23455 réponses à ce sujet

[Thanatos144]

darkway1 wrote...

Thanatos144 wrote...

AmstradHero wrote...

Netherspin wrote...

Following this topic for a few days has brought me to a realization.
While there are indeed a few whose main problem with the ending are the logic iregularities such as character placement (Crew being in London when Normandy returns to Sword, then suddently on Normandy when it abandons Sword - Anderson somehow getting ahead of Shepard even thou he says he enters the beam after Shepard) - and some are upset that their choices didn't matter at all in regards to the ending, even thou that would be an asbolute first for a Mass Effect or even Bioware game.
What the vast majority of the players here want is a neat glittering silk bow of an ending where the reapers suddently die and everybody else lives happily ever after.

Stop right there. This is where you are categorically and unequivocally wrong.

That you're stating this as though it is fact is disrespectful to all the people raising problems with the ending. Not everyone wants a happy ending. Many people expected Shepard to die. They just expected that death to happen in a meaningful fashion that was logical and thematically consistent with the rest of the game, and not through an arbitrary deus ex machina space child using space magic. I will accept that some people would like a happy ending, but the fact that the ending isn't "happy" (though if you actually believe the logic of the space child, synthesis is actually a fairly happy ending, but I digress), it's that it doesn't fit with the rest of the series.

The ending is preposterous. It's derivative of science fiction filled with philosophical questions about the "unimportant of the individual" and "the effect of technology on the self". It's ripping themes and a philosophical mindset from things like Deus Ex, Battlestar Galatica, Inception, Stargate SG-1, 2001: A Space Odyssey (among others) and attaching them with duct tape to an epic war story.

Simply put, Mass Effect 3's doesn't fit with the rest of the series. It doesn't belong. It's not thematically consistent with the rest of the game and has no place at the end of the trilogy except as some awful attempt to make the game "artistic".

It's not just that the ending can't be explained without copious amounts of handwaving to solve the enormous amount of logic and plot holes that are present in what the player is shown, it's that it is completely at odds with the delivery of the rest of the series and relies entirely on tropes of other science fiction entertainment for relevancy.

If the team truly believed in the artistic integrity of the product as it was, they wouldn't issue an extended cut. They'd just go "it's up to the player to decide". That's the kind of ending it is. It's an ending that is supposed to make the player come up with their own conclusion. To go back on that is in itself undermining the artistic integrity of the ending as provided. If BioWare are going to do that, they may as well remove the whole damn thing altogether and make an ending that matches the tone and theme of the rest of the series. To do otherwise both undermines their beloved "artistic integrity" and fails to provide the fans with what they are actually asking to be given.

You know for weeks I have been reading this.....And yet everyone can see
that it is bogus. The ending does fit the series you just don't like it.
How do I know this? Cause I have been playing the series.  Now not
liking the ending is just fine ..Don't like it. unlike some here I am not
trying to dictate your taste. Yet I cannot keep hearing the same bull
and  stay quiet. I have in many posts shown why this ending is not out of
the story. I have also admitted to it being badly edited and parts just
not well written. But it does fit. Your actions did matter through out
the WHOLE game and not just the last choices where you have never had
much choice in any of the games.

  I do believe that Shepard
meeting her fate is the main reason many dislike the ending. I also
think only a few are honest enough to admit it.  I also think the only
reason the relays shake people up is cause they cant seem to understand
the next games does not have to happen directly after ME3...Heck it
could happy a thousand years later.

The AI irks people cause they didn't see  it coming and never realized how one dimensional the
reapers were. I expected this or more aptly a Video recording
explaining the reason for the reapers. Any one who played the first game
and heard Sovereign talk should have known that the reapers were mere
tools....Like Hitlers use of the SS. Kill first never question why.

The
actual cut scenes after you make the choice having very little difference is something they should fix cause it apparently confused
many and left to many to use their own mind to figure it out. Yes the
Joker part was not well thought out or more aptly fleshed out.

The
relay shock wave.....Okay people get freaking real huh? If they blow up
relays and not everything dies then that's what happened.  You all seem
to ignore the fact that they were destroyed differently then the one in
Arrival and dang it they shouldn't have to explain this to you.  You
should know the difference between a controlled explosion and a catastrophic explosion.

