205 réponses à ce sujet

[saracen16]

Asnine112 wrote...

saracen16 wrote...

The good thing about this game is that it's not forcing someone else's endings... not yours, not mine, and not even the developers.. down your throat. You're the one left to compute what just happened.

And that is a more powerful experience than any other.

ROFL

So why even have ME3? ****, I could've just made up my own entire ME3 and it would, in your retarded argument, be better than having a ME3.



Stupidity confirmed.

I'm not convinced that my argument is "retarded". Care to show me? Because trolling isn't going to get you anywhere. BioWare stated that Mass Effect 3 will be the conclusion of Shepard's story. The way it ends is up to you, depending on the choices you made in the previous games and in this one. You see that many of the subplots were ended. The main plot ended in the last 10 minutes. They can't humanly sneak in every single detail at the end.

[Auru]

The original post is brilliant, this guy/gal found himself questioning what was experienced at the end.. and went on to think about what it all actually meant, for all the races involved.. did you destroy or save the galaxy? Who was actually the enemy?

Why do people need it to be so clear cut.

[Aduro]

saracen16 wrote...

I disagree. I don't feel betrayed because I don't go in with expectations.

It's not all about expectations - we were openly lied to.

http://i.imgur.com/xUq9t.png

[saracen16]

Walrusninja wrote...

Well saracen, anything that made even a little sense would be nice. I can think of a million possibilities and would like to have been able to simply respect their artistic license as ever, but the ending they chose was appalling.

If they showed you too much, they would have made the ending forgettable. If they showed too little, they'd have made the ending forgettable as well. I personally think that BioWare struck an almost perfect balance between the two because the journey to the ending was written by us. Even the destination was in question: we were being indoctrinated.

[saracen16]

Aduro wrote...

saracen16 wrote...

I disagree. I don't feel betrayed because I don't go in with expectations.

It's not all about expectations - we were openly lied to.

http://i.imgur.com/xUq9t.png

BioWare was bashed because ME2's campaign was too spoilery. Now, we're bashing them because they were being dodgy and not spoilery. I can hardly believe it, but I think we're gonna complain no matter what...

[Dranume]

This Guy.."OP" only really seems to care about defending his thread. And yea I read your post and for the most part, it was a good read, and you can tell that it was well thought out and you put some thought and effort into it

Same can be said for others that put up thought provoking threads that are against the endings.

[Aetius5]

Glad the OP is happy with his ending. Here's how everyone else feels.

[Arthorius]

Fine. I'll play along, that's more than you deserve. I don't really have much better to do anyway.

Plotholes.

Their name is Legion, for they are many. You cannot deny it. First, the obvious. How did the team made it back to the Normandy in time? They were in a warzone, surrounded by half a dozen of Sov-class Reapers, each of them well aware of the fact that the Normandy is Shepard's flagship. The second it came into view, they would have given chase until destruction.
Why was Joker flying? If anything, what we know of him and the squadies, is that they are utterly loyal to Shepard. They would never flee in the middle of a battle and leave him behind. At least, the Normandy would have been the first to enter the Citadel to help/pick up Shepard.
Also. Obvious time distortion/travel.

Reapers theory, aka " Yo dawg, I heard you didn't like to be kill by synthetics so I built synthetics to kill you every 50k years so that you don't get kill by synthetics!"
Plain and simple, this is Bullsh*t. The existance of the Geth and EDI proves that. That Shepard doesn't even mention them is aggravating.
The Catalyst comes out of the blue, we had never heard of him 5 minutes before the end. All we knew about Reapers is that they had some kind of Great Plan for us. Their "salvation" could have been anything. Even some kind of religious BS.

The plot device. Aka space magic.
Yup. That's the end of this Space Opera. A giant colourfull beam, worthy of the most cheesy Sci-fi movies of all time. Each choices are as cheesy as it gets and the only decisive fact is that one of them allow Shepard to "live", for all the good it's worth.
Relays are explosing. And by the look of it, they are explosing because of some kind of overload, wich should be even worse than being hit by an asteroid in a matter of explosion radius.
Goodbye galaxy. It's been nice knowing you.

