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THe end wont change. They will just "explain" somethings and "give us more closure".. Nothing will change. Thats terrible, but its the truth.
On the Mass Effect 3 endings. Yes, we are listening.
Débuté par
Chris Priestly
, mars 15 2012 02:55
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#9352
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:44
robedon08
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Btw the Weakend Reapers in A could be dealt with in DLC lol
#9353
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:45
LawNinja
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#9354
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:47
NovaM4
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I just made my own Meme of ME3
Just to kill time waiting for the DLC
:happy:
Just to kill time waiting for the DLC
:happy:
#9355
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:47
Vox Draco
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Hmm...for the very first time I stopped playing a game that I actually liked immediately after beating it. This was two weeks ago. The ending shattered my desire to dive into the ME-Universe again.
Now that is quite an achievement, Bioware?! And I am glad I came to these boards to learn i am far from being alone in this matter. It is truly a shame, for I enjoyed almost every minute of the game, until the harbinger beam hit my femshep.
Why did you come up with this idea of denying the player any kind of real triumph? Be it good for the happy-end-supporters like me, or bad for the nihilistic/pessimistic/realistic ones? There should have been options for the player to choose from. Choices to make.
And most of all: If you create one of the most iconic video-game-heroes ever and actually allow the player to get emotionally attached to him/her over the course of three games...Then you MUST realize that killing this character is in a way like killing a part of the player. You don't do that. Not in an interactive medium like ME3. And if you do it, than at least don't be surprised that everybody and their mom seems to be p-ssed off by this.
Well, of course you can call it art. Quite an overused excuse, in my opinion at least. But today simply killing the hero in the end (and, as far as I am concerned, most of the galaxy with him/her) is just as unoriginal than a happy ending. But at least a possible (!) happy end wouldn't have caused so much distress among the fans, and myself.
You know, if you want a bad ending with everybody dead, including the world, you might want to read Elric of Melnibone. But here almost from the start of the novels you actually felt that this wasn't going to be a happy end. But Mass Effect was all about hope. Shepard was preaching this from the first part throughout the trilogy. And deep inside us, most of the fans hoped for some kind of happer conclusion.
No rainbows and lollipos. That's usually the cheap response you get for demanding a nicer end. No. But an end that leaves the player with hope for the future. At least this should be possible in some of the multiple endings promised, depending on our choices made.
And to make things clear: Seeing my Shepard disintegrate doesn't make me feel hopeful. I know, the galaxy is supposed to be a better place afterwards yadda yadda, because some ghost says so. I don't believe him...And I don't believe Shepard would, either...
Why should we, anyway? We don't get any reason to assume anything said in the end is true. Noteven the ending sequences confirm anything about a better gaalxy just because Shepard vaporized him/herself.
And to make this even worse, if we choose destroy and have done everything perfect, Shepard seems to be alive in teh rubble of London. Right. This scene alone makes everything the Star child said look even more like lies, doesn't it?
So if you, Bioware, decide to rework the end, maybe you want to keep these things in mind. It would hardly be enough to simply add a couple of cutscenes where we see Joker picking up some squadmates, followed by some textboxes that ecplain how awesome the thing is that Shepard has done. No. It wouldn't be enough, at least not for me. But maybe my interpretation of closure and answered questions, and choices that matter, is different. But i am sure again I am not alone in this as well...
So Bioware, make Shepard rise from the Ashes of London one more time. Give her/him the most awesome comeback in videogame-hstory, and let us players do what we always wanted to do, since ME1. Let us destroy the Reapers, save the Earth and move on. And this time give us an end that doesn't need a doctor's grade in philosophy or metaphysics...or spacemagic.
And don't forget to look on one of your last and maybe best products...Dragon Age 1. It had a wonderful ending, no, it had wonderful endingS. And for my characters, there really were some endings that truly deserved to be called "bittersweet", and I loved them.
A long post, and I doubt it will be read by anyone. But it makes me feel a little better to write it down. Don't know why, maybe some kind of psychological therapy...
Now that is quite an achievement, Bioware?! And I am glad I came to these boards to learn i am far from being alone in this matter. It is truly a shame, for I enjoyed almost every minute of the game, until the harbinger beam hit my femshep.
Why did you come up with this idea of denying the player any kind of real triumph? Be it good for the happy-end-supporters like me, or bad for the nihilistic/pessimistic/realistic ones? There should have been options for the player to choose from. Choices to make.
And most of all: If you create one of the most iconic video-game-heroes ever and actually allow the player to get emotionally attached to him/her over the course of three games...Then you MUST realize that killing this character is in a way like killing a part of the player. You don't do that. Not in an interactive medium like ME3. And if you do it, than at least don't be surprised that everybody and their mom seems to be p-ssed off by this.
Well, of course you can call it art. Quite an overused excuse, in my opinion at least. But today simply killing the hero in the end (and, as far as I am concerned, most of the galaxy with him/her) is just as unoriginal than a happy ending. But at least a possible (!) happy end wouldn't have caused so much distress among the fans, and myself.
You know, if you want a bad ending with everybody dead, including the world, you might want to read Elric of Melnibone. But here almost from the start of the novels you actually felt that this wasn't going to be a happy end. But Mass Effect was all about hope. Shepard was preaching this from the first part throughout the trilogy. And deep inside us, most of the fans hoped for some kind of happer conclusion.
No rainbows and lollipos. That's usually the cheap response you get for demanding a nicer end. No. But an end that leaves the player with hope for the future. At least this should be possible in some of the multiple endings promised, depending on our choices made.
And to make things clear: Seeing my Shepard disintegrate doesn't make me feel hopeful. I know, the galaxy is supposed to be a better place afterwards yadda yadda, because some ghost says so. I don't believe him...And I don't believe Shepard would, either...
Why should we, anyway? We don't get any reason to assume anything said in the end is true. Noteven the ending sequences confirm anything about a better gaalxy just because Shepard vaporized him/herself.
And to make this even worse, if we choose destroy and have done everything perfect, Shepard seems to be alive in teh rubble of London. Right. This scene alone makes everything the Star child said look even more like lies, doesn't it?
So if you, Bioware, decide to rework the end, maybe you want to keep these things in mind. It would hardly be enough to simply add a couple of cutscenes where we see Joker picking up some squadmates, followed by some textboxes that ecplain how awesome the thing is that Shepard has done. No. It wouldn't be enough, at least not for me. But maybe my interpretation of closure and answered questions, and choices that matter, is different. But i am sure again I am not alone in this as well...
So Bioware, make Shepard rise from the Ashes of London one more time. Give her/him the most awesome comeback in videogame-hstory, and let us players do what we always wanted to do, since ME1. Let us destroy the Reapers, save the Earth and move on. And this time give us an end that doesn't need a doctor's grade in philosophy or metaphysics...or spacemagic.
And don't forget to look on one of your last and maybe best products...Dragon Age 1. It had a wonderful ending, no, it had wonderful endingS. And for my characters, there really were some endings that truly deserved to be called "bittersweet", and I loved them.
A long post, and I doubt it will be read by anyone. But it makes me feel a little better to write it down. Don't know why, maybe some kind of psychological therapy...
#9356
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:48
GuardianEdens
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I want to preface this statement by saying that I will not respond to anyone on this subject after I post this. This is my opinion, and if you don't like it/don't agree with it, that's great, because the world is all about freedom of choice.
