438 réponses à ce sujet

[Reaver102]

x Riddler x wrote...

Cyonan wrote...


Explain to me how Quarian Infiltrators are worthless.

You need to say more than "Sabotage is ruined and is bad". I need specifics.

Wow really kid? Lets see BioWare made Sabotage almost useless against the geth and turrents now. So what the hell is the difference bettween a Quarian and a damn Human. *HINT* THERE IS NONE. Quarians are now missing their skill which made them any good and to say that they are still good is to be ignorant! I would be ok with the buffs BioWare did to the geth to make them harder as a enemy but to buff them and then take away the skill that can beat them is just stupid! It takes 8 *EIGHT* seconds for your hacked geth to pull any aggro or even move/shoot! Thats from the 15 seconds that you have them hacked before IF ITS A FULL DURATION! For you to be fighting to see this is telling me that you fail to understand tthe full mechanics of the skill.

I believe you read it wrong no offense.  In those eight seconds your hack will still be moving and shooting the enemy, it just won't be targeted by the enemy until the 8 seconds ends.  The skill still works and is still worth using, its just not crazy op and game breaking anymore.  I do the feel the increase in cool down was a bit silly and unneccsary though.

Modifié par Reaver102, 14 mars 2012 - 02:25 .

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

The 8 seconds only applies to other Geth attacking the hacked target. Your hacked Geth will still attack other things during that time.

Other than one false point, you haven't actually said why Sabotage is bad beyond "it's bad".

Thats the POINT! I used it to also pull aggro when needed, LIKE WHEN A GETH PRIME AND HIS LESSERS ARE IN MY FACE!

[Cyonan]

GGW KillerTiger wrote...
Uh I think they also reduced the sabatoge skill to go from a duration of 15 to 10 seconds? ..... So yea that's 2 seconds of the hacked unit being useful to you? 0.0

It's a base of 10 seconds. It goes upto 15 second if you have the duration evolve. It also does damage for the entire duration.

[AreleX]

Blissey1 wrote...

you mean Geth prime shooting his buddies for 15 seconds, right? or are you one of the people who misread "enemies won't fire on hacked targets for 8 seconds" as "hacked targets won't fire on enemies for 8 seconds"

i was quoting what uk wildcat said earlier in the thread. some condescending bs about how 'smart people will realize geth primes won't attack for 8 seconds' or something like that.

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

GGW KillerTiger wrote...
Uh I think they also reduced the sabatoge skill to go from a duration of 15 to 10 seconds? ..... So yea that's 2 seconds of the hacked unit being useful to you? 0.0

It's a base of 10 seconds. It goes upto 15 second if you have the duration evolve. It also does damage for the entire duration.

Yeah because I use Sabatoge for damage right!?! ROFL Lets try CC next time!

[Cyonan]

x Riddler x wrote...

Cyonan wrote...

The 8 seconds only applies to other Geth attacking the hacked target. Your hacked Geth will still attack other things during that time.

Other than one false point, you haven't actually said why Sabotage is bad beyond "it's bad".

Thats the POINT! I used it to also pull aggro when needed, LIKE WHEN A GETH PRIME AND HIS LESSERS ARE IN MY FACE!

Your point is that the ability is no longer a free win button against Geth. You could easily cloak, hack one target and run away, or just run away if you didn't get the free power evolve for cloak.

Sabotage effectively CCing the entire Geth army(because they're now attacking the hacked targets) was absurdly overpowered. It needed a nerf. I might not think it needed all 4 nerfs it got, but it still needed a nerf.

[MatyrGustav]

Omg. The vandicator didnt need a Nerf. why oh why? That was my favorite gun.

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

Your point is that the ability is no longer a free win button against Geth. You could easily cloak, hack one target and run away, or just run away if you didn't get the free power evolve for cloak.

Sabotage effectively CCing the entire Geth army(because they're now attacking the hacked targets) was absurdly overpowered. It needed a nerf. I might not think it needed all 4 nerfs it got, but it still needed a nerf.

Congrats your got half my point now let me tell you the other half. Quarian Infiltrators are now complete Trash! No point to use them since the skill that they had that made them what they are is now nerfed to hell! Quarian Infiltrator was MADE to be used against the Geth, and on Gold if you dont have one on your team you are most likly not going to finish the challenge.

Modifié par x Riddler x, 14 mars 2012 - 02:45 .

[Wolfbane98]

Dachau Joseph wrote...

Excessive is not the word.

This is like nerfing Krogan melee damage in Rage mode, but instead of tweaking the damage, they remove his arms.

To be fair, a Krogan doesn't exactly need arms.  He can still pull most anything but a fully grown thresher maw apart... with his teeth.  

[Cyonan]

x Riddler x wrote...
Congrats your got half my point now let me tell you rhte other half. Quarian Infiltrators are now complete Trash! No point to use them since the skill that they had that made them what they are is now nerfed to hell! Quarian Infiltrator was MADE to be used against the Geth, and on Gold if you dont have one on your team you are most likly not going to finish the challenge.

