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[Tiax Rules All]

20 seconds after endings if you choose destroy with over 4K EMF

Shepard Lives!
but that is not even the important part at all really, its really about what it means for the nature of all the endings in general.

I wont hide that I firmly believe that this is "proof" of the indoctrination theory. I have created a thread thats 40 pages and growing so far but its certainly not the only one. There I describe indoctrination theory in detail.
Indoctrination theory described in detail

My take on this is that it proves that Shepard never left the spot he was left in after getting hit by the destroyer beam, starting when he gets up and does the slow motion walk to the the beam still in London, and all the way till the above clip, is all a hallucination/ indoctrination attempt and Shepard is fighting it in his mind. Including the crucible going off, relays exploding, Earth celebrating, Nromandy running, crashing and living happily ever after on sunset planet. Its all in shep's head. This is what he imagines for the world and his companions. He imagines them all escaping evil and living happily ever after... THEN he wakes up (above clip)

He doesn't just wake up but its in a pile of rubble ,that to me, is obviously London's debris. He is on Earth, right where he was after the blast. Look at the bricks in the Shep lives rubble. Stone, grey, look at the design on the faces, now look at this screenshot. taken from london, with beam in background. Look at the building to the left. Same bricks. almost irrefutable.





There is more debris around that looks EXACTLY like the rubble he is seen in at the end.

Have you all seen this ending? I truley believe that this 20 second clip is the whole and real ending for the game. It means everything.

Please read the indoctrination theory link I provided if you want all the plot holes left by the "taken at face value" endings filled with not conjecture but theory backed with in game references.


Mainly though I want to hear your thoughts. What does this mean to you? indoctrination? something different entirely?
Discuss...

Modifié par Tiax Rules All, 19 mars 2012 - 01:48 .

[TheMadBlimper]

Damn straight.

[Tiax Rules All]

well there is one in the agree column.. I honestly would like to hear how this is NOT indoctrination theory by someone that rejects the theory. I can't find anybody that wants to touch it or can explain it differently.

[Arppis]

I took this ending. After trying the middle one for giggles.

I'm not so worried about indocrination tbh, the game says that you have become legend and saved everyone. Stargazer wouldn't propably know about Shepard otherwise.

But the scene suggests that Shepard might have been indocrinated. But if that's true... Reapers win either way. And that's grim.

Modifié par Arppis, 14 mars 2012 - 08:52 .

[GnusmasTHX]

I agree with anyone else who wears Hahne-Kedar.

[Tallestra]

Well, maybe the reason we see it only in destruction ending is, because it's the only ending where Shepard's body is not destroyed. If that clip was shown in two other endings, than it would be obvious, that everything was dream. It also possible that destruction of his body symbolize some sort of destruction of his mind by reapers.

But the truth is, I'm grasping the straws, for me it looks much more realistic that it's just bad writing, and not some conspiracy from BW.

[Tiax Rules All]

Arppis wrote...

I took this ending. After trying the middle one for giggles.

I'm not so worried about indocrination tbh, but the scene suggests that Shepard might have been indocrinated. But if that's true... Reapers win either way. And that's grim.

Well I would say that if you choose correctly and Shep wakes then Reapers don't win but the story is actually not yet over. Shep is ready to finish the job.

[Rockpopple]

This is what made me question the endings and not take them at face value. To me, it's the starkest evidence there is that we're not meant to take the endings at face value.

The texture of those buildings is not only similar to the rubble Shep ends up under, it's exactly the same.

How did Shep go from the Citadel that's exploding in orbit to a breathable atmosphere with rubble that looks exactly like it came from London debris? Hoowwwwwww?????

[SirJeal]

Either that, or Shepard beat their indoctrination by "destroying" them in his mind... so when he wakes up, he isn't indoctrinated.

[Tiax Rules All]

Tallestra wrote...

Well, maybe the reason we see it only in destruction ending is, because it's the only ending where Shepard's body is not destroyed. If that clip was shown in two other endings, than it would be obvious, that everything was dream. It also possible that destruction of his body symbolize some sort of destruction of his mind by reapers.

But the truth is, I'm grasping the straws, for me it looks much more realistic that it's just bad writing, and not some conspiracy from BW.

i guess I don't see it as bad writing or a conspiracy, its more like its a tricky and risky ending, that going in they must have known that not everybody would catch on or get this.

[jzzabelle]

"You can continue to build Shepard's legend through further gameplay and downloadable content"

/EA trollface

[Tiax Rules All]

SirJeal wrote...

Either that, or Shepard beat their indoctrination by "destroying" them in his mind... so when he wakes up, he isn't indoctrinated.

Thats what I have been saying all along. Indoctrination thread is all about this.

[viperabyss]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

well there is one in the agree column.. I honestly would like to hear how this is NOT indoctrination theory by someone that rejects the theory. I can't find anybody that wants to touch it or can explain it differently.

I definitely would (and I know I'm in the minority). I'd love to post my response to all of the supposed "evidence", but there's a high chance it'll be lost in the forum somewhere. 

[Arppis]

Tiax Rules All wrote...

Arppis wrote...

I took this ending. After trying the middle one for giggles.

I'm not so worried about indocrination tbh, but the scene suggests that Shepard might have been indocrinated. But if that's true... Reapers win either way. And that's grim.

Well I would say that if you choose correctly and Shep wakes then Reapers don't win but the story is actually not yet over. Shep is ready to finish the job.