Bioware, do not remake the endings. The endings you have in there are great, granted the ending cinematic between all 3 are pretty similar, with very few variations, (i.e Shepard living in the best Destruction ending possible to achieve) but they all brought the series to an amazing end. Granted it might not be the ending that all of us were expecting, or perhaps wanting, where Shepard pulls a Chuck Norris and Round-House-Kicks the Reapers back to Darkspace (I say this because it seems to be the ending most people wanted, though I have to say I loved the ending you guys made the Synergy Ending was my favorite) but in honesty, the game is supposed to be the grim tale of a Galaxy at War. I wasn't expecting a happy ending where FemShep gets to live out her days making blue babies with Liara, and I wasn't expecting the ending that you, Bioware, provided for us. The endings you provided were great wrap ups to Shepards story, and the war as a whole. I think people are loosing focus on what the goal of the entire series was,
It wasn't about stopping Saren (ok, well for most of the first game it was, but then you find out about the Reaper Threat). Shepards goal wasn't to stop the Illusive Man or to even stop the Reapers, it was the preservation of all existence. Regardless of which ending you got, the goal is still acheived, sometimes through great sacrifice of the hero we have all grown to love.
The characters in this series were amazing! I felt like I came to know all of them personally throughout all the games. They felt real to me. In one of my ME2 playthroughs, Legion died, so I wasn't able to secure the Quarians and the Geth in ME3, and I chose to side with the Quarians. Tali's death, as well as the deaths of almost her entire species still weighed heavily on me throughout the game, and I still remember vividly the scene of her taking off her mask and falling off the cliff on Rannoch. Those are the things I will take away from this series. It made me feel a personal attachment to all the characters, so that I actually was vested in the fight. I loved the fact that you could be with Liara throughout all 3 games and have a lasting relationship with her. Instead of like some of the others that were merely just transitory flings.
In conclusion, Bioware, I don't think you should change anything about the games, or listen to the 'fans' that say they didn't like the endings. Otherwise your game will end up being the video game equivalent of the Spider Man 3 movie. Originally, Venom wasn't even supposed to be in that movie, the director said that they had enough bad guys in it as it was, but the fans whined and complained (much like they are doing about the ending to ME3) and the producer forced the director to put Venom in. They got Topher Grace to play Venom just as retribution for the whining ubber comic book nerd fans that wanted Venom to be in it. If you know anything about the Spider Man comics then you know that Eddie Brock was a linebacker on his highschool and college football teams. Topher Grace would get broke in two if he tried being a linebacker. They ruined the entire Spider Man 3 movie by listening to the fans and adding in a character that is complex enough to warrant an entire movie on his own with no other villains. Don't make my beloved Mass Effect Series become the Spider Man 3 of video games by listening to the whiners now. Stick to your guns Bioware. I salute you on a job well done!
Bioware, do not remake the endings. The endings you have in there are great, granted the ending cinematic between all 3 are pretty similar, with very few variations, (i.e Shepard living in the best Destruction ending possible to achieve) but they all brought the series to an amazing end. Granted it might not be the ending that all of us were expecting, or perhaps wanting, where Shepard pulls a Chuck Norris and Round-House-Kicks the Reapers back to Darkspace (I say this because it seems to be the ending most people wanted, though I have to say I loved the ending you guys made the Synergy Ending was my favorite) but in honesty, the game is supposed to be the grim tale of a Galaxy at War. I wasn't expecting a happy ending where FemShep gets to live out her days making blue babies with Liara, and I wasn't expecting the ending that you, Bioware, provided for us. The endings you provided were great wrap ups to Shepards story, and the war as a whole. I think people are loosing focus on what the goal of the entire series was,
It wasn't about stopping Saren (ok, well for most of the first game it was, but then you find out about the Reaper Threat). Shepards goal wasn't to stop the Illusive Man or to even stop the Reapers, it was the preservation of all existence. Regardless of which ending you got, the goal is still acheived, sometimes through great sacrifice of the hero we have all grown to love.
The characters in this series were amazing! I felt like I came to know all of them personally throughout all the games. They felt real to me. In one of my ME2 playthroughs, Legion died, so I wasn't able to secure the Quarians and the Geth in ME3, and I chose to side with the Quarians. Tali's death, as well as the deaths of almost her entire species still weighed heavily on me throughout the game, and I still remember vividly the scene of her taking off her mask and falling off the cliff on Rannoch. Those are the things I will take away from this series. It made me feel a personal attachment to all the characters, so that I actually was vested in the fight. I loved the fact that you could be with Liara throughout all 3 games and have a lasting relationship with her. Instead of like some of the others that were merely just transitory flings.
In conclusion, Bioware, I don't think you should change anything about the games, or listen to the 'fans' that say they didn't like the endings. Otherwise your game will end up being the video game equivalent of the Spider Man 3 movie. Originally, Venom wasn't even supposed to be in that movie, the director said that they had enough bad guys in it as it was, but the fans whined and complained (much like they are doing about the ending to ME3) and the producer forced the director to put Venom in. They got Topher Grace to play Venom just as retribution for the whining ubber comic book nerd fans that wanted Venom to be in it. If you know anything about the Spider Man comics then you know that Eddie Brock was a linebacker on his highschool and college football teams. Topher Grace would get broke in two if he tried being a linebacker. They ruined the entire Spider Man 3 movie by listening to the fans and adding in a character that is complex enough to warrant an entire movie on his own with no other villains. Don't make my beloved Mass Effect Series become the Spider Man 3 of video games by listening to the whiners now. Stick to your guns Bioware. I salute you on a job well done!
#9357
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:50
BCMakoto
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So, I have to also add my thoughts to this discussion again.
I appreciate every opinion on this world, be it a bad or good one, as opinions make people special. What I cannot have of any sort is to hear demands of people stopping their opinions, AND demand something by himself or herself.
I only want to point out why I think that most people do not actually get it that we want to change the ending.
People assume that: "We are upset because the game didn't end with a rainbow and an unicorn." That may be partial true, but that also emerged from the promises the developers made to us. We were promised, and I repeat, and if someone comes up with a statement that negates both of the following in a most ridicolous way, I will simply ignore him:
"This will result in a story that diverges into wildly different
conclusions based on the player's actions in the first two chapters."
"“There are many different endings. We wouldn’t do it any other way. How
could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and
then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets?”
You could write me ten miles of text, explaining Casper the ghost to me, what we were promised to get was not delivered in the slightest. No, they sat one brick on the wall by actually providing us with endings which do not even fit into the trilogy. The whole game was about the unification of different people, and how their strenghts can overcome any odd. The synthesize ending negates that completly. By forcing everyone into a partial organic, partial synthetic life, we negate every choice. We FORCE them to give up their differences.
"But they will evolve into a higher state of evolution...they won't disagree.". Wrong! An organic life-form fears change, it fears the unknown. They would never agree to be synthesized because a Reaper AI says so. We are doing the most "Renegade" choice of all, we force the whole galaxy into a process they maybe don't even want. Yes, Joker will be happy with EDI, but what of the rest? We have the obvious evidence over our heads that the Star child is wrong, yet we accept it as right and superior.
There is also no change in the game if you were a loyal customer for many years. I expected my decisions in Mass Effect 1 and 2 to have a wide consequence. While there was some consequence, I would not call it big. My first thought about sparing the Rachni Queen in ME 1 was: "Hm...maybe she will help me against the Reapers one day.". All she did in 3 was giving us some little Rachni workers for one hundred points.
Is actually nobody, even when beeing happy with Casper, interested to see Rachni and Krogans charge into Husks, Turian cruiser suiciding to kill a Reaper, Asari biotics throwing giant boulders on Marauders? The only difference our choices make are 5 seconds of cutscene loss in which a Turian cruiser gets blown up. That is the only difference before and in the battle on Earth.
What Bioware pulled of in this game was a Deus ex machina. A "Deus ex machina" is a synonym in books and games for an event which occurs at the end of a game, introducing a new character to the game which hasn't been in there before, giving him superior power over the enemy and he can solve the situation as he sees fit. This would be like...hm...imagine Lord of the Rings.
"The battle of Minas Tirith is raging across the Pelenor fields. The orcs are going relentless against the human soldiers, slaughtering them in the night. Suddenly, A new wizard from across the sea appears, swinging his staff, killing every orc in just a single wave after introducing himself by telling us his name.". That would be boring, wouldn't it? If you would sit in the cinema, would you like it? No, of course not. Don't tell me otherwise. To end an epic plot like this...you would certainly not.
