319 réponses à ce sujet

[Severyx]

Absolutely not, and I'm glad it stayed this way. Changing character's 'preferences' in the middle of any story to suit the absurd wants of the fans shows weak-willed character development. I hate that crap.

Wasn't happy when Kaiden was suddenly bi (He certainly WASN'T in ME1) - I'd feel moderately insulted if Tali fell to that nonsense as well.

[Unit-Alpha]

We need some straight people in the Mass Effect universe; seriously, heterosexuals are a minority there, so it seems.

Also, it is stupid how Kaiden just decided to be bisexual halfway through the story.

Good move, Bioware.

Modifié par Unit-Alpha, 23 avril 2012 - 02:04 .

[Biotic Flash Kick]

ManShep has an induction straw
Femshep dont

[Noelemahc]

Unit-Alpha wrote...

We need some straight people in the Mass Effect universe; seriously, heterosexuals are a minority there, so it seems.

Also, it is stupid how Kaiden just decided to be bisexual halfway through the story.

Good move, Bioware.

AFAIK, Kaidan rationalizes it away, making him a welcome situation where the dude and the girl get different romance stories for the same character, unlike Liara. I'm still not done with my hacked-up ME1 DudeShep/Kaidan playthrough, but I'm looking forward to seeing his ME3 gaymance.

On a more serious note, you DO have more straight people than gay or bi even on the Normandy. Joker is straight. Chakwas is straight. Michel is straight. Adams, Ken, Gabby, Pressly, Anderson, all straight. Garrus, Jacob, Kasumi, Wrex, straight. Vega supposedly straight, at least he flirts only with Lola and Ashley.  Zaeed and Grunt I'm not sure about. They're both killersexuals, they get their kicks via violence, and apparently don't need anyone. Maybe because Grunt is still too young to consider these things, and Zaeed is too dead inside.

Even if you count Shepard as bi, the rest... Traynor, Cortez, gay. Kelly, Liara, Samara, Morinth, bi, if you can even consider asari, who are omnisexual, as bi. Kaidan changes halfway through from straight to bi. Mordin is asexual, but indicates that if he was interested in anyone, he'd only be interested in Shepard. Then Shepard calls his bulldren, of course.

Thane, Tali, Jack and Miranda I discount from either count for reasons I've outlined earlier. ME2 plays them as straight even though they are implied to not be, just unavailable for same-sex stuff for no real reason.

Modifié par Noelemahc, 23 avril 2012 - 02:12 .

[Baihu1983]

Severyx wrote...

Absolutely not, and I'm glad it stayed this way. Changing character's 'preferences' in the middle of any story to suit the absurd wants of the fans shows weak-willed character development. I hate that crap.

Wasn't happy when Kaiden was suddenly bi (He certainly WASN'T in ME1) - I'd feel moderately insulted if Tali fell to that nonsense as well.

He was originally but yeah i dont get why Bioware/gamers have this sudden urge to turn as many chacarters gay/Bi half way through a story.

[Unit-Alpha]

Noelemahc wrote...

Unit-Alpha wrote...

We need some straight people in the Mass Effect universe; seriously, heterosexuals are a minority there, so it seems.

Also, it is stupid how Kaiden just decided to be bisexual halfway through the story.

Good move, Bioware.

AFAIK, Kaidan rationalizes it away, making him a welcome situation where the dude and the girl get different romance stories for the same character, unlike Liara. I'm still not done with my hacked-up ME1 DudeShep/Kaidan playthrough, but I'm looking forward to seeing his ME3 gaymance.

On a more serious note, you DO have more straight people than gay or bi even on the Normandy. Joker is straight. Chakwas is straight. Michel is straight. Adams, Ken, Gabby, Pressly, Anderson, all straight. Garrus, Jacob, Kasumi, Wrex, straight. Vega supposedly straight, at least he flirts only with Lola and Ashley.  Zaeed and Grunt I'm not sure about. They're both killersexuals, they get their kicks via violence, and apparently don't need anyone. Maybe because Grunt is still too young to consider these things, and Zaeed is too dead inside.

