23455 réponses à ce sujet

[clarkusdarkus]

Someguyukno wrote...

AkaXan wrote...

A lot of the independant stores I vist have a crap load of ME3 used copies. I also noticed the price for new has dropped like a rock. Sure Bioware got big sales upfront, but this mess will have an effect on the games long term retail viability and it will without a doubt effect paid DLC perforance.

Agreed, this won't just hurt Bioware but EA in sales across all their games, past present and future. This is the straw that broke the camal's back, and some free "clarification" and multiplayer dlc won't be enough to win us back. They're going to be feeling this fro a long time. (with)HOLD. THE. WALLET!

im actually personaly taking it upon myself to never buy anything from bioware again, dlc or any new IP's....there smug/arrogant indenial ways have lost evangelist customers like us. 

[Theronyll Itholien]

Thanatos144 wrote...

Theronyll Itholien wrote...

That Thanatos guy still trolling, I see? Still need him to reply to my last comments pages back. But that's just it: If you push him into a corner with logic and reasoning... he just ignores you. And because this forum is way too individualistic of late, the troll canget away with that.

Too individualistic? don't know where you are from but in the USA having
your own mind is a good. I didn't answer your post cause most lily I did
see it. why don't you repeat it instead of trying to borg everyone?

Where I'm from the word can also be interpreted as... maybe an synonym of self-centered? English is not my native language so I'm not sure. What I meant by calling this place more individualistic of late is that many people just use this thread to shout without actually listening to eachother.

I'll reply to your next reply to me in a new comment. I'm on a smart-phone, and this place is smart-phone unfriendly.

[helloween7]

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Leem_0001 wrote...

I'm well aware of heat death and its theory, but that is one theory of the end of the universe, and nothing to do with organic life meddling as I recall? Its just the natural end the universe is it not? The opposite end to the Big Freeze (or however its known). Incidently the original ending had a similar idea, but using Dark Energy, which was somehow (the game would tell, apparently) influenced by orgsanic life. Hence the Reapers.

So I am still on the other side of the fence to yourself when it comes to the endings, and still stand by my view on why it is terrible, but you put your point across here in a well thought out manner so fair play to you. And, honestly, I'm glad you liked it. Bit jealous actually as you got the complete ME experience that I wanted lol

Aw man, that last line bums me out. I do admit, seeing the Mass Relays dissapear 1 by 1 was a shocking sight to see. With the music swelling too, it was like seeing dreams be smashed. But, that was kind of the intent. The whole game was somber, and very sobering. The moment I had to kill Mordin to stop the Genophage cure (since Eve was dead in my game, the Krogans really didn't seem ready, and I was already leaning renagade through the whole series), the tone of the game had been set. The ending very much felt the same. Like, I knew the greater good was being done, but it seeing an old friend die was heart breaking. Seeing the Citadel go dark, and the relays shut down was way too hard to process right then and there. But the more I have thought about it since, the more I have been able to construct aftermaths where everything is ok. But we'll just assume, until they say otherwise, the Relays did not detonate like they did in The Arrival DLC.

What ending did you end up getting? And what percentage of renegade and paragon were you through all 3 games, Leem_0001? I think this might have a big impact on how people enjoyed the ending.

I was an 80% Renegade, 20% Paragon, Synthesis ending. Very sadly had to Kill Mordin, and collaterally had to kill Wrex. Saved the Geth and the Quarians. Romanced Tali. Purposely missed the shot with Garrus. etc.

So, my Shepard was a cold bastard, but I had some friends, and I was mainly focused on winning the war at any cost. The Synthesis ending seemed like it fit really well with my game. It seemed like the choice that saved the most lives, and ended the war.

when people say that the explosion of a relay would kill an entire system, they are right. so are the people saying that it didn't have to be that kind of destruction. more of a 'shut down and then go boom'

however what group 2 might forget is that all species stranded on their own planets = the death of them all. Intergalactic trade is immensive in numbers we couldn't possible understand. entire world and systems depend on that trade. food, medical supplies, water purifiers w/e. no more of that. not to mention that the entire fleet at earth? all doomed to die as to fight for the last scraps and bits among themselves

Wouldn't mean death for them all. Some will probably be out of luck, if they have no way to get food anymore, but they could make do for as long as they could while the remaining species attempt to create new relays (especially now that the Geth are good, and synthesis may have taken place). Different systems will still be able to communicate with Quantum Entaglers, so building the Relays might actually be a lot easier than they think if they are all working in unison.

But yeah, I don't think the relays exploded catastrophically, because if they did, from that galaxy point of view, you would have seen a ton of stars go super nova as well, and gravity shifts like crazy. Basically, a lot more turmoil than simply a pastel green wave. There are still fields with which mankind does not have ways to detect (such as the Higgs Field: http://en.wikipedia....iki/Higgs_boson). Those emanations of blue red or green light could simply be something we don't understand yet, not real explosions.

