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Unbelievable quote from a new Gamespot article dismissing our concerns over the ending.


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#51
Cody211282

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Chaota Vos wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


I'd take Forbes over any of those holier-than-thau hacks, TBH


That Forbes article looked like it was written by a six year old, tbh. And it was full of nonsense.


Actauly he was talking about how as a buisness this is a horrible way to treat your customers, but you know keep bashing anything that doesnt fit with how you see the world.

#52
HenchxNarf

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Cody211282 wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


Kotaku came out saying it was horrible.

Defranco just said to calm down and that he liked the rest of the game, and that they already have our money and there really isnt anything we can do abou it.

Destructiod (or at least Jims article) was about as unbiased as he gets so I'll leave you to think what you will.


Only Luke didn't like the ending. Two seperate writers thought the lot of you should shut it. Even Owen said to shut it.

Destructoid thinks you all are being "whiny ****s" and that you all need to shut it.

Defranco is basically telling the lot of you to STFU.

Adam Sessler from G4 told the lot of you to shut it.

Need I go on? It's a pretty consistant theme from people who know what the eff they're talking about.

#53
CaptainJaques

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Uh sourcefed and philly D didnt say the ending was fine and we were acting "entitled". they just said it's "just a game" and we shouldnt make such a big deal of it. It's condescending, but sure as hell isn't insulting.

#54
Jake71887

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I don't see why a company affiliated with EA would do this.... They're just throwing gasoline on the fire.  

#55
HenchxNarf

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Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Chaota Vos wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


I'd take Forbes over any of those holier-than-thau hacks, TBH


That Forbes article looked like it was written by a six year old, tbh. And it was full of nonsense.


Actauly he was talking about how as a buisness this is a horrible way to treat your customers, but you know keep bashing anything that doesnt fit with how you see the world.


Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?

#56
Jake71887

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HenchxNarf wrote...
Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?


Racist... :P

#57
HenchxNarf

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Jake71887 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...
Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?


Racist... :P


Who me? Nah lol :innocent:

#58
AlexMBrennan

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So, your point is that because all gaming sites are biased and have a serious conflict of interests when reporting such issues, we should just assume that they're not?

#59
Sireniankyle1

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Laura Parker has been indoctrinated. nuff said.

#60
Chaota Vos

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Oh god, it's turning into quote wars.

Basic point is that because a bunch of arrogant, sycophantic opinion writers who barely know what they're talking about are saying "bend over, take it, then be grateful that you paid for it" does not mean that this fanbase is going to take it. Hell, they said the same thing back on SWTOR when the Jedi Sage was gonna be called the Wizard, and look what happened. Bioware listened.

Here's hoping they'll listen again.

Modifié par Chaota Vos, 14 mars 2012 - 11:12 .


#61
Nimrodell

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Comparing Rushdie's work or Monet's work with Mass Effect? Interesting. While there can be artistic license and art in something that is franchise, specifically made to earn money, really, comparing great artists and Mass Effect... it's just absurd - those just don't simply fall into same category. The writer of this article should know better distinction between something that is pure art and made as such (Monet after all was impressionist and one of their ideals was actually l'art pour l'art and not l'art pour d'argent) and something that is business with artistic bits.

#62
Tartilus

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It's a common theme I've been seeing lately, sort of a... I'm actually not familiar with the proper terminology. It's a position adopted by individuals after thinking over a matter (in this instance, the nature of art) but which nevertheless is actually less congruous with the reality of the situation than the unthinking interpretation.

As I posted elsewhere, and as a writer myself, the immutability of stories and their 'sacredness' as works of art is nonsense, and I'm unfamiliar with any writer who feels otherwise. It's an artifact of a lack of understanding regarding how art is made - an expectation that rather than being the product of hard work and endless reiteration (which it is), it's some mystical Other, drawn from the aether and immune to any sort of objective reasoning. It's almost pseudo-religious, and it's nonsense. Art in a vacuum is indeed subjective, but novels are almost never art in a vacuum, and trilogies most assuredly are not. While I agree with individuals stating that we cannot demand alterations, the position that there is something philosophically wrong with an author altering a story after its initial release is metaphysical, not rational, and certainly should not be proffered as fact. Unless it was the author's intention to fail to bring closure to a significant number of people, their work is just as open to criticism and revision as any other non-art product. The fact that such alterations are uncommon in novels (they do happen, more often than you might think, though on smaller scales,) is more a matter of logistics than principle.

Videogames are the first truly fluid medium - indeed, it's a given that additional story will be released, and ostensibly it will (if only in incidental fashions) have the effect of altering the original story. The suggestion that we should not be able to voice our opinions as to how those resources should be directed is nothing short of bizarre, and stems from this pseudo-idealization of art. Writers (and painters, sculpters, etc.) are not savants, gifted with some amazing gift; we're mostly regular people doing a job that takes hard work, practice, and time. Accordingly, our products are as fallible as we are, and when they fail to elicit the desired reaction, they can be fixed. They don't have to be fixed, which is a point I'm finding it more and more important to stress, but they can be.

