418 réponses à ce sujet

[Persephone]

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...

So everything MUST be spoon fed to the audience these days?

Back in the day, endings that challenged the audience were appreciated. I.E. "Gone With The Wind". Ocne THAT got its tacked on "closure" and "happy ending" crap, no one was happy with either.

I think that is the difference between a book or movie and a game: In the former, you watch. If the author wants an open end, fine.

In the latter, WE DIRECT SHEPHARD. We feel like him, fell AS him. We want to get our happy ending because WE WORKED FOR IT.

In a movie, we watch. If an open end makes sense, ok.

But in Mass Effect, we WORKED for our good ending. I am surely not the only one who wasted hours on scanning for minerals and doing sidequests for Paragon / Renegade points so you could solve teammate conflicts in ME2. I am not the only one who wasted time with this sh!tty Planet scanning and Reaper escaping in ME3. We invested that time because we hoped that, in the end, it would change a "everyone dies" ending into a "everyone is happy, Liara bears my children, with Garrus being their Godfather, Joker finally finds love in EDI, there is peace and harmony like in a freaking hippie musical and we watch ponies and rainbows" ending.
[/i]

Now there is an ending I WOULD actually oppose. I think I'm choking on the saccharine here. Sorry, but it doesn't get more clichee and dull.

[Tirigon]

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

[Sinnerous]

This is obviously a lie.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Persephone wrote...

Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...

Persephone wrote...
So everything MUST be spoon fed to the audience these days?

Back in the day, endings that challenged the audience were appreciated. I.E. "Gone With The Wind". One THAT got its tacked on "closure" and "happy ending" crap, no one was happy with either.

Vital information is not "spoon feeding."

Which of your squadmates (or galactic races for that matter) survived the final battle?  Did Shepard survive his injuries in the best ending?

We don't have to know what happens in the centuries that followed... but even Gone With The Wind provided a solid springboard for speculation... not plot holes and plot gaps.  Big difference.

The game does not resolve these things... when Bioware said they would.  Your stance is faulty on that point alone.

Use your imagination. Or wait for more content.

I have yet to see plot holes and gaps in the endings. And GWTW provided no more than ME3 did.

In case you haven't heard the hallucination/indoctination theories, we are using our imagination already... but plot holes are plot holes.  You don't see plot holes because you're in your own world.. not the game's (ie.  You're using your imagination and not going off of what the game gave you).

How did your LI/squadmates that were with you when you charged toward the beam get on the Normandy?  (Plot Hole)

How did Shepard survive Earth's re-entry/the Citadel's explosion/oxygen-less vacuum of space with virtually no armor or shield systems?  If your answer is hallucination/indoctrination... did Shepard even stop the Reapers?  (plot hole/plot gap)

Please be aware of what a plot hole/plot gap is before you respond with "use your imagination."  By default, any plot hole can be filled with "your imagination."  That's a cop-out and an excuse.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 14 mars 2012 - 07:41 .

[Rafe34]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

That is why most polls get wrong results or different ones to what expected when the reailty and actual numbers are tallied. The flaw in polls is making vast assumptions. You cannot claim majority based on assumption. The only thing you actually have as far as data goes shows that a few thousand people disliked the endings (end of story), that is all you have but on the otherside Bioware made millions of sales. Your using whatever number you can come up with to somehow corner Bioware when in reality they have nothing to be cornered by. They made millions of sale, a few thousand appear to be complaining.


As for your comment above that you feel pissed off that other people enjoyed what you did not and expressed as such, also bare in mind they did not come into your thread throwing disdain and hyperbole at you for your dislikes. You on the other hand did come into his and attacked him.

If that is true why is it that there is only a small amount of people that seem to like the ending?

BSN is filled with the most arrogant, childish, selfish and self entitled people who buy Biowares games which is why they have had to update the rules and remind people of such recently. Also note happy people don't tend to in general moan and complain and most customers don't feel the need to register on a site or bicker with others over a game.

