1594 réponses à ce sujet

[Zeroscape]

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

Modifié par Zeroscape, 15 mars 2012 - 05:16 .

[RinpocheSchnozberry]

That (supposed to be) eye opening moment is supposed to tell you that
Shepard was never on the Citadel. He lies just where he was knocked out
by the destroyer blast, in the rubble of London. This is where the
confusion takes place.

How do we know it's London?  One, the story tells us.  Two, the red boxes tie the setting to a real world location.

How do we know the human marines celebrating at the end are in London?  The cut scene shows us the skyline.  That ties it to a real world location.

If BioWare wanted us to believe that the place where Shepard wakes up is also London, they would have added some kind of detail, in the same way that they did with the other two scenes.  But they didn't.  All we know is Shepard was on the Citadel/Crucible, shot  up the conduit, everything exploded, and Shepard woke with a gasp.  If they wanted us to know that was London, they would have added some kind of detail.

Counterpoint:  The blocks do look like concrete and stone...  But that still doens't mean it =can't= be on the Citadel.  

[Zyrious]

"Circumstantial evidence is evidence in which an inference is required to connect it to a conclusion of fact, like a fingerprint at the scene of a crime. By contrast, direct evidence supports the truth of an assertion directly—i.e., without need for any additional evidence or the intervening inference."

Everything you present is Circumstantial evidence at best. Your interpretation of things presented in the game is presented as evidence to your theory. Things which could just as easily be artistic license, easter eggs, and plot holes, which is consistent with every other game in the series. Even the ending, it is HARD to write endings, some of the most well written books have had horrid endings. It happens. It happened. Stop treating your theory as fact.

[trancers3]

Rawgrim wrote...

I am currently replaying the game, and I got to the first dream sequence some hours ago. I noticed when Shep reaches the kid, for the first time. We hear a reaper sound. Might be a pointer.

ofc because death of the kid haunt him and it did see reaper kill him

[Zeroscape]

Zyrious wrote...

"Circumstantial evidence is evidence in which an inference is required to connect it to a conclusion of fact, like a fingerprint at the scene of a crime. By contrast, direct evidence supports the truth of an assertion directly—i.e., without need for any additional evidence or the intervening inference."

Everything you present is Circumstantial evidence at best. Your interpretation of things presented in the game is presented as evidence to your theory. Things which could just as easily be artistic license, easter eggs, and plot holes, which is consistent with every other game in the series. Even the ending, it is HARD to write endings, some of the most well written books have had horrid endings. It happens. It happened. Stop treating your theory as fact.

I agree that none of this discussion should be seen as fact, 'set-in-stone' or truth. It's speculation with perhaps a fair bit of 'grasping for straws'. But right now there's so many red flags that this line of inquiry merits some attention. Everyone needs to do their own research before drawing any personal conclusions. 

Like I said in an earlier post, I think there's something going on and this Indoc Theory is close to what I feel happened at the end. But I admit I could be totally wrong and the endings we have now are 'it'.

Again, we wont know until we get some word from Bioware. Until then, the theorizing will continue.

[Tiax Rules All]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

...
It's fair that ME3 DLC is still ME3, too.  I'm not saying BioWare lied, I'm just saying that based off of what we see before us, there's no reason to think that Shepard's story isn't over. 

2 reasons to think its not over coming right up

1)  shep breathing in rubble at end of best ending,
2) stargazer says "one more story"

thats enough for now i have now provided evidence to the contrary. you cant say there is no reason anymore.

I do think the theory is busted though.  Why would Shepard's subconscious imagining of a happy ending involve all the relays being destroyed?  That makes no sense.  My Shepard so loved the galaxy that she filled the hours of her life flying around it, trying to keep it safe from Reapers.  She had faith that the krogan and salarians could work things out, faith that the rachnai queen would learn from the mistakes of the past, faith that the geth and quarians were better together than they were apart. 

Why would her happy ending involve seperating all these races with the destruction of the relays?  That makes no sense.

1) if you know indoc theory then the relays never blow IRL
2) they might have been convienient and maybe even ESSENTIAL, but they were put there by reapers/ for reaper agendas, destroying them WOULD F up the reapers day.
3)its a dream, not all dreams make sense. plus if the dream made sense by itself, we wouldnt need indoc theory at all
4) its one of many things (holes some call them) that are put there purposely to make you reject it and search for the REAL answer

You can say the relays being destroyed is a metaphor, but that would be a cop out.  In HT, Shepard's dreamed that every she loved would be carved up and seperated forever.  That makes no sense.  That is not a happy ending.