Blue babies......How the heck do you know there isn't any??????????????? It isn't like they didn't do the deed before the last chapter.

The whole how did the crew get on and why would Joker take off....One we don't know how long Shepard was out and two BIG DANG LIGHTS DESTROYING CRAP!  Joker smartly took the heck off. This is commonsense and not hard to understand.

Everyone
wants Shepard to tell the AI to pee up a rope ....... Is Shepard so
stupid to destroy it all just so she can get her fight on????? No

The
Synthetic will always destroy their creator....You all seem to miss the
fact that this is the FIRST time that this didn't happen. How is a
program to foresee something that has never happened ever before? The
fact that it did happen opened up new avenues for it to take.

The destroy option....Yes it does suck that all AI has to die to kill the reapers but like a EMP how would the beam  differentiate between friend and foe.

Just
a short synopsis and logic as to how it fits. You don't like the
ending? Fine hate it. Stop telling us it doesn't make sense or fit cause
it does.


End rant.

I like your way of thinking.......if the ending DOES NOT WORK......I'LL MAKE IT WORK......LOL.

As normal some just ignore.

[AmstradHero]

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
 You know for weeks I have been reading this.....And yet everyone can see that it is bogus. The ending does fit the series you just don't like it. How do I know this? Cause I have been playing the series.  Now not liking the ending is just fine ..Don't like it. unlike some here I am not trying to dictate your taste. Yet I cannot keep hearing the same bull and  stay quiet. I have in many posts shown why this ending is not out of the story. I have also admitted to it being badly edited and parts just not well written. But it does fit. Your actions did matter through out  the WHOLE game and not just the last choices where you have never had much choice in any of the games.
[/quote]
Nope, you're given plenty of choice. The ramifications of these choices play out in the second and third game. When someone dies, another person fulfils their functional role within the story, but the effects of their involvement play out significantly differently. If you've played the games extensively, you'd know this. Shepard's choices do matter and do affect the lives of many. To say otherwise is complete bollocks.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
  I do believe that Shepard meeting her fate is the main reason many dislike the ending. I also think only a few are honest enough to admit it.  I also think the only reason the relays shake people up is cause they cant seem to understand the next games does not have to happen directly after ME3...Heck it could happy a thousand years later.
[/quote]
This is your supposition. I don't care when the scene after the credits occurs, but it's obvious since Shepard is now some kind of Space Jesus that it is many hundreds or thousands of years later. To prove my point, I love that Shepard can be killed by the Illusive Man. I think it should have been EASIER for this to happen. Shepard utterly and comprehensively failing should have been more likely. THAT would have been a brilliant, ballsy and artistic ending. That it requires the player to deliberately fail to make two renegade interrupts (if they've failed to convince the Illusive Man) is a weak choice on BioWare's part.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The AI irks people cause they didn't see  it coming and never realized how one dimensional the reapers were. I expected this or more aptly a Video recording explaining the reason for the reapers. Any one who played the first game and heard Sovereign talk should have known that the reapers were mere  tools....Like Hitlers use of the SS. Kill first never question why.
[/quote]
The game keeps telling you that the Reapers are incomprehensible. The series reiterates this at every turn. To have this undermined in the final chapter of the series undermines the mystique and authority of the Reapers. They're just a giant galactic cleaning service. That's hardly incomprehensible. Now they're simple and unimpressive. Way to undermine the gravity of the threat that you've spent three games developing.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The actual cut scenes after you make the choice having very little difference is something they should fix cause it apparently confused many and left to many to use their own mind to figure it out. Yes the Joker part was not well thought out or more aptly fleshed out.
[/quote]
I understood the philosophical difference between the three choices and have little problem extrapolating many different possibilities as a result of those choices. As I said, the problem is that it's a weak ending because it's completely at odds with the rest of the series.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The relay shock wave.....Okay people get freaking real huh? If they blow up relays and not everything dies then that's what happened.  You all seem to ignore the fact that they were destroyed differently then the one in Arrival and dang it they shouldn't have to explain this to you.  You should know the difference between a controlled explosion and a catastrophic explosion.
[/quote]
"It's a special explosion". That's what you're saying. It's still an explosion. This is a special magical explosion that doesn't destroy things, unlike every other explosion since the beginning of time? To use your own words: "get freaking real huh?"

