Ce sujet est fermé
The part of me that is endlessly optimistic wants to believe that this was all a massive Bioware plan from day one, and I think that is awesome. Bioware have constantly pushed the boundaries for what makes a great game, they've raised the bar every damn chance they get... If you play a game to the end, you play it and it's done. There's no chance to think about it, reflect, question, analyse, debate it except after the fact. Because until you're done, you're too busy playing it!
IF they have actually given us 'cliffhanger' endings, with the intent to globally release the actual endings as a DLC, they've engaged their fanbase to a degree that is absolutely unprecedented. Pro-ending or anti-ending, the Mass Effect fanbase is so intensely passionate about this right now!!
On the Mass Effect 3 endings. Yes, we are listening.
Débuté par
Chris Priestly
, mars 15 2012 02:55
Retour en haut
#9652
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:30
MasterRed_ko7
-
- Members
- 60 messages
I would like to say first that I am a huge fan of Bioware, since back during when the Original Xbox was out. I loved the games they have made, from KOTOR, to Jade Empire (I am also happy that they are making a Jade Empire 2. I am very looking forward to that game).
I have played and beated several times Dragon Age: Origins, and loved it, with the dark story, great fights, and the characters making you laugh. Even Dragon Age 2 was a great game (not the best, but it was still a good title. I won't go more into that now, though).
Then I played Mass Effect 1... and it changed my life for gaming. The fact that you can choose what to say, and your character actually says it with a voice!? That was jaw dropping back then. At least to me it was. The graphics were excellent, the story made you wonder what would happen next... and the fact that many various things could happen that will affect the story in some way, from it being small, to something major. Sure, it had a few problems, but it was still a great game.
It took me several years after the release date of Mass Effect 2 to finally get it, mainly because of thinking it would be exactly the same as the first game. How I was wrong in an excellent way. The fights are excellent, better than in the first game (though I have to wonder why we have to have ammo now when in the first game it said that each clip in a gun can shoot thousands of shoots, but... meh, it wasn't something to really complain about). The story amped itself up so much, the first thing that you would see would be Shepard falling down to a planet.
What made it better was that you can import your game from the first title to the second, adding even more to the story, to extra things you would not get if you just started with the second title. Sure, I didn't much like, though, the Cerberus Network and Code, but I understood. It was a way to get people to buy it, and it gave you several features if you got it for free. That I greatly support (even though I got it from Gamefly originally, but I loved it so much I bought it from them and got the Code). Again, great story and combat, with such a good story, and a wonderful Final Boss that made my jaw drop and say 'Holy ****' out loud. And with how great the DLCs that came out were only added to it.
For Mass Effect 3...
I love the game. I truly do. It feels more... I don't know the word, but the combat compliments the second game's very well, bringing it over and adding to it, especially in the amount of weapons and armor you can collect. That would be the only flaw in the second title, but this made up for it. And being able to buy in-game all of the sepcial armor, like the Blood Dragon Armor, was an excellent idea. The fact that even all of the DLC you bought for the second title actually counts for something only adds to how much the developers put into this.
But...
Why must we have the Online Pass just to play Multiplayer? I do get they are trying to get people to buy the game new, and not used from retailers, who do not give a penny to the developers if they sell a used copy for, and this is not even a joke, $5 less than new. But making us have to have the Online Pass just to play online, and that's it?
The second title had it perfect with this. Buy a new copy, or get the Cerberus Code, and you get the extra character, missions, and weapons. Again, that I totally support. But restricting Multiplayer like this, making people who, say for example, share an Xbox or Playstation 3, pay an extra $10 for the Pass just feels very cheap to me, and makes me sad inside. And it is somewhat needed to get the best ending. It's not required, but it would help and make getting it so much more easily.
The Day 1 DLC... meh. It's not that big of a deal to me. I have seen many people complain about it, of how it should be in the game already, since the data is already on the disc, but I have no real opinion on that.
Now, I finally get to what I needed to say. There may be spoilers ahead, incase no one has beaten the game and has been reading this. I know I hate it when a plot is spoiled.
The ending for Mass Effect 3 felt somewhat rushed. The last 15 minutes, I mean, starting from the point where you run to the beam to go to the Citadel. There is not even a Final Boss in this game. The first two games had an intense final boss battle, each one challenging and exciting. Even to this day, my heart will race when I fight the second title's final boss. But the fact Mass Effect 3 did not have one was a big let down.
But I could forgive that. Not all stories call for some epic final boss, for a big bad guy to fight at the end. I appreciate how important a story is to a game. Actually, to anything, really.
I must really get to my point here. I've been rambling for a while about how great the other games were.
Can you blame me?
Once you go up that strange elevator once the Illusive Man dies is where everything changes for the worst for me. It felt like it was just shoves into my face, that some unknown being walks up to you, in the form of the child you saw die, and giving you three choices.
To:
Destroy all Synthetic Life.
To Control the Reapers.
To Fuse Synthetic Life with Organic.
No matter what path you choose, Shepard dies (unless you get the best ending, and with that I believe you only survive if you choose the first option I listed above. I'm not totally sure on that). To add to it, no matter what path you choose, the Mass Relays are destroyed. This in itself would pose some serious problems.