You have to either come up with a better reason for the "dream" or admit the whole theory is busted.

its not that its broken cause i dont have the answers,this as bad logic. Your are asking me to make sense of something that was written to not make sense on purpose. Maybe its all just to get you to "OMG RELAYS" and freak while they laugh at you with the DLC disk in hand at the office.

FWIW, I love the work that people are putting into this.   :)  I just don't see how it is right based off of what we know now.

i will continue to sight what i can if you want to continue. im not scared to debate. I feel i have all the evidence i need and there will be PROOF soon, so i just have to be patient to be right.

also

Chris Priestly
twitter.com/#!/BioEvilChris/status/179967731070799872
Jessica Merizan
twitter.com/#!/JessicaMerizan/status/179808402011193344
twitter.com/#!/JessicaMerizan/status/179828285327409152
The official "Mass Effect" twitter from Bioware:
twitter.com/#!/masseffect/status/179686320568926209
twitter.com/#!/masseffect/status/179680647869243392
twitter.com/#!/masseffect/status/179688066787704832
twitter.com/#!/masseffect/status/179682383304462338
twitter.com/#!/masseffect/status/179681231766695936
more evidence, when this becomes PROOF how will you react?

[Smiley556]

Zyrious wrote...

"Circumstantial evidence is evidence in which an inference is required to connect it to a conclusion of fact, like a fingerprint at the scene of a crime. By contrast, direct evidence supports the truth of an assertion directly—i.e., without need for any additional evidence or the intervening inference."

Everything you present is Circumstantial evidence at best. Your interpretation of things presented in the game is presented as evidence to your theory. Things which could just as easily be artistic license, easter eggs, and plot holes, which is consistent with every other game in the series. Even the ending, it is HARD to write endings, some of the most well written books have had horrid endings. It happens. It happened. Stop treating your theory as fact.

Your entire argument is void everytime you post a comment. In every comment you tell us to stop saying these are fact, we are not saying they are facts. Let me ask you this, your explenation to the ending, whatever that might be, do you see that as fact?

[Tiax Rules All]

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

 and watch again radio chatter continues throughout the whole scene, nobody ever sees shep, they proceed with "hammer is decimated" "we need to fall back and regroup"  hes walking during those...

the anderson thing is ABOUT as rediculous as shep surving blowing up the citadel, getting spaced with no suit, re-entry through earths atmosphere, landing in a pile of London rubble and living. some things i feel i dont have to prove wrong.

[trancers3]

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

anderson say he was following you and dint land same place and he was not so bad hurt too so he could move faster

[Zyrious]

Smiley556 wrote...

Zyrious wrote...

"Circumstantial evidence is evidence in which an inference is required to connect it to a conclusion of fact, like a fingerprint at the scene of a crime. By contrast, direct evidence supports the truth of an assertion directly—i.e., without need for any additional evidence or the intervening inference."

Everything you present is Circumstantial evidence at best. Your interpretation of things presented in the game is presented as evidence to your theory. Things which could just as easily be artistic license, easter eggs, and plot holes, which is consistent with every other game in the series. Even the ending, it is HARD to write endings, some of the most well written books have had horrid endings. It happens. It happened. Stop treating your theory as fact.

Your entire argument is void everytime you post a comment. In every comment you tell us to stop saying these are fact, we are not saying they are facts. Let me ask you this, your explenation to the ending, whatever that might be, do you see that as fact?

I see it as most likely and as what is intended to be seen by the devs. I have seen twist endings before, there is more allusion than what we are given. Why doesn't shepard wake up in all 3 endings, just indoctrinated in 2 of them? Why not a REAL, relavent teaser like hearing radio chatter post-credits or something like that? Following true narrative style of making sure the audience follows your intent, even while leaving room for doubt. This leave a planet of doubt of your theory which is supposed to be true.

Further i find you claim of bioware intentionally leaving the ending of the game off-disk hard to believe. It doesn't follow with their pre-release comments, post-release comments, or anything inbetween. The intentions of the developers seem quite clear. The burdon of evidence is on you as it goes against what the clear intent of the ending is as presented to us, and i see only circumstantial evidence.

