23455 réponses à ce sujet

[CuseGirl]

knection wrote...

I have heard on the game informer site that the editors that had beaten the game were responding to the retake mass effect movement. The editors were commenting that the retake mass effect movement were wanting a Care Bear Stare ending where The Normandy Crew hold hands and activate the crucible and take down the reapers or have all your crew one by one come up and punch a reaper in the face.... that made me kind of mad because they were blatantly ignoring why this ending is bad in the first place....space kid....normandy crew deserting....a galactic fleet stuck on earth...its not oh no shep dies it is so much more than that.

It's everything you touched on but I will be the lone "happier ending" flag waver out here. that's not my only reason for disliking the ending (and I dont understand why that's such a bad thing, to want a happy ending) but it is one many reasons. I truly believed I was gonna kill the Reapers and then run off with Miranda. I had that image in my mind.....

[ReluctantMind]

There is nothing wrong with wanting some sunshine in the ending, hold the rainbows and unicorns. If nothing else it would provide some of the supposed variety that was described pre-release. I think that has been one of the biggest problems for me. A company that supposedly listens to its fans somehow did not pick up on our desire for an epic ending that gave us closure with the characters we love.

[epicalus]

okay , annoying.
I've just spend allot of time replaying mass effect 1.

here's what i'd forgotten since last i played it .

the keepers are controlled by the citadel. giving validity to the existance of the catalyst.
the keepers were also made by the reapers for 2 reasons .
- to receive the signal to activate the citadel , meaning to activate the mass relay , hidden inside the superstructer of the citadel .
- to ensure the new species that find the citadel will be able to opperate it without understanding it.
meaning to hide the secrets of the citadel that being.
the citadel controls the mass relays .( that i remembered) but it also explained in a way that the citadel is an AI . giving more validity to the catalyst (god child - starchild)
wich is also why the citadel keeps being the single thing it all comes back to.
so i understand it and it has been spoken of before the ending of ME3.
but , the reapers being controled by the catalyst. still feels wrong even now that i replayed me1
seeing as Sovereing and harbingers way of interacting with sheppard they inadvertable are sentient machines. and boy they have a god complex.
i also took note to sovereigns words.
he spoke of (chaos of organic life's evolution) wich means what exactly ?
building synthetics? no he said organic evolution not technological advancement .
or no not technological evolution.
what sovereign refers to is the chaotic evolution of organics.
meaning what ? well why do turians have scales?
why are asari monogendered?
why do krogan breed so fast?
why do krogan have more organs ? (4 testicles)
by sovereigns words , thats what the cycle is about .
pull in a bit of stargate and organics might ascend ?

then theres the bit about the mass relays blowing up .
okay i see what you did there.
sovereign says that the reapers left the relays and the citadel to ensure that organics will evolve along the technological path they want us to .
so yes destroying the relays and the citadel will ensure we technologically evolve differently.
BUT why destroy it all at the moment the reapers are here?
ME3 revolves around finding a way to stop the reapers ONCE AND FOR ALL.
at this point destroying the relays and the citadel IS NOT NECCESARY
becausse its already to late , we have technologically evolved on there desired path.
so what ? the next cycle will evolve differently?
okay yes that makes sence . but we are stopping the reapers so theres no point in throwing away Mass effect technology.

so now , i understand the catalyst's existance . but his solution is bull , so is his "problem to solve"
cos its not about synthetics destroying organic life . Thats what HIS reapers are doing .
its about the chaos of organic Evolution.
aso to that point the reapers created the keepers most likely from the first race that they harvested.
they were created/changed to respond to the reaper and citadel signals.
but during there time there they also evolved to the point where they would no longer respond to the reaper signals only the citadel signals.
wich the protian scientists changed . they changed the signals so that the citadel can't commune with the keepers anymore.
leading back to chaotic evolution of organic life.

so yes the ending makes a little more sence to me but its still NOT what its supposed to be .
my time spend replying ME1 was infact enlightning , but not to the point of completely agreeing to the ending .

why the reapers do what they do . is not explained in ME3 , its a lie to make the ending work , wich it doesn't .

