178 réponses à ce sujet

[HellzMonkes]

really the only plot holes that are significant are

1. all mass relays are destroyed which = supernovas which would wipe out all life since all the systems are destroyed no one lives thee end

2. your squadmates who were on earth with you are back on the normandy...this sint star trek no beaming me up scotty

3. he can breath in space...........

4. synthesis ending is bull**** your telling me glowy green explosion and dust can just rewrite everyone's dna with out destroying them utterly and making them new i highly doubt it

5 sheapard lives after the citadel and crucible are destroyed....

the god child isnt a plot hole its just stupid....the guys from EA probably thought it up put their own EA twist on a great game

in short they need to just make a new ending which fixes all of this crap fallout 3 broken steel anyone

[Abirn]

DemGeth wrote...

It's not a Deus Ex Machina ending.

The crucible was not a Deus Ex Machina.  THe stupid god child was.

[Black Raptor]

grimgim wrote...
If the reapers wanted to be guardian, they simply could make an ultimatum. "Don't make robots or we turn you into goo!".

And 5 million years later when organics are stronger than the Reapers, what then?
Ultimatums only work when you are strong enough to enforce them and the other side is threatened by you. Your solution is only a temporary one. The Reaper solution was meant to be permanent.

grimgim wrote...
And why it has to be a war? Because the "flawless" logic of the starchild is supreme. Even though you are shown in-game that the geth did not turned against their creators, that they did not wiped out the quarians when they had the chance and let them escape.

Really?!

That is 300 years worth of evidence where the Geth did almost wipe out the Quarians. They didn't persue a peaceful resolution with the Quarians when it was obvious they were going to win, they just chased them away and attacked anyone who tried to get back.

The starchild has observed the evidence for several billion years seeing the same thing happen again and again. You are then trying to claim that the fact that the Geth didn't try to destroy the Quarians in 1 out of 3 times in the last 300 years compares to it?

Modifié par Black Raptor, 13 mars 2012 - 06:29 .

[Wrathra]

Why was my dead squad on the Normandy at the end? Did they wind up in heaven? I seriously thought they were implying they went to some space paradise and I was waiting for Shep to show up.

How come Mass relays no longer destroy their neighboring systems when they are destroyed (arrival)

Who is this god child? If the god child was in the Citadel from the start why the hell did the Reapers need Sovereign?

etc.

[Fishy]

1: Synthethic : Which mean every organic that exist and will ever exist. Which include every microbacterial form of life are now hybrid and every future form of organic life will also be hybrid? Hard to swallow. Space Magery is a great mocking way to define this.

2: AI God-Child : So you tell me from the start Sovereign and Harbinger were controlled by some AI residing inside the citadel for millions of years? It's made clear the Reaper need organic  for creating themselves. The Human Reaper they created in Mass Effect 2 were a direct result of collecting hundred of thousand of Human beings. They hunted Shepard for another reason which was never explained in ME3. I wanted his other half to play a larger role. They could have exploited this much more.

3: Shepard Allies the Geth and Quarians . Cure the Genophage(OR NOT) and make everything right between ever species .. But at the end he push da button that wipe out all his hard work .. WHY?

4: The Super Weapons was built by many different species. The protheans were not the first to start the super weapons. Each cycle added to it. Yet Shepard is the first organic to discover what the catalyst really is. What the Hell?

5: Dark Matter: ????????

[VirtualAlex]

Don't worry I am taking careful notes. Everything said here is refutable.

[Legendaryred]

Black Raptor wrote...

grimgim wrote...
If the reapers wanted to be guardian, they simply could make an ultimatum. "Don't make robots or we turn you into goo!".

And 5 million years later when organics are stronger than the Reapers, what then?
Ultimatums only work when you are strong enough to enforce them and the other side is threatened by you. Your solution is only a temporary one. The Reaper solution was meant to be permanent.

grimgim wrote...
And why it has to be a war? Because the "flawless" logic of the starchild is supreme. Even though you are shown in-game that the geth did not turned against their creators, that they did not wiped out the quarians when they had the chance and let them escape.