Because of the various races on Earth (which is just one planet and the best to explain this problem), not all of them would be able to live on it. Because of Turians not being able to eat food humans can. The Economy would still be shattered, and, to add to it, the planet would probably quickly suffer from being over populated. And since humans cannot travel FTL anymore (or travel at that speed. I could very well be wrong with how fast a ship could go and how fast the Relays can make a ship travel) through the Relays... I suppose my point has been made here.
Even if everything I just said can be proved wrong, that every race on Earth (the Krogan, Turian, Quarians too) can live there, there are several things that cannot be explained. I am sure these points have been brought up several times before, but I feel like I must bring them back up.
For example, why was Joker going through the Mass Relays when he was supposed to be fighting the Reapers over Earth (I believe he was supposed to be doing that. Still, the question still stands)? Why would he take the entire crew and just leave you there?
Another is that, when you are blasted by the massive beam from Harbinger, what happened to your party? They don't die, or even become wounded, because at the last scene, they are shown walking out of the wrecked ship with Joker.
One more that boggles me (always wanted to say that:P ) is that one choice (which I believe is the canon choice. Again, I am not sure here) is to destroy all Synthetic life. That would mean the Geth would die. The race where your friend, Legion, gave his life so that his people could have true AIs. And because of that, they were helping the Quarians adapt to their homeworld again. So quickly, in fact, that Quarian children could walk on the planet without ever having to wear a suit. If the Geth are destroyed, the Quarian race would have to wait until thier bodies became adapted to their planet again, and have to do everything themselves... that made them sound lazy, but the Geth were building houses, electric grids, things like that in weeks that would have taken the Quarians years. And not being able to use the Relays only makes it worse.
And with Legion, again, sacrificing his life for his people... wouldn't that be a kick to the groin for him? Honestly, I cannot think of a better way to put that. I apologize if that's offensive to anyone.:innocent:
And what about EDI? Her body would be destroyed, I'm sure of that. But I am not sure about her 'true' form inside Normandy. But let's say that it would affect that... Joker would be one sad guy to lose her.
Even if everything else is explained somehow, in some way... the ending of the game really does lack the impact it should have. With all of the choices you have made in the game, from Mass Effect 1 all the way to Mass Effect 3, where they all made for nothing? In the end, you are given those three choices, and that's it. No other choice really matters in the game. It has literally little to no impact on the ending, no matter what path you choose.
Maybe Bioware is making DLC to explain some of this? To add to it? I do not know. The ending was supposed to answer most questions, to close the story for good, with whatever outcome you made with your decisions...
But that is not the case. Three Paths, three decisions... no matter which one you make, all of the Mass Relays will be destroyed, every race that is on Earth will be stranded there with little chance of survival for various reasons, and the eventual need to travel to another suitable planet will come, and they may not be able to travel to a new planet. The prime example of this is the Drell, who's home planet was ravished by being over populated, and is now a wasteland.
With all of that said (finally!) and done with... I still love the game. Everything else excapt for the last 15 minutes of the game is perfect to me and deserves all of the scores the reviewers gave the game. Multiplayer is so much fun (could have had more varity, like different missions, but it is still great fun. I could play it for hours, honestly), the fact that you can finally resolve most of the galatic problems is saytisfying... and finally being able to see Tali's face!
With all of that said... well... I've said my peace, I suppose.
I have played and beated several times Dragon Age: Origins, and loved it, with the dark story, great fights, and the characters making you laugh. Even Dragon Age 2 was a great game (not the best, but it was still a good title. I won't go more into that now, though).
Then I played Mass Effect 1... and it changed my life for gaming. The fact that you can choose what to say, and your character actually says it with a voice!? That was jaw dropping back then. At least to me it was. The graphics were excellent, the story made you wonder what would happen next... and the fact that many various things could happen that will affect the story in some way, from it being small, to something major. Sure, it had a few problems, but it was still a great game.
It took me several years after the release date of Mass Effect 2 to finally get it, mainly because of thinking it would be exactly the same as the first game. How I was wrong in an excellent way. The fights are excellent, better than in the first game (though I have to wonder why we have to have ammo now when in the first game it said that each clip in a gun can shoot thousands of shoots, but... meh, it wasn't something to really complain about). The story amped itself up so much, the first thing that you would see would be Shepard falling down to a planet.
What made it better was that you can import your game from the first title to the second, adding even more to the story, to extra things you would not get if you just started with the second title. Sure, I didn't much like, though, the Cerberus Network and Code, but I understood. It was a way to get people to buy it, and it gave you several features if you got it for free. That I greatly support (even though I got it from Gamefly originally, but I loved it so much I bought it from them and got the Code). Again, great story and combat, with such a good story, and a wonderful Final Boss that made my jaw drop and say 'Holy ****' out loud. And with how great the DLCs that came out were only added to it.
For Mass Effect 3...
I love the game. I truly do. It feels more... I don't know the word, but the combat compliments the second game's very well, bringing it over and adding to it, especially in the amount of weapons and armor you can collect. That would be the only flaw in the second title, but this made up for it. And being able to buy in-game all of the sepcial armor, like the Blood Dragon Armor, was an excellent idea. The fact that even all of the DLC you bought for the second title actually counts for something only adds to how much the developers put into this.
But...
Why must we have the Online Pass just to play Multiplayer? I do get they are trying to get people to buy the game new, and not used from retailers, who do not give a penny to the developers if they sell a used copy for, and this is not even a joke, $5 less than new. But making us have to have the Online Pass just to play online, and that's it?
