873 réponses à ce sujet

[111987]

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

[CavScout]

NReed106 wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...
But this is just speculation.  There's absolutely NO evidence that proves this is what will take place.

Actually you have no evidence it WON'T.

If your suggesting something will happen, you should support it instead of demanding others disprove it. It's kinda of basic debate 101.

 
Evidence of relays going supernova:
Arrival DLC

Arrival shows us what happens when you externally destroy a relay with an asteroid. Arrival doesn't show us what self-destrcuted relays do.

Evidence the ships are screwed:
Normandy is hit by the energy wave in EACH ENDING, and EACH TIME is stranded on the planet (how can an undestructive force damage the normandy so thoroughly? ) Common sense means that the same happens to ships orbiting earth

We do see the Normandy damaged by something while doing something. The scene is poorly explained.

We see in the good red ending that the energy wave doesn't destroy any other alliance ships, doesn't even destroy the reapers (deactivates them) and doesn't even hurt buildings or people on the ground.

In the bad destroy, it does vap everything, but that's why it's bad!

Evidence Earth doesnt have the capacity to sustain population
-Quarians and Turians eat different food (codex)
-Destruction of Reapers (what is seen, talked about, and common sense)

Earth's capabilities are not even addressed.

Where is your evidence everything is sunshine and roses?

Not being as dire as your proclimations is not the same as "sunshine and roses".

[ashdrake1]

pomrink wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

Witchfinder General wrote...

While the OP is effective it is also a red herring. It is rightfully proclaiming games as art, but it is also conveniently forgetting that games are consumer products as well. And it is a consumer's right to complain when they feel cheated in the sense that the product did not deliver what was promised.

I am confused, most art is a consumer product.  Be it paintings, movies, books or games the majority are sold.  Hence consumer product.  

This issue goes far beyond complaing, it is outright demanding as well as attacks on the company.

What's wrong with demanding it? It's a business. We can demand whatever we want from a business.

Nothing.  The issue is giving into these demands.  That is what compromises artistic integrity.  So what if you had issues with their story?  It's their story, they spent years telling it.  Pride in ones work is paramount to a true artist.  It is thier view they are expressing.  Changing it into something else because of complaints and money ( cause they will charge you for it) does not really reflect the views of the writers, but pressure from the publishers.

[Lmaoboat]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Hammer6767 wrote...

Admoniter wrote...

I don't consider myself part of the pro-ending movement but I'm glad that there are others out there that can respect Biowares stance of not compromising their vision for mass effect. I'll readily admit the presentation around the endings needs quite a bit of work, and I hope that Bioware puts the effort in to rectifying that. But I believe then endings in and of themselves are completely serviceable and IMO completely rewriting new endings would do just as much harm as good to the IP.

So while I don't outright support you OP I can respect and get behind your stance.

+1

This right here.  +1 so much.

I agree as well. I hate the endings, but I think if we made Bioware go against their own vision to make new endings, the result DLC wouldn't feel "real." The OP, however has an almost psychopathic ability to show unbelievable smugness and condescension all the while acting like a victim.

[MintyCool]

Shallyah wrote...

Hello OP.

Hello Shallyah.

Shallyah wrote...

I took the liberty to take five minutes of my free time to find a bit of where does that hipstery attitude of yours come from, as to insult about everyone as if they are incapable of apprecaiting art in such a high and mighty manner as you do.

So from what I can infer I'm a "hipster" because my opinion differs from yours....

While you have spent 5 minutes trying to belittle my thoughts and opinion about the ending of ME3; I've had to clear messages from my inbox with constant harassement, threats, and continual mocking of my ideas.

Every other post in this thread, I'm continually called a troll for simply not agreeing with Retake. What an awesome movment....

Shallyah wrote...
** Here is you bashing Dragon Age 2 with your hipstery attitude: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/4799687

You failed to convince anyone, apparently. Dragon Age 2 was a massive success.

I found Dragon Age 2 to be quite the disapointment. I fail to see what is wrong with that.