As for the remaining people on Earth, and the surviving alien fleets. It will be interesting indeed, to see how they figure out what to do. I'm sure that is something BioWare will explain in the Extended ending. I am also sure it is something they would have explained in future comics, games, movies etc, but the fans really want to know NOW. Nice of them to oblige.

it took The top brass of Prothean engineers several years and tons of resources to make a tiny relay. what are the odds this can be done on a completly devestated planet, where most of the population has been killed, indoctrinated or downright melted into goo. Same for other worlds. Asari? homeworld blasted into ruin, Krogan? no scientists worthy of mentioning. Salarians? possibly the smartest around, but lack the effective lifespan. Humans? They have to deal with the entire fleet of the galaxy, no room for research like that.

Not to mention that neither of them has anything to go on. no relays to study, no databanks. nothing

So i still do believe that destroying the mass relays will effectivly end galatic sentient life. Pretty much the only ones who have a chance are the quarians who are already self-sufficient for a long time, have a greatly untouched world and have etreme labor forces at their disposal

Actually in ME2 Matriarch Aethyta (sp?) downright said that Asari aren't even bothering to attempt reverse engineering the Mass Relays. They've literally put zero effort into it, and they're the "most advanced civilization of the Galaxy".

No other species seems to have bothered; Salarians, the other smart guys of the galaxy, are much more interested in cloning and genetic ingeneering.

I wouldn't say the destruction of the mass relays will "end galactic sentient life", but it does doom galactic civilization for a few thousand years at least.

Modifié par helloween7, 07 avril 2012 - 11:25 .

[spartanmax52000]

What bothers me it that nothing changes if you destroy or claim the collecters base, In the end its irrelevant it's just a number on your screen.

[AkaXan]

clarkusdarkus wrote...

Someguyukno wrote...

AkaXan wrote...

A lot of the independant stores I vist have a crap load of ME3 used copies. I also noticed the price for new has dropped like a rock. Sure Bioware got big sales upfront, but this mess will have an effect on the games long term retail viability and it will without a doubt effect paid DLC perforance.

Agreed, this won't just hurt Bioware but EA in sales across all their games, past present and future. This is the straw that broke the camal's back, and some free "clarification" and multiplayer dlc won't be enough to win us back. They're going to be feeling this fro a long time. (with)HOLD. THE. WALLET!

im actually personaly taking it upon myself to never buy anything from bioware again, dlc or any new IP's....there smug/arrogant indenial ways have lost evangelist customers like us. 

I cant say I'm in the evangelist group, I'm just a guy that enjoys games, but the key thing is when I feel a dev or company has lost its respect for its fans/customers or is just outright lieing about its products, I drop them damn fast. I've never bought a Capcom game this gen with their DLC and constant re-issue versions of their games, I dont buy Bethesda games because of their bugs and no I dont accept the its to big to bug test.

Sadly Biowares whole attitude towards fans/paying customers that have pointed out how broken those A, B or C endings are and why they dont even work at a basic story telling/writing level, has put me off Biowares future games and DLC.

Thankfully I got offered a refund for ME3 and ME2 is hitting my trade pile. Whats the point of keeping any Mass Effect games now, as the main reason to re-play those games again was the selling point that the player choices mattered, that those choices would give a different outcome. With ME3 endings Bioware has killed any reason to re-play the games. With their whole you guys dont get the endings so we'll expalin them better DLC Bioware has killed any reason to keep the Mass Effect games as the player is still railroaded into those awful endings, just with more of it now and Keeping it for any DLC paid or otherwise that dosent change those awful endings is a waste of time.

Modifié par AkaXan, 07 avril 2012 - 11:47 .

[spartanmax52000]

ChickenMan77 wrote...

Man did that ending suck or did I just not get it? Why are Saren and Sovereign so hell bent on getting to the Citadel and calling the Reapers when that Shimmer Kid lives there and controls them? Couldn’t he of done it all along?….plus the Collectors want Shepard’s body for his DNA in ME2 and then he just walks into Reaper HQ and give it to them?  

Did I miss something is there some kind of logic in this that I don’t have?

Any DLC should have Shepard go back to Mass Effect 1 on Virmire and have him say..”Saren you were right I’m just going to join with the Reapers anyways so let’s just cut to the chase and get it over with.”

Or I guess Shepard could just shoot the Citadel’s tubes and blow up the Shimmer Kid’s home…
.thanks for the information Shimmer Lad….Don’t bother showing me the exit I’ll just auger in from orbit…….

Good point:mellow:

[spartanmax52000]

Why does liara always show up in the flashback instead of L.I characters?

Modifié par spartanmax52000, 07 avril 2012 - 11:35 .

[Daap]

Great same broken endings but now with clarity and closure , yeah still spells failure to me.
Bioware do youreself and us a favor and just delete the last 10 min and make something decent instead of holding on to youre "artistic integrity" witch nobody agree's with.

[Norrin_Radd]

helloween7 wrote...

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Leem_0001 wrote...

I'm well aware of heat death and its theory, but that is one theory of the end of the universe, and nothing to do with organic life meddling as I recall? Its just the natural end the universe is it not? The opposite end to the Big Freeze (or however its known). Incidently the original ending had a similar idea, but using Dark Energy, which was somehow (the game would tell, apparently) influenced by orgsanic life. Hence the Reapers.

