On the Mass Effect 3 endings. Yes, we are listening.
#3551
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:19
Soz 4 wall o' text.
#3552
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:20
RiGoRmOrTiS_UK wrote...
Subject One wrote...
I play games, listen music, read books and watch films to FEEL something. Good, depressing, uplifting or bad. What I don't want is to be bored. And I think that I wasn't bored for a second with ME3.
And yes, the ending is weird, depressing and thought provoking. And I understand why a lot of people hate it. But personally for me it's better a bitter ending than an average/ predictable ending that don't make me feel/ think anything. But maybe it's just me.
Thing is, its not thought provoking because its deep, multi-layered or clever. Its thought provoking in that there are certain things that make absolutly no sense. There are 4 huge "slap you in the face" things which clearly don't make sense..
..i.e. Dead Squadmates appears on the jungle planet...
shepard just "accepting" everything the star child says..
Anderson getting to the control panel first.. Anderson's "shifting walls and rooms" comment doesn't cut it because the control panel room is in your view when he mentions it.
etc...etc.. etc..
oh and the fact the game wasn't going to have an A, B, C ending (mentioned a mere 2 months ago by bioware)
The point is: Starchild really tells the truth? Control are not the IM ending? Merge are not Saren ending? If we destroy the reapers will be Geth really destroyed? After all there is a Control ending where Sheppard lives... despite of having synthetic tech inside him. And the Saren or IM 'endings' are really any worse than the Destroy ending?
Yeah, at that level I think that the game is thought provoking. I don't like the rushed Normandy ending, it needs to be more fleshed out. But I'm fine with the Shepard/ Reapers side of the ending. Just my 2 cents.
Modifié par Subject One, 16 mars 2012 - 01:20 .
#3553
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:20
And I agree with the others there, you really need to cut back on the smileys
#3554
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:20
bpzrn wrote...
bwFex wrote...
I really have been trying to let myself get over this nightmare, but since you guys promise you're listening here, I'll try to just say it all, get it all out.
I have invested more of myself into this series than almost any other video game franchise in my life. I loved this game. I believed in it. For five years, it delivered. I must have played ME1 and ME2 a dozen times each.
I remember the end of Mass Effect 2. Never before, in any video game I had ever played, did I feel like my actions really mattered. Knowing that the decisions I made and the hard work I put into ME2 had a very real, clear, obvious impact on who lived and who died was one of the most astounding feelings in the world to me. I remember when that laser hit the Normandy and Joker made a comment about how he was happy we upgraded the shields. That was amazing. Cause and effect. Work and reward.
The first time I went through, I lost Mordin, and it was gut-wrenching: watching him die because I made a bad decision was damning, heartbreaking. But it wasn't hopeless, because I knew I could go back, do better, and save him. I knew that I was in control, that my actions mattered. So that's exactly what I did. I reviewed my decisions, found my mistakes, and did everything right. I put together a plan, I worked hard to follow that plan, and I got the reward I had worked so hard for. And then, it was all for nothing.
When I started playing Mass Effect 3, I was blown away. It was perfect. Everything was perfect. It was incredible to see all of my decisions playing out in front of me, building up to new and outrageous outcomes. I was so sure that this was it, this was going to be the masterpiece that crowned an already near-perfect trilogy. With every war asset I gathered, and with every multiplayer game I won, I knew that my work would pay off, that I would be truly satisfied with the outcome of my hard work and smart decisions. Every time I acquired a new WA bonus, I couldn't wait to see how it would play out in the final battle. And then, it was all for nothing.
I wasn't expecting a perfect, happy ending with rainbows and butterflies. In fact, I think I may have been insulted if everyone made it through just fine. The Reapers are an enormous threat (although obviously not as invincible as they would like us to believe), and we should be right to anticipate heavy losses. But I never lost hope. I built alliances, I made the impossible happen to rally the galaxy together. I cured the genophage. I saved the Turians. I united the geth and the quarians. And then, it was all for nothing.
When Mordin died, it was heartwrenching, but I knew it was the right thing. His sacrifice was... perfect. It made sense. It was congruent with the dramatic themes that had been present since I very first met Wrex in ME1. It was not a cheap trick, a deus ex machina, an easy out. It was beautiful, meaningful, significant, relevant, and satisfying. It was an amazing way for an amazing character to sacrifice themself for an amazing thing. And then it was all for nothing.
