Even if the races that are left can build their own relays, how would they coordinate the effort to build a compatible system and line things up with other systems? Unless I've overlooked something and there is a separate extreme range comms system independant of the relays that allows for our continued connection with all the other star systems...

Hmm, anyway, I guess that's a possible future ME scenario. Although it doesn't change the fact that there are thousands of individuals of different races all now trapped in the Sol system with little means to support them all. I imagine that once everyone has got over beating the Reapers and then realised they're stuck there, some survival based in-fighting will start to flare up.

[bleetman]

Myeah. Destroying the relays also has the wonderful side effect of utterly invalidating whole swathes of what you otherwise accomplish in the rest of the game. Assuming the Turians and Quarians don't all starve to death, they'll never see their homeworlds again. Wrex isn't getting back to Tuchanka. Couple that with the possible destruction of the Geth, and, well. Yeah.

I probably shouldn't think about the possibility of every character that was on the citadel being dead, too.

Modifié par bleetman, 14 mars 2012 - 12:36 .

[Scipio000]

This is the ending i think we all wanted, and one which I would play all the ME games over and over for. Very thought provoking without changing much at all:

http://arkis.deviant...ILERS-289902125

Modifié par Scipio000, 14 mars 2012 - 12:30 .

[Moirai]

Sora Kitano wrote...

Moirai wrote...
?

I'm confused. Are you assuming I'm 'raging' on this point? I'm certainly not, I assure you.

It was simply pointing out what I felt was a rather glaring plothole, especially given what was shown in Arrival. Assuming that the destruction of the relays was very localised explosion is just that at present, assumption, since we don't know enough about them.

Anyway, we should not be getting into any heated discussions with each other here. A united front is what we need.

Only the first portion of that post was directed to you as you were the one to bring up the Relays not going nuclear. I have seen a discussion on that subject before and also well thought out reasoning for why the Crucible'd relays did not do the same. Like I pointed out in that part of the post that was directed to you, the relays looked like they were tearing themselves apart, leading to their destruction through overwhelming kinetic forces and possible technical overloads causing the localized explosions. The Alpha Relay was destroyed due to being struck by an asteroid used like a planitoid scale mass driver round. It is possible that there was something inside of the asteroid, due to Object Rho being rooted to the asteroid, leading me to believe that it may have been a power source of unknown means keeping Object Rho functional that added to the overall destructive force that was used to destroy the Alpha Relay and the surrounding star system.

The rest was a more generally aimed statement towards those that have been venting rage indiscriminantly over the endings and pointing out the real reason to be wrong instead of the more commonly appearing reason that people have been raging over. I have had to fend off people on other sites that have been using the more common reason to rage due to their use of the common excuse to be angry and being blind to something that has been a common Bioware trend for a long time now in their two triple A series.

Fair enough. I haven't seen those posts personally, so you'll have to excuse my ignorance of them.

That said, I was still surprised that Shepard never questioned that issue, given his/her own experiences. But there we go.

[CDRSkyShepard]

@bleetman and Moirai - Yeah, hence why I've said that the way it was done in the game wasn't the way it should have been done. I do back up Aethyta, though...they needed to find a way to make their own, to become independent of Reaper technology.