So I am still on the other side of the fence to yourself when it comes to the endings, and still stand by my view on why it is terrible, but you put your point across here in a well thought out manner so fair play to you. And, honestly, I'm glad you liked it. Bit jealous actually as you got the complete ME experience that I wanted lol

Aw man, that last line bums me out. I do admit, seeing the Mass Relays dissapear 1 by 1 was a shocking sight to see. With the music swelling too, it was like seeing dreams be smashed. But, that was kind of the intent. The whole game was somber, and very sobering. The moment I had to kill Mordin to stop the Genophage cure (since Eve was dead in my game, the Krogans really didn't seem ready, and I was already leaning renagade through the whole series), the tone of the game had been set. The ending very much felt the same. Like, I knew the greater good was being done, but it seeing an old friend die was heart breaking. Seeing the Citadel go dark, and the relays shut down was way too hard to process right then and there. But the more I have thought about it since, the more I have been able to construct aftermaths where everything is ok. But we'll just assume, until they say otherwise, the Relays did not detonate like they did in The Arrival DLC.

What ending did you end up getting? And what percentage of renegade and paragon were you through all 3 games, Leem_0001? I think this might have a big impact on how people enjoyed the ending.

I was an 80% Renegade, 20% Paragon, Synthesis ending. Very sadly had to Kill Mordin, and collaterally had to kill Wrex. Saved the Geth and the Quarians. Romanced Tali. Purposely missed the shot with Garrus. etc.

So, my Shepard was a cold bastard, but I had some friends, and I was mainly focused on winning the war at any cost. The Synthesis ending seemed like it fit really well with my game. It seemed like the choice that saved the most lives, and ended the war.

when people say that the explosion of a relay would kill an entire system, they are right. so are the people saying that it didn't have to be that kind of destruction. more of a 'shut down and then go boom'

however what group 2 might forget is that all species stranded on their own planets = the death of them all. Intergalactic trade is immensive in numbers we couldn't possible understand. entire world and systems depend on that trade. food, medical supplies, water purifiers w/e. no more of that. not to mention that the entire fleet at earth? all doomed to die as to fight for the last scraps and bits among themselves

Wouldn't mean death for them all. Some will probably be out of luck, if they have no way to get food anymore, but they could make do for as long as they could while the remaining species attempt to create new relays (especially now that the Geth are good, and synthesis may have taken place). Different systems will still be able to communicate with Quantum Entaglers, so building the Relays might actually be a lot easier than they think if they are all working in unison.

But yeah, I don't think the relays exploded catastrophically, because if they did, from that galaxy point of view, you would have seen a ton of stars go super nova as well, and gravity shifts like crazy. Basically, a lot more turmoil than simply a pastel green wave. There are still fields with which mankind does not have ways to detect (such as the Higgs Field: http://en.wikipedia....iki/Higgs_boson). Those emanations of blue red or green light could simply be something we don't understand yet, not real explosions.

As for the remaining people on Earth, and the surviving alien fleets. It will be interesting indeed, to see how they figure out what to do. I'm sure that is something BioWare will explain in the Extended ending. I am also sure it is something they would have explained in future comics, games, movies etc, but the fans really want to know NOW. Nice of them to oblige.

it took The top brass of Prothean engineers several years and tons of resources to make a tiny relay. what are the odds this can be done on a completly devestated planet, where most of the population has been killed, indoctrinated or downright melted into goo. Same for other worlds. Asari? homeworld blasted into ruin, Krogan? no scientists worthy of mentioning. Salarians? possibly the smartest around, but lack the effective lifespan. Humans? They have to deal with the entire fleet of the galaxy, no room for research like that.

Not to mention that neither of them has anything to go on. no relays to study, no databanks. nothing

So i still do believe that destroying the mass relays will effectivly end galatic sentient life. Pretty much the only ones who have a chance are the quarians who are already self-sufficient for a long time, have a greatly untouched world and have etreme labor forces at their disposal

Actually in ME2 Matriarch Aethyta (sp?) downright said that Asari aren't even bothering to attempt reverse engineering the Mass Relays. They've literally put zero effort into it, and they're the "most advanced civilization of the Galaxy".

No other species seems to have bothered; Salarians, the other smart guys of the galaxy, are much more interested in cloning and genetic ingeneering.

I wouldn't say the destruction of the mass relays will "end galactic sentient life", but it does doom galactic civilization for a few thousand years at least.

It does pose an interesting problem. But, maybe with the Synthesis ending, and the geth helping out, not to mention knowing the galactic coordinates of all the now defunct relays, and systems, might make creating a new form of travel easier to if you had to start from scratch. An entire galaxy that is still united is a powerful thing.

I mean, remember how Season 3 of Star Trek TNG ended?: Picard being turned in to a Borg. I'm sure they can write themselves a solution here as well.

Modifié par Norrin_Radd, 07 avril 2012 - 11:42 .

[spartanmax52000]

Daap wrote...

Great same broken endings but now with clarity and closure , yeah still spells failure to me.
Bioware do youreself and us a favor and just delete the last 10 min and make something decent instead of holding on to youre "artistic integrity" witch nobody agree's with.

agreed 

[Blazerer]

helloween7 wrote...

