1594 réponses à ce sujet

[Tiax Rules All]

Egonne wrote...

I would certainly commend 'Tiax Rules All' for his work here.

He has been called 'high minded', 'condescending', 'obnoxious' and an 'idiot'.  And that was only in the first 10 pages of this thread.

Unfortunately some mistake his confident manner for arrogant iconoclasm.

He should be applauded for his patience.

And his vocabulary is second to none.
'Chastize' alone should be worth quite a bit in the 'good word usage' category.

heh thanks for that. Sometimes i just feel like burning this thread down to the ground but I try to keep it together.

[ollec92]

After finishing Mass effect 3 i felt empty... I felt as if a void of nothingness had consumed me. "What kind of ending is this?!" Right up until the end I viewed it as one oft the three greatest games of all time. However, my opinion was then corrupted by wahat I thought were poor writing...
It has taken a few days of contemplation and the aid of a certain video to turn that opinion around. It is not untill you realize what might realy be going on that you appreciate the current ending. I'm certain you can find this somewhere else on this website, but i belive that everyone who is the least intrested in the ending to Mass effect 3 should watch this exceptionally well made video.

(commendations to ACAVYOS for this extremly polished video)

[Smiley556]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

annoyingpoodle wrote...

Smiley556 wrote...

Small note by the way. If the ending is released for free its called a patch, not DLC.

Carry on.

It would be content that you download also known as downloadable content. A patch edits content already in the game.

and also the term patch might imply that its a "fix" for the ending as aposed to additional content

nowhere in "download content" does it mean payment is required.

So your saying all that WoW's patches did was edit and fix content already in the game...? They were free, they added game content (and lots of it!) and were never called DLC. The term DLC started coming into use when games started releasing extra paid content.

Edit: where I'm going with this is the fact people argue the end cant be released later because there would be no post ending DLC according to Bioware, and that ME3 would conclude the story. As you said, ME3 DLC is still ME3. I'm just adding, if its free and expands the main story and nothing else (ie. it doesnt add extra CONTENT like characters/weapons/missions), its technically a patch, not a DLC.

Modifié par Smiley556, 17 mars 2012 - 12:15 .

[Tiax Rules All]

ollec92 wrote...

After finishing Mass effect 3 i felt empty... I felt as if a void of nothingness had consumed me. "What kind of ending is this?!" Right up until the end I viewed it as one oft the three greatest games of all time. However, my opinion was then corrupted by wahat I thought were poor writing...
It has taken a few days of contemplation and the aid of a certain video to turn that opinion around. It is not untill you realize what might realy be going on that you appreciate the current ending. I'm certain you can find this somewhere else on this website, but i belive that everyone who is the least intrested in the ending to Mass effect 3 should watch this exceptionally well made video.

(commendations to ACAVYOS for this extremly polished video)

i was the same. i didnt realise the whole indoc thing at first but you aren't really supposed to right away are you. I suppose if it was obvoius that it was a trick then nobody would choose wrong.. I feel better about beig tricked, some people cant accept it or are offended by the notion.

the video... pure gold, I posted it here recently and its the one in my Sig

[Plasma Prestige]

 The indoctrination theory is the only framework which makes the ending even slightly coherent. Nothing you said seems overtly untrue, and I would like the DLC you described.

[Shallyah]

To be fair, you could also stop the "BW gave us an unfinished game to sell us the DLC" guilt triping. It's like saying "Star Wars was pieced in 3 trilogies to make us pay for 9 books/cinema tickets instead of 1". I'd have prefered a ME4, but if it'll be DLC, then let it be DLC. We'd have to pay for ME4 all the same, and we'd happily do so, waiting for it with anticipation.

We got an ending for ME3, same as we did for ME1 and ME2, an open ending that allows BW to create more content. And if it's content as good as all of the ME trilogy, damn it all. I'll gladly pay for anything of similar quality that blooms out of them.

The only way I'd be truly disappointed is if we are left hanging with that ending and nothing else, but they've already stated that there will be official statements and possibly additional content coming at some point to appease all this nerdraging mass that got out of control.

Just for the record, I can possitively say that ME3 was my best invested 50 bucks in the last few years, so please, enough with the guilt tripping. BW is a company that needs profit to create more of this stuff, and I personally will support them at every step as long as they continue their work.

If not because of Bioware, we'd all be playing husks of games without meat or essence, based just on senseless pretty graphics, but hollow in truth ala Far Cry.

Modifié par Shallyah, 17 mars 2012 - 12:24 .

[Tiax Rules All]

Smiley556 wrote...