The second title had it perfect with this. Buy a new copy, or get the Cerberus Code, and you get the extra character, missions, and weapons. Again, that I totally support. But restricting Multiplayer like this, making people who, say for example, share an Xbox or Playstation 3, pay an extra $10 for the Pass just feels very cheap to me, and makes me sad inside. And it is somewhat needed to get the best ending. It's not required, but it would help and make getting it so much more easily.
The Day 1 DLC... meh. It's not that big of a deal to me. I have seen many people complain about it, of how it should be in the game already, since the data is already on the disc, but I have no real opinion on that.
Now, I finally get to what I needed to say. There may be spoilers ahead, incase no one has beaten the game and has been reading this. I know I hate it when a plot is spoiled.
The ending for Mass Effect 3 felt somewhat rushed. The last 15 minutes, I mean, starting from the point where you run to the beam to go to the Citadel. There is not even a Final Boss in this game. The first two games had an intense final boss battle, each one challenging and exciting. Even to this day, my heart will race when I fight the second title's final boss. But the fact Mass Effect 3 did not have one was a big let down.
But I could forgive that. Not all stories call for some epic final boss, for a big bad guy to fight at the end. I appreciate how important a story is to a game. Actually, to anything, really.
I must really get to my point here. I've been rambling for a while about how great the other games were.
Can you blame me?
Once you go up that strange elevator once the Illusive Man dies is where everything changes for the worst for me. It felt like it was just shoves into my face, that some unknown being walks up to you, in the form of the child you saw die, and giving you three choices.
To:
Destroy all Synthetic Life.
To Control the Reapers.
To Fuse Synthetic Life with Organic.
No matter what path you choose, Shepard dies (unless you get the best ending, and with that I believe you only survive if you choose the first option I listed above. I'm not totally sure on that). To add to it, no matter what path you choose, the Mass Relays are destroyed. This in itself would pose some serious problems.
Because of the various races on Earth (which is just one planet and the best to explain this problem), not all of them would be able to live on it. Because of Turians not being able to eat food humans can. The Economy would still be shattered, and, to add to it, the planet would probably quickly suffer from being over populated. And since humans cannot travel FTL anymore (or travel at that speed. I could very well be wrong with how fast a ship could go and how fast the Relays can make a ship travel) through the Relays... I suppose my point has been made here.
Even if everything I just said can be proved wrong, that every race on Earth (the Krogan, Turian, Quarians too) can live there, there are several things that cannot be explained. I am sure these points have been brought up several times before, but I feel like I must bring them back up.
For example, why was Joker going through the Mass Relays when he was supposed to be fighting the Reapers over Earth (I believe he was supposed to be doing that. Still, the question still stands)? Why would he take the entire crew and just leave you there?
Another is that, when you are blasted by the massive beam from Harbinger, what happened to your party? They don't die, or even become wounded, because at the last scene, they are shown walking out of the wrecked ship with Joker.
One more that boggles me (always wanted to say that:P ) is that one choice (which I believe is the canon choice. Again, I am not sure here) is to destroy all Synthetic life. That would mean the Geth would die. The race where your friend, Legion, gave his life so that his people could have true AIs. And because of that, they were helping the Quarians adapt to their homeworld again. So quickly, in fact, that Quarian children could walk on the planet without ever having to wear a suit. If the Geth are destroyed, the Quarian race would have to wait until thier bodies became adapted to their planet again, and have to do everything themselves... that made them sound lazy, but the Geth were building houses, electric grids, things like that in weeks that would have taken the Quarians years. And not being able to use the Relays only makes it worse.
And with Legion, again, sacrificing his life for his people... wouldn't that be a kick to the groin for him? Honestly, I cannot think of a better way to put that. I apologize if that's offensive to anyone.:innocent:
And what about EDI? Her body would be destroyed, I'm sure of that. But I am not sure about her 'true' form inside Normandy. But let's say that it would affect that... Joker would be one sad guy to lose her.
Even if everything else is explained somehow, in some way... the ending of the game really does lack the impact it should have. With all of the choices you have made in the game, from Mass Effect 1 all the way to Mass Effect 3, where they all made for nothing? In the end, you are given those three choices, and that's it. No other choice really matters in the game. It has literally little to no impact on the ending, no matter what path you choose.
Maybe Bioware is making DLC to explain some of this? To add to it? I do not know. The ending was supposed to answer most questions, to close the story for good, with whatever outcome you made with your decisions...
But that is not the case. Three Paths, three decisions... no matter which one you make, all of the Mass Relays will be destroyed, every race that is on Earth will be stranded there with little chance of survival for various reasons, and the eventual need to travel to another suitable planet will come, and they may not be able to travel to a new planet. The prime example of this is the Drell, who's home planet was ravished by being over populated, and is now a wasteland.
With all of that said (finally!) and done with... I still love the game. Everything else excapt for the last 15 minutes of the game is perfect to me and deserves all of the scores the reviewers gave the game. Multiplayer is so much fun (could have had more varity, like different missions, but it is still great fun. I could play it for hours, honestly), the fact that you can finally resolve most of the galatic problems is saytisfying... and finally being able to see Tali's face!
With all of that said... well... I've said my peace, I suppose.
#9653
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:31
MasterRed_ko7
-
- Members
- 60 messages
Oh my God. I did not realize I typed so much down!