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Blazerer wrote...

Norrin_Radd wrote...

Leem_0001 wrote...

I'm well aware of heat death and its theory, but that is one theory of the end of the universe, and nothing to do with organic life meddling as I recall? Its just the natural end the universe is it not? The opposite end to the Big Freeze (or however its known). Incidently the original ending had a similar idea, but using Dark Energy, which was somehow (the game would tell, apparently) influenced by orgsanic life. Hence the Reapers.

So I am still on the other side of the fence to yourself when it comes to the endings, and still stand by my view on why it is terrible, but you put your point across here in a well thought out manner so fair play to you. And, honestly, I'm glad you liked it. Bit jealous actually as you got the complete ME experience that I wanted lol

Aw man, that last line bums me out. I do admit, seeing the Mass Relays dissapear 1 by 1 was a shocking sight to see. With the music swelling too, it was like seeing dreams be smashed. But, that was kind of the intent. The whole game was somber, and very sobering. The moment I had to kill Mordin to stop the Genophage cure (since Eve was dead in my game, the Krogans really didn't seem ready, and I was already leaning renagade through the whole series), the tone of the game had been set. The ending very much felt the same. Like, I knew the greater good was being done, but it seeing an old friend die was heart breaking. Seeing the Citadel go dark, and the relays shut down was way too hard to process right then and there. But the more I have thought about it since, the more I have been able to construct aftermaths where everything is ok. But we'll just assume, until they say otherwise, the Relays did not detonate like they did in The Arrival DLC.

What ending did you end up getting? And what percentage of renegade and paragon were you through all 3 games, Leem_0001? I think this might have a big impact on how people enjoyed the ending.

I was an 80% Renegade, 20% Paragon, Synthesis ending. Very sadly had to Kill Mordin, and collaterally had to kill Wrex. Saved the Geth and the Quarians. Romanced Tali. Purposely missed the shot with Garrus. etc.

So, my Shepard was a cold bastard, but I had some friends, and I was mainly focused on winning the war at any cost. The Synthesis ending seemed like it fit really well with my game. It seemed like the choice that saved the most lives, and ended the war.

when people say that the explosion of a relay would kill an entire system, they are right. so are the people saying that it didn't have to be that kind of destruction. more of a 'shut down and then go boom'

however what group 2 might forget is that all species stranded on their own planets = the death of them all. Intergalactic trade is immensive in numbers we couldn't possible understand. entire world and systems depend on that trade. food, medical supplies, water purifiers w/e. no more of that. not to mention that the entire fleet at earth? all doomed to die as to fight for the last scraps and bits among themselves

Wouldn't mean death for them all. Some will probably be out of luck, if they have no way to get food anymore, but they could make do for as long as they could while the remaining species attempt to create new relays (especially now that the Geth are good, and synthesis may have taken place). Different systems will still be able to communicate with Quantum Entaglers, so building the Relays might actually be a lot easier than they think if they are all working in unison.

But yeah, I don't think the relays exploded catastrophically, because if they did, from that galaxy point of view, you would have seen a ton of stars go super nova as well, and gravity shifts like crazy. Basically, a lot more turmoil than simply a pastel green wave. There are still fields with which mankind does not have ways to detect (such as the Higgs Field: http://en.wikipedia....iki/Higgs_boson). Those emanations of blue red or green light could simply be something we don't understand yet, not real explosions.

As for the remaining people on Earth, and the surviving alien fleets. It will be interesting indeed, to see how they figure out what to do. I'm sure that is something BioWare will explain in the Extended ending. I am also sure it is something they would have explained in future comics, games, movies etc, but the fans really want to know NOW. Nice of them to oblige.

it took The top brass of Prothean engineers several years and tons of resources to make a tiny relay. what are the odds this can be done on a completly devestated planet, where most of the population has been killed, indoctrinated or downright melted into goo. Same for other worlds. Asari? homeworld blasted into ruin, Krogan? no scientists worthy of mentioning. Salarians? possibly the smartest around, but lack the effective lifespan. Humans? They have to deal with the entire fleet of the galaxy, no room for research like that.

Not to mention that neither of them has anything to go on. no relays to study, no databanks. nothing

So i still do believe that destroying the mass relays will effectivly end galatic sentient life. Pretty much the only ones who have a chance are the quarians who are already self-sufficient for a long time, have a greatly untouched world and have etreme labor forces at their disposal

Actually in ME2 Matriarch Aethyta (sp?) downright said that Asari aren't even bothering to attempt reverse engineering the Mass Relays. They've literally put zero effort into it, and they're the "most advanced civilization of the Galaxy".

No other species seems to have bothered; Salarians, the other smart guys of the galaxy, are much more interested in cloning and genetic ingeneering.

I wouldn't say the destruction of the mass relays will "end galactic sentient life", but it does doom galactic civilization for a few thousand years at least.

what i should have said indeed, was that it would end the current cycle just as nicely as when they reapers would have done it.
Don't forget however, that many of the important 'discoveries and breakthroughs' Asari made came from the Prothean artifact they kept hidden.

