1594 réponses à ce sujet

[Jerrybnsn]

As far as this theory goes (and its not a bad one and at least has more than what the game offered for explanations), my Shepard was lying on the ground away from the Citadel beam when the radio com said that 'no one made it'. So, it was true, that no one made it yet. And as for all three choices, maxed out with all war assests, they were all the same with slight variations of how the Reapers are defeated, who gets off the crashed Normandy, and different colored beams.

This rubble scene you speak of, I haven't seen.

Modifié par Jerrybnsn, 15 mars 2012 - 07:29 .

[Himmelstor]

Meltemph wrote...

ACtually we dont have a "confrimed" meaning behind the ending at all, hell they even admited they wanted peopel to talk about what it means.  So I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "the ending we have confirmed".  We have the ending we SEE, but no, no ending meanings are confirmed, at all.

Incorrect.  Without the theory, it is, indeed, an ending. Just one riddled with plot holes, faulty logic, and bad continuity. It does not go into detail, and the implifications are absolutely horrific to contemplate. But is is an ending.

It is not sufficient on its own.

It's enough to drive me to drink. And I'm too tired now to start.
So goodnight all.

EDIT: May as well leave with music:

Modifié par Himmelstor, 15 mars 2012 - 07:28 .

[augustburnt]

Yep, my 3G collections of books and I clearly dont know a **** story line when I see one. Thank you for opening my eyes.

[Soilworker77]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

As far as this theory goes (and its not a bad one and at least has more than what the game offered for explanations), my Shepard was lying on the ground away from the Citadel beam when the radio com said that 'no one made it'. So, it was true, that no one made it yet. And as for all three choices, maxed out with all war assests, they were all the same with slight variations of how the Reapers are defeated, who gets off the crashed Normandy, and different colored beams.

This rubble scene you speak off, I haven't seen.

You need to have a EMS score of 4000 or higher (you also need to "save" Anderson from being executed by TIM).
If you have a EMS score of 5000 it won't matter if you "save" Anderson or not.
Don't forget that you also need to choose to destroy the Reapers.

[Tiax Rules All]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

As far as this theory goes (and its not a bad one and at least has more than what the game offered for explanations), my Shepard was lying on the ground away from the Citadel beam when the radio com said that 'no one made it'. So, it was true, that no one made it yet. And as for all three choices, maxed out with all war assests, they were all the same with slight variations of how the Reapers are defeated, who gets off the crashed Normandy, and different colored beams.

This rubble scene you speak off, I haven't seen.

That rubble scene Is everything
It is the "proof" of Indoc theory

without it, its just a ****ty ending.

This is tacked onto the game if you choose destroy with over 4000 EMF, (EDIT what above poster said was better) The truth

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 15 mars 2012 - 07:31 .

[Jerrybnsn]

But I did everything in the game. I'm not sure what my EMS score was, but the green bar was maxed out and I completed all side missions. I did save Anderson from being executed, but he ended up dying next to Shepard anyway. ...And still, the endings are all the same.

What do I need to do to get the score up higher?

[Tiax Rules All]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

But I did everything in the game. I'm not sure what my EMS score was, but the green bar was maxed out and I completed all side missions. I did save Anderson from being executed, but he ended up dying next to Shepard anyway. ...And still, the endings are all the same.

What do I need to do to get the score up higher?

MP

[JasonTan87]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

As far as this theory goes (and its not a bad one and at least has more than what the game offered for explanations), my Shepard was lying on the ground away from the Citadel beam when the radio com said that 'no one made it'. So, it was true, that no one made it yet. And as for all three choices, maxed out with all war assests, they were all the same with slight variations of how the Reapers are defeated, who gets off the crashed Normandy, and different colored beams.

This rubble scene you speak off, I haven't seen.

That rubble scene Is everything
It is the "proof" of Indoc theory

without it, its just a ****ty ending.

This is tacked onto the game if you choose destroy with over 4000 EMF, (EDIT what above poster said was better) The truth

What if it's just a ****ty ending anyway?