You know, you have yet to actually explain why it's bad. Telling me that it's bad over and over doesn't actually count as a point.

and gold is still perfectly doable without a Quarian Infiltrator. It just isn't a free 75k credits with one.

[dividedbyn1ght]

What they need is a level requirement for Gold. I've lost count for how many times any level between 1-10 has joined a group and thought we were going to carry him.

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

You know, you have yet to actually explain why it's bad. Telling me that it's bad over and over doesn't actually count as a point.

and gold is still perfectly doable without a Quarian Infiltrator. It just isn't a free 75k credits with one.

Your ignorance amazes me! Ok here it is clear as clean air!

Sabotage Power
- Damage from weapon backfire increased from 150 to 200
If you use Sabotage for damage then you miss the point of the skill!
- Rank 4 weapon backfire damage bonus increased from 30% to 50%
Minor buff to try to make up for the MASSIVE nerfs!
- Maximum number of simultaneous hacked robots reduced from 2 to 1
HUGE nerf, making the AoE of it useless!
- Base cooldown increased from 8 to 14 seconds
Makes Sabotage no longer being able to save your life in a tight spot where all you can do is run away with cloak and on gold makes no difference since the enemy can still shoot you even though you are cloaked.
- Rank 5 cooldown bonus increased from 25% to 35%
Minor buff to try to make up for the MASSIVE nerfs!
- Base hack duration reduced from 12 to 10 seconds
Improved hack from 17 seconds down to 15 making the diminishing returns come sooner and maing the delay even more relevant *More on this below.
- Rank 6 Berserk upgrade damage bonus reduced from 100% to 50%
Now your hacked target does less damage and produces less aggro as a result, seeing as any Infiltrator should be using a high powered sniper rifle.
- Delay before enemies can attack hacked robots increased from 2 to 8 seconds
Sabotage can no longer pull aggro from you in tight moments because of this delay now. Also because of this your hacked target will just stand in one place for more then half the duration of the hack makeing him COMPLETELY USELESS! Do the math 15(for improved hack) or 10 sec - 8 sec of nothing means 7 or 2 secs of something, and thats to say the hack is a FULL duration BEFORE the diminishing returns!

Modifié par x Riddler x, 14 mars 2012 - 03:05 .

[Deathjam]

Hmmm..sabotage seems almost bugged to me now. I have found hacked targets still attack me, and then Geth Primes and Atlases most of the time pause for less than a second then resume attacking me, if they stopped attacking at all.

[Cyonan]

x Riddler x wrote...

Your ignorance amazes me! Ok here it is clear as clean air!

Sabotage Power
- Damage from weapon backfire increased from 150 to 200
If you use Sabotage for damage then you miss the point of the skill!
- Rank 4 weapon backfire damage bonus increased from 30% to 50%
Minor buff to try to make up for the MASSIVE nerfs!

These points are actually irrelivant as they apply to the backfire mechanic, which doesn't occur on Geth because they get hacked. It's a buff to QI for both Cerberus and Reaper forces.

x Riddler x wrote... 
- Maximum number of simultaneous hacked robots reduced from 2 to 1
HUGE nerf, making the AoE of it useless!

It does make the AoE pointless against the Geth. This would be one of the points I agree with.

x Riddler x wrote... 
- Base cooldown increased from 8 to 14 seconds
Makes Sabotage no longer being able to save your life in a tight spot where all you can do is run away with cloak and on gold makes no difference since the enemy can still shoot you even though you are cloaked.

Sabotage wasn't meant to be a get out of jail free card. That's what Tactical Cloak's job is, which I might add also resets the cooldown on Sabotage. If you Cloak -> Sabotage then Sabotage only gets a 3-5 second cooldown because it uses Cloak's cooldown.

x Riddler x wrote... 
- Base hack duration reduced from 12 to 10 seconds
Improved hack from 17 seconds down to 15 making the diminishing returns come sooner and maing the delay even more relevant *More on this below.
- Rank 6 Berserk upgrade damage bonus reduced from 100% to 50%
Now your hacked target does less damage and produces less aggro as a result, seeing as any Infiltrator should be using a high powered sniper rifle.

It's only doing 25% less damage, but it can attack without being 1 shot by it's allies for 300% longer. It ends up balancing out, probably in favour doing more damage provided that your allies aren't 1 shotting it.

x Riddler x wrote... 
- Delay before enemies can attack hacked robots increased from 2 to 8 seconds
[b]Sabotage can no longer pull aggro from you in tight moments because of this delay now. Also because of this your hacked target will just stand in one place for more then half the duration of the hack makeing him COMPLETELY USELESS! Do the math 15(for improved hack) or 10 sec - 8 sec of nothing means 7 or 2 secs of something, and thats to say the hack is a FULL duration BEFORE the diminishing returns!