Sorry for the long read... if anyone reads it. >.>
Sorry for the long read... if anyone reads it. >.>
#9654
Guest_magnetite_*
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:34
Guest_magnetite_*
Guest_magnetite_*
-
- Guests
+1 the indoc theory makes so much sense that it would be really
surprising if it isn´t true... what´s more as you said.. a staff who
wrote ME 1, ME2 + the excellent game ME3 was during the joruney (99% of
the game) can ´t possibly just made so many mistakes in the last 10
minutes, it would be unbelieavable...
After watching that 20 minute video on it and replaying Arrival this afternoon, I'm pretty much a believer now. Harbinger says, "You will be the first to witness our arrival", followed by Shepard getting hit with Object Rho's energy. This was the start of the indoctrination process.
I think people who can't figure it out need Bioware to spell it out for them.
Arrival Object Rho scene
Fast forward to around 4:50 or so to see it. Video is about 5 minutes long.
Modifié par magnetite, 23 mars 2012 - 07:37 .
#9655
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:37
darkelightnx01
-
- Members
- 27 messages
Sorry to post again, but it occurred to me a much simpler motivation for the reapers would have satisfied some of these issues and been much more logical. If the reapers wiped out civilisations that were wiping out civilisations who were approaching a technological sophistication to bea threat to them, which could be explained if at some point they had turned on their own creators and were almost defeated. It would explain the cycle of every 50000 years and the fact within 3 years the races of the citadel council were able to make a last stand. Then in the ending which would follow as before, Shephard could refuse to help and let his war assets decide the outcome or detonate the citadel destroying the reaper control mechanism sacrificing himself in the ensuing outcome then your war assets and galactic readiness level could have dictated how much of the galaxy was to have been saved. Thanks for such a great game and if some changes could be made to the game then it could turn a great game to the greatest ever.
#9656
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:48
Thanatos144
-
- Members
- 924 messages
why do you assume the reapers rose against thier creators and did just defend themselves for organics that threatened to exterminate them????????? Like what happened to the geth.darkelightnx01 wrote...
Sorry to post again, but it occurred to me a much simpler motivation for the reapers would have satisfied some of these issues and been much more logical. If the reapers wiped out civilisations that were wiping out civilisations who were approaching a technological sophistication to bea threat to them, which could be explained if at some point they had turned on their own creators and were almost defeated. It would explain the cycle of every 50000 years and the fact within 3 years the races of the citadel council were able to make a last stand. Then in the ending which would follow as before, Shephard could refuse to help and let his war assets decide the outcome or detonate the citadel destroying the reaper control mechanism sacrificing himself in the ensuing outcome then your war assets and galactic readiness level could have dictated how much of the galaxy was to have been saved. Thanks for such a great game and if some changes could be made to the game then it could turn a great game to the greatest ever.
#9657
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:52
darkelightnx01
-
- Members
- 27 messages
Just a quick and hopefully final word (from me) It wouldn't be first time time an ending been changed in a massive franchise due to fan reaction. Wrath of Khan had its ending changed, Ronald d Moore and branning braga changed the death scene in generations after testing. Empire strikes back in 1980 was added during its original release. There are so many more. Big sci fan after all. Changes can win back audiences and those three are examples of the big two franchises in sci fi.
#9658
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 07:57
apieros
-
- Members
- 91 messages
Keep this short. I've made my displeasure known. Ball's in Bioware's court.
Once, I was a big fan of a big-name author. Read most of his books. He wrote a series of 7 books, the first four were incredible. The last three concluded the series, and the end was a letdown.
I stopped reading him. Not out of rage, or a boycott, but out of a loss of interest.
I've stopped watching shows that started sucking. I don't buy DVD's of movies that suck. I'm not interested.
I don't finish games that suck. Games I think might suck, I get through Gamefly.
Game companies who deliver on promises of quality, I preorder their products. This was a very short list: Bethesda, Blizzard, Bioware, and Valve.
Depending on what happens in April, Bioware games will fall off the list. No pre-order, and a good chance of no purchase. Possibly I'll Gamefly them.
I support people who produce quality. Ball's in Bioware's court, to prove they can still do so.
Hold the line.
End of line.
Once, I was a big fan of a big-name author. Read most of his books. He wrote a series of 7 books, the first four were incredible. The last three concluded the series, and the end was a letdown.
I stopped reading him. Not out of rage, or a boycott, but out of a loss of interest.
I've stopped watching shows that started sucking. I don't buy DVD's of movies that suck. I'm not interested.
I don't finish games that suck. Games I think might suck, I get through Gamefly.
Game companies who deliver on promises of quality, I preorder their products. This was a very short list: Bethesda, Blizzard, Bioware, and Valve.
Depending on what happens in April, Bioware games will fall off the list. No pre-order, and a good chance of no purchase. Possibly I'll Gamefly them.
I support people who produce quality. Ball's in Bioware's court, to prove they can still do so.
Hold the line.
End of line.
Modifié par apieros, 23 mars 2012 - 07:59 .
#9659
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:06
darkelightnx01
-
- Members
- 27 messages
Thanatos144 wrote...
why do you assume the reapers rose against thier creators and did just defend themselves for organics that threatened to exterminate them????????? Like what happened to the geth.darkelightnx01 wrote...
