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On the Mass Effect 3 endings. Yes, we are listening.


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#15876
Daramatis

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jeweledleah wrote...

Daramatis wrote...

Hi Jeweledleah.

Thanks for the info.  Ultimately Bioware didn't have to add Kaidan as a gay love interest at all, as you say, it was a very small group who would be affected by this so no real pressure existed.  I can't comment on the Ashley side of thing, but I don't really care if it was a cut-down version of the femshep romance, it was there and deeply affected me as a player on a personal level.  I will always respect Bioware for adding this no matter what; because it affected a minority and because of the respectful way they treated the subject.

I don't want to get involved in the endings debate (beyond trying to get an ending that I should already be able to get - Shepard Lives) as many other posters are doing a great job of vocalising things; I was just wanting to answer the original question from 600-odd pages back.  :) 

Eryri - thanks for your posting, sounds like a well deserved ending to me, though I imagine a scene where they are walking along a beach and Shepard stops to pick up a shell, keeping it in memory or Morden.  :)


I will not go into detail on how I feel about that character change (but I do NOT share your feelings, to say the least)

I brought it up becasue we have similar situations here where a group of fans is asking for something of bioware.  and in one case - they give one group of fans, much MUCH smaller group, what they want, while in the other case - more options for the endings, something that's being requested by a MUCH MUCH larger group of fans - they refuse to budge.

 they give people Garrus and Tali to romance.  they permeate the game with so much fan service, you can play a drinking game with all the references and nods.  they make changes that are direct result of fan requests.  many of those changes were done - in later stages of production  (for example - Ashley's armor).  but they don't budge here.

and I have a strong suspicion that its not becasue its a teams artistic integrity.  its because its Mac Walter's and Casey Hudson's pride.



Hi Jeweledleah

I sense a deep rooted anger in your replies and also that this could easily degenerate - you've already hijacked my original post (what did you enjoy?) to link it to your strong feelings about the ending, completely irrelevant to what I was saying, in my humble opinion.  I think there is a Reaper-filled galaxy of a difference between the implementation of a gay Kaidan and changing the endings, but I accept you'll disagree with that no matter what I say, as is your entitlement.  

You don't like Kaidan being gay?  Don't play that option.  He is still available to female Shepards so I don't see what the problem is?  Well, I can hazard a guess, but I'm certainly not touching that with a 10 foot pole!

I never actually asked you about your feelings on the matter at any rate; to be frank, I don't really want to know - I wasn't asking for approval of my views, or orientation, just answering the original post.  Yup, sure, making a post will open it up to being answered pro and con, but I wanted to make a positive contribution to the forums, not be swept along in the wave of negative feedback about one aspect of the game.

For me, when playing a game, reading a book, watching a tv series, ultimately the journey is far more important than the destination, which in ME3 is probably just as well.  I'm still deeply passionate about the journey if not the destination, and I will take away golden memories of strong, vivid "living" characters, fantastic, witty, poignant dialogue voiced with care and soul, and amazing, subtle animation.

Take from it what you will, that's your choice.

That's the last word I'll utter on this.

#15877
Changer the Elder

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jeweledleah wrote...

you exist becasue we allow it and you will end becasue we demand it - implies their whim, their choice.

the cucle cannot be broken, implies that they don't have a will, they must continue, regardless of the situation. one is an inscrutable enemy, the other is. pawn? yeah...


Not necessarily. Both quotes can also mean they truly believe they are doing the right thing for the sake of the greater good (just as saving a thousand over two people, it's equal to say that preserving evolution and life as a whole is of higher importance than preserving individual species).

When people go culling a sick herd, they also don't dispute with the said herd members (some of which might even be immune or unstruck by the sickness) whether they want to die or not. And not just because of the language barrier.