It's not entitlement to want the product we were promised, with a definitive ending, where our choices mattered, and where we werent left with more questions than answers, exactly as Hudson and Gamble promised us.

It's just being justifiably pissed off.

Modifié par Rafe34, 14 mars 2012 - 07:39 .

[Persephone]

PresidentCowboy wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

Hang on to that feeling and don't let anyone else tell you otherwise.

This. I envy you OP, and that's not trying to be condescending. I really really want to enjoy it because at the moment it's souring the entire series for me.

Why? I would have liked better endings myself but I don't get the "This ruined the whole series for meeeee!" melodrama. ME3 had moments of greatness the other two could never touch. And nothing will take that away from me.

[Harbinger of your Destiny]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

That is why most polls get wrong results or different ones to what expected when the reailty and actual numbers are tallied. The flaw in polls is making vast assumptions. You cannot claim majority based on assumption. The only thing you actually have as far as data goes shows that a few thousand people disliked the endings (end of story), that is all you have but on the otherside Bioware made millions of sales. Your using whatever number you can come up with to somehow corner Bioware when in reality they have nothing to be cornered by. They made millions of sale, a few thousand appear to be complaining.


As for your comment above that you feel pissed off that other people enjoyed what you did not and expressed as such, also bare in mind they did not come into your thread throwing disdain and hyperbole at you for your dislikes. You on the other hand did come into his and attacked him.

If that is true why is it that there is only a small amount of people that seem to like the ending?

BSN is filled with the most arrogant, childish, selfish and self entitled people who buy Biowares games which is why they have had to update the rules and remind people of such recently. Also note happy people don't tend to in general moan and complain and most customers don't feel the need to register on a site or bicker with others over a game.

Really did this happen with Mass Effect 1 and 2?  Oh I'm sure some people weren't happy with some parts of the game but on the whole people loved it and if you were to poll the forums that would have been shown. Do you know why people came to the forums why I personally came to these forums? BECAUSE WE LOVED MASS EFFECT !!! If people had the same issue with Mass Effect 1 as they did with Mass Effect 3 I guarantee you that Mass Effect would have flopped.

Modifié par Harbinger of your Destiny, 14 mars 2012 - 07:40 .

[Tirigon]

Persephone wrote...


Now there is an ending I WOULD actually oppose. I think I'm choking on the saccharine here. Sorry, but it doesn't get more clichee and dull.

Which, in fact, is the entire point of it.

And obviously it shouldnt be the only one - there should also be an ending where you majorly f*ck up andeveryone gets harvested, and one where Shepard wins but the stress he went through breaks him and he dies alone as crazed madman, and all that sh!t.
There should be a happy ending for those who want that, and others for those who dont.

[Rafe34]

Persephone wrote...

PresidentCowboy wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

Hang on to that feeling and don't let anyone else tell you otherwise.

This. I envy you OP, and that's not trying to be condescending. I really really want to enjoy it because at the moment it's souring the entire series for me.

Why? I would have liked better endings myself but I don't get the "This ruined the whole series for meeeee!" melodrama. ME3 had moments of greatness the other two could never touch. And nothing will take that away from me.

Because the moments of greatness mean nothing in the end.

The sacrifice of certain people to save an entire race, if you know what I mean, doesn't matter because that race will now starve to death in the Sol system due to only having FTL travel and no way they have enough dextro-based food to make it back.

[Persephone]

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

[Harbinger of your Destiny]

Persephone wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

Since when is expecting the same amount of quality in the end of the game as the rest of the game had all of a sudden entitlement?

[Rafe34]

Persephone wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...

So everything MUST be spoon fed to the audience these days?

Back in the day, endings that challenged the audience were appreciated. I.E. "Gone With The Wind". Ocne THAT got its tacked on "closure" and "happy ending" crap, no one was happy with either.

I think that is the difference between a book or movie and a game: In the former, you watch. If the author wants an open end, fine.

