181 réponses à ce sujet

[v0rt3x22]

Lethys1 wrote...

All of this means I purchased a game wihout an ending......

Why is anyone happy about this being true if it's the case???

I posted it before, and I'll gladly post it again -

For a guy that's been a survivor throughout 3 games - someone that manages to bring down Sovereign, killed Saren, survived the collectors, survived a 1:1 fight with a Reaper - I honestly think this is an absolutely great plot twist.

Consider the fact that when the Asari World is lost - we see a completely new side to Shepard.
He's sick of Cerberus, he's sick of the War - he's in need of a much deserved break -
and he even gets sick at Jeff's Jokes.

Shepard is exhausted - and not that 'Super Hero'-I Survive-Everything - kind of guy anymore.

To have him (in a way) 'finally' succumb to the Reapers through indoctrination - and thereby highlighting the fact that Shepard always was 'Just Human' - is - for me - such a way better ending than what we all came to expect:

-> Go to the Citadel
-> Activate the Crucible
-> War over.

It would have been almost predictable.

Modifié par v0rt3x22, 13 mars 2012 - 11:24 .

[Rawgrim]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

The ghostly visions are in the dream sequences. Benezzia also mentions the whisperings, in ME1. The whispers in the dream sequences just increases in eac sequence. On Rannoch Shep talks to the reaper. Tali doesn`t seem to notice the conversation at all. She is close to the reaper, and he hears "alien voices in his head".

Reaper: Shepard.
Shepard: You know who I am?
Reaper: Harbinger speaks of you. You resist. But you will fail.

Interesting choice of words too.

Strange things happen in dreams. The whispers are those of characters who you have met, and are mostly from those who died. In the second and third, you hear Mordin's voice. The ghosts are simply Bioware representing those who have died fighting the Reapers.

There's no indication that Tali can't hear the Reaper; its simply not her the Reaper is talking to, and even a dying Reaper is something you'd be afraid to be near. Surely if the voice was in Shepard's head, Tali would ask what Shepard is replying to?

You are resisting the Reapers by fighting the Cycle.

None of those things prove the indoctrination theory. I agree that they suggest it, if you ignore all the stuff I pointed out, but there are logical explanations for all of those things besides indoctrination. 

You also see that black energy stuff all about in the dream. the same stuff you se when you talk to the illusive man in the citadel. odd coincidence that. Especially given the Rachni queen`s description of indoctrination.

[Asepsis]

Legendaryred wrote...

Yea, there is no way the crucible would know about the kid that shepard saw died.

I thought this was odd too, I figured the AI was somehow reading Shepard's mind and creating a form that Shepard would be sympathetic too, the fact Shepard kept dreaming about the kid was interesting too.

I think Shepard was indocrinated, it's the only logical explanaiton of why he/she would suddenly take everything the AI controller of all Reapers at face value. Also, did anyone else get the feeling the AI was trying to protect itself? Why else would it destroy all organic life to PREVENT more synthetics from rising to destroy organic life? The Reapers just want to stay in control, nothing noble about that. (I hated that the stinkin' Reaper AI was trying to act all noble, yeaaaa right)

[arisian]

Okay, look, when an author makes a total mess of a plot, after a certain point the only way to fix things is to just say "it was all a dream" and pretend that a bunch of stuff never happened.  The ending is a mess in terms of plot holes, and I agree that "it was all a dream" is about the only way to make the endings "make sense" given what we know about the universe.

But.

If the indoctrination theory is true, then Sheppard never made it to the citadel, and never activated the catalyst.  This means that, based on the game I bought (and not some hypothetical continuation), the reapers win, everyone dies, and the *entire trilogy* was one giant "shoot the shaggy dog" story.  That would be about the worst thing an author could do to an audience.  At least if the endings are taken at face value the Cycle is halted, and *some* life has a chance to go on *somewhere,* so Sheppard's sacrifice isn't in vain.  Heck, even some (all?) of our squad lives on (though it's not clear how long they would last on that planet).

