1717 réponses à ce sujet

[Akrim_Drak]

Zkyire wrote...

John Epler wrote...

canadianvandal wrote...

John Epler wrote...

J4mes wrote...

This is the problem with the world as we know it, people wanting to segregate themselves... then complain about being viewed as a separate segregated society.

What a double standard this thread is proving once again. It should be deleted.

I'm fairly certain that asking to play with those who respect their lifestyle, and as such won't use language that degrades that lifestyle is not 'segregation'. Nor is it a double standard.

it's not a 'lifestyle'

Sexual orientation, then. I misspoke.

The point is the same, however. Wanting to play with people who understand that certain terms are hurtful and cause negative sentiment is not segregationist, nor do I see any problem with it.

*snip stuff*
What I'd like to know is what are the levels of claimed homophobic attitudes (where the players are doing nothing but make assumptions about the meaning of what the other person said - remember, context is everything), vs the instances of actual directed homophobic abuse whereby the other people are specifically inferring some kind of hatred of threats against a person based on their sexual orientation.

Given the very nature of the OP, it is likely the former, and not the latter is the case, thus bringing it all back to the fear of crime being more common than the instances of crime, leading them to segregate themselves from the wider community based on this fear, and not actual instances of homophobia.

Have you played on XBox Live like ever? Especially a "shooter" type of game? People aren't "worried it will happen so they're trying to avoid it". It happens EVERY SINGLE DAY. It's not as bad on PC but I've been called a F** more than once, and retarded, or gay etc. and I have no gay characteristics that one could noticably tell. The online gaming environment IS a very hostile place for people who aren't white and male, period. It's not at all about fear, it's FACT.

And it doesn't matter if the word is meant in the context or not. I could say "Wow, that dude was such a N***** and mean dumb or stupid etc. and it would not be okay. Those words should just NEVER be used, period. Also believe it or not when people say "Oh that's so gay!" meaning stupid, it does hurt gay people. Because gay =/= stupid. It's just not okay to say, at all, and that's why we seek each other and like-minded individuals out, because it hurts, and makes some games freaking unplayable. I'll never play another online FPS because of the crap that's spewed.

Modifié par Akrim_Drak, 16 avril 2012 - 11:28 .

[Felhand]

Marionettenspieler wrote...

I'll play with anyone regardless of sexuality so...

Origin: Eiyuu_Ou

Can't really handle gold yet, but I can handle myself in silver fairly well.

Gold isnt really THAT bad people just get there nickers in a bunch because the jump in difficulty from bronze to silver is so steep they figure the jump from silver to gold must be a step into hell, just requires less screwing around and more talking.

[ntstlkrsod]

Gay friendly : Origin ntstlkr160 (send me a pm if you're a BF3 player too)

[Repojam]

I'll play with anyone. PC tag is the same name as it is on BSN, on PS3 it's Arrogance_Un-ltd. I'm utterly mute when it comes to online gaming, since I can't be troubled to pick up the microphone on the PC and refuse to get one for the PS3.

[Marionettenspieler]

Felhand wrote...

Marionettenspieler wrote...

I'll play with anyone regardless of sexuality so...

Origin: Eiyuu_Ou

Can't really handle gold yet, but I can handle myself in silver fairly well.

Gold isnt really THAT bad people just get there nickers in a bunch because the jump in difficulty from bronze to silver is so steep they figure the jump from silver to gold must be a step into hell, just requires less screwing around and more talking.

That's part of the problem. My mic is on the fritz most of the time. So I can't really talk lol. I'll follow most "orders" though, as long as I don't find them completly retarded.

Modifié par Marionettenspieler, 16 avril 2012 - 11:30 .

[Roninraver]

Zkyire wrote...

*snip*

Few points.


One, it isn't segregated.  The OP is very inclusive in the criteria for the list.  The only people who would be excluded under the terms the OP stated are those who would "commit the crimes" to put it in a term you'd be comfortable with.

The only people who are not welcome to the dinner are those who would steal the flatware and the good china.

If only there was an analogue for those kinds of people in the real world...

Oh yeah!  Criminals.  Your problem is...?


