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[elite196]

There were a lot of good, maybe epic and funny scenes in ME3. But in my opinion the ending procedure is too dramatic! Every decission is too extrem. Why can´t it be the good old way? Acitivate the super weapon and blast those reapers with a little help from the fleet out of the sky? Pack this in an amazing cut-scene! Done!

I think the best game was ME1. Best story best ending.

[Hexley UK]

I think some people at Bioware need to read this -

www.writersdigest.com/whats-new/the-dos-and-donts-of-novel-endings

[garytwine]

Norrin_Radd wrote...

harrier25699 wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

I'm just curious for all the ending haters:

What is the optimal ending, in your opinion?

Having my choices matter, being able to reject the star child's principles and, like ME2, have a variety of endings ranging from everyone dead and the galaxy reaped, to everyone survives and lives happily ever after.  This should depend on how much effort you put into questlines, otaining EMS and choices from ME1 and 2 have ALOT more of an impact other than revealing a secret movie that implies you might not be dead if you chose red flavour, e.g. indoc theory.  If the protagonist HAS to die (bioware canon) then there should be ALOT more to the ending than simply red, green or blue. 

Presently, the ending is like Luke Skywalker throwing himself onto Vader's funeral pyre at the end of RotJ just to make sure the flames don't go out.

You don't think your choices mattered? The only reason the Crucible was built was a direct result of all of your choices. A lot of the Mass Effect series has not been the end result, but how you got there (Every choice can be re-written as a result that will be static for all players, somewhere). Did you kill a guy to get there, did you talk him down, did you let him kill himself etc. Your choice is rarely what the outcome will be, but how that outcome is achieved.

In the end of the game, you basically have to destroy the citadel and the relays, and how you choose to do that is up to you. If the Relays were created by the Reapers' masters, and the citadel was created by the Reapers' masters, and the crucible was likely also designed by the Reapers' masters, then it would make some sense that their one stipulation for ending this cycle where you get to live, is that all of their technology may never be used again.

It makes more sense if you think about the crucible as the symbol of breaking the pattern that every cycle before it has followed. If a cycle can create the crucible and use it, than the cycle is broken, and must be altered. The Starchild flat out says that Shepard being there has forever changed the cycle, or something similar.

Bah, I don't know, some how Shepard being able to topple the Reapers, and the Reapers' masters, and do it keeping everyone alive, would only have cheapened the threat in the first place.

The choices mattered story and character wise throughout all three games. The choices you made, who lived or who died. This tailored the game so that you saw Thane again (if he lived in Mass Effect 2) and plenty of other examples. Also, these choices helped increase EMS throughout the game (even stuff you had mined in ME2 effected EMS).

However, at the end of the day, its not these choices which matter. Its the EMS.

EMS would matter if you are fighting the Reapers in the final 10 minutes. There would be a very real equation here. 5 dreadnaughts = 1 Reaper  (for example). So, if you had enough EMS you could win. If you didn't you lose.

However, I don't see how or why the EMS shoud effect any interaction with the Godchild, why it would limit or increase the options he gives you and why if should effect end scene.

It makes no sense. You're not trying to blow him up with your armada in the final scenes. He is talking to you (I initially put, you are talking to him - not really true though) and then he gives you a choice. The fact that EMS factors in that choice makes no sense at all.

There is no logic to it and it the amount of EMS doesn't even play into the story of how you actually got here in the end. You could have minimal EMS and still meet the Godchild. He would give you one crappy destroy ending where everyone dies. The end.

How and why should the EMS even effect this outcome?

[shonefob]

Damien Tricarico ‏ @d_tr1cks

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@masseffect how long until the new dlc comes out?
Mass Effect Mass Effect ‏ @masseffect

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@d_tr1cks There will be an announcement made this month. Stay tuned!
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3:13 AM - 4 Apr 12 via HootSuite · Details
Via Twitter. Lets see what happens!

[Reindeer Ninja]

Does anyone else think that this ****** poor ending is a product of the direction gaming is going in?

I mean if you look at the statistics, casual gamers are the driving force of the gaming market these days, not (for want of a better word) "hardcore" gamers. The Nintendo Wii has sold more consoles than the PS3 and 360 combined. I think that statisticians at games companies are seeing these figures and pandering to the largest market out there, the casual gamer.