In the latter, WE DIRECT SHEPHARD. We feel like him, fell AS him. We want to get our happy ending because WE WORKED FOR IT.

In a movie, we watch. If an open end makes sense, ok.

But in Mass Effect, we WORKED for our good ending. I am surely not the only one who wasted hours on scanning for minerals and doing sidequests for Paragon / Renegade points so you could solve teammate conflicts in ME2. I am not the only one who wasted time with this sh!tty Planet scanning and Reaper escaping in ME3. We invested that time because we hoped that, in the end, it would change a "everyone dies" ending into a "everyone is happy, Liara bears my children, with Garrus being their Godfather, Joker finally finds love in EDI, there is peace and harmony like in a freaking hippie musical and we watch ponies and rainbows" ending.
[/i]

Now there is an ending I WOULD actually oppose. I think I'm choking on the saccharine here. Sorry, but it doesn't get more clichee and dull.

Right. Because Lord of the Rings would have been so much better if Frodo and Sam learned that to destroy the ring they would have to kill all the elves and the hobbits, and then die themselves.

[Vasarkian]

Persephone wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

The game is incomplete though, promised functions are not functioning properly, and key content is obviously missing despite dedicating 27+ hours to getting it only to find it does nothing.

You've sidetracked this entire thread btw.

[Persephone]

Rafe34 wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

That is why most polls get wrong results or different ones to what expected when the reailty and actual numbers are tallied. The flaw in polls is making vast assumptions. You cannot claim majority based on assumption. The only thing you actually have as far as data goes shows that a few thousand people disliked the endings (end of story), that is all you have but on the otherside Bioware made millions of sales. Your using whatever number you can come up with to somehow corner Bioware when in reality they have nothing to be cornered by. They made millions of sale, a few thousand appear to be complaining.


As for your comment above that you feel pissed off that other people enjoyed what you did not and expressed as such, also bare in mind they did not come into your thread throwing disdain and hyperbole at you for your dislikes. You on the other hand did come into his and attacked him.

If that is true why is it that there is only a small amount of people that seem to like the ending?

BSN is filled with the most arrogant, childish, selfish and self entitled people who buy Biowares games which is why they have had to update the rules and remind people of such recently. Also note happy people don't tend to in general moan and complain and most customers don't feel the need to register on a site or bicker with others over a game.

It's not entitlement to want the product we were promised, with a definitive ending, where our choices mattered, and where we werent left with more questions than answers, exactly as Hudson and Gamble promised us.

It's just being justifiably pissed off.

Choices did matter throughout the bloody game.

Rant and rave all you like. See how far tantrums will get you.

[dfstone]

The biggest dissapointment about the end, Kaiden. Romanced Kaiden, got sloppy drunk with him, made passionate love to him and expressed my undying love, then threw myself into a giant laser. Thats pretty damn rude. And Kaiden had to walk out of the Normandy wreck all alone watching Joker and EDI get it on. I mean hell, the poor guy...

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Persephone wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

So totally wrong.  When it's for sale, customers are entitled to say whatever they want.  This isn't some free "gift" from Bioware.  We're investors... and investors can say whatever they want about what they're investing in.

And did you really try to take the "Don't like it don't buy it" stance?  Think it through... who knew about this ending before they bought it.  Seriously, calm down and think things through.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 14 mars 2012 - 07:45 .

[Dragoonlordz]

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

That is why most polls get wrong results or different ones to what expected when the reailty and actual numbers are tallied. The flaw in polls is making vast assumptions. You cannot claim majority based on assumption. The only thing you actually have as far as data goes shows that a few thousand people disliked the endings (end of story), that is all you have but on the otherside Bioware made millions of sales. Your using whatever number you can come up with to somehow corner Bioware when in reality they have nothing to be cornered by. They made millions of sale, a few thousand appear to be complaining.