When Thane died, it was tearjerking. I knew from the moment he explained his illness that one day, I'd have to deal with his death. I knew he was never going to survive the trilogy, and I knew it wouldn't be fun to watch him go. But when his son started reading the prayer, I lost it. His death was beautiful. It was significant. It was relevant. It was satisfying. It was meaningful. He died to protect Shepard, to protect the entire Citadel. He took a life he thought was unredeemable and used it to make the world a brighter place. And then it was all for nothing.
When Wrex and Eve thanked me for saving their species, I felt that I had truly accomplished something great. When Tali set foot on her homeworld, I felt that I had truly accomplished something great. When Javik gave his inspiring speech, I felt that I had inspired something truly great. When I activated the Citadel's arms, sat down to reminisce with Anderson one final time, I felt that I had truly accomplished something amazing. I felt that my sacrifice was meaningful. Significant. Relevant. And while still a completely unexplained deus ex machina, at least it was a little bit satisfying.
And then, just like everything else in this trilogy, it was all for nothing.
If we pretend like the indoctrination theory is false, and we're really supposed to take the ending at face value, this entire game is a lost cause. The krogans will never repopulate. The quarians will never rebuild their home world. The geth will never know what it means to be alive and independent. The salarians will never see how people can change for the better.
Instead, the quarians and turians will endure a quick, torturous extinction as they slowly starve to death, trapped in a system with no support for them. Everyone else will squabble over the scraps of Earth that haven't been completely obliterated, until the krogans drive them all to extinction and then die off without any women present. And this is all assuming that the relays didn't cause supernova-scaled extinction events simply by being destroyed, like we saw in Arrival.
And perhaps the worst part is that we don't even know. We don't know what happened to our squadmates. We didn't get any sort of catharsis, conclusion. We got five years of literary foreplay followed by a kick to the groin and a note telling us that in a couple months, we can pay Bioware $15 for them to do it to us all over again.
It's not just the abysmally depressing/sacrificial nature of the ending, either. As I've already made perfectly clear, I came into this game expecting sacrifice. When Mordin did it, it was beautiful. When Thane did it, it was beautiful. Even Verner. Stupid, misguided, idiotic Verner. Even his ridiculous sacrifice had meaning, relevance, coherence, and offered satisfaction.
No, it's not the sacrifice I have a problem with. It's the utter lack of coherence and respect for the five years of literary gold that have already been established in this franchise. We spent three games preparing to fight these reapers. I spent hours upon hours doing every side quest, picking up every war asset, maxing out my galactic readiness so that when the time came, the army I had built could make a stand, and show these Reapers that we won't go down without a fight.
In ME1, we did the impossible when we killed Sovereign. In ME2, we began to see that the Reapers aren't as immortal as they claim to be: that even they have basic needs, exploitable weaknesses. In ME3, we saw the Reapers die. We saw one get taken down by an overgrown worm. We saw one die with a few coordinated orbital bombardments. We saw several ripped apart by standard space combat. In ME1, it took three alliance fleets to kill the "invincible" Sovereign. By the end of ME3, I had assembled a galactic armada fifty times more powerful than that, and a thousand times more prepared. I never expected the fight to be easy, but I proved that we wouldn't go down without a fight, that there is always hope in unity. That's the theme we've been given for the past five years: there is hope and strength through unity. That if we work together, we can achieve the impossible.
And then we're supposed to believe that the fate of the galaxy comes down to some completely unexplained starchild asking Shepard what his favorite color is? That the army we built was all for nothing? That the squad whose loyalty we fought so hard for was all for nothing? That in the end, none of it mattered at all?
It's a poetic notion, but this isn't the place for poetry. It's one thing to rattle prose nihilistic over the course of a movie or ballad, where the audience is a passive observer, learning a lesson from the suffering and futility of a character, but that's not what Mass Effect is. Mass Effect has always been about making the player the true hero. If you really want us to all feel like we spent the past five years dumping time, energy, and emotional investment into this game just to tell us that nothing really matters, you have signed your own death certificate. Nobody pays hundreds of dollars and hours to be reminded how bleak, empty, and depressing the world can be, to be told that nothing we do matters, to be told that all of our greatest accomplishments, all of our faith, all of our work, all of our unity is for nothing.
No. It simply cannot be this bleak. I refuse to believe Bioware is really doing this. The ending of ME1 was perfect. We saw the struggle, we saw the cost, but we knew that we had worked hard, worked together, and won. The ending of ME2 was perfect. We saw the struggle, we saw the cost, but we knew that we had worked hard, worked together, and won.