Second, you're right that context is important.  But context is a two way street.
It is based on the intended meaning of the speaker, and the interpretation of the listener.

What YOU and many people need to understand, is that while you do have a right to say 'XYZ' and then say "Whoah, hold on now.  That's not what I meant when I said 'XYZ'", the person who heard and was possibly offended by 'XYZ' has just as much right to say "I don't care what your intent was, this is how I interpreted it."

If the listener decides to explain their reasoning for the interpretation, or you explain your intent, and the two of you make up after and come to some reconciliation is irrelevant.

The point is, you don't get to choose how other people hear what you say.  You get to pick your words and say them, they get to hear those words and interpret them.

That's the deal.  You don't get to control both halves of an exchange.

Modifié par Roninraver, 16 avril 2012 - 11:33 .

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

[quote]mangrilla wrote...

[quote]Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

"Homophobe" is a hate word.[/quote]
No, it's not.  It's an accurate depiction, but that's only if you know the definition, which you clearly don't.  
[/quote]

"Homophobe" has been used frequently in this very thread as a hate word to smear those who have suggested the thread title is offensive to them. I have said nothing against the "gay community." I have a gay friend who I have known for years. Unlike some people however, he feels no need to throw his sexual preferences in my face and has no need to inform everyone he meets that he is gay.  I'm quite sure he would not start a "Gay-friendly chess club", "Homosexual basketball league," or " Gay Computer Gamer Club."  Sexuality does not enter into any of those activities.

[quote]
[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
I think if someone used the word "heterophobe" you would be offended.[/quote]  
Probably amused by the stupidity of the person who used that word.  Do you see even the slightest hint of antipathy of heterosexuals in this thread?  Probably not, considering the OP openly welcomes straight allies like me.
[/quote]

Yes. I see a number of people constantly throwing around insulting phrases like homophobe and bigot.  I would say many of those who constantly resort to such hate speech are in fact heterophobes. They have a prejudice againt heterosexuals all the while accusing the heterosexuals of being the ones with a prejudice. I could care less how many people of what gender anyone sleeps with. When I play multiplayer I am playing the game, not discussing my or anyone else's sex life. I don't wear my sex life on my sleeve and don't understand anyone who does.

[quote]
 Let me guess, you're one of those brainiacs who wonders why there isn't a "White history Month" too, aren't you?
[/quote]

I resent you claiming I am a racist. Actually, however, if "Black History Month" is not prejudicial why would "White History Month" be prejudicial? I believe in equal treatment for ALL people. By the way, I am of mixed racial heritage. A "Hines 57." 

[quote]
[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
Anyways, why should anyone feel the need to announce whether they like to have sex with men or women in this forum?  I assume if you are playing the game with someone you will be talking about tactics while the game is going on. I've never heard anyone talk about sex during the game. In fact I DON'T want to hear about anyone's sexual escapades when playing a game.[/quote]
If you're actually curious about the answer to this question, they're right here in this thread.  But my bet's on you being a homophobic troll.
[/quote]

I resent your insults. I am not a homophobic troll. I neiter fear nor hate homosexuals. I love all people.

[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
Crusades for any " special political rights" for special interest groups has no place in the multiplayer thread in my opinion.
[/quote]
Well, you're in luck!  This thread doesn't ask for anything of the kind.  Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
[/quote]

My discussions have been civil. It is sad you have chosen to not respond in kind. 

I am neither "gay friendly" nor "gay unfriendly." I do not care what you do in your bedroom frankly. I just don't particularly want to hear about it during gaming sessions.

Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 16 avril 2012 - 11:38 .

[AHadley23]

I could certainly do with some teammates... firm ally here. I've been known to be quite firm with people who use homophobic slurs in a casual manner.

My Origin username is the same as my BSN handle.

[Mckay91]

It's about getting together with people who share interests? Doesn't mean you're going to get along, as far as I can tell the only interest you'll share is banging dudes.

I don't automatically get on with other straight players because we clearly share an interest.

One of my best Xbox Live friends is gay, and I jump into the gay banter, like he'll ask me which 2 male celebrities I'd prefer to sleep with. And I joke I only like him for his body etc.

[Grumpy Old Wizard]

[quote]mangrilla wrote...

