1634 réponses à ce sujet

[FRANCESCO84Inn]

ya i like this, can yuo give me the Female Shepard banner and put the Italian Fleet ?

[Beba]

maybe you've already seen this:
http://social.biowar...ndex/10534386/1

[MadMatt910]

http://social.biowar.../index/10054944

http://social.biowar...5/index/9831144

Was talking with a few people in other threads, could the fact dark energy plot was dropped and tht me3 ending (specifically starkid) invalidates plots of me1 an 2.

the links are basically a list on information about dark energy in the game and a list of major and minor plot holes

[Nauks]

This is a good incentive OP, but it just seems so biased to outright changing the ending.
What if it actually is as the game itself hints at? that the ending isn't to be taken literally, and there was always planned to be an extended real ending incoming: In a nutshell.

There is so much already in the game, that hints to an indoc theory type extention to the ending.
Why are there nothing about that in the OP? do you simply not agree with those ideas or wanted to make a speciffic thread about just how the current fake ending could be re-written?

It would do the thread a great disservice not to at least include the idea of it.

For one thing, the grievances aren't a problem anymore:
*The god-child was Harbinger trying to trick Shep.
*The retarded Organics vs Synthetics reason for reaping was a lie told by Harbinger, and the real reason is yet to come.
*Shep awake on earth doesn't need to be explained, since he/she never left.
*The Citadel or Relays never blow up (this is ofcourse subject to change in the actual continuation of the ending)
*etc.

Modifié par Nauks, 24 mars 2012 - 01:39 .

[LilyasAvalon]

Madecologist wrote...

Who is Miracle of Sound?

Miracle of Sound is a youtuber who makes songs based off games, he's the guy who wrote the Commander Shepard song.

[Wildhide]

LilyasAvalon wrote...

Madecologist wrote...

Who is Miracle of Sound?

Miracle of Sound is a youtuber who makes songs based off games, he's the guy who wrote the Commander Shepard song.

He's pretty good at what he does, I follow him to hear whatever songs he comes out with, though admittedly half of them are for games I haven't played, so they don't appeal to me as much.

[Chronor]

Those of you who are proponents of the indoc theory, may I ask to lay off on perpetuating that theory all over the place? I only ask because there are too many assumptions and circumstantial evidence involved in that theory, that it almost lacks substance.

I think most of us want different endings as promised, not just some simple exposition of the current ending (singular). Either way we have to wait till April for anything definitive, and I for one do not think we should be hanging our hopes on such a theory. Any ending should be clear on it's own right, and none of us should have to speculate this hard to make sense of it.

[Kyuso]

Thanks for this excellent resource. I've been sharing it with lots of friends as a go-to place for comprehensive information.

[Sanrei]

I'm fine with people supporting the indoctrination theory but to tell everyone that certain problems are no longer an issue, as if the indoctrination theory was already word of god at Bioware, is counter-productive.

I feel they've made it pretty obvious that they never intended the ending to be taken any other way.
If they want to save their asses by expanding on the indoctrination theory then so be it. It's better than just "answering questions and providing closure."

Modifié par PedEgg, 24 mars 2012 - 07:31 .

[CDRSkyShepard]

Hey everyone! I want to first thank you all for the kind words, it really makes all this effort worth the while!

I've added Danish, Indian, Italian, and Welsh Fleet banners to the OP, as well as the link to all the banners from Bachuck's old thread. I think that should cover all the bases banner-wise.

I'll be hard at work updating the grievances section today. So many more things have been brought to my attention, it's scary. You should see the pages of notes I have...yikes. That list shouldn't be as long as it is in the first place, and now it's only going to get longer. All the more reason for BioWare to take note and try to rectify as much as they can.

I will be responding to a couple of you individually here in a minute, but I need to get myself fed first. Lol.

[Sanrei]

I found another article, which brings up something that had me bothered: The destruction(or lack thereof) of the collector base, and how it doesn't seem to matter.

I blew that thing up, with the human reaper in it, so how does TIM have it in his base?? I would have figured a decision that important would have really made a difference.