So your saying all that WoW's patches did was edit and fix content already in the game...? They were free, they added game content (and lots of it!) and were never called DLC. The term DLC started coming into use when games started releasing extra paid content.

I just said "imply"  Either term could be used for extra free content. but if im Bioware i think in terms of how people would view it would be percieved diff, just because of the name. and "Ending fix" seems like, "we broke it, and repaired it"
while "Ending DLC" sounds more like something planned and a bonus. just my opinion.

and yeah I play SWTOR and we "patch" i think MMO's are the exception to the terminologies rule.

Still, to me I could care less what they call it, i just want to see it.

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 17 mars 2012 - 12:20 .

[CitizenSnips]

Plasma Prestige wrote...

 The indoctrination theory is the only framework which makes the ending even slightly coherent. Nothing you said seems overtly untrue, and I would like the DLC you described.

True. Without the framework of either indoctrination or a dream, the entire ending is basically nonsensical.

[Tiax Rules All]

yeah, I cant understand exactly why i feel the way i do about this potential DLC

I am usually on the side of DLC is bad. not because I dont like more stuff or anything but for the (insert one of a million reasons there are)

but with ME3 Ending DLC? Im already throwing money ant the screen waiting for something to happen. It must be that this whole debacle has not made me think less of Bioware like some have concluded. I loved the game and I want more. and if and when this DLC comes, I will prob love the ending we have now even more because it will then be a really cool part in the larger game and not just a "vague" ending...

[Tiax Rules All]

@Shallyah

I agree with all you said, then I got to how you were saying you paid 50 bucks for ME3 and got jealous

[B1ackba11z]

Bioware is brilliant. After my second play through, I realized the indoctrination theory is the way to go for sure. So many clues in your face. Some people say were grasping at straws to make ourselves fell better but I say to them "open your eyes". And on this thread we have Tiax here showing them all the proof and they still can't see it. Bioware has really succeeded in indoctrinating the player.This ending is so great hahaha

Good job holding it together Tiax, you must be a teacher or something to have this much patience repeating yourself. I know i couldn't do it.

PS- if somehow we are wrong on this tho, and Bioware did really screw up......FML what a fail!!!

[Tiax Rules All]

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

Plasma Prestige wrote...

 The indoctrination theory is the only framework which makes the ending even slightly coherent. Nothing you said seems overtly untrue, and I would like the DLC you described.

True. Without the framework of either indoctrination or a dream, the entire ending is basically nonsensical.

True again. While i am confident in the theory, Its not confirmed. That being said, NO true meaning is confirmed and to what you said, I just seems wierd to me that some people would rather accept a nonsensical ending over one that made sense, Even if it was just for headcanon. I have said that IF no DLC is released and this truley is the end with no clarification, no matter what, this is my headcanon.

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 17 mars 2012 - 12:36 .

[kailiea]

It was PTSD from watching all his friends die.....which is played up in certain dialogue sequences...

Also if you take into account that a scene was removed of your teammates getting vaporized at the portal..which fits the PTSD framework.

How could Anderson see the kid in the vent... the kid was hiding deep inside and Anderson was already ahead of Shepard clearing a path. I saw that posted video and all it showed me was an individual that spent waaay too much time grasping at straws.

I hate to say it but the ending sucked because they simply ran out of time and had to come up with something. Casey Hudson said they where working on the ending sequences up into November.

[Chuvvy]

I don't like them because they're full of plotholes and they're all the same.

Modifié par Slidell505, 17 mars 2012 - 12:38 .

[KILLER_CATTT]

Great post! I really hope this is how we are supposed to understand the ending. I'm a big fan of the ME universe and the ending made me really sad.
I hope to get some closure through a statement from Bioware or by DLC. Shepard deserves better.

ME3 is still a fantastic game with a fantastic story, just sad that the ending is the thing people will remember (in a bad way).

If Shepard is going to die (which I don't hope is the only option) it should at least be a spectacular and epic one and not what we got!

Modifié par KILLER_CATTT, 17 mars 2012 - 12:44 .

[Smiley556]

mushoops86anjyl wrote...

Plasma Prestige wrote...

 The indoctrination theory is the only framework which makes the ending even slightly coherent. Nothing you said seems overtly untrue, and I would like the DLC you described.

True. Without the framework of either indoctrination or a dream, the entire ending is basically nonsensical.

Exactly this. There is only one explenation to the ending so far which is indoctrination. Its how I experienced the game. I see no reason to disbelieve this if no alternative is given. And a random asortment of scenes patched together that makes no sense and form 10 plotholes is not an alternative... "I understand thats how you experienced the game and your explenation makes sense, but its not true, this explenation full of plotholes is." Thats pretty much what everyone trying to debunk indoctrination theory sounds like to me untill they come up with a better theory of their own.

