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For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
On the Mass Effect 3 endings. Yes, we are listening.
Débuté par
Chris Priestly
, mars 15 2012 02:55
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#9252
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 04:55
Thanatos144
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I agree with youTomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
#9253
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 04:57
k8ee
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Thanatos144 wrote...
I agree with youTomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
How can something that makes no sense what so ever answer important questions? And what important questions do you think were answered?!?! Honestly, I would like to know.
#9254
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 04:58
vje6
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First of all thanks a lot for hundreds of hours of fantastic fun in the Mass Effect Universe!
Second, the ending is... complicated. I have never felt such strong emotion for a imho messed up ending like that of ME3 because I adore those games sooo much! And I don't want to encourage Bioware to make a "happy ending" (even though as an option I wouldn't mind). I could go on what was flawed and such but I think this document here pretty much states it all:
https://docs.google....?pli=1&sle=true
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better). It's the very much hushed endings, which are far too similar, don't take any of your actions into account and are just... I don't know, random. I had a similar feeling when I watched the ending of Lost or Battlestar Galactica, I just thought WTF. But Lost was a complete plothole-mess from start to finish so I really didn't believe a real closure or answers when I reached the last episode. But Mass Effect was such a brilliantly written Story, so clear, with a few mystery elements but nothing like Twin Peaks or Lost. And at the very end you turned it into... this.
Now, don't get me wrong, I WANT to respect your visions as artists and there's a lot of art that isn't immediately understood by viewers and so on. And imho the writers at Bioware should craft their story as they see fit. But by getting us players so deeply involved into this, giving us the chance to influence so much of it, you also made it ours. Normally, when you watch a painting, you just see the end result, you don't change the painting in its process. Video games, especially ones with so much decisionmaking as Mass Effect, are a whole different thing. You take the player with you, as you develop the game. Ending it with a (imho) completely unnecessary plot twist is just bad storywriting. If we would have gotten some glimpses that all is not as it seems throughout the game series it might have been ok. Introducing or hinting the true existence of the catalyst halfway through the game and having some time after that to deal with the massively changed situation might have given us a chance to adapt to the plottwist. But as I finished ME2 I was sure the whole reason for the extinction cycle was just the reproduction cycle of the reapers. They whipe everything out and process it into new reapers. THIS is a motive, might be very basic, but understandable. And now it all is completely thrown out the window and we get this.
Sorry, Bioware, as much as I respect your work on this series, this just feels like your writers (or whoever) just got a bit over-ambitious at the last chance and thought "Wow, we're gonna make something that's so much over the top that people fall out of their chairs!" Yes, you certainly did that.
I don't understand, how this happened? Didn't anyone say "Hey, just a second, this is not very convincing and most people might not get it!" ?? Did someone then return "I don't care, this is MY artistic vision?" The whole series was written so well, so consistent! The end seems like you fired the whole team of writers 5 minutes before deadline and someone else completely disregarded the canon and wrote something which most people would call artist masturbation.
I have nothing against mindf*ck-stories, I LOVED Inception! But you have to stay consistent. If the whole story is very sober and at the last bit you get all wild with larger than life themes (even larger than Mass Effect was up to that point), you can't blame people, that they don't get it! Just imagine you watch a movie like Dawn of the dead and you get all "Ah, yeah, Zombies, cool!" and at the end the hero gets into some building and a door opens and an alien comes out and says "Those are not Zombies, but another alien race and we are their enemies and here to help you! Sorry that earth became our battleground!" And then the screen fades to black.
I mean, come on, did really no one at Bioware suspect that this ending and all the plotholes (I still don't understand how SO many could have been missed by such a great team of writers) would enrage people? Creating art is one thing but this was written very badly. Just because it's art doesn't mean that you shouldn't check for errors!
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
Second, the ending is... complicated. I have never felt such strong emotion for a imho messed up ending like that of ME3 because I adore those games sooo much! And I don't want to encourage Bioware to make a "happy ending" (even though as an option I wouldn't mind). I could go on what was flawed and such but I think this document here pretty much states it all:
https://docs.google....?pli=1&sle=true
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better). It's the very much hushed endings, which are far too similar, don't take any of your actions into account and are just... I don't know, random. I had a similar feeling when I watched the ending of Lost or Battlestar Galactica, I just thought WTF. But Lost was a complete plothole-mess from start to finish so I really didn't believe a real closure or answers when I reached the last episode. But Mass Effect was such a brilliantly written Story, so clear, with a few mystery elements but nothing like Twin Peaks or Lost. And at the very end you turned it into... this.
Now, don't get me wrong, I WANT to respect your visions as artists and there's a lot of art that isn't immediately understood by viewers and so on. And imho the writers at Bioware should craft their story as they see fit. But by getting us players so deeply involved into this, giving us the chance to influence so much of it, you also made it ours. Normally, when you watch a painting, you just see the end result, you don't change the painting in its process. Video games, especially ones with so much decisionmaking as Mass Effect, are a whole different thing. You take the player with you, as you develop the game. Ending it with a (imho) completely unnecessary plot twist is just bad storywriting. If we would have gotten some glimpses that all is not as it seems throughout the game series it might have been ok. Introducing or hinting the true existence of the catalyst halfway through the game and having some time after that to deal with the massively changed situation might have given us a chance to adapt to the plottwist. But as I finished ME2 I was sure the whole reason for the extinction cycle was just the reproduction cycle of the reapers. They whipe everything out and process it into new reapers. THIS is a motive, might be very basic, but understandable. And now it all is completely thrown out the window and we get this.
Sorry, Bioware, as much as I respect your work on this series, this just feels like your writers (or whoever) just got a bit over-ambitious at the last chance and thought "Wow, we're gonna make something that's so much over the top that people fall out of their chairs!" Yes, you certainly did that.
I don't understand, how this happened? Didn't anyone say "Hey, just a second, this is not very convincing and most people might not get it!" ?? Did someone then return "I don't care, this is MY artistic vision?" The whole series was written so well, so consistent! The end seems like you fired the whole team of writers 5 minutes before deadline and someone else completely disregarded the canon and wrote something which most people would call artist masturbation.
I have nothing against mindf*ck-stories, I LOVED Inception! But you have to stay consistent. If the whole story is very sober and at the last bit you get all wild with larger than life themes (even larger than Mass Effect was up to that point), you can't blame people, that they don't get it! Just imagine you watch a movie like Dawn of the dead and you get all "Ah, yeah, Zombies, cool!" and at the end the hero gets into some building and a door opens and an alien comes out and says "Those are not Zombies, but another alien race and we are their enemies and here to help you! Sorry that earth became our battleground!" And then the screen fades to black.
I mean, come on, did really no one at Bioware suspect that this ending and all the plotholes (I still don't understand how SO many could have been missed by such a great team of writers) would enrage people? Creating art is one thing but this was written very badly. Just because it's art doesn't mean that you shouldn't check for errors!