Taken at face value, the end of ME3 throws every single thing we've done in the past five years into the wind, and makes the player watch from a distance as the entire galaxy is thrown into a technological dark age and a stellar extinction. Why would we care about a universe that no longer exists? We should we invest any more time or money into a world that will never be what we came to know and love?
Even if the ending is retconned, it doesn't make things better. Just knowing that the starchild was our real foe the entire time is so utterly mindless, contrived, and irrelevant to what we experienced in ME1 and ME2 that it cannot be forgiven. If that really is the truth, then Mass Effect simply isn't what we thought it was. And frankly, if this is what Mass Effect was supposed to be all along, I want no part of it. It's a useless, trite, overplayed cliche, so far beneath the praise I once gave this franchise that it hurts to think about.
No. There is no way to save this franchise without giving us the only explanation that makes sense. You know what it is. It was the plan all along. Too much evidence to not be true. Too many people reaching the same conclusions independently.
The indoctrination theory doesn't just save this franchise: it elevates it to one of the most powerful and compelling storytelling experiences I've ever had in my life. The fact that you managed to do more than indoctrinate Shepard - you managed to indoctrinate the players themselves - is astonishing. If that really was the end game, here, then you have won my gaming soul. But if that's true, then I'm still waiting for the rest of this story, the final chapter of Shepard's heroic journey. I paid to finish the fight, and if the indoctrination theory is true, it's not over yet.
And if it's not, then I just don't even care. I have been betrayed, and it's time for me to let go of the denial, the anger, the bargaining, and start working through the depression and emptiness until I can just move on. You can't keep teasing us like this. This must have seemed like a great plan at the time, but it has cost too much. These people believed in you. I believed in you.
Just make it right.
This ---> We don't know what happened to our squadmates. We didn't get any sort of
catharsis, conclusion. We got five years of literary foreplay followed
by a kick to the groin and a note telling us that in a couple months, we
can pay Bioware $15 for them to do it to us all over again.
Quoting because this shouldn't be lost in the shuffle.
#3555
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:21
#3556
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:22
#3557
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:23
THEN SHE KICKS YOU IN THE NUTS AND YOU NEVER SEE HER AGAIN!
#3558
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:23
But the ending is just this huge overwhelming negative blur that overshadows all the other moments I want to remember.
I dont need a happy ending, I need an ending that makes sense and fits with the quality of the games I spent 5 years playing. The last 15 minutes is not when its time to charge gears with the style of storytelling.
#3559
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:24
Cuz you wrote a block of passionate text, and for that, we love you. They probably skip reading the blocks but still lolbwFex wrote...
Awww, I come back 60 pages later and you guys are still talking about me. That's sweet.
#3560
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:25
Ashtarth1 wrote...
Bantz wrote...
Chris Priestly wrote...
We appreciate everyone’s feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know that we are listening. Active discussions about the ending are more than welcome here, and the team will be reviewing it for feedback and responding when we can. Please note, we want to give people time to experience the game so while we can’t get into specifics right now, we will be able to address some of your questions once more people have had time to complete the game. In the meantime, we’d like to ask that you keep the non-spoiler areas of our forums and our social media channels spoiler free.
We understand there is a lot of debate on the Mass Effect 3 ending and we will be more than happy to engage in healthy discussions once more people get to experience the game. We are listening to all of your feedback.
In the meantime, let's give appreciation to Commander Shepard. Whether you loved the ME3 ending or didn't or you just have a lot of questions, he/she has given many of us some of the best adventures we have had while playing games. What was your favorite moment?
anyone else read this as "We're glad your talking about this, and we'll be happy to explain to you simple minded folks the brilliance of our work after we've had enough time to ****** off another entire country of fans. Thank you for your patience." ?
Hope i'm wrong and Chris is being genuine but it just seems based of twitter comments and such that you expect us to head cannon everything. IE I picked red and destroyed the reapers, geth and EDI (although if you listen to twitter the star child may have been lying!). My crew is stranded and I'm laying battered bruised and, 5 minutes before meeting star child I was bleeding out. So I take a half a breath which means i"m alive! So disregarding my dire medical situation and unknown location I'm to head cannon that I'm found, nursed back to health and find a pilot to fly me out on a wild goose chase to find my crew. Hey STEEEEEEEEVE !!!! crashed on earth somewhere and apparently "he's ok!" so maybe he'll help after all he'll do "anything for me".
