438 réponses à ce sujet

[plebeianprint]

So, despite being my favorite class, I've always thought that the Infiltrator was almost too strong a class; The quarian infiltrator against geth was even more so.

Does that buy my following statement some legitimacy? You've carried this nerf too far. Geth kicked our butt on silver tonight, after doing so on gold, as well. We don't lose on silver. Not even to reapers. Geth hunters are invisible, staggering tanks with way too much shields now.

I hope that with time, like most nerfs, the geth/quarian infiltator synergy will find a more moderate relationship.

[AlphaJarmel]

They definitely broke QI. I think I'm going to go Engineer or something until I get Salarian Infiltrator.

[Sereaph502]

Geth are overpowered even on bronze.

Too many geth pyros + hunters. They have too much health even on bronze for how fast they swarm and kill you. You can't even run away because the pyro flamethrower does damage to you well out of range, and you'll probably just end up running/rolling into another geth pyro or hunter anyway.

This was with a quarian infiltrator btw, as well as with 3 other level 20ish players all with gold/N7 weapons.

Modifié par Sereaph502, 14 mars 2012 - 08:14 .

[QcumberR]

"They definitely broke QI"--in what way? your sabotage will only have a slightly increased cooldown if you're running recharge speed or light equipment (or both). not being able to hack two enemies at once means that you'll be actually required to fire bullets/powers at things for them to die, rather than just hacking a squad of geth pyros and having them kill a prime in about five seconds. other than that, the infiltrator is still an amazing class with a lot of versatility, even if only because it can cloak.

the geth buffs are also necessary to bring them in line with cerberus (though the reapers are still the strongest of the three by a significant amount). they were by far the easiest enemies to deal with even without a squad of infiltrators or engineers spamming sabotage/overload/energy drain/(black) widow.

this patch is a good thing; the nerfs and buffs were not too severe and it addressed some weaknesses in the multiplayer balance.

[Spaceguy5]

QcumberR wrote...

"They definitely broke QI"--in what way? your sabotage will only have a slightly increased cooldown if you're running recharge speed or light equipment (or both). not being able to hack two enemies at once means that you'll be actually required to fire bullets/powers at things for them to die, rather than just hacking a squad of geth pyros and having them kill a prime in about five seconds. other than that, the infiltrator is still an amazing class with a lot of versatility, even if only because it can cloak.

the geth buffs are also necessary to bring them in line with cerberus (though the reapers are still the strongest of the three by a significant amount). they were by far the easiest enemies to deal with even without a squad of infiltrators or engineers spamming sabotage/overload/energy drain/(black) widow.

this patch is a good thing; the nerfs and buffs were not too severe and it addressed some weaknesses in the multiplayer balance.

(1) Even firing bullets isn't enough when there's lots of enemies in an area, especially if there's a geth prime
(2) Hahaha, what powers? We have a grenade. It's not very useful though and it's limited use.
(3) I disagree with the "easiest enemy" part. I think Cerberus is/was easier. For one thing, they're a heck of a lot easier ot kill.
(4) I also highly disagree that they "were not too severe" because I'm having a very, very hard time getting rid of Geth on gold and even silver now.

This patch kinda killed my will to play Multiplayer which is a shame because I was starting to like it |=

[Legato 0021]

Spaceguy5 wrote...

QcumberR wrote...

"They definitely broke QI"--in what way? your sabotage will only have a slightly increased cooldown if you're running recharge speed or light equipment (or both). not being able to hack two enemies at once means that you'll be actually required to fire bullets/powers at things for them to die, rather than just hacking a squad of geth pyros and having them kill a prime in about five seconds. other than that, the infiltrator is still an amazing class with a lot of versatility, even if only because it can cloak.

the geth buffs are also necessary to bring them in line with cerberus (though the reapers are still the strongest of the three by a significant amount). they were by far the easiest enemies to deal with even without a squad of infiltrators or engineers spamming sabotage/overload/energy drain/(black) widow.

this patch is a good thing; the nerfs and buffs were not too severe and it addressed some weaknesses in the multiplayer balance.

(1) Even firing bullets isn't enough when there's lots of enemies in an area, especially if there's a geth prime
(2) Hahaha, what powers? We have a grenade. It's not very useful though and it's limited use.
(3) I disagree with the "easiest enemy" part. I think Cerberus is/was easier. For one thing, they're a heck of a lot easier ot kill.
(4) I also highly disagree that they "were not too severe" because I'm having a very, very hard time getting rid of Geth on gold and even silver now.