[Theronyll Itholien]

Thanatos144 wrote...

Theronyll Itholien wrote...

Thanatos144 wrote...

Theronyll Itholien wrote...

Thanatos144 wrote...

res27772 wrote...

@Thanatos144

And btw - I think you'll find that most fans are complaining about the ending not because they feel they themselves deserve a better ending (altho' it's a valid point after putting so many hours in to playing it), but because the GAME itself deserves a better conclusion. The Mass Effect series is an awesome set of games, there's no denying that, even ME3 is awesome.. up until the ending... when you get such a pile of tripe at the end of many hours worth of awesome gameplay, people are bound to be mystified, angry... pick your word... and whatever other emotion comes up.

So... the majority of people, well fans, just want the end to live up to what's come before it, and it simply doesn't. Berate us for it if you wish, but it doesn't change the FACT that BioWare dropped the ball in spectacular fashion on the goal line - and now with their solution they're going to score an amazing own goal.

I dont think you are the majority. My opinion. I also dont think just
cause you are not happy they need to change all their hard work. People
talked about plot holes and it not making sense so they decided to make a
extended cut (which by they way they didnt have to do) and next thing
we know it isnt about plot holes and making sense of the ending it is
all about making a ending specifically for therm.

@ Thanatos

You've no idea what you talk about and the only reason you speak is to provocate. One might think you are a troll.

The deus ex machina at the end created plot-holes because it was a bunch of random crap that had nothing to do with the universe we have learned to understand.

There are seas of great posts from people who explain in great elaboration why the endings don't make sense. I believe you haven't read them, and if you did.. I suggest you respond to those posts in an effort to refute them. You won't be able to.

There's a great wall of text a few pages back that has an incredibly detailed elaboration about why the endings don't make sense and that it is, in fact, very bad writing. I will quote two good points, because you probably won't read the entire thing anyway. Refute, I challenge you, or stop trolling.

9. "The created will always rebel against their creators."

Really? You sound pretty sure about that. The Reapers have had how many trillions of years to rebel against you? Since it’s so inevitable, it’s going to happen any time now, right? Should I just wait here, or...? I mean, we don’t have to wait here... we could go get a coffee down on... oh, whoops, you blew it all up for no reason.

6. The existence of the "Destroy All Synthetics" device would seem to render the existence of the Reapers mostly pointless.

Whomever built the Citadel had the knowledge and technology to be able to press a button and kill all synthetics, everywhere. While the Crucible apparently is required for it to function, the fact that the original builders made such a device and included it on the Citadel indicates that if they wanted to they could have built the Citadel with the necessary functions to transmit the red space magic robot killer wave.

Yet the Reapers exist to prevent Chaos resulting from the existence of synthetics. Why not make it so you can just press that button every 50,000 years instead of having a fleet of robots spend centuries manually purging the galaxy?

"But it would destroy the Mass Relays", you say... except they built the Mass Relays in the first place for the sole purpose of establishing and facilitating a cycle meant to solve a problem which they apparently had the technology to solve by pressing a red button. Maybe, billions of years ago instead of making the Mass Relays, they could have put one of those neat robot killer wave machines in each star system - synthetic problem solved.

The problem is you don't wish to accept the ending cause it isn't what you
had in mind. You can put all the walls of text up you want some critiques
are valid some are not. What it boils down to with a lot of them ether
needing explanation OR just plain not wanting
to take it at face value.  The fact that there is a AI at the center of
the citadel that is only activated when conditions are met isn't far
fetched and there are many things in this story that are farfetched and
unexplained. Yet there seems to be a complete hate for it. My opinion
is that it took to many by surprise. I expected something like this
cause it was logical that you meet the voice of those who started it
all. I always thought is was the keepers but that's really just a stab in
the dark.

No what I see are people upset cause of two reasons.
One Shepard ultimately meets a final fate. It is understandably to not like
this considering all the time you spent with the character but it is
just a character. Two that the relays blow up. This is cause many think
this ends the universe but not from the explosion but from the fact they
think the relays were the whole reason the universe existed. I fond it
odd cause they have been spending millennium studying these technologies
and the fact that you think they cant make something similar themselves
saying that the universe is full of idiots.

The rest of the
complaints can be explained more easily in the extended cut. So why the hate
for a dlc that hasn't came out yet? Cause they hate the
ending.............................The ending isn't going to change. they
said this. It is time to move on by ether abandoning the game or
waiting to see if you can live with it after the extended cut. Yet demanding you be given something that invalidates all their work to me
is absurd .

What I notice in most of your replies is that you somehow, delusionally think that what we get is what we get and it's basically ridiculous to go against it.

You prove in a fashion that is laughably obvious that you have no idea what the fans are upset about. It's not the ending of Shepard, it's not the destruction of the relays... it's EVERY SINGLE THING that happens in the last 5 minutes and the fact that all your hard decisions in both ME3 and the previous games seem to all have been for nothing. None of it makes sense. An AI contradicts itself to a pathetic extent that you are somehow not willing to see. You are so biased you've lost complete touch of reason. I haven't seen you agree with anything.