#15878
LiarasShield

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and like I've mentioned I have like 5 to 10 vids link that will explain everything why this ending was not that good and no you war assets don't matter do you see them in the final battle do you know what occurs to the races you brought together hell no you don't right and no the assets you don't see them on the battlefield right now do you thee extended could fix some of these which I hope they do but now for the several links for you people who think the ending is ok if you still think the ending was ok after looking at these videos then I will leave it alone



 




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E[/quote]
[/quote]

Well lets hope thee extended does do something if not it will be another head ache[/quote]

I will keep posting those links so that alot of you on the otherside who only think were upset about shepard dieing will understand that we are alot more upset then just that and it will also explain the many plotholes and the reasons why the ending in and of its self should be changed and 10 posts ago why not give the people who want a different ending a different ending and keep the original ending for those who like it instead of having all sides be at war at each other and everybody could win instead of everyone losing or be pissed off at one another [/quote]

I just hope that even if they were rushed or whatever I just hope in the end all of the fans can get a decent ending and that our choices and war assets matter please for the love of god and any other religious figure that exists is that really too much to ask for.....


I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever
[/quote]


The god kid was kinda a no not really I mean a final confrontation with harbinger even if not a boss battle would have been more preferable

#15879
LittleBlueChildrenNow

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There must be something else we can do than keep posting on forums. I mean something that can really change things.. Collect signatures... I don't know.

And for those who keep saying they like the ending... I'm only going to repeat this: the more you played ME, the more you hate the ending.

#15880
Changer the Elder

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dea_ex_machina wrote...

But there have been no hints on this plot-driving, important character whatsoever. It's only logical people would bring it into question.


I think there were many hints. On numerous occassions throughout the game, it's implied that the Reapers might not be the ones in charge, that there might be something above them, whether it being a cause or an actual person. Whether it's the dialogues about Reapers' purpose and origin from ME1 to Victory's evolution/Crucible recap on the Cronos station, it had been there. Just not... corporeal.

#15881
Changer the Elder

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LittleBlueChildrenNow wrote...
And for those who keep saying they like the ending... I'm only going to repeat this: the more you played ME, the more you hate the ending.


I'm not sure I'm willing to count that as an argument, since it crosses a bit too uncomfortably into the "real-fans-hate-the-ending" territory for my tastes. But I personally have played ME1 twice, ME2 once + favorite missions again, ME3 twice and a half. I've read Evolution and Redemption. I've seen hours (literally) of gamecontent on youtube from playthroughs I've been locked out of by my choices.

And yet, I still like the Catalyst concept.

So, if I may ask, how many playthroughs and background lore is enough for "the more you played"?

#15882
Caprea

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Changer the Elder wrote...

dea_ex_machina wrote...

But there have been no hints on this plot-driving, important character whatsoever. It's only logical people would bring it into question.


I think there were many hints. On numerous occassions throughout the game, it's implied that the Reapers might not be the ones in charge, that there might be something above them, whether it being a cause or an actual person. Whether it's the dialogues about Reapers' purpose and origin from ME1 to Victory's evolution/Crucible recap on the Cronos station, it had been there. Just not... corporeal.

Then me and pretty much the majority of players who took the ending at face value and didn't like the inconsistencies there, must've missed it. Can you give examples? Please, enlighten me.

#15883
LiarasShield

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[quote]LiarasShield wrote...





and like I've mentioned I have like 5 to 10 vids link that will explain everything why this ending was not that good and no you war assets don't matter do you see them in the final battle do you know what occurs to the races you brought together hell no you don't right and no the assets you don't see them on the battlefield right now do you thee extended could fix some of these which I hope they do but now for the several links for you people who think the ending is ok if you still think the ending was ok after looking at these videos then I will leave it alone



 




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E[/quote]
[/quote]

Well lets hope thee extended does do something if not it will be another head ache[/quote]

I will keep posting those links so that alot of you on the otherside who only think were upset about shepard dieing will understand that we are alot more upset then just that and it will also explain the many plotholes and the reasons why the ending in and of its self should be changed and 10 posts ago why not give the people who want a different ending a different ending and keep the original ending for those who like it instead of having all sides be at war at each other and everybody could win instead of everyone losing or be pissed off at one another [/quote]

I just hope that even if they were rushed or whatever I just hope in the end all of the fans can get a decent ending and that our choices and war assets matter please for the love of god and any other religious figure that exists is that really too much to ask for.....


I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever
[/quote]


The god kid was kinda a no not really I mean a final confrontation with harbinger even if not a boss battle would have been more preferable
[/quote]

Well it would been cool if harbinger was truelly the leader instead of the god child that we only saw in the last 5 minutes and the circular logic about how he made synthetic reapers to destroy organics from making other synthetics and destroying or preserving them so that they all wouldn't be killed by synthetics is a bit on the nonsense side but if the character was introduced earlyer and was done well maybe It would be less upsetting

#15884
Caprea

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Changer the Elder wrote...

dea_ex_machina wrote...