Even if you count Shepard as bi, the rest... Traynor, Cortez, gay. Kelly, Liara, Samara, Morinth, bi, if you can even consider asari, who are omnisexual, as bi. Kaidan changes halfway through from straight to bi. Mordin is asexual, but indicates that if he was interested in anyone, he'd only be interested in Shepard. Then Shepard calls his bulldren, of course.

Thane, Tali, Jack and Miranda I discount from either count for reasons I've outlined earlier. ME2 plays them as straight even though they are implied to not be, just unavailable for same-sex stuff for no real reason.

Sorry, that was intentional hyperbole on my part; I'm perfectly find with the current ratio. I still attest that changing a character's sexual orientation after midway through a plotline is an example of poor writing on Bioware's part.

[Noelemahc]

Sorry, that was intentional hyperbole on my part; I'm perfectly find with the current ratio. I still attest that changing a character's sexual orientation after midway through a plotline is an example of poor writing on Bioware's part.

Oh. Sorry.

Who else except for Kaidan changes, anyway? Is it actually THAT jarring or it's a knee-jerk reaction along the lines of "OMG, why did they do it, he's too cute to be gay-- oh wait", etc, etc?

[Unit-Alpha]

Noelemahc wrote...

Sorry, that was intentional hyperbole on my part; I'm perfectly find with the current ratio. I still attest that changing a character's sexual orientation after midway through a plotline is an example of poor writing on Bioware's part.

Oh. Sorry.

Who else except for Kaidan changes, anyway? Is it actually THAT jarring or it's a knee-jerk reaction along the lines of "OMG, why did they do it, he's too cute to be gay-- oh wait", etc, etc?

No, Kaiden is the big example. I don't have an issue with him being bisexual in the story, it's just that I know that doing that kind of character shift that is unrelated to plot development is just a hamfisted way of retconning a character's identity. Nothing more.

[Baihu1983]

Unit-Alpha wrote...

Noelemahc wrote...

Sorry, that was intentional hyperbole on my part; I'm perfectly find with the current ratio. I still attest that changing a character's sexual orientation after midway through a plotline is an example of poor writing on Bioware's part.

Oh. Sorry.

Who else except for Kaidan changes, anyway? Is it actually THAT jarring or it's a knee-jerk reaction along the lines of "OMG, why did they do it, he's too cute to be gay-- oh wait", etc, etc?

No, Kaiden is the big example. I don't have an issue with him being bisexual in the story, it's just that I know that doing that kind of character shift that is unrelated to plot development is just a hamfisted way of retconning a character's identity. Nothing more.

Same with Male Shep, dont think his shown any sign of being gay/Bi in the first 2 games?

[dreaming_raithe]

I was really disappointed with this, too. You can argue that Tali is straight, but FemShep gets all the same flirty dialogue with her that BroShep does. She blushes just the same when she mentions linking suits with Shepard whether Shepard is male or female. If she just wanted to suit-link the way her mom and "Auntie Raan" did, she wouldn't be blushing about it.

People say a lot of the time that Bioware records all of the dialogue with both Meer and Hale, but I'm not sure I buy that. I don't think anyone's ever uncovered left over dialogue of Meer flirting with Jacob, for instance, and from what I remember, Meer has completely different dialogue choices with Jacob compared to Hale (though I've only done BroShep once).

It really feels like they changed their minds later and chopped off the options for FemShep.

[Noelemahc]

Same with Male Shep, dont think his shown any sign of being gay/Bi in the first 2 games?

It's not generally something you show off, I think. I mean, does he suddenly start walking and talking different if you romance Cortez or Kaidan?

People say a lot of the time that Bioware records all of the dialogue
with both Meer and Hale, but I'm not sure I buy that. I don't think
anyone's ever uncovered left over dialogue of Meer flirting with Jacob,
for instance, and from what I remember, Meer has completely different
dialogue choices with Jacob compared to Hale (though I've only done
BroShep once).

Not to my memory, no, they get about the same dialogue except that Jacob may make some moves on FemShep.