Anyway, here it is: games.on.net/article/15190/RPG_on_Rails_Mass_Effect_3_and_the_Illusion_of_Choice

[numark]

Want to bump this back up to the top. Really everything I could possibly say has been covered, so just want to reiterate a few points:

- There is no closure, to any of your shipmates or to the fleet.
- Lack of choice, the options given to Shepard are things he/she would never agree to

peace

[Spectre_Shepard]

"And what are we holding onto, Sam?

That there's some good in this world, Mr. Frodo. And it's worth fighting for."

Damn straight, Sam. Damn straight.

[ilComico]

thanks again for the italian signature!

[CDRSkyShepard]

Baronesa wrote...

OP?

Could you also point out a few articles by gaming sites... PRAISING the fact that fans pointed out mistakes on Mass Effect Deception and were VERY happy about the decision of Bioware and Del Rey to change the book?

Kotaku on Mass Effect Deception

Thank you, and great dedication here

I've been thinking about how the successful fan campaign against Deception can be used to help our cause, showing that not only are fan campaings not useless wastes of time, but that BioWare can admit its mistakes. It also shows that  However, there are some fundamental differences.

Deception was written completely independent of the rest of the ME writing team, and even BioWare. Then, we never called BioWare's artistic integrity into question because it wasn't theirs, it was the writer's, we were questioning. The only thing we really ever called BioWare on was on matters of quality assurance. While I would also love to tie the apparent lack of quality assurance with the endings issue with the blatant lapse in quality control with Deception, I'm afraid I have no definitive proof to do so.

As for the media reactions to the successful fan campaign, that's also a bit of a different ball of wax. During the fan campaign against Deception, the media was, at first, amused more than annoyed. Once they realized that these novels were considered canon and were obviously not written up to par with the rest of ME lore, they took us more seriously and the vast majority of outlets were on our side. Of course they would hail BioWare's decision to apologize for Deception.

The fan reaction also wasn't nearly as polarized regarding Deception. I think it's the one time I've seen the vast majority of the BSN united against something. There really were no "Why the Deception hate?" threads. EVERYONE pretty much agreed that the book was crap and needed to be denounced. While I think that the proof Deception was crap was about as concrete as the proof the ending is crap, we weren't directly calling BioWare's artistic vision into question with Deception. I think because we're doing that with this, just because of the nature of the argument, people feel a lot more inclined to defend BioWare and the game itself. I really can't blame them for that.

In other words, I'd like to integrate that in, but I'm not sure how. I wonder if it would be better to start another thread for a topic like that.

Nauks wrote...

[color=rgb(170, 170, 170)">This is a good incentive OP, but it just seems so biased to outright ]changing[/color] the ending.
[color=rgb(170, 170, 170)">What if it actually is as the game itself hints at? that the ending isn't to be taken literally, and there was always planned to be an extended ]real [/color]ending incoming: In a nutshell.

There is so much already in the game, that hints to an indoc theory type extention to the ending.
[color=rgb(170, 170, 170)">Why are there nothing about that in the OP? ] fake[/color] ending could be re-written?

It would do the thread a great disservice not to at least include the idea of it.

For one thing, the grievances aren't a problem anymore:
*The god-child was Harbinger trying to trick Shep.
*The retarded Organics vs Synthetics reason for reaping was a lie told by Harbinger, and the real reason is yet to come.
*Shep awake on earth doesn't need to be explained, since he/she never left.
*The Citadel or Relays never blow up (this is ofcourse subject to change in the actual continuation of the ending)
*etc. 

This is all assuming that Indoctrination Theory is true.

This thread doesn't exist to argue for or against Indoctrination Theory. Sure, since it's endings-relevant, discussion on it is welcome, but I'm not going to put a section in the OP that says, "Oh! Indoctrination Theory, this is what it is and this is why it makes sense." No, that's not the purpose of this thread. The purpose of this thread is discussion about the endings, and the OP is designed to consolidate all of our arguments against why the endings don't work as they stand now and to present all our combined resources (media, blogs, fan reactions, videos, etc) in one place.

The OP isn't biased at all, which is why I'm not pushing/negating anything regarding Indoctrination Theory. I'm also not putting anything PR-related in the OP, either. It's there for pure information purposes only, not for theorizing or speculation. I do, however, encourage any discussion relating to the endings in the OP, so long as it stays civil.