Another thing which is often seen in those Forums is that people come here, say that our demands are against "Artistic integrity."(More on that later.). They say "Oh, do not change the ending.", and then demand something of their own five sentences later.
Question: "What makes your 60$ (Or in case of the N7 edition like me 80 $) more important then mine?". Answer: "Nothing.". For your mutual interest: "We, as in the majority of players who played the game so far want a better ending." is actually just what you are doing...asking for a fix/patch/DLC. So, what makes your opinion more entitled then mine or the ones of hundreds of thousands of other players out there?
Now, many people will shout: "It is Bioware's storie. Artistic integrity.". They will hold a letter into my face, and I will tear it appart. Why? There is no such thing as "Artistic integrity.". Sorry to burst your bubble here. I appreciate that Bioware is the owner of the Mass Effect universe, but I would also appreciate if people finally get it that they made the Mass Effect universe for US, the customers. They did not went trough all that work to read it to themselves in their offices. They made it so we can have it. They made it so we PAY for it. And if the people purchasing the book/game/DLC do not like it, do you think it shouldn't be dealt with? If I paint a picture, and the person paying me for it wants it in another way redrawn, I do it. Artistic integrity will not pay my bills, or fill my stomache with food.
We have said many times: "If you like the current ending, and count to the 11% of happy customers on the poll: Then do not get the DLC.". Simple as that. If you do not want new endings, more endings, the things you were promised to get by spending money on this game, then it is not OUR (As in "The unhappy customers") problem. Then do not click on download on the DLC page, and stay with your current endings. THIS is a perfect solution. Why? We get more endings, things that fit into our varity, you stay with your endings, Biowares PR is restored to a certain extend, and everyone can be happy ever after. Someone even goes as far as to say: "Those people are whiney people, they deserve to be insulted.".
We, as in the "raging fanboys" are always shown as the evil ones here. In fact, we are "Unhappy customers" not "raging fanboys". And we are certainly NOT the minority. We have come to you many times, giving you the option above, making everyone kind of happy. NO, we get refused time and time again, with YOUR (As in the people who demand the ending to stay.) glove slapped into the face. We have to listen to insults from time to time, stating us as "Whin** *****es" and "N*rds who live in momys basement".
And the thing which really makes me angry: We shall place our wishes behind your ones. We have to be silent, because the customer is never right and the artist is. "No, do not change the end. But while you are at it: Change X/Y/Z". There is simply no evidence as why your changes should be made earlier then ours.
We have extended our hands many times...we tried to find compromises...so your end can stay and we get a new one...what we get is harassement. And it is...disappointing.
I appreciate every opinion on this world, be it a bad or good one, as opinions make people special. What I cannot have of any sort is to hear demands of people stopping their opinions, AND demand something by himself or herself.
I only want to point out why I think that most people do not actually get it that we want to change the ending.
People assume that: "We are upset because the game didn't end with a rainbow and an unicorn." That may be partial true, but that also emerged from the promises the developers made to us. We were promised, and I repeat, and if someone comes up with a statement that negates both of the following in a most ridicolous way, I will simply ignore him:
"This will result in a story that diverges into wildly different
conclusions based on the player's actions in the first two chapters."
"“There are many different endings. We wouldn’t do it any other way. How
could you go through all three campaigns playing as your Shepard and
then be forced into a bespoke ending that everyone gets?”
You could write me ten miles of text, explaining Casper the ghost to me, what we were promised to get was not delivered in the slightest. No, they sat one brick on the wall by actually providing us with endings which do not even fit into the trilogy. The whole game was about the unification of different people, and how their strenghts can overcome any odd. The synthesize ending negates that completly. By forcing everyone into a partial organic, partial synthetic life, we negate every choice. We FORCE them to give up their differences.
"But they will evolve into a higher state of evolution...they won't disagree.". Wrong! An organic life-form fears change, it fears the unknown. They would never agree to be synthesized because a Reaper AI says so. We are doing the most "Renegade" choice of all, we force the whole galaxy into a process they maybe don't even want. Yes, Joker will be happy with EDI, but what of the rest? We have the obvious evidence over our heads that the Star child is wrong, yet we accept it as right and superior.
There is also no change in the game if you were a loyal customer for many years. I expected my decisions in Mass Effect 1 and 2 to have a wide consequence. While there was some consequence, I would not call it big. My first thought about sparing the Rachni Queen in ME 1 was: "Hm...maybe she will help me against the Reapers one day.". All she did in 3 was giving us some little Rachni workers for one hundred points.
Is actually nobody, even when beeing happy with Casper, interested to see Rachni and Krogans charge into Husks, Turian cruiser suiciding to kill a Reaper, Asari biotics throwing giant boulders on Marauders? The only difference our choices make are 5 seconds of cutscene loss in which a Turian cruiser gets blown up. That is the only difference before and in the battle on Earth.
What Bioware pulled of in this game was a Deus ex machina. A "Deus ex machina" is a synonym in books and games for an event which occurs at the end of a game, introducing a new character to the game which hasn't been in there before, giving him superior power over the enemy and he can solve the situation as he sees fit. This would be like...hm...imagine Lord of the Rings.
"The battle of Minas Tirith is raging across the Pelenor fields. The orcs are going relentless against the human soldiers, slaughtering them in the night. Suddenly, A new wizard from across the sea appears, swinging his staff, killing every orc in just a single wave after introducing himself by telling us his name.". That would be boring, wouldn't it? If you would sit in the cinema, would you like it? No, of course not. Don't tell me otherwise. To end an epic plot like this...you would certainly not.
Another thing which is often seen in those Forums is that people come here, say that our demands are against "Artistic integrity."(More on that later.). They say "Oh, do not change the ending.", and then demand something of their own five sentences later.
Question: "What makes your 60$ (Or in case of the N7 edition like me 80 $) more important then mine?". Answer: "Nothing.". For your mutual interest: "We, as in the majority of players who played the game so far want a better ending." is actually just what you are doing...asking for a fix/patch/DLC. So, what makes your opinion more entitled then mine or the ones of hundreds of thousands of other players out there?
Now, many people will shout: "It is Bioware's storie. Artistic integrity.". They will hold a letter into my face, and I will tear it appart. Why? There is no such thing as "Artistic integrity.". Sorry to burst your bubble here. I appreciate that Bioware is the owner of the Mass Effect universe, but I would also appreciate if people finally get it that they made the Mass Effect universe for US, the customers. They did not went trough all that work to read it to themselves in their offices. They made it so we can have it. They made it so we PAY for it. And if the people purchasing the book/game/DLC do not like it, do you think it shouldn't be dealt with? If I paint a picture, and the person paying me for it wants it in another way redrawn, I do it. Artistic integrity will not pay my bills, or fill my stomache with food.
We have said many times: "If you like the current ending, and count to the 11% of happy customers on the poll: Then do not get the DLC.". Simple as that. If you do not want new endings, more endings, the things you were promised to get by spending money on this game, then it is not OUR (As in "The unhappy customers") problem. Then do not click on download on the DLC page, and stay with your current endings. THIS is a perfect solution. Why? We get more endings, things that fit into our varity, you stay with your endings, Biowares PR is restored to a certain extend, and everyone can be happy ever after. Someone even goes as far as to say: "Those people are whiney people, they deserve to be insulted.".
We, as in the "raging fanboys" are always shown as the evil ones here. In fact, we are "Unhappy customers" not "raging fanboys". And we are certainly NOT the minority. We have come to you many times, giving you the option above, making everyone kind of happy. NO, we get refused time and time again, with YOUR (As in the people who demand the ending to stay.) glove slapped into the face. We have to listen to insults from time to time, stating us as "Whin** *****es" and "N*rds who live in momys basement".