That's why we're seeing a serial dilution or "dumbing down" of each new game that comes out in a franchise. It's so that it's more accessible to the masses. Also casual gamers are much more just there "for the ride" so to speak so the ending to ME3 doesn't bother them that much for numerous reasons.

Casual gamers are also far less likely to go on game developers forums and voice their displeasure with a game. This also skews the statistics that BW are receiving. For every disgruntled "hardcore" gamer we have voicing out an opinion to BW here there's 6 (disgruntled or not) casual gamers sitting around doing whatever it is that casual gamers do, it's not trolling on the BW forums though that's for sure.

I'm not sure, and I hope I'm wrong but it's a sad direction to be going in if this is the case. But hey it's not all doom and gloom, I'll lighten the mood a little and finish with a joke...

http://i.imgur.com/8D7Vj.jpg

[holmcross]

I e-mailed this to BioWare well before I realized this forum topic existed. I figure I'll repost it here just in case it didn't go through:

Let me just start by saying I loved the game. The gameplay was way better than either of its predecessors (and both ME1 and ME2 were really good, so that's saying a lot). You guys clearly listened to the reactions the fans had to both ME1 and ME2, and found the perfect happy medium between them in ME3. I really liked all the plot tie-ins, was really impressed with how all these things from the previous games were building and building towards the conclusion. And then I got to the conclusion, and suddenly none of it mattered.

So, unfortunately, as much as I absolutely adored the game itself, I have to agree with a lot of the fan reactions to the ending. I found it weak on multiple levels. One is the issue of construction - that none of those hard moral choices you make in the game really play out in affecting the final state of the galaxy. Another is that the "final choice" isn't one - it's just an illusion of choice. The ending of Dragon Age: Origins would have been much weaker (and wouldn't have garnered the overwhelming positive reaction it did, I think) if the player had no choice but to sacrifice their Grey Warden at the end.

In general, I found it incongruent with the thematic build-up of the previous two games. There are two things we know about Commander Shepard from ME1 and ME2:

1. He/she is a great leader who succeeds not necessarily through personal strength but through the deep loyalty and respect inspired in his/her crew.

2. He/she always finds a way to beat the odds, often by not accepting the conventional solution.

So when Shepard goes solo at the very end, I was surprised - the crew is always so important, and they have no role to play in the final moments of the game? Then the Illusive Man vs. Anderson + Shepard showdown happens - that was pretty good - but then things went sharply downhill. To illustrate: when the Catalyst finished explaining the three choices to my Shepard, and I had the opportunity to walk down the paths, the first thing I did was try to walk the opposite direction and reject the choice wholesale. I didn't feel that Shepard (at least, not the "Chaotic Good" Shepard I was playing) would accept any of the options as presented. When that didn't work, the next thing I tried to do (no joke!) was shoot the Catalyst. I mean, he/it had just admitted to controlling the Reapers! But then that also didn't do anything, and I was disappointed once again. I mean, the whole series has built up Shepard as this daring problem-solver who refuses to submit to fate - and then the physical embodiment of "Fate" or "God" shows up, offers Shepard three bad, galactic civilization-destroying choices, and Shepard just picks one? I was shaking my head in disbelief.

So, you know, I picked what I felt my Shepard would see as the least of three evils (the Synthesis path), but I was coerced into doing it by the structure of the game. I felt (and still feel) like I was missing the "real" solution that didn't necessarily kill all the geth + EDI, doom the galaxy to chaos, blow up all the relays, and/or bring about the Singularity. All of the given options force the player to play right into the hand of the Reapers' puppetmaster, and it feels like the bad guys won. I was really surprised and disappointed to see such limited scope after the precedent set by the suicide mission in ME2 - a whole range of things could happen, from everyone dying (sad, downer) to everyone living (happy, awesome), to a bunch of things in between.

Also, I don't know what the coded decision process was for who comes out of the Normandy with Joker after the crash landing, but I'm assuming it's the romanced character (if present)? I took Liara down to Earth... and then she was on the Normandy at the very end. I really have a hard time understanding how she could possibly have made it back to the ship. Minor, I know, but it jarred me out of my suspension of disbelief.