Edit: That said, I probably will link to one of the blogs describing Indoctrination Theory for reference purposes, but I won't push it as a main argument. I'm not convinced it was in BioWare's "master plan," or that BioWare ever had a "master plan." I think it's a lot more likely there's a bunch of coincidences and that the writing is just that messed up.

Modifié par CDRSkyShepard, 24 mars 2012 - 09:33 .

[CV77]

Ok, finished the game, got disappointed, read the forums.

I'd say the iTheory is interesting, certainly more than the official endings, although there's a key element missing - the motive. Why would Harbinger try to indoctrinate Shepard? He hit him with his laser, then saw Shepard survived and decided to indoctrinate him because....?

For fun? Cat and mouse game? To kill time until his minions mop up the joint fleets? Seems a bit of a stretch. What I think is the endings were so messed up that any attempt to imbue them with some meaning is doomed.

And small correction - the very first comment by CDRSkyShepard says that Normandy "is caught in transit between two relays". This can't be true because a) the travel between relays is instantaneous, Joker would have to travel all the way to Pluto to Charon relay. Normandy must have been in FTL mode, Joker probably saw the big explosion coming at him and made a jump.

Modifié par CV77, 24 mars 2012 - 11:15 .

[Spectre-00N7]

I agree with the op

CDRSkyShepard wrote...
Is there food for Tali and Garrus on Gilligan's Planet?

This does not belong in the plothole section, as it is just a question and not a contradiction of set logic.

[CDRSkyShepard]

CV77 wrote...

Ok, finished the game, got disappointed, read the forums.

I'd say the iTheory is interesting, certainly more than the official endings, although there's a key element missing - the motive. Why would Harbinger try to indoctrinate Shepard? He hit him with his laser, then saw Shepard survived and decided to indoctrinate him because....?

For fun? Cat and mouse game? To kill time until his minions mop up the joint fleets? Seems a bit of a stretch. What I think is the endings were so messed up that any attempt to imbue them with some meaning is doomed.

And small correction - the very first comment by CDRSkyShepard says that Normandy "is caught in transit between two relays". This can't be true because a) the travel between relays is instantaneous, Joker would have to travel all the way to Pluto to Charon relay. Normandy must have been in FTL mode, Joker probably saw the big explosion coming at him and made a jump.

We don't know WHAT it was Joker was doing. Thus why the whole thing makes no sense. If he was in FTL trying to outrun some explosion, that would mean that this same explosion was very dangerous and would've wiped out EVERY ship and EVERY fleet in orbit of Earth, and perhaps everyone ON Earth as well. It makes sense to say it was a relay corridor because the relays were being destroyed. However, yes, relay travel is instantaneous, so why they'd do this, it contradicts established lore.

[CDRSkyShepard]

Spectre-00N7 wrote...

I agree with the op

CDRSkyShepard wrote...
Is there food for Tali and Garrus on Gilligan's Planet?

This does not belong in the plothole section, as it is just a question and not a contradiction of set logic.

It's a plot hole because it's inconsistent with established lore...how can the writers expect Tali and Garrus to survive with the same food as the others?

[dr00w]

This site could be worth mentioning in the war assets. Seems like lots of fans contributed to this to support RetakeME3.

http://lugoentertain....com/me3ending/

Note: I did not make this site.

[CDRSkyShepard]

Ha, that's awesome! I like it.

[Madecologist]

CDRSkyShepard wrote...

We don't know WHAT it was Joker was doing. Thus why the whole thing makes no sense. If he was in FTL trying to outrun some explosion, that would mean that this same explosion was very dangerous and would've wiped out EVERY ship and EVERY fleet in orbit of Earth, and perhaps everyone ON Earth as well. It makes sense to say it was a relay corridor because the relays were being destroyed. However, yes, relay travel is instantaneous, so why they'd do this, it contradicts established lore.

That paragraph alone constitutes 6 shots minimum if not more for contridictions found  True it is an if/or speculation, but both are considered in that analysis.

Bottoms up!

[Flextt]

Since the Mass Effect wikia guys were able to get a definite answer from Bioware regarding Deception and its plotholes, it might be ingenious for the Retake movement to win them over for the ME 3 issues as well.

[Sanrei]

Hold the line!

[nitefyre410]

Bump this because it needs to be on the front page...