324 réponses à ce sujet

[Dragoonlordz]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Xusa wrote...

iNikki wrote...

They're not "patching" it. They're continuing the story after the indoctrination/hallucination or whatever you want to call it. They planned on this.

Do you have any proof regarding this?

Nope, only third-hand rumours.
"Someone who knows someone who got something about something."

And as for my brethren who say those who like the endings are a "disposable" minority, I say:
What.The.Hell?
People are free to like things as much as they are free to dislike them. We aren't in any position to say who's relevant or isn't, and if they have the endings they like *NOW* why deny them those endings?
We don't like them, we don't find enough closure in them and we don't find the smallest bit of sense or decent player action in any of the so-called decisions, and, although those who like the endings seem hellbent on making every possible action to deny us some sort of satisfaction for the money and time we invested, it is not our place to tell them what they should or should not like/have.
It only makes us into them.
People are free to like what they like, and if they already have something they like, they shouldn't be denied it. Same way we shouldn't be denied by them the OPTION to get the endings (plural) we would like to have.

Hold the Line, but be excellent to each other.

Thank you for mature and reasonable response. You have my appreciation for such.

[Pobatti]

If Bioware decide to go ahead with DLC such as is currently being debated, and if rumors are true (especially the part about it being free), I can't see there being any harm in it. You won't be forced to 'patch up' before you can resume online play as it's not a bugfix.

Because there's rumored to be multiplayer content in the patch too, some of the data may very well end up separated off into a mandatory 'data patch' which must be installed however. This is so that folks who choose not to grab the DLC can still play games alongside those who do - and the extra classes and weapons need graphics and object data and the like so that other players with the DLC can be properly displayed in a match from the POV of a person without the DLC.

So basically, if you have real issues with the ending you can grab the DLC. If you're happy with the endings (or prefer them to the ones in the DLC) you're not forced to. The vast majority of folks end up happy, you'll be able to type 'Mass Effect 3' into Google without bringing up hundreds of results highlighing people's anger over the endings, and people can remember the game for what it really is - an action-packed shooter RPG with the most interesting lore, universe and story since pretty much ever in a video game series.

If you haven't seen the rumored 'leak' I'm referring to here, I direct you to this image:

This may or may not be real - only time will tell

[Xusa]

Doc089 wrote...

Xusa wrote...

Doc089 wrote...

Xusa, my curiosity makes me ask, what did you think of ME1 and ME2? And what did you play the three as? Paragon/Renegade/Paragade?

Iliked the first one a little. It has some problems regarding the size of the citadel (I thought it was just too big. The citadel from ME3 is perfect) and the menus (which were confusing and... strange. Not to say the game explained little of the ME universe and u had to, or delve deep into the story to understand things or pass a long time into the codexes.

The second was huge. I loved it in many ways. Ok, the story isn't as deep as the other 2, but still ****ing good.

I played the 3 as... dunno, I had only a little more than a one bar as renegade the rest full paragon.

I'm glad you enjoyed the ending.

But didn't you find it a bit of a let down that once you enter the light your only "winning" options were renegade? I never thought of Anderson as a Renegade but they put him on that ending. To take the blue, or what has been associated with Paragon choices, you had to side with TIM.

I didn't see that ending as renegade. The catalyst says that organics will create AI and that will rebel against them. But I've been through 2 game in which the total oposite happened. An AI that got to love organics and did her best to comprehend them. I found the destroy ending the one my 3/4 paragon Shepard would gladly take, and that's the one I chose.

[Pedro Costa]

Doc089 wrote...
I'm glad you enjoyed the ending.

But didn't you find it a bit of a let down that once you enter the light your only "winning" options were renegade? I never thought of Anderson as a Renegade but they put him on that ending. To take the blue, or what has been associated with Paragon choices, you had to side with TIM.