And the thing which really makes me angry: We shall place our wishes behind your ones. We have to be silent, because the customer is never right and the artist is. "No, do not change the end. But while you are at it: Change X/Y/Z". There is simply no evidence as why your changes should be made earlier then ours.
We have extended our hands many times...we tried to find compromises...so your end can stay and we get a new one...what we get is harassement. And it is...disappointing.
#9358
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:52
JCronic2k
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- Members
- 1 messages
First off i'm a huge ME fan. I look at ME as a great sci-fi franchise and the "Star Wars" of video games. The story and plot was just incredible.
Now I'm one of those people that didnt really mind the ending. Yes, I thought it coulda used more closure, but i'm not someone who's going to slam Bioware for how they ended THEIR game. Its Bioware's story, not mine.
Having said that, i've read alot into the "Indoctrination Theory." All the talk and evidence I've seen point to this theory being a reality and if that is indeed the case, which is what i'm convinced of, then I am floored. Absolutely brilliant!
Now I'm one of those people that didnt really mind the ending. Yes, I thought it coulda used more closure, but i'm not someone who's going to slam Bioware for how they ended THEIR game. Its Bioware's story, not mine.
Having said that, i've read alot into the "Indoctrination Theory." All the talk and evidence I've seen point to this theory being a reality and if that is indeed the case, which is what i'm convinced of, then I am floored. Absolutely brilliant!
#9359
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:53
AwefulShot
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- Members
- 48 messages
Cobretti ftw wrote...
THe end wont change. They will just "explain" somethings and "give us more closure".. Nothing will change. Thats terrible, but its the truth.
Might not be terrible - perhaps Bioware just wrote something that went over everyone's head? It happens, things 'obvious' to some people are to others. Perhaps by knowing the details of what happened and more about the why will be enough?
Until the promised DLC from Bioware appears we have nothing to go on. I'm sure they will keep it under wraps. Everyone who made a fuss should take heart, I'm sure Bioware wouldn't have bothered otherwise to clear the matter of the endings up. No matter what they decide to do, it's a win for the Take Back ME3 campaign.
I just hope no one is silly enough to think that whatever Bioware will make everyone happy...
#9360
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 07:54
Jcswe
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- Members
- 4 messages
Soilworker77 wrote...
If you are interested I could tell you a few things that is part of the indoctrination theory and since you nickname is Jcswe, I take it you are from Sweden?Jcswe wrote...
I relly hope they gone fix a new DLC for the ending! I i have play all the 3 games.
The end has no point! all the mass relays explods up?!? and all the turian,salarian,krogan and human is on planet earth! joker,he escape before Shepherd has decided! Why should his team escape?
sorry Bad eng
Isånafall så kan jag förklara på svenska om det är lättare ^^
Om du vill det så hade jag blivit glad!
#9361
Guest_Paulomedi_*
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:02
Guest_Paulomedi_*
Guest_Paulomedi_*
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- Guests
The end is perfect just put the Linkin Park music and it's perfect!
www.youtube.com/watch
[Chester]
It starts with one...
[Mike]
One thing,
I don't know why
It doesn't even matter how hard you'd try
Keep that in mind
I designed this rhyme
To explain in due time
[Chester]
All I know...
[Mike]
Time is a valuable thing
Watch it fly by as the pendulum swings
Watch it count down 'till the end of the day
The clock ticks life away
[Chester]
It's so unreal...
[Mike]
You didn't look out below
Watch the time go right out the window
Trying to hold on, to didn't even know
I wasted it all just to
[Chester]
Watch you go...
[Mike]
I kept everything inside
And even though I tried,
It all fell apart
What it meant to me will eventually
Be a memory of a time when
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
[Mike]
One thing, I don't know why
It doesn't even matter how hard you'd try
Keep that in mind I designed this rhyme
To remind myself how
[Chester]
I've tried so hard...
[Mike]
In spite of the way you were mocking me
Acting like I was part of your property
Remembering all the times you fought with me
I'm surprised, it
[Chester]
Got so far...
[Mike]
Things aren't the way they were before
You wouldn't even recognize me anymore
Not that you wouldn't knew me, back then
But it all comes back to me
[Chester]
In the end...
[Mike]
You kept everything inside
And even though I tried,
It all fell apart
What it meant to me will eventually
Be a memory
Of a time when
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I've put my trust in you
Pushed as far as I can go
For all this
There's only one thing you should've know
I've put my trust in you
Pushed as far as I can go
For all this
There's only one thing you should've know
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
www.youtube.com/watch
[Chester]
It starts with one...
[Mike]
One thing,
I don't know why
It doesn't even matter how hard you'd try
Keep that in mind
I designed this rhyme
To explain in due time
[Chester]
All I know...
[Mike]
Time is a valuable thing
Watch it fly by as the pendulum swings
Watch it count down 'till the end of the day
The clock ticks life away
[Chester]
It's so unreal...
[Mike]
You didn't look out below
Watch the time go right out the window
Trying to hold on, to didn't even know
I wasted it all just to
[Chester]
Watch you go...
[Mike]
I kept everything inside
And even though I tried,
It all fell apart
What it meant to me will eventually
Be a memory of a time when
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
[Mike]
One thing, I don't know why
It doesn't even matter how hard you'd try
Keep that in mind I designed this rhyme
To remind myself how
[Chester]
I've tried so hard...
[Mike]
In spite of the way you were mocking me
Acting like I was part of your property
Remembering all the times you fought with me
I'm surprised, it
[Chester]
Got so far...
[Mike]
Things aren't the way they were before
You wouldn't even recognize me anymore
Not that you wouldn't knew me, back then
But it all comes back to me
[Chester]
In the end...
[Mike]
You kept everything inside
And even though I tried,
It all fell apart
What it meant to me will eventually
Be a memory
Of a time when
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I've put my trust in you
Pushed as far as I can go
For all this
There's only one thing you should've know
I've put my trust in you
Pushed as far as I can go
For all this
There's only one thing you should've know
[Chester]
I've tried so hard
And got so far
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
I had to fall
To lose it all
But in the end,
It doesn't even matter.
#9362
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:02
Hitokiri83
-
- Members
- 352 messages
My biggest question that I hope will be heard
Why is the whole idea of unity, friendship and cooperation with synthetics and organics (quarian-geth, joker-EDI) leads to the fact that you have to destroy them.
Of course we have the options of synthesis, however, that would destroy Individuality and need for significant Differences Between the races.
Shep can not play God and Decide for all races
This end up on the fact That all organic beings and synthetics will be the same, and this is not acceptable
GETH AND EDI doNT deserve to fall along with the reapers
Why is the whole idea of unity, friendship and cooperation with synthetics and organics (quarian-geth, joker-EDI) leads to the fact that you have to destroy them.
Of course we have the options of synthesis, however, that would destroy Individuality and need for significant Differences Between the races.
Shep can not play God and Decide for all races
This end up on the fact That all organic beings and synthetics will be the same, and this is not acceptable
GETH AND EDI doNT deserve to fall along with the reapers
#9363
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:03
savagejuicebox
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- Members
- 184 messages
Listen... if you want to be a lawyer that doesn't mean i have to be a lawyer,right? i can be what i want and you can be what you want. i have a choice, you have a choice, we all have a CHOICE. Same thing goes for the ending of mass effect if i don't want YOUR ending then i shouldn't have to have your ending i want MY ending, i want to be different, most people want to be different, unique. You can have your artistic ending where we merge with robots and microchips, i want my own unique ending! Most people do!
#9364
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:04
Vox Draco
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- Members
- 2 939 messages
AwefulShot wrote...
Cobretti ftw wrote...
THe end wont change. They will just "explain" somethings and "give us more closure".. Nothing will change. Thats terrible, but its the truth.