But there have been no hints on this plot-driving, important character whatsoever. It's only logical people would bring it into question.


I think there were many hints. On numerous occassions throughout the game, it's implied that the Reapers might not be the ones in charge, that there might be something above them, whether it being a cause or an actual person. Whether it's the dialogues about Reapers' purpose and origin from ME1 to Victory's evolution/Crucible recap on the Cronos station, it had been there. Just not... corporeal.

Then me and pretty much the majority of players who took the ending at face value and didn't like the inconsistencies there, must've missed it. Can you give examples? Please, enlighten me. Because the way you put it, it sounds rather... vague.

Edit: Oops, double post. Feel free to ignore.

Modifié par dea_ex_machina, 09 avril 2012 - 06:45 .


#15885
DJCaptainPicard

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Lordambitious wrote...

 Image IPB



Yup, BioWare really was indoctrinated (not Indoctrination Theory):

http://indoctrinatio...octrinated.html

#15886
Luzarius

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Bioware,

Don't hold back on the Extended Cut DLC. Give us as much information as possible. Even in the form of Codex.

DO NOT HOLD BACK. Give us as much information as you can in the upcoming Extended Cut Ending DLC.

Luzarius
www.twitch.tv/luzarius
"no death ruleset"

Modifié par Luzarius, 09 avril 2012 - 06:49 .


#15887
LiarasShield

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and like I've mentioned I have like 5 to 10 vids link that will explain everything why this ending was not that good and no you war assets don't matter do you see them in the final battle do you know what occurs to the races you brought together hell no you don't right and no the assets you don't see them on the battlefield right now do you thee extended could fix some of these which I hope they do but now for the several links for you people who think the ending is ok if you still think the ending was ok after looking at these videos then I will leave it alone



 




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E[/quote]
[/quote]

Well lets hope thee extended does do something if not it will be another head ache[/quote]

I will keep posting those links so that alot of you on the otherside who only think were upset about shepard dieing will understand that we are alot more upset then just that and it will also explain the many plotholes and the reasons why the ending in and of its self should be changed and 10 posts ago why not give the people who want a different ending a different ending and keep the original ending for those who like it instead of having all sides be at war at each other and everybody could win instead of everyone losing or be pissed off at one another [/quote]

I just hope that even if they were rushed or whatever I just hope in the end all of the fans can get a decent ending and that our choices and war assets matter please for the love of god and any other religious figure that exists is that really too much to ask for.....


I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever
[/quote]


The god kid was kinda a no not really I mean a final confrontation with harbinger even if not a boss battle would have been more preferable
[/quote]

Well it would been cool if harbinger was truelly the leader instead of the god child that we only saw in the last 5 minutes and the circular logic about how he made synthetic reapers to destroy organics from making other synthetics and destroying or preserving them so that they all wouldn't be killed by synthetics is a bit on the nonsense side but if the character was introduced earlyer and was done well maybe It would be less upsetting
[/quote]

nope after playing all the way through and those are you only choices how can you feel like a hero lol

#15888
EugeneBi

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Lordambitious wrote...

Chrislo1990 wrote...

Lordambitious wrote...

 Image IPB

Haha nice LordAmbitious.

Also I've been thinking. How much money will EA actually spend on making the Extended Cut DLC? They won't be making a profit out of it. As such will the extended cut dlc be of good quality? I said of good quality becaue I don't want the extended cut in the first place! I want new endings that actually made sense!


EA doesn't want to cave to pressure, because that would set the precedent that what fans want matter, and would involve them admitting they screwed up on the ending. However, the 80 thousand raised for sick kids and the 1000 raised for cupcakes makes the fans look awesome in the media, and EA looks like:devil: for refusing to do anything. So they release the "extended cut" DLC. The Media reports that EA is giving fans what they want (Even though it's just polishing a turd, and not what we asked for) and when fans point this out, EA can just respond with "We gave you what you wanted!" and then every news story will paint us as whiners and probably include quotes from Thanatos as a false equivalency saying "even the fans are divided on the ending" even though he's just one troll on the forum.