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
#9255
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:00
Margurka
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k8ee wrote...
Thanatos144 wrote...
I agree with youTomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
How can something that makes no sense what so ever answer important questions? And what important questions do you think were answered?!?! Honestly, I would like to know.
I liked everything about the ending except the ghost boy, it really didn't make sense. The idea of control, synthesis, or destruction did, I just think they could've put some explanation as to what the hell he was.
#9256
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:01
Lord Atherios
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Thanatos144 wrote...
I agree with youTomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
So maybe you can explan something to me.
Where is the "logic" in a statement like. "Hey mate, we have a problem... someday an evil race of robots is going to kill you, so I decided to create an evil race of robots to kill you NOW. You are going to be killed by robots anyway, but instead of livinf XXX years, youre not going to live any longer".... could you explain that to me? I dont understand that.
Is just like thinking: "Hey, im going to die someday, so... why not commiting suicide right now? anyway im going to die sooner or later"
Its just and plain stupid.
Modifié par Lord Atherios, 22 mars 2012 - 05:04 .
#9257
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:02
Margurka
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vje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
I completely agree there
#9258
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:02
micjohns
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First I will say this to get it out there. I love the Mass Effect Series
ME3 was damn well amazing until the.... reaper child thingit. any way
to get this out there. I had a couple ideas, but until recently was not
all to confident to toss them out here. regardless I would appreciate
constructive feedback (My hope is someone at Bioware gets to see this)
Ending
From
the current existing endings you have your three choices Control/
Synthesis/ Destroy all Synthetic life. If your Effective Military
strength is 5000 or higher, you get a little cutscene where Shepard (I
am assuming) takes half a breath before it cuts to credits. What I would
suggest I suppose is more of a tweak to the existing system. Ine Mass
Effect 2 in your preparation for the Suicide Mission you could perform
resource mining to upgrade the Normandy SR 2. leaving the existing
endings as say ONE ending a second could involve widespread upgrading of
your allied Armada, I wasn't a fan of the mining mechanic in Mass
Effect 2 and will admit once i completed a playthrough, searched for a
save editor for the pesky mining. However with completion of missions in
ME3 you receive Alliance Funding. I suggest resources be added to this
'funding' (I know the Reaper Invasion makes this difficult but if you
were to include a script that makes use of Resource collection from ME1
to expand the Alliance fleet and all resources gathered from ME2 you
could divert small amounts of resources to upgrade fleets) in doing all
of this your Armada is then able to challenge the Reapers and intercept
Harbinger and the other Reapers before they land, allowing the team on
the ground to reach the Citadel beam. once the team is aboard the
citadel Shepard and the team can fonfront the Illusive man and either
persuade or execute him. after the Crucible is docked Shepard again has
the discussion with the reaper child thing but different options are now
availible if the Player completed certain side quests during the main
story. In particular the Reaper code fragment rather than destroy all
synthetic life simply shut down the Reapers with their code fragment
(You can then decide whether to study them or have the armada completely
trash the Reapers.) If you obtained Conrad Verner's Discertation on
Dark Energy the crucible merely sends a signal to the Reapers to shut
down. Potential then exists for a happy ending. I have seen on a Forum
post here somewhere mention of Shepard and Garrus sitting on a beach
discussing how they finally beat the Reapers, while piece of them splash
down in the ocean. this could also be changed so that you can make a
few final choices regarding Shepard's Life. Does he/she remain in the
Alliance Military? do they settle down with their Love Interest and
raise a family (This could depend on PC's Background Spacer, Earthborn,
Colonist. Psych Profile) for the Spacers, do we ever actually see
Hannah, or does she remain a faceless voice?
DLC Idea
This has been an Idea since Mass Effect that being said it's probably too late to implement but I'll throw it out here
Shepard's
Background is one of three things and I like the variance Earthborn,
Spacer, Colonist. I don't know about other players but I had a difficult
time with some of the things Shepard had to endure pre-service History
wise. I disliked the little kid dream sequence in ME3, I felt that there
was something else that could go there after the first dream.
Shepard's own personal demons for example. I'd base them on either
Preservice history in the case of Colonists or Eartborns and Psych
Profile for the Spacer.
The second part of this is an idea that I
had for Shepard's Family (preservice of course) being an only child is
okay, but for certain actions Shepard can take (on the Paragon side) I
thought it seems more like the instinct of an older brother or sister
(gender dependant) so that was also a thought I had give Shepard a
little brother or sister. now before somone says it's a shooter's game
now I'm saying Shepard has a younger or older sibling, choice dependant
by the player. Here's how i worked things out for my Shepard
Background: Colonist
Psych profile: War Hero/Sole Survivor (Another thought allow players to combine 2 Psych profiles)
class: Infiltrator (Potential to allow players to create custom classes ex Infiltrator with Vanguard's Biotic Charge)
your
sibling can have an exposure to eezo making them a biotic. (note this
also would give your Shepard an eezo exposure- but not require you to
play as a biotic class)so into the backstory we have Shepard going about
his/her day on Mindoir, happens to be younger sister bday (I chose
having a little sister for this) parents are either former Alliance
Marines, civilians, or combination of civilian and military. Former
Military parent opens up different options later in game (note one
parent was an N6 Marine, and the class you choose determines their's)
for simplicity mom's name is Hannah (I chose her to be a normal
civillian) my Shepard's father Jason is the N6 Marine and an Infiltrator
(Military parent washed out of the N7 Program but was greatly respected
until their honorable discharge) so Shep recieves some training from
dad long before enlisting in the military. there's even a plan for
pirate raids, get mom and sister to barn, dad and Shep pick off any
pirate/slaver that tries to get into barn. Batarian slaving raid occurs
and this plan succeeds in part, Shep's dad is killed in street
protecting his daughter leaving Shep to enact remainder of plan.
regardless of choices Shepard is overwhelmed and incapacitated, being
left for dead.
In Mass Effect you would mention this to your LI
in the courting stage if male or female Ash/Kaiden/Liara's response
varies in Mass Effect 2 after completing Miranda's Loyalty Mission
Shepard becomes unsettled as he is able to protect Miranda's sister but
not his own. Miranda utilizes her contacts to recover information on
Shepard's sister and forwards it to him. however if the player romanced
Ashley/Kaiden (Gender dependent) in ME Garrus will provide information
to Shepard to be able to rescue his/her sibling on the Purgatory
mission. By ME3 Shep's Sibling has become an N6 marine waiting on entry
to the N7 program.
Notes: Spacer spent time on Arcturus (Friends with Joker/sibling goes on field trip to Mindoir is still abducted)
Earthborn depending on how you handle a fight your sibling can be killed
As
in ME when the console could be used to add different class powers
(more than one) I personally would like to see some custom made classes
made avaiable and your background play at least some small role in ME3
like a mission to mindoir if you're from there.