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
Blue babies......How the heck do you know there isn't any??????????????? It isn't like they didn't do the deed before the last chapter.
[/quote]
I agree Liara might have blue babies if you romanced her. So?

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The whole how did the crew get on and why would Joker take off....One we don't know how long Shepard was out and two BIG DANG LIGHTS DESTROYING CRAP!  Joker smartly took the heck off. This is commonsense and not hard to understand.
[/quote]
Wait, you just said it wasn't well done but no you're arguing its merits? Alliance chatter says: "Everyone was killed by the blast." What, everyone except Shepard, Anderson, and Shepard's two squad mates? All of whom are in a completely open and in an area with zero cover? It's ridiculous. Also, the "big dang lights destroying crap" - nope - the shockwave doesn't necessarily destroy things. Either Joker managed to see the explosion start and immediately jump into FTL (seemingly unlikely given it takes time to prepare as demonstrated in ME1/ME2) before it hit anything, or he gets out after he sees it hit other ships in the fleet which it presumably doesn't damage in most cases because it doesn't affect technology - just AI, and even then it doesn't necessarily damage them.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
Everyone wants Shepard to tell the AI to pee up a rope ....... Is Shepard so  stupid to destroy it all just so she can get her fight on????? No
[/quote]
No, people just want to point out the fallacies in the AI's argument. They're never given the option to do so.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The Synthetic will always destroy their creator....You all seem to miss the fact that this is the FIRST time that this didn't happen. How is a program to foresee something that has never happened ever before? The fact that it did happen opened up new avenues for it to take.
[/quote]
Well, obviously it had foreseen this possibility, otherwise there wouldn't be three convenient devices already pre-existing on the Citadel to provide the necessary technology for these new unforeseen solutions. Unless some Keepers managed to almost instantaneously create them while Shepard was riding the magic space elevator.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
The destroy option....Yes it does suck that all AI has to die to kill the reapers but like a EMP the beam would differentiate between friend and foe.
[/quote]
You mean like, say... the Reaper IFF system that was introduced in ME2? Yeah, that would work just fine. Admittedly EDI would still die, but it wouldn't be wide scale AI genocide. Besides, didn't you just argue above that it's a "controlled explosion"? So... it's controlled, but not really controlled? You can't even maintain consistency in your defence of the ending. Surely that should tell you something.

[quote]Thanatos144 wrote...
Just a short synopsis and logic as to how it fits. You don't like the ending? Fine hate it. Stop telling us it doesn't make sense or fit cause it does.

End rant.
[/quote]
Nope. It doesn't.

Modifié par AmstradHero, 18 avril 2012 - 02:01 .

[darkway1]

Thanatos144...........come now,there are some mega holes in the ending.....all Bioware has to do is answer some obvious questions but no one is willing to address anything........the free DLC is going to be released because there are so many issues with the end.......and yet in your eye's the ending is fine,good for you........but for the majority of people the ending was rushed,slapped together and presented more questions than answers.

[3DandBeyond]

Thanatos144 wrote...


 You know for weeks I have been reading this.....And yet everyone can see
that it is bogus. The ending does fit the series you just don't like it.
How do I know this? Cause I have been playing the series.  Now not
liking the ending is just fine ..Don't like it. unlike some here I am not
trying to dictate your taste. Yet I cannot keep hearing the same bull
and  stay quiet. I have in many posts shown why this ending is not out of
the story. I have also admitted to it being badly edited and parts just
not well written. But it does fit. Your actions did matter through out
the WHOLE game and not just the last choices where you have never had
much choice in any of the games.

  I do believe that Shepard
meeting her fate is the main reason many dislike the ending. I also
think only a few are honest enough to admit it.  I also think the only
reason the relays shake people up is cause they cant seem to understand
the next games does not have to happen directly after ME3...Heck it
could happy a thousand years later.