In the end, all we wanted to know is what happened to our buddies. And through them, what happened to the species of the galaxy. Who gives a **** about a distant world in a distant time?

That was not meant to be. Our guys are either stranded on Earth with millions of hungry aliens and what's left of their fleet, or stranded on a world that Shepard will never see and that we know nothing about. Great. Just great.

The whole galaxy is isolated, no one will ever see an other star system in their lifetime, the Geth just loose 200 of IQ and the Krogans will most likely bomb themselves back to the stone age, due to a lack of space to expand.
The Quarians will be lucky if they manage to settle and repopulate before becoming extincts and the Asari will slowly succomb to the Ardat-Yakshi gene.

But hey! If not for that, our choices might have meant something, so it's alright, right?

We didn't bought this game to use our imagination. Most of us already knew that we would have to cure the Genophage and make peace between Quarians and Geths, and everyone already knew that we would have to assemble a giant fleet to fight back the Reapers. If the point of this game was to imagine the ending, we really didn't had to buy it in the first place!

The ending fail at so many levels that I have trouble putting them into order.

But it seems I didn't get it. Because obviously, Bioware is going to spend considerable amounts of time and money in CGI sequences that are not real. And the sequence with Joker-Stargazer totally confort me in the opinion that I didn't really saw the ending.

We were promised an end that would bring closure and answer all the questions. It fails to deliver. Everything else is speculation and fan-fiction.

End of the line.

[Aduro]

saracen16 wrote...

Aduro wrote...

saracen16 wrote...

I disagree. I don't feel betrayed because I don't go in with expectations.

It's not all about expectations - we were openly lied to.

http://i.imgur.com/xUq9t.png

BioWare was bashed because ME2's campaign was too spoilery. Now, we're bashing them because they were being dodgy and not spoilery. I can hardly believe it, but I think we're gonna complain no matter what...

I don't understand what you're saying, could you elaborate? They told us one thing (ending would not be 'A, B or C') and did the exact opposite. I also made other points in a previous post, and I don't wanna rewrite things - but the conversation and logic used by the god-child is faulty and under-explained. It might be fine if they went through to address each of these inconsistencies, he didn't.

The final state of the races also partially, if not totally, invalidates many of your previous choices (again, mentionedi n greater detail in previous post)

[Blacksnyder]

nitefyre410 wrote...

That the problem the more I think about it ... the worst it gets...

[Malchat]

When the game´s tag line is TAKE BACK EARTH, I might be inclined to think that I could, in fact, take back Earth before the end.

[aliengmr1]

I get the whole "Thinking and debating the ending is fun" thing. Problem is the "debate" is coming from a place of confusion. The ending shows the relays being destroyed. Doesn't matter at all of they take out an entire solar system or not, the races are still stranded. Any theories after the destruction of the relays is rendered moot since nobody is going anywhere. The only things that are clear in the ending at all are that the relays are gone, the Normandy abandoned Shep, and then crashed landed on a random planet where only 3 of are thought to survive.

You can debate what the god-kid is or the reapers intentions (which were completely asinine) till you are blue in the face, but it changes nothing... relays still destroyed, galaxy not saved, and everyone dies. So unless there is an explanation for the galaxy ultimately being screwed, there is nothing more to be said.

[Arppis]

Malchat wrote...

When the game´s tag line is TAKE BACK EARTH, I might be inclined to think that I could, in fact, take back Earth before the end.

"Rise to power"

[Glitch007]

To Quote Casey:

"This story arc is coming to an end with this game. That means the endings can be a lot more different. At this point we're taking into account so many decisions that you've made as a player and reflecting a lot of that stuff. It's not even in any way like the traditional game endings, where you can say how many endings there are or whether you got ending A, B, or C.

"It's more like there are some really obvious things that are different and then lots and lots of smaller things, lots of things about who lives and who dies, civilizations that rose and fell, all the way down to individual characters. That becomes the state of where you left your galaxy. The endings have a lot more sophistication and variety in them."