Leftover dialogues of DudeShep/Thane are present in the French release of the game, BTW. It's a mirror of FemShep's as well, no unique lines.

There's only one such line in the ME2 files, attached to the trigger that is the DudeShep's analogue for FemShep's "Garrus is very dear to me" in Mordin's sex ed speech. You know what it contains? Meer's protesting yell of "I AM NOT SCREWING GARRUS" =) It's absurdly hilarious =)

Modifié par Noelemahc, 23 avril 2012 - 02:51 .

[JesseLee202]

Mr. Big Pimpin wrote...

Nope, she's straight.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^


She likes manly shep. 

[Unit-Alpha]

Baihu1983 wrote...

Unit-Alpha wrote...

Noelemahc wrote...

Sorry, that was intentional hyperbole on my part; I'm perfectly find with the current ratio. I still attest that changing a character's sexual orientation after midway through a plotline is an example of poor writing on Bioware's part.

Oh. Sorry.

Who else except for Kaidan changes, anyway? Is it actually THAT jarring or it's a knee-jerk reaction along the lines of "OMG, why did they do it, he's too cute to be gay-- oh wait", etc, etc?

No, Kaiden is the big example. I don't have an issue with him being bisexual in the story, it's just that I know that doing that kind of character shift that is unrelated to plot development is just a hamfisted way of retconning a character's identity. Nothing more.

Same with Male Shep, dont think his shown any sign of being gay/Bi in the first 2 games?

I can accept this as it is the player character, the one we are supposed to define ourselves.

[Taboo]

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 23 avril 2012 - 02:52 .

[JesseLee202]

dreaming_raithe wrote...

I was really disappointed with this, too. You can argue that Tali is straight, but FemShep gets all the same flirty dialogue with her that BroShep does. She blushes just the same when she mentions linking suits with Shepard whether Shepard is male or female. If she just wanted to suit-link the way her mom and "Auntie Raan" did, she wouldn't be blushing about it.

People say a lot of the time that Bioware records all of the dialogue with both Meer and Hale, but I'm not sure I buy that. I don't think anyone's ever uncovered left over dialogue of Meer flirting with Jacob, for instance, and from what I remember, Meer has completely different dialogue choices with Jacob compared to Hale (though I've only done BroShep once).

It really feels like they changed their minds later and chopped off the options for FemShep.

It was cut, and so it is not canon. And for them to go back now releasing DLC would be offensive. Is it really so hard to ask for a heto romance without people complaining? There are plenty of... other... options out there... 

[JesseLee202]

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

[dreaming_raithe]

Noelemahc wrote...

Leftover dialogues of DudeShep/Thane are present in the French release of the game, BTW. It's a mirror of FemShep's as well, no unique lines.

There's only one such line in the ME2 files, attached to the trigger that is the DudeShep's analogue for FemShep's "Garrus is very dear to me" in Mordin's sex ed speech. You know what it contains? Meer's protesting yell of "I AM NOT SCREWING GARRUS" =) It's absurdly hilarious =)

I've heard rumors that Thane, Tali, and someone else (Garrus, I think?) were going to be romance options for both Shepards originally. Something about pre-release interviews stating that some of the LIs would be available to both. I've never actually seen them, though, as I came into ME2 late (as a PS3 player) so I missed all the pre-release hype. That would go a long way toward explaining some of the left-over dialogue, if it's actually true.

It really just seems odd to me that they'd actually record all of the dialogue for both actors if they never intended to use it. It feels like that'd be a waste of time.

[JesseLee202]

dreaming_raithe wrote...

Noelemahc wrote...

Leftover dialogues of DudeShep/Thane are present in the French release of the game, BTW. It's a mirror of FemShep's as well, no unique lines.