Shallyah wrote...
** Here's you calling doom and gloom over Mass Effect 3 multiplayer: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/323/index/8437526

Obviously you failed too, as Mass Effect 3 Multiplayer seems to have received massive acceptance, and the weekend event "Operation Goliath" has been successfully met, despite the backlash due to the endings controversy.

Again, apperently I "failed" for voicing my concerns over multiplayer. You would think this information would be cheered on by the Retake Movement since they are so open to other peoples insights on such subjects.

Shallyah wrote...
** And here is you explaining how Mass Effect as a whole sucks, and The Witcher is so much better franchise: social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/141/index/4536498

So thinking Witcher is a better series makes my point invalid with this topic...how?

Shallyah wrote...
You are quite the Bioware fan, I see. Ready to stab at every opportunity the company of which now you claim to be defending their artistic integrity.

Yes, I have varying opinions like any other human being. Again, I really am not following you.

Shallyah wrote...
Well, this time too, you have lost. Please feel free to contradict me, or be a hipster overanayzing what I said.

Actually I kind of agreed with you... and I'm still very confused. Maybe shoulda spent another 10 minutes perhaps trying make a point? Or was that just it? Another Retake Mass Effect member calling me....

troll.

I look forward to your response.

Modifié par MintyCool, 22 mars 2012 - 03:12 .

[ashdrake1]

Shallyah wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

Witchfinder General wrote...

While the OP is effective it is also a red herring. It is rightfully proclaiming games as art, but it is also conveniently forgetting that games are consumer products as well. And it is a consumer's right to complain when they feel cheated in the sense that the product did not deliver what was promised.

I am confused, most art is a consumer product.  Be it paintings, movies, books or games the majority are sold.  Hence consumer product.  

This issue goes far beyond complaing, it is outright demanding as well as attacks on the company.

Whoever is attacking the company does not fit with us. By us I mean those who are politely requesting Bioware to offer more information and closure on the current endings, and perhaps offer additional possibilities without completely rewriting what already exists.

You know who insults Bioware? The OP of this thread. Just follow some of those links posted in the past few pages of this thread to see the pretty namecalling and tagging Bioware's devs and about anyone who has worked in creating Mass Effect 2, Mass Effect 3 and Dragon Age 2 as incompetents. Even trying to convince the people of these boards how The Witcher 2 is a better game and attempting to force his views into Bioware's development of its products. So much for protecting the artistic integrity of Bioware.

Don't care.  It does not invalidate my view, anymore than you seperating yourself from the extremist on your side of the argument does.  I have seen plenty of people attack the company with the tag line of hold the line.

[Lmaoboat]

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

I joined the argument late, and assume it was over the whole "organics and synthetics will never get along" theme.

[CavScout]

durasteel wrote...

CavScout wrote...

...

Second, the Reapers aren't synthetic...

Of course they are. Just because they're made out of biomass doens't make them any less synthetic.  They are created beings, controled by AI. They're synthetic.

I wonder why you delete the other response that was paired with that... but in anycase...

Sovereign says they are the pinnacle of organic evolution. They harvest organics to add to themselves. Reapers are not synthetic, they are some kind of hybrid.

[johnnybravo2]

i strongly disagree with mintycool

[111987]

Lmaoboat wrote...

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

I joined the argument late, and assume it was over the whole "organics and synthetics will never get along" theme.

All I was originally saying was that the cooperation between Geth and Quarians is not necesarrily disproving the Catalyst's logic, because they did have conflict, and we have no idea if their current peace is sustainable.

[Cpl_Facehugger]

Why's this called Checkmate? I don't get it. I mean, okay, thread for the hundred or so people who actually liked the ending, yeah. But where's the checkmate here?

[Cloaking_Thane]

CavScout wrote...

durasteel wrote...

CavScout wrote...

...

Second, the Reapers aren't synthetic...

Of course they are. Just because they're made out of biomass doens't make them any less synthetic.  They are created beings, controled by AI. They're synthetic.

I wonder why you delete the other response that was paired with that... but in anycase...