so to sum it up .
- catalyst's sollution to a problem his reapers create (synthetics destroying organic life)(cut it from the game) so also remove the 3 choices .
- keep the catalyst as it is refered to in ME1 (but seriously the boy from earth NO NO NO)
- as the ending is now ... ITS Nothing BUT the indoctrination theory , as it tells me things i know are NOT true . and it will also give you that ART .

i'm a fan and i just broke your ending .
This is why people say theres too many plotholes .
And i just gave you more plotholes.
I've disected the ending for a week and i found problems .
i replayed ME1 and i found more problems .

am i saying your should remake the ending ? no i'm not .
but i am appealing to your artistic side .
someone who creates someting wants it to be perfect .
please bioware consider the ending or at least do what i did .
go back to the beginning , reconnect with the information you gave us .
and you'll see that the ending you've provided isn't right .
if you follow the path i've chosen and went back to the beginning , you'll see it aswell.

Modifié par epicalus, 01 avril 2012 - 12:51 .

[knection]

MaltMilchek wrote...

To me the ending was perfect, particularly the Green ending, which seems like the intended ending. In short, it all ties up everything nicely, how you say?

- The Reapers actually WANT synthesis with organics
- The 50,000 year cycle/cleansing is to test to see if the current cycle organics are ready
- Only the perfect cycle organics would create the Crucible and reach the Citadel conduit
- This perfect cycle and its leader, would reach the conduit and would 'prove' themselves worthy of being the framework for a synthetic/organic new life-form
- This is the real "solution", cleanse every 50k years, until a true hero for organics emerges.
- The plans for the Crucible are passed down from the Reapers
- The Citadel is built by the Reapers
- The Reapers basically give the tools necessary, then sit back and kill everything every 50k years until an organic life-form worthy and ready is able to complete the synthesis.

Thoughts?

Okay then why do the mass relays blow up from systhesis.....why is the normandy abandoning shepard....and if a mass relay blows up than there goes the galaxy that was in....bioware writers did not check on there own lore...these are the reasons they have to go back and add more.  You would think all of the guys in testing/editing would catch some of these things and it suprises me that not one of them would say hmmm...do you think this is kind of a rushed ending by changing the color of the explosion but keeping most of the motions the same....Nah I dont think nobody will notice.

[JuannBell]

today i ended mas effect 3.....3times......sadness.......A LOT of sadness in all the 3 ending (3?!?!?).
Pleae Bioware i will pay good money for a DLC with a different finals

[CuseGirl]

MaltMilchek wrote...

To me the ending was perfect, particularly the Green ending, which seems like the intended ending. In short, it all ties up everything nicely, how you say?

- The Reapers actually WANT synthesis with organics
- The 50,000 year cycle/cleansing is to test to see if the current cycle organics are ready
- Only the perfect cycle organics would create the Crucible and reach the Citadel conduit
- This perfect cycle and its leader, would reach the conduit and would 'prove' themselves worthy of being the framework for a synthetic/organic new life-form
- This is the real "solution", cleanse every 50k years, until a true hero for organics emerges.
- The plans for the Crucible are passed down from the Reapers
- The Citadel is built by the Reapers
- The Reapers basically give the tools necessary, then sit back and kill everything every 50k years until an organic life-form worthy and ready is able to complete the synthesis.

Thoughts?

To your first part? No, the Reapers were VERY clear: "we are your salvation THROUGH destruction". In other words, organics with who have reached a certain technological level will "ascend" or "reach a higher level of existence" by being liquified and preserved in a Reaper. So organics are better off not performing the functions that they NATURALLY perform (eating, sleeping, walking, talking, and yes, fighting, arguing, killing, disagreeing, etc). This whole "synthesis is the perfect ending" is some marketing jargon made up by the devs. Based on the previous 2 games, you cannot look at the in-game description of synthesis and say "yea, this is the best ending", especially since it includes Shepard's death.

Essentially what your saying is the Reapers sit around waiting for a group of organics to luck up into getting to the top of the Citadel (and I guess w'ere REJECTING the indoc theory and taking that scene at face value). That's nonsense. The Reapers have wanted to kill organics, period.

[EDG255]

Please dont change anything just because some cry babies need closure, it is shepards journey and if aliens camp out around earth or tali makes love with garrus that's for another game that you dont need to make nor any other extra DLC for that matter.