Less critical, personal reactions: I know this probably makes me old-fashioned or whatever, as "grittiness" is currently the big thing in storytelling - but I'm a sucker for happy endings and I wish there was a "Shepard lives" option. Even if it meant making a very questionable choice like in Dragon Age: Origins (I keep bringing this up because it's a great model. The endings to DA:O, were not all happy, but they were absolutely superb in accommodating player choice). The ME3 ending was really depressing in the context of romancing Liara. All the build-up dialogue was so hopeful! You know, little blue babies, retiring to a quiet life among the stars... and then Shepard is forced to self-sacrifice. And on top of that, she shows basically no reaction in the ending, that the first love of her life is dead.

Okay, sorry this was so long. You know how fans can be, though, I'm sure. I'm really glad that BioWare are acknowledging the negative reaction and possibly trying to change some things - it shows that all the crap the userbase has been giving you about "screwing over your customers" with From Ashes was/is completely undeserved. I sincerely hope something comes of it, because, as I said, I loved (LOVED!) the trilogy, with the sole exception of the last 10 minutes. I can't even describe how absolutely fantastic it would be if we had more freedom to conclude the story on our terms.

Modifié par holmcross, 04 avril 2012 - 07:28 .

[harrier25699]

garytwine wrote...

How and why should the EMS even effect this outcome?

I utterly reject the god child, it's choices and it's principles and I choose to fight the reapers using the fleet I assembled.  Oh wait.  You can't.

[shonefob]

Bioware can you please just simply in yes or no tell us if an ending was planned as DLC before the game came out? I mean this isnt a Non spoiler channel anyways. And if it's no than there really isnt a spoiler to worry about.

Modifié par shonefob, 04 avril 2012 - 07:45 .

[dannii2]

Reindeer Ninja wrote...

Does anyone else think that this ****** poor ending is a product of the direction gaming is going in?

I mean if you look at the statistics, casual gamers are the driving force of the gaming market these days, not (for want of a better word) "hardcore" gamers. The Nintendo Wii has sold more consoles than the PS3 and 360 combined. I think that statisticians at games companies are seeing these figures and pandering to the largest market out there, the casual gamer.

That's why we're seeing a serial dilution or "dumbing down" of each new game that comes out in a franchise. It's so that it's more accessible to the masses. Also casual gamers are much more just there "for the ride" so to speak so the ending to ME3 doesn't bother them that much for numerous reasons.

Casual gamers are also far less likely to go on game developers forums and voice their displeasure with a game. This also skews the statistics that BW are receiving. For every disgruntled "hardcore" gamer we have voicing out an opinion to BW here there's 6 (disgruntled or not) casual gamers sitting around doing whatever it is that casual gamers do, it's not trolling on the BW forums though that's for sure.

I'm not sure, and I hope I'm wrong but it's a sad direction to be going in if this is the case. But hey it's not all doom and gloom, I'll lighten the mood a little and finish with a joke...

http://i.imgur.com/8D7Vj.jpg

Interesting opinion. I would call myself a 'casual gamer' but I'm very selective in the games I play. I want to be completely immersed in the game world, the lore, everything about them. I don't like it when games get 'dumbed down' at all. I didn't like the endings at all and voiced my opinion here.
Perhaps I'm just misunderstanding the definitions of 'casual' and 'hardcore'?

x

[shonefob]

I am really just waiting for Bioware to just be like ohh we got you guys, sorry for making you wait just wanted everyone to get emotional to make the game feel more real. Here's the FREE DLC that finishes the story. And we are all like ohh you guys you got us good we still love you though *Everyone is happy*

Modifié par shonefob, 04 avril 2012 - 07:48 .

[Reindeer Ninja]

Apologies, allow me to clarify:

"Casual Gamer" - Someone not particularly interested in the games industry as a whole and see's gaming as a means to an end, the end being a bit of relaxation after work or some such... They're not particularly bothered about immersion or committing large amounts of time to completing games. They're looking for a quick fix, something they can just pick up and play whenever they like.