Sovereign says they are the pinnacle of organic evolution. They harvest organics to add to themselves. Reapers are not synthetic, they are some kind of hybrid.

created by a god child....to stop synthetic destruction, even though shep had peace...good point

[Lexagg]

ashdrake1 wrote...
Nothing.  The issue is giving into these demands.  That is what compromises artistic integrity.  So what if you had issues with their story?  It's their story, they spent years telling it.  Pride in ones work is paramount to a true artist.  It is thier view they are expressing.  Changing it into something else because of complaints and money ( cause they will charge you for it) does not really reflect the views of the writers, but pressure from the publishers.

There is no such thing as ARTISTIC INTEGRITY IN CONSUMER PRODUCT.

[Tyrzun]

ashdrake1 wrote...

pomrink wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

Witchfinder General wrote...

While the OP is effective it is also a red herring. It is rightfully proclaiming games as art, but it is also conveniently forgetting that games are consumer products as well. And it is a consumer's right to complain when they feel cheated in the sense that the product did not deliver what was promised.

I am confused, most art is a consumer product.  Be it paintings, movies, books or games the majority are sold.  Hence consumer product.  

This issue goes far beyond complaing, it is outright demanding as well as attacks on the company.

What's wrong with demanding it? It's a business. We can demand whatever we want from a business.

Nothing.  The issue is giving into these demands.  That is what compromises artistic integrity.  So what if you had issues with their story?  It's their story, they spent years telling it.  Pride in ones work is paramount to a true artist.  It is thier view they are expressing.  Changing it into something else because of complaints and money ( cause they will charge you for it) does not really reflect the views of the writers, but pressure from the publishers.

#1 They work for us.  

#2 They advertised and promised a DIFFERENT ending and product.

Yet you dare mention integritty?  To do the bait and switch is UNETHICAL and not legal

You talk to an artist and he says he wants to sell you a painting of a tree, it's in this box you can't see, you pay them for it, take it home and open it up and it's a painting of a frog!  They do NOT have the right to sell you something different after you bought what was promised.  That is unethical and it is not defended by artistic freedom.  You are sold a Blu-Ray player you GET a blu-ray player, no one has the right to swtich it with a CD player.  it's that simple.

I'll repost ALL of the quotes from Bioware about what kind of ending we were going to have right before release if you insist. 

None of you have any grounds to stand on that make false advertising ok or ETHICAL while you scream about integrity...

[CavScout]

jonal11 wrote...

Just Hold the Line people. We are Commander Shepard.

Commander Shepard wouldn't cry over a video game's ending.

[Cloaking_Thane]

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

I joined the argument late, and assume it was over the whole "organics and synthetics will never get along" theme.

All I was originally saying was that the cooperation between Geth and Quarians is not necesarrily disproving the Catalyst's logic, because they did have conflict, and we have no idea if their current peace is sustainable.

Sure, but how is this any different than the sustainability of the Citadel races?

or Krogan....or any other free willed being...........no answer for this at all


God child proclaims inevitability, oniscience in the last 2 min lol be serious

Modifié par Cloaking_Thane, 22 mars 2012 - 03:08 .

[KTheAlchemist]

ashdrake1 wrote...

KTheAlchemist wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

You don't think at all a ending that is "forced" upon us is a tool to keep telling a story.  Shepards story may be done, but they have stated the setting will continue, and that we should keep our saves.  It as it always has been with every game in the series.  The ending is always the same, but the choices you make affect the story as it goes.

It doesn't really function in that capacity, though.

Let's say for the sake of argument that this doesn't create a devastated galaxy that is incapable of functioning (which goes back into plot holes, but okay). Let's say that they eventually create better FTL drives and the galaxy sloooowly creeps back up to where it once was and is a place where you could have a game of somewhat similar scope to ME1-3.

You've still got "Is everyone hybrid synthetic?", "Are all synthetics dead?" and "Are the reapers still around under the control of some weird disembodied Shepard-consciousness?". Three things that would grossly change the face of a future ME title to the point that it would probably be beyond even Bioware's means to create such a game.