No, you get ending green, blue or red... Hrhm, BIG difference.

http://www.videogame...orgettable.html

Looks like they're happy with the ending...

BioWare=LieoWare!

www.mememaker.net/static/images/memes/78357.jpg

Modifié par Glitch007, 14 mars 2012 - 06:45 .

[TheScott1987]

 People are only backlashing because they love the story and the series as a whole. If this were just any old game people would be annoyed, but not to the point that they post in droves. In fact, if the ending was better, I imagine this board would be full of positive, loving speech . . . look at most of the "WAH ENDING" threads, they usually start with 'So I loved the story --'

Questions at the end of a trilogy is fine. Questions regarding characters whose stories are ending THIS TRILOGY is not. The 'special ending' basically says "this is what happened. Or is it? We don't even remember!" Also, putting the "you're done, you've won, now go buy DLC" SHOULD BE totally unnecessary. When a game company has to tell their players when a series is actually finished in a medium outside of the narrative ... that's bad. It's like a book going out and saying "OK, this book is done, the main character won!" at the very last page. 

Replayability was killed. This was HUGE in the ME series. People could easily play 4-5 characters and still be immersed and have a great time. Now, many cannot even play the games again (once again bad) because they already know the ends. When I can get all of the endings with one character when playing the final MINUTE -- that's not great. And yes, they are the 'endings,' as the choices throughout the game aren't featured in it at all. Bringing it back to point 1 -- people love the journey, but not the end. 

If they wanted it to be the end, why didn't they allow us to talk to the child? Simply putting in some Paragon / Renegade OPTIONS would have helped (he could have turned them down with something approaching logic). As would have making some investigation options in the conversation so we could get more information -- this was done on every other conversation, why not the most important one? 

Honestly, if I wanted this game to end on a total imagination note, I would have written a fanfiction for the end. 

Modifié par TheScott1987, 14 mars 2012 - 06:35 .

[KustomDeluxe]

I sympathize with the OP. I really do. I saw how these endings were supposed to be thought-provoking on a pretty metaphysical scale. I SAW how the different endings were supposed to represent different approaches to some pretty complex problems. I KNEW what they were going for because I am a massive nerd and have read more science fiction (space opera & more serious) and recognize the issues they are trying to represent and address in the ending.

The problem is these issues don't fit in with most of the rest of the game, and no matter how you swing it are confusing. I mean, when half+ of people aren't debating the impact & philosophical viewpoints of the ending but are instead digging deep enough in to find evidence that the ending NEVER HAPPENED there is a problem. And assuming Indoctrination theory is correct, it's still not good because BioWare wrapped up the on-disc game with a dream of all things after convincing us we were in a real-world situation. I mean, one could reasonably make an argument that the boy on the mystery-planet after the credits was imagining himself as Shepherd. This isn't powerful, this isn't philosophical, this is just outright insulting. It's cliche when soap operas & cartoons use endings like that, it is insulting and downright pathetic when a game does so.

[Asnine112]

saracen16 wrote...

Asnine112 wrote...

saracen16 wrote...

The good thing about this game is that it's not forcing someone else's endings... not yours, not mine, and not even the developers.. down your throat. You're the one left to compute what just happened.

And that is a more powerful experience than any other.

ROFL

So why even have ME3? ****, I could've just made up my own entire ME3 and it would, in your retarded argument, be better than having a ME3.



Stupidity confirmed.

I'm not convinced that my argument is "retarded". Care to show me? Because trolling isn't going to get you anywhere. BioWare stated that Mass Effect 3 will be the conclusion of Shepard's story. The way it ends is up to you, depending on the choices you made in the previous games and in this one. You see that many of the subplots were ended. The main plot ended in the last 10 minutes. They can't humanly sneak in every single detail at the end.

I understand exactly what your logic is. I already summed it up earlier. Basically, by leaving a lot in the air they let you fill in the gaps with your imagination. In essence, you make your own ending.