Well I am a paragon... but this is my train of thought about Reapers.

I'm usualy compromising a lot, but Reapers MUST be stopped if people want to have any hope. And they should pay for destroying so many civilizations.

[Tiax Rules All]

Rockpopple wrote...

This is what made me question the endings and not take them at face value. To me, it's the starkest evidence there is that we're not meant to take the endings at face value.

The texture of those buildings is not only similar to the rubble Shep ends up under, it's exactly the same.

How did Shep go from the Citadel that's exploding in orbit to a breathable atmosphere with rubble that looks exactly like it came from London debris? Hoowwwwwww?????

The only other explaination is "bad writing"

and there is no real credit to bad writing ANYWHERE in the series. So why now would they seemingly employ a whole different set of crappy writers to just do the (super important) ending of the series.

[Beatrix Tair]

Indoctrination.

Nothing after being hit by Harbinger happened outside of Shepard's subconsciousness.

If Shepard beats the indoctrination attempt & still remains focused on destroying the Reapers (note that it's only in her mind, it's not actually happening, it's a visual representation that she's beaten Harbinger's indoctrination attempt)...

...

...she wakes up, presumably then continues the fight & throws herself forward in the "true ending", whatever that is.

[Jedib2]

Tallestra wrote...

Well, maybe the reason we see it only in destruction ending is, because it's the only ending where Shepard's body is not destroyed. If that clip was shown in two other endings, than it would be obvious, that everything was dream. It also possible that destruction of his body symbolize some sort of destruction of his mind by reapers.

But the truth is, I'm grasping the straws, for me it looks much more realistic that it's just bad writing, and not some conspiracy from BW.

I believe that if he was really there, and he destroyed that conduit.... making everything go boom.. he wouldn't be alive planetside..

I do not believe he could survive re-entry with barely any armor, no shields, no air, and mostly dead on his feet. Let alone survive Impact.

To me, him waking up is the only real reasonable assumption

[Rulycar]

Problem:
... BioWare promised you do not have to play MP to get best ending.
... 4000 EMS requires MP.
... Most would agree, Shepard living must be best ending.
... Would BioWare lie? (err ... logic error detected)

[Thornquist]

Shepard crash landed back to earth after he blew up the citadel, end of story.

Yes, its full of plot-holes.

Wouldnt be the first.

[Tiax Rules All]

viperabyss wrote...

Tiax Rules All wrote...

well there is one in the agree column.. I honestly would like to hear how this is NOT indoctrination theory by someone that rejects the theory. I can't find anybody that wants to touch it or can explain it differently.

I definitely would (and I know I'm in the minority). I'd love to post my response to all of the supposed "evidence", but there's a high chance it'll be lost in the forum somewhere. 

you dont post you forfiet your opinion and I take it as you never really had one, you are just rejecting this out of stubborness, prove me wrong.

[Tiax Rules All]

Jedib2 wrote...
...
I believe that if he was really there, and he destroyed that conduit.... making everything go boom.. he wouldn't be alive planetside..

I do not believe he could survive re-entry with barely any armor, no shields, no air, and mostly dead on his feet. Let alone survive Impact.

To me, him waking up is the only real reasonable assumption

Yes I was going to put this in the OP but resisted. Its absolutely absurd to think the whole explosion, re-entry/ land back in London thing is even remotely possible let alone survivable...

[Arppis]

Jedib2 wrote...

Tallestra wrote...

Well, maybe the reason we see it only in destruction ending is, because it's the only ending where Shepard's body is not destroyed. If that clip was shown in two other endings, than it would be obvious, that everything was dream. It also possible that destruction of his body symbolize some sort of destruction of his mind by reapers.

But the truth is, I'm grasping the straws, for me it looks much more realistic that it's just bad writing, and not some conspiracy from BW.

I believe that if he was really there, and he destroyed that conduit.... making everything go boom.. he wouldn't be alive planetside..

I do not believe he could survive re-entry with barely any armor, no shields, no air, and mostly dead on his feet. Let alone survive Impact.

To me, him waking up is the only real reasonable assumption

I don't think people would die planetside. They didn't die from the energy beam (unless you had bad enough ending) either. I think the relays are just spreading the "sollution" and getting depleted after. The explosion you see first that reaches earth is just spreading in galaxy. And then the relays and Citadel are destroyed.

Normady is affected, because it's using the relays at the same time it's passing trough it.

[SirJeal]

I just know that Shepard had three chances of dying in that ending, but somehow lives.

1. When they shoot the pipe thing, it blows up and Shepard is encased in the explosion.

2. Citadel blows up completely at the center where Shepard was located.

3. Star Child said Shepard would die with that option since they were part synthetic also, and all synthetics would be destroyed.

4. Shepard couldn't survive the trip from orbit through earth's atmosphere and hitting the ground, and if that didn't happen... the explosion from the citadel wouldn't leave any air available due to destroying any artifical atmosphere if there had been an atmosphere in the first place.

[Sam Anders]

Thornquist wrote...

Shepard crash landed back to earth after he blew up the citadel, end of story.

Yes, its full of plot-holes.

Wouldnt be the first.

Makes literally no sense at all.

False.

[Arppis]

Rulycar wrote...

Problem:
... BioWare promised you do not have to play MP to get best ending.
... 4000 EMS requires MP.
... Most would agree, Shepard living must be best ending.
... Would BioWare lie? (err ... logic error detected)

Yeah, I got about 7000 total points and that's just 3500... 500 short.