The AI irks people cause they didn't see  it coming and never realized how one dimensional the
reapers were. I expected this or more aptly a Video recording
explaining the reason for the reapers. Any one who played the first game
and heard Sovereign talk should have known that the reapers were mere
tools....Like Hitlers use of the SS. Kill first never question why.

The
actual cut scenes after you make the choice having very little difference is something they should fix cause it apparently confused
many and left to many to use their own mind to figure it out. Yes the
Joker part was not well thought out or more aptly fleshed out.

The
relay shock wave.....Okay people get freaking real huh? If they blow up
relays and not everything dies then that's what happened.  You all seem
to ignore the fact that they were destroyed differently then the one in
Arrival and dang it they shouldn't have to explain this to you.  You
should know the difference between a controlled explosion and a catastrophic explosion.

Blue babies......How the heck do you know there isn't any??????????????? It isn't like they didn't do the deed before the last chapter.

The whole how did the crew get on and why would Joker take off....One we don't know how long Shepard was out and two BIG DANG LIGHTS DESTROYING CRAP!  Joker smartly took the heck off. This is commonsense and not hard to understand.

Everyone
wants Shepard to tell the AI to pee up a rope ....... Is Shepard so
stupid to destroy it all just so she can get her fight on????? No

The
Synthetic will always destroy their creator....You all seem to miss the
fact that this is the FIRST time that this didn't happen. How is a
program to foresee something that has never happened ever before? The
fact that it did happen opened up new avenues for it to take.

The destroy option....Yes it does suck that all AI has to die to kill the reapers but like a EMP the beam would differentiate between friend and foe.

Just
a short synopsis and logic as to how it fits. You don't like the
ending? Fine hate it. Stop telling us it doesn't make sense or fit cause
it does.


End rant.

Well at last you finally stated the way you see things.  I asked repeatedly. 

Apparently since you think the endings make sense (it's your right, ok), you live in a parallel universe from mine.  I'm sorry, but they don't.  I understand them as they are, but they do not fit the rest of the games.  They don't thematically, logically, or in any other way.

We understand and always understood the mindlessness of the reapers, but there did seem to be a hierarchy of understanding.  We could understand if ultimately it was Harbinger controlling things.  That might even make some sense.  We could understand if every 50k years they came back because they needed the sludge that they got from organics to maintain their own life-this would make sense since every organism needs to feed, even a synthetic needs something to continue to exist.  But what we are given is this dreamchild/magical starkid that got pulled out of nowhere who thinks he knows everything and can control much.  It gives up its control by letting the crucible and citadel mate.  The whole thing isn't lost on me.  If you choose Synergy/Synthesis you get to send out the freaking sperm to create this.  This is obvious.

The main flaw in all of this is that we are at once expected to accept that Shepard found a gun with unlimited ammo, that Anderson was following Shepard but is in front of him, that TIM just magically appeared, that Harbinger wasn't in control of anything, the vidkid was.  We are supposed to believe that this magical being with super intelligence can only conceive of 3 ways to reconcile everything that has gone on before.  Apparently this is the "different way" it has come up with.  We are supposed to believe that Shepard somehow goes all quiet in the face of such unreasonable reason.  Shepard never shut up before.

We are given endings that are based more upon EMS than anything else, even which one we pick impacts things far less than EMS.

We are given 3 stupid options.  A child's brain can conceive of other options to the mess, so why not a god/star/reaper-owning VI?  I'd buy into it more if at least the stupid kid showed some nuanced smarts.  It's controlled the reapers for many many millenia and all it's learned is there are 3 ways to go about dealing with the evolution of organics and synthetics?  I think it needs to go back to the shop 'cause something ain't working so well. 

We are told that the reapers ascend organic life by taking it in.  Ok, what?  They either turn organic life into sludge or they turn them into mindless killing machines.  If that's a part of higher intelligence I'd rather stay stupid, thank you very much. 

Sure, ok, let's go with the relays were only the victims of limited or focused destruction and whole systems weren't destroyed.  You've still got billions of lifeforms stranded in the Sol system.  Sucks to be them.  Your decision may have just shut off (destroy) all synthetic life as you know it-so sucks to be Geth and since the Geth were helping the Quarians, well now they are on their own-sucks to be them, too.  Stupid to care-just when you helped the Geth to ascend and find their inner humanity (if you must use that word), you destroy them. Yay!