There's only one such line in the ME2 files, attached to the trigger that is the DudeShep's analogue for FemShep's "Garrus is very dear to me" in Mordin's sex ed speech. You know what it contains? Meer's protesting yell of "I AM NOT SCREWING GARRUS" =) It's absurdly hilarious =)

I've heard rumors that Thane, Tali, and someone else (Garrus, I think?) were going to be romance options for both Shepards originally. Something about pre-release interviews stating that some of the LIs would be available to both. I've never actually seen them, though, as I came into ME2 late (as a PS3 player) so I missed all the pre-release hype. That would go a long way toward explaining some of the left-over dialogue, if it's actually true.

It really just seems odd to me that they'd actually record all of the dialogue for both actors if they never intended to use it. It feels like that'd be a waste of time.

Actually I think it would save time. Record as much as you can in a session, so you wouldn't have to call them back over and over. IDK we should just ask BW about this.

[Taboo]

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

There is evidence to support these claims. It isn't something that you can just dismiss.

[Unit-Alpha]

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

Sexuality is not based on a conscious decision, that much is apparent.

[JesseLee202]

Taboo-XX wrote...

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

There is evidence to support these claims. It isn't something that you can just dismiss.

Show me. cite ye sources

[dreaming_raithe]

JesseLee202 wrote...

dreaming_raithe wrote...

I was really disappointed with this, too. You can argue that Tali is straight, but FemShep gets all the same flirty dialogue with her that BroShep does. She blushes just the same when she mentions linking suits with Shepard whether Shepard is male or female. If she just wanted to suit-link the way her mom and "Auntie Raan" did, she wouldn't be blushing about it.

People say a lot of the time that Bioware records all of the dialogue with both Meer and Hale, but I'm not sure I buy that. I don't think anyone's ever uncovered left over dialogue of Meer flirting with Jacob, for instance, and from what I remember, Meer has completely different dialogue choices with Jacob compared to Hale (though I've only done BroShep once).

It really feels like they changed their minds later and chopped off the options for FemShep.

It was cut, and so it is not canon. And for them to go back now releasing DLC would be offensive. Is it really so hard to ask for a heto romance without people complaining? There are plenty of... other... options out there... 

That's not the point--if a character is supposed to be heterosexual, that's fine. It never bothered me that Jacob doesn't hit on BroShep or anything. I also don't care that Cortez isn't interested in FemShep or that Miranda isn't, either. The dialogue with those characters is constructed so that you don't get the impression that they *are* interested. The cut off point for Tali make it seem like the romance was originally there (and in fact, all the dialogue files are on the disc).

For what it's worth, my original FemShep didn't *have* any options. If a "hit on this person" line felt really awkward for her character, I never chose it, which is why she never romanced Garrus, for instance (because she wouldn't make such a blatant request for sex). She did accuse Tali of blushing because it was more subtle, but that romance option was for some reason cut out of the game even though the work was already done.

In ME3, from what I understand, her only romance option was actually Traynor, since she didn't romance Garrus in ME2 and Kaiden died on Virmire. Somewhere along the way, she missed even the option for Traynor to get in the shower. So she got a very sad scene when she woke up before the final assault with no one there.

To be honest, if the cut-off on the dialogue with Tali was done better, I don't think I would have cared as much. I would have been slightly annoyed, I think (because I played DA2 before ME2 and went into the latter with certain assumptions regarding romances), but I would have been cool with it.

Modifié par dreaming_raithe, 23 avril 2012 - 03:16 .

[Unit-Alpha]

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

There is evidence to support these claims. It isn't something that you can just dismiss.

Show me. cite ye sources

So you believe those homosexual reform camps actually work? Because they are based on your logic.

[Severyx]

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

JesseLee202 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

People do not become gay nor do they become bisexual. Go open a book on human psychology and read the chapter on sexuality. Please stop creating these threads.

Sexuality and attraction are based upon genetic markers, alleles and come to find out brain plasticity. It is not a choice, nor is it something that is in anyway harmful.

Because books are always correct and are infallible...  

There is evidence to support these claims. It isn't something that you can just dismiss.

Show me. cite ye sources

As much as I'd love to see people debate this, I think it's a bit off-topic. Don't you two?

[CHALET]

Not every character has to turn bisexual at the sight of Shepard. This isn't Dragon Age.