Sorry to post again, but it occurred to me a much simpler motivation for the reapers would have satisfied some of these issues and been much more logical. If the reapers wiped out civilisations that were wiping out civilisations who were approaching a technological sophistication to bea threat to them, which could be explained if at some point they had turned on their own creators and were almost defeated. It would explain the cycle of every 50000 years and the fact within 3 years the races of the citadel council were able to make a last stand. Then in the ending which would follow as before, Shephard could refuse to help and let his war assets decide the outcome or detonate the citadel destroying the reaper control mechanism sacrificing himself in the ensuing outcome then your war assets and galactic readiness level could have dictated how much of the galaxy was to have been saved. Thanks for such a great game and if some changes could be made to the game then it could turn a great game to the greatest ever.
Either way would have worked for me actually.
#9660
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:20
Cooperthehusky
-
- Members
- 8 messages
The choice you make at the end, and the ending itself is irrelevant, Shepard dies, game over. The galaxy is saved! Or is it?......Irrelevant, Shepard = dead(or is He/She?Aaargh). The journey to this point (as Shepard) is the real focus of the story, what you did to get there and who you sacrificed (N7 style) along the way....these things are important.
Now my speculation: The fact you meet the child Shepard has dreamt about (and can't save from death) hints at the fact that the whole time the Reapers had been maneuvering the organic races to assembling their might in the one place, Earth, with the promise of victory, and then ending all hope in one fell swoop. Subtle indoctrination? more like millions of years of harvesting organics and getting the job done. Saren and Sovereign? Harbinger and the Collectors? Shepard and the Ghost-Child-of-unknowing-knowledge-that-gave-the-Crucible-plans-and-Citadel-to-the-organics? Hmmmm.....maybe the internets was right, it is a conspiracy and elvis lives!
I've seen the "story" in the end credits, but am too stupid to read into them as anything more than "in a galaxy far far away" ME4 the prequel is being made, "tell me another story"....hopefully something with dragons! (hint hint Bioware).
Garrus for ME4! ...... Too soon?
Now my speculation: The fact you meet the child Shepard has dreamt about (and can't save from death) hints at the fact that the whole time the Reapers had been maneuvering the organic races to assembling their might in the one place, Earth, with the promise of victory, and then ending all hope in one fell swoop. Subtle indoctrination? more like millions of years of harvesting organics and getting the job done. Saren and Sovereign? Harbinger and the Collectors? Shepard and the Ghost-Child-of-unknowing-knowledge-that-gave-the-Crucible-plans-and-Citadel-to-the-organics? Hmmmm.....maybe the internets was right, it is a conspiracy and elvis lives!
I've seen the "story" in the end credits, but am too stupid to read into them as anything more than "in a galaxy far far away" ME4 the prequel is being made, "tell me another story"....hopefully something with dragons! (hint hint Bioware).
Garrus for ME4! ...... Too soon?
Modifié par Cooperthehusky, 23 mars 2012 - 08:41 .
#9661
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:21
sgreco1970
-
- Members
- 86 messages
MasterRed_ko7 wrote...
Oh my God. I did not realize I typed so much down!
Sorry for the long read... if anyone reads it. >.>
i did read it, but glad u made this second post as its easier to quote lol.
Consider the indoc theory, it makes the ending awesome and opens the door for a real ending still to come. It makes your concerns less concerning.
#9662
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:22
sgreco1970
-
- Members
- 86 messages
ShadowSleth wrote...
Just finished the game today and just hated the lack of closure I felt. Everything I'm about to say has probably been said before and I usually don't make forum posts, but since it really seems like you want to hear from your customers, I'll type it out anyway.
I
just felt that the "child's" explanations made no sense, the endings
were all too similar, and that my choices through the previous two games
didn't matter.
I spent a lot of time doing side missions and mutiplayer (didn't like being forced to play multiplayer, but it was actually quite fun.) but it didn't seem like my EMS had any impact, visual or otherwise on the last battle.
The lack of any answers really sparked a fear that I would have to buy dlc to get a satisfying ending and really ruined an otherwise great game for me. It actually reminded me of the ending to Dragon Age 2, nothing being concluded.
So what do I want? Just an ending that lets me put the mass effect 3 disc back into its case with none of the "big" questions remaining unanswered and one that lets me reflect fondly on shepards journey.
watch this
#9663
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:27
sgreco1970
-
- Members
- 86 messages
darkelightnx01 wrote...
Just a quick and hopefully final word (from me) It wouldn't be first time time an ending been changed in a massive franchise due to fan reaction. Wrath of Khan had its ending changed, Ronald d Moore and branning braga changed the death scene in generations after testing. Empire strikes back in 1980 was added during its original release. There are so many more. Big sci fan after all. Changes can win back audiences and those three are examples of the big two franchises in sci fi.
yah except they only made those changes after showing it to test audiences, not a month after the premiere...
#9664
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:27
OzgunRonin
-
- Members
- 14 messages
Hahaha, the more I think the more I like the endings 
1000s of people were Indoctrinated... Became Saren or the Illusive man...
Ok the ending is seemed blunt any way but before saying lots of mean things to the geniuses of a 2 great games (3 actually ) we must think twice...
I'm really really happy and I'm proud with my self that I made my ending choise
1000s of people were Indoctrinated... Became Saren or the Illusive man... Ok the ending is seemed blunt any way but before saying lots of mean things to the geniuses of a 2 great games (3 actually
) we must think twice... I'm really really happy and I'm proud with my self that I made my ending choise
#9665
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:28
Sir Hecubus
-
- Members
- 64 messages
DivergentZen wrote...