Anyway Let me know what you think I welcome constructive feedback
ME3 was damn well amazing until the.... reaper child thingit. any way
to get this out there. I had a couple ideas, but until recently was not
all to confident to toss them out here. regardless I would appreciate
constructive feedback (My hope is someone at Bioware gets to see this)
Ending
From
the current existing endings you have your three choices Control/
Synthesis/ Destroy all Synthetic life. If your Effective Military
strength is 5000 or higher, you get a little cutscene where Shepard (I
am assuming) takes half a breath before it cuts to credits. What I would
suggest I suppose is more of a tweak to the existing system. Ine Mass
Effect 2 in your preparation for the Suicide Mission you could perform
resource mining to upgrade the Normandy SR 2. leaving the existing
endings as say ONE ending a second could involve widespread upgrading of
your allied Armada, I wasn't a fan of the mining mechanic in Mass
Effect 2 and will admit once i completed a playthrough, searched for a
save editor for the pesky mining. However with completion of missions in
ME3 you receive Alliance Funding. I suggest resources be added to this
'funding' (I know the Reaper Invasion makes this difficult but if you
were to include a script that makes use of Resource collection from ME1
to expand the Alliance fleet and all resources gathered from ME2 you
could divert small amounts of resources to upgrade fleets) in doing all
of this your Armada is then able to challenge the Reapers and intercept
Harbinger and the other Reapers before they land, allowing the team on
the ground to reach the Citadel beam. once the team is aboard the
citadel Shepard and the team can fonfront the Illusive man and either
persuade or execute him. after the Crucible is docked Shepard again has
the discussion with the reaper child thing but different options are now
availible if the Player completed certain side quests during the main
story. In particular the Reaper code fragment rather than destroy all
synthetic life simply shut down the Reapers with their code fragment
(You can then decide whether to study them or have the armada completely
trash the Reapers.) If you obtained Conrad Verner's Discertation on
Dark Energy the crucible merely sends a signal to the Reapers to shut
down. Potential then exists for a happy ending. I have seen on a Forum
post here somewhere mention of Shepard and Garrus sitting on a beach
discussing how they finally beat the Reapers, while piece of them splash
down in the ocean. this could also be changed so that you can make a
few final choices regarding Shepard's Life. Does he/she remain in the
Alliance Military? do they settle down with their Love Interest and
raise a family (This could depend on PC's Background Spacer, Earthborn,
Colonist. Psych Profile) for the Spacers, do we ever actually see
Hannah, or does she remain a faceless voice?
DLC Idea
This has been an Idea since Mass Effect that being said it's probably too late to implement but I'll throw it out here
Shepard's
Background is one of three things and I like the variance Earthborn,
Spacer, Colonist. I don't know about other players but I had a difficult
time with some of the things Shepard had to endure pre-service History
wise. I disliked the little kid dream sequence in ME3, I felt that there
was something else that could go there after the first dream.
Shepard's own personal demons for example. I'd base them on either
Preservice history in the case of Colonists or Eartborns and Psych
Profile for the Spacer.
The second part of this is an idea that I
had for Shepard's Family (preservice of course) being an only child is
okay, but for certain actions Shepard can take (on the Paragon side) I
thought it seems more like the instinct of an older brother or sister
(gender dependant) so that was also a thought I had give Shepard a
little brother or sister. now before somone says it's a shooter's game
now I'm saying Shepard has a younger or older sibling, choice dependant
by the player. Here's how i worked things out for my Shepard
Background: Colonist
Psych profile: War Hero/Sole Survivor (Another thought allow players to combine 2 Psych profiles)
class: Infiltrator (Potential to allow players to create custom classes ex Infiltrator with Vanguard's Biotic Charge)
your
sibling can have an exposure to eezo making them a biotic. (note this
also would give your Shepard an eezo exposure- but not require you to
play as a biotic class)so into the backstory we have Shepard going about
his/her day on Mindoir, happens to be younger sister bday (I chose
having a little sister for this) parents are either former Alliance
Marines, civilians, or combination of civilian and military. Former
Military parent opens up different options later in game (note one
parent was an N6 Marine, and the class you choose determines their's)
for simplicity mom's name is Hannah (I chose her to be a normal
civillian) my Shepard's father Jason is the N6 Marine and an Infiltrator
(Military parent washed out of the N7 Program but was greatly respected
until their honorable discharge) so Shep recieves some training from
dad long before enlisting in the military. there's even a plan for
pirate raids, get mom and sister to barn, dad and Shep pick off any
pirate/slaver that tries to get into barn. Batarian slaving raid occurs
and this plan succeeds in part, Shep's dad is killed in street
protecting his daughter leaving Shep to enact remainder of plan.
regardless of choices Shepard is overwhelmed and incapacitated, being
left for dead.
In Mass Effect you would mention this to your LI
in the courting stage if male or female Ash/Kaiden/Liara's response
varies in Mass Effect 2 after completing Miranda's Loyalty Mission
Shepard becomes unsettled as he is able to protect Miranda's sister but
not his own. Miranda utilizes her contacts to recover information on
Shepard's sister and forwards it to him. however if the player romanced
Ashley/Kaiden (Gender dependent) in ME Garrus will provide information
to Shepard to be able to rescue his/her sibling on the Purgatory
mission. By ME3 Shep's Sibling has become an N6 marine waiting on entry
to the N7 program.
Notes: Spacer spent time on Arcturus (Friends with Joker/sibling goes on field trip to Mindoir is still abducted)
Earthborn depending on how you handle a fight your sibling can be killed
As
in ME when the console could be used to add different class powers
(more than one) I personally would like to see some custom made classes
made avaiable and your background play at least some small role in ME3
like a mission to mindoir if you're from there.
Anyway Let me know what you think I welcome constructive feedback
#9259
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:03
azereus2
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- Members
- 133 messages
TomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
That is fantstic and i felt the same as you. But then i realized that bioware promised soemthing that was on the game.
No ABC ending, and at least 27 posible endings. I only saw 3. I told my friend the same thing you just said, a video game is like a book but with graphics, they are telling you a story and the story ended taht way, he enraged saying that he wanted to know every detail, and i said you should use your imagination, like i did with the ending, i just filled the holes with thinks i believe was the correct stuff there.
But what happened here is not a matter of happy ending, is a matter of we fell cheated. Imagine yourself dating a girl for 5 years and every day she reminds you she wont cheat on you, one day she comes at you and says,.. i am cheating on you. What would you do? say *awww thats pretty emotional, good way to end our relationship* or you will at least ask why? in this case bioware is not telling us why they made jenifer hale and mark meer tell us on their youtube channel our choises matter when we come to realize no matter what you do in the end everyone gets the same ending. and i cried with mordins dead, and i said at loud this is for you liara when i used destruction choise ( C ), so it was emotional for me too.
#9260
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:04
Thanatos144
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- Members
- 924 messages
It was a AI.......Why is that seem to be always missed by you guys?Margurka wrote...
vje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
I completely agree there
#9261
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:04
Margurka
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- Members
- 18 messages
Lord Atherios wrote...