The alternative is that the game isn't actually over, which would mean that the game was actually ended with *absolutely everything* unresolved, and an "ending" scene which was intentionally confusing, ambiguous, and distressing.  There is no *conclusive* evidence for the indoctrination theory; all the evidence is circumstantial.  So we would have to believe that Bioware intentionally released a game which had no ending, and offered the player no clear evidence that an ending was forthcoming.  This would be an absolutely cruel way to treat the fans of the series, and would show tremendous disrespect for us.

There are three possible ways this ending was "intended."  One, it was meant to be taken at face value.  Two, we were meant to understand that Sheppard fails and the Reapers win.  Three, it was never intended to be an ending, and the actual game terminates before any actual ending or resolution has been reached.

All three of those things are bad.  I don't want to argue over which would be more offensive or cruel, but none of them is an acceptable way to treat paying customers, particularly given that this is the final game in a trilogy (as opposed to a standalone game, where this sort of thing would be merely "bad" instead of "horrifying").  The third is dangerously close to outright fraud (i.e. we were sold a product and told it was complete, but it turns out it was missing parts, and the seller knew that going in and lied about it). 

It almost doesn't matter which one of these interpretations is right; in every case, it's bad.  Personally, I tend to give Bioware the benefit of the doubt and assume they didn't *intend* to cause 95% of their fans to feel terrible.  I assume that, while they may have made a mistake, they are not cruel.  This leads me to the "face value" assumption; the authors had an ending in mind which they thought would satisfy us, but failed to convey it well, and we were left with an ambiguous, plot-hole filled mess instead.

Hopefully they'll give us some free DLC that will give us a more satisfying ending.  But personally, I hope the "false ending" indoctrination theory is not true.  Because I really don't think I could forgive Bioware for that.

[Sc2mashimaro]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Evidence that this theory cannot be correct:

-Firstly, and most importantly, the game outright tells you that Shepard has ended the Reaper threat, regardless of which ending you pick. It doesn't say that Shepard will go on to end the threat, or that the VI's Liara plants around the galaxy will help hte next Cycle end the threat, but that within the context of the ME3 story that is on the disc Shepard has ended the Reaper threat.

-Why would Bioware end the story to one of their greatest series on a cliffhanger? And why would they deliberatly withold the 'true' ending until it could be released as DLC?

-Why would the player be shown the scenes of the Crucible activating and the Normandy crashing all the time? If Shepard broke free of indoctrination, why would the Reapers keep creating random visions such as the Normandy crash? And if Shepard fails, and sucumbs to indoctrination, why show us scenes of the Reapers leaving and the Relays being destroyed? If he has become fully indoctrinated why keep showing visons - he is already inder their spell?

....

What the devs seem to be implying is that the story is not over. We seem to be in agreement there. However, them vaguely implying that there may be more story to follow doesn't prove that the endings we were given we illusions, which is what some people are claiming.

There are inconsistencies in the endings, no doubt about it. But this theory has too many flaws, and too much stacked against it, for it to be considered anything other than wishful thinking. 

I think you're misunderstanding my interpretation. I'm nearly 100% sure the end sequence with the child ghost thing was an indoctrination-dream. I don't know about the Citadel stuff leading up to it or how much of that was indoctrination. From there, it's hard to tell whether it actually is a cliff-hanger or not.

If it's a cliff-hanger, it supports the indoctrination theory that more content is incoming to resolve this problem and that the problem was planned by Bioware from the beginning. I hope that's true.

On the other hand, it could be that, while Shepard is indoctrinated, this final choice really is the end of the game and possibly Shepard's life. The indoctrination is seperate from whether the fleet succeeds or not, because that's not part of Shepard's personal journey at this point. So your EMS determines how much the Reapers are struggling, but either way, Harbinger tries to indoctrinate you. He tries harder if the Reapers are having a harder time fighting off the allied forces, thus, the greater selection of endings with higher EMS along with higher rates of success for whether Earth itself makes it. Although, I don't see that part in the cut-scene. Shepard's choice reflects only whether he was indoctinated or not and the final cut-scene is what Shepard sees in his mind happening because of his choice (regardless of if that is how it actually plays out). That could be the end, as in, the end of the whole trilogy. I really hope not, because I don't find it emotionally satisfying in the least, but I think it is plausible.