So, you prefer to belive a colour in the last 5 minutes than a person's actions through a whole trilogy?
If there's *one* thing the ending did well was break away from the typical "blue for paragon" "red for renegade", the fact TIM and Anderson are swapped only reinforces it.

Point is, there is no "paragon" nor "renegade" ending. You either agree with Anderson's pov or TIM's. OR Saren's, who should be but isn't there represented.

[stevesyanks17hotmail.com]

Pobatti wrote...

If Bioware decide to go ahead with DLC such as is currently being debated, and if rumors are true (especially the part about it being free), I can't see there being any harm in it. You won't be forced to 'patch up' before you can resume online play as it's not a bugfix.

Because there's rumored to be multiplayer content in the patch too, some of the data may very well end up separated off into a mandatory 'data patch' which must be installed however. This is so that folks who choose not to grab the DLC can still play games alongside those who do - and the extra classes and weapons need graphics and object data and the like so that other players with the DLC can be properly displayed in a match from the POV of a person without the DLC.

So basically, if you have real issues with the ending you can grab the DLC. If you're happy with the endings (or prefer them to the ones in the DLC) you're not forced to. The vast majority of folks end up happy, you'll be able to type 'Mass Effect 3' into Google without bringing up hundreds of results highlighing people's anger over the endings, and people can remember the game for what it really is - an action-packed shooter RPG with the most interesting lore, universe and story since pretty much ever in a video game series.

If you haven't seen the rumored 'leak' I'm referring to here, I direct you to this image:

If you believe that image, wow, just wow. I've got some Enron stock to sell if you're interested.

[Sainta117]

Xusa wrote...

Sainta117 wrote...

Xusa wrote...

(snip)

Why bother throwing anything? You're entitled to your opinion, but the level of intellectual rigor and logic in your argument (not to mention your grammar and spelling) makes it clear that your ideas are without merit or value.

I'm not american nor is english my first language. Does that make my opinion lower than yours?

Argumentum ad populum at its best

Did I imply you were American somehow? I criticized your logic, not your nationality. Anyway, I'm pretty sure you meant "ad hominem," as in "an ad-hominem" argument (literally "at the man"). An "Argumentum ad populum" is a case made by referring to popular opinion as evidence of correctness. For instance:

"The vast majority of people on these forums disagree with your contention that Bioware should keep these endings, therefore you're wrong."

That's an "Argumentum ad populum." Welcome to English, BTW. At the risk of sounding like a complete troll, it would appear that you also fail at latin.

[Xusa]

I don't believe in this image. It says there will be Asari Justicar, but that doesn't make sense. If you play Asari Vanguard (not sure if adept is the same) you can upgrade your justicar skill. What sense will there be to make an asari justicar class if you can have an adept fully trained in justicar? That doesn't fit.

[Pedro Costa]

Dragoonlordz wrote...
Thank you for mature and reasonable response. You have my appreciation for such.

I appreciate the kind words, but all I'm trying to do is put myself in your shoes.
I try to be neutral or at least see both sides of the coin, even if sometimes I'm not that successful...

[Xusa]

Sainta117 wrote...

Xusa wrote...

Sainta117 wrote...

Xusa wrote...

(snip)

Why bother throwing anything? You're entitled to your opinion, but the level of intellectual rigor and logic in your argument (not to mention your grammar and spelling) makes it clear that your ideas are without merit or value.

I'm not american nor is english my first language. Does that make my opinion lower than yours?

Argumentum ad populum at its best

Did I imply you were American somehow? I criticized your logic, not your nationality. Anyway, I'm pretty sure you meant "ad hominem," as in "an ad-hominem" argument (literally "at the man"). An "Argumentum ad populum" is a case made by referring to popular opinion as evidence of correctness. For instance:

"The vast majority of people on these forums disagree with your contention that Bioware should keep these endings, therefore you're wrong."

That's an "Argumentum ad populum." Welcome to English, BTW. At the risk of sounding like a complete troll, it would appear that you also fail at latin.