Thanatos144 wrote...
I agree with youTomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
So maybe you can explan something to me.
Where is the "logic" in a statement like. "Hey mate, we have a problem... someday an evil race of robots is going to kill you, so I decided to create an evil race of robots to kill you NOW. You are going to be killed by robots anyway, but instead of livinf XXX years, youre not going to live any longer".... could you explain that to me? I dont understand that.
The idea seems to be that the reapers overthrew their creators long LONG ago and that they come back to harvest organic life before things get out of control, hence the geth war being a fresh scar on the universe.
#9262
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:07
azereus2
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- Members
- 133 messages
Margurka wrote...
vje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
I completely agree there
like any story the dark energy stuff was something added to give ¨life¨ to he galaxy, it has nothing to do with shepards journey. it was soemthing tali was investigating, why did you though it has anything to with reapers?. mass effect 3 is focused on shepards journey not on what happens on some random star. That is not a plot hole.
Your brain decided this was an important matter when it wasnt. Tom bombadil is inmune to the rings power, he is just there to give some life to the world. nothing else.
#9263
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:08
Seeeg
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- Members
- 24 messages
Margurka wrote...
Please Bioware, don't change the ending. I was one of those fans in the beginning that was extremely displeased with the ending, but I didn't take to the internet because I have never been one for rash decisions. After having time to think about it, I realized it isn't exactly what I expected, but I can respect the artistic side of the game. All I really want is some sort of cutscene to show that my actions really had some sort of mass effect on the fate of the galaxy. Show what happens to everyone else, not just the Normandy.
A lot of people are saying it is just bad writing, but all those people are just refusing that there was an undertone from the start about the cost technology is chipping away on society and the sacrifices it takes to make even the smallest wrongs right. It just hurt too much how invested we got in our characters that this is how it had to end.
So I'll restate, can we just get some additional cutscenes to show what mark we left on the galaxy after our sacrifice? That's all I really need, and all any of us need.
Also an official explanation to the little ghost kid would be nice. That part didn't make any sense to me even two weeks after I beat the game.I hope I made a difference, I understand everyone's rage, but we can't add eyebrows to the Mona Lisa, why change Mass Effect?
i'm sure they aren't change the ending, just drawing a line from event to event.
see it like a puzzle:
you can fully understand the meaning when it is complete, but take a few key pieces from it and it doesnt make any sense.
i'm sure that bioware knows exactly what to do, just wait.
but, hell.. maybe i'm wrong, and the ending and everything it's just a big, bad mess. who knows..
#9264
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:08
Margurka
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- Members
- 18 messages
Thanatos144 wrote...
It was a AI.......Why is that seem to be always missed by you guys?Margurka wrote...
vje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
I completely agree there
AI of what? How did it take on the figure of the little kid? Was it Reaper AI or was it something completely beyond us? Why was it in a Crucible that WE built without US noticing? Or was it God? Catching my drift? Some sort of hint at what it is would have been nice. There is absolutely no evidence that is AI or God, therefore we have to assume Bioware took the easy way out with this one
#9265
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:10
Margurka
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- Members
- 18 messages
Seeeg wrote...
Margurka wrote...
Please Bioware, don't change the ending. I was one of those fans in the beginning that was extremely displeased with the ending, but I didn't take to the internet because I have never been one for rash decisions. After having time to think about it, I realized it isn't exactly what I expected, but I can respect the artistic side of the game. All I really want is some sort of cutscene to show that my actions really had some sort of mass effect on the fate of the galaxy. Show what happens to everyone else, not just the Normandy.
A lot of people are saying it is just bad writing, but all those people are just refusing that there was an undertone from the start about the cost technology is chipping away on society and the sacrifices it takes to make even the smallest wrongs right. It just hurt too much how invested we got in our characters that this is how it had to end.
So I'll restate, can we just get some additional cutscenes to show what mark we left on the galaxy after our sacrifice? That's all I really need, and all any of us need.
Also an official explanation to the little ghost kid would be nice. That part didn't make any sense to me even two weeks after I beat the game.
i'm sure they aren't change the ending, just drawing a line from event to event.
see it like a puzzle:
you can fully understand the meaning when it is complete, but take a few key pieces from it and it doesnt make any sense.
i'm sure that bioware knows exactly what to do, just wait.
but, hell.. maybe i'm wrong, and the ending and everything it's just a big, bad mess. who knows..
Exactly what I feel, without details from Bioware, it's 50/50 they just trolled us.
#9266
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:11
Thalos
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- Members
- 3 messages
Why, in my
opinion, ME 3 current ending can't possibly be well received by players:
Hello
everyone,
in the
following wall of text I will attempt to explain why, in my opinion, the
current ending of the game turned out to be such a fiasco and caused such a
harsh reaction in the fan community. I should warn you that this is going to be
a quite extensive dissertation and I apologize about that but I reckon it to be
necessary in order to provide a constructive and clear feedback.
First of
all I just want to say that I've been a huge fan of ME since ME1 first hit the
market, I've played ME 8 times, ME2 11
times and I've now finished ME3 for the first time.
So, we've
heard many reasons why people do not like the ending of ME3, some of which are:
because you promised 16 different endings and delivered 3, because you said
that our choices during the game would influence those endings and instead
we've got those 3 endings regardless of all the decisions we've made, because
those 3 endings are extremely unclear, and so on. Many are the weak points of
the way you chose to end ME3 but I am more than sure that you are able to lift
the fog over the controversial points in said endings and that you could maybe
make 3 REALLY different cutscenes for those 3 outcomes but I am absolutely sure
that it would not fix the problem and that it would not put the community at
ease. All the problems I've mentioned up until now are real enough but they are
not the REAL ISSUE, they are not the reason why so many players who have played
the game in a thousand different ways felt so disappointed.
I will now
try to explain what the CORE issue with the ending of ME3 really is, and also
why the majority of players stated that the game was an absolute masterpiece
until the last 15 minutes.
First of
all you need to ask yourselves: "what is mass effect about?". It's
about fighting and struggling and sacrificing in the name of hope, the hope
that it is possible to overcome doom and earn the chance to write our own
destiny; It's about fighting for the freedom of making a choice, fighting to
prove that not everything has already been decided for us and that there's no
escaping that doom, fighting to show that we are really free!
This right
here is why mass effect 3 (save for the end) is such a magnificent game, this
is why people shed tears sitting in front of their screens, this is why people
feel so attached to shepard and his/her friends and companions; because they
fight in the name of freedom, the freedom that comes or should come with being
alive, they fight because they believe that things can be changed if they all
work together, because they believe that unity, friendship, love and will can
be stronger than doom and shape the future. And they players are drawn to these
values, because these ideas are part of us as human beings, we want and need to
believe that we have the chance to shape our destiny, and that faith makes
every sacrifice worth it, even death (for example I think that most of the
players would be fine with having commander shepard die in one of the possible
endings, but only as long as his/her sacrifice served the cause and ideals I
just mentioned).