[Tiax Rules All]

kailiea wrote...

It was PTSD from watching all his friends die.....which is played up in certain dialogue sequences...

Also if you take into account that a scene was removed of your teammates getting vaporized at the portal..which fits the PTSD framework.

How could Anderson see the kid in the vent... the kid was hiding deep inside and Anderson was already ahead of Shepard clearing a path. I saw that posted video and all it showed me was an individual that spent waaay too much time grasping at straws.

I hate to say it but the ending sucked because they simply ran out of time and had to come up with something. Casey Hudson said they where working on the ending sequences up into November.

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

[Smiley556]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

kailiea wrote...

It was PTSD from watching all his friends die.....which is played up in certain dialogue sequences...

Also if you take into account that a scene was removed of your teammates getting vaporized at the portal..which fits the PTSD framework.

How could Anderson see the kid in the vent... the kid was hiding deep inside and Anderson was already ahead of Shepard clearing a path. I saw that posted video and all it showed me was an individual that spent waaay too much time grasping at straws.

I hate to say it but the ending sucked because they simply ran out of time and had to come up with something. Casey Hudson said they where working on the ending sequences up into November.

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

Is it so wrong if I believe it and still dont like the ending? I mean, hey, best case scenario for me wouldve been I bought ME3, play it, finished it, and got an awsome ending to the series. That already didnt happen so indoc or not, I'm pretty bummed at this.

[Tiax Rules All]

Smiley556 wrote...

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

Is it so wrong if I believe it and still dont like the ending? I mean, hey, best case scenario for me wouldve been I bought ME3, play it, finished it, and got an awsome ending to the series. That already didnt happen so indoc or not, I'm pretty bummed at this.

no of course its not wrong. i have said here before. I don't care If you hate it, as long as you are hating it for the right reasons. if you believe Indoc theory and still dont like the ending then that a complaint for a different thread.

I am absolutly guilty of it at times but Id like to TRY to keep this as educational and constructive and not just a "tell me what you dont like and get it off your chest" thread. There are plenty of those. My favorite posts here are the "hmm i like this idea here but I got this question about this certain part and what it means"  

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 17 mars 2012 - 01:10 .

[SupremeLegate]

To be honest this does sound like the best explanation especially given those tweets, assuming those were Davs. In which case, I am VERY interested in seeing what come next. The main reason I believe this, or choose to believe it, is that I have yet to be disappointed with a BW game and given the level of story telling to this point it just does not make any since for the ending to be so....disjointed.

[kailiea]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

kailiea wrote...

It was PTSD from watching all his friends die.....which is played up in certain dialogue sequences...

Also if you take into account that a scene was removed of your teammates getting vaporized at the portal..which fits the PTSD framework.

How could Anderson see the kid in the vent... the kid was hiding deep inside and Anderson was already ahead of Shepard clearing a path. I saw that posted video and all it showed me was an individual that spent waaay too much time grasping at straws.

I hate to say it but the ending sucked because they simply ran out of time and had to come up with something. Casey Hudson said they where working on the ending sequences up into November.

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

I watched it and I am most definitely not convinced.

The deleted scene of your squad mates getting vaporized at the beam paints a far different picture.  Also the other statements of them working on the ending to the last minute screams it was thrown together.  I am glad people are finding solice in this fictional ending because truth be told they ran out of time and had to deliver something.

The ending is so ambiguous it could be interpreted any number of ways, which definitely plays to their favor and that is why it was done that way. 

I also believe a developer once said something about a galactice dark age...which most definitely happened. because that fancy space magic blew out every relay and vaporized most of known civilization.

Modifié par kailiea, 17 mars 2012 - 03:49 .

[Wolvy]

kailiea wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

kailiea wrote...

It was PTSD from watching all his friends die.....which is played up in certain dialogue sequences...

Also if you take into account that a scene was removed of your teammates getting vaporized at the portal..which fits the PTSD framework.

How could Anderson see the kid in the vent... the kid was hiding deep inside and Anderson was already ahead of Shepard clearing a path. I saw that posted video and all it showed me was an individual that spent waaay too much time grasping at straws.

I hate to say it but the ending sucked because they simply ran out of time and had to come up with something. Casey Hudson said they where working on the ending sequences up into November.

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

I watched it and I am most definitely not convinced.

The deleted scene of your squad mates getting vaporized at the beam paints a far different picture.  Also the other statements of them working on the ending to the last minute screams it was thrown together.  I am glad people are finding solice in this fictional ending because truth be told they ran out of time and had to deliver something.