After a week now, it just dawned on me why the ending is so bad and why people so passionately hate it. And I'm not talking about plot holes, limited choice, etc. And this is something that I think fundamentally bothers even the people who like the ending.
Shepherd didn't beat the Reapers. Shepherd didn't do anything. The Reapers did everything. Shepherd became passive in his/her own story. And that effectively removed all the conflict from the game.
Shepherd was given permission and even assisted by the Reapers to both reach and activate the catalyst/crucible. Shepherd was even used by the Reapers to do it.
So the reason the ending feels so different from the rest of the game is the fact it's no longer Shepherd's story. As soon as the light elevator rises up, it's the Starchild's/Reaper's story, as he/they are the ones being proactive in the end.
So, I'm sorry, but a basic and fundamental rule of story telling was broken. Characters, especially protagnoists, should be active and not passive/reactive. And just clarifying the ending will not address this issue. There needs to be a rewrite. Thanks.
Thanks for this point of view. I never thought of it this way.
I think having the option to disregard the starchild and have at it with the reapers should have been an option. That right there brings the story back to Sheppard's story and keeps the protagonist active.
#9666
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:30
Big Yeti Cane
-
- Members
- 119 messages
Mass Effect 3 is good. Its almost great...
I feel like I'm doing chores when sitting down to do multiplayer though. I don't want to fall asleep mining every single system either. Neither of those activities are the reason why I free up time for Mass Effect. Can't I just throw more money at Bioware like I did for ME2 and just pick the ending I want?
Haha, thanks!
I feel like I'm doing chores when sitting down to do multiplayer though. I don't want to fall asleep mining every single system either. Neither of those activities are the reason why I free up time for Mass Effect. Can't I just throw more money at Bioware like I did for ME2 and just pick the ending I want?
Haha, thanks!
#9667
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:30
Flyers215
-
- Members
- 256 messages
Federelis wrote...
GehnTheGrey wrote...
I hope you don't change a damn thing in regards to the endings. You did a superb job. Couldn't have been happier with my synthesis choice. I'm glad you didn't ruin the credibility and themes of the ME trilogy just to appease some people who can't handle not having a white picket fence ending with their LI. You did Shepard's story a Justice.
Keep sticking to your guns Bioware. Those endings took balls and no small amount of artistic integrity. Two things which EA seem intent on breeding out of you. I'd applaud you for that alone, but the whole game was such a joy to play, start to finish, that that wouldn't be fair. I implore you: Please, please, please don't cave in and retcon the great work you've done with this game.
Stellar job guys.
Good for you man. But then you're just one guy NOT playing the full ending DLC, we all crave for.
Not to be hard on you, but why cheer so hard for something you already got?
Because it shows that people did like the game and the endings amongst all this hatred & disapproval. It's not bad to show appreciation every once in a while. I find that many forums are just places for people to go to complain. It's far too infrequent that I see someone saying "hey, I liked that experience. Thank you." It's usually "_____ is awful, I hate it, I'm never buying anything from you ever again, and you suck."
#9668
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:31
Caradore
-
- Members
- 26 messages
Posting again because I think I posted this in the wrong thread - yes I'm blonde - but even blondes play ME!
My thoughts for what it’s worth:
What I loved:
Loved the smooth transition from cut scenes to action;
Loved the dialogue, friendships and the romances;
Loved the gameplay, being able to jump and use ladders made it feel a bit more realistic;
Getting closure with all my old comrades;
What I didn’t love:
The face importer didn’t work well for me, after my first attempt I rebuilt my 2nd Shep’s face rather than import it.
Like many others, the ending.
I have four saved Shepherds. I’ve played the first one and am now playing the second, it’s harder playing my second shep because she was the one I was the most emotionally invested in, maybe because in the first run through I didn’t really know what I was doing and I missed lots of things, whereas in the second one I get to think more about the consequences and pick up on some of the nuances. For me Shepherd was all about beating the odds, having to go that extra mile to protect the people I love and the ending felt tacked on and nonsensical. I can’t believe that Shep would just accept what the ghost in the machine said without even questioning it.
I appreciate the artistic control argument but in a film or a book you identify with the character, in this game I became the character. You are not killing Shepherd you are killing me and there is no way around that, other that not doing the last scene which is how I will finish my other games. I feel guilty for dying despite allegedly beating the Reapers, because I felt like I had let my friends and loved ones down and I don't believe it.
I never expected the ending to be easy, there could have made a happy ending that was difficult to achieve but at least I could have aspired to it.
I buy a lot of Bioware games and now feel like I’ve lost faith in their ability to predict what the fans want. I am also a DA fan and I loved DA2 so was disappointed to find that the new DA2 DLC has been cancelled.
My thoughts for what it’s worth:
What I loved:
Loved the smooth transition from cut scenes to action;
Loved the dialogue, friendships and the romances;
Loved the gameplay, being able to jump and use ladders made it feel a bit more realistic;
Getting closure with all my old comrades;
What I didn’t love:
The face importer didn’t work well for me, after my first attempt I rebuilt my 2nd Shep’s face rather than import it.
Like many others, the ending.
I have four saved Shepherds. I’ve played the first one and am now playing the second, it’s harder playing my second shep because she was the one I was the most emotionally invested in, maybe because in the first run through I didn’t really know what I was doing and I missed lots of things, whereas in the second one I get to think more about the consequences and pick up on some of the nuances. For me Shepherd was all about beating the odds, having to go that extra mile to protect the people I love and the ending felt tacked on and nonsensical. I can’t believe that Shep would just accept what the ghost in the machine said without even questioning it.