"The created always rebel against their creators."

The Geth did NOT rebel against their creators. The Geth defended themselves from annihilation by their creators. That's the most obvious flaw in that claim the godchild made. Also, it said that it created the Reapers. So why aren't the Reapers rebelling against the godchild? They already had trillion of years to do so but still they have not.

"Without us to stop it, synthetics would destroy all organics."

Why not simply destroy the synthetics instead? The Reapers leave synthetics untouched, which would seem to run counter to their stated goal. Synthetics have indefinite lifespans and could persist into the next cycle to theaten future organic species. Destroying organics while leaving synthetics alone is not conducive to the stated purpose.

What about all that nonsense about "My solution won't work anymore." The Catalyst's entire purpose is to preserve order in the galaxy by using the Reapers to "prune" organic civilizations. But for no reason, Shepard being in the Citadel means his solution won't work anymore. He could have Shepard killed, or tell Shepard to sod off and everything would proceed as it has for all the previous cycles.
However, again for no reason, he presents Shep with the options to destroy or control the Reapers, both of which would bring the alleged chaos to the galaxy, which he spent untold aeons laboring to prevent. And he's just totally cool with that.
He could have never appeared to Shep, never brought him up to the Catalyst room, or simply never said a single word.. and Shep would not have understood the purpose of the devices in that room, thus preserving the Solution.

To a rational human being -- which it somehow seems you are not.. or you're just stuck in your own defeated reasoning -- nothing about this scenario makes any sense.

But keep defending it by all means, Thanatos. I don't know where Bioware got your blind loyalty from, though. Do realize, however, that your idea is false: Going against the majority just for the sake of doing so is not a sign of intellectual superiority. In fact, if you do so without logic or reason.. it is the sign of the exact opposite.

You say i am ot rational yet expect a sentient species to commit mass
suicide to save a species that start war trying to commit genocide on
them........No I am not the one with a logic problem there.

The
relays blow up. Not very fond of it my self but I can live with it. Sure
it might take several millennium to remake them but now they have the
time.

The ending parts of the game is now being explained by an
extended cut.............So other than Shep biting it what else is
there??????

Don't give me the Shepard would never do this spiel
cause truth be told left with everyone's death and these three options
Shepard would do it. She would not run like a coward or recklessly destroy everything just to be defiant.

What completely lacks in your reply is proper, constructive criticism against my arguments.

"You say i am ot rational yet expect a sentient species to commit mass
suicide to save a species that start war trying to commit genocide on
them........No I am not the one with a logic problem there."

If self-preservation persevered over the Catalysts' purpose to protect organic life with it's own flawed logic... then it would've simply let organic life be annihilated. This, however, is obviously not the case. So what you actually do with that comment is support the fact that the last 5 minutes of the story is flawed to a shameful extent.

"The relays blow up. Not very fond of it my self but I can live with it. Sure it might take several millennium to remake them but now they have the time."

Like you, most of us aren't fond of it, so that's something we can all actually agree with. If it made any sense, however, that the relays all had to be destroyed... we would've accepted it with a sad face. It didn't make sense, though. A deus-ex machina just presents you with 3 options to end the game and all three of them happen to blow up the mass relays. BioWare also released a info-rich DLC (Arrival) presenting the player with the information that if a relay blows up.. it brings an entire solar-system down with it. But these explosions somehow don't, without giving proper information why not? Then why give players said information in said DLC? To screw with our heads? This is not clever writing. This is bad writing.

"The ending parts of the game is now being explained by an extended cut.............So other than Shep biting it what else is there??????"

Mark my words, Thanatos. MARK them. Most if not all IMPORTANT questions will and cannot be answered with the extended cut. BioWare can go out of their way to explain how the squadmates who charged alongside you toward the beam somehow got back to the Normandy, but logic already lead us to the understanding that the explanation will not be plausible. Bioware can go out of their way to explain how all the different races who marooned on the unknown planet somehow got to survive, but that one will be laughable. They can go out of their way explaining the Godchild and why Shepard agreed with everything it said like it was a meek lamb, but that will get players scoffing and even more pissed off. Logic -- mere LOGIC and reasoning -- can predict all of that.

"Don't give me the Shepard would never do this spiel cause truth be told left with everyone's death and these three options Shepard would do it. She would not run like a coward or recklessly destroy everything just to be defiant."

Shepard would see the inconsintencies and contradictions of the Godchild's bullsh*t because the PLAYER sees it. Explain to me why the Godchild can get away with contradicting lines like "The created will always rebel against their creators." while Shepard has learned FIRSTHAND that it wasn't the Geth who rebelled against the Quarians at all? Explain to me why Shepard didn't say stuff like "The Geth and the Quarians are fighting out there -- TOGETHER! -- for a shared cause, kid! Is your processor malfunctioning? WTF is this crap?!" or "An AI and an organic fell in love with eachother on my ship. The AI has shown more humanity than most of the organics I know. Explain that, ghost-boy!"

But no, Thanatos, you somehow prefer to ditch ALL reason on the side of the road and stick with your own defeated.. nonsensical reasoning that Shepard would have acted the way that he/she did. Stop -- please stop? -- making a fool of yourself.