Modifié par Tartilus, 14 mars 2012 - 11:24 .


#63
Cody211282

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Chaota Vos wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


I'd take Forbes over any of those holier-than-thau hacks, TBH


That Forbes article looked like it was written by a six year old, tbh. And it was full of nonsense.


Actauly he was talking about how as a buisness this is a horrible way to treat your customers, but you know keep bashing anything that doesnt fit with how you see the world.


Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?


Sure, Ive said many times that if we are going to get anywere we need to be civil and show them we mean what we are seroius about this.

As for the the articles, most of them said that they were disapointed in the endings but people were making to much noise over them. I understand what they are saying but dont agree with it, you on the other hand are being a bit of a dick and refusing to see any point of veiw but your own.

#64
Guest_Raga_*

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Another thing which renders this whole "works of art must be pure and unaltered to be works of art" as BS is the simple fact that art is routinely changed by people who aren't the creator. Is a book no longer art because the editor asked for changes before it was published? Is a game no longer art because a developer's publisher put parameters on what they could and couldn't make? Is a movie no longer art because stuff had to be cut because of budget constrains?

#65
HenchxNarf

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AlexMBrennan wrote...

So, your point is that because all gaming sites are biased and have a serious conflict of interests when reporting such issues, we should just assume that they're not?


They're not biased. They're just tired of the BS and the fact that the lot of you are making real gamers and real fans look bad. You're giving the gaming community as a whole a bad name.

You're making it so that if anyone posts something positive, you troll them right off the boards. No wonder people are afraid to say anything.

#66
Sireniankyle1

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Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Chaota Vos wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


I'd take Forbes over any of those holier-than-thau hacks, TBH


That Forbes article looked like it was written by a six year old, tbh. And it was full of nonsense.


Actauly he was talking about how as a buisness this is a horrible way to treat your customers, but you know keep bashing anything that doesnt fit with how you see the world.


Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?


Sure, Ive said many times that if we are going to get anywere we need to be civil and show them we mean what we are seroius about this.

As for the the articles, most of them said that they were disapointed in the endings but people were making to much noise over them. I understand what they are saying but dont agree with it, you on the other hand are being a bit of a dick and refusing to see any point of veiw but your own.


ha ha ha long quote, and i have nothing to add, cuz i didn't even read this.

#67
Hexxys

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HenchxNarf wrote...

Need I go on? It's a pretty consistant theme from people who know what the eff they're talking about.


Do you live your life based on the opinions of others who "know what the eff they're talking about"?  I feel sorry for you, if so.

Btw, they're pretty much obligated to defend game studios/publishers.

#68
Chaota Vos

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HenchxNarf wrote...

They're not biased. They're just tired of the BS and the fact that the lot of you are making real gamers and real fans look bad. You're giving the gaming community as a whole a bad name.

You're making it so that if anyone posts something positive, you troll them right off the boards. No wonder people are afraid to say anything.


So, now critiquing a game developer about the ending to a game franchise you've spent five years playing, loving and paying for makes you a "fake fan/gamer"?

Being a real fan is more than being Bioware's sychophantic boot-licker.  No offense intended to people who think that this IS the case <_<

Modifié par Chaota Vos, 14 mars 2012 - 11:16 .


#69
HenchxNarf

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Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Cody211282 wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Chaota Vos wrote...

Dridengx wrote...

Denethar wrote...

Meh, Gamespot is an even bigger joke than IGN. While IGN is always suspected of being bought by game companies, Gamespot has pretty much been confirmed to be controlled by EA.


So kotaku is a joke, Ign is a joke, Destructiod, G4, Source Fed, Philip Defranco, Giant Bomb, Gamespot, shall we continue or should I just assume you guys are dense and don't want to see the big picture here? There is not one gaming site that actually agrees with you other than Gamefront (whoever that is)


I'd take Forbes over any of those holier-than-thau hacks, TBH


That Forbes article looked like it was written by a six year old, tbh. And it was full of nonsense.


Actauly he was talking about how as a buisness this is a horrible way to treat your customers, but you know keep bashing anything that doesnt fit with how you see the world.


Hello pot, should I introduce you to your kettle?


Sure, Ive said many times that if we are going to get anywere we need to be civil and show them we mean what we are seroius about this.

As for the the articles, most of them said that they were disapointed in the endings but people were making to much noise over them. I understand what they are saying but dont agree with it, you on the other hand are being a bit of a dick and refusing to see any point of veiw but your own.


Most of them said that what you are trying to do is ridiculous and that you're taking it overboard. It's cool to not like the ending. Hoorah for you.