This.

And a couple of more points to this.
  • They did get fans divided: some of posters here were genuinely dissatisfied with ending shortness and will be quite happy with DLC whatever it is.
  • They get a break. Many people got hope and are now silenced for a while. By the time DLC is out some of unsatisfied crowd will move on, especially if some other game launches by that time. I.e. whatever DLC is going to be they got some pressure relief.


#15889
LiarasShield

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Fight like a krogan run like a leapard you'll never beat Commander Shepard

#15890
Holger1405

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LiarasShield wrote...

this I think we can all agree on? that if this doesn't get resolved one way or another we will be fighting each other forever?



I don't fight you, and hope I didn't came across that way. I simply voice my opinion. And
I surely hope that the DLC satisfies as many People as possible.  

Modifié par Holger1405, 09 avril 2012 - 06:57 .


#15891
LiarasShield

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and like I've mentioned I have like 5 to 10 vids link that will explain everything why this ending was not that good and no you war assets don't matter do you see them in the final battle do you know what occurs to the races you brought together hell no you don't right and no the assets you don't see them on the battlefield right now do you thee extended could fix some of these which I hope they do but now for the several links for you people who think the ending is ok if you still think the ending was ok after looking at these videos then I will leave it alone



 




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E[/quote]
[/quote]

Well lets hope thee extended does do something if not it will be another head ache[/quote]

I will keep posting those links so that alot of you on the otherside who only think were upset about shepard dieing will understand that we are alot more upset then just that and it will also explain the many plotholes and the reasons why the ending in and of its self should be changed and 10 posts ago why not give the people who want a different ending a different ending and keep the original ending for those who like it instead of having all sides be at war at each other and everybody could win instead of everyone losing or be pissed off at one another [/quote]

I just hope that even if they were rushed or whatever I just hope in the end all of the fans can get a decent ending and that our choices and war assets matter please for the love of god and any other religious figure that exists is that really too much to ask for.....


I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever
[/quote]


The god kid was kinda a no not really I mean a final confrontation with harbinger even if not a boss battle would have been more preferable
[/quote]

Well it would been cool if harbinger was truelly the leader instead of the god child that we only saw in the last 5 minutes and the circular logic about how he made synthetic reapers to destroy organics from making other synthetics and destroying or preserving them so that they all wouldn't be killed by synthetics is a bit on the nonsense side but if the character was introduced earlyer and was done well maybe It would be less upsetting
[/quote]

nope after playing all the way through and those are you only choices how can you feel like a hero lol[/quote]

What if some of the major or harcore fans don't move on then  what lol though we do have some hope for extended?

#15892
Esorevik

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PS: I know this might be hard, Bioware, but try to keep as unique and independent as possible from EA...keep thinking on your Mission and Vision, even if you are not an independent studio. Your fans will appreciate it and if EA let's you, fans will like EA a tiny bit more

#15893
EugeneBi

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LiarasShield wrote...


*snip*

I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever

*snip*


Hmm... release game editor - like Bethesda? The community really saved Oblivion by simply fixing all the glaring issues.

#15894
Jassu1979

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Changer the Elder wrote...

I doubt they are just henchmen following Catalyst's orders. No one knows how exactly do they work or think, but Harbinger and Sovereign both are way more than that. They know exactly what they're doing and why, regardless whether they know for whom.

"We have no beginning. We have no end. We are infinite. Rudimentary creatures of blood and flesh. You touch my mind, fumbling in ignorance. Incapable of understanding. There is a realm of existence so far beyond your own you can't even imagine it.  I am beyond your comprehension."

"We impose order on the chaos of organic evolution. The Cycle cannot be broken."

"You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it."

That was waaaaay back on Virmire. So it's not like the whole "Catalyst and its logic" was a plot thrown in at the end of production when they ran out of time.


Do you honestly feel that these lines actually help to validate the Star Child and its lackluster rationale?
I'd say that the very opposite is the case: none of this lines up with the Star Child's argument, and the only thing they have in common is their reference to the cycle and imposing order.

Without the ending, all three Mass Effect games paint the Reapers as Lovecraftian tentacle horrors from Dark Space, who can turn people into insane slaves even in death, appear godlike to minions and enemies alike and consume whole civilizations when they wake up.
They deliberately leave the mass relays and the citadel behind to cultivate the cultural evolution of space-faring civilizations in a certain direction, right until they're "ripe" for the harvest.