I meant hominem. Sorry. I'm replying to too many people and I'm getting confused now.

[Pedro Costa]

Xusa wrote...

I don't believe in this image. It says there will be Asari Justicar, but that doesn't make sense. If you play Asari Vanguard (not sure if adept is the same) you can upgrade your justicar skill. What sense will there be to make an asari justicar class if you can have an adept fully trained in justicar? That doesn't fit.

Same goes for "Krogan Battlemaster".
And yes, Asari Adept is the same. The fourth skill is the species' passive power.

[Aran Linvail]

I dont get it some people here at this forun , so you like the end , great man , you got what you want for you money and for your time , now let me ask something , IF , and thats a big one , Bioware makes a DLC or Patch with more endings , you get more replay value for YOUR game , and the unhappy gamers can enjoy the game to , if they dont do nothing you already have your endings and is ok for you, Its a win win situation for you. So whats the problem , you dont want other gamers happy with the game ? Or you just doing that For The Sake of Disagreeing?

[Doc089]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Doc089 wrote...
I'm glad you enjoyed the ending.

But didn't you find it a bit of a let down that once you enter the light your only "winning" options were renegade? I never thought of Anderson as a Renegade but they put him on that ending. To take the blue, or what has been associated with Paragon choices, you had to side with TIM.

So, you prefer to belive a colour in the last 5 minutes than a person's actions through a whole trilogy?
If there's *one* thing the ending did well was break away from the typical "blue for paragon" "red for renegade", the fact TIM and Anderson are swapped only reinforces it.

Point is, there is no "paragon" nor "renegade" ending. You either agree with Anderson's pov or TIM's. OR Saren's, who should be but isn't there represented.

Actually I didn't like any of them. 3 colors, one ending. So I died from Harbinger's beam and never made it to the light, never faced off against TIM and never knew there anything else after that. I liked my ending, seeing what would happen if I made it to the light.

[Jat371]

Please Bioware, take more of my money. I'll give you my credit card number, just buy whatever you want. Please.

[Warrior Craess]

Xusa wrote...

Warrior Craess wrote...

Xusa wrote...

PKchu wrote...

I don't get the idea of Bioware making games is for Bioware's sake and we don't know anything.

"
You're watching too much drama TV series where they explain everything in order for common people to understand and take ease at a story which is (normally) better than their simple life."

Common people? Seriously?

That's like the most arrogant thing I've ever seen posted on this website.

Maybe it is, but that's how it is done. Think of it like this: When you enter a mega store, everything is explained so common people understand what the product in sale does in the simplest way possible. But when you enter a store especialized in kitchen, PC, forniture, they don't do so, because whoever buy things in those shops already know about the products they're buying.

TV is the same thing. If you watch a Gaming show on TV it'll probably look dumb, if you do so on, let's say, IGN, it'll look more suitable for gamers.

LOL poor choice of an example, becuase in all theose cases your taught how to create or perform something. It's an interactive thing with you, as a person with choices, having control of the end product.  This is what Bioware promised and this is what bioware failed to deliver.  

And you do have the control. But the game is incredible in simulating "life" because in life there are something you can't control exactly how it goes, and the game presents you that just too well.

Who wants to pay 60 bucks (or more in my case) for a game/book/movie that mimics real life? I can by a newspaper or read the internet if I want to see how depressing/uncontrolable things are.

 Authors/scriptwriters /game designers who continuly finish their story with open ended conclusions generally don't tend to do well over a period of time. Becuase no one wants to invest their time, and emotions if they never get a sense of closure. And we speak with our money - fail to provide me with the closure I need from your story, and eventually, regardless of how talented a story teller you may be, I'll refuse to buy your books/movies/games.  

