779 réponses à ce sujet

[Furluge]

HKR148 wrote...

kind of want prime-rib... damn those things are expansive though.

Hate to break it to you but IHOP isn't gonna give you prime rib with your steak and eggs. ;p
(The US thing was due to it being 6AM in the morning on the east coast right now.)

[jerms510]

ticklefist wrote...

Let me preface by saying I don't find any of these endings satisfying. Still, they are what they are and they're not going away. Every single ending has its own positives and negatives.

Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time. It is both the most virtuous and most selfless. You save everybody at the cost of your own life but you destroy the mass relays in the process.

Blue is the middle road. You develop a peace of sorts. You save the Citadel and mass relays (watch the vids) but you're no better than TIM. You do not die, but you do not carry on living. While seemingly good, not entirely selfless.

Red is the seemingly right choice. Using Anderson as the avatar of this choice is a deception. It's actually the worst and most selfish. You only end the current cycle. You kill all synthetic life including allies and friends. You destroy the mass relays. You live.

holy crap, someone gets it!

[Ieldra]

Icinix wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

Why exactly should I listen to the reaper kid?

He clearly states the destroy option to be the bad/evil one. The one were the Reaper get killed. The other two, where the Reapers live are the good ones in his "explanation". He is trying to fool Shep in my opinion.

If the creator of the Reapers tells me A, I will always do B, you can believe that.

Pretty much.

Reaper child wanted me to do anything but destroy - I went straight to destroy. Consequences be damned.

In other words: you didn't think about it.

[Tony208]

ticklefist wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

ticklefist wrote...
Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time. It is both the most virtuous and most selfless. You save everybody at the cost of your own life but you destroy the mass relays in the process.

It does not end the cycle.
The only proof we have that it ends the cycle is because the Catalyst says so, however the Catalyst is a moron.

It's pretty clear BioWare wanted this stuff open to interpretation and on that level it's working. While i see green as the most purely altruistic option, another poster mentioned that it changes everyone without their consent. Totally valid way of looking at it. Doesn't change my mind.

That's complete bs, Synthesis is like changing everyone's skin color to white but telling them you still have the same personality so it's ok. Hitler would choose this option in a heartbeat and he'd have his perfect race.

Not to mention the whole thing was cooked up by the idiot starchild who's killed trillions so far, it's pure evil.

Synthethics will fight other synthethics, not just organics. (Geth and EDI vs. Reapers)

As long as something is different from you even in the smallest possible way, there is the possibility that you'll come to blows.

It's not limited to some organic vs synthetic crap we're led to believe by the stupid ai god child.

[Furluge]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Don't ask about the science. It makes no sense at all. I just substitute the original line from the leaked script I quoted above. More vague about what exactly is done, but at least you can use your imagination to let it make some sense.

Yes please don't ask about the science. Or I'll have to dig up the bookmark about a page a phyisict maintains to try to get science fiction writers to put plausible science in their books. And just allowing for FTL travel period changes the fundamental nature of the universe so much it will make you cross-eyed trying to find BS to explain it away.

Modifié par Furluge, 13 mars 2012 - 10:29 .

[Ieldra]

jerms510 wrote...

ticklefist wrote...

Let me preface by saying I don't find any of these endings satisfying. Still, they are what they are and they're not going away. Every single ending has its own positives and negatives.

Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time. It is both the most virtuous and most selfless. You save everybody at the cost of your own life but you destroy the mass relays in the process.

Blue is the middle road. You develop a peace of sorts. You save the Citadel and mass relays (watch the vids) but you're no better than TIM. You do not die, but you do not carry on living. While seemingly good, not entirely selfless.

Red is the seemingly right choice. Using Anderson as the avatar of this choice is a deception. It's actually the worst and most selfish. You only end the current cycle. You kill all synthetic life including allies and friends. You destroy the mass relays. You live.

holy crap, someone gets it!

Indeed. How could I have overlooked this excellent summary.

[TobiTobsen]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Icinix wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

Why exactly should I listen to the reaper kid?

He clearly states the destroy option to be the bad/evil one. The one were the Reaper get killed. The other two, where the Reapers live are the good ones in his "explanation". He is trying to fool Shep in my opinion.

If the creator of the Reapers tells me A, I will always do B, you can believe that.

Pretty much.

Reaper child wanted me to do anything but destroy - I went straight to destroy. Consequences be damned.

In other words: you didn't think about it.

I thought about it.
And came to the conclusion that listening to a Reaper wasn't exactly healthy for anbody since they were created.

Modifié par TobiTobsen, 13 mars 2012 - 10:29 .

[John Locke N7]

DieHigh2012 wrote...

John Locke N7 wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote...

Biotic do not acount for Newton's three laws. I don't think you know what Newton's law is.