If shepard is abducted by aliens or simply dies at the end and what you  see that at the end, it is just part of what you have to make for yourself because you never choose how youre gonna die or if shepard doesnt die who knows he/she saved earth in any way you picked up to be(and yes cry babies you also pick the colors at the end).

Does it matter what you did in the three games YES because you simply make your choice for you, for your enjoyment and pleasure.

And at the end thanks bioware, great game and please stop this nonsense.

if you want to make something else additionally with the game remmeber that you dont own anything to the players you already did what you thougt it was best for the story of this great game.

[CuseGirl]

EDG255 wrote...

Please dont change anything just because some cry babies need closure, it is shepards journey

dude, we're Shepard. So it's our journey and we were told we would shape it's ending.

[Hexley UK]

EDG255 wrote...

Please dont change anything just because some cry babies need closure, it is shepards journey and if aliens camp out around earth or tali makes love with garrus that's for another game that you dont need to make nor any other extra DLC for that matter.

If shepard is abducted by aliens or simply dies at the end and what you  see that at the end, it is just part of what you have to make for yourself because you never choose how youre gonna die or if shepard doesnt die who knows he/she saved earth in any way you picked up to be(and yes cry babies you also pick the colors at the end).

Does it matter what you did in the three games YES because you simply make your choice for you, for your enjoyment and pleasure.

And at the end thanks bioware, great game and please stop this nonsense.

if you want to make something else additionally with the game remmeber that you dont own anything to the players you already did what you thougt it was best for the story of this great game.

The ending is complete gibberish and insulting other forum users is hardly going to make people see your point.

Modifié par Hexley UK, 01 avril 2012 - 01:00 .

[jeweledleah]

MaltMilchek wrote...

knection wrote...

MaltMilchek wrote...

To me the ending was perfect, particularly the Green ending, which seems like the intended ending. In short, it all ties up everything nicely, how you say?

- The Reapers actually WANT synthesis with organics
- The 50,000 year cycle/cleansing is to test to see if the current cycle organics are ready
- Only the perfect cycle organics would create the Crucible and reach the Citadel conduit
- This perfect cycle and its leader, would reach the conduit and would 'prove' themselves worthy of being the framework for a synthetic/organic new life-form
- This is the real "solution", cleanse every 50k years, until a true hero for organics emerges.
- The plans for the Crucible are passed down from the Reapers
- The Citadel is built by the Reapers
- The Reapers basically give the tools necessary, then sit back and kill everything every 50k years until an organic life-form worthy and ready is able to complete the synthesis.

Thoughts?

Okay then why do the mass relays blow up from systhesis.....why is the normandy abandoning shepard....and if a mass relay blows up than there goes the galaxy that was in....bioware writers did not check on there own lore...these are the reasons they have to go back and add more.  You would think all of the guys in testing/editing would catch some of these things and it suprises me that not one of them would say hmmm...do you think this is kind of a rushed ending by changing the color of the explosion but keeping most of the motions the same....Nah I dont think nobody will notice.

To me the Mass Relays become irrelevant, they are built by the Reapers to give organics a kind of "head start". Once synthesis is achieved, nothing else matters as there is peace forever, the Mass Relays are no longer necessary. The Normandy fleeing to me was a bit strange, but I guess it served as a mechanism to show that once it crash lands that Joker and EDI are now 'synthesised' and start fresh. In any case the facts are there the whole time about the Citadel and Crucible being created by and passed down originally from the Reapers. The starchild even says, "we leave the primitive races alone", they harvest, and 'reap' untill the perfect cycle is found, and the perfect avatar of that cycle (Shepard), choses to merge with them and create peace by synthesis.

how is there peace forever?  does synthesis = brainwashing then? changing the very core of their personalities?  becasue organics fight other organics far more then they fight synthetics.

not to mention - they are all still stuck in Sol system.  do they not care about the rest of their people anymore, the ones left behind in different clusters? do they still need to eat?  what about those "primitive" races whose developemnt we just ran roughshoed over?

[kglaser]

devwild wrote...

Seival wrote...

It looks like BioWare is really listening:
http://masseffect.bi...ity/comm_center

Some noticable negative reviews are included... Something big is about to happen! 

And random crap not even related to mass effect... That's just an automated content agregator that pulls mass effect stuff from social media, it doesn't demonstrate anything.