[Smiley556]

Tiax, maybe you should scrap the part saying he wakes up in London. That is afterall our logical conclusion, not fact. What is fact is that he wakes up on earth. You and I both know he wakes up in London, but people are using it as an argument to state 'nothing proves its london, your wrong!' just so they dont have to answer how the hell he got from citadel to earth.

[Tiax Rules All]

RinpocheSchnozberry wrote...

That (supposed to be) eye opening moment is supposed to tell you that
Shepard was never on the Citadel. He lies just where he was knocked out
by the destroyer blast, in the rubble of London. This is where the
confusion takes place.

How do we know it's London?  One, the story tells us.  Two, the red boxes tie the setting to a real world location.

How do we know the human marines celebrating at the end are in London?  The cut scene shows us the skyline.  That ties it to a real world location.

If BioWare wanted us to believe that the place where Shepard wakes up is also London, they would have added some kind of detail, in the same way that they did with the other two scenes.  But they didn't.  All we know is Shepard was on the Citadel/Crucible, shot  up the conduit, everything exploded, and Shepard woke with a gasp.  If they wanted us to know that was London, they would have added some kind of detail.

Counterpoint:  The blocks do look like concrete and stone...  But that still doens't mean it =can't= be on the Citadel.  

why? so you can reject that too? its myterious and edgy this way. when people ask for stuff like this its what makes all other games out there afraid to do anytthing other then dumbed down cookie cutter endings. They COULD have put a flashing neon "welcome to london" sign next to shep but THAT is bad writing. That is telling your customers you think they are to dumb to fugure things out for themselves.

the detail IS the scene.. its existince is biowar telling you to question and leading you into the DLC

[Zeroscape]

trancers3 wrote...

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

anderson say he was following you and dint land same place and he was not so bad hurt too so he could move faster

I could reply to that with: If he was following you, he would've shouted or tried to get your attention. Especially because is faster than you. 

But the problem is more what happens on the Citadel. There is seemingly only one path to take to the console where you meet up with Anderson. Anderson said that the walls were shifting and he landed somewhere else but we see no evidence of that as far as I can recall. 

So this goes back to what the Indoc Theory tries to look at: "Do you take things at face value?" There's enough elements that seem extremely out-of-place and weird about that whole scene which gives merit to questioning what happened.

[Tiax Rules All]

Smiley556 wrote...

Tiax, maybe you should scrap the part saying he wakes up in London. That is afterall our logical conclusion, not fact. What is fact is that he wakes up on earth. You and I both know he wakes up in London, but people are using it as an argument to state 'nothing proves its london, your wrong!' just so they dont have to answer how the hell he got from citadel to earth.

if you think he not on the citadel, and you think hes not in london, then where would he be and how on earth would that makes even a little sense
 (pic of london)...

the buildings blocks are not only similar. they are the same

once again. i provided evidence.
can you show me a pic of the citadel with grey stone?
can you cite any reason he would be in rubble on earth but NOT in London.

when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 15 mars 2012 - 05:46 .

[BoneNinja]

https://twitter.com/...345246671056896

Just keep adding what little things I'm finding

[Smiley556]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Smiley556 wrote...

Tiax, maybe you should scrap the part saying he wakes up in London. That is afterall our logical conclusion, not fact. What is fact is that he wakes up on earth. You and I both know he wakes up in London, but people are using it as an argument to state 'nothing proves its london, your wrong!' just so they dont have to answer how the hell he got from citadel to earth.

if you think he not on the citadel, and you think hes not in london, then where would he be and how on earth would that makes even a little sense
 (pic of london)...
<a href=http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/3176/masseffect3201203120427.jpg" alt=""/>
the buildings blocks are not only similar. they are the same

once again. i provided evidence.
can you show me a pic of the citadel with grey stone?
can you cite any reason he would be in rubble on earth but NOT in London.

when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth

I know its London, but I'm tired of people not adding 1 and 1 together just because there isnt a red phone booth in the rubble pile. Saying its earth is enough to disprove the theory that shepard was on the citadel, and it counters the one argument these people come up with ('no evidence its london lalala cant hear what your saying I'm right').

[Tiax Rules All]

BoneNinja wrote...

https://twitter.com/...345246671056896

Just keep adding what little things I'm finding

fixed link

more evidence everybody

take note so i dont have to hear you say i have no evidence again

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 15 mars 2012 - 05:49 .

[trancers3]

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

anderson say he was following you and dint land same place and he was not so bad hurt too so he could move faster

I could reply to that with: If he was following you, he would've shouted or tried to get your attention. Especially because is faster than you. 