I appreciate the artistic control argument but in a film or a book you identify with the character, in this game I became the character. You are not killing Shepherd you are killing me and there is no way around that, other that not doing the last scene which is how I will finish my other games. I feel guilty for dying despite allegedly beating the Reapers, because I felt like I had let my friends and loved ones down and I don't believe it.
I never expected the ending to be easy, there could have made a happy ending that was difficult to achieve but at least I could have aspired to it.
I buy a lot of Bioware games and now feel like I’ve lost faith in their ability to predict what the fans want. I am also a DA fan and I loved DA2 so was disappointed to find that the new DA2 DLC has been cancelled.
#9669
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:36
Lord Atherios
-
- Members
- 10 messages
sgreco1970 wrote...
ShadowSleth wrote...
Just finished the game today and just hated the lack of closure I felt. Everything I'm about to say has probably been said before and I usually don't make forum posts, but since it really seems like you want to hear from your customers, I'll type it out anyway.
I
just felt that the "child's" explanations made no sense, the endings
were all too similar, and that my choices through the previous two games
didn't matter.
I spent a lot of time doing side missions and mutiplayer (didn't like being forced to play multiplayer, but it was actually quite fun.) but it didn't seem like my EMS had any impact, visual or otherwise on the last battle.
The lack of any answers really sparked a fear that I would have to buy dlc to get a satisfying ending and really ruined an otherwise great game for me. It actually reminded me of the ending to Dragon Age 2, nothing being concluded.
So what do I want? Just an ending that lets me put the mass effect 3 disc back into its case with none of the "big" questions remaining unanswered and one that lets me reflect fondly on shepards journey.
watch this
You can believe or not in the "indoctrination theory" if you want. but the facts are the facts:
- They promised 16 different endings. Are there 16 different endings? NO
- Thet promised that your acts will impact directly in the ending. If the indoctrination theory is true, NO MATTER WHAT KIND OF DECISIONS YOU MADE DURING THE GAME, 100% OF THE PLAYES WERE INDOCTRINATED (Because the Indoctrination theory is about that, every single player is getting indoctrinated in the end). So, your decisions are impacting directly in the end? NO (youre going to be indoctrinated yes or yes)
#9670
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 08:37
nitraw
-
- Members
- 29 messages
Just out of curiosity: Is there a post on this forum by someone who liked the ending as it is (ie not indoctrination theory) explaining why they like it? All I ever see is people claiming to like the ending, "artistic integrity", "don't you dare change anything". I've yet to see someone addressing at least some of the issues other people have with the ending.
#9671
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 09:15
Mixon
-
- Members
- 679 messages
Russian fantast-writer criticizes the ending. (I apologize for Russian language in 40min voice-audio)
You can listen it here: http://rghost.ru/37160219
The key it is that the ending does not give us feel of satisfaction, and even what kind it is, we do not give a sense of humility. The fact that all of this - is a line. Verdict: The ending just illogical and fans who have lived with Mass Effect since 2007 deserve to get more, maybe even a happy ending...
You can listen it here: http://rghost.ru/37160219
The key it is that the ending does not give us feel of satisfaction, and even what kind it is, we do not give a sense of humility. The fact that all of this - is a line. Verdict: The ending just illogical and fans who have lived with Mass Effect since 2007 deserve to get more, maybe even a happy ending...
#9672
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 09:30
MasterRed_ko7
-
- Members
- 60 messages
sgreco1970 wrote...
MasterRed_ko7 wrote...
Oh my God. I did not realize I typed so much down!
Sorry for the long read... if anyone reads it. >.>
i did read it, but glad u made this second post as its easier to quote lol.
Consider the indoc theory, it makes the ending awesome and opens the door for a real ending still to come. It makes your concerns less concerning.
Well... that is certainly some serious food for thought. I might have figured something was amiss if I would have just turned around and saw the strange trees behind Shepard, thought. lol
I knew something would come up after hearing 'One more story', too, but I figured that was just DLC, as obvious as we know they will come out with some.
It could very well be a ruse by the writer and the April thing is going to be a DLC that has what happens next.
And at the ending, where Shepard takes that gasp of air, that could very well be where he was blasted by Harbinger.
I would say we would owe Bioware an apology, but... if this is the case, with what is said in the video, then it wasn't right of them to show that part, or without some sort of hidden ending to play after Shepard broke through the illusion. How else were we supposed to think and act when we saw that ending to a beloved series?
Then again, the video could be totally wrong. I guess we will have to wait until April and see.
#9673
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 09:35
Caradore
-
- Members
- 26 messages
I also think the indoctrination theory could work, and it would be very clever of Bioware and BRAVE to try it given all the outcry - either a very clever publicity stunt or a potential minefield. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
#9674
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 09:36
Face125
-
- Members
- 12 messages
I have to say i loved all of the game and i actually thought the ending i got was great. i know there were questions unanswered and lots more questions asked by the ending but to me it just gave me hope of more mass effect to come. I mean come on lets face it we all wanted this final game soooo much but i felt a certain sadness that this could mean the end of the games i can honestly rate as the best ive played and ive been playing since the sinclair and commodore days. So lets look on the bright side that characters made it out alive and have a story to continue if bioware see fit to do so. I also think until all the dlc has been released we cant really call it an ending. who knows what curveballs the guys at bioware have in store for us yet.