[Rawgrim]

Asepsis wrote...

Legendaryred wrote...

Yea, there is no way the crucible would know about the kid that shepard saw died.

I thought this was odd too, I figured the AI was somehow reading Shepard's mind and creating a form that Shepard would be sympathetic too, the fact Shepard kept dreaming about the kid was interesting too.

I think Shepard was indocrinated, it's the only logical explanaiton of why he/she would suddenly take everything the AI controller of all Reapers at face value. Also, did anyone else get the feeling the AI was trying to protect itself? Why else would it destroy all organic life to PREVENT more synthetics from rising to destroy organic life? The Reapers just want to stay in control, nothing noble about that. (I hated that the stinkin' Reaper AI was trying to act all noble, yeaaaa right)

The kid never lived. Nobody saw him but Shep, nobody interacted with the kid.

-When Anderson calls for Shepard at the beginning of the game, when
Shepard is talking to the child, Shepard turns back and the child is
gone. Shepard has been "snapped out of it".
-When Shepard turns towards Anderson after being "snapped out of
it", a growl is heard. In the third novel, when Greyson resisted the
reapers they would make a growling noise once they realized they didn't
have him under complete control.

[PSUHammer]

Rawgrim wrote...

Hammer6767 wrote...

I wonder why Javik got off the shuttle with Joker and Ash (my LI) at the end? Would have assumed Garrus.

I belive its Joker, Love interest, and the squadmate you used most often.

Well that would be a scripting fail as I used Javik once!

[Rawgrim]

Hammer6767 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Hammer6767 wrote...

I wonder why Javik got off the shuttle with Joker and Ash (my LI) at the end? Would have assumed Garrus.

I belive its Joker, Love interest, and the squadmate you used most often.

Well that would be a scripting fail as I used Javik once!

Could be. I used Javik alot, and I got him, Joker and LI at the end scene.

[Meeporized]

Well im to lazy to read everthing here now but from what you say you actually never "played the game itself" because right after the first Reaper attack on earth you see the Kid you cant say for sure if he is real or not
I mean you see him standing there and climbing himself <- into the shuttle and so many Soldiers and people just sitting there and ignoring the poor lad "running" for his live and not helping him to get inside the shuttle?

While you talk to him the first time Anderson does not even ask you why the heck you checked the friggin vents instead of getting the heck outta there.
I mean you hear something..... heck reapers are just invading Earth and you see/hear shooting people screaming etc. and Shep hears something in the vent and checks for it?
Must have been a really loud sound coming from that vent drowned everything else you probably hear and must sounded dangerous (no not some weird gaslike form would've been epic tho Edit: but then Shep would've been Lassie )

Wich leads me to the question. Are you already Indoctrinated or has the Indoctrination started?

Modifié par Meeporized, 13 mars 2012 - 11:42 .

[Rawgrim]

Meeporized wrote...

Well im to lazy to read everthing here now but from what you say you actually never "played the game itself" because right after the first Reaper attack on earth you see the Kid you cant say for sure if he is real or not
I mean you see him standing there and climbing himself <- into the shuttle and so many Soldiers and people just sitting there and ignoring the poor lad "running" for his live and not helping him to get inside the shuttle?

While you talk to him the first time Anderson does not even ask you why the heck you checked the friggin vents instead of getting the heck outta there.
I mean you hear something..... heck reapers are just invading Earth and you see/hear shooting people screaming etc. and Shep hears something in the vent and checks for it?
Must have been a really loud sound coming from that vent drowned everything else you probably hear and must sounded dangerous (no not some weird gaslike form would've been epic tho )

Wich leads me to the question. Are you already Indoctrinated or has the Indoctrination started?

