220 réponses à ce sujet

[noriyoku5151]

So from what I'm seeing its not lack of an ending but lack of an epilogue people have issues with

[Kloborgg711]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Tequila Man wrote..

Sorry to argue like a troll, but...

All that? Fanfiction. You've created a universe/world/excuse that simply doesn't exist on any intellectual level aside from "maybe."

Nope those are from all 3 games.  If you paid attention and got off the Tequila.  Bioware did it right. 

What. We know what happens at the end of ME1. Shepard beats Saren, stops Sovereign, and delays the Reapers. He gets Udina or Anderson on the council and goes off with his crew to continue his fight against the Reapers. The end.

ME2? Shepard destroys the human Reaper that Harbinger ordered, destroys or keeps the base, and loses X squadmates. He flies back to safety, continuing his fight. With DLC, he further delays the Reapers invasion and ends up causing the death of 300k Batarians. He goes back to Earth to face court. The end.

ME3? Well, um.. maybe he was indoctrinated at some point... and maybe it's a dream.. uh if it wasn't then an unspecified amount of technology was wiped out... and uh somehow your squad teleported to the Normandy and it ... uh, ran away for unspecified reasons... and uh.. you might've kinda somehow survived being on an exploding space station.. and your crew is probably stranded forever ... and a lot more people might starve to death.. probably.


Did you spot the difference?

[Tequila Man]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...
Give the fans what we wanted in Mass Effect 1.  Space Combat.

[Kloborgg711]

noriyoku5151 wrote...

So from what I'm seeing its not lack of an ending but lack of an epilogue people have issues with

There is an ending in the fact that the game does end. There isn't in any real intellectual sense. No closure of any sort. We have no idea what the consequences of our actions are, and we can only really guess what our actions were to begin with.

[alpha54]

To the original OP: I could not agree more. The ending(s) forever cemented the ME trilogy as one of the greatest sci-fi properties ever created for me. The self-sacrificial hero is the underpinning of Western mythology; it was the only fitting way for Shepard's journey to end.,

[DirectorStormchaser1]

Tequila Man wrote...

*facepalm*

Okay. Fair enough, I guess. Fanfiction it is.

Hey, everyone. Shepard was indoctrinated. A non-canon idea says so.


If it's any consolation, man, I wish your ending was the one Bioware went with. But, alas, they didn't.

Not fan fic.

Pay close attention to dialogue.  In all 3.

No technology in the timeline could bring Shepherd alive.  And, paid close attention to Kang you would understand Shepherd's implants are the same Reaper Tech.

What did Shepherd say about Reaper Tech in Arrival???  It leads to Indoctrination.

Being hit by Harbinger Beam was the nail in the coffin.  For someone which Liara said "Strong Willed".  That beam from Harbinger, shattered Shepherd's will.

Take some psychology courses. 

Modifié par DirectorStormchaser1, 14 mars 2012 - 05:56 .

[x-Killision-X]

noriyoku5151 wrote...

So from what I'm seeing its not lack of an ending but lack of an epilogue people have issues with

Almost 100% right. Chioces for ending is part of it too.

[TheLostGenius]

THought it was great. Very tragic and mysterious.

[Meshaber]

Gemini1179 wrote...

We could argue this ad infinitem. If the Normandy scene makes no sense, how can you use it as justification for anything? Honestly, it's not even that important. The endings still are terrible and left me asking myself "Why would I play this again? Why would I buy DLC? None of it matters." I LOVED the game up until that final moment. I don't know how to play it again knowing that I'm not achieving anything in the end.

Because, sense-making or not, it's what happened.

And hey, it's not like Joker running away is a theoretical impossibility, we just don't have any idea why he did it. And companions being space-magicked up there was just a slip-up, obviously. Like heat clips Jacobs loyalty mission.

I didn't mind the endings that much myself. They were horribly bad, but I'm certainly going to keep playing the games, I don't see how they "ruined" anything other then themselves, the journey is what matters. But the mass relays did not explode á la arrival, that much is obvious, and if people are going to smack talk the endings I'm going to have them smack talk the endings for the right reasons!

[KainrycKarr]

skaye wrote...

I absolutely adored the ending to this game.

Each option gave a sense of finality, a real commitment to the science fiction that underpins the series: that the galaxy is locked in a cycle where organics and synthetics contend for supremacy. And this game lets me completely rewrite the future of that universe. 

The option I chose for my 'primary' playthrough (spoiler!) was the synergy (middle) route. Haunting, shaking, and with that great kicker after the credits.