None of this matches up with what the Star Child says. It doesn't make sense to establish a 50,000 year cycle to keep synthetics from wiping out all organic life. It doesn't make sense to hand superior technology to organics, advancing them to a technological level that makes the creation of murderous AI all the more likely. It doesn't make sense for the creator of the Reapers to be the Citadel (or live in the Citadel), because the space station in itself was created as a trap by the Reapers, luring organic civilizations into using it as a political hub.

#15895
Dead_Meat357

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Changer the Elder wrote...

dea_ex_machina wrote...

But there have been no hints on this plot-driving, important character whatsoever. It's only logical people would bring it into question.


I think there were many hints. On numerous occassions throughout the game, it's implied that the Reapers might not be the ones in charge, that there might be something above them, whether it being a cause or an actual person. Whether it's the dialogues about Reapers' purpose and origin from ME1 to Victory's evolution/Crucible recap on the Cronos station, it had been there. Just not... corporeal.


The Catalyst is a horrible idea because it goes against what we've learned about the Reapers earlier. It suggests they are not sentient at all. If they are just puppets which are forced to respond to the wishes of the Starchild or Shepard using the crucibal, then how are they sentient? Why are they compelled to do anything outside their own wishes if they are sentient? They don't seem to be rebelling against their creator(s)? Something the Catalyst states is inevitable for all AI/Machines. So it's inevitable and a huge problem, but not with the Reapers? That statement is contradictory as hell. Look, either the damned things are sentient or they are not. The conversations with Sovereign, Harbinger, and the Reaper on Rannoch all point to them being perfectly self-aware. Part of being self-aware is making your own choices and determining your own paths. Something the Catalyst goes against entirely. 

The idea of the Catalyst is offensive for a number of other reasons. This belittles the Geth. If the Reapers aren't truly sentient, then how did Reaper code upgrades make the Geth anything more than they were? The Geth also chose not to destroy their creators during their first war. If you broker peace between the Quarians and the Geth, then again you go against the very idea that organics and synthetics have to fight. So again the Catalyst's statements and assertions look like total nonsense. 

The only fix for this is to nix the entire Catalyst / Crucibal plot. It doesn't fit with the lore of the universe or the themes of the games. It contradicts them in a harsh and abrasive way. Personally I think that the Reapers should have been handled more like the Geth in which there are diametrically opposed factions. I think it would have been cool for a single Reaper, or a faction of them to have been introduced, offering to help the humans in their fight. If they are sentient, why do they all agree with this cycle? (Another plot hole.) This Reaper or many of them could have told the other races how to defeat the Reapers or provided the means to do it. Then we could have solved the problem more like in ME1 where we just saw a massive battle in which the Reapers were defeated the old fashioned way without some magic device.

I would have loved to have seen a story arc in which you recruited a Reaper much like Shepard recruits the rest of the team mates. A loyalty mission to foster trust and the Reaper reciprocating with the information Shepard needs. If done right this Reaper could have been a huge war asset whcih could have helped the allied forces in their fight. It would have given them a real chance, not this hail marry garbage with an unknown alien device and a stupid god child AI.  Or maybe, we could have uploaded Legion into a Reaper body, given their similar nature and Legion could have told us how to defeat them.  Basically using the same basic idea above.

#15896
Changer the Elder

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dea_ex_machina wrote...

Then me and pretty much the majority of players who took the ending at face value and didn't like the inconsistencies there, must've missed it. Can you give examples? Please, enlighten me. Because the way you put it, it sounds rather... vague.


I'm digging through the files for Victory's (or Vendetta's, I can never tell which one's which) quotes from the Cronos station.It's either on Thessia, or on Cronos station, now I'm not entirely sure. But I'll post it here as soon as I'm successful.
I'll also try to dig for the others, but it's going to take some time, I don't have audio extracted from the other two games and my memory's not fresh enough to know where it comes from.

#15897
jeweledleah

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Daramatis wrote...