Again, Sabotage wasn't intended to make you get out of a tight spot. We already have Tactical Cloak to do that. It's also worth noting that your hacked target does not stand around like an idiot for 8 seconds. He starts attacking immediately.

[Saboteur-6]

Cyonan wrote...

x Riddler x wrote...
Congrats your got half my point now let me tell you rhte other half. Quarian Infiltrators are now complete Trash! No point to use them since the skill that they had that made them what they are is now nerfed to hell! Quarian Infiltrator was MADE to be used against the Geth, and on Gold if you dont have one on your team you are most likly not going to finish the challenge.

You know, you have yet to actually explain why it's bad. Telling me that it's bad over and over doesn't actually count as a point.

and gold is still perfectly doable without a Quarian Infiltrator. It just isn't a free 75k credits with one.

He hasn't explained why the Quarian Infiltrator "is trash now" because he can't. He's just one of the many bitter that Sabotage is no longer an I win button.

[x Riddler x]

What do you expect EVEN the game knows that BioWare broke Sabotage, that's how sad it is now. BioWare just needs to put it back the way it was and stop worrying about if it makes playing the geth on gold too easy. How about then worry about how crappy the end of the game is and fix that with DLC.

[Mike Aus]

Hmmm, I'm glad I got the Unwavering achievement out of the way early after seeing this. Some of the modifications are significant (like adding another 1,000 odd to Pyro shields), not to mention the obvious ones with hacking.

I agree that the Geth were too easy to take down (made Gold feel like Bronze sometimes)...

...but the Vindicator?!?! Why, oh why? Barely anyone I know used it and it was my favorite because it didn't completely screw up your cooldown.

[Cyonan]

Vech24 wrote...

He hasn't explained why the Quarian Infiltrator "is trash now" because he can't. He's just one of the many bitter that Sabotage is no longer an I win button.

That's actually what I originally figured. I was mostly trying to point out that he was just complaining to complain and didn't really have an argument. Even when he broke it down point by point his argument is just that he wants Sabotage to be something that not only it's not supposed to be, but something that another of our abilities already is.

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

Again, Sabotage wasn't intended to make you get out of a tight spot. We already have Tactical Cloak to do that. It's also worth noting that your hacked target does not stand around like an idiot for 8 seconds. He starts attacking immediately.

Sabotage is a pure CC skill period! Tactical Cloak is where all your damage comes from. If you use the Cloak just to get away from enemys then you are failing to use it correctly!

How can I put this so you understand! ENEMYS WONT ATTACK YOUR HACKED TARGET THEREFORE FAILLING TO PULL AGGRO THEREFORE ENEMYS WILL STILL ATTACK YOU THEREFORE ITS NO LONGER A CROWD CONTROLL ABILITY!
How you can't understand this is mind blowing to me!

[Mike Aus]

Actually, come to think of it I get why the Vindicator was nerfed. I played as a Level 1 Engineer last night with the Vindicator and behind cover that thing ripped enemies to shreds...

[x Riddler x]

Vech24 wrote...

He hasn't explained why the Quarian Infiltrator "is trash now" because he can't. He's just one of the many bitter that Sabotage is no longer an I win button.

Fail troll, learn to read posts kid. ROFL

[Mike Aus]

Tactical Cloak can be used for both though, depending on the situation. For instance, I used the Vindicator to keep the cooldown low and only used Tactical Cloak to get points and run away from sticky situation. Because I didn't use a sniper rifle, it was never used as a damage buff much.

[FataliTensei]

I really hope they buff the drell characters a bit, I mean it's nice that they take half damage while dodging but their shields are soooooooooo low that it doesnt really help much. For an adept it's not that bad because you're generally not moving in but a vanguard it's really crippling, not the point of the character being non-effective though.

[Cyonan]

x Riddler x wrote...

Sabotage is a pure CC skill period! Tactical Cloak is where all your damage comes from. If you use the Cloak just to get away from enemys then you are failing to use it correctly!

How can I put this so you understand! ENEMYS WONT ATTACK YOUR HACKED TARGET THEREFORE FAILLING TO PULL AGGRO THEREFORE ENEMYS WILL STILL ATTACK YOU THEREFORE ITS NO LONGER A CROWD CONTROLL ABILITY!
How you can't understand this is mind blowing to me!

The thing is that Tactical Cloak is used for damage and getting out of things.

If you think otherwise, you're ignoring the whole part where you become invisible with that ability. If it was a pure damage thing, it would just say "Your next attack does 90-140% more damage".

[x Riddler x]

Cyonan wrote...

The thing is that Tactical Cloak is used for damage and getting out of things.

If you think otherwise, you're ignoring the whole part where you become invisible with that ability. If it was a pure damage thing, it would just say "Your next attack does 90-140% more damage".

Right and because you still dont get shot when playing on Gold right even though you are "invisible" right?

P.S. nothing to post on that delay for Sabotage now huh? Now do you understand it!

Modifié par x Riddler x, 14 mars 2012 - 03:39 .