Might not be terrible - perhaps Bioware just wrote something that went over everyone's head? It happens, things 'obvious' to some people are to others. Perhaps by knowing the details of what happened and more about the why will be enough?
Until the promised DLC from Bioware appears we have nothing to go on. I'm sure they will keep it under wraps. Everyone who made a fuss should take heart, I'm sure Bioware wouldn't have bothered otherwise to clear the matter of the endings up. No matter what they decide to do, it's a win for the Take Back ME3 campaign.
I just hope no one is silly enough to think that whatever Bioware will make everyone happy...
I will wait patiently for how Bioware will adress the Edning-Problem. But I don't feel very enthusiastic about a simple explanation of the Star child, or why the choices he offeres are so great and all. I simply don't like the concept at all, and my hope still is they somehow find a way/are willing to rectify the entire Star child Thing...
No matter how much "clarification" you add in the end to this, it will never change the fact that the child feels like being patched onto the End without fitting into the entire ME-Concept. It rubs me the wrong way entirely.
Sadly, my hopes are not very high at the moment.... I am afraid we will only see a half-hearted attemempt to calm down the rage. And by April, this rage will have cooled down anyway
#9365
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:05
Quintefoil
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- Members
- 9 messages
This is an adapted version of a post from my blog on writing, which I partially wrote about the importance of a good ending when readers have emotionally invested in your writing, but which I mostly wrote because I finished the game and needed to get down what I felt didn't work about it.
Well, the Mass Effect franchise has been a great feat of interactive storytelling. The stories and characters are what I love most about these games, and the third game of the trilogy didn’t disappoint … that is, right up until the last 10 minutes.
The writers of ME3 did a brilliant job of tying up so many plotlines in this final game in a way that reflected your previous decisions and allowed you to make new ones to ultimately let you decide the course of the galaxy (ie, the fate of the Rachni, the Krogan Question and the Quarians vs the Geth). And it wasn’t just the big questions, the futures of races, that Bioware brought to the fold of ME3, there were also those great little touches like the conclusion of the Conrad Verner fan-boy story; these were small moments that were a nice nod to the long-time players and their choices across the trilogy.
So, yes, I loved the game – it was engaging, emotional and tough, both in terms of game-play (bloody banshees!) and the cut-scene decisions. The fall of Thessia left me feeling genuinely gutted that I/Shepard had failed. There were plenty of moments that brought a tear to my eye (Thane!). And by the end, I truly hated Kai Leng. Oh, and I won’t even go in to the date with Kaidan – I’ll just say that it left me very happy for my Shep!
The writers went to so much effort to draw us in, to get us feeling something, to make us care about the characters and the future of the galaxy and that takes some skill, nevermind that they also had to allow for so many permutations of player-choice. So I doff my hat to them – I’m not sure if I could do that (though I’d bloody well love to try, so Bioware if you want any writers, you know where I am! Hey, I can dream!).
And all that skilful wrapping up is exactly why the end didn’t make sense. There are continuity discrepancies. There are things that just don’t make sense. There are omissions that, if you’ve ever played a Bioware game, just aren’t Bioware. Hell, I just wrote “played a Bioware story” the first time I typed that – these are developers who care so much about creating not just games, but stories, that they employ dedicated writers and pride and market their games on that very quality.
So, continuity. First off, two of your squadmates are with you at the final battle and apparently everyone running at the beam to the Citadel is killed. Now, I can understand that the ‘everyone’s dead, Jim’ over the radio might be that the observer was mistaken and didn’t see Shepard staggering for the beam. Fine, I can accept that. But if Shep and Anderson made it through the beam and everyone else was dead, then how in the galaxy did my two crewmates make it back to the Normandy to appear in that final crash landing scene? In fact, it was rather conspicuous that the two members of crew that step out of the Normandy with Joker were the two I took with me on that last mission and no one else.
And why was the Normandy no longer in the assault upon the reapers and instead fleeing the scene? If they turned tail and ran, I want to know why. If my two squadmates survived and were picked up by Joker, I want to know why and how. It simply doesn’t make sense.
Neither does the fact that Anderson claimed to follow Shep into the beam, and yet he conveniently ends up being dumped in another part of the Citadel, and somehow manages to get ahead of Shep to the control panel (in a room with only one apparent entrance) without being seen. How does that work?
It doesn’t.
If you got a high enough EMS rating in the game, you also see what’s apparently Shep’s charred body breathing in the rubble of London. But if she (I play a femShep, of course!) was in an explosion on the Citadel, why is her body in a pile of concrete and very Earthly debris and not floating around in space, or at least lying in the mangled metal remains of the Citadel? Again, it doesn’t make sense. The writing after Shep is hit by Harbinger reads like a rushed first draft, you know, the bit before you edit your work and realise you missed out a key point or that it’s impossible for that character to be in this place.
So the continuity and the logic aren’t there, and neither is the classic closure that Bioware devotees know and love about their games. OK, so we know that the Warden of DA:O went on to do ‘other things’ that we’re not necessarily told about in great detail, but if we romanced Alistair, then we know he was never far from the Warden, and we have a nice summary to read about how the Kingdom of Ferelden does in the aftermath of our decisions. Most importantly, though, we get a little epilogue of what happens to the characters we’ve adventured with. The same in DA2. Mass Effect is arguably Bioware’s biggest story, its space opera of epic proportions and yet … we’re left with a weird lack of consistency and a short, vague scene about the aftermath of our actions (reapers destroyed/flew away) and the lives of those characters we’ve come to care about (Joker and some combination of the crew crash land on an unknown, leafy planet and step out to smile at the sun.
Yes, fine, I understand about open endings, but if this is meant to be the ending to end all endings, which is kind of what it’s been set up as, then we need a bit more closure than that. Whenever we enjoy a story and follow it through to the end, however bitter that ending may be, we need some sense of reward, and that just wasn’t there with ME3. Even if it was a funeral for Shepard (missing, presumed dead), just that epilogue scene showing goodbyes so we get some closure and can find out who survived the war and who didn’t.
It’s all rather strange. In fact, that whole end sequence is rather dream-like, with slow motion, Shep accepting weird dream-logic (where you believe what you’re told in a dream without questioning it, even though it makes no sense at all to the waking mind) and the return of scenery and characters from the past (the Child and TIM). So some fans have come up with The Indoctrination Theory. While I like the idea (it would be very clever and fit with what has happened in the previous games, and it would explain this weird ending as being deliberate, rather than just a horrible mistake in storytelling), I’m trying not to hold out hope – does it seem like the logical answer because we so badly don’t want that ending to be ‘it’?
I kind of always thought the trilogy would end with Shepard sacrificing herself for the galaxy, which is fine and can be part of great storytelling, but for it to be done in such an emotionless and poorly written way, well that just doesn’t give any sort of reward. And frankly, the 16 different endings are not different enough to reflect my decisions throughout the series, to justify my hours played over all three games or to do justice to the emotions the games stirred up until that point.
The main differences are:
- Do the reapers leave or are they destroyed?
- Can I still go and see Big Ben on my next sightseeing tour of London?
- What colour is the wave that spreads across the galaxy and destroys the mass relays?
- Does joker have slightly glowy techno skin?
The only significant one is whether you see Shepard’s breath in the debris at that very last moment, other than that, the other differences feel like window dressing.
Never mind the player’s decisions, that isn’t an ending that does justice to the achievement of the writers who have come up with such great and difficult decisions for us to make. And this is why I’m keeping my fingers crossed, but trying not to get my hopes up, that the Bioware rethink of the ending will do something to improve what has been such a disappointment for so many people.
I don't think the three choices, necessarily need changing (though they don't entirely make sense), it's more the way that the post-Harbinger-pew-pew part of the story was done, as described above (I think the plot holes/inconsistencies annoy me the most), the lack of satisfying differentiation between the endings and the need for some sort of epilogue closure so I know there were some consequences to my actions and what the heck happened to my crew.