I am guessing it started after the events of Arrival. And subtly grows stronger during ME3.

[Meeporized]

oh okay did not get Arrival becaus i boycott some DLC's
from just reading what happened in Arrival it didnt felt like it =)

[Candidate 88766]

Rawgrim wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

The ghostly visions are in the dream sequences. Benezzia also mentions the whisperings, in ME1. The whispers in the dream sequences just increases in eac sequence. On Rannoch Shep talks to the reaper. Tali doesn`t seem to notice the conversation at all. She is close to the reaper, and he hears "alien voices in his head".

Reaper: Shepard.
Shepard: You know who I am?
Reaper: Harbinger speaks of you. You resist. But you will fail.

Interesting choice of words too.

Strange things happen in dreams. The whispers are those of characters who you have met, and are mostly from those who died. In the second and third, you hear Mordin's voice. The ghosts are simply Bioware representing those who have died fighting the Reapers.

There's no indication that Tali can't hear the Reaper; its simply not her the Reaper is talking to, and even a dying Reaper is something you'd be afraid to be near. Surely if the voice was in Shepard's head, Tali would ask what Shepard is replying to?

You are resisting the Reapers by fighting the Cycle.

None of those things prove the indoctrination theory. I agree that they suggest it, if you ignore all the stuff I pointed out, but there are logical explanations for all of those things besides indoctrination. 

You also see that black energy stuff all about in the dream. the same stuff you se when you talk to the illusive man in the citadel. odd coincidence that. Especially given the Rachni queen`s description of indoctrination.

They're figures. They're humanoid and reperesent the dead, and they increase each time because Bioware is trying to show that Shepard is getting affected by all this death.

Then in TIM's scene, you see trendrils along the screen. Not humanoid shapes, but tendrils.

Besides, seeing weird stuff in dreams is expected. Shepard never sees these things at any other time, nor does he hear whispers during the game.

Hell, the Prothean VI outright tells you that you're not indcotrinated right before the final assault. Indoctrination is not rapid, so if he wasn't indoctrinated then then he couldn't have been so indoctrinated by the end that he was imagining everything.

[Candidate 88766]

Sc2mashimaro wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Evidence that this theory cannot be correct:

-Firstly, and most importantly, the game outright tells you that Shepard has ended the Reaper threat, regardless of which ending you pick. It doesn't say that Shepard will go on to end the threat, or that the VI's Liara plants around the galaxy will help hte next Cycle end the threat, but that within the context of the ME3 story that is on the disc Shepard has ended the Reaper threat.

-Why would Bioware end the story to one of their greatest series on a cliffhanger? And why would they deliberatly withold the 'true' ending until it could be released as DLC?

-Why would the player be shown the scenes of the Crucible activating and the Normandy crashing all the time? If Shepard broke free of indoctrination, why would the Reapers keep creating random visions such as the Normandy crash? And if Shepard fails, and sucumbs to indoctrination, why show us scenes of the Reapers leaving and the Relays being destroyed? If he has become fully indoctrinated why keep showing visons - he is already inder their spell?

....

What the devs seem to be implying is that the story is not over. We seem to be in agreement there. However, them vaguely implying that there may be more story to follow doesn't prove that the endings we were given we illusions, which is what some people are claiming.

There are inconsistencies in the endings, no doubt about it. But this theory has too many flaws, and too much stacked against it, for it to be considered anything other than wishful thinking. 

I think you're misunderstanding my interpretation. I'm nearly 100% sure the end sequence with the child ghost thing was an indoctrination-dream. I don't know about the Citadel stuff leading up to it or how much of that was indoctrination. From there, it's hard to tell whether it actually is a cliff-hanger or not.

If it's a cliff-hanger, it supports the indoctrination theory that more content is incoming to resolve this problem and that the problem was planned by Bioware from the beginning. I hope that's true.