I see lots of views, but I also don't agree with this whole 'movement' that's being thrown around. I have no problems with people who don't like the ending. I'm actually friends with them. But guess what? They're not making a fool of themselves by trying to HOLD THE LINE for a better ending. Because it's not their story to change. It's BioWares, and you were lucky enough to play it the way you wanted to until you got to the end they envisioned.

#70
Sireniankyle1

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HenchxNarf wrote...

AlexMBrennan wrote...

So, your point is that because all gaming sites are biased and have a serious conflict of interests when reporting such issues, we should just assume that they're not?


They're not biased. They're just tired of the BS and the fact that the lot of you are making real gamers and real fans look bad. You're giving the gaming community as a whole a bad name.

You're making it so that if anyone posts something positive, you troll them right off the boards. No wonder people are afraid to say anything.


So you'd have us sit there and take it? If you don't already live in America, they'd love to have another conformist. I can say that because I AM an American.

#71
HenchxNarf

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Hexxys wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

Need I go on? It's a pretty consistant theme from people who know what the eff they're talking about.


Do you live your life based on the opinions of others who "know what the eff they're talking about"?  I feel sorry for you, if so.

Btw, they're pretty much obligated to defend game studios/publishers.


Actually they're not. I've seen them bash plenty of companies and games in my time as a gamer.

#72
Sireniankyle1

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Chaota Vos wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

AlexMBrennan wrote...

So, your point is that because all gaming sites are biased and have a serious conflict of interests when reporting such issues, we should just assume that they're not?


They're not biased. They're just tired of the BS and the fact that the lot of you are making real gamers and real fans look bad. You're giving the gaming community as a whole a bad name.

You're making it so that if anyone posts something positive, you troll them right off the boards. No wonder people are afraid to say anything.


So, now critiquing a game developer about the ending to a game franchise you've spent five years playing, loving and paying for makes you a "fake fan/gamer"?

Being a real fan is more than being Bioware's sychophantic boot-licker .


Agree. WE WILL NOT FAULTER!

#73
Pottumuusi

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All this "don't whine about the endings it's art" stuff is just bull****.

Yeah, they can end it however they want but I can also say that the ending sucks bowling equipment and the only thing developers can do to protect their game from that is to make their ending not suck.

#74
Benrosan

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Tartilus wrote...

It's a common theme I've been seeing lately, sort of a... I'm actually not familiar with the proper terminology. It's a position adopted by individuals after thinking over a matter (in this instance, the nature of art) but which nevertheless is actually less congruous with the reality of the situation than the unthinking interpretation.

As I posted elsewhere, and as a writer myself, the immutability of stories and their 'sacredness' as works of art is nonsense, and I'm unfamiliar with any writer who feels otherwise. It's an artifact of a lack of understanding regarding how art is made - an expectation that rather than being the product of hard work and endless reiteration (which it is), it's some mystical Other, drawn from the aether and immune to any sort of objective reasoning. It's almost pseudo-religious, and it's nonsense. Art in a vacuum is indeed subjective, but novels are almost never art in a vacuum, and trilogies most assuredly are not. While I agree with individuals stating that we cannot demand alterations, the position that there is something philosophically wrong with an author altering a story after its initial release is metaphysical, not rational, and certainly should not be proffered as fact. Unless it was the author's intention to fail to bring closure to a significant number of people, their work is just as open to criticism and revision as any other non-art product. The fact that such alterations are uncommon in novels (they do happen, more often than you might think, though on smaller scales), is more a matter of logistics than principle.

Videogames are the first truly fluid medium - indeed, it's a given that additional story will be released, and ostensibly it will (if only in incidental fashions) have the effect of altering the original story in some fashion. The suggestion that we should not be able to voice our opinion as to how those resources should be directed is nothing short of bizarre, and stems from this pseudo-idealization of art. Writers (and painters, sculpters, etc.) are not savants, gifted with some amazing gift; we're mostly regular people doing a job that takes hard work, practice, and time. Accordingly, our products are as fallible as we are, and when they fail to elicit the desired reaction, they can be fixed. They don't have to be fixed, which is a point I'm finding it more and more important to stress, but they can be.


Agreed. Thank you for putting it so eloquently.

#75
HenchxNarf

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Chaota Vos wrote...

HenchxNarf wrote...

They're not biased. They're just tired of the BS and the fact that the lot of you are making real gamers and real fans look bad. You're giving the gaming community as a whole a bad name.

You're making it so that if anyone posts something positive, you troll them right off the boards. No wonder people are afraid to say anything.


So, now critiquing a game developer about the ending to a game franchise you've spent five years playing, loving and paying for makes you a "fake fan/gamer"?

Being a real fan is more than being Bioware's sychophantic boot-licker.  No offense intended to people who think that this IS the case <_<


Well, if you were a fan, you could see the big picture here and you wouldn't disregard the whole series because of something that didn't go your way.

There has been a lot of games where I seethed and hated the endings of, but did I condemn the creators? No. You know why? Because it was their story, it's not supposed to end the way I want it to.