What did people want? What were people expecting? A kind of "and then Shepard killed the reapers and everyone was okay and there was another sex scene with Liara rainbows butterflies medals Chewbacca roar end credits" sort of thing?

What we get here is far better - an opportunity to have a powerful impact on the universe, and to make a kind of concluding judgement about the series' principle themes.

I don't accept some of the arguments floating around, that the final choices didn't reflect the series' 'paragon/renegade' duality. We got given some very complex options, with massive iceburgs of unforeseen consequences in each one. What, did people want a drop-down menu, listing the effects?

I loved this series, but its not until these endings that Mass Effect is elevated to the status of powerful science fiction. I for one would be very upset if Bioware changed them even a jot. They're beautiful just as they are.

Anyway, this thread is just to congratulate Bioware - I've been following you guys since Baldur's Gate, and I can't wait to see what happens next - and to see if anybody else has a more positive response to the endings.

Yet again, someone doesn't understand why the endings suck.


The problem isn't that the ending is sad. It's that it's filled with plotholes and things that just plain don't make sense.
Why did Sovereign need to open the citadel if the citadel was IN CONTROL OF THE REAPERS?
Why was the Normandy way off, by itself, with the squadmates you took with you to EARTH THAT MAGICALLY TELEPORTED, by the relay?
Why did the kid NOT mention that the relay energy opens up wormholes that suck in ships and spit them out on random locations?
Why did I see Liara in my flashback instead of Tali, my LI?
Why was there no text-based epilogue detailing the consequences of my actions and the state I left the galaxy in?
We're forced to accept that synthetics will always wipe out organics, EVEN THOUGH WE JUST PROVED THE EXACT OPPOSITE WITH THE GETH AND QUARIANS.

[Tequila Man]

alpha54 wrote...

To the original OP: I could not agree more. The ending(s) forever cemented the ME trilogy as one of the greatest sci-fi properties ever created for me. The self-sacrificial hero is the underpinning of Western mythology; it was the only fitting way for Shepard's journey to end.,

Yes. Shepard probably does need to die in this trilogy.

He doesn't need to die without a fight, without choices that matter, and with Rainbow Bright Ice Cream Lighting.

[Tequila Man]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Tequila Man wrote...

*facepalm*

Okay. Fair enough, I guess. Fanfiction it is.

Hey, everyone. Shepard was indoctrinated. A non-canon idea says so.


If it's any consolation, man, I wish your ending was the one Bioware went with. But, alas, they didn't.

Not fan fic.

Pay close attention to dialogue.  In all 3.

No technology in the timeline could bring Shepherd alive.  And, paid close attention to Kang you would understand Shepherd's implants are the same Reaper Tech.

What did Shepherd say about Reaper Tech in arrival???  It leads to Indoctrination.

Being hit by Harbinger Beam was the nail in the coffin.  For someone whoch Liara said "Strong Willed".  That beam from Harbinger, shattered Shepherd's will.

Take some psychology courses. 

I think I'm being trolled. I really do.


Cool story, bro. Why don't you call Bioware and tell them what you think, same as us. I guess you'll... uh.... hold the line?

[Lethys1]

Liking them and explaining is okay.  I disagree with the OP, but I respect the opinion.  At least he isn't belittling the entire group of people who do want them changed because how awful they are.

[Erriiieeee]

So I've lurking on the forums reading everyone's reaction to the ending and the hallucination/indoctrination theories...

If Shepard never entered the Citadel... how the hell did it open in the first place? 

Next question supports the indoctrination theory but...

How does Anderson get to the control panel before Shepard when it's obvious there's only one walkway towards  the control panel?

If
the answer is Shepard is dreaming then that immediately brings us back
to the first question which  the only answer is a gigantic plot hole.
I whole heartedly agree on a bleak ending for a rather bleak storyling but this ending just doesn't allow for "interpretation" as Casey Hudson states. Yes it had a effect on me and I'll never forget but I don't think I'm going to be running through ME3 again with my renegade character since I know there's not much else to the game.

[Shock n Awe]

skaye wrote...

I absolutely adored the ending to this game.

Each option gave a sense of finality, a real commitment to the science fiction that underpins the series: that the galaxy is locked in a cycle where organics and synthetics contend for supremacy. And this game lets me completely rewrite the future of that universe. 

The option I chose for my 'primary' playthrough (spoiler!) was the synergy (middle) route. Haunting, shaking, and with that great kicker after the credits.