I'm not trying to put you down, but please look that up and explain your possition to me.

its explains exactly where that force and matter is coming from.... instead of it just coming out of nowhere. its a manipulation of darkmatter

Magic itself is an out side force, and it explains where it comes from be it mana or some other fantastic reason. The dark matter explination is no different...

theres no mana in non video game fantasy (that i know of )

Modifié par John Locke N7, 13 mars 2012 - 10:29 .

[DieHigh2012]

Tony208 wrote...

ticklefist wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

ticklefist wrote...
Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time. It is both the most virtuous and most selfless. You save everybody at the cost of your own life but you destroy the mass relays in the process.

It does not end the cycle.
The only proof we have that it ends the cycle is because the Catalyst says so, however the Catalyst is a moron.

It's pretty clear BioWare wanted this stuff open to interpretation and on that level it's working. While i see green as the most purely altruistic option, another poster mentioned that it changes everyone without their consent. Totally valid way of looking at it. Doesn't change my mind.

That's complete bs, Synthesis is like changing everyone's skin color to white but telling them you still have the same personality so it's ok. Hitler would choose this option in a heartbeat and he'd have his perfect race.

Not to mention the whole thing was cooked up by the idiot starchild who's killed trillions so far, it's pure evil.

Synthethics will fight other synthethics, not just organics. (Geth and EDI vs. Reapers)

As long as something is different from you even in the smallest possible way, there is the possibility that you'll come to blows.

It's not limited to some organic vs synthetic crap we're led to believe by the stupid ai god child.

Fairly certain Hitler whould choose control. Come on now, think about it.

[goofyomnivore]

Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time.

How does Synthesis end the cycle?

[jerms510]

TobiTobsen wrote...


If the creator of the Reapers tells me A, I will always do B, you can believe that.

Enjoy your ad hominem? offhand dismissal on account of the source is irresponsible.

[The Angry One]

Furluge wrote...
Actually I'm pretty sure half the point of that ending is that... no, EDI isn't actually a machine anymore. And yes, that's going to stick everyone's craw in this because it's asking us to believe in a new framework for life that doesn't exist anywhere.

So why does she still look like a machine with green bits?
And how the hell does this green space ray change their brains? EDI does not have a human brain or an approximation of it, she is a droid. It doesn't even follow that her "brain" is going to be in her head, not to mention that she still shares processes with the Normandy.
I don't care if you have magically fused organic matter with whatever she's made of, she is still DIFFERENT to hybrids like Joker.

This isn't even remotely pretending to be scientific. This is pure magic.

[jerms510]

Godwin has been invoked. Thread over.

as for those saying "how do synthetics get to be more organic?!" You must've missed the part where they were explaining how the reaper upgrades affected the Geth. There were images of the geth consciousness before and after the upgrade; Shep even notes how post-upgrade, the geth intelligence looked quite alot like an organic mind.

Modifié par jerms510, 13 mars 2012 - 10:32 .

[DieHigh2012]

John Locke N7 wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote...

John Locke N7 wrote...

DieHigh2012 wrote...

Biotic do not acount for Newton's three laws. I don't think you know what Newton's law is.

I'm not trying to put you down, but please look that up and explain your possition to me.

its explains exactly where that force and matter is coming from.... instead of it just coming out of nowhere. its a manipulation of darkmatter

Magic itself is an out side force, and it explains where it comes from be it mana or some other fantastic reason. The dark matter explination is no different...

theres no mana in non video game fantasy (that i know of )

And there is no manipulation of dark matter the way biotics do in non video game reality.

[Icinix]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Icinix wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...

Why exactly should I listen to the reaper kid?

He clearly states the destroy option to be the bad/evil one. The one were the Reaper get killed. The other two, where the Reapers live are the good ones in his "explanation". He is trying to fool Shep in my opinion.

If the creator of the Reapers tells me A, I will always do B, you can believe that.

Pretty much.

Reaper child wanted me to do anything but destroy - I went straight to destroy. Consequences be damned.

In other words: you didn't think about it.

No. I did. I thought "Reaper child wants me to pick two other options that just seem dumb based on dumb logic of a 'what if?' scenario that we seem to have already proven inaccurate. - Destroy it is."

Oviously there is a deeper level of thought there - but it was just a very clear cut decision from the moment Reaper child presented them.

[asilarae]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Tallestra wrote...
Well, most of the conflicts in our world stem from differences nationality, religion, even sex. So here perfect solution - someone turns us into a unisex same race, following same hybrid religion. Problem solved. If you want to leave in this state - fine, I don't.

That is not implied. That's something *you* add.

Also remember that Shepard's a hero. All endings make the Reapers leave, even if you choose Control you don't have the option of letting them do their job. I.e. all endings are supposed to be good. Which is the best might be debatable, but all result in more good than bad from a certain perspective. 