Ok sarcasm and lack of faith aside. Chris you asked what my favorite parts of ME3 were? Just about all of it. I romanced tali, I LOVED the flirtations between her and shep all game. It really made the romance feel more organic. Now it would have been nice when i went to speak to her if i got something other then "shepherd". even in ME2 when you started romancing her you got a change in dialog when you asked "got time to talk". It went from "not now need to fix the engine", to "Ofcourse, always have time for you". I loved the missions on rannoch and Tuchanka. And even though I romanced Tali I think the Tuchanka missions were your finest work. Between Moridins "Metal in tank excellent supliment for thresher maws diet", to his "I MADE A MISTAKE!" or "Would have liked to run tests on seashells". That series of quests had moments of absolute hilarity and moments that made you completely choke up and fight back tears.
Oh and being able to punch that headstrong quarian admiral that ordered the fleet to fire on the dreadnaught while I was still inside. GET THE HELL OFF MY SHIP MR. QUIB QUIB!
Han'Gerrel is the Admiral that did that lolol
Quib Quib wants peace.
fair enough, I still yelled GET OFF MY SHIP QUIB QUIB at that moment just for fun though
#3561
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:25
Xerkysz wrote...
For all you people crying about the "No response to the endings" and how "Bad" they are...
There's the key to why you're not getting a response, and they aren't bad at all if you do a little research and are able to understand it.
This is a common response by some who thought that a book, movie or game was not only good but clever, but finds people who think otherwise.
I believe I understood it (or I did after looking at the other quote unquote ending(s)), and I still think it sucked, and I didn't think it was particularly clever. Some people like yourself think differently and that's also fine, but it's wrong to dismiss all dissenters to your opinion as people who haven't understood something.
Modifié par whitey4444, 16 mars 2012 - 01:28 .
#3562
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:25
and oh, i'm a marketer by profession... this thread is just to allow clients to think they are doing something, but actually they are not doing anything at all...
dao/me2 i bought every single dlc & CE because that was a lovely game...
the DLCs for me3 are lepers to me as long as the ending does not get fixed...
i will never buy anything remotely related to bioware or even EA if i can help it if the ending is not fixed...
you think we care about this series because of the mass effect universe? hell no...
it was all about the characters and the story arc...
and to think that i got a CE pre-order for me3.....................
#3563
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:26
#3564
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:26
tgz wrote...
...I understand that this saga can not be concluded with "happily ever after". I understand sacrifice is necessary
I disagree entirely. If I choose to, and if I work hard enough for it, I want a rainbows and happy thoughts ending. We already potentially lose a number of friends throughout the campaign, I want to take back Earth, kick the Reapers and go live on Rannoch with Tali and have creepy mutant babies.
Of course as it is all about choice I totally understand there should be options for total destruction, Shep dying and everything in between. That choice is what makes Mass Effect so replayable, because no two play-throughs will ever be the same.
I apologise if I seem to be ranting at you in paticular, I'm not, but I have seen so many people saying there shouldn't be a happy ending it kinda annoys me. Just because it isn't your choice, nor the "canon" ending, doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to get there myself.
#3565
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:27
bwFex wrote...
Awww, I come back 60 pages later and you guys are still talking about me. That's sweet.
Well, you exactly got the point in your post.
This here isn't the mindless DAII I experienced and took part in. The games are brilliant, its just the last 10 minutes that absolutly don't come up to it.
I think, and Bioware should lie here if its not the case, Bioware should state that the Indoctrination Theory is true and tht they are still working on the final ending and release it as a patch when its ready.
#3566
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:28
bwFex wrote...
If that really is
the truth, then Mass Effect simply isn't what we thought it was. And
frankly, if this is what Mass Effect was supposed to be all along, I
want no part of it. It's a useless, trite, overplayed cliche, so far
beneath the praise I once gave this franchise that it hurts to think
about.
My thoughts too.
#3567
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:28
I loved the game, the best of the 3!
Relationships:
My male Shepard have a LI with Tali, and this relationship in ME3 it's too beautiful, I really don't expected a so intensive relationship. Tnks Bio for this, it's really was as I expected.
Game Story:
Works perfect, to me, the best game ever!
Multiplayer:
Hum... funny, but I had played just to help Shepard to save the world...
End game:
Like 99% of the player, I didn't liked the end game. I think that has no good options, just 3 "choices" that the only difference it's the color of the Mass Relay.
Why Shepard can do a selfish decision? Like "Save my crew and kill the others" or "Save my LI, she is too important to me". Even agree with the Reapers and destroy the cycle.