[Meltemph]

Himmelstor wrote...

Meltemph wrote...

ACtually we dont have a "confrimed" meaning behind the ending at all, hell they even admited they wanted peopel to talk about what it means.  So I'm not exactly sure what you mean by "the ending we have confirmed".  We have the ending we SEE, but no, no ending meanings are confirmed, at all.

Incorrect.  Without the theory, it is, indeed, an ending. Just one riddled with plot holes, faulty logic, and bad continuity. It does not go into detail, and the implifications are absolutely horrific to contemplate. But is is an ending.

It is not sufficient on its own.

It's enough to drive me to drink. And I'm too tired now to start.
So goodnight all.

EDIT: May as well leave with music:

That is like saying Event Horizon's ending was supposed to be taken at face value because that is all there was.

But the point of the ending to do exactly that, make theories or at least that is the arguement and I think there is more to support that then isnt.

[Tiax Rules All]

JasonTan87 wrote...

What if it's just a ****ty ending anyway?

you mean like hypothetically?
because Bioware ended the Bhall Spawn's story in Baldur's Gate 1, 2 and Throne of Bhall expantion
and that series MADE Bioware
they have done it before... its not crazy at all.

So when the real ending is released i am vindicated for all this and i play the **** outta it. I dougt it will "just be a ****ty ending anyway" but speculating on the ending of the dlc is just dumb so i wont try, we will all see in the end.

the real end

[Walshrus]

My only problem with all these theories of it being a dream/indoctrination is the stargazer scene after the credits, which clearly wouldn't be part of his hallucination. The child says something along the lines of "When can I go to the stars" hinting that the mass relays were really destroyed, you would have to think if it was all a dream and the relays were still there people who know of him would have space travel. Unless the ending is reality and the relays are destroyed and that is someone on Earth (or some other planet, one that Joker landed on which is likely since both had the two moons/planets in the background) remembering stories they heard about the Shepard. I just can't see how people would be talking about going to the stars like it is some far off idea if the relays were still around.

[NorDee65]

OP, this is certainly an interesting discussion, and you and many others here have made cogent points I find myself at least to some extent agreeing with. (Aside the fact, that the way BIOWARE presented these endings is like a funeral without a body ).

I do not dispute either the intoctrination nor the hallucination theory, both have valid arguments. My questions (towards Biware, anyway) concentrate - among others - on the "epilogue", when the kid asks for stories about "the shepard". This may well be a hint to the legend Shepard becomes, but what bothers me a bit is that all three "endings" get this dialogue. And for me it isn't enough to explain, that Bioware just included this to move people to buy more DLCs.

So what if:
I believe that whatever else is going on, after that last reaper beam Shepard was dying. In such a weakend state indoctrination and / or hallucination (blood loss etc.) would be feasable. So the last scenes could well be products of imagination. BUT they may also be real (and not just the one "good" red ending). To me Shepard is doomed and the question ist, in what way. So Shepard gets to make a choice. The natural inclination would be the red one, because she wants the reapers stopped, but she refused to take it, because she does not want to doom the geth nor EDI. The blue choice is a bit more feasable, but as as she states to TIM, "we are not ready for that much power". So she goes with the green one. Both the blue and the green choice lead to Shepards disintegration, resembling the humans' disintegration on the collector base. The red choice leads to massive destruction all about, and Shepard lying in rubbles alive, which certainly gives fuel to OPs well presented theories.

Yet what if the cycle has to continue, has to come to a conclusion, what if the citadel, a giant mass relay supposedly built by the reapers IS the catalyst? (Why would the allow their fine piece of hardware to be used against them? It may all have been a giant hoax, even the plans for the crucible) And we are doomed anyway, but Shepards choices give our fate a certain twist? What if every species before alway took the red choice and therefore all reapers got this menacing red aura and their merciless yet practical approach to the underlying dilemma? Yet when taking the blue or green (or red for that matter, but that is debatable^_^) option not only is a human reaper created, finalised by Shepard's choice, but also all Reapers near and far are changed to blue or green, either accepting Shepard's "control over them, or becoming individuals with free will. And the human reaper will henceforth be called "The Shepard" as opposed to "harbinger" or "sovereign".