Well yes, but the positive outcomes that you're proposing aren't necessarily implied either.  Literally the only clue that singularity is any different from control is the fact that Joker and EDI are together--which means that you can point definitively to one positive outcome AND THAT IS IT.  In fact, as has been pointed out before, Joker continues to limp--meaning we cannot state with any certainty that being a combination of synthetic and organic provides any positive traits.  

Now, if Joker showed no noticeable limp at the end of the green ending, that would have been a quick, and impactful way of showing how singularity might benefit all life.  With no knowledge of what it means, we're left discussing whether or not it's right or wrong to force everything in existence to have its genetic code rewritten to contain either synthetic or organic material, depending.  And while it MIGHT be a positive step, it is still, at best, ethically ambiguous. 

[jb1983]

The problem with the synthesis ending, no matter your views on it, is that in 30 seconds it nullifies hundreds of hours of gameplay and the entire reason for the Reapers existing.

If synthesis is the solution to the problem between organics and synthetics, then why didn't the Reapers just offer that millions of years ago, or force it upon someone? Why not give an early organic synthetic upgrades and, boom, problem solved?

Secondly, ignoring the fact that the ending completely contradicts the entire point of the game (at least as explained prior to this choice), if anyone with implants can be dumped in there, did we not just kill the Illusive Man? Why can't he be thrown in?

Third, aren't you just taking the path that Saren offerred in ME1? Why is it that the Reapers didn't offer him this choice back in ME1 since it apparently solves the problem between organics and synthetics?

Fourth, it's the exact solution the Reapers are trying to enact, only without bloodshed. The species were "raised up" into Reaper form through a very bloody process. We know from ME1 and ME2 that Reapers are both synthetic and organic. The synthesis option does exactly what the Reapers are attempting to do, albeit bloodlessly. So why didn't they just do that from the beginning (see my previous three points)?

So no, it's not "beautifully done." It's horribly written, contradicts everything, and shows that the Reapers are ultimately superfluous to the story. If you can simply create a synthesis so synthetics and organics will never war against each other, then there's no need for the Reapers.

[Tamcia]

Husks are part organic and synthetic. Congratulations on helping the Reapers.....

You think wars will cease? Magically everyone will become good? Yeah, lets make a huge decision for everyone in the galaxy. It's same as making a choice for everyone who will be in power - I hear this is practiced in North Korea quite well - one mans makes the decision, everyone has no choice but to follow.

[Dilandau3000]

didymos1120 wrote...

suusuuu wrote...

Catalyst: "Synthesis is the final evolution of life"
Life exists to evolve, to progress. That is its goal and purpose. If it reaches its final form, it loses its meaning. You just robbed the entire galaxy out of meaning and purpose. 

Also, you know, evolution doesn't work that way.  It doesn't have some end goal.

That statement is made 1000000000x more awesome by the fact that you have a crocoduck as your avatar. Potholer54 fan?

[TobiTobsen]

jerms510 wrote...

TobiTobsen wrote...


If the creator of the Reapers tells me A, I will always do B, you can believe that.

Enjoy your ad hominem? offhand dismissal on account of the source is irresponsible.

And what makes you so sure that the Reaper Kid is telling you the truth?
If you point a weapon at me I'm pretty sure that I will make any option besides shooting me look more attractive for you.

[HKR148]

...Regardless, at this stage, I believe the best option is to just go straight for shooting the vent-kid's head with your pistol until you get bored and turn off the xbox.

[Furluge]

The Angry One wrote...

This isn't even remotely pretending to be scientific. This is pure magic.

You don't say?

Though seriously, I can't answer your questions. The magic green space magic ray changes everything right down to the very building blocks all life synthetic and organic and changes it. I'm not going to sit here and try to explain it because I can't, because the explanation doesn't exist anywhere in the game. I can't tell you anything else other than what the game already says it does, and that the Spacebaby says it will solve the problem.

If the game actually did it's job and explained anything satisfactorily we wouldn't be here complaining about the ending.

[jerms510]

@jb1983:
clearly it was not doable without the crucible + catalyst. Saren had neither, nor did any races in any of the previous cycles.

[The Angry One]

jerms510 wrote...

Godwin has been invoked. Thread over.

as for those saying "how do synthetics get to be more organic?!" You must've missed the part where they were explaining how the reaper upgrades affected the Geth. There were images of the geth consciousness before and after the upgrade; Shep even notes how post-upgrade, the geth intelligence looked quite alot like an organic mind.

Yeah and guess what.
THEY'RE STILL MACHINES. \\o/

[Tony208]

strive wrote...

Green creates what will be a peaceful end of the cycle for all time.

How does Synthesis end the cycle?

It's a completely idiotic theory. Last I checked, Humans were all the same on the inside and we can't agree on anything most of the time.

It doesn't matter if it's organics or synthetics, they all have different beliefs and they're gonna kill each other. If some other machine race came exploring the milky way and didn't agree with what the reapers were doing, they'd try to wipe them out. It's the way of the universe.