[quote]Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

"Homophobe" is a hate word.[/quote]
No, it's not.  It's an accurate depiction, but that's only if you know the definition, which you clearly don't.  
[/quote]
[/quote]

"Homophobe" has been used frequently in this very thread as a hate word to smear those who have suggested the thread title is offensive to them. I have said nothing against the "gay community." I have a gay friend who I have known for years. Unlike some people however, he feels no need to throw his sexual preferences in my face and has no need to inform everyone he meets that he is gay.  I'm quite sure he would not start a "Gay-friendly chess club", "Homosexual basketball league," or " Gay Computer Gamer Club."  Sexuality does not enter into any of those activities.

[quote]
[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
I think if someone used the word "heterophobe" you would be offended.[/quote]  
Probably amused by the stupidity of the person who used that word.  Do you see even the slightest hint of antipathy of heterosexuals in this thread?  Probably not, considering the OP openly welcomes straight allies like me.
[/quote]

Yes. I see a number of people constantly throwing around insulting phrases like homophobe and bigot.  I would say many of those who constantly resort to such hate speech are in fact heterophobes. They have a prejudice againt heterosexuals all the while accusing the heterosexuals of being the ones with a prejudice. I could care less how many people of what gender anyone sleeps with. When I play multiplayer I am playing the game, not discussing my or anyone else's sex life. I don't wear my sex life on my sleeve and don't understand anyone who does.

[quote]
 Let me guess, you're one of those brainiacs who wonders why there isn't a "White history Month" too, aren't you?
[/quote]

I resent you claiming I am a racist. Actually, however, if "Black History Month" is not prejudicial why would "White History Month" be prejudicial? I believe in equal treatment for ALL people. By the way, I am of mixed racial heritage. A "Hines 57." 

[quote]
[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
Anyways, why should anyone feel the need to announce whether they like to have sex with men or women in this forum?  I assume if you are playing the game with someone you will be talking about tactics while the game is going on. I've never heard anyone talk about sex during the game. In fact I DON'T want to hear about anyone's sexual escapades when playing a game.[/quote]
If you're actually curious about the answer to this question, they're right here in this thread.  But my bet's on you being a homophobic troll.
[/quote]

I resent your insults. I am not a homophobic troll. I neiter fear nor hate homosexuals. I love all people.

[quote]
[quote] Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
Crusades for any " special political rights" for special interest groups has no place in the multiplayer thread in my opinion.
[/quote]
Well, you're in luck!  This thread doesn't ask for anything of the kind.  Don't let the door hit you on the way out.
[/quote]

My discussions have been civil. It is sad you have chosen to not respond in kind. 

I am neither "gay friendly" nor "gay unfriendly." I do not care what you do in your bedroom frankly. I just don't particularly want to hear about it during gaming sessions.
[/quote]

Modifié par Grumpy Old Wizard, 16 avril 2012 - 11:40 .

[AHadley23]

Mckay91 wrote...

It's about getting together with people who share interests? Doesn't mean you're going to get along, as far as I can tell the only interest you'll share is banging dudes.

You mean, apart from the other four types of people being specifically recruited in the thread?

[xtorma]

AHadley23 wrote...

Mckay91 wrote...

It's about getting together with people who share interests? Doesn't mean you're going to get along, as far as I can tell the only interest you'll share is banging dudes.

You mean, apart from the other four types of people being specifically recruited in the thread?

I've read the entire thread. It's degraded into a political/social discussion. needs to go. there are other forums more suited for this kind of debate.

[Roninraver]

Mckay91 wrote...

It's about getting together with people who share interests? Doesn't mean you're going to get along, as far as I can tell the only interest you'll share is banging dudes.

I don't automatically get on with other straight players because we clearly share an interest.

One of my best Xbox Live friends is gay, and I jump into the gay banter, like he'll ask me which 2 male celebrities I'd prefer to sleep with. And I joke I only like him for his body etc.

Okay, so you might have read the OP and just failed to comprehend?

That is slightly more acceptable.  I don't know quite HOW you could have failed to understand, as it is pretty clearly laid out...

xyzmkrysvr wrote...