At the end, Shepard aways loose. Even if he survive, he's stay alone in earth as your friends and the love of his life are on another planet, this is worse than death...I think that Shepard deserves more than this.
Too sad...
#3568
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:28
Also. All of this rage over the ending is hilarious. Talking about the inclusion of some "star child" or "ghost" and getting so offended that the series ended on such a terrible, juvenile, unsatisfying note. I'm just about as entertained reading the feedback as I was playing the game.
Everyone. Look at the notes in your codex regarding Reaper indoctrination. Read them. Twice, if you have to. Then play the push on Earth to the Citadel over again when Shepard is charging for the beam. Rinse and repeat this process until the ending of the game makes your jaw hit the floor in complete, mind-blowing awe.
I'm not going to spoil anything. I'm just going to sit back and smile knowing that Bioware has pulled the wool over just about everyone's eyes on this forum in such a deep way. It's brilliant.
However, if the ending IS supposed to be taken at face value and some of us are just reading far too much into it, then there are still very profound questions that need answers. But, this I highly doubt is the case.
#3569
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:29
#3570
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:29
Chris Priestly wrote...
We appreciate everyone’s feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know that we are listening. Active discussions about the ending are more than welcome here, and the team will be reviewing it for feedback and responding when we can. Please note, we want to give people time to experience the game so while we can’t get into specifics right now, we will be able to address some of your questions once more people have had time to complete the game. In the meantime, we’d like to ask that you keep the non-spoiler areas of our forums and our social media channels spoiler free.
We understand there is a lot of debate on the Mass Effect 3 ending and we will be more than happy to engage in healthy discussions once more people get to experience the game. We are listening to all of your feedback.
In the meantime, let's give appreciation to Commander Shepard. Whether you loved the ME3 ending or didn't or you just have a lot of questions, he/she has given many of us some of the best adventures we have had while playing games. What was your favorite moment?
It is hard to show appreciation with the ending but my favorite moment is how well the romance with Ashley was done.
As for my feeback, I just want a happy ending. Reapers die, sqaud lives, its been the Mass Effect goal when I started this in 2007.
#3571
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:31
#3572
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:31
Either way, I honestly don't care how long it takes to fix the ending, I really don't. And I understand that talking about it officially just one day after it's last release date doesn't work. But fix it, don't tell us we need to fill in the blanks because we don't understand the ending or whatever, just fix it. Heck I don't care if Shepard dies or not, I'm expecting that, but this game series has been far to good to be allowed to end so badly. I mean really, up until that point it felt more like I was playing a book than a game, and that's an amazingly good thing, and then you drop an ending on me I don't think even my grade school teacher would have passed.
Just man up as a company and admit you got it wrong and set things right again, it looks a whole lot better than denying it or making up excuses.
That said, I have started a replay from Me1 and up, hoping that by the time I get to the end of Me2 there will be a DLC or something out for the ending.
#3573
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:32
Chris Priestly wrote...
We appreciate everyone’s feedback about Mass Effect 3 and want you to know that we are listening.
"We're listening"... nearly 150 pages and it won't be too hard to get the overall "feedback"
- Now stop listening and REACT
#3574
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:33
Titan_HQ wrote...
tgz wrote...
...I understand that this saga can not be concluded with "happily ever after". I understand sacrifice is necessary
I disagree entirely. If I choose to, and if I work hard enough for it, I want a rainbows and happy thoughts ending. We already potentially lose a number of friends throughout the campaign, I want to take back Earth, kick the Reapers and go live on Rannoch with Tali and have creepy mutant babies.
Of course as it is all about choice I totally understand there should be options for total destruction, Shep dying and everything in between. That choice is what makes Mass Effect so replayable, because no two play-throughs will ever be the same.
I apologise if I seem to be ranting at you in paticular, I'm not, but I have seen so many people saying there shouldn't be a happy ending it kinda annoys me. Just because it isn't your choice, nor the "canon" ending, doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to get there myself.
Yes, it's like saving the Rachni in Mass Effect 1. You now you wouldn't loose the game if you save her or kill her.
Still as player you can decide to take the "save" path and kill her or risk it and show mercy.
Like that in an ideal ending you should have options that sound like "sacrifice but it will 100% kill the reapers" or one that could (and would) lead to "little blue childern".
As someone said, important to me is the road, I agree, as long as it doesn't end in a deadlock like now.
Modifié par MDT1, 16 mars 2012 - 01:37 .
#3575
Posté 16 mars 2012 - 01:33




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