On the other hand, it could be that, while Shepard is indoctrinated, this final choice really is the end of the game and possibly Shepard's life. The indoctrination is seperate from whether the fleet succeeds or not, because that's not part of Shepard's personal journey at this point. So your EMS determines how much the Reapers are struggling, but either way, Harbinger tries to indoctrinate you. He tries harder if the Reapers are having a harder time fighting off the allied forces, thus, the greater selection of endings with higher EMS along with higher rates of success for whether Earth itself makes it. Although, I don't see that part in the cut-scene. Shepard's choice reflects only whether he was indoctinated or not and the final cut-scene is what Shepard sees in his mind happening because of his choice (regardless of if that is how it actually plays out). That could be the end, as in, the end of the whole trilogy. I really hope not, because I don't find it emotionally satisfying in the least, but I think it is plausible.

Why would you hope that Bioware shipped the final part of the this trilogy without the actual ending?

Also, how would Shepard have become indoctrinated so quickly? He's not indoctrinated in TIM's base, and from then on all that happens around Reaper tech is you spend about 10 minutes in the Citadel. Indoctrination that rapid would destroy Shepard's brain if were even possible at all, leaving nothing in which these hallucinations could exist.

And why would the same cutscenes (Relays exploding, the scene on Earth, the Normandy crash, the Stargazer) play in both the indoctrinated ending and the Shepard breaking free ending?

I get that people don't want the current endings to be true. But latching onto a theory with so many problems doesn't seem like the right way to change this - it will lead to more disappointment.

[Asepsis]

Rawgrim wrote...

Asepsis wrote...

Legendaryred wrote...

Yea, there is no way the crucible would know about the kid that shepard saw died.

I thought this was odd too, I figured the AI was somehow reading Shepard's mind and creating a form that Shepard would be sympathetic too, the fact Shepard kept dreaming about the kid was interesting too.

I think Shepard was indocrinated, it's the only logical explanaiton of why he/she would suddenly take everything the AI controller of all Reapers at face value. Also, did anyone else get the feeling the AI was trying to protect itself? Why else would it destroy all organic life to PREVENT more synthetics from rising to destroy organic life? The Reapers just want to stay in control, nothing noble about that. (I hated that the stinkin' Reaper AI was trying to act all noble, yeaaaa right)

The kid never lived. Nobody saw him but Shep, nobody interacted with the kid.

-When Anderson calls for Shepard at the beginning of the game, when
Shepard is talking to the child, Shepard turns back and the child is
gone. Shepard has been "snapped out of it".
-When Shepard turns towards Anderson after being "snapped out of
it", a growl is heard. In the third novel, when Greyson resisted the
reapers they would make a growling noise once they realized they didn't
have him under complete control.

Yeah the fact that Shepard was the only one to "see" the kid is really suspicious, which makes the mind control thing even more plausible if the AI was reaching into Shepard's brain somehow. (perhaps since Shepard is partially synthetic it was pretty easy to add in that hallucination). Even in the vents, when the kid goes "you can't help me", I almost wonder if any of that was even real but it probably was.

I don't know, this is all very WEIRD and disconcerting if you ask me.

[Rawgrim]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

The ghostly visions are in the dream sequences. Benezzia also mentions the whisperings, in ME1. The whispers in the dream sequences just increases in eac sequence. On Rannoch Shep talks to the reaper. Tali doesn`t seem to notice the conversation at all. She is close to the reaper, and he hears "alien voices in his head".

Reaper: Shepard.
Shepard: You know who I am?
Reaper: Harbinger speaks of you. You resist. But you will fail.

Interesting choice of words too.

Strange things happen in dreams. The whispers are those of characters who you have met, and are mostly from those who died. In the second and third, you hear Mordin's voice. The ghosts are simply Bioware representing those who have died fighting the Reapers.

There's no indication that Tali can't hear the Reaper; its simply not her the Reaper is talking to, and even a dying Reaper is something you'd be afraid to be near. Surely if the voice was in Shepard's head, Tali would ask what Shepard is replying to?

You are resisting the Reapers by fighting the Cycle.