This of couse does not answer why the mass relays had to be destroyed nor Normandy's flight, I'll admit.

[Tiax Rules All]

Meltemph wrote...

That is like saying Event Horizon's ending was supposed to be taken at face value because that is all there was.

But the point of the ending to do exactly that, make theories or at least that is the arguement and I think there is more to support that then isnt.

not sure i follow, are you saying that the ending was ****ty on purpose to so people could generate buzz about how ****ty it is?

I think Bioware assumed we would have seen this as more of a "cool, there is more to come. more story to see"
but people are just confused and angry right now. It will clear up soon, official comments are being delayed for many reasons at the moment.

[Mystical_Gaming]

an epilogue still would have been nice. a way to make my femshep be alive and see her for more than a split second wouldn't be bad either.

All I really get from the ending is loneliness to be honest. When I think of the 3 mass effect games as a whole I don't know if I will play them again or soon. The lonely feeling of knowing how it will all end will always be and forever present unless the endings get changed or a nice epilogue to wrap it all up happens.

I'm not mad but being part of the series since it started in 07' it's just hard to all process seeing the character I've played as for so long now gone in the last 10 mins of a game that had no big battle / final boss or something more epic than choosing a color. I would have been fine with her dyng but it hurts to see her tricked into her death / demise.

Another game did something similar: Shadow of the Colossus. The main character the entire game is essentially tricked to his demise and he basically dies in the end ... it's very hard to watch seeing a character with good intentions go evil and deteriorate. When i saw my femshep die it was really hard to watch. I guess I could have chose the other option but it's really not that different or satisfying really.

I dunno .. I really don't need to say more. Everyone else has already repeated it probably 5 million times by now

[mahlerbone]

JoeLaTurkeyII wrote...

If this is true, it's like selling Mass Effect 2 and then telling everyone they'll have to buy the actual Collector Base mission as DLC.

exactly. its a terrible idea for a company to make the player buy an ending

[Tiax Rules All]

Walshrus wrote...

My only problem with all these theories of it being a dream/indoctrination is the stargazer scene after the credits, which clearly wouldn't be part of his hallucination. The child says something along the lines of "When can I go to the stars" hinting that the mass relays were really destroyed, you would have to think if it was all a dream and the relays were still there people who know of him would have space travel. Unless the ending is reality and the relays are destroyed and that is someone on Earth (or some other planet, one that Joker landed on which is likely since both had the two moons/planets in the background) remembering stories they heard about the Shepard. I just can't see how people would be talking about going to the stars like it is some far off idea if the relays were still around.

Stargazer is just vague enough that any ending of the dlc that is coming later will not change it.

Shep is always a legend

-DId that all really happen?
-Yes, but some of the details have been lost in time. it all happened so very long ago.
-when can i go to the stars?
-one day my sweet.
-what will be there?
-anything you can imagine, our galaxy has buillions of stars etc etc..
-tell me anouther story about the shepard
-its getting late but ok , one more story...

transcript of Stargazer ending, nothing you mention breaks any of what he said.. read carefully.
all i hear is more dlc

[Tiax Rules All]

mahlerbone wrote...

JoeLaTurkeyII wrote...

If this is true, it's like selling Mass Effect 2 and then telling everyone they'll have to buy the actual Collector Base mission as DLC.

exactly. its a terrible idea for a company to make the player buy an ending

Baldur's Gate 1, 2 and Throne of Bhall Expantion pack

The series that made Bioware did it, this is the same exact thing

[Jerrybnsn]

Multiplayer is only for those that subscribe to XboxGold. For $5 a month, I could get a few second cutscene that shows Shepard taking a breath from the rubble, instead of watching Joker crash land on a planet? I think I'll stick with my ****ty ending and just lump ME3 as a disappointment like the majority.