[Edited as my paragraphs merged somehow!]
Well, the Mass Effect franchise has been a great feat of interactive storytelling. The stories and characters are what I love most about these games, and the third game of the trilogy didn’t disappoint … that is, right up until the last 10 minutes.
The writers of ME3 did a brilliant job of tying up so many plotlines in this final game in a way that reflected your previous decisions and allowed you to make new ones to ultimately let you decide the course of the galaxy (ie, the fate of the Rachni, the Krogan Question and the Quarians vs the Geth). And it wasn’t just the big questions, the futures of races, that Bioware brought to the fold of ME3, there were also those great little touches like the conclusion of the Conrad Verner fan-boy story; these were small moments that were a nice nod to the long-time players and their choices across the trilogy.
So, yes, I loved the game – it was engaging, emotional and tough, both in terms of game-play (bloody banshees!) and the cut-scene decisions. The fall of Thessia left me feeling genuinely gutted that I/Shepard had failed. There were plenty of moments that brought a tear to my eye (Thane!). And by the end, I truly hated Kai Leng. Oh, and I won’t even go in to the date with Kaidan – I’ll just say that it left me very happy for my Shep!
The writers went to so much effort to draw us in, to get us feeling something, to make us care about the characters and the future of the galaxy and that takes some skill, nevermind that they also had to allow for so many permutations of player-choice. So I doff my hat to them – I’m not sure if I could do that (though I’d bloody well love to try, so Bioware if you want any writers, you know where I am! Hey, I can dream!).
And all that skilful wrapping up is exactly why the end didn’t make sense. There are continuity discrepancies. There are things that just don’t make sense. There are omissions that, if you’ve ever played a Bioware game, just aren’t Bioware. Hell, I just wrote “played a Bioware story” the first time I typed that – these are developers who care so much about creating not just games, but stories, that they employ dedicated writers and pride and market their games on that very quality.
So, continuity. First off, two of your squadmates are with you at the final battle and apparently everyone running at the beam to the Citadel is killed. Now, I can understand that the ‘everyone’s dead, Jim’ over the radio might be that the observer was mistaken and didn’t see Shepard staggering for the beam. Fine, I can accept that. But if Shep and Anderson made it through the beam and everyone else was dead, then how in the galaxy did my two crewmates make it back to the Normandy to appear in that final crash landing scene? In fact, it was rather conspicuous that the two members of crew that step out of the Normandy with Joker were the two I took with me on that last mission and no one else.
And why was the Normandy no longer in the assault upon the reapers and instead fleeing the scene? If they turned tail and ran, I want to know why. If my two squadmates survived and were picked up by Joker, I want to know why and how. It simply doesn’t make sense.
Neither does the fact that Anderson claimed to follow Shep into the beam, and yet he conveniently ends up being dumped in another part of the Citadel, and somehow manages to get ahead of Shep to the control panel (in a room with only one apparent entrance) without being seen. How does that work?
It doesn’t.
If you got a high enough EMS rating in the game, you also see what’s apparently Shep’s charred body breathing in the rubble of London. But if she (I play a femShep, of course!) was in an explosion on the Citadel, why is her body in a pile of concrete and very Earthly debris and not floating around in space, or at least lying in the mangled metal remains of the Citadel? Again, it doesn’t make sense. The writing after Shep is hit by Harbinger reads like a rushed first draft, you know, the bit before you edit your work and realise you missed out a key point or that it’s impossible for that character to be in this place.
So the continuity and the logic aren’t there, and neither is the classic closure that Bioware devotees know and love about their games. OK, so we know that the Warden of DA:O went on to do ‘other things’ that we’re not necessarily told about in great detail, but if we romanced Alistair, then we know he was never far from the Warden, and we have a nice summary to read about how the Kingdom of Ferelden does in the aftermath of our decisions. Most importantly, though, we get a little epilogue of what happens to the characters we’ve adventured with. The same in DA2. Mass Effect is arguably Bioware’s biggest story, its space opera of epic proportions and yet … we’re left with a weird lack of consistency and a short, vague scene about the aftermath of our actions (reapers destroyed/flew away) and the lives of those characters we’ve come to care about (Joker and some combination of the crew crash land on an unknown, leafy planet and step out to smile at the sun.
Yes, fine, I understand about open endings, but if this is meant to be the ending to end all endings, which is kind of what it’s been set up as, then we need a bit more closure than that. Whenever we enjoy a story and follow it through to the end, however bitter that ending may be, we need some sense of reward, and that just wasn’t there with ME3. Even if it was a funeral for Shepard (missing, presumed dead), just that epilogue scene showing goodbyes so we get some closure and can find out who survived the war and who didn’t.
It’s all rather strange. In fact, that whole end sequence is rather dream-like, with slow motion, Shep accepting weird dream-logic (where you believe what you’re told in a dream without questioning it, even though it makes no sense at all to the waking mind) and the return of scenery and characters from the past (the Child and TIM). So some fans have come up with The Indoctrination Theory. While I like the idea (it would be very clever and fit with what has happened in the previous games, and it would explain this weird ending as being deliberate, rather than just a horrible mistake in storytelling), I’m trying not to hold out hope – does it seem like the logical answer because we so badly don’t want that ending to be ‘it’?
I kind of always thought the trilogy would end with Shepard sacrificing herself for the galaxy, which is fine and can be part of great storytelling, but for it to be done in such an emotionless and poorly written way, well that just doesn’t give any sort of reward. And frankly, the 16 different endings are not different enough to reflect my decisions throughout the series, to justify my hours played over all three games or to do justice to the emotions the games stirred up until that point.
The main differences are:
- Do the reapers leave or are they destroyed?
- Can I still go and see Big Ben on my next sightseeing tour of London?
- What colour is the wave that spreads across the galaxy and destroys the mass relays?
- Does joker have slightly glowy techno skin?
The only significant one is whether you see Shepard’s breath in the debris at that very last moment, other than that, the other differences feel like window dressing.
Never mind the player’s decisions, that isn’t an ending that does justice to the achievement of the writers who have come up with such great and difficult decisions for us to make. And this is why I’m keeping my fingers crossed, but trying not to get my hopes up, that the Bioware rethink of the ending will do something to improve what has been such a disappointment for so many people.
I don't think the three choices, necessarily need changing (though they don't entirely make sense), it's more the way that the post-Harbinger-pew-pew part of the story was done, as described above (I think the plot holes/inconsistencies annoy me the most), the lack of satisfying differentiation between the endings and the need for some sort of epilogue closure so I know there were some consequences to my actions and what the heck happened to my crew.
[Edited as my paragraphs merged somehow!]
Modifié par Quintefoil, 22 mars 2012 - 08:09 .
#9366
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:08
Ilking
-
- Members
- 2 messages
Has to be Anderson's death. Cried so much. I loved ME3. I liked the ending actually but I would like furthe closure as I've read on certain websites.
#9367
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:08
TheCinC
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- Members
- 644 messages
Crossposting part of my reply to a topic of what I had been expecting the ending of ME3 to be like:
I expected a massive war effort to take out the Reapers across the Galaxy, starting at some weak point, wiping out Reapers one by one, possibly with a weapon designed somewhere during the period from Sovereign's attack on the Citadel and the start of ME3 or gained during ME3, ending with a final confrontation between Shepard and Harbinger, possibly inside/aboard Harbinger (after all, Saren, Benezia and a lot of Geth were aboard Sovereign once and in ME2 we visited a 'mostly dead' Reaper). I expected there would be progress towards this point much earlier in ME3 or that ME3 would focus on finding/creating a weapon, such as the Crucible.
I also considered the possibility of a battle for the Citadel, especially once I started playing ME3, which is somehow important to the Reapers, as we saw earlier, in ME1 as well.
