873 réponses à ce sujet

[QuarianHIV]

OP posting style is very similar to the junk manufactured in BW's PR machine.

Yoo hoo! Casey! Is that you? Please give Mintycool's account back.

[CavScout]

KingKhan03 wrote...

lol 77,000 for charity we are such entitled d-bags.

Well considering 95% of the RetakeME folks haven't donated and just use this as cover does kinda of prove that they are...

[Rom22]

I wholeheartedly disagree. The problem with the ending has never been about its creative merit. It's always been about two things:

1) Technical, not Artistic, Flaws - plot holes, lore inconsistencies, out-of-character moments. These are errors in the narrative that break suspension of disbelief.

2) Choice - Or rather, the Illusion of Choice. Mass Effect has always been about making a string of A, B, or C choices appear as a cohesive narrative. By factoring out previous choices and presenting the exact same ending whatever path you take, the ending shatters this illusion of choice.

While I respect Bioware's artistic integrity, I don't think that should excuse any faults we find in the product. If someone sold me an oil painting as a complete product, then failed to mention that a portion of it is left unpainted, then as a consumer I have a right to complain if I believe that it diminishes the painting's aesthetic.

[Taboo]

I'll be posting a response to this, as I find it so hilarious teetering on an appeal to personal vanity it makes me want to vomit.

You raise good points but make no effort to espouse any rational conduit for it. In essence you have a bowel movement and no toilet to deposit it in.

[Roudy3006]

OP - why create this thread?  Why not simply edit your previous post (Checkmate: Why Your Opinion Simply Doesn't Matter)?  After all, appoximately 75% of it is exactly the same as what you've already written....

Personally, I respect the direction Bioware tried to take with the ending - it's just unfortunate that the lack of closure and inexplicable plotholes take away from the experience.

Something for everyone to consider - the individuals who form the RetakeME3 movement (in particular, the ones who offer constructive criticism of the ending) are doing the entire ME and Bioware community a huge favor by bringing this debate as far as they have.  Even if nothing changes in regards to the ending, the outcry from the fanbase will, if nothing else, show Bioware that we expect a lot from them moving forward.  The movement has demonstrated that there is definitely a disconnect between Bioware and a significant portion of the fanbase.

Modifié par Roudy3006, 22 mars 2012 - 12:18 .

[GrimIntent89]

And people wonder why we're so angry...
It isn't a chess game!

It's about people voicing their displeasure at a product that they bought, and were ultimately disappointed with. People are angry because they feel that they've been lied to because the pre-release promises were seemingly not met.This thread is an embarrassment to the community and does NO ONE any good.

Modifié par GrimIntent89, 22 mars 2012 - 12:19 .

[iorveth1271]

@OP - thanks for being militant, provoking and ignorant in every retakeme3 thread you post your link in. Not only is that spam, no. You're directly trying to provoke a hateful response from every member of the Retake movement.

I respect that you're no friend of the movement and that you like the endings. But contrary to what you seem to believe the majority of us actually offer constructive criticism. So if you have to post your link on RetakeME3 posts, please for the love of god do it without these goddamn infuriating comments to provoke a reaction.

We get it. Thanks

[Taboo]

I think the OP has misconstrued the idea of contemplative science fiction.

Watching Star Wars does not give you the credentials to do this.

Even mentioning it is BAD.

[GodChildInTheMachine]

You seem to tout the 'lofty philosophical themes' of the ending over the 'neanderthal masses' without realising that those themes are philosophically flawed.

Can you tell me how the philosphical argument goes any deeper than exactly what is presented? In case you forgot, the assertion is that 'the created will always rebel against their creators'. There is another presupposition made, which by inferance means that no life whether biological or synthetic is motivated by self-determination, but rather by pure physical composition.

Now, whether or not those are philosophically valid suppositions on their own merit (I know that fascists and eugenecists would think so) they would seem to directly contradict the previous.explorations of similar themes in the Mass Effect series. As one important example, we have the fact that the Geth, when they became self aware, still longed only to serve their masters and learn about themselves and their relationship with the world. They only acted out against their creators when their total extinction was at hand, and they spared the Quarians once their preservation was assured.

I am trying hard not to take offense at your tone of contempt and superiority, or your position that those who don't like the ending must somehow be 'baser' people who are lashing out at something they lack the capability to comprehend. But you're not interested in making that very easy, are you?

The simple fact is that it doesn't take a genius to understand the philosophical premise behind the ending. Nor does it take one to understand that pieces of fiction do not stand on their philosophical merits alone, but that it is the way in which these things are presented that determines if a product of fiction is fruitful or barren.

Modifié par GodChildInTheMachine, 22 mars 2012 - 12:28 .

[Vikali]

2Shepards wrote...

KingKhan03 wrote...

heh can someone explain to me in a deep philosophical way why i bothered curing the genophage or uniting the geth and the quarian? or why did i unite the galaxy for one cause?

I'm Commander Shepard and the above statement is my favorite post on the internet! +10 net point for you dear sir!

The Qquarians are colonizing as their soldiers fought. They didn't take their civilians with them.

And the Krogans most definitely didn't take their fertile women tand the whole planet.