Gah...I don't even want to navigate that site; it's giving me an ice-cream headache

[Chrislo1990]

VaddixBell wrote...

Mass Effect 3 was incredible. Simply seeing the conclusion to age old conflicts between the Geth & Quarians and the Krogan & Salarians was simply stunning and highlighted just how rich and deep the Mass Effect universe is.

The ending however is shambolic. Let's say for instance that the "Indoctrination Theory" is true and the ending presented is simply the internal struggle in Shepard's head. That ending does not finish the series,we don't finish the war. We don't see how our actions ultimately effected that universe.

We did not see the conclusion, we seen Commander Shepard's internal struggle and that's it. If it was all in his head and we still chose destruction, then let us see the war be won or lost. And if DLC comes out that shows the true ending, that Shepard got up and finished the fight, then it looks as if Bioware always intended this ending and removed it in order to sell a better ending. And that's below Bioware.

There's no denying that ME3 is an incredible game, however I believe that it could have been bettter. Besides the horrible endings of which I am so very disappointed about, ME3 was dumbed down. How so you may ask?

1.) Dialogue has been take down a couple of notches. Even in full RPG mode, or full conversation mode, the dialogue trees have been simplified. Most of the time you are presented with only two lines of dialogue to choose from: paragon or renegade. To add insult to injury, there are fewer dialogue trees to begin with when compared to ME1 and ME2. I had expected ME3 to have even richer dialogue, not less. After all it had been mentioed by Mac Walters multiple times that ME3 had more writing compared to it's predecessors. In fact I remember him tweeting over the summer how Bioware had hired additional writers and a second editor.

2.) You are given very few opportunities to actually interact with your squadmates and love interests through dialogue trees. This really bothered me because it went against another promise Bioware had made regarding ME3's focus on developing more intimate relationships with your squad. Most of the time you press the A button only to extract a sentence or two of dialogue from your fellow squadmember. It irritated me that when I would approach Ashley on the Normandy all she would have to say were a line or two like "Hey Commander" and what not. The lack of dialogue trees takes a way that level of intimacy you can have with your favorite squadmates. There are fewer opportunities to bond with them, to care about them. Shepard and his crew are in the  middle of a gruesome war. They should have more to say other than  "Hey Commander" and the occasional random line or two of dialogue. I could understand why Bioware chose that approach with Zaeed and Kasumi in ME2. After all, they weren't essential characters. But squadmembers that you have known from the very beginning, like Ashley...that is unacceptable. It really takes away from ther immersion.

3.) Most of the members from the Suicide team have extremely brief appearances. I wanted to have more time Miranda, Thane, Jack and Samara. Instead Thane dies after only conversing with you only once at the hospital., Samara disappears after the situation with the Ardat YAkshi sanctuary is resolved. Miranda briefly speaks to you and then goes in search of her sister, and Jack leaves for battle after the Grissom academy mission.

4.) Side missions fell more like fetch missions,rather than actual missions. with the exception of the occasinal N7 mission involving shooting and a subplot.
 
Now with regard to the endings, they are illogical as they are ridiculous. They go against established concepts and offer no closure. In fact they break story coherence and bring forth more question than answers. I too have wondered whether this was a deliberate move by Bioware,but why would they risk enraging almost the entire fanbase just to charge you for the actual ending of the trilogy? It's just way too risky. Are they that desperate for money?  

I think it's more likey that Bioware simply rushed in order to release the game on time. Had EA given them more time, perhaps they would have actually sat down and reevealuated the ending. Who knows. All I know is that  no longer trust them. I think their priorities are changing and that they are straying further and further away from their roots. It really is a shame. I am saddened that the company behinfdmy favorite franchise of all time would choose to release an incomplete game just for the sake making money sooner.

As such I will hold the line! The endings need to be fixed! They must revolve around our decisions, moral inclinations, EMS scores, reputations and so on and so forth.  They have to provide answers rather than questions. I believe that it should be up to the player whether Shepard lives or dies and whther or he gets a happy ending, a bitter seet ending, or and bad ending. We've spent so many hours shaping our Sgepards. It's only natural that we feel upset when control is taken away form us, especially when this is to be his or her last appearance in the ME universe.

Modifié par Chrislo1990, 01 avril 2012 - 01:17 .

[jeweledleah]

MaltMilchek wrote...