Given this ending as is, if shepard's story ends and we go on to other stories in this universe that take place later, they're going to have to create a "canon ending" as far as that NEW series of games goes. Forcing us into a tunnel at the end doesn't solve that in any way. It actually makes the problem worse. A universe that's pretty much the same a hundred years into the future to what it is now, is much easier to work around and work player choices into in some fashion than a galaxy whose entire face is changed.

Meanwhile, my and many people's real problem with all this remains: If you're going to ram everything down to 3 off-the-peg choices in pursuit of some philosophical "point", you'd better not promise people something wildly different from what you're planning to deliver.

It really doesn't though.  It's pretty easy to write through.  Reapers never return.  Shepard basically  becomes a god in the control option.  Does not see a reason to return.   Synthesis convinces the reapers they are no longer needed and destroy is obvios.  No need for reapers.  

Even with the destroy option, godchild states we will still create synthetics.  So you do a skin swap for any robot people and change some dialoge.  Same for the synthesis.  It's not like these will be active topics if the place the next game a 1000 years from now.

Actually the problem is that they WILL be an active topic 1000 years from now. You do realize that the "robot people" you're talking about reskinning would be, in the case of a "synthesis" future scenario, every single living being in the galaxy, right? That's basically an entire 2nd set of art assets that only exists if you chose synthesis. Compare this to a history where Shepard saved the galaxy (since obviously a total failure ending would have to be non-canon if you're playing a future game) , but the differences are more did Shepard live, did Shepard die, what became of his crew members, et cetera. They're not saving themselves work or making future games somehow easier in any way with this...if anything we're more likely to get a "canon" ending.

[Dreogan]

Lexagg wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...
Nothing.  The issue is giving into these demands.  That is what compromises artistic integrity.  So what if you had issues with their story?  It's their story, they spent years telling it.  Pride in ones work is paramount to a true artist.  It is thier view they are expressing.  Changing it into something else because of complaints and money ( cause they will charge you for it) does not really reflect the views of the writers, but pressure from the publishers.

There is no such thing as ARTISTIC INTEGRITY IN CONSUMER PRODUCT.

I just made a sandwich from a jar of peanut butter! ARTISTIC INTEGRITY!

[Foulpancake]

1. Shepard, war torn and exhausted, leaped into the crucibles energy source sacrificing his life to intertwine existences between synthetics and organics.

well except the ending with the file name "shepardgood_lives" ya know...shepard lives...

2. The writing team behind Mass Effect 3 was able to elevate the narrative premise by weaving a philosophical debate about the relationship between organic and synthetic coexistence. The entire story throughout the third addition is laced with the ideas of life, harmony, and self preservation.

Self preservation huh? Too bad the galaxy ends no matter what colored lights you chose

3, The existence of The Creators vs. The Created.

3. Two camps are formed because of this instance. The story the writers wish to tell, and the fans who feel entitled to observe the story they themselves envisioned.

The writers, it seems, realized the message that they wanted people to take from this third installment. This had the team shifting the narrative focus to a more elevated dynamic.

The coexistence of Synthetics vs. Organics.

What except for the parts way before the game was released when they said that WE would craft this tale, not them? That every shepard would be different? That it was OUR story, not theirs? Did you miss that part?

4. To this end, Mass Effect 3 succeeds in weaving a narrative from beginning to end. To say otherwise is disingenuous.

Philosophical themes trounce the Neanderthal-dopamine induced urges people wish to see in this addition. Especially in the end game where this theme becomes the stories main focal point.

Honestly is a cameo appearance from Wrex for the 50th time really going to add anything to the finality of this story? No.

Ya, a narrative with the last chapter missing...just like the point here...the one you missed completely

5. Unfortunately I find a Star Wars Syndrome happening with this series. A fan base digesting every bit of corn fructose they can gulp down. Needing everything to be spelled out; desperate to know every last bit of information.