#9675
Posté 23 mars 2012 - 09:46
dpmeister
-
- Members
- 1 messages
To single out a single moment as my favorite in Mass Effect 3 would be like picking a single brand of chocolate I like over the rest and never having access to any other. I just can't do it in good conscience.
The fact is, Mass Effect is not only one of the best series I've ever played, it's one of the best stories I've ever had the privilege of experiencing. As a person who plays video games on occasion, there are many games to which I would begrudgingly, or mutteringly, admit to having played once or twice to a girl who asked. Mass Effect, on the other hand, I would shout from the rooftops. Seriously, BioWare, you guys are my heroes. My only complaint is that you might have ruined video games for me forever, because right now nothing can compare with what you've created.
I'll pick out a few moments though, just so I can stop gushing:
Curing the Krogan Genophage. Hands down, one of the most epic times I've had playing a game. It's an addictive high of relief, sorrow, adrenaline and profound joy for the future of a species that are completely alien and fictional. Nevertheless, I'm connected. Plus... the fact that Mordin died with a smile on his face humming his "Scientist Salarian"... Priceless.
Liara coming into my office to let me have my input on my own entry into her star record. A profoundly sweet and simultaneously tragic moment of... "What if we fail?" Liara's development throughout the series really shines right there. The connection developed between those two is wonderful and poetic.
Thane's death. His duel with Kai Leng was badass. And his prayer brought me to tears. I'm such a wuss... but I'm not ashamed.
The music was truly awe-inspiring too. This is probably the wrong section for that, but everything hit exactly the right note. Music does incredible things for moving a story and involving the viewer emotionally. This game does that in spades.
I was honestly surprised when I read an article saying that BioWare would be adding content to satisfy complaints from gamers about the ending. Personally, I didn't have any problem with the ending. I personally picked Synthesis, and while it was a very "Sci-Fi" ending as I like to call it, it was completely satisfactory. I don't really want a cutshot to explain where everyone ends up after the battle and the change. It's one of those things that's btter left to the imagination. (Although... you should have given us a real animation of Tali, just saying) The final result is that as a result of Shephard's sacrifice, the galaxy finds some measure of galactic peace.
I wonder whether or not the level of dissatisfaction has to do with the fact that the series is so definitively over. In that case, I think the most difficult part of a story is writing a satisfactory ending. While I wouldn't complain about BioWare adding anything, I honestly think that the game was fine as is.
So, for those who do read this, please let the team know that there are a few people out there who love the ending as it is. There are some things that are just better left unsaid, and I like it that way. I walked away from the game satisfied, and able to move on with my life. I will look forward to more stories from the universe.
Also, I don't see Shephard living as a real possibility for this story. It would be nice... but this series has never been about being "nice". It's been about excellence and hardship. Shephard dying along with the threat Reapers is the inevitable conclusion to the series.
The fact is, Mass Effect is not only one of the best series I've ever played, it's one of the best stories I've ever had the privilege of experiencing. As a person who plays video games on occasion, there are many games to which I would begrudgingly, or mutteringly, admit to having played once or twice to a girl who asked. Mass Effect, on the other hand, I would shout from the rooftops. Seriously, BioWare, you guys are my heroes. My only complaint is that you might have ruined video games for me forever, because right now nothing can compare with what you've created.
I'll pick out a few moments though, just so I can stop gushing:
Curing the Krogan Genophage. Hands down, one of the most epic times I've had playing a game. It's an addictive high of relief, sorrow, adrenaline and profound joy for the future of a species that are completely alien and fictional. Nevertheless, I'm connected. Plus... the fact that Mordin died with a smile on his face humming his "Scientist Salarian"... Priceless.
Liara coming into my office to let me have my input on my own entry into her star record. A profoundly sweet and simultaneously tragic moment of... "What if we fail?" Liara's development throughout the series really shines right there. The connection developed between those two is wonderful and poetic.
Thane's death. His duel with Kai Leng was badass. And his prayer brought me to tears. I'm such a wuss... but I'm not ashamed.
The music was truly awe-inspiring too. This is probably the wrong section for that, but everything hit exactly the right note. Music does incredible things for moving a story and involving the viewer emotionally. This game does that in spades.
I was honestly surprised when I read an article saying that BioWare would be adding content to satisfy complaints from gamers about the ending. Personally, I didn't have any problem with the ending. I personally picked Synthesis, and while it was a very "Sci-Fi" ending as I like to call it, it was completely satisfactory. I don't really want a cutshot to explain where everyone ends up after the battle and the change. It's one of those things that's btter left to the imagination. (Although... you should have given us a real animation of Tali, just saying) The final result is that as a result of Shephard's sacrifice, the galaxy finds some measure of galactic peace.
I wonder whether or not the level of dissatisfaction has to do with the fact that the series is so definitively over. In that case, I think the most difficult part of a story is writing a satisfactory ending. While I wouldn't complain about BioWare adding anything, I honestly think that the game was fine as is.
So, for those who do read this, please let the team know that there are a few people out there who love the ending as it is. There are some things that are just better left unsaid, and I like it that way. I walked away from the game satisfied, and able to move on with my life. I will look forward to more stories from the universe.
Also, I don't see Shephard living as a real possibility for this story. It would be nice... but this series has never been about being "nice". It's been about excellence and hardship. Shephard dying along with the threat Reapers is the inevitable conclusion to the series.