If they had decided that they wanted to continue the story in another sequal, a simple announcement made during the midnight madness that they had decided to continue the story, would have avoided all of this issue. In fact I would have loved the cliffhanger ending and anxiously awaited ME4. However no such announcment was made, This is, according to everything that BW said, the ending of the story of Shepard. As such it needs to provide the closure to shepards story, and it doesn't. It doesn't even provide closure to shepards life. It provides nothing at all except some glowing color explosions, and creates gaping (I could safely fit the Grand Canyon in the plot holes left in this ending) plots holes that effectively ruin everything we've all spent oh so many hours creating. 

Given this type of treatment, with out any discourse from BW, I'm highly unlikely to buy another ME game. The Story has been ruined for me at this point and I really have no further emotional connection to the characters. BW is in danger of joining the ranks of Lucas, and George R.R. Martin in my mind, as people whose product I avoid at all cost.

Modifié par Warrior Craess, 15 mars 2012 - 04:59 .

[N7 Banshee Bait]

Dragoonlordz wrote...

Steelgrave wrote...

Why do the 2% even bother??? You're hopelessly outnumbered.

Read.

Already answered this question.

That's not exactly what I meant.

[Pedro Costa]

Doc089 wrote...

Actually I didn't like any of them. 3 colors, one ending. So I died from Harbinger's beam and never made it to the light, never faced off against TIM and never knew there anything else after that. I liked my ending, seeing what would happen if I made it to the light.

Ah, ok then.
For what it's worth, mine woke up from the bad dream.

[Xusa]

To get it clearer: The point it not that I don't want a different ending, explanations etc. What I want is that the game flows the way it should, not the way the masses want. Why should distrust BioWare if up until now she hasn't done anything to receive that? I expect great thing to come. Be it DLC, be it a sequel, w/e. You shouldn't rage at the show before it's finished.

[Xusa]

Doc089 wrote...

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Doc089 wrote...
I'm glad you enjoyed the ending.

But didn't you find it a bit of a let down that once you enter the light your only "winning" options were renegade? I never thought of Anderson as a Renegade but they put him on that ending. To take the blue, or what has been associated with Paragon choices, you had to side with TIM.

So, you prefer to belive a colour in the last 5 minutes than a person's actions through a whole trilogy?
If there's *one* thing the ending did well was break away from the typical "blue for paragon" "red for renegade", the fact TIM and Anderson are swapped only reinforces it.

Point is, there is no "paragon" nor "renegade" ending. You either agree with Anderson's pov or TIM's. OR Saren's, who should be but isn't there represented.

Actually I didn't like any of them. 3 colors, one ending. So I died from Harbinger's beam and never made it to the light, never faced off against TIM and never knew there anything else after that. I liked my ending, seeing what would happen if I made it to the light.

well. XD

IF you ask me, I didn't like the endings the way they were too, but because I was too fond of the characters too see them all left apart from each other. In the end it was the way it may have to be and I'm glad I finished those reapers off.

[Doc089]

DarkLord_PT wrote...

Doc089 wrote...

Actually I didn't like any of them. 3 colors, one ending. So I died from Harbinger's beam and never made it to the light, never faced off against TIM and never knew there anything else after that. I liked my ending, seeing what would happen if I made it to the light.

Ah, ok then.
For what it's worth, mine woke up from the bad dream.

Just another one of those nightmare's that caused him not to sleep through the night? Yeah, that would explain why he's back on the ship.

Modifié par Doc089, 15 mars 2012 - 05:02 .

[lm_Commander_Shepard]

Again, that's great if you're fine with cheap Deus Ex Machina literary devices, a lack of closure, betrayal of central themes, and broken narrative -- but by no means is it a good ending. Mass Effect is very much a franchise that was shaped by the fans. Bioware may own it in the legal sense, but most people freely gave out criticism to Lucas for his prequel trilogy in Star Wars. Why? Because Star Wars became a cultural institution, and a part of many people's lives. The complaints are legitimate and too bad if you don't like that people are making them.

[RShara]

Okay, I don't know if anyone has made these points, but this is why I didn't like (among other things) the ending. This relates to the ending being full of plot holes, as well as being lazy.