Really?!

That is 300 years worth of evidence where the Geth did almost wipe out the Quarians. They didn't persue a peaceful resolution with the Quarians when it was obvious they were going to win, they just chased them away and attacked anyone who tried to get back.

The starchild has observed the evidence for several billion years seeing the same thing happen again and again. You are then trying to claim that the fact that the Geth didn't try to destroy the Quarians in 1 out of 3 times in the last 300 years compares to it?

Not sure if you played ME3, but the Geth had very good reasons to drive the quarians ou tof their homeworld. Quarians were killing other quarians who did not agree with exterminating the Geth. The Get chose not to eliminate the Quarians, nor any organic until Sovereign showed up and brainwashed some Geth into fighting organics. Not enough Admirals on the Quarians side wanted peace, we saw them divided with some peace and some war. Legion very clearly said peace was possible, BUT you have that stupid other quarian i think her name was Xen, who wanted to make the Geth the servants of the Quarians again. Legion stated in ME2 that when organics thought they had the upperhand over the geath, 100% of the time they would attack. Not one single Organic species (not even the quarians) ever sought peace with the Geth.

[grimgim]

Black Raptor wrote...

grimgim wrote...
If the reapers wanted to be guardian, they simply could make an ultimatum. "Don't make robots or we turn you into goo!".

And 5 million years later when organics are stronger than the Reapers, what then?
Ultimatums only work when you are strong enough to enforce them and the other side is threatened by you. Your solution is only a temporary one. The Reaper solution was meant to be permanent.

grimgim wrote...
And why it has to be a war? Because the "flawless" logic of the starchild is supreme. Even though you are shown in-game that the geth did not turned against their creators, that they did not wiped out the quarians when they had the chance and let them escape.

Really?!

That is 300 years worth of evidence where the Geth did almost wipe out the Quarians. They didn't persue a peaceful resolution with the Quarians when it was obvious they were going to win, they just chased them away and attacked anyone who tried to get back.

The starchild has observed the evidence for several billion years seeing the same thing happen again and again. You are then trying to claim that the fact that the Geth didn't try to destroy the Quarians in 1 out of 3 times in the last 300 years compares to it?

How can the catalyst be certain that synthetics will wipe out all organic life for sure? The first batch of Reapers were created with that claim as a fact and they came to reset organic life every 50k years.

So the catalyst basically created a solution for a problem that may not exist. It doesn't make any sense really.

Modifié par grimgim, 13 mars 2012 - 07:17 .

[VirtualAlex]

How can the catalyst be certain that synthetics will wipe out all organic life for sure? The first batch of Reapers were created with that claim as a fact and they came to reset organic life every 50k years.

So the catalyst basically created a solution for a problem that may not exist. It doesn't make any sense really.

A. The catalyst and the reapers have seemingly been through this process thousands if not millions of times. Apparently there is enough of a track record of synthetics taking over that they beleive this is the only way to keep life around. It is actually very logical if you think about it. Machines ARE better than humans physically and mentally. Only makes sense for them to realize they should be running things. It is a pretty common Sci-fi trope.

B. Totally reaosnable that the catalyst is just wrong. Maybe THIS time is an exception. Why do you take it as fact? it is just something you are being told. The catalyst beleives it to be fact, but clearly there can be no proof that synthetics will for a fact take over. Shepard can (and does) disagree with this assumption when he chooses destroy and lets the universe take it's chances despite the threat of the cycle repeating.

The cycle might not repeat.

[bucyrus5000]

another major plot hole:
why go to earth to use the Reaper defended transporter to the Citadel, when we could just go to Ilos?

Plot hole:
If Casper-the little boy being of light can rearrange the citadel to serve his will, why didn't he undo the changes the Protheans made? Couldn't he have done Saren's job for him? Wouldn't he have notice the changes made to the keepers? Why not just destroy the Citadel or Shepard with his willpower and then remake the Citadel?

Modifié par bucyrus5000, 13 mars 2012 - 08:23 .

[N7Raider]

Lost Cipher wrote...