Hi Jeweledleah

I sense a deep rooted anger in your replies and also that this could easily degenerate - you've already hijacked my original post (what did you enjoy?) to link it to your strong feelings about the ending, completely irrelevant to what I was saying, in my humble opinion.  I think there is a Reaper-filled galaxy of a difference between the implementation of a gay Kaidan and changing the endings, but I accept you'll disagree with that no matter what I say, as is your entitlement.  

You don't like Kaidan being gay?  Don't play that option.  He is still available to female Shepards so I don't see what the problem is?  Well, I can hazard a guess, but I'm certainly not touching that with a 10 foot pole!

I never actually asked you about your feelings on the matter at any rate; to be frank, I don't really want to know - I wasn't asking for approval of my views, or orientation, just answering the original post.  Yup, sure, making a post will open it up to being answered pro and con, but I wanted to make a positive contribution to the forums, not be swept along in the wave of negative feedback about one aspect of the game.

For me, when playing a game, reading a book, watching a tv series, ultimately the journey is far more important than the destination, which in ME3 is probably just as well.  I'm still deeply passionate about the journey if not the destination, and I will take away golden memories of strong, vivid "living" characters, fantastic, witty, poignant dialogue voiced with care and soul, and amazing, subtle animation.

Take from it what you will, that's your choice.

That's the last word I'll utter on this.


well, I can imagine what sort of assumptions you are making, and I can tell you upfront that most if not all of them are wrong. (and incidentaly, I said nothing bout YOUR orientation, only about the change to that of a single specific character, particularely WHY it was changed - as that particular CHANGe was actualy relevant to the main conversation at hand.  you know Bioware making some core changes for smaller group of fans and at the same time - not budging on making aditions, not even changes - aditional options, for much larger group of fans)

that said - pay attention to the title of this thread "On Mass Effect 3 endings".  Journey is important.  but so is the destination of that journey.  and its much easier to deal with small annoyances along the way when destination is worth it.

its much harder to look back on the journey fondly, when destination sucks. even harder to enjoy taking that journey all over again, KNOWING that no matter what steps or detours you'll take, it will end exactly the same way. but I'll let someone far more qualified then me explain why. http://www.ted.com/t..._vs_memory.html

Modifié par jeweledleah, 09 avril 2012 - 07:12 .


#15898
Changer the Elder

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Edit: I'm in a bit of a rush here now, so I apologize beforehand if my short-cut answers sound strange or let alone dismissive in any way. I just need to conserve time as much as possible at the moment, so I tried to keep it short.

Dead_Meat357 wrote...
The Catalyst is a horrible idea because it goes against what we've learned about the Reapers earlier. It suggests they are not sentient at all. If they are just puppets which are forced to respond to the wishes of the Starchild or Shepard using the crucibal, then how are they sentient?

How does the ending say Reapers are not sentient?

The idea of the Catalyst is offensive for a number of other reasons. This belittles the Geth. If the Reapers aren't truly sentient, then how did Reaper code upgrades make the Geth anything more than they were?

Dtto the above question. Plus, I believe Legion answered the "how" part for me in the game itself.

The only fix for this is to nix the entire Catalyst / Crucibal plot. It doesn't fit with the lore of the universe or the themes of the games. It contradicts them in a harsh and abrasive way.

As stated before, that is a matter of opinions. To you, it doesn't fit. To many people, it does.

I think it would have been cool for a single Reaper, or a faction of them to have been introduced, offering to help the humans in their fight. If they are sentient, why do they all agree with this cycle? (Another plot hole.)

Nobody says they do. Might even be a reason why Protheans couldn't be converted into a Reaper. With their mentality, they'd be a powderkeg.

This Reaper or many of them could have told the other races how to defeat the Reapers or provided the means to do it. Then we could have solved the problem more like in ME1 where we just saw a massive battle in which the Reapers were defeated the old fashioned way without some magic device.

It took one whole giant fleet to take down one sole Reaper, only after it's been weakened by a temporary shield-hole. And it still took large part of the fleet down with it. The combined force of the whole galaxy doesn't have enough resources to stop about four hundred of those things.

Or maybe, we could have uploaded Legion into a Reaper body, given their similar nature and Legion could have told us how to defeat them.  Basically using the same basic idea above.

Considering "We are each a nation", I doubt Legion has sufficient hardware to store a Reaper consciousness. I doubt anything but a Reaper has. But yeah, I admit, having a defected Reaper as a war asset might be interesting.