This patch kinda killed my will to play Multiplayer which is a shame because I was starting to like it |=

I'm kind of with spaceguy on this one.
I did a whole bunch of gold runs and although the QI made fighting geth easier on gold.... nerfing her ability that bad was completely uncalled for. The game is about having fun not about balancing something that really doesn't even give you a 100% sure win. The geth needed a buff but when you start adding 4k to health AND shields for almost every unit on Gold for geth you obviously should rasie some serious questions to what they are doing down at Bioware.

The geth weren't the hardest enemy, but they sure as hell made it so people who can't do Gold runs a hell of a chance to finally be able to do that. So what if people farmed Gold with QIs against Geth. All Bioware really did here was screw over all those players that want to play Gold and don't have any friends to do it with. The QI for randoms made fighting geth do-able. Now with the update you defintly need to pray for people to have mics and are smart enough to use characters to help one another.

All in all Bioware seems to forget this is a game that multiplayer will not last forever..... taking away things that make people happy for reasons of 'balancing' is just silly. Besides, even with a QI before the patch Geth on Gold wasn't a 100% sure thing like I already stated. (: Still requires firing and running from cover to cover.

[Lycidas]

Legato 0021 wrote...
...
The geth weren't the hardest enemy, but they sure as hell made it so people who can't do Gold runs a hell of a chance to finally be able to do that. So what if people farmed Gold with QIs against Geth. All Bioware really did here was screw over all those players that want to play Gold and don't have any friends to do it with. The QI for randoms made fighting geth do-able. Now with the update you defintly need to pray for people to have mics and are smart enough to use characters to help one another.

All in all Bioware seems to forget this is a game that multiplayer will not last forever..... taking away things that make people happy for reasons of 'balancing' is just silly. Besides, even with a QI before the patch Geth on Gold wasn't a 100% sure thing like I already stated. (: Still requires firing and running from cover to cover.

Exactly. In the game as it is credit farming is what people do so they may finally get the weapon / race they want to play with. Punishing those who like to play in public groups (the majority) on demand of those who want to mostly feel elite for being able to handle Gold with their group of friends is not a good idea.

[Aeduz]

QcumberR wrote...

"They definitely broke QI"--in what way? your sabotage will only have a slightly increased cooldown if you're running recharge speed or light equipment (or both). not being able to hack two enemies at once means that you'll be actually required to fire bullets/powers at things for them to die, rather than just hacking a squad of geth pyros and having them kill a prime in about five seconds. other than that, the infiltrator is still an amazing class with a lot of versatility, even if only because it can cloak.

the geth buffs are also necessary to bring them in line with cerberus (though the reapers are still the strongest of the three by a significant amount). they were by far the easiest enemies to deal with even without a squad of infiltrators or engineers spamming sabotage/overload/energy drain/(black) widow.

this patch is a good thing; the nerfs and buffs were not too severe and it addressed some weaknesses in the multiplayer balance.

They broke them because the only real thing QI were good at is now gone, and there are more viable solutions for it. Salarian Engineer Decoy is basically doing what the QI did before but better, yeah the Decoy won't kill other Geth, but you only need it for the distraction to pick the Geth off. The SE makes things just as trivial, so 1 of those for CC + Salarian Infiltrator is just as bad as 2 QI pre-nerf. It makes no difference to farmers, just makes 1 class useless. 

They either need to buff Sabotage v.s. Cerberus & Reapers or get rid of it and give them something else. 

[thefiresidecat]

I haven't had a chance to use sabotage in the MP but in the game the hacked ai never shoots at it's kin. it always just stands there. totally useless.

[We Tigers]

Pyros take forever to kill now, even on silver. Yeesh. I don't even have a QI, but I enjoyed playing against geth because they were a weak defense/high damage opponent, a unique challenge. Now they're high defense/high damage.

Playing against geth now feels a bit like playing ME1 on insanity, when every enemy had a mountain of HP and damage reduction--it's not really hard, but it's fairly tedious. Shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot etc., etc.

[Raycer X]

Even though a nerf was painfully obvious, buffing the Geth to this level is a little too much imo. Nerfing Sabotage? Fine, whatever, it just made playing QI require a bit more skill.

Buffing Geth to the point that they have a lot of health and shields in addition to making hunters faster, well, that's kind of going a bit overboard. I mean, hunters already have their stealth cloaks to begin with so they have a much better chance of sneaking up on a player.