I've suffered through too many random matches where I hear things like "geth hunters are SO gay!" or "that guy just wasted a missile on a pack of phantoms?!? What a f*****g f****t!" 
Now, I certainly can't speak for everyone in the gay community, but I take serious offense to that, especially when the derrogatory remarks are directed at me or another player.

That’s *another* reason why I created this thread: I wanted to find gay-friendly people I could feel comfortable playing with, knowing that they wouldn’t call me the F word if I didn’t make it to the LZ in time!

But then I played a match with some random people who started throwing around the N word and telling racially-charged jokes about lynching, and I realized that what I REALLY wanted all along was to form groups of mature, respectful, open-minded individuals to play with.

...but better than not reading it at all, I suppose.

Do you get it now?  Do you understand the point of the thread?


Once more, with feeling!

xyzmkrysvr wrote...

to form groups of mature, respectful, open-minded individuals to play with.

I don't know how much clearer it can be said.

Modifié par Roninraver, 16 avril 2012 - 11:51 .

[Malkeor]

Jeez even when a Bioware staff member posts, people are still goin nuts.
Guys chill out, take this over an instant messaging program if you have too.
Stay on topic with the thread, you either post your name and want to play with others in a friendly environment, or you don't post here.

I'm tired of scrolling and sifting through garbage when i'm interesting in playing with folk, and if I got something to ask or say it's going to be buried in this vat of back and forth "what's-the-point-of-this-followed-by-endless ranting"

You don't like a post? Report it and move on. And I understand it's hard to stand back and watch without telling people to cool it, (i'm a fine example of giving in) But I want both sides to stop, and just leave the thread, and if you wanna argue with each other, go somewhere else and do it.
I can't be any clearer.

[Khirna]

I am not against LBGT and the such, and would have my name added to play with folks, but alas, my insults to other people might be a tad offensive to those I would be playing with.

I do like to see such a great initiative on behalf of the community here.

[MuteSyndrome]

Ok...I added pretty much everyone. Not very good at this yet, lol, but getting better.
EDIT: P.S. Is anyone going to talk about the game/playing together in this thread? lol
EDIT: Double P.S.: "I'm not homophobic! I have a gay friend...in this story." ;D
EDIT: TRIPLE P.S.: I'm gay and like to play with anyone. Haven't hooked up the mic yet though. Play mostly Bronze, sometimes Silver, have a Vangaurd and Adept.

Modifié par MuteSyndrome, 17 avril 2012 - 12:04 .

[SolidBeast]

Sure, I'll play with anyone friendly.
Origin ID: SolidBeastN7

Mostly play on silver, haven't gotten around even trying gold yet after the demo. Vanguard.

[AldarionnEB]

I'm straight, and I totally support this thread. There is plenty to be said for building a community of people who are respectful of everyone. Homosexuality isn't my thing, but if it's your thing, I support your right to it. If you want a tolerant teammate who can hold his own on Silver+ hit me up. My 360 gamertag is AldarionnEB.

[Deviija]

Oh my. "My friend is gay, so I have authority to speak on their behalf and the subject..." "Shoving your sexuality down my throat..." "They're the ones intolerant of my opinions." "They're oppressing us heteros/it's heterophobia..." and so much more. My homophobic bingo card is totally full! Gosh, what do I win? Social injustice.

[mangrilla]

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

"Homophobe" has been used frequently in this very thread as a hate word to smear those who have suggested the thread title is offensive to them.

The thread title is "Any Gay or (Gay-Friendly) Players Out There?"  You described this, I believe, as some kind of gay pride parade, and shoving sexuality into other people's faces.  You find something offensive about the title, I'm assuming, because it mentions homosexuality.  I'd say that probably counts as an aversion, on your part, to the mention of homosexuality, which I think pretty much fits the bill as far as homophobia is concerned. 

Another interpretation could be that you are offended by the title because you automatically assume that the only reason for it could be to discuss "what goes on in the bedroom."  And this pre-judgment, or, prejudice, if you will, causes you to be come in here and complain that you'd rather not see this kind of thread (AVERSION).  This is also homophobia.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
I have a gay friend who I have known for years. Unlike some people however, he feels no need to throw his sexual preferences in my face and has no need to inform everyone he meets that he is gay.