Why must one need to see Tali's face? Why do we need to know a detailed history of the Protheans? How come we need to see the Rachni and Krogan attack the enemy? Isn't the struggle of loss and war already inferred multiple times throughout the story? The focus of the end game is obviously being developed on a much deeper/different theme.

Midichlorians anyone? You do not need to know how exactly the force works...

This desperate need to dig up plot holes and inconsistencies from the hard core is entirely unhealthy for the series and its fans. All stories have inconsistencies, stories you tell to your friends are punched up exaggerations of what really happened. Your Facebook account is not a mirror image of the life you lead, but the life you wish you lived.

You had the chance to say goodbye to the entire main cast in one way or another. Multiple times is it mentioned/inferred that all races are about to battle the Reapers.

Needing to know a detailed resolution of what happens to everyone in the galaxy only dilutes the escapist reality the writers created.

Some things are better left to the imagination. Less is more and allowing the mind to explore possibilities is one of the great strengths of human thought.

I don't remember "choose your own adventure Star Wars" do you? Did you go to the theater and George Lucas popped out and said "You views will decide the fate of the galaxy!!! Behold!" ...ya you are missing the point...AGAIN

6. In the end, it would seem the Bioware writing team effectively succeeded in what they wanted to say in the Mass Effect saga. This is something I can respect. Instead of appeasing to the vocal mob; they finished the story on their own terms.

Mass Effect became a tale about cultural synthesis. The Mass Effect team was finally able to find this series a voice. Knowing this, makes me content that I have finished this series in its entirety; in the way it was meant to be seen.

And I enjoyed every minute of it.

I'm just repeating myself here, you're obviously so focused on how you're so much better than us because of the insults and childish names hurled at us hidden behind your use of large words and loquatiousness that you just can't see beyond your own prejudices, and that's sad

Checkmate

Have you ever played chess?...nm you don't really have a clue do you

Modifié par Foulpancake, 22 mars 2012 - 03:09 .

[Tyrzun]

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

I joined the argument late, and assume it was over the whole "organics and synthetics will never get along" theme.

All I was originally saying was that the cooperation between Geth and Quarians is not necesarrily disproving the Catalyst's logic, because they did have conflict, and we have no idea if their current peace is sustainable.

The entire argument is silly.

Whenever there is more than one of anything their will be conflict AKA disagrement.  If both have their own minds and desires.  For as smart as people want to pretend this subject is, it's really not.  It's simple and not complex at all.

Kinda like oppression.  Democracy is oppression.  Add 1 more to the 2 people and you have 3.  If 2 agree and the 1 does not, the 1 is the minority and oppressed.  The 1 won't like it and there will be conflict.

[Lmaoboat]

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

111987 wrote...

Lmaoboat wrote...

He said "Not without additional data that suggests coexistence is possible or desirable for the creators." And from a more metagaming standpoint, it would be one hell of a red-herring for Bioware to suddenly go, "JK, they were evil all along. "

What is your argument here? You said in ME2 the Geth were willing to accept back the Quarians; your own statements show this is not true. Not because the Geth were evil, but I never said that was why they wouldn't accept the Quarians back. I was merely pointing out that your claim was false as stated.

Unless I am confusing what you said with what another poster said, something i freely admit is possible.

I joined the argument late, and assume it was over the whole "organics and synthetics will never get along" theme.

All I was originally saying was that the cooperation between Geth and Quarians is not necesarrily disproving the Catalyst's logic, because they did have conflict, and we have no idea if their current peace is sustainable.

If it is sustainable, I thing it would really weaken the organics vs synthetics thing, which I found odd to go from recurring motif to main theme in the last 5 minutes anyway. If it's not sustainable, I think it would be a waste of a great character and a great subplot.

[CavScout]

Mahrac wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

CavScout wrote...

Cloaking_Thane wrote...
Pessimistic at best. You missed a key point about Legions conclusions and the realizations that they are self aware beings, EDI was for all intents and purposes human. Legion would have shot shepard as much as he would shoot himself. Indeed the paralells between Legion and Shepard are eerie,

Hell, Legion tries to kill Shepard if he doesn't support Legion.