[Tiax Rules All]

Mystical_Gaming wrote...

an epilogue still would have been nice. a way to make my femshep be alive and see her for more than a split second wouldn't be bad either.

All I really get from the ending is loneliness to be honest. When I think of the 3 mass effect games as a whole I don't know if I will play them again or soon. The lonely feeling of knowing how it will all end will always be and forever present unless the endings get changed or a nice epilogue to wrap it all up happens.

I'm not mad but being part of the series since it started in 07' it's just hard to all process seeing the character I've played as for so long now gone in the last 10 mins of a game that had no big battle / final boss or something more epic than choosing a color. I would have been fine with her dyng but it hurts to see her tricked into her death / demise.

Another game did something similar: Shadow of the Colossus. The main character the entire game is essentially tricked to his demise and he basically dies in the end ... it's very hard to watch seeing a character with good intentions go evil and deteriorate. When i saw my femshep die it was really hard to watch. I guess I could have chose the other option but it's really not that different or satisfying really.

I dunno .. I really don't need to say more. Everyone else has already repeated it probably 5 million times by now

oh man you are sooooooo gonna love the DLC

[Tiax Rules All]

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Multiplayer is only for those that subscribe to XboxGold. For $5 a month, I could get a few second cutscene that shows Shepard taking a breath from the rubble, instead of watching Joker crash land on a planet? I think I'll stick with my ****ty ending and just lump ME3 as a disappointment like the majority.

whatever dude if you cant afford intrnet then you probably cant afford DLC and they aren't marketing to you anyways.. just sayin

[Walshrus]

I wasn't saying there won't be more DLC I was just saying that the way the child said about going to the stars, as if it something you or I would say now, something that isn't available to everyone seems to contradict the idea that it was all a dream and the relays weren't destroyed. When the relays were around space travel was commonplace with colonies all over the galaxy, but the way the child is talking makes it seem like space travel is a distant memory, which to me would make sense if the relays were destroyed.

[Jerrybnsn]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Jerrybnsn wrote...

Multiplayer is only for those that subscribe to XboxGold. For $5 a month, I could get a few second cutscene that shows Shepard taking a breath from the rubble, instead of watching Joker crash land on a planet? I think I'll stick with my ****ty ending and just lump ME3 as a disappointment like the majority.

whatever dude if you cant afford intrnet then you probably cant afford DLC and they aren't marketing to you anyways.. just sayin

Only 10% of gamers actually purchase dlc, so why not market your games to the other 90%?

 Wait, that would explain why ME3 only has an average 3.5 user rating, wouldn't it?

[thoreauscabin]

If Shepard was never on the Citadel, and the 3 choices offered only determine Shepard's mental state, what happened to the Reapers?

It's seems like your explanation has a lot of disconnect between what  happened in Shepard's mind (supposedly) and what happened outside of it.

Modifié par thoreauscabin, 15 mars 2012 - 08:13 .

[Meltemph]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Meltemph wrote...

That is like saying Event Horizon's ending was supposed to be taken at face value because that is all there was.

But the point of the ending to do exactly that, make theories or at least that is the arguement and I think there is more to support that then isnt.

not sure i follow, are you saying that the ending was ****ty on purpose to so people could generate buzz about how ****ty it is?

I think Bioware assumed we would have seen this as more of a "cool, there is more to come. more story to see"
but people are just confused and angry right now. It will clear up soon, official comments are being delayed for many reasons at the moment.

I think they intended people like you to look at it from that perspective, but I think they full well knew(specially after the book stuff) that there was going to be a buzz about the ending.  Ya, they probably were not expecting it to this extent, but I do think the knew this was coming.

In other words, they made it where you had to look for the inconsistencies to understand the point, on purpose.

Modifié par Meltemph, 15 mars 2012 - 08:13 .

[Deventh]

Why did this thread go so far? Threads like this are exactly what BioWare want so they won't give us the thing we want (most of us)