No, I'm not going to even bother about their rapid fire shotgun that can tear apart a full shield in one single shot.

Pyros did need a bit more buff, but the sheer amount of them is just overwhelming at times. The rocket troopers and geth prime all have explosive AoE weaponry so I don't think they needed buffs.

If anything, storyline wise, Geth are supposed to be immune to hacking, so what I want to know is one thing: Are there diminishing returns for sabotaging Geth as a whole during a wave? If not, why wasn't this implemented?

Edit: If diminishing returns were implemented so that sabotage became less effective versus Geth during one particular wave, why not nerf Geth shields and heatlh a tiny bit? Hell, I wouldn't mind a reversion of the geth rocket troopers, prime, and hunters. Keep the pyros as they are right now

Modifié par Raycer X, 14 mars 2012 - 01:00 .

[Legato 0021]

We Tigers wrote...

Pyros take forever to kill now, even on silver. Yeesh. I don't even have a QI, but I enjoyed playing against geth because they were a weak defense/high damage opponent, a unique challenge. Now they're high defense/high damage.

Playing against geth now feels a bit like playing ME1 on insanity, when every enemy had a mountain of HP and damage reduction--it's not really hard, but it's fairly tedious. Shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot etc., etc.

I believe this guy right here should be quoted for every post here on.....
Just saying.
Really has powerful arguement in my opinion.

[claughane]

Apollys wrote...

I love how quickly they jump to fix something that makes it easier to acquire some credits, but completely ignore the hundreds of severe glitches littering this game.

[Legato 0021]

claughane wrote...

Apollys wrote...

I love how quickly they jump to fix something that makes it easier to acquire some credits, but completely ignore the hundreds of severe glitches littering this game.

[Lycidas]

claughane wrote...

Apollys wrote...

I love how quickly they jump to fix something that makes it easier to acquire some credits, but completely ignore the hundreds of severe glitches littering this game.

Because it takes time to actually locate and fix the bug in coding and even more time to test and deliver the fixes. Throwing around some HP, damage and cool-down numbers in a spreadsheet / database can be done quickly.

[AgamenonAtreides]

AgamenonAtreides wrote...

Guys u dont understand how works EA...

As they made on Battlefield Play 4 Free, they first nerf all guns and classes, then make a DLC or new weapons and classes than are OP.. then again they nerf the new weapons for make another DLC with other weapons..

And dont underestimate EA because all know the changes are made by Bioware but the Fly behind the hear is EA telling them what do for take money fast as hell overall.

They dont have any problem in ruin a game or a Saga just for take 1$ more

As i said before..

[jimmyw404]

After playing last night with my QI the only problem I have is with pyros. Those things are damage sponges.

[Fortack]

We Tigers wrote...

Playing against geth now feels a bit like playing ME1 on insanity, when every enemy had a mountain of HP and damage reduction--it's not really hard, but it's fairly tedious. Shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot shoot etc., etc.

ME3 (Gold / Insanity) is ME1 Insanity with ME2 powers on a one second cooldown. Plus nearly every combination of powers results in an explosion. Tactics are pointless, teamwork (besides reviving buddies) is pointless, shooting is (almost) pointless. It's spamming one or two powers every couple seconds for an eternity. Having to kill a single enemy 10 times ain't fun or challenging - tedious is what it is

[Rikishi141]

Heather Cline wrote...

I believe there is some problems with unlocks still. There aren't any customization packs dropping for unlocked characters. Like patterns, skin colors for Asari and other aliens with faces. Color changes for Lights and so on. I've been playing MP on and off and earning quite a bit of credits. I've bought several Spectre packs, Veteran packs and even Recruit packs and all I usually get are either exp boosts, weapons or a character unlock but no customization packs for armor and skin or lights. Only ones that get lights, patterns and armor stuff seems to be soldiers or Vanguards. Everyone else I have for options don't even get those.

Can this be fixed?

Thanks.

This is simply not true, I have an Asari Adept with the patterns etc. unlocked, my mate does too, you are just having a stroke of bad luck.

[OCD Skifer]

 oh wow, thanks for wrecking my favorite class...the quarian is justabout useless now...it was PERFECTLY balenced before....

Modifié par OCD Skifer, 14 mars 2012 - 02:25 .

[DblIncertion]

Boo. . . . My hair is a bird.

[SuperADJ]

After the good first balance update this one has me a bit baffled.