"Hardcore gamer" - Someone who likes to get completely immersed in games and will often spend large amounts of time playing them. As such most aspects of games are important to these people (lore, immersion, gameplay, replayability etc...), you're not going to devote time to a game which isn't worth it. Due to the amount of time spent playing games, the "hardcore" gamer gets a feel for what he/she likes and dislikes and translates this into loyalty to certain publishers. When this loyalty is betrayed the gamer complains.

I'm sure people will disagree with these definitions, which is why I didn't want to use the term "hardcore" in the first place.

So in a nutshell it's a matter of time, and what you want out of a game that defines whether you're casual or not. From what you've written I wouldn't call you a casual gamer.

[harrier25699]

shonefob wrote...

I am really just waiting for Bioware to just be like ohh we got you guys, sorry for making you wait just wanted everyone to get emotional to make the game feel more real. Here's the FREE DLC that finishes the story. And we are all like ohh you guys you got us good we still love you though *Everyone is happy*

The only way that could even remotely happen is if the indoc theory is correct, however that means that BW deliberately gave us a vapid ending so we'd scramble to buy the DLC that concludes things properly.  I'm not sure BW would stoop that low tbh.   So, the ending we got is the ending they settled on, they knew it would ask more questions than it answered and have been feverishly working on DLC to appease the angry mob they knew would form over it.  However BW put so much effort into ME3 why would they purposefully fluff the whole thing up with such a $hi77y ending?  They did not conceive that we would hate it so much?  Is that really the truth?  God I hope not.  I really really hope not.  

I can't even THINK about buying more DLC for this game right now.

Modifié par harrier25699, 04 avril 2012 - 08:03 .

[shonefob]

harrier25699 wrote...

shonefob wrote...

I am really just waiting for Bioware to just be like ohh we got you guys, sorry for making you wait just wanted everyone to get emotional to make the game feel more real. Here's the FREE DLC that finishes the story. And we are all like ohh you guys you got us good we still love you though *Everyone is happy*

The only way that could even remotely happen is if the indoc theory is correct, however that means that BW deliberately gave us a vapid ending so we'd scramble to buy the DLC that concludes things properly.  I'm not sure BW would stoop that low tbh.   So, the ending we got is the ending they settled on, they knew it would ask more questions than it answered and have been feverishly working on DLC to appease the angry mob they knew would form over it.  However BW put so much effort into ME3 why would they purposefully fluff the whole thing up with such a $hi77y ending?  They did not conceive that we would hate it so much?  Is that really the truth?  God I hope not.  I really really hope not.  

I can't even THINK about buying more DLC for this game right now.

Id really rather them be after a little extra cash tbh than that actually  be the ending they planned.  Who knows maybe the DLC is just to big to fit in the games.  Or as I said if you didnt see "FREE DLC"  so was just a way for use to build up want it even more.  Maybe Shpeard has been unconsiouse in a hosptial after the beam hit him for well the month or so the game has been out.  So we havent been playing him for a month but we are wanting to get back in the fight more than ever.

I meen look at what we as a commuinty have band together to do.  We are actually in this fight together now.  We have united just as in the game even the most diverse of people.

Modifié par shonefob, 04 avril 2012 - 08:09 .

[doeman87]

harrier25699 wrote...

The only way that could even remotely happen is if the indoc theory is correct, however that means that BW deliberately gave us a vapid ending so we'd scramble to buy the DLC that concludes things properly.  I'm not sure BW would stoop that low tbh.   So, the ending we got is the ending they settled on, they knew it would ask more questions than it answered and have been feverishly working on DLC to appease the angry mob they knew would form over it.  However BW put so much effort into ME3 why would they purposefully fluff the whole thing up with such a $hi77y ending?  They did not conceive that we would hate it so much?  Is that really the truth?  God I hope not.  I really really hope not.  

I can't even THINK about buying more DLC for this game right now.

i can't tell you how many times i've thought the EXACT same way... i was so sure that the indoc theory was true, in some form or another <_<

[Aurelius369]

holmcross wrote...

I e-mailed this to BioWare well before I realized this forum topic existed. I figure I'll repost it here just in case it didn't go through:

Let me just start by saying I loved the game. The gameplay was way better than either of its predecessors (and both ME1 and ME2 were really good, so that's saying a lot). You guys clearly listened to the reactions the fans had to both ME1 and ME2, and found the perfect happy medium between them in ME3. I really liked all the plot tie-ins, was really impressed with how all these things from the previous games were building and building towards the conclusion. And then I got to the conclusion, and suddenly none of it mattered.

etc.