During the
entire game we, and our characters, are pushed and sustained by these ideals
and values, we travel all around the galaxy, fighting, sacrificing our closest
friends, making difficult choices, forging alliances by broadcasting the very
ideals I mentioned. We suffer, watch people die and entire worlds crumble but
we carry on because we have hope! The hope that all of this will be worth it,
that we will be ultimately be able to break this pattern and shape a new
future.
At this
point some of you could say:"what you say is true, in fact at the end
shepard manages to end the pattern and change the future, so what are you
complaining about?".
Fair point,
and I will now tell you why I still think this ending was a mistake: it is a
mistake and it has been so criticized because it undoes everything we've been
fighting for in 3 games.
Think about
it: after all the struggle and fights and loves and friendships and achievements
you end up face to face with some sort of deity who rules the galaxy and who
tells you that you CANNOT accomplish what you've set out to do, that this deity
can't allow you to choose what you really wanted to choose; this "god"
plainly tells you that organic life has NO HOPE of surviving on its own, that
the only possible outcome is chaos, that Harbringer was actually right when he
said "we are your salvation through destruction". In a word, this god
is telling us that hope was in vain because, as it turns out, we are not free,
that we cannot choose our destiny, that whatever we do this galactic cycle is
over, that whatever WHATEVER we do there's only ONE POSSIBLE OUTCOME to organic
life, that freedom is an illusion because the end had already been written and
cannot be changed (sure we can choose how we want the next cycle to begin, but
that wasn't our goal, what we wanted, what players really wanted, what shepard
really wanted was to save THIS CYCLE, but he/she just can't). This god is
telling us that organics and syntetics can't possibly coexist, while we have
proved otherwise (or so we thought) by bringing peace between the quarians and
the geth; and what of Legion, who at the end, just before dieing, considered
himself a person; and what about EDI, who actually states that she would die
for Joker. Was all that just an illusion doomed to end in chaos? Why doesn't
Shepard (and humanity, and asari and turians and quarians and geth and krogan
etc) deserve a chance to choose to take the risk of living and changing the
fate of the galaxy; and yea maybe it will ultimately end up in chaos and we
would have been wrong but why can't we choose to risk being wrong? That's part
of being human, that's part of a person and a player.
Some of you
could maybe say: "but if you chose to control the reapers and drive them
away everything will just remain as it is"
No it
won't! Because in any case the cycle has to end (the deity was very clear on
that) and the mass relays are destroyed, changing the galaxy as we know it
forever. That's not the galaxy we wanted to save, that's not the future we
wanted to shape, that's not the choice we wanted to make!
Do you
realize that we (shepard) have come all this way, sacrificed so much, lost so
much, soffered so much just to hear a "god" telling us that we are
not free? Worse than that actually, this "god" tricks us by once
again giving us the illusion that we can choose but we really can't because he
denies us the freedom to make a REAL CHOICE.
That's
what's wrong with ME3 ending, that's what hurts people, that's why this ending
cannot possibly be accepted. It goes against human nature, against human
believes, against the rest of the game itself because it takes away the most important
value we can perceive: freedom. We were created free.
This is
ofcourse my own personal opinion and my feedback, I just hope that it can help
(even a little bit).
opinion, ME 3 current ending can't possibly be well received by players:
Hello
everyone,
in the
following wall of text I will attempt to explain why, in my opinion, the
current ending of the game turned out to be such a fiasco and caused such a
harsh reaction in the fan community. I should warn you that this is going to be
a quite extensive dissertation and I apologize about that but I reckon it to be
necessary in order to provide a constructive and clear feedback.
First of
all I just want to say that I've been a huge fan of ME since ME1 first hit the
market, I've played ME 8 times, ME2 11
times and I've now finished ME3 for the first time.
So, we've
heard many reasons why people do not like the ending of ME3, some of which are:
because you promised 16 different endings and delivered 3, because you said
that our choices during the game would influence those endings and instead
we've got those 3 endings regardless of all the decisions we've made, because
those 3 endings are extremely unclear, and so on. Many are the weak points of
the way you chose to end ME3 but I am more than sure that you are able to lift
the fog over the controversial points in said endings and that you could maybe
make 3 REALLY different cutscenes for those 3 outcomes but I am absolutely sure
that it would not fix the problem and that it would not put the community at
ease. All the problems I've mentioned up until now are real enough but they are
not the REAL ISSUE, they are not the reason why so many players who have played
the game in a thousand different ways felt so disappointed.
I will now
try to explain what the CORE issue with the ending of ME3 really is, and also
why the majority of players stated that the game was an absolute masterpiece
until the last 15 minutes.
First of
all you need to ask yourselves: "what is mass effect about?". It's
about fighting and struggling and sacrificing in the name of hope, the hope
that it is possible to overcome doom and earn the chance to write our own
destiny; It's about fighting for the freedom of making a choice, fighting to
prove that not everything has already been decided for us and that there's no
escaping that doom, fighting to show that we are really free!
This right
here is why mass effect 3 (save for the end) is such a magnificent game, this
is why people shed tears sitting in front of their screens, this is why people
feel so attached to shepard and his/her friends and companions; because they
fight in the name of freedom, the freedom that comes or should come with being
alive, they fight because they believe that things can be changed if they all
work together, because they believe that unity, friendship, love and will can
be stronger than doom and shape the future. And they players are drawn to these
values, because these ideas are part of us as human beings, we want and need to
believe that we have the chance to shape our destiny, and that faith makes
every sacrifice worth it, even death (for example I think that most of the
players would be fine with having commander shepard die in one of the possible
endings, but only as long as his/her sacrifice served the cause and ideals I
just mentioned).
During the
entire game we, and our characters, are pushed and sustained by these ideals
and values, we travel all around the galaxy, fighting, sacrificing our closest
friends, making difficult choices, forging alliances by broadcasting the very
ideals I mentioned. We suffer, watch people die and entire worlds crumble but
we carry on because we have hope! The hope that all of this will be worth it,
that we will be ultimately be able to break this pattern and shape a new
future.
At this
point some of you could say:"what you say is true, in fact at the end
shepard manages to end the pattern and change the future, so what are you
complaining about?".
Fair point,
and I will now tell you why I still think this ending was a mistake: it is a
mistake and it has been so criticized because it undoes everything we've been
fighting for in 3 games.