Deus Ex Machina ending.

no it's not, i don't like the ending either but I'm sick of seeing this term used wrong.  The kid that shows up at the end was not the solution to dealing with the reapers it is and always was the crucible, the kid did nothing but provide some plot hole ridden explanations about the reapers and explain your 3 options that's it.  The crucible only had to be connected to the citadel to work the kid didn't magically activate it or anything like I said he only gave some bad explanations and explain to you your 3 choices.  

[VirtualAlex]

If the kid is even real. Clearly the "kid" and the hole catalyst being the controller of the reapers is only Shepard dream.

[Archonsg]

N7Raider wrote...

Lost Cipher wrote...

Deus Ex Machina ending.

no it's not, i don't like the ending either but I'm sick of seeing this term used wrong.  The kid that shows up at the end was not the solution to dealing with the reapers it is and always was the crucible, the kid did nothing but provide some plot hole ridden explanations about the reapers and explain your 3 options that's it.  The crucible only had to be connected to the citadel to work the kid didn't magically activate it or anything like I said he only gave some bad explanations and explain to you your 3 choices.  

He isn't referring to the term but the GAME "Deus Ex Machina : Human Revolution" by Eidos. 

youtu.be/DibJL1F6S5k

Watch that and tell me ME3's ending isn't a rip off from THAT game.

Modifié par Archonsg, 13 mars 2012 - 09:39 .

[TFulls]

your basically autistic

[VirtualAlex]

My retort is complete. It is pretty long:

http://alexjuice.com...nding-explained

Modifié par VirtualAlex, 14 mars 2012 - 11:54 .

[Lunaluxlepus]

VirtualAlex wrote...

 I have seen literally hundreds of threads with people saying the ending is full of plot holes. But I actually don't know what plot holes they are talking about. Maybe people don't know what plot hole means?

Can you guys please tell me what the plot holes are? I don't want to rage against the ending, I am just curious what these "plot holes" are everyone is talking about but never going into detail about. A list would be wonderful.

Seriously?

Don't tell me you have not read this article

http://www.gamefront...fans-are-right/ 

[ShepGep]

1. The starchild claims that he has had TIM indoctrinated the entire time. However, if this is true, then why does he attack TIM's base in order to steal research data on indoctrination? I mean, he has him indoctrinated so what's the point? To provide TIM with the illusion that he's not indoctrinated and close to a breakthrough in indoctrination theory and controlling the Reapers? Why? You already have him under your control. Once again, what's the point?

2. The star child goes on about how organics and inorganics cannot live together in peace and harmony. Yet, you prove him wrong throughout the game getting the Quarians and Geth to work together as well as earning the loyalty of a rogue VI/unshacled AI in EDI. She even says near the end of the game that she would die for you and the team. That doesn't sound like organics and inorganics not getting along to me. Why didn't Shepard just say "What...are...you...smoking...?" to the star child and omniblade him in the face. That's what Commander Shepard would have done, not adhere to one of only three choices presented to him...which leads me to my next point...

3. Why are your only three options to control the reapers (TIM), combine organic and inorganic life (Saren), and destroy the reapers/mass relays (Anderson/Shepard)? All throughout the series Shepard has defied the odds and defied being backed into a corner and choosing between the lesser of two evils. He's the ultimate bad ass, plain and simple. He would have just been like "Well...um...okay then, if you say so..." like he did to the starchild. He would have omni-bladed him and did whatever he thought was best like, oh I don't know, relying on the 7K+ armada he's assembled to take down the reapers with 100% readiness? Oh wait...forgot...that doesn't matter at all in the end.

4. How does the Normandy escape the battle, with crew members who were all on Earth in London during the final assault? Better yet, why would they leave you to die on Earth during the epic final battle? They've been with you through thick and thin...then at the most important moment in the history of the universe they're just going to ditch and run?
 
So let me get this straight...the Normandy snuck into London past all of the Reaper defenses/assaults...picked up everybody but Shepard....then snuck back out past the Reaper defenses/assault...then somehow made it through a mass relay AFTER it blew up...and landed on a random planet that looked like something out of Lost? Am...am I missing something here? How is this not a plot hole if this is the real ending and not a hallucination to be expanded upon? LOL


Should I go on?