 Absolutely. Well said and exactly my feelings on the matter.
I'm currently holding on for dear life to the life raft known as Indoc Theory and assuming BioWare has the real conclusion to this amazing epic we all love dearly in some DLC they've been planning all along to release soon.

I'm also assuming they planned from the start to give us this wierd non-ending just to extend the final moments of their saga (ie EA told them to milk it for all its worth) for dramatic effect so that said coming soon DLC will have maximum impact (ie sales)...and that they drastically, catastrophically underestimated the fan reaction to their little head f**k trick.

[shonefob]

And what if this DLC is huge. Maybe taking our created fleet across the galaxy wiping out the reapers one solar system at a time. Meeting new friends on the way. lol highly unlikely but a boy can hope for something we all know Bioware is capable of.

[Archonsg]

shonefob wrote...

And what if this DLC is huge. Maybe taking our created fleet across the galaxy wiping out the reapers one solar system at a time. Meeting new friends on the way. lol highly unlikely but a boy can hope for something we all know Bioware is capable of.

If this is so, it's a step towards regaining the use of my finger with the instant reaction to clicking the "pre-order now" button, everytime I see a new Bioware product.

But, as is, that finger is offline as far as Bioware/EA is concerned.

Modifié par Archonsg, 04 avril 2012 - 08:29 .

[elite196]

Maybe the green ending is the only true one. It´s the way of evolution. The reapers wanted this goal but in an very drastic way! That´s the problem! But synts can evolve: see EDI and the geth.
It´s true that we can´t live without tec. Remeber! People are speaking with their phones this very moment!

[Theronyll Itholien]

New detail about IT:

I noticed this when I played the ending again 2 weeks ago. Didn't read anyone mentioning this yet.

As you walk close to the indoctrination choices (so not the red one), the more you approach the choice.. a high-pitch beep starts to crawl into the foreground. Knowing that Reapers indoctrinate through soundwaves, that high-pitch sound seems to me the final.. climactic influence conquering Shepard's mind.. right when one of the wrong choices is made.

Very impressive little detail if you ask me.

What also gave me goosebumps was Vega saying as you pass him by "Do you hear a humming sound?" or something. Ugh. The IT must be a fact. It must be.

[shonefob]

elite196 wrote...

Maybe the green ending is the only true one. It´s the way of evolution. The reapers wanted this goal but in an very drastic way! That´s the problem! But synts can evolve: see EDI and the geth.
It´s true that we can´t live without tec. Remeber! People are speaking with their phones this very moment!

Still though if it is it counters everything the games have stood for.  Diversity is our power.  Alians fighting on human ships, Fighting along side cerberues, and the Prothean even saying that they lost to the reapers and we have a much better chance because of it.  The syntisis makes everyone the same and no race diffrent cause they are all merged together in one new race.

Not to mention it is what Seren wanted who was infact indoctrinated.

Modifié par shonefob, 04 avril 2012 - 08:38 .

[Enomis Scorcher]

Dormin wrote...

We are listening also, listening for a response, a response we have yet to receive.

Just to be clear... I'm listening too, BW dear Sirs

[elite196]

Well on the green ending Joker an EDI are at the "paradise" planet. Joker looking a little enhanced but still is Joker (as do the leaves). So I would not say there will be only one merged race. Only if Joker an EDI having babys!

Live can still go different ways.

[shonefob]

Guess we really won't know the best choice until they actually let us know what the 3 choices at the end do.
So far I am a destroy guy myself.  Mostly cause I get to kill reapers, it's what Anderson would have done, and Shepard lives.

Modifié par shonefob, 04 avril 2012 - 08:48 .

[Enomis Scorcher]

Sometimes I think that the point is all about the Crucible....If I'm not wrong the word means something similar to a melting pot and so mybe the intended (canon) ending is the green one since any diversity, any individuality anything at all melts in a single big, new evolved civilization.

Still ending sucks even because looks a lot like a "resistance is futile!" issue!

[shonefob]

I gotta say i started off hating the indoctrination thing, but every moment that passes im hoping it is true more and more.