As for your comment above that you feel pissed off that other people enjoyed what you did not and expressed as such, also bare in mind they did not come into your thread throwing disdain and hyperbole at you for your dislikes. You on the other hand did come into his and attacked him.

If that is true why is it that there is only a small amount of people that seem to like the ending?

BSN is filled with the most arrogant, childish, selfish and self entitled people who buy Biowares games which is why they have had to update the rules and remind people of such recently. Also note happy people don't tend to in general moan and complain and most customers don't feel the need to register on a site or bicker with others over a game.

Really did this happen with Mass Effect 1 and 2?  Oh I'm sure some people weren't happy with some parts of the game but on the whole people loved it and if you were to poll the forums that would have been shown. Do you know why people came to the forums why I personally came to these forums? BECAUSE WE LOVED MASS EFFECT !!! If people had the same issue with Mass Effect 3 as they did with Mass Effect 1 I guarantee you that Mass Effect would have flopped.

I would bet on it not having flopped at all. BSN jumps up and down and throws hissy fits and toys out the pram at the slightest element they dislike. With each new title they get more arrogant and agressive. They most of the time feel Bioware owes them when they do not actually owe them anymore than what is written on the box or label of the product. After a few weeks to a month from releasing a new game these forums tend to get more civil and those ranting and attacking other people who might have enjoyed something they did not tends to get lower in occurrence even if does not vanish completley. Honestley with fans like some of those on here, the phrase "with friends lke you, who needs enemies" could be applied with great validity. This post this thread served one purpose to let Bioware know the OP enjoyed what he bought, he did not go into other threads and attack them but you feel you have the right and entitled (some of you) to attack his thread because he liked something you did not. Grow up and take a good long look at yourselves in the mirror.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 14 mars 2012 - 07:46 .

[Rafe34]

Persephone wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

Persephone wrote...
Better company than melodramatic, entitled fanbrats, I gotta say.:innocent:

Actually, we ARE entitled.
BioWare make a game for their fans, who pay their wages by buying it. We are not talking about some obscure artist uploading his garage recordings to YouTube.

That guy can go "hey, its for me, if you dont like it dont watch". A company whose business is making games cant. Not if they want to stay in business, at any rate.

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

They TOLD us that it would be a definitive ending, that it wouldn't be simply A, B, C choices, that are choices would matter, and that they wouldn't pull a lost on us.

So we listened and we bought the game, and then they did EXACTLY what they told us they wouldn't do.

What part of this is not getting through to you? We're mad because they promised us a product they didn't end up giving us! It's not being entitled, it's being pissed off because we were LIED to.

[Persephone]

Rafe34 wrote...

Persephone wrote...

PresidentCowboy wrote...

loungeshep wrote...

Hang on to that feeling and don't let anyone else tell you otherwise.

This. I envy you OP, and that's not trying to be condescending. I really really want to enjoy it because at the moment it's souring the entire series for me.

Why? I would have liked better endings myself but I don't get the "This ruined the whole series for meeeee!" melodrama. ME3 had moments of greatness the other two could never touch. And nothing will take that away from me.

Because the moments of greatness mean nothing in the end.

The sacrifice of certain people to save an entire race, if you know what I mean, doesn't matter because that race will now starve to death in the Sol system due to only having FTL travel and no way they have enough dextro-based food to make it back.

And that's what makes it POWERFULLY TRAGIC rather than meaning "nothing". That's what I actually like about it.

[Tirigon]

Persephone wrote...

You are in NO WAY entitled to tell ANYONE how to finish their own creation. Don't like it? Don't buy it, like an adult.

Oh of course. I rented the game from a friend, which is why you dont see that ME3 icon under my profile. And actually, at Rannoch I was close to running to a shop and buy it for myself (even though I hate Origins), but the endings changed my opinion on that.

But I think it is valid to demand they do what they promised, and it is valid to criticize if they didnt.

Oh and by the way, BioWare advertised by saying that you could create your very own Shepard, so you actually PROVE my point because BioWare took that choice away with the endings that didnt reflect your actions.