Think about
it: after all the struggle and fights and loves and friendships and achievements
you end up face to face with some sort of deity who rules the galaxy and who
tells you that you CANNOT accomplish what you've set out to do, that this deity
can't allow you to choose what you really wanted to choose; this "god"
plainly tells you that organic life has NO HOPE of surviving on its own, that
the only possible outcome is chaos, that Harbringer was actually right when he
said "we are your salvation through destruction". In a word, this god
is telling us that hope was in vain because, as it turns out, we are not free,
that we cannot choose our destiny, that whatever we do this galactic cycle is
over, that whatever WHATEVER we do there's only ONE POSSIBLE OUTCOME to organic
life, that freedom is an illusion because the end had already been written and
cannot be changed (sure we can choose how we want the next cycle to begin, but
that wasn't our goal, what we wanted, what players really wanted, what shepard
really wanted was to save THIS CYCLE, but he/she just can't). This god is
telling us that organics and syntetics can't possibly coexist, while we have
proved otherwise (or so we thought) by bringing peace between the quarians and
the geth; and what of Legion, who at the end, just before dieing, considered
himself a person; and what about EDI, who actually states that she would die
for Joker. Was all that just an illusion doomed to end in chaos? Why doesn't
Shepard (and humanity, and asari and turians and quarians and geth and krogan
etc) deserve a chance to choose to take the risk of living and changing the
fate of the galaxy; and yea maybe it will ultimately end up in chaos and we
would have been wrong but why can't we choose to risk being wrong? That's part
of being human, that's part of a person and a player.
Some of you
could maybe say: "but if you chose to control the reapers and drive them
away everything will just remain as it is"
No it
won't! Because in any case the cycle has to end (the deity was very clear on
that) and the mass relays are destroyed, changing the galaxy as we know it
forever. That's not the galaxy we wanted to save, that's not the future we
wanted to shape, that's not the choice we wanted to make!
Do you
realize that we (shepard) have come all this way, sacrificed so much, lost so
much, soffered so much just to hear a "god" telling us that we are
not free? Worse than that actually, this "god" tricks us by once
again giving us the illusion that we can choose but we really can't because he
denies us the freedom to make a REAL CHOICE.
That's
what's wrong with ME3 ending, that's what hurts people, that's why this ending
cannot possibly be accepted. It goes against human nature, against human
believes, against the rest of the game itself because it takes away the most important
value we can perceive: freedom. We were created free.
This is
ofcourse my own personal opinion and my feedback, I just hope that it can help
(even a little bit).
#9267
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:14
jeweledleah
-
- Members
- 4 043 messages
I've learned something new today. there is apparently a movement, called Neo-Luddism. based on original technology fearing group back from 19th century. with all the talk of how mass relays are dangerous, technology has bad affect on societies.. the one thing I didn't expect is that its an actual movement. live and learn.
something for you lovely folks who love the endings to ponder. I'm happy that those endings fit with your Shepards. but what about those of us that the endings don't fit? those of us who were PROMISED by developers that we'd have a fitting conclusion, through tweets interviews, etc. those of us who were promised variety? don't we deserve an ending that fits us too? didn't we pay the same monye as you did? maybe even more, counting the merchandise etc?
why does it bother you so much that someone else might have an option that they enjoy? and please, stop bringing up "artistic integrity" as an excuse. the reason we cannot add eyebrows to mona Lisa is becasue original artist is not there to do it, you know being dead and all. I bet you if his clients, the ones who ordered original, or the ones that bought the copies from his workshop (oh, you think he didn't make any? look it up) - if they asked him to add the eyebrows? you betcha he'd do it.
something for you lovely folks who love the endings to ponder. I'm happy that those endings fit with your Shepards. but what about those of us that the endings don't fit? those of us who were PROMISED by developers that we'd have a fitting conclusion, through tweets interviews, etc. those of us who were promised variety? don't we deserve an ending that fits us too? didn't we pay the same monye as you did? maybe even more, counting the merchandise etc?
why does it bother you so much that someone else might have an option that they enjoy? and please, stop bringing up "artistic integrity" as an excuse. the reason we cannot add eyebrows to mona Lisa is becasue original artist is not there to do it, you know being dead and all. I bet you if his clients, the ones who ordered original, or the ones that bought the copies from his workshop (oh, you think he didn't make any? look it up) - if they asked him to add the eyebrows? you betcha he'd do it.
Modifié par jeweledleah, 22 mars 2012 - 05:16 .
#9268
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:15
marmot 1333
-
- Members
- 105 messages
Hello, Bioware. Thank you for making ME3 such a wonderful game. In a lot of ways, it felt like the best gaming experience I have ever had.
A big part (perhaps the main part) was the writing, voice acting, and characters. They really touched me in ways I didn't realize until I was playing this game.
Some of my favorite moments:
- The music for the galaxy map is quite possibly my favorite music ever, and whatever person is responsible for it staying through all three games should be heartily thanked.
- The Legion/Tali discussion on Rennoch
- The Legion/Geth part where you had to destroy the reaper code.
- My love interest in ME1 & Me3 was Liara--the part near the end where she says "I have a gift for you" and then you're alone with her in the middle of the galaxy (I guess?) and you kiss. That part was beautiful.
- When I went on the mission to rescue the Cerebrus scientists and Jacob was there! Yeah!
- Pretty much all the interactions with characters from the other games; particularly my conversations with Alenko. The voice acting & writing on him was top-notch.
- I liked all the dream sequences, especially the second one for some reason. It was powerful; the shadow figures and the slow movement rate is... affecting.
- I just beat it this morning, and I've been reading other people's thoughts. I am OK with the ending, all of it. (Then again, I was mostly OK with the ending to LOST and a lot of people seemed to have big problems with that) The more I think about it, the more I'm starting to think that I was indoctrinated into choosing "Control". The thing that really makes me belive this is that I began walking over towards that choice--the one on the left--and I changed my mind. BUT! But I couldn't walk back. I couldn't turn around to make another choice.
My one compaint on the game has to do with combat difficulty and squad/weapon selection. For most of the game, combat was a complete cakewalk. This was OK with me because I was mostly interested in learning the story; i was eager to rush through the combat. I was destroying everything in few seconds. However, once I landed in London, I was getting torn up!!! That one part where you fight a bunch of Banshees while protecting the tanks and then getting to the tanks to hit the switch to fire the missiles--I died SO MUCH there. This wouldn't be so bad except that by the time I was at that point, I realized I had chosen my suad poorly for the foes I was to face, and it would have been much easier had I been able to acces the squad powers/squad selection/weapon selection screen somehow.
A big part (perhaps the main part) was the writing, voice acting, and characters. They really touched me in ways I didn't realize until I was playing this game.
Some of my favorite moments:
- The music for the galaxy map is quite possibly my favorite music ever, and whatever person is responsible for it staying through all three games should be heartily thanked.
- The Legion/Tali discussion on Rennoch
- The Legion/Geth part where you had to destroy the reaper code.
- My love interest in ME1 & Me3 was Liara--the part near the end where she says "I have a gift for you" and then you're alone with her in the middle of the galaxy (I guess?) and you kiss. That part was beautiful.
- When I went on the mission to rescue the Cerebrus scientists and Jacob was there! Yeah!
- Pretty much all the interactions with characters from the other games; particularly my conversations with Alenko. The voice acting & writing on him was top-notch.
- I liked all the dream sequences, especially the second one for some reason. It was powerful; the shadow figures and the slow movement rate is... affecting.