None of those things prove the indoctrination theory. I agree that they suggest it, if you ignore all the stuff I pointed out, but there are logical explanations for all of those things besides indoctrination. 

You also see that black energy stuff all about in the dream. the same stuff you se when you talk to the illusive man in the citadel. odd coincidence that. Especially given the Rachni queen`s description of indoctrination.

They're figures. They're humanoid and reperesent the dead, and they increase each time because Bioware is trying to show that Shepard is getting affected by all this death.

Then in TIM's scene, you see trendrils along the screen. Not humanoid shapes, but tendrils.

Besides, seeing weird stuff in dreams is expected. Shepard never sees these things at any other time, nor does he hear whispers during the game.

Hell, the Prothean VI outright tells you that you're not indcotrinated right before the final assault. Indoctrination is not rapid, so if he wasn't indoctrinated then then he couldn't have been so indoctrinated by the end that he was imagining everything.

The prothians are correct (at that time). Because Shep isn`t fully indoctrinated then. The process takes quite some time. Shep isn`t fully indoctrinated untill he picks anything but Destroy, at the ending.

[Myrmedus]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Lethys1 wrote...

All of this means I purchased a game wihout an ending......

Why is anyone happy about this being true if it's the case???

I posted it before, and I'll gladly post it again -

For a guy that's been a survivor throughout 3 games - someone that manages to bring down Sovereign, killed Saren, survived the collectors, survived a 1:1 fight with a Reaper - I honestly think this is an absolutely great plot twist.

Consider the fact that when the Asari World is lost - we see a completely new side to Shepard.
He's sick of Cerberus, he's sick of the War - he's in need of a much deserved break -
and he even gets sick at Jeff's Jokes.

Shepard is exhausted - and not that 'Super Hero'-I Survive-Everything - kind of guy anymore.

To have him (in a way) 'finally' succumb to the Reapers through indoctrination - and thereby highlighting the fact that Shepard always was 'Just Human' - is - for me - such a way better ending than what we all came to expect:

-> Go to the Citadel
-> Activate the Crucible
-> War over.

It would have been almost predictable.

However, while it's important to reinforce that Shepard is indeed human, if the ending is left as is it's simply not an ending - that's the only problem.

I feel his reaction to Thessia was enough. Even if we have him being influenced (I think he's being influenced by Harbinger at the end, not necessarily indoctrinated) that's absolutely fine but we still need a conclusion.

[Myrmedus]

My only concern with the indoctrination theory is that this would suggest we will hear Harbinger speak at some point: however, Keith Szarabajka's bibliography doesn't have him working on Mass Effect 3 so not sure where this leaves things?

[Candidate 88766]

Rawgrim wrote...

The prothians are correct (at that time). Because Shep isn`t fully indoctrinated then. The process takes quite some time. Shep isn`t fully indoctrinated untill he picks anything but Destroy, at the ending.

It takes months, not a matter of hours. The VI doesn;t detect any hint of indoctrination on you - if you were on the verge of becoming fully indoctrinated, it stands to reason that it would detect that. If Shepard can fall to it mere hours later, he is in the late stages already by TIM's base, which the game says you're not.

If it only takes a few hours to indoctrinate, then all of humanity would've been harvested. The Reapers could simply hover over a city for a day or two and everyone would be indoctrinated.

[Candidate 88766]

Execute23 wrote...

To those pointing out the codex message congratulating the player after the end of the game, it is simply a game mechanic informing the player they reached the end and nothing more.

My theory is that Bioware always intended to release post-end DLC that revealed that Shepard was indoctrinated during the final run all along, but they had no idea that the response over the initial endings would be so widely denounced.

The codex message is just there to bring closure to players who would never get the DLC. In other words, let them think they beat the Reapers and the galaxy was saved. For those who would eventually download the DLC, then they would know better.

Why would Bioware intentionally not include the full ending to the concludin part of one of their most successful franchises?

The backlash would be volcanic.