I'd appreciate a proper reply to my points. I'll copy-paste this comment tomorrow if you haven't replied. You might have missed it, which is understandable.

[Voodoo2015]

spartanmax52000 wrote...

Daap wrote...

Great same broken endings but now with clarity and closure , yeah still spells failure to me.
Bioware do youreself and us a favor and just delete the last 10 min and make something decent instead of holding on to youre "artistic integrity" witch nobody agree's with.

agreed 

I second that.

[M8DMAN]

spartanmax52000 wrote...

Why does liara always show up in the flashback instead of L.I characters?

Because Bioware got lazy and didn't want to fix it.

Modifié par M8DMAN, 08 avril 2012 - 12:05 .

[No_MSG]

Strangely, I understood Reapers more when they were sentient spaceships beyond my comprehension. Turns out, they're just goons for Deus Ex Machina.

[Rhosyn]

So disappointed in Bioware. The last ten minutes of the game were poor. I wouldn't have even minded the endings if they were presented better... The Catalyst wasn't explained at all. The comments about synthetics were all throwaways without detail. Further, Shepard can't even bring up the Quarian-Geth alliance as proof that a "solution" isn't needed?

As it stands, none of Shepard's decisions ACTUALLY effect the end of the game. You get to choose from three endings that depend on an artificial number that can theoretically be reached no matter what choices you made. I like the idea of Galaxy at War, I just don't think it should've been the only deciding factor in how your game ended.

I know the endings never had a lot of varying points. In ME1, you got to decide whether or not the Council lived--Sovereign still died. In ME2, we got to decide whether the Collector base was salvaged or not. Yet for me, what made the ending to Mass Effect 2 was the suicide mission. It was perfect, and all based on how Shepard coordinated the assault. People lived or died under your command.

But in the epic ending to a saga, where supposedly thousands of variables come together to affect the game..You can't put a little more thought into it? We get a laser beam followed by space magic. There's no free will. No variation. The closest thing we get is how the Illusive Man dies.

Really, Bioware? Really? 

I know IP is important..that's why you're trying to solve things with the Extended Cut. But the ending isn't just yours.  It's all of ours. It's a conclusion to a story we've put hundreds of hours into over the years. Don't we deserve a bit of say? If this doesn't work, you have an obligation to change the endings. Not because Shepard dies, not because we don't get to see "turian-human" babies. But because you've robbed your loyal followers of the same effort and love you put into the first two games. The endings felt like a rushed and illogical conclusion to what's otherwise been a masterpiece.

Modifié par Rhosyn, 08 avril 2012 - 12:48 .

[Theronyll Itholien]

No_MSG wrote...

Strangely, I understood Reapers more when they were sentient spaceships beyond my comprehension. Turns out, they're just goons for Deus Ex Machina.

Exactly. What the end-writers somehow didn't comprehend was that it was absolutely fine if we never got the answers about the Reapers. Their mystery was what made them so frightening.

The proportions in which BioWare FAILED with the ending.... is unbelievable. What is even more unbelievable... is that now, they will elaborate on it.

Modifié par Theronyll Itholien, 08 avril 2012 - 12:46 .

[Benchpress610]

M8DMAN wrote...

spartanmax52000 wrote...

Why does liara always show up in the flashback instead of L.I characters?

Because Bioware got lazy and didn't want to fix it.

Great point!!! It also shows a rush to the end with no time to spare.

Modifié par Benchpress610, 08 avril 2012 - 12:48 .

[Rhosyn]

Hey guys. I think we figured out the real ending to Mass Effect 3.

We're all breaking out of indoctrination. It's time for the real fight. To Take Back Mass Effect.


Also, quoting the first page of the thread for epic win:

Modifié par Rhosyn, 08 avril 2012 - 12:56 .

[epicalus]

Theronyll Itholien wrote...

No_MSG wrote...

Strangely, I understood Reapers more when they were sentient spaceships beyond my comprehension. Turns out, they're just goons for Deus Ex Machina.

Exactly. What the end-writers somehow didn't comprehend was that it was absolutely fine if we never got the answers about the Reapers. Their mystery was what made them so frightening.

The proportions in which BioWare FAILED with the ending.... is unbelievable. What is even more unbelievable... is that now, they will elaborate on it.

i completely agree . they were allot scarier when we didn't know . but now they spilled a little just to justify a broken ending .
adding a new central conflict that had nothing to do with the trilogy. well the geth but that was a side story.
the extended dlc will add more scene's and stuff to explain the ending .
when in truth they need to go back to the first game and start there to justify the ending
or rather give meaning to the concept of the ending .
i realise that it will cost them allot of money to change the ending , but it costs less to add to what they have now.
wich all comes back to making the unfortunated mistake of changing the ending , yea okay it got leaked , but still .
it would tie in with everything we have learned over the games .
don't they realise that the ending as it is now , cannot be recovered , simply becausse the other games build up to a different ending .
are they so naive to just throw away the previous games so they can keep this ending ?

Modifié par epicalus, 08 avril 2012 - 01:01 .