And by extension of this logic, you could also just say "Why the ME2 ending was perfect: I can imagine everything that happens afterwards," and etc.


And like I said in my earlier post, I'm happy for you if you enjoy making up your own fanfic to cover for BioWare's missing elements (intentional or not). But calling other people stupid for not liking your view is exactly what I was just doing to you (and by the looks of your response, it seems as if you missed the point entirely)

[alienman]

Malchat wrote...

When the game´s tag line is TAKE BACK EARTH, I might be inclined to think that I could, in fact, take back Earth before the end.

Well, considering the ending, I think they ment that we took back earth from a predetermined evolution that revolvs around the mass effect fields.

But by taking back earth, we destroyed everything in the galaxy. Humanity and other species will have to start over from scratch, and this time around the technological evolution will come at "normal" rate.

Anyway, this is what I figured from the ending... For some unknown reason BioWare considered the starting over part for all races the best one. I don't agree though. Because, at least considering my Shepard, he would never go for something like this. He lives now, and protects the galaxy as it is. He never saw the mass effect fields as something evil. So the ending choice destroyes everything he(me) believes in... and you are forced to take one.

Sorry, my english feels a bit poor today, and I'm tired

[Lucubration]

I think about my Shepard's ending constantly. That's why I'm here, trying to get it fixed.

[Total Biscuit]

OP is entitled to love the ending.

He and the other 2% who like it unconditionally are lucky, because they got a satisfying ending.

However, trying to tell the 90% majority of us who are not satisfied with all the plot holes, unanswered questions, totally unrelenting bleakness, cookie cutter '17' variables, complete abandonment of player imput, utter annihilation of everything that made the ME franchise uniques, the complete pointlessness of our actions, the forced unavoidable fate of every character we care about, and the total lack of impact any of our voices make, and the fact that we get the Reapers hand waved away with space magic and 'I Win' buttons, that we are wrong and acting like blinkered imbeciles is incredibly rude and arragant, and completely dismissing and ignoring the fact that most of us sodding HATE these endings.

Yes, you like the endings, and are perfectly happy to headcanon all the rest of the ending we aren't shown. Great, but most of us actually want proper conclusions and payoffs for years of work and emotional investment in these characters and plots. we want to choose our own damned fates, and be shown what our actions caused. We should never be forced down one path.

No one is asking for this ending to be erased. You got the ending you wanted, great, I'm happy for you. But I want my happy ending, because it sure as hell isn't anything like yours, which isn't surprising, as I'm afraid to say you and the few others that like this have really weird taste.

[elferin91]

saracen16 wrote...

This is just my opinion. I LOVED the endings. I thought they were amazing. Why is that? Because they raise many questions.

i stopped here. Are you serious, I mean really? Did you play ME1 & 2, did you watch announcments while the game was in the making? do you know what a trilogy is?

[Plazeor]

After I have made the choice, the defining choice in the series, what everything has been leading up to, I will see the relays destroyed and Joker and few squadmates standing on a planet. If I have done enough I will get to see Shepard take a breath and find out that this was just the story of Shepard being told to a kid.

There is nothing really different between my ending and everyone else. We can talk about what of the three choices was made, and who was standing at the end, as well as did you have enough EMS to get the "good" ending but that is about it. My ending experience was exactly the same as yours. The questions I wanted answered after I made that choice, was simple...

Was it worth it? Was the cost to high? Did I do enough? Should Shepard have been stronger? Should Shepard have shown more compassion? How will Shepard be remembered?

The game didn't provide the answers I wanted at the end, so I am stuck waiting for DLC or another game. Had it answered my questions, I would be popping in Mass Effect 1 tonight to start making what I wanted my final Shepard story to be. However, since we all experienced the same ending, I don't feel that need to run through them all again.

[Linus108]

Ah, the ol' use your imagination. The, they left us a lot of things open, so we can come up with our own conclusions...

Only problem with that is, the ending makes no logical sense in order for the player to fill in the blanks. How the hell did the Normandy get marooned on a jungle planet? How did squadmates that were on earth, magically appear on the Normandy at the end? Why was Joker flying away in the first place?