What did people want? What were people expecting? A kind of "and then Shepard killed the reapers and everyone was okay and there was another sex scene with Liara rainbows butterflies medals Chewbacca roar end credits" sort of thing?

What we get here is far better - an opportunity to have a powerful impact on the universe, and to make a kind of concluding judgement about the series' principle themes.

I don't accept some of the arguments floating around, that the final choices didn't reflect the series' 'paragon/renegade' duality. We got given some very complex options, with massive iceburgs of unforeseen consequences in each one. What, did people want a drop-down menu, listing the effects?

I loved this series, but its not until these endings that Mass Effect is elevated to the status of powerful science fiction. I for one would be very upset if Bioware changed them even a jot. They're beautiful just as they are.

Anyway, this thread is just to congratulate Bioware - I've been following you guys since Baldur's Gate, and I can't wait to see what happens next - and to see if anybody else has a more positive response to the endings.

In regards to the highlighted text:
Ha.  Hahaha.   Hahahahhahahahaha.


You may or may not have been trying to troll, but troll you have.

Erriiieeee wrote...

So I've lurking on the forums reading everyone's reaction to the ending and the hallucination/indoctrination theories...

If Shepard never entered the Citadel... how the hell did it open in the first place? 

Next question supports the indoctrination theory but...

How does Anderson get to the control panel before Shepard when it's obvious there's only one walkway towards  the control panel?

If
the answer is Shepard is dreaming then that immediately brings us back 
to the first question which  the only answer is a gigantic plot hole.
I whole heartedly agree on a bleak ending for a rather bleak storyling but this ending just doesn't allow for "interpretation" as Casey Hudson states. Yes it had a effect on me and I'll never forget but I don't think I'm going to be running through ME3 again with my renegade character since I know there's not much else to the game. 

 
The Citadel doesn't open until after Shepard is hit by Harbinger's laser.  The Indoctrination Theory proposes that everything after the laser is him fighting Indoctrination, not just the God Starchild part.

Modifié par Shock n Awe, 14 mars 2012 - 06:00 .

[Meshaber]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Meshaber wrote...

No, the normandy bit doesn't make sense, but it directly contradicts the idea that the Mass relays destroyed everything. So they didn't. And since the method by which they are destroyed are completely different from each other, we can conclude that this is the explanation.

The Relays were not destroyed.  When a prisoner is brainwashed in real lfie.  They will have dreams within dreams.  Abnormakl Psychology teaches you this. 

So when Shepherd went for whatever choice, Shepherd makes would be a dream of where his crew and squad mates are safe. 

In reality the Relays are not destroyed and war wages on. 

As Bioware stated the Trilogy is "Shepherd's Story"  big hint Shepherd was not going to be in the whole Mass Effect Series.

Shepherd would be the one that warned paving way for another Legend.  Since it is obvious from Epilogue that Shepherd Story was the one that is known best.

I cannot wait for Mass Effect 4.   Bioware left a clue what Mass effect 4 would be.  "The best tactic against the Reapers is hit and run."  So to make Mass Effect 4 best game possible, Bioware, please hire Chris Roberts to make this series even better than Freelancer.  Give the fans what we wanted in Mass Effect 1.  Space Combat.

First stage of grief: Denial.

It's okay bub, just let it out<3

[Arlind Webb]

Jarlaxlecq wrote...

loved it! like a kick to the balls.....

Yup... sums up my opinion as well.

[DirectorStormchaser1]

Tequila Man wrote...

I think I'm being trolled. I really do.


Cool story, bro. Why don't you call Bioware and tell them what you think, same as us. I guess you'll... uh.... hold the line?

Not trolling telling what is in all the dialogue.  Which you did not pay attention too.

People rush game and not pay attention to 25% of the dialogue.  There are no plotholes.  They just need to read and remember and write down everything said and done.  And, would know what is going on.

I am creating a video showing the Indoctrination process since many missed it.  Along with all the dialogue from all Mass Effects.

Modifié par DirectorStormchaser1, 14 mars 2012 - 06:01 .

[GuyWithFace]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Being hit by Harbinger Beam was the nail in the coffin.  For someone which Liara said "Strong Willed".  That beam from Harbinger, shattered Shepherd's will.

Take some psychology courses. 

Because being hit by a laser beam that can destroy spaceships designed for combat somehow breaks the WILL of a man, but not his body entirely?

Because psychology courses teach you what happens when you get hit by a laser beam from an infinitely-old sentient synthetic bent on the genocide of all organic sentients every 50,000 years, or what being brought back to life with some technology from those same beings does to one's psyche?