Glad they looked at SMGs, although I'm still not sure they actually belong in anyone's arsenal. I guess time will tell. The Vindicator wasn't OP really, just an attractive option for certain classes who wanted to keep CD reasonable without having to resort to a pistol. One or the other nerfs could have been applied, but by increasing its weight AND decreasing the damage I can't see anyone using it. So, back to the pistols, then!

As for the Geth, well I wondered why we were having unexpected difficulty with them on Silver last night! But I welcome the change, they are now up to par in comparison with the other enemies. To be honest I don't agree they need a sniper-type enemy, the rocket troopers are now quite formidable and the close-range units are very nasty.

So, onto the QI. I'll reserve judgement here as I've never played it. But, from reading the 17 pages of debate, I can see both sides of the argument. It seems a nerf was needed (just buffing the Geth wouldn't have sufficed for obvious reasons) but BioWare do appear to have gone a bit wild with it. Seems like there isn't much point in picking the Quarian over the other Infiltrators, even against the Geth, which is a shame as that was (and should be) their specialty. Seems a bit like the Human Sentinel...will still be fun but is ultimately a bit pointless.

My biggest concern, though, is this. BioWare have positively jumped on an exploit that allowed players to obtain credits relatively easily. Meanwhile, a problem that has seen players lose their rewards (and, therefore, their money) seems not to matter. I wonder if they would have been so quick in nerfing the QI if the option to buy credits wasn't there? It smacks more of money-grabbing than game balancing, as far as I can see.

[Lionheartwolf]

seriously, the key word here is "Balance" there was nothing balanced about the Quarian Infiltrators and Geth. Anybody who thinks there was just wanted a cheap way to farm gold. if the words "EASY" and "GOLD" are in the same sentence its most likely because its not "BALANCED" just be happy you got the credits you got and move on. i highly suggest not wasting your time looking for the next quirk that lets you abuse the system and actually work on getting better on things that cant be patched, like learning teamwork, and the basic abilities of all your classes. its how the game was designed to be played and its what bioware is going to keep doing in order to preserve that. if you dont like it i suggest either playing offline so you can exploit all you want, or look for a different game.

[Cloaking_Thane]

Actually 10-12/ Wave 8&9

-Primes
-Banshee/Brute
-Phantom, Atlas's

It's not particularly challenging other than the cheap insta-kills they use and volume. The mechanics of defeating them remain the same.

Alternatively a team with 20 Cobra missles will laugh at any gold game....

Nerf Cobra Missles? I can stock up on a few hundred right now

Modifié par Cloaking_Thane, 14 mars 2012 - 03:53 .

[Kopikatsu]

SuperADJ wrote...

After the good first balance update this one has me a bit baffled.

Glad they looked at SMGs, although I'm still not sure they actually belong in anyone's arsenal. I guess time will tell. The Vindicator wasn't OP really, just an attractive option for certain classes who wanted to keep CD reasonable without having to resort to a pistol. One or the other nerfs could have been applied, but by increasing its weight AND decreasing the damage I can't see anyone using it. So, back to the pistols, then!

As for the Geth, well I wondered why we were having unexpected difficulty with them on Silver last night! But I welcome the change, they are now up to par in comparison with the other enemies. To be honest I don't agree they need a sniper-type enemy, the rocket troopers are now quite formidable and the close-range units are very nasty.

So, onto the QI. I'll reserve judgement here as I've never played it. But, from reading the 17 pages of debate, I can see both sides of the argument. It seems a nerf was needed (just buffing the Geth wouldn't have sufficed for obvious reasons) but BioWare do appear to have gone a bit wild with it. Seems like there isn't much point in picking the Quarian over the other Infiltrators, even against the Geth, which is a shame as that was (and should be) their specialty. Seems a bit like the Human Sentinel...will still be fun but is ultimately a bit pointless.

My biggest concern, though, is this. BioWare have positively jumped on an exploit that allowed players to obtain credits relatively easily. Meanwhile, a problem that has seen players lose their rewards (and, therefore, their money) seems not to matter. I wonder if they would have been so quick in nerfing the QI if the option to buy credits wasn't there? It smacks more of money-grabbing than game balancing, as far as I can see.

Bugs (Especially bugs in which the developers have admitted to not knowing what causes it) are significantly more difficult to fix than making balance changes. They don't have a magic wand that they can point at a computer and fix all of the bugs instantly. Balance changes only require a few value alterations.

Modifié par Kopikatsu, 14 mars 2012 - 06:09 .