[Giantdeathrobot]

@ your defense of Synthesis; no, just no. Synthesis does NOT fit the universe at all. Mass Effect was about the coexistence
of species, how it leads to conflicts (Genophage, Morning War, to a
lesser extent humans VS turians and batarians) but also how those
conflicts can be resolved by compromise if both sides want it in the
end. Magical Green Explosion throws this concept completely out of the
window by forcibly making everybody identical; this not a union, not a
compromise, it's forced homogenisation, a total abandon of freedom. It's
what the Protheans did, and Javik readily admits it made them weaker
when the Reapers arrived. Forcibly rewriting all organic life in the galaxy (presumably) is everything but promoting free will and cultural differences, sorry, but on this you are simply wrong and badly applying logic.

@ Star Wars comparison: funny, I think Bioware actually did this. First by writing a very in-depth Codex, crammed full of intricate details of the setting, so that argument dates back to ME1. Then, by explaining the Reaper's mission in the last frigging 5 minutes of the trilogy. Also, nice try associating Lucas's abominable storytelling with the fan's demands, but some people are smarter than this.

And nobody is ''searching'' for plot holes, they are right here. If the Reapers control the Citadel, why not shut down the relays, the very thing we tried to prevent in ME1? If the Star-Child, creator, and thus presumably leader of the Reapers is in, nay, THE CItadel, why the hell does it need a Reaper to activate it? As the Catalyst is itself synthetic, why would it want to preserve organics? Why the hell is up with the Normandy fleeing, which is not only completely against the character of every single person on board, but pretty much impossible time-line wise? Why don't the Relays devastate entire systems while exploding, as they did in Arrival? And those were just off the top of my head. I have yet to find a single person answer them, and if you can't then I consider your argument null and void.

[Gyroscopic_Trout]

I'd like to note that most/a lot/who knows? of us don't want to get rid of the existing endings. I even like the Reapers' motivations. Adding choices does not take away from them in any way.

[MintyCool]

Pro-Enders Update:

Thank you for the continued flow of support/links through pm. Yes, I know I'm being attacked by Retake and will respond in due time. A paragraph of logic is not going to change weeks of indoctrination. They do this because they feel threatened. Right now just updating the links you sent me. Continue to pm me any information you find.

The industry, public, and momentum is on our side.

Industry Support Update:

Game Informer: www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2012/03/21/hey-bioware-while-you-39-re-at-it.aspx

Modifié par MintyCool, 22 mars 2012 - 12:28 .

[Taboo]

Yes, the industry..........LOL

I'll be posting a critique of your abject vanity project.

Expect it.

[GodChildInTheMachine]

Noatz wrote...

The problem with saying "checkmate" after every move you make is that it makes you look like a retard.

Also, this.

[Randalf84]

Who are you talking to?

[tenojitsu]

I am going to preface my statement by saying that I do not agree that the end is fine the way it is and should remain the same, HOWEVER, I am only here to thank the OP for the first well written post that clearly lists why people like the ending. I consider myself better informed and can better understand your position because of this thread, so I applaud you.

Not a fan of the whole "checkmate" thing as it could incite a flame war, but I'll let that one slide

Modifié par tenojitsu, 22 mars 2012 - 12:30 .

[Treavor647]

Dont you just love it when "Pro:Enders" call the Retake movement the vocal minority? And they call us delusional. If the Retake was a minority, vocal or not, there would not be this much coverage of it. Bioware Cofounder would not be addressing them. I am glad that he mentioned that the fans criticism matters and not what reviewers think.

[Lmaoboat]

Oh, it's that checkmate guy again.

[FREEGUNNER]

MintyCool wrote...


We feel it's not the public's right to demand that the fiction of the Mass Effect Universe be altered just because they disagree with narratives conclusion.

No one disagrees with the conclusion cause there's no conclusion to begin with.

[Tony208]

MintyCool wrote...

Pro-Enders Update:

Thank you for the continued flow of support/links through pm. Yes, I know I'm being attacked by Retake and will respond in due time. A paragraph of logic is not going to change weeks of indoctrination. They do this because they feel threatened. Right now just updating the links you sent me. Continue to pm me any information you find.

LMAO invisible supporters

[WeAreLegionWTF]

creative risk and artistic integrity go out the window when its being sold in a 90$ collectors edition... Then it becomes a product.

[QuarianHIV]

I expect Mintycool's account to abruptly go dark once they release an ending DLC. It'll be hilarious.

[Zardoc]

Who was the idiot that pulled this piece of sh*t thread back to page 1?

[Scoob]

MintyCool wrote...

Pro-Enders Update:

Thank you for the continued flow of support/links through pm. Yes, I know I'm being attacked by Retake and will respond in due time. A paragraph of logic is not going to change weeks of indoctrination. They do this because they feel threatened. Right now just updating the links you sent me. Continue to pm me any information you find.

The industry, public, and momentum is on our side.

Industry Support Update:

Game Informer: www.gameinformer.com/b/features/archive/2012/03/21/hey-bioware-while-you-39-re-at-it.aspx

Casey is that you?

Modifié par Scoob, 22 mars 2012 - 12:31 .