And the codex message isn't a vague message saying that you've reached the end - the message, along with names of the achievements/trophies you getting for finishing, indicate that Shepard ended the Reaper threat during the story you just played. It explicitly tells you that the Reaper threat is gone, no matter which ending you chose, which directly contradicts this indoctrination theory.

[ZeroCrewX]

Let's for a moment assume that all of this is true.

WHERE THE **** IS MY ENDING?!

[kato42]

I'm afraid that while the Indoctrination theory makes MORE sense than what we saw, it still doesn't make complete sense. Its still got giant plot holes, such as Candidate 88766 has been pointing out.

Not to mention that not having the real ending in the game is a horrible idea, that is a serious "F You!" to the customers. "Here is you full game. Well, actually, its not. To get the full game you have to shell out another 10 bucks just to get a decent ending. But we didn't tell you that because we knew that many people wouldn't buy the game when we released it because they would wait for the ending to be available. Not to mention that people would be angry that they had to spend more money to get the DLC with the 'real' ending! They might think it deceptive of us to say this was the end of the series that would answer all their questions, only to find out that you have to get the DLC to get those answers and an ending that doesn't annoy most of the fans."

No... I have no idea what these 'plans' of theirs are, but it all smacks of A. bad writing, or B. bad business decisions. Or C. Both.

[aimlessgun]

 More stuff against the "destroy is the 'right' choice" wing of this theory:
-If the reapers want to steer you away from "destroy" why do they show Anderson doing it? Anderson, the guy you respect maybe the most in the whole galaxy. That's a clear incentive  to choose destroy.

-When listing the downsides of destroy, why mention the Geth dying but not EDI? You are much more likely to be emotionally attached to EDI, and many players may have wiped out the Geth already. 

[Candidate 88766]

Execute23 wrote...

Candidate 88766 wrote...

Execute23 wrote...

To those pointing out the codex message congratulating the player after the end of the game, it is simply a game mechanic informing the player they reached the end and nothing more.

My theory is that Bioware always intended to release post-end DLC that revealed that Shepard was indoctrinated during the final run all along, but they had no idea that the response over the initial endings would be so widely denounced.

The codex message is just there to bring closure to players who would never get the DLC. In other words, let them think they beat the Reapers and the galaxy was saved. For those who would eventually download the DLC, then they would know better.

Why would Bioware intentionally not include the full ending to the concludin part of one of their most successful franchises?

The backlash would be volcanic.

And the codex message isn't a vague message saying that you've reached the end - the message, along with names of the achievements/trophies you getting for finishing, indicate that Shepard ended the Reaper threat during the story you just played. It explicitly tells you that the Reaper threat is gone, no matter which ending you chose, which directly contradicts this indoctrination theory.

They may have thought the original endings were satisfying enough for the fans and wouldn't raise any major complaints. The "true ending" DLC would have been a special surprise released in the future. Now such a DLC is being made out to be a necessity by the fans in order to get the full experience; not what Bioware intended.

I'm basing this on their defense of the endings in Twitter posts and also hints of "something" to appease the anger.

The codex message is just there for both players of the game with a theoretical "true ending" DLC and those without it. For those without it, no matter what choice you picked, you're getting that message because you aren't aware that some of the choices you picked were a result of indoctrination. For those with the DLC, then I'm assuming it can only end one way: defy Harbinger and destroy the Reapers. Else you will get a Critical Mission Failure.

Again, that's how I assume it will work. The message is more of an indicator whether or not DLC is coming, not that the Indoctrination Theory is either true or false.

But why not put this special ending in the game if they think its better?

This theory relies on someone at Bioware, at some point, saying that what they consider to be the ending shouldn't be in the game and should instead be released later, and then no-one disagreeing with this and pointing out that its stupid.

Also, surely this ending is much worse if there is now only one actual choice?

Whereas before you have three variations of an ending, now you have only one ending that you can't even be sure is real - if the indoctrination is so strong that Shepard is imagining entire conversations with the Citadel itself, then there is no way he is simply going to break free of their inlfuence. Saren and TIM were relatively sane, and yet they could only break free through suicide.