- I just beat it this morning, and I've been reading other people's thoughts. I am OK with the ending, all of it. (Then again, I was mostly OK with the ending to LOST and a lot of people seemed to have big problems with that) The more I think about it, the more I'm starting to think that I was indoctrinated into choosing "Control". The thing that really makes me belive this is that I began walking over towards that choice--the one on the left--and I changed my mind. BUT! But I couldn't walk back. I couldn't turn around to make another choice.
My one compaint on the game has to do with combat difficulty and squad/weapon selection. For most of the game, combat was a complete cakewalk. This was OK with me because I was mostly interested in learning the story; i was eager to rush through the combat. I was destroying everything in few seconds. However, once I landed in London, I was getting torn up!!! That one part where you fight a bunch of Banshees while protecting the tanks and then getting to the tanks to hit the switch to fire the missiles--I died SO MUCH there. This wouldn't be so bad except that by the time I was at that point, I realized I had chosen my suad poorly for the foes I was to face, and it would have been much easier had I been able to acces the squad powers/squad selection/weapon selection screen somehow.
#9269
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:16
FlareKnight
-
- Members
- 3 messages
It really is tough to decide where to start with talking about what was wrong with this ending.
I think it is almost sad how well the Indoctrination Theory lines up over what happened. At the very least it sounds a whole lot better than what happened in the game and could be used pretty easily. Even if that wasn't Bioware's plan they barely have to do much to take advantage of it. Just wake Shepard up after he gets out of Indoctrination and actually procede to the end of the game. Feel free to toss in someone controlled by Harbinger so he and Shepard can settle things once and for all.
If we're going to talk about what was wrong though I have to bring up the victory fleet. Besides the small chatter before the battle started you really don't get a feel for the guys you brought along. It isn't a good idea to show people all these resources and then ignore them completely. I expected like in ME2 that the specific forces you brought in would matter. If you chose not to use Aria's mercenaries *this* would happen, or if you could only get one of the Quarians/Geth to come along *this* would happen. There should have been consequences for who you brought along and not just for the sake of a certain readiness rating.
Really do think Bioware should just use the Indoctrination Theory if they didn't actually intend to anyways. It gives a good moral battle for Shepard within himself before the battle is settled outside. Of course some things probably can't be fixed by an ending change too easily. Like why are the Reapers giving you that kind of access to the entrance to the Citadel? Why don't they shut the damn beam down? Was it all just to lure Shepard so Harbinger could finish his indoctrination or finish him off ?
In the end we can't just have all the actions previous mean nothing. What is the point if you wipe out systems via mass relay explosions or doom your own fleet to starvation? Let's see the real consequences of your actions. How will the Rachni be treated by the Galaxy if you let them live? How will the Krogans get along now that they have or have not been cured? Will humans be viewed better by the Galaxy thanks to Shepard's actions or worse because of Cerberus? I just hope that Bioware isn't going to cheaply fix this by adding some minor option to the Star Child scene. If they are going to fix it, do it right so people can remember Mass Effect as a great trilogy. Not just a good one that could have been great if the ending hadn't been a disaster.
I think it is almost sad how well the Indoctrination Theory lines up over what happened. At the very least it sounds a whole lot better than what happened in the game and could be used pretty easily. Even if that wasn't Bioware's plan they barely have to do much to take advantage of it. Just wake Shepard up after he gets out of Indoctrination and actually procede to the end of the game. Feel free to toss in someone controlled by Harbinger so he and Shepard can settle things once and for all.
If we're going to talk about what was wrong though I have to bring up the victory fleet. Besides the small chatter before the battle started you really don't get a feel for the guys you brought along. It isn't a good idea to show people all these resources and then ignore them completely. I expected like in ME2 that the specific forces you brought in would matter. If you chose not to use Aria's mercenaries *this* would happen, or if you could only get one of the Quarians/Geth to come along *this* would happen. There should have been consequences for who you brought along and not just for the sake of a certain readiness rating.
Really do think Bioware should just use the Indoctrination Theory if they didn't actually intend to anyways. It gives a good moral battle for Shepard within himself before the battle is settled outside. Of course some things probably can't be fixed by an ending change too easily. Like why are the Reapers giving you that kind of access to the entrance to the Citadel? Why don't they shut the damn beam down? Was it all just to lure Shepard so Harbinger could finish his indoctrination or finish him off ?
In the end we can't just have all the actions previous mean nothing. What is the point if you wipe out systems via mass relay explosions or doom your own fleet to starvation? Let's see the real consequences of your actions. How will the Rachni be treated by the Galaxy if you let them live? How will the Krogans get along now that they have or have not been cured? Will humans be viewed better by the Galaxy thanks to Shepard's actions or worse because of Cerberus? I just hope that Bioware isn't going to cheaply fix this by adding some minor option to the Star Child scene. If they are going to fix it, do it right so people can remember Mass Effect as a great trilogy. Not just a good one that could have been great if the ending hadn't been a disaster.
Last time I checked the Mona Lisa didn't have promises made as to what she'd look like before it was painted. If Bioware is hurt by all the criticism it's their own fault for not living up to what they repeatedly promised from the ending. Don't say it won't be a simple A/B/C kind of ending and then give exactly that. Don't say choice is going to matter when it doesn't at all. If Bioware didn't make all those promises people would have less to stand on....well besides the ending making absolutely no sense whatsoever. If they don't change the ending the only thing they will explain to you is how the victory fleet is starving to death or was wiped out by mass relay explosions. I suppose the decisions will matter in terms of who was trapped orbiting Earth and going to die.Margurka wrote...
Please Bioware, don't change the ending. I was one of those fans in the beginning that was extremely displeased with the ending, but I didn't take to the internet because I have never been one for rash decisions. After having time to think about it, I realized it isn't exactly what I expected, but I can respect the artistic side of the game. All I really want is some sort of cutscene to show that my actions really had some sort of mass effect on the fate of the galaxy. Show what happens to everyone else, not just the Normandy.
Also an official explanation to the little ghost kid would be nice. That part didn't make any sense to me even two weeks after I beat the game.
#9270
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:16
m2iCodeJockey
-
- Members
- 625 messages
I played a number of times with several ME2 saves.
I prefer to play as FemShep.
Tali's death was emotionally draining. I stopped playing and wept openly. Very well done.
FS: "Why pick me?" Fit well.
---
FS: "War cannot be reduced to simple mathematics."
GV: "Tell that to the Quarions."
Needed
-FS: "F you, Garrus..." *sobs and walks off*
-MS: *Pause, rage climbs, sharp inhale, pushes GV into a console, walks off nearly in tears*
Without Wrex:
Shooting Mordin was another emotionally draining scene.
I watched and thought "f this game" but, at that moment, Shep whips the pistol to the side. Well done.
With Liara as faithful LI:
FS: "You know me well enough..."
LT: "Earth's... ...was born in space... ...and it was a privilege to know her."