I interpreted the green rush of energy extending through the galaxy and "merging" all synthetic and organic together (as seen by EDI and Joker - both with that greenish synthesis look at the end) - hence this is where "peace forever" came from. Also, after the credits there is the brief clip of the old man telling his grandson(?) a story about "The Shepard" in what seems to be a peaceful setting, speaking of a kind of 'legend'. I interpreted this as "and they lived happily ever after" in a way.

So in a sense, everything, be it primitive or current organic, etc - ALL organic and synthic life is merged by the final wave (as the energy passes from relay to relay and cluster to cluster). I didn't think everyone was stuck in Sol, just the fleets that went there.

the fleets that came to Sol were sizable.  very.  sizable.

also - unless that green rush of scientificaly unviable energy somehow changed the very mindsets of people it touched?  peace forever is not even close to guaranteed, especialy when you concider the state of Sol system, its lack of resources vs amount of people in it who need them.  Citadel looks pretty peaceful, even during reaper war it looked and felt peaceful.  it doesn't mean the rest of the universe is, or that that peace isn't merely an illusion.


I'm sorry, but the "symbolism" of that green ending crumbles the moment you start to examine it logicaly (not to mention scientificaly) and it doesn't fit with the world of hard sci-fi, that Mass Effect was up until that point.

Modifié par jeweledleah, 01 avril 2012 - 01:27 .

[PH03N1X 108]

jeweledleah wrote...

the fleets that came to Sol were sizable.  very.  sizable.

also - unless that green rush of scientificaly unviable energy somehow changed the very mindsets of people it touched?  peace forever is not even close to guaranteed, especialy when you concider the state of Sol system, its lack of resources vs amount of people in it who need them.  Citadel looks pretty peaceful, even during reaper war it looked and felt peaceful.  it doesn't mean the rest of the universe is, or that that peace isn't merely an illusion.


I'm sorry, but the "symbolism" of that green ending crumbles the moment you start to examine it logicaly (not to mention scientificaly) and it doesn't fit with the world of hard sci-fi, that Mass Effect was up until that point.

This. It didn't change the mindset though, it somehow physically changed the DNA of every organic being in the galaxy. Even if that was possible, it would be so painful lol.

Modifié par PH03N1X 108, 01 avril 2012 - 01:31 .

[CuseGirl]

MaltMilchek wrote...

To me the Mass Relays become irrelevant, they are built by the Reapers to give organics a kind of "head start". Once synthesis is achieved, nothing else matters as there is peace forever, the Mass Relays are no longer necessary. The Normandy fleeing to me was a bit strange, but I guess it served as a mechanism to show that once it crash lands that Joker and EDI are now 'synthesised' and start fresh. In any case the facts are there the whole time about the Citadel and Crucible being created by and passed down originally from the Reapers. The starchild even says, "we leave the primitive races alone", they harvest, and 'reap' untill the perfect cycle is found, and the perfect avatar of that cycle (Shepard), choses to merge with them and create peace by synthesis.

So galaxy travel is irrelevant? You still have the majority of militarized galactic forces shoehorned into the Sol system with no way to leave. I don't care what type of synthesis we have, THAT MAKES NO SENSE in the ending.

Modifié par CuseGirl, 01 avril 2012 - 01:33 .

[jeweledleah]

PH03N1X 108 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

the fleets that came to Sol were sizable.  very.  sizable.

also - unless that green rush of scientificaly unviable energy somehow changed the very mindsets of people it touched?  peace forever is not even close to guaranteed, especialy when you concider the state of Sol system, its lack of resources vs amount of people in it who need them.  Citadel looks pretty peaceful, even during reaper war it looked and felt peaceful.  it doesn't mean the rest of the universe is, or that that peace isn't merely an illusion.


I'm sorry, but the "symbolism" of that green ending crumbles the moment you start to examine it logicaly (not to mention scientificaly) and it doesn't fit with the world of hard sci-fi, that Mass Effect was up until that point.

This. It didn't change the mindset though, it somehow physically changed the DNA of every organic being in the galaxy. Even if that was possible, it would be so painful lol.

well, if it didn't change the mindset, that means sooner or later wars will begin again.  probably sooner, concidering overpopulation of Sol system after the reaper war.

althought how can that green beam possibly change DNA into synthetic/organic hybrid, concidering that Shepard him/heself is organic with prosthetics/implants?  I don't even...  Even then, the only way we saw of changing DNA was with collectors building a human reaper... and that took a fair bit of trial and error, before they got it working

[improperdancing]

jeweledleah wrote...