In any case, a final boss battle and a final all-out confrontation with the Reapers, where it would be possible to pick any (former) squad member to accompany Shepard, which then would result in:
-Reaper victory, all allied races defeated and Shepard and his/her squad wiped out
-Victory for the allied races, but a Pyrrhic one, including Shepard and his/her crew wiped out, perhaps with some Reapers surviving and retreating, leaving room for an expansion/sequel destroying the remaining Reapers
-Victory for the allied races, but Shepard survived, although his/her love interest died as well as at least several of the squad
-Paragon: Complete victory for the allied races, at a price, but with Shepard, LI and (most of) squad still alive and kicking, with Shepard's honour and reputation intact, through uniting all the various races to fight the Reapers.
-Renegade: Complete victory for the allied races, at a price, but with Shepard, LI and (most of) squad still alive and kicking, but through the use of former Reaper technology gained from -not- destroying the Reaper base in ME2 and by joining forces with Cerberus to achieve victory -at any cost- and without any regard for ethics, possibly resulting in Humans taking up a dominating place in the Galaxy, Shepard becoming a controversial figure at least to aliens and probably among humans to, but being defended because Shepard did succeed in defeating the Reapers.
I also expected the outcomes to depend on choices made in ME1 and ME2, not just ME3, so a real need to replay ME1 and/or ME2 to get the various endings and no easy way to remedy certain mistakes.
I expected a massive war effort to take out the Reapers across the Galaxy, starting at some weak point, wiping out Reapers one by one, possibly with a weapon designed somewhere during the period from Sovereign's attack on the Citadel and the start of ME3 or gained during ME3, ending with a final confrontation between Shepard and Harbinger, possibly inside/aboard Harbinger (after all, Saren, Benezia and a lot of Geth were aboard Sovereign once and in ME2 we visited a 'mostly dead' Reaper). I expected there would be progress towards this point much earlier in ME3 or that ME3 would focus on finding/creating a weapon, such as the Crucible.
I also considered the possibility of a battle for the Citadel, especially once I started playing ME3, which is somehow important to the Reapers, as we saw earlier, in ME1 as well.
In any case, a final boss battle and a final all-out confrontation with the Reapers, where it would be possible to pick any (former) squad member to accompany Shepard, which then would result in:
-Reaper victory, all allied races defeated and Shepard and his/her squad wiped out
-Victory for the allied races, but a Pyrrhic one, including Shepard and his/her crew wiped out, perhaps with some Reapers surviving and retreating, leaving room for an expansion/sequel destroying the remaining Reapers
-Victory for the allied races, but Shepard survived, although his/her love interest died as well as at least several of the squad
-Paragon: Complete victory for the allied races, at a price, but with Shepard, LI and (most of) squad still alive and kicking, with Shepard's honour and reputation intact, through uniting all the various races to fight the Reapers.
-Renegade: Complete victory for the allied races, at a price, but with Shepard, LI and (most of) squad still alive and kicking, but through the use of former Reaper technology gained from -not- destroying the Reaper base in ME2 and by joining forces with Cerberus to achieve victory -at any cost- and without any regard for ethics, possibly resulting in Humans taking up a dominating place in the Galaxy, Shepard becoming a controversial figure at least to aliens and probably among humans to, but being defended because Shepard did succeed in defeating the Reapers.
I also expected the outcomes to depend on choices made in ME1 and ME2, not just ME3, so a real need to replay ME1 and/or ME2 to get the various endings and no easy way to remedy certain mistakes.
Modifié par TheCinC, 22 mars 2012 - 08:14 .
#9368
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:08
dorktainian
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- Members
- 4 415 messages
nice to see a bit of linkin park make it onto the forum....
#9369
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:10
BCMakoto
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- Members
- 271 messages
TheCinC wrote...
-Reaper victory, all allied races defeated and Shepard and his/her squad wiped out
-Victory
for the allied races, but a Pyrrhic one, including Shepard and his/her
crew wiped out, perhaps with some Reapers surviving and retreating,
leaving room for an expansion/sequel destroying the remaining Reapers
-Victory
for the allied races, but Shepard survived, although his/her love
interest died as well as at least several of the squad
-Paragon:
Complete victory for the allied races, at a price, but with Shepard, LI
and (most of) squad still alive and kicking, with Shepard's honour and
reputation intact, through uniting all the various races to fight the
Reapers.
-Renegade: Complete victory for the allied races, at a
price, but with Shepard, LI and (most of) squad still alive and kicking,
but through the use of former Reaper technology gained from -not-
destroying the Reaper base in ME2 and by joining forces with Cerberus to
achieve victory -at any cost- and without any regard for ethics,
possibly resulting in Humans taking up a dominating place in the Galaxy,
Shepard becoming a controversial figure at least to aliens and probably
among humans to, but being defended because Shepard did succeed in
defeating the Reapers.
THIS. Give us more of such endings. Make terrible ones, make good ones, happy ones, sad ones. But make our choices matter...make our allignment matter.
#9370
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:10
Hue of Bone
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- 13 messages
Further to my earlier post I had the following thought.
All the home-world planets, Palaven, Sur'kesh, Tuchanka, Rannoch, Thessia possess Mass
Relays in their systems. So with the A,B,C ending, where the Mass Relays are all destroyed, you
are also destroying all the home-worlds of your allies. So it negates all the work in solving the
various problems and gaining the said allies in the first place.
This cannot be right!
All the home-world planets, Palaven, Sur'kesh, Tuchanka, Rannoch, Thessia possess Mass
Relays in their systems. So with the A,B,C ending, where the Mass Relays are all destroyed, you
are also destroying all the home-worlds of your allies. So it negates all the work in solving the
various problems and gaining the said allies in the first place.
This cannot be right!
#9371
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:11
Cobretti ftw
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Vox Draco wrote...
AwefulShot wrote...
Cobretti ftw wrote...
THe end wont change. They will just "explain" somethings and "give us more closure".. Nothing will change. Thats terrible, but its the truth.
Might not be terrible - perhaps Bioware just wrote something that went over everyone's head? It happens, things 'obvious' to some people are to others. Perhaps by knowing the details of what happened and more about the why will be enough?
Until the promised DLC from Bioware appears we have nothing to go on. I'm sure they will keep it under wraps. Everyone who made a fuss should take heart, I'm sure Bioware wouldn't have bothered otherwise to clear the matter of the endings up. No matter what they decide to do, it's a win for the Take Back ME3 campaign.
I just hope no one is silly enough to think that whatever Bioware will make everyone happy...
I will wait patiently for how Bioware will adress the Edning-Problem. But I don't feel very enthusiastic about a simple explanation of the Star child, or why the choices he offeres are so great and all. I simply don't like the concept at all, and my hope still is they somehow find a way/are willing to rectify the entire Star child Thing...
No matter how much "clarification" you add in the end to this, it will never change the fact that the child feels like being patched onto the End without fitting into the entire ME-Concept. It rubs me the wrong way entirely.
Sadly, my hopes are not very high at the moment.... I am afraid we will only see a half-hearted attemempt to calm down the rage. And by April, this rage will have cooled down anyway
Maybe. But if they release that so called "explanation" on april, and fans still dont like it, then things will go crazy again. But i believe thats whats going to happen anyway.
#9372
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:12
Cobretti ftw
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Hue of Bone wrote...
Further to my earlier post I had the following thought.
All the home-world planets, Palaven, Sur'kesh, Tuchanka, Rannoch, Thessia possess Mass
Relays in their systems. So with the A,B,C ending, where the Mass Relays are all destroyed, you
are also destroying all the home-worlds of your allies. So it negates all the work in solving the
various problems and gaining the said allies in the first place.
This cannot be right!
haha imagine omega system with 2 relays
#9373
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:12
elodar11
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I love Mass Effect!
I've replayed ME1 numerous times. The ending rocks. I/Shepherd have to battle Saren to the end. And victory is possible. And that ending tugs my emotions every time.