I've posted elsewhere: Combined with the memory shard tech: New saga of Shep clone?
Watching Joker and EDI play "Hot or Not" was a nice counter balance to killing friends just to cut deals.
That being said, from that point, the ending made the entire experience into an anti-technology story where, taking what Catalyst says at face value (accepting him as the Catalyst,) I had willfully participated in multiple acts of genocide and/or chosen to force a new state of existence on everyone at once, betraying everyone that had allied with me. Both were the very things the Reapers were doing.
Very anti-climax. I even looked to walk the other way before Marauder Shields.
Javic: "...because you still have hope that this war will end with your honor intact..."
I prefer to play as FemShep.
Tali's death was emotionally draining. I stopped playing and wept openly. Very well done.
FS: "Why pick me?" Fit well.
---
FS: "War cannot be reduced to simple mathematics."
GV: "Tell that to the Quarions."
Needed
-FS: "F you, Garrus..." *sobs and walks off*
-MS: *Pause, rage climbs, sharp inhale, pushes GV into a console, walks off nearly in tears*
Without Wrex:
Shooting Mordin was another emotionally draining scene.
I watched and thought "f this game" but, at that moment, Shep whips the pistol to the side. Well done.
With Liara as faithful LI:
FS: "You know me well enough..."
LT: "Earth's... ...was born in space... ...and it was a privilege to know her."
I've posted elsewhere: Combined with the memory shard tech: New saga of Shep clone?
Watching Joker and EDI play "Hot or Not" was a nice counter balance to killing friends just to cut deals.
That being said, from that point, the ending made the entire experience into an anti-technology story where, taking what Catalyst says at face value (accepting him as the Catalyst,) I had willfully participated in multiple acts of genocide and/or chosen to force a new state of existence on everyone at once, betraying everyone that had allied with me. Both were the very things the Reapers were doing.
Very anti-climax. I even looked to walk the other way before Marauder Shields.
Javic: "...because you still have hope that this war will end with your honor intact..."
#9271
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:16
Margurka
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azereus2 wrote...
Margurka wrote...
vje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
I completely agree there
like any story the dark energy stuff was something added to give ¨life¨ to he galaxy, it has nothing to do with shepards journey. it was soemthing tali was investigating, why did you though it has anything to with reapers?. mass effect 3 is focused on shepards journey not on what happens on some random star. That is not a plot hole.
Your brain decided this was an important matter when it wasnt. Tom bombadil is inmune to the rings power, he is just there to give some life to the world. nothing else.
Tom Bombadil's translated names in all the lore languages hint that he's some sort of Elder being, some sort of God or demi-God perhaps even. It would make sense that if he's some sort of wise being he wouldn't have any care for the desires of man. Just his own personal curiosity/
#9272
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:17
vje6
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Huh? I didn't regard this as an important matter or related to the reapers in any way. I was just wondering what happened to that...azereus2 wrote...
like any story the dark energy stuff was something added to give ¨life¨ to he galaxy, it has nothing to do with shepards journey. it was soemthing tali was investigating, why did you though it has anything to with reapers?. mass effect 3 is focused on shepards journey not on what happens on some random star. That is not a plot hole.Your brain decided this was an important matter when it wasnt. Tom bombadil is inmune to the rings power, he is just there to give some life to the world. nothing else.Margurka wrote...
I completely agree therevje6 wrote...
It's the MASSIVE plotholes that concern me. It's the mystical figure of the catalyst which is introduced at the last minutes of this epic saga which completely changes everything (and sadly not for the better)
Btw. what happened to the Dark Energy thing? I recall a mission on Haestrom in ME2 where Tali opened this Bottle about someone injecting large Masses of dark energy into the star causing it to degenerate faster than it should. This wasn't answered anywhere or did I miss it?
#9273
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:19
Thanatos144
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Maybe.....But it is a mystery that can be left unaswered if they want.Margurka wrote...
Seeeg wrote...
Margurka wrote...
Please Bioware, don't change the ending. I was one of those fans in the beginning that was extremely displeased with the ending, but I didn't take to the internet because I have never been one for rash decisions. After having time to think about it, I realized it isn't exactly what I expected, but I can respect the artistic side of the game. All I really want is some sort of cutscene to show that my actions really had some sort of mass effect on the fate of the galaxy. Show what happens to everyone else, not just the Normandy.
A lot of people are saying it is just bad writing, but all those people are just refusing that there was an undertone from the start about the cost technology is chipping away on society and the sacrifices it takes to make even the smallest wrongs right. It just hurt too much how invested we got in our characters that this is how it had to end.
So I'll restate, can we just get some additional cutscenes to show what mark we left on the galaxy after our sacrifice? That's all I really need, and all any of us need.
Also an official explanation to the little ghost kid would be nice. That part didn't make any sense to me even two weeks after I beat the game.
i'm sure they aren't change the ending, just drawing a line from event to event.
see it like a puzzle:
you can fully understand the meaning when it is complete, but take a few key pieces from it and it doesnt make any sense.
i'm sure that bioware knows exactly what to do, just wait.
but, hell.. maybe i'm wrong, and the ending and everything it's just a big, bad mess. who knows..
Exactly what I feel, without details from Bioware, it's 50/50 they just trolled us.
#9274
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:19
JeronimoLex
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Margurka wrote...
Please Bioware, don't change the ending. I was one of those fans in the beginning that was extremely displeased with the ending, but I didn't take to the internet because I have never been one for rash decisions. After having time to think about it, I realized it isn't exactly what I expected, but I can respect the artistic side of the game. All I really want is some sort of cutscene to show that my actions really had some sort of mass effect on the fate of the galaxy. Show what happens to everyone else, not just the Normandy.
A lot of people are saying it is just bad writing, but all those people are just refusing that there was an undertone from the start about the cost technology is chipping away on society and the sacrifices it takes to make even the smallest wrongs right. It just hurt too much how invested we got in our characters that this is how it had to end.
So I'll restate, can we just get some additional cutscenes to show what mark we left on the galaxy after our sacrifice? That's all I really need, and all any of us need.
Also an official explanation to the little ghost kid would be nice. That part didn't make any sense to me even two weeks after I beat the game.
I wont demand anything even when i am one of the most displeased fans, but posting no to satisfy the other is just wrong. You may understand everyone's rage, but you are asking for not to let them be happy. I cant agree with you, sorry.
And in the end, you are asking for your own changes. Again, wrong.
i said it, and im gona say it again: if you want something properly, do it yourself. Thats what im doing: http://masseffect4in....wordpress.com/
#9275
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 05:19
Cobra's_back
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TomasKratky1 wrote...
For me, the ending was most impressive. Very emotional, answered the important questions and still left enough for my imagination.
I can only applaud BioWare for "having the guts" to come with an end that made the whole Mass Effect trilogy a masterpiece to me and that was probably bound to get some negative reactions, because it's not a simple "save everyone and be happy" standard ending.
It is not about a happy ending. You missed the boat by a mile.