Modifié par ShepGep, 15 mars 2012 - 12:08 .

[brain_damage]

VirtualAlex wrote...

My retort is complete. It is pretty long:

http://alexjuice.com...nding-explained

Also, do you have to insult people who wasted some of their time to answer your questions?

Modifié par brain_damage, 15 mars 2012 - 12:16 .

[nitefyre410]

clonedoriginzero wrote...

DemGeth wrote...

It's not a Deus Ex Machina ending.

what? its pretty much the definition of deus ex machina.

that being said. deus ex machina is not a plothole, its just poor story writing.

 

 Its a Diablos Ex Machina... not a Deus Ex Machina... 

Here   
http://tvtropes.org/...abolusExMachina    


"This is not the convenient plot twist that saves our heroes. This is the convenient plot twist that makes them even more screwed."[/i]— Ryan MC, Two Evil Scientists

[SandTrout]

nitefyre410 wrote...

 Its a Diablos Ex Machina... not a Deus Ex Machina... 

Here   
http://tvtropes.org/...abolusExMachina    


"This is not the convenient plot twist that saves our heroes. This is the convenient plot twist that makes them even more screwed."[/i]— Ryan MC, Two Evil Scientists

To be fair, most people aren't as intimately familiar with the broad list of tropes to realize that Diabolus Ex Machina exists as a distinct trope. Not disagreeing with you here, just saying to cut a little bit of slack.

[Valah79]

http://www.gamefront...ns-are-right/6/

This article explains the plot holes and much more in detail.

[WeAreLegionWTF]

Modifié par WeAreLegionWTF, 15 mars 2012 - 12:25 .

[ShepGep]

VirtualAlex wrote...

My retort is complete. It is pretty long:

http://alexjuice.com...nding-explained

I hate pseudo-intellectuals who feel the need to attack other people in order to appear more intelligent than they actually are.

I guess I will have to expand since you have such a typical toolbox attitude and a feigned superiority complex. See what I did there? You're even defending Tali's cropped Google image photo now? Really? Your Bioware fanboy is showing through quite strongly. If they spent 1/10th of the time on Tali's face, something 95% of fans really wanted to see realized in-game via not a crappy cropped photo, as they did on Chobot then it would have been done quite well. No idea what you're talking about when you say how "diffcult" or "bad" that would be if they took that route to make it fully realised in-game...just blows my mind.

I'm with you on the indoctrination theory, however, the story just stops It's an amazing story that just simply stops. You assume that Shepard wakes up and goes on to destroy the reapers. You have no reason to believe that actually happens.
 
All you get is a lame-ass text message saying that "Shepard is a legend and has destroyed the reapers. Please buy our DLC when it comes out to embark on more adventures!" or something like that. You're cool with that? Really? There's no ending let alone an epilogue. The story just stops. What happens to Shepard, the reapers, the galaxy, your crew, etc. All you can do is assume.

This game was advertised as a final conclusion to the series and Shepard arc and what you get is a bunch of what ifs, maybes, and assumptions. By your standards, hah...well, Bioware could just just ended the game right before the Earth battle and sent a text message in everyone's inbox saying "Shepard is now a champ! He has defeated the reapers and saved the galaxy! Buy our DLC!" and it just takes you back to right before the assault of Earth again...you're all right with this? I'm sure you would be.

I personally love the idea of Shepard wrestling with indoctrination...however...him taking a breath in London then you assuming you just get up and go blow up and defeat the Reapers somehow is just a TERRIBLE ending and not even an ending, it's just an assumption. This series was as much about destroying the reapers as it was the personal relationships with your crew and your interactions with the galaxy around you. Therefore, how can there not be an ending explaining what happens during and after an ending if this is truly the ending to the game?

 Like I said, you have no idea how or if the reapers are truly defeated, what happens to your crew, what happens to the galaxy....nothing. There's no ending, let alone an epilogue to wrap some of these things up.

Modifié par ShepGep, 15 mars 2012 - 12:52 .