I've replayed ME2 numerous times. Again, I have the control to bring everyone home. Not easy, but can be done.
ME3. Mostly loved it. Don't want to replay it, because the ending has been taken away from me. I'm no longer in control. I can't "bring everyone home" like in previous games. There is no hope ending. There is nothing to play for. I can't save the galaxy.
Here's what I'd like to see:
Everything after Sovereign's beam is an indoctrination based dream. It only happened in Shepherd's head. He/she now understands that the current strategy can only bring the end of the relays/galaxy. Time for a new plan:
Mass Effect 4: The Battle for Earth Continues! Go Bioware Go!!
I've replayed ME1 numerous times. The ending rocks. I/Shepherd have to battle Saren to the end. And victory is possible. And that ending tugs my emotions every time.
I've replayed ME2 numerous times. Again, I have the control to bring everyone home. Not easy, but can be done.
ME3. Mostly loved it. Don't want to replay it, because the ending has been taken away from me. I'm no longer in control. I can't "bring everyone home" like in previous games. There is no hope ending. There is nothing to play for. I can't save the galaxy.
Here's what I'd like to see:
Everything after Sovereign's beam is an indoctrination based dream. It only happened in Shepherd's head. He/she now understands that the current strategy can only bring the end of the relays/galaxy. Time for a new plan:
Mass Effect 4: The Battle for Earth Continues! Go Bioware Go!!
#9374
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:12
Reit Fox
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I'm basically just echoing what most people have already said, but I honestly loved every second of the game until I got to the end.
It seemed to me like there was this fantastic, blockbuster of a game with a very hastily tacked on ending which barely felt relevant. I can see that there was probably some big idea behind the omniscient child thing but in the game we don't get any explanation of who this child is or where they came from. Is the child supposed to symbolise God? Is it some ancient Ai? Is Shepard simply hallucinating? We have no idea.
Also, the being states that they created the Reapers as a solution to the chaos. The chaos being that synthetics will always destroy organics? So, they created synthetics to destroy organics to prevent synthetics from destroying organics? That's a ridiculously contradictory way of thinking. It is especially irritating after Shepard resolves the whole Quarian/Geth conflict, proving Synthetics and Organics can co-exist.
I don't like not knowing what happens to my squad members either. The only squad members I saw at the end of my game were; EDE, Joker and Liara - what happened to the rest of my squad? Are they on the Normandy? Did they die on Earth? This is the type of thing I really feel should have been included in the game, especially since ME3 is the final Shepard game. There was no closure.
I felt trapped at the end of the game. I've heard it said that ME3 was supposed to have a really diverse range of endings dependant on so many different things. But as far as I can tell it really, really doesn't. You either control, destroy or synthesise. And even given these three choices, I really felt as though I didn't have any options. Control was always presented as the bad thing to do, and my Shepard always spoke out against it. It would have made no sense for me to suddenly pick that at the end of the game. Destroy was what I intended to do all along, but then I'm told it would take out other Synthetics? I wasn't prepared to sacrifice the Geth and EDE, not after all we'd been through. So I was emotionally blackmailed into Synthesis. I'm not even entierly sure how Synthesis is even supposed to work or why the idea was only thrown at me at the end of the game but that's what I picked, and only because I had no other choice.
Also, I've heard the indoctrination theories. If you spend your entire game Pargon-ing then suddenly the "control" option is presented as blue (Paragon) and the "destroy" option is presented as red (renegade), choosing to destroy breaks Shepard free of indoctrination. Then, Shep wakes up in London and re-joins the fight. I really, really hope this isn't the case, as it would mean ME3 is an unfinished game. Although, this is the only possible explanation (ignoring Synthesis) currently presented for the end of the game which makes sense.
There are more issues I have with the end of the game, but I don't want to go on for any longer than I already have. I would like to say I am so happy that Bioware are actually listening and responding to fan feedback though. It's outstanding, and more than most games companies these days would be doing. Much respect guys, and thankyou for bringing us such an awesome game series.
Oh, best moment? "That was for Thane, you son of a b*tch!"
Yeah, I cried like a baby when Thane died. It felt good to take down Kai Leng.
It seemed to me like there was this fantastic, blockbuster of a game with a very hastily tacked on ending which barely felt relevant. I can see that there was probably some big idea behind the omniscient child thing but in the game we don't get any explanation of who this child is or where they came from. Is the child supposed to symbolise God? Is it some ancient Ai? Is Shepard simply hallucinating? We have no idea.
Also, the being states that they created the Reapers as a solution to the chaos. The chaos being that synthetics will always destroy organics? So, they created synthetics to destroy organics to prevent synthetics from destroying organics? That's a ridiculously contradictory way of thinking. It is especially irritating after Shepard resolves the whole Quarian/Geth conflict, proving Synthetics and Organics can co-exist.
I don't like not knowing what happens to my squad members either. The only squad members I saw at the end of my game were; EDE, Joker and Liara - what happened to the rest of my squad? Are they on the Normandy? Did they die on Earth? This is the type of thing I really feel should have been included in the game, especially since ME3 is the final Shepard game. There was no closure.
I felt trapped at the end of the game. I've heard it said that ME3 was supposed to have a really diverse range of endings dependant on so many different things. But as far as I can tell it really, really doesn't. You either control, destroy or synthesise. And even given these three choices, I really felt as though I didn't have any options. Control was always presented as the bad thing to do, and my Shepard always spoke out against it. It would have made no sense for me to suddenly pick that at the end of the game. Destroy was what I intended to do all along, but then I'm told it would take out other Synthetics? I wasn't prepared to sacrifice the Geth and EDE, not after all we'd been through. So I was emotionally blackmailed into Synthesis. I'm not even entierly sure how Synthesis is even supposed to work or why the idea was only thrown at me at the end of the game but that's what I picked, and only because I had no other choice.
Also, I've heard the indoctrination theories. If you spend your entire game Pargon-ing then suddenly the "control" option is presented as blue (Paragon) and the "destroy" option is presented as red (renegade), choosing to destroy breaks Shepard free of indoctrination. Then, Shep wakes up in London and re-joins the fight. I really, really hope this isn't the case, as it would mean ME3 is an unfinished game. Although, this is the only possible explanation (ignoring Synthesis) currently presented for the end of the game which makes sense.
There are more issues I have with the end of the game, but I don't want to go on for any longer than I already have. I would like to say I am so happy that Bioware are actually listening and responding to fan feedback though. It's outstanding, and more than most games companies these days would be doing. Much respect guys, and thankyou for bringing us such an awesome game series.
Oh, best moment? "That was for Thane, you son of a b*tch!"
Yeah, I cried like a baby when Thane died. It felt good to take down Kai Leng.
#9375
Posté 22 mars 2012 - 08:14
hchadw
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This used to be Art... now the EA/Bioware are working together now with the reapers, its no longer important to have quality story telling and to have a proper ending.... Shepard had to die in order for them to push this Crappy Multiplayer on us.. Its more important to them now to make money of the masses of idiots that will drop real world cash on Weapons kits in a multiplayer game that will be dead in 6 months (and thats being nice) Just take a look at the complants of people that have lost money and have no way of getting it back.... I tried to warn but i was called a nub and hater and many other things...............(atleast i still have my money) anyways....Several places in the game where buggy.. Conversations had some issues..... 90% of the ladders didnt work (Thanks for adding ladders but you should really test them) I seen they had 6 testers at the end of the game credits and well...that kinda explains the problems there. This is no longer the ART you think it is...
Its the art to make losts of cash fast and end a franchise quickly so they can move onto the Cash Cow that EA wants them to do............ this broke MULTIPLAYER!
Its the art to make losts of cash fast and end a franchise quickly so they can move onto the Cash Cow that EA wants them to do............ this broke MULTIPLAYER!
Modifié par hchadw, 22 mars 2012 - 08:14 .