Again, the folks who make sexuality an issue are those members of the online community that constantly use derogatory and homophobic remarks.  This is simply people who have been offended by that who seek to play the game without that influence.  Additionally, your friend may choose to live his life however he pleases, but I don't think one homosexual's choices make the people on this thread's choice any less valid.  Additionally, perhaps he doesn't really mention homosexuality around you because you kind of show a lot of hostility towards the topic.  Just sayin'.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
Yes. I see a number of people constantly throwing around insulting phrases like homophobe and bigot.  I would say many of those who constantly resort to such hate speech are in fact heterophobes.

 
Sometimes one must call a spade a spade, GOW.  I've used the term bigot to describe members of the online community that use bigoted language.  I've used the term "homophobic" to describe folks, such as yourself, who clearly have issues, antipathy, aversion, etc. to a thread as innocent as this one simply because it mentions homosexuality.  Your reaction to a thread that openly welcomes heterosexuals (as long as they are not, in fact, going to use homophobic language) is to call it heterophobic?  Well look: If you can use the old "I've got a gay friend," canard as Proof Positive that you couldn't possibly be a homophobe, then what do you make of the fact that you're calling heterosexual members of this thread heterophobes?

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
They have a prejudice againt heterosexuals all the while accusing the heterosexuals of being the ones with a prejudice.

Please find me one example of a single commenter on this thread describing all heterosexuals in one way.  Please find me one serious comment here where someone openly called heterosexuals disgusting or anything of that nature.  Please don't judge me if I don't hold my breath waiting.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
When I play multiplayer I am playing the game, not discussing my or anyone else's sex life. I don't wear my sex life on my sleeve and don't understand anyone who does.

I've addressed this particular "point" of yours at least 4 times in this thread alone, not to mention the countless other posters who have also addressed it.  Later on in your response, you gripe about me not treating you with kindness.  Your apparent lack of respect to even understand what this thread is about is evidence of your blatant antipathy towards those in it.  If you can't even be bothered to respect the folks on this thread enough to understand what's going on before laying your BS judgment upon them, why on God's green Earth would you expect a SHRED of respect from me?

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
I resent you claiming I am a racist. Actually, however, if "Black History Month" is not prejudicial why would "White History Month" be prejudicial? I believe in equal treatment for ALL people. By the way, I am of mixed racial heritage. A "Hines 57."

I did not claim you were a racist, sir.  I'm merely pointing out that your privilege is showing.  If you actually give a damn, which I think it's fairly obvious you don't, you should look into the terms "Heteronormativity," and "male privilege".  Not to drag this thread even further off topic, but here I go: A person who believes that "Black History Month" is a double standard is blind to their own privilege, blind to the fact that black history month is necessary because, as the white folks are the majority and have held a disproportionate amount of power throughout this country's history, history in America is WHITE history.  Every month is white history month.  In that same way, you show heterosexual privilege, or "heteronormativity" by claiming that the mere MENTION of the word gay is throwing sexuality in your face.  Question: What about every film, television show, book, on the planet that openly depicts heterosexual couples finding each other, falling in love, and getting married?  Is that throwing heterosexuality in everyone's faces?  No?  But somehow, what has gone on in this thread is beyond the pale because... why?  Because it's gay people?  Again, your privilege is showing.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...

I resent your insults. I am not a homophobic troll. I neiter fear nor hate homosexuals. I love all people.

You say that, but your obvious lack of respect for the people in this thread, as evidenced by your inability to just read some of the posts before yammering on, certainly makes you seem like you're lying about the whole "love all people," thing.  If you truly DO love all people, why not read the thread which answers your questions re: "people talking about their sexual escapades in the game," (hint: THAT'S NOT WHAT THIS IS ABOUT, AT ALL).

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
My discussions have been civil. It is sad you have chosen to not respond in kind.  

Your willful ignorance of this thread's goals is evidence enough of hostility.

Grumpy Old Wizard wrote...
I am neither "gay friendly" nor "gay unfriendly." I do not care what you do in your bedroom frankly. I just don't particularly want to hear about it during gaming sessions.