If you're gonna troll, or at least try to offer a valid argument, please do so with some logic.

Edit: For clarification.

Modifié par GuyWithFace, 14 mars 2012 - 06:04 .

[Where my deeds have lead me]

Huh? What? Did you play the first two? If you did how can you even remotely like them? They are illogical, have no closure, and go against the lore.

[Hudathan]

Gemini1179 wrote...

Hudathan wrote...
The only thing left to do was to make sure the galaxy has the chance to see tomorrow, that hopefully there is a brighter future than mass extinction. The game DOES provide the player with all of these things, but once again the ending is just too short.

All three endings will bring about mass extinction anyway. Think about it. Every fleet at Earth is stuck to being able to go as far as their FLT drives will take them. Then think about food, resources, etc. Each and every race is cut off from one another. All that peacemaking you did? For naught.

The troops who fought at Earth are certainly in a tough spot, but there is still a chance that many of them will survive as opposed to losing the war and facing certain total annihilation. The galactic races might be cut off from one another, but that doesn't mean they won't be able to survive on their own. Humans only joined the galactic community recently and we were fine up to that point. All of these races existed before they each discovered mass relays and they will continue to exist, none of which would even be possible if the cycle didn't end. And as for the peace-making being for naught, it's a silly way to think that just because space travel is now much more difficult that helping so many species reach catharsis had no value. For better or worse, the Krogan got what they wanted, the Quarians who settled on Rannoch got what they wanted, if the Geth survived in your story then they got what they wanted. Just because Quarian/Krogan/Geth/human children don't all get to play together on the Citadel doesn't mean that solving all those conflicts and helping all those people didn't have an effect on their future and state of happiness.

[DirectorStormchaser1]

Meshaber wrote...

First stage of grief: Denial.

It's okay bub, just let it out<3

Not denial.  Since it is obvious I am extremely happy.  And, I LOVE BIOWARE!!! SHEPHERD FINALLY INDOCTRINATED!!!! BIOWARE MARRY ME!!!!!!

Modifié par DirectorStormchaser1, 14 mars 2012 - 06:03 .

[Tequila Man]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Tequila Man wrote...

I think I'm being trolled. I really do.


Cool story, bro. Why don't you call Bioware and tell them what you think, same as us. I guess you'll... uh.... hold the line?

Not trolling telling what is in all the dialogue.  Which you did not pay attention too.

People rush game and not pay attention to 25% of the dialogue.  There are no plotholes.  They just need to read and remember and write down everything said and done.  And, would know what is going on.

I am creating a video showing the Indoctrination process since many missed it.  Along with all the dialogue from all Mass Effects.

Okay, how to spell it out. Let me phrase this properly.

Your video? Will be fanfiction.
The Indoctrination theory? Fanfiction.
Any theory about Indoctrination or "dream" or "fairy tale?" Currently: fanfiction.
All your dialogue arguments? Now fanfiction because the ending has nothing to do with any dialogue in any of the games? To be fair, the entire dark energy plot? Anything associated with it (theories, stories, guesses) is now... everyone with me: fanfiction.

[Meshaber]

DirectorStormchaser1 wrote...

Tequila Man wrote...

I think I'm being trolled. I really do.


Cool story, bro. Why don't you call Bioware and tell them what you think, same as us. I guess you'll... uh.... hold the line?

Not trolling telling what is in all the dialogue.  Which you did not pay attention too.

People rush game and not pay attention to 25% of the dialogue.  There are no plotholes.  They just need to read and remember and write down everything said and done.  And, would know what is going on.

I am creating a video showing the Indoctrination process since many missed it.  Along with all the dialogue from all Mass Effects.

We are well aware that everything you are talking about did, in fact, occur. We are aware of these conversations and of what is being said. At no point is there any direct evidence, or even a good hint, that Shepard is being, or has been indoctrinated to any noticable degree. Also, Vendetta can sense indoctrination.

[KingyyyizME]

I do not understand how anyone can say the ending was a fit one for this game series. The plot holes alone sank the entire journey. God Child? Joker fleeing through a relay during a battle with your squad-mates who were with you just minutes ago for no apparent reason. Being able to breathe in space without a suit? In the case of destroy with shep living, falling from space and surviving an impact, let alone burning up during reentry? It makes nooo sense, at all. This series prided itself on believable sci-fi, and now, we just accept green space magic?

Any gamer, any lover of stories, would be appalled with the above things.

Plus, we get no epilogue, or any sort of closure into characters we had invested in for over five years. O, but yeah, the ending was fine.......