Why are synthetics destined to kill organics? Didn't we JUST go through this with the geth, and find out the exact opposite? Except when organics are controlling geth. Or, organic/synthetic hybrids(Reapers). Exactly what you(Shepard) has either just taken control of, or just turned everyone into.

If Shepard survives, how did he get on Earth? He was in an exploding space station. In the middle of a space battle. With exploding ships. And exploding Reapers. And Exploding Relays. When we've already seen that Planet vs Shepard, Shepard does not win.

What happens to Hackett? The rest of the fleet? Spacer Shepard's mother?

No matter which choice you make, you get almost exactly the same cutscene. Have you seen the side-by-side video with all the endings? Can you see the color shift, even in that very small image? Why would a multi-million dollar company cop out on giving you *at the least* a unique cutscene for each choice?

How are your squadmates (I had no LI in 3 since Thane died, which I am also bitter about), who are with you when the beam hits, on the Normandy with Joker? And EDI, and anyone else for that matter?

How exactly do you Control something when you're dead?

We know from Arrival, destroying a Mass Relay destroys the solar system that it is in. The Charon Relay is in the Sol system. So Earth and the assembled might of the galaxy should all be destroyed. So how are you on Earth and alive?
And for those who say that this energy is different--when you pan out to the galaxy view, you see a pretty darn big explosion . It looks to be the size of the cluster, doesn't it? Or is it? Do we know?

[zimm2142]

Tequila Man wrote...

http://social.biowar...5/index/9851623

No stones. Just... points. It is their artistic vision. A vision that was supposed to be ours, too.

This.
Until they fix this, they have lost my bussiness, I have also cancelled all preorders for EA games, and my STWOR membership.

[GreyhameBioware]

Xusa wrote...

GreyhameBioware wrote...

At this point, with the negative feedback, they should release something. It's smart business. It probably won't get back the people who already may have returned their games, but it will make the people you want to buy your DLC happier. Personally I don't see the point in getting any DLC for ME3 with how I feel about the ending. And seeing as the only DLC I bought for ME 2 was the Shadow Broker one, I think I can safely say I don't need it.

You missed Arrival, it was pretty important. And Kasumi Goto is a lovable character (and the story behind her is also pretty good)

Eh, not really that worried about it.  Not having it certainly didn't seem to affect my game overly much other than a war asset thing.  And I was considering going back to get in as part of my ME1-ME3 playthrough.  Then I hit the end of ME3, and the desire dropped completely.  Still doing the playthrough though.

Modifié par GreyhameBioware, 15 mars 2012 - 05:13 .

[The Real Bowser]

stevesyanks17hotmail.com wrote...

Don't change a thing Bioware.

Also, no business will be lost. These whiners will buy any DLC, and they certainly will buy ME4, or ME: Miranda or whatever.

Don't count on it, smartass.

[Sethal]

Xusa wrote...

Foulpancake wrote...

seriously the "don't change it for the whiners" crap again? Has Bioware spoken yet? With the VERY well written and thought out "Indoctrination" theory, only a fool would completely dismiss it, and all the hints bioware has thrown out. You have NO IDEA if they are even done yet. All of your whining about "whiners" could be amounting to is you insisting Bioware keep an ending...they never intended on BEING the ending...so chill out, let them speak first

I lie the indoctrination theory. It's a good one. What I'm asking isn't about BioWare leaving the game as it is now. It's about they doing what they want to, and not what the fanbase tells them to.

Sometimes fan influence can be beneficial to an artist.

Arthur Conan Doyle killed off Sherlock Holmes in The Final Problem, outraged fans then wrote to him and his publisher demanding he bring Sherlock back from the dead. He then decided to rewrite the ending of that book.  Doyle later went on to write The Hound of the Baskervilles.

Don't underestimate the whiners... fans.

Edit: Oops! misspelled a word.

Modifié par Sethal, 15 mars 2012 - 05:40 .