Modifié par Changer the Elder, 09 avril 2012 - 07:11 .


#15899
LittleBlueChildrenNow

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Changer the Elder wrote...

LittleBlueChildrenNow wrote...
And for those who keep saying they like the ending... I'm only going to repeat this: the more you played ME, the more you hate the ending.


I'm not sure I'm willing to count that as an argument, since it crosses a bit too uncomfortably into the "real-fans-hate-the-ending" territory for my tastes. But I personally have played ME1 twice, ME2 once + favorite missions again, ME3 twice and a half. I've read Evolution and Redemption. I've seen hours (literally) of gamecontent on youtube from playthroughs I've been locked out of by my choices.

And yet, I still like the Catalyst concept.

So, if I may ask, how many playthroughs and background lore is enough for "the more you played"?


I'm not discussing who played ME more, but in many cases, a lot of people comenting in Youtube, forums, etc when I read their comments explaining why they like the ending it just like... "Ok... Do you really played the same game as me?"

BTW, I have no problem with the Catalyst. My first problem is that I loved ME a lot, and now the only thing I want is to forget about it. Why? Because I have no desire of playing the 3 games again, because no matter what choices I make or how much I become involved with the story, the ending is still the same.  So yes, the 3 games are really good but with that ending,  the essence of the games is lost.

First,  I was impressed with the ending. The Catalyst, the Citadel, TIM. It was like WOW! But then it came that "thing": the Normandy leaving Earth. Really? Do you think I'm going to believe that the same people who swear to be with me til the end is just leaving me behind? No.  I started another playthrough and I'm looking more in detail to the conversations and everything.... There is no way they leave Earth without fighting until death. No way.

In addition, when you think about the ending it seems like Bioware and EA runned out of time and came up with that ending in 2 days.

The ending does not do justice to the ME trilogy. It's poor writing, unless ****** is true, which in that case the ending is brilliant and amazing!

#15900
LiarasShield

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and like I've mentioned I have like 5 to 10 vids link that will explain everything why this ending was not that good and no you war assets don't matter do you see them in the final battle do you know what occurs to the races you brought together hell no you don't right and no the assets you don't see them on the battlefield right now do you thee extended could fix some of these which I hope they do but now for the several links for you people who think the ending is ok if you still think the ending was ok after looking at these videos then I will leave it alone



 




http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M0Cf864P7E[/quote]
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Well lets hope thee extended does do something if not it will be another head ache[/quote]

I will keep posting those links so that alot of you on the otherside who only think were upset about shepard dieing will understand that we are alot more upset then just that and it will also explain the many plotholes and the reasons why the ending in and of its self should be changed and 10 posts ago why not give the people who want a different ending a different ending and keep the original ending for those who like it instead of having all sides be at war at each other and everybody could win instead of everyone losing or be pissed off at one another [/quote]

I just hope that even if they were rushed or whatever I just hope in the end all of the fans can get a decent ending and that our choices and war assets matter please for the love of god and any other religious figure that exists is that really too much to ask for.....


I just wish they could figure a way to satisfie the people who hated the ending for decent valid reasons and give them a option a getting a newer or better ending while keep the core 3 endings for the fans that liked them so everybody could win and we could stop fighting each other once and for all otherwise we will be at each others throat forever
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The god kid was kinda a no not really I mean a final confrontation with harbinger even if not a boss battle would have been more preferable
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Well it would been cool if harbinger was truelly the leader instead of the god child that we only saw in the last 5 minutes and the circular logic about how he made synthetic reapers to destroy organics from making other synthetics and destroying or preserving them so that they all wouldn't be killed by synthetics is a bit on the nonsense side but if the character was introduced earlyer and was done well maybe It would be less upsetting
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nope after playing all the way through and those are you only choices how can you feel like a hero lol[/quote]

What if some of the major or harcore fans don't move on then  what lol though we do have some hope for extended?
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brings another point about starchild who whole point about how the created will always rebel against their creators if that was the case how could we bring peace between the geth and quarians if that was correct why didn't the reapers repel against him in the first place and for the whole reapers are only the starchilds puppets don't make sense because harbinger and soverign both have sentient minds and seem to have their own motivations for doing what they personally want so yes the starchild loses more points and makes less sense