PH03N1X 108 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

the fleets that came to Sol were sizable.  very.  sizable.

also - unless that green rush of scientificaly unviable energy somehow changed the very mindsets of people it touched?  peace forever is not even close to guaranteed, especialy when you concider the state of Sol system, its lack of resources vs amount of people in it who need them.  Citadel looks pretty peaceful, even during reaper war it looked and felt peaceful.  it doesn't mean the rest of the universe is, or that that peace isn't merely an illusion.


I'm sorry, but the "symbolism" of that green ending crumbles the moment you start to examine it logicaly (not to mention scientificaly) and it doesn't fit with the world of hard sci-fi, that Mass Effect was up until that point.

This. It didn't change the mindset though, it somehow physically changed the DNA of every organic being in the galaxy. Even if that was possible, it would be so painful lol.

well, if it didn't change the mindset, that means sooner or later wars will begin again.  probably sooner, concidering overpopulation of Sol system after the reaper war.

althought how can that green beam possibly change DNA into synthetic/organic hybrid, concidering that Shepard him/heself is organic with prosthetics/implants?  I don't even...  Even then, the only way we saw of changing DNA was with collectors building a human reaper... and that took a fair bit of trial and error, before they got it working

Don't think too much on it.  It was just sloppy writing.

[PH03N1X 108]

improperdancing wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

PH03N1X 108 wrote...

jeweledleah wrote...

the fleets that came to Sol were sizable.  very.  sizable.

also - unless that green rush of scientificaly unviable energy somehow changed the very mindsets of people it touched?  peace forever is not even close to guaranteed, especialy when you concider the state of Sol system, its lack of resources vs amount of people in it who need them.  Citadel looks pretty peaceful, even during reaper war it looked and felt peaceful.  it doesn't mean the rest of the universe is, or that that peace isn't merely an illusion.


I'm sorry, but the "symbolism" of that green ending crumbles the moment you start to examine it logicaly (not to mention scientificaly) and it doesn't fit with the world of hard sci-fi, that Mass Effect was up until that point.

This. It didn't change the mindset though, it somehow physically changed the DNA of every organic being in the galaxy. Even if that was possible, it would be so painful lol.

well, if it didn't change the mindset, that means sooner or later wars will begin again.  probably sooner, concidering overpopulation of Sol system after the reaper war.

althought how can that green beam possibly change DNA into synthetic/organic hybrid, concidering that Shepard him/heself is organic with prosthetics/implants?  I don't even...  Even then, the only way we saw of changing DNA was with collectors building a human reaper... and that took a fair bit of trial and error, before they got it working

Don't think too much on it.  It was just sloppy writing.

Indeed. We keep forgetting this, and for the most part it's because we love the series so much. As a fanbase, we just need to accept that Bioware let us down on the ending and they need to resolve it.

[CuseGirl]

improperdancing wrote...
Don't think too much on it.  It was just sloppy writing.

The simplest answer is usually the best/right answer. The 2 simple reasons why these endings make no sense at all (based on the previous lore/in-game-events and decisions the players makes) is because it is possible EA/Bioware truly believed they could flip this into a financial win AND the ending was rushed. 

[CesarSan]

The indoctrination theory:

If the ending is all in Shepard's mind and destroying the red tube means resisting Harbinger's indoctrination then Shepard keeps his freewill. But he's still laying on Earth half-dead, he never got to the citadel and the war is still raging on. The RGB explosion was all in his imagination.This is not an ending.

It also means he would gladly betray the Geth trust and destroy them and EDI who saved his life at least twice. That makes him a treacherous ***hole.

It still doesn't explain why Shepard accepts everything the creepy energy kid says at face value, including the ridiculous reasoning for creating the Reapers, without laughing at his face. I would.

If it was true and then followed by a true ending then it would be pure genius. It was not...

Even assuming he somehow got into the citadel and the explosion was real why would Harbinger show him the kill switch of his entire species?

Modifié par CesarSan, 01 avril 2012 - 01:46 .