Well, you're certainly not gay friendly since you presume to put words in the mouths of folks on this thread based on your own preconceived notions.  Again, no one is in here to find people to talk about gay sex with, but you're a little too steeped in your own prejudice and sanctimoniousness to realize that.

Modifié par mangrilla, 17 avril 2012 - 02:27 .

[coinop25]

MuteSyndrome wrote...

Ok...I added pretty much everyone. Not very good at this yet, lol, but getting better.
EDIT: P.S. Is anyone going to talk about the game/playing together in this thread? lol
EDIT: Double P.S.: "I'm not homophobic! I have a gay friend...in this story." ;D
EDIT: TRIPLE P.S.: I'm gay and like to play with anyone. Haven't hooked up the mic yet though. Play mostly Bronze, sometimes Silver, have a Vangaurd and Adept.

"Ah, yes, 'a gay friend.' We have dismissed this claim..."

[King Gigglez]

"I love this thread! It's exciting!"

[alienatedflea]

To grumpy old wizard...

Alright man, I am gonna tell it like it is...
I posted here last night.  And these gay or gay friendly people will use anything to justify why sexual preference matters.  My point last night is sexual preference of anyone is no one's business and its no one's fault but their own if you show off your true colors which might get negative reactions.  Being respectable because its the right thing is one thing but only being respectable to someone's choice of sexuality because "they have it harder" is a whole 'nother thing.  If the OP is looking for respectable gamers then say it, but he/she isnt looking for that.  The OP is looking for gay or gay friendly gamers...why? I guess to flirt with? if thats the case then say it! It shouldn't matter what other people think about you if you are happy with who you are...right?

Modifié par alienatedflea, 17 avril 2012 - 02:35 .

[T0X]

mfw this thread


Sorry for stealing your avatar, flea. Keir Dullea made me do it!

Modifié par T0X, 17 avril 2012 - 02:40 .

[Roninraver]

alienatedflea wrote...

To grumpy old wizard...

Alright man, I am gonna tell it like it is...
I posted here last night.  And these gay or gay friendly people will use anything to justify why sexual preference matters.  My point last night is sexual preference of anyone is no one's business and its no one's fault but their own if you show off your true colors which might get negative reactions.  Being respectable because its the right thing is one thing but only being respectable to someone's choice of sexuality because "they have it harder" is a whole 'nother thing.  If the OP is looking for respectable gamers then say it, but he/she isnt looking for that.  The OP is looking for gay or gay friendly gamers...why? I guess to flirt with? if thats the case then say it! It shouldn't matter what other people think about you if you are happy with who you are...right?

Yeah!  The OP SHOULD just come out and say that they're looking for respectable gamers to play with, rather than building a group to flirt in!

He should even put it in the OP, as a kind of mission statement or something.

You know, just so there can be no possible confusion in the minds of any reasonable, mature person with a basic grasp of the English language and the ability to read the original post before they spout off with inane garbage...

xyzmkrysvr wrote...
I've suffered through too many random matches where I hear things like "geth hunters are SO gay!" or "that guy just wasted a missile on a pack of phantoms?!? What a f*****g f****t!" 
Now, I certainly can't speak for everyone in the gay community, but I take serious offense to that, especially when the derrogatory remarks are directed at me or another player.

That’s *another* reason why I created this thread: I wanted to find gay-friendly people I could feel comfortable playing with, knowing that they wouldn’t call me the F word if I didn’t make it to the LZ in time!

But then I played a match with some random people who started throwing around the N word and telling racially-charged jokes about lynching, and I realized that what I REALLY wanted all along was to form groups of mature, respectful, open-minded individuals to play with.

 

xyzmkrysvr wrote...

to form groups of mature, respectful, open-minded individuals to play with.

  


O-SHI*!!!!



It's like he was doing exactly what you said he should be doing the whole time!

AMAZING!



But hey, reading one single post before you open your mouth is hard, right?  I totally understand, I too like to just shut the ol' thinker box off now and again and zone out, maybe drool on myself a little bit.

Difference between you and me though, is I do it in the privacy of my own home, where no one can witness me acting a fool, whereas you like to display it publicly.

To each their own!