But the problem is more what happens on the Citadel. There is seemingly only one path to take to the console where you meet up with Anderson. Anderson said that the walls were shifting and he landed somewhere else but we see no evidence of that as far as I can recall. 

So this goes back to what the Indoc Theory tries to look at: "Do you take things at face value?" There's enough elements that seem extremely out-of-place and weird about that whole scene which gives merit to questioning what happened.

there is just too many plotholes wich makes it look that it was written badly like why did joker runaway from fight to use relay wich has no sense 

[Tiax Rules All]

Smiley556 wrote...

I know its London, but I'm tired of people not adding 1 and 1 together just because there isnt a red phone booth in the rubble pile. Saying its earth is enough to disprove the theory that shepard was on the citadel, and it counters the one argument these people come up with ('no evidence its london lalala cant hear what your saying I'm right').

sorry but i refuse to not use one of the strongest pieces of indoc theory evidence because they didn't write it so even the blind squirels could find the nut.

If you cant accept London then you cant accept ANYTHING I say.

[Rawgrim]

trancers3 wrote...

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Zeroscape wrote...

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

If you listen to the radio chatter before Shepard goes into the beam, you can hear allied forces saying that NOBODY made it to the beam, not you and not Anderson before you. This is the real world radio chatter now in the background subconscious of this hallucination.

ofc he say none made it in to beam because it was true in that time when shepard was down too and it was after that when he moved in to beam

If no one made it to the beam in the time your were unconscious and you were looking straight at the beam after getting up.... how did Anderson beat you to it? 

anderson say he was following you and dint land same place and he was not so bad hurt too so he could move faster

I could reply to that with: If he was following you, he would've shouted or tried to get your attention. Especially because is faster than you. 

But the problem is more what happens on the Citadel. There is seemingly only one path to take to the console where you meet up with Anderson. Anderson said that the walls were shifting and he landed somewhere else but we see no evidence of that as far as I can recall. 

So this goes back to what the Indoc Theory tries to look at: "Do you take things at face value?" There's enough elements that seem extremely out-of-place and weird about that whole scene which gives merit to questioning what happened.

there is just too many plotholes wich makes it look that it was written badly like why did joker runaway from fight to use relay wich has no sense 

The whole point is that it doesn`t make sense. I suggest you read page 1 of this topic...

[Smiley556]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

sorry but i refuse to not use one of the strongest pieces of indoc theory evidence because they didn't write it so even the blind squirels could find the nut.

If you cant accept London then you cant accept ANYTHING I say.

Thats pretty much what most people are doing by default anyway <_<
Hang in there Tiax

Modifié par Smiley556, 15 mars 2012 - 05:58 .

[BoneNinja]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

BoneNinja wrote...

https://twitter.com/...345246671056896

Just keep adding what little things I'm finding

fixed link

more evidence everybody

take note so i dont have to hear you say i have no evidence again

Thanks Tiax, I'm actually new to Twitter (over all this ME3 crap I couldn't resist since that seems to be where they are most vocal) so I'm a total noob at trying to post things from there.

[Tiax Rules All]

trancers3 wrote...

there is just too many plotholes wich makes it look that it was written badly like why did joker runaway from fight to use relay wich has no sense 

you are at stage .001 of understanding indoc theory.
joker didnt run anywhere, cept in sheps imagination.
he never went to any relay and never crashed...

hes where you left him, so is shep, so is your team, what you saw after harbingers beam hits you and shep "waking up" at best ending is all hallucination then indoc attempt. and hallucination again

if shep is not unconscience then why would he have to wake up? what else would he be waking up from?
yes, page one, read it.

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 15 mars 2012 - 05:58 .

[trancers3]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

BoneNinja wrote...

https://twitter.com/...345246671056896

Just keep adding what little things I'm finding

fixed link

more evidence everybody

take note so i dont have to hear you say i have no evidence again

it was say before that mass effect 3 is last game in trilogy but not mass effect game

[Tiax Rules All]

trancers3 wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

BoneNinja wrote...

https://twitter.com/...345246671056896

Just keep adding what little things I'm finding

fixed link

more evidence everybody

take note so i dont have to hear you say i have no evidence again

it was say before that mass effect 3 is last game in trilogy but not mass effect game

copy paste quote #12 fo the 100th time....

ME3 DLC is still ME3
that statement is not false.
ME3 will still be the last