Why is this Star Child showing up in the last 1% of the game, and telling you everything you thought is wrong. Who is he? Why should Shepard believe him? Why should we, as a player who has just invested 100 + hours into a world we were told is the truth, believe someone telling you that everything you thought was wrong?

Up until the run to the beam, everything made sene. But once you get taken up to the Citadel, all logic and reason is thrown out the window. I'm not even going to get into the plot holes and lore errors that this ending presents. Read about that here:

http://www.gamefront...ns-are-right/3/

&

http://www.gamefront...ns-are-right/4/

I'm glad you liked the ending. But I just can't disagree with you enough. It didn't put the player in a place where they could make assumptions/interpretations. Instead it was non-sensical. I find it hard to believe that anyone could really be happy with this ending, if they actually did the research and understood why the ending was so poor. But hey, to each his/her own. 

Modifié par Linus108, 14 mars 2012 - 07:16 .

[saracen16]

Total Biscuit wrote...

OP is entitled to love the ending.

He and the other 2% who like it unconditionally are lucky, because they got a satisfying ending.

You are entitled to hate the ending but don't belittle us by pointing out that we are a minority. I know it's a fact, but don't belittle us.

However, trying to tell the 90% majority of us who are not satisfied with all the plot holes, unanswered questions, totally unrelenting bleakness, cookie cutter '17' variables, complete abandonment of player imput, utter annihilation of everything that made the ME franchise uniques, the complete pointlessness of our actions, the forced unavoidable fate of every character we care about, and the total lack of impact any of our voices make, and the fact that we get the Reapers hand waved away with space magic and 'I Win' buttons, that we are wrong and acting like blinkered imbeciles is incredibly rude and arragant, and completely dismissing and ignoring the fact that most of us sodding HATE these endings.

Yes, you like the endings, and are perfectly happy to headcanon all the rest of the ending we aren't shown. Great, but most of us actually want proper conclusions and payoffs for years of work and emotional investment in these characters and plots. we want to choose our own damned fates, and be shown what our actions caused. We should never be forced down one path.

No one is asking for this ending to be erased. You got the ending you wanted, great, I'm happy for you. But I want my happy ending, because it sure as hell isn't anything like yours, which isn't surprising, as I'm afraid to say you and the few others that like this have really weird taste.

I'm fine with my "weird" taste, but I went in with ZERO expectations, and that paid off for me. We got a conclusion to the trilogy. I didn't care that it was a conclusion to whatever false promises devs throw at you: I'm starting to think that they do that to intentionally mislead you and avoid spoilers. It seems to me that everyone is pissed for different reasons. Some people wanted a happy ending. Others felt that there was no closure. We weren't promised happy endings. We weren't even promised sad endings. We were promised endings, and I think we've got a good deal of it.

At least tell me you read the OP, because it seems that you didn't... and neither did most of the trolls who just posted here to bait me and insult me (not you, your argument is reasonable, and at least you're being more civil about it than others).

[saracen16]

thomash81 wrote...

Malchat wrote...

When the game´s tag line is TAKE BACK EARTH, I might be inclined to think that I could, in fact, take back Earth before the end.

Well, considering the ending, I think they ment that we took back earth from a predetermined evolution that revolvs around the mass effect fields.

But by taking back earth, we destroyed everything in the galaxy. Humanity and other species will have to start over from scratch, and this time around the technological evolution will come at "normal" rate.

Anyway, this is what I figured from the ending... For some unknown reason BioWare considered the starting over part for all races the best one. I don't agree though. Because, at least considering my Shepard, he would never go for something like this. He lives now, and protects the galaxy as it is. He never saw the mass effect fields as something evil. So the ending choice destroyes everything he(me) believes in... and you are forced to take one.

Sorry, my english feels a bit poor today, and I'm tired

I hear you, but your Shepard and my Shepard are only human, and there's only so much that we can do. What makes you so sure that the galaxy was destroyed? How are Joker and the Normandy crew still alive?