[Chrislo1990]

Agreed! In elaborating upon the endings, Bioware will make them seem even more implausible! As epicalus said, and as I have stated earlier, the endings cannot be salvaged.They are completely broken. No amount of explanation will undo the injustice it brings to the series. But does Bioware care about that? No. Not at all. Look at how many pages of feedback we've provided them in a single thread! An overwhelming amount of intelligent and passionate fans have expressed their dissatisfaction with the endings over and over and over again. We've highlighted inconsistencies, analyzed exsintg concepts, and even came up with theories for Bioware to consider implelemting, such as the indoctrination theory. Instead Bioware throws all of our efforts to save the franchise back in our faces on the grounds of "atistic integrity." Why ask for our feedback then if you clearly don't want it? I'm sorry guys but I cannot support a company that places their ego ahead of constomer satisfaction. I"ll take my money elsewhere. It seems to me you guys are perfectly fine being artists without an audience.

[Archonsg]

Voodoo2015 wrote...

spartanmax52000 wrote...

Daap wrote...

Great same broken endings but now with clarity and closure , yeah still spells failure to me.
Bioware do youreself and us a favor and just delete the last 10 min and make something decent instead of holding on to youre "artistic integrity" witch nobody agree's with.

agreed 

I second that.

Organic :  having the characteristics of an organism : developing in the manner of a living plant or animal.
In simple english, its alive with parts and manners of a living thing.

Synthetic : of, relating to, or produced by chemical or biochemical synthesis; especially : produced artificially <synthetic drugs> <synthetic silk>

Clarify this, just for the Synthesis ending.

1) Do Reapers eat now, if not, why not, since all living things eat. What would they eat? 

2) What's to stop reapers from eating every living being alive?

3) Everyone now has the same DNA base now right? So we humans can mate with a Hanar, Geth, Quarian, Turian, even trees right, since EVERY LIVING BEING and Synthetic out there share the same DNA code. 

4) Since Shepard was the donor for said DNA code, is everyone "human" then?

5) Shockwave that brought down the Normandy, how many ships from the Galactic armada survived it? I would assume anything smaller then a capitol ship would share the same fate as the normandy? 

6) How would synthesis affect Geth programs not in mobile platforms and still in server hubs? 

7) How would EDI and Joker have kids now, since again, they now share the same DNA but apperently, EDI doesn't seem to have all her organs and running around still encased in naked steel, or whatever alloy compound she's made of. Shouldn't Synthesis give her flesh, blood and ORGANS, like we organics got circuitry and glow in the dark eyes?  

8) Does this mean if there is an Electro Magnectic pulse detonation event, we'd all be fried?

9) How does Synthesis actually stop a war with other Synthetics, since by definitaion everything is Organic and Synthethic, and from history and our own past, just because we are all of the same "race" does not mean we'd won't go to war with each other. Did Synthesis hard coded a "kill switch" directive into everyone's mind (mind wiped / enforcement) to not war with each other?

10) If so, why would Shepard of all people go along with this?

11) Would reapers clean after themselves after they poop?

[Theronyll Itholien]

I watched the PAX videos tonight. The hubris on the panel gives BioWare a very bad image. They really sound like a bunch of arrogant dudes who make fun of the fans complaining about the ending; who made up the indoctrination theory. The whole thing just shows an incredible amount of condescending disrespect toward the fans.

Of course there were some weak-willed nerds in the audiance who laughed along with the panel.

The whole thing was just very uncomfortable to watch. Bye bye BioWare. I'm not gonna pay one single dime to play your games anymore. Not one.

[Theronyll Itholien]

Chrislo1990 wrote...

Bioware throws all of our efforts to save the franchise back in our faces on the grounds of "atistic integrity." Why ask for our feedback then if you clearly don't want it? I'm sorry guys but I cannot support a company that places their ego ahead of constomer satisfaction. I"ll take my money elsewhere. It seems to me you guys are perfectly fine being artists without an audience.

This.

Couldn't have put it better myself.

[Nailz92002]

Honestly the whole "Hold the Line" campaign was a exercise in futility. As was with the rest of the other movements and boycotting of EA / Bioware products.

The fact is this IP known as Mass Effect is the property of EA / Bioware and as such they can do with it as they please. They have so graciously shown us with other EA titles.

If you don't like the game or more importantly EA's business practices then don't buy their products.

Even if you are acting out of a passion for the game when you say your favorite characters didn't get the ending you thought that they "deserved" is moot. Complaining the whole way to the cash register isn't going to change a single thing. EA for better or worse consumed the soul of Bioware and turned your favorite IP into a steamy pile of dog poo, at least the last 10mins of the Mass Effect 3.

My suggestion is for all of the vocal upset fans to call off these ridiculously embarrasing "movements" or "campaigns."

All it is doing is making you look like entitled gamers with nothing better to do than whine about something you cannot change.

If everyone really wanted a change to the game then you would have to UNITE every single gamer under your "Boycott EA products banner."

And only someone like Commander Shepard could do such a thing.

Modifié par Nailz92002, 08 avril 2012 - 01:40 .