[Rafe34]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Harbinger of your Destiny wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

That is why most polls get wrong results or different ones to what expected when the reailty and actual numbers are tallied. The flaw in polls is making vast assumptions. You cannot claim majority based on assumption. The only thing you actually have as far as data goes shows that a few thousand people disliked the endings (end of story), that is all you have but on the otherside Bioware made millions of sales. Your using whatever number you can come up with to somehow corner Bioware when in reality they have nothing to be cornered by. They made millions of sale, a few thousand appear to be complaining.


As for your comment above that you feel pissed off that other people enjoyed what you did not and expressed as such, also bare in mind they did not come into your thread throwing disdain and hyperbole at you for your dislikes. You on the other hand did come into his and attacked him.

If that is true why is it that there is only a small amount of people that seem to like the ending?

BSN is filled with the most arrogant, childish, selfish and self entitled people who buy Biowares games which is why they have had to update the rules and remind people of such recently. Also note happy people don't tend to in general moan and complain and most customers don't feel the need to register on a site or bicker with others over a game.

Really did this happen with Mass Effect 1 and 2?  Oh I'm sure some people weren't happy with some parts of the game but on the whole people loved it and if you were to poll the forums that would have been shown. Do you know why people came to the forums why I personally came to these forums? BECAUSE WE LOVED MASS EFFECT !!! If people had the same issue with Mass Effect 3 as they did with Mass Effect 1 I guarantee you that Mass Effect would have flopped.

I would bet on it not having flopped at all. BSN jusmps up and down and throws hissy fits and toys out the pram at the slightest element they dislike. With each new title they get more arrogant and agressive. They most of the time feel Bioware owes them when they do not actually owe them anymore than what is written on the box or label of the product. After a few weeks to a month from releasing a new game these forums tend to get more civil and those ranting and attacking other people who might have enjoyed something they did not tends to get lower in occurrence even if does not vanish completley. Honestley with fans like some of those on here, the phrase "with friends lke you, who needs enemies" could be applied with great validity. 

I notice you didn't answer the point. Because it's not answerable. The boards were not like this at all for ME1 or ME2. Sure people didn't like it, but it was nowhere near the vast majority opinion we have on the ME3 endings, 90-10. So obviously, these forums are not just for people who are whiny and entitled and only come on here if they don't like a game, since we loved ME1 and ME2.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

You don't even know how the game ended... lol, how could it be powerfully anything with absolute certainty?

[Dragoonlordz]

Rafe34 wrote...

Dragoonlordz wrote...

I would bet on it not having flopped at all. BSN jumps up and down and throws hissy fits and toys out the pram at the slightest element they dislike. With each new title they get more arrogant and agressive. They most of the time feel Bioware owes them when they do not actually owe them anymore than what is written on the box or label of the product. After a few weeks to a month from releasing a new game these forums tend to get more civil and those ranting and attacking other people who might have enjoyed something they did not tends to get lower in occurrence even if does not vanish completley. Honestley with fans like some of those on here, the phrase "with friends lke you, who needs enemies" could be applied with great validity. This post this thread served one purpose to let Bioware know the OP enjoyed what he bought, he did not go into other threads and attack them but you feel you have the right and entitled (some of you) to attack his thread because he liked something you did not. Grow up and take a good long look at yourselves in the mirror. 

I notice you didn't answer the point. Because it's not answerable. The boards were not like this at all for ME1 or ME2. Sure people didn't like it, but it was nowhere near the vast majority opinion we have on the ME3 endings, 90-10. So obviously, these forums are not just for people who are whiny and entitled and only come on here if they don't like a game, since we loved ME1 and ME2.

It also had vastly less user and members, I also stated it has got worse over time the fans immature attitudes and that is why it is worse now than prior. I answered the question you just did not acknowledge it.

Modifié par Dragoonlordz, 14 mars 2012 - 07:48 .