The ending is so ambiguous it could be interpreted any number of ways, which definitely plays to their favor and that is why it was done that way. 

I also believe a developer once said something about a galactice dark age...which most definitely happened. because that fancy space magic blew out every relay and vaporized most of known civilization.

So out of curiousity, what would your opinion be if you found out you were wrong?    I only ask because there have been several tweets posted in this thread and on twitter. The mass effect feed also stated that Michael Gamble tweeted on his feed that if everyone knew what was in store, the reaction would have been different. I am not saying it's anything important or it could be nothing. I was just curious what your opinion would be if you were wrong. Personally even if this is the "true" ending I have come to grips with it and I am not letting it spoil the whole other 99% of the game for me or the whole trilogy for that matter.   But we all have different views on that and I am okay with that.

Modifié par ronbo_68, 17 mars 2012 - 07:04 .

[RagingCeltik]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Smiley556 wrote...

not to be pushy but watch this

If you cant get on board and this does not work for you then all i can say is im sorry you feel that way. I do believe you are wrong though and not allowing yourself to like the ending.

Is it so wrong if I believe it and still dont like the ending? I mean, hey, best case scenario for me wouldve been I bought ME3, play it, finished it, and got an awsome ending to the series. That already didnt happen so indoc or not, I'm pretty bummed at this.

no of course its not wrong. i have said here before. I don't care If you hate it, as long as you are hating it for the right reasons. if you believe Indoc theory and still dont like the ending then that a complaint for a different thread.

I am absolutly guilty of it at times but Id like to TRY to keep this as educational and constructive and not just a "tell me what you dont like and get it off your chest" thread. There are plenty of those. My favorite posts here are the "hmm i like this idea here but I got this question about this certain part and what it means"  

This is why I don't like the ending.  It's not as simple as "the endings suck".   The conclusion doesn't satisfy the story because the conclusions isn't a conclusion at all.   It's a climax.

[Bowie Hawkins]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Bowie Hawkins wrote...

ronbo_68 wrote...

Here is a question for everyone. I don't know Tiax but i do believe he has stated in another thread he started that if he is wrong about this, he will apologize to everyone.

And yet in the meanwhile he's continuing to be rude and condescending to those who disagree with him.

ya, know I MUST be rude and condescending because I don't really notice im doing it.

That could definitely account for why you chose a thread title that implied that anyone who disagreed with you had to be too stupid to understand the ending ofthe game without your help.

People not "getting it" isn't why they had a problem with the endings. The game not actually having an ending is why they had a problem - as I said upthread, it doesn't end, it just stops. You have chosen to decide that this means we're going to get the DLC that, despite your own admission that you have no proof that it will be made available, you insist will prove you right about everything. That's arguing by assertion (a basic logicsl fallacy), not to mention unduly arrogant for someone who has criticised others for not being able to provide evidence to back up their opinions in other posts.

It's entirely possible that the whole game was about the Reapers trying to indoctrinate Shepard, and the starkid was just part of that, but it's also entirely possible that the starkid was telling the truth. In one of your conversations with Javik, he reveals that the first sign of trouble in his cycle was their creation of synthetics, and in another he reveals that they were the ones that manipulated the rachni into being so vicious. Both of these are examples of the theme of the Created inevitably rising up against the Creator, and the timing of the Reaper attacks beginning soon after the Protheans' war with their synthetic creations indicates that war might have been what caused the Reapers to attack.

in the aftermath of the Rannoch mission Javik states that peace can never exist between organic and sythentic.

Also, the conversation that Shepard has with the dying Reaper on Rannoch where it talks about how the Reapers are te only hope that organics have of avoiding an otherwise inevitable doom could signify that the what the starkid said was true. All of these things are as much a part of the game as the things you based your conclusions on, and all of them lend themselves to equally valid conclusions.

Which brings us back to why you came across as smug and condescending: It's not just your refusal to treat seriously the possibility that you were wrong, but also the way that you proceeded from a presented asumption that the only legitimate reason why somebody might not share you conclusions was if they weren't bright enough to, and that you were helping the poor fools who just didn't "get it".

[Dom382]

I'm sure someone has pointed this out already, but the Ghost kid/Catayst/last minute plot point 's plan doesn't make any sense.

He believes that all orgainic life will evenutually be wiped out by synthetics. So his solution is to build an army of synthetics to systematically wipe out all orgainic life. How is that a solution? 

But I mainly hate the ending's because there is no choice. Whatever you pick, the Mass Relays are destroyed killing billions, The Normandy crashes somewhere and the crew get out (How did they even get back onto the ship?) and look like nothing is wrong, despite how Sheperd just died.