Legion has the right to defend his life

True, but why not have the Geth fleets flee instead of commiting genocide if you side with him?

Why don't they? (other than it's not an option in game)

because they don't believe the quarians are willing to accept peace. ie. they believe that the quarians will hunt them down, so they commit genocide to prevent genocide being commited on them.

 Nothing we see in game suggest this. They're just being territorial.

if you convince the quarians to try for peace, the geth have no reason to continue the conflict, and the quarians realize their reason for war is false.

The Quarians just want to return to their homeworld yet the mean old Geth keep preventing them.

[DrNick1221]

Artistic vision is nice and all, but only if the majority of people can enjoy it in some form. If i was an artist and my vision was to take a video of some Bum using a powerpole as a washroom, the majority of people would not enjoy what i visualised as a great art piece. Mass effect 3 is that powerpole.

[CronoDragoon]

ashdrake1 wrote...

pomrink wrote...

ashdrake1 wrote...

Witchfinder General wrote...

While the OP is effective it is also a red herring. It is rightfully proclaiming games as art, but it is also conveniently forgetting that games are consumer products as well. And it is a consumer's right to complain when they feel cheated in the sense that the product did not deliver what was promised.

I am confused, most art is a consumer product.  Be it paintings, movies, books or games the majority are sold.  Hence consumer product.  

This issue goes far beyond complaing, it is outright demanding as well as attacks on the company.

What's wrong with demanding it? It's a business. We can demand whatever we want from a business.

Nothing.  The issue is giving into these demands.  That is what compromises artistic integrity.  So what if you had issues with their story?  It's their story, they spent years telling it.  Pride in ones work is paramount to a true artist.  It is thier view they are expressing.  Changing it into something else because of complaints and money ( cause they will charge you for it) does not really reflect the views of the writers, but pressure from the publishers.

Actually, Bioware has stated themselves that it is not just their story, but also the players. That together we have "co-created" the story. Whether you like it or not, Mass Effect is different than books. It is a series predicated on customer choice. They spent years making it, and we spent years playing it. Also, I would be more interested in defending their artistic integrity if the decision to end the game the way it did hadn't boiled down to 1. A deliberate ambiguity to stimulate internet speculation and 2. Forcing a bittersweet ending no matter what. No serious writer goes into a story saying, "I really want a bittersweet ending for this one, how should I end it thusly?"

[CavScout]

ashdrake1 wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

durasteel wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

durasteel wrote...

No matter which color you choose for the explosions, galactic civilization is plunged into a dark age--it says so in Mac Walter's notes. Without the relays, whole systems will be unsustainable, whole races will perish, and galactic culture and civilization as we know it has come to an end. Earth, in particular, will need a lot of help to rebuild just to a point of survival, and that help will not be coming. What few resources remain in the Sol system will be fought over as the various races of the "Victory Fleet" begin to starve and die, and it is anyone's guess whether there will be a human race left on Earth after a few generations. In his efforts to prevent the decimation of Earth and galactic civilization, Shepard has failed, regardless of whether he lives or dies or the Reapers live or die.

But this is just speculation.  There's absolutely NO evidence that proves this is what will take place.

I invite you to propose even one reasonably possible alternative. The technology of the Mass Effect universe is well described, and conventional FTL drives would cook a ship's crew with static on a trip between clusters, even if they didn't run out of fuel first. There is specific reference to how badly Earth has been trashed in the game. Turians and Quarians can't even eat Earth's protein. In Red or Green, the Citadel is demolished.

I may not have "proof," but you lack even possibility.

I lack possiblity?  Conventional FTL is a possibility.  The math's been done, and it's not nearly as far-fetched.  Sure, there is the refueling issue, but overall, conventional FTL is very much an alternative.  Also, as for the Turians and Quarians, the Quarians brought their liveships, which were normally designed to feed MILLIONS of Quarians.  I'm sure they could accomodate the turians.

Even more so as it was just thier military that fought.  Quarians are still on the home planet with the Geth helping them so far....

You better check your EMS stats....