Ok, you may choose to save synthetic life and to join with them through synergy/synthesis.  Welcome to stagnation nation.  And congratulations, you just single-handedly decided the fate of every organic lifeform that is and will be.  And, we are told that is the end of evolution.  Great.

Or, you may choose to control the reapers, but wait, you die so who the heck is controlling them?  And why in heck would you want to control mindless butt ugly killing machines with exorcist voices, anyway?

But, it always comes back to the circular logic-it's the stupidest suggestion within these games and any game I have played ever.  And I am older than most, so I have played thousands of games in my lifetime.  Never has a game so insulted my intelligence as this one did with this singular thought.  It is not a given that the created will always rebel against the creator, nor does that even mean that the created will of necessity destroy the creator.  It isn't true, it is not ultimately even remotely a certainty.  No one, I repeat no one in Sci Fi history would ever say this is ultimately always true.  Nor would they formulate a whole ending of any story around this idea if they wanted people to appreciate their logic.  You have only to look at some of the most recent well-received sci fi stories out there.  It's why I cited I Robot before, because humans have conceived of the possibility of created life rebelling and have postulated ways to inhibit or stop it from happening, including ultimate solutions-turning them all off.  It's why even friendly androids have fail-safes or off switches.  They conceive of the possibility but not the inevitability.  If it's inevitable the alternate real solution is to never create synthetics in the first place.  It's far less destructive not only to the synth but to all life as well.

To be clear, yes I do want choices that lead me to a possible happy ending with end content that allows me to experience the happy ending, but I also want choices that lead me to a possible or even probable non-happy one with end content that allows me to experience that.  I want to be able to cry over these things and I want to be able to experience them with the folks I came to care about in these games.  I don't want to be left in a pile of rubble while my LI debates whether or not Joker is daddy material or worse.  I don't want dying to mean sacrifices meant very little.  And I don't want to be left with the idea that all in life and in this game is futile because all roads lead to Rome.

There are undertones of many different allegories within ME3.  One can even see the endings as an allegory for the use of genetic engineering.  The big problem is, none of this is coherent enough or truly a part of what the rest of the story is about in ways that make sense.  Genetics is a recurrent theme, true.  The Genophage, the way the Asari reproduce, the creation of the geth/humanity "gene".  The 3 choices may indicate what faces us in terms of genetic engineering in our societies.  We think we can control it, but that's naive.  We think we can assimilate all the ideas together in one synergistic ideal, but again that's naive.  So, the choice many gravitate towards is to destroy the school of genetic engineering.  They can't decide what to do with it, so they must get rid of it.  This seems to be one undertone.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 18 avril 2012 - 02:17 .

[LiarasShield]

Again Ai or god child logic failed because you can united the geth with the quarians if all the created rebeled against their creators the catalyst would've been destroyed a long time ago and again with the breaking of characters all the way through mass effect 1 and 2 your crew were loyal they wouldn't abandon you they fight side by your side till the very end even as your fighting a giant human reaper or getting blasted as your runing your ass back to your ship joker didn't abanon shepard during the collector base nor WIth soverign it is almost impossiable to believe or accept that he would do this in the most pivotal battle with the rest of the fleets I would've accept normandy getting blasted to kingdom come or being stranded like the rest of the fleets instead of abandoing shepard and the army to flee to some damn jungle planet because it is not like them and shepard giving up or not fighting the advanced ai back is not acceptable because shepard has always been about finding another way or to never give up representing the human spirit and will to keep going through dire situations so why in the final minutes would shepard become a mindless drone that can't think for him or herself and be at least heroic the way he or she has always been

Modifié par LiarasShield, 18 avril 2012 - 02:06 .

[zacgodbold]

They need cutscenes showing each and every war asset acquired and how they actually helped in the end.

[Xellith]

The repercussions of each of the 3 colors needs to be VARIED GREATLY based on your actual major choices. The ending currently is just bad.

How you could go from an ending like dragon age origins where your actions actually had consequences to ME3 where "you can do anything you like as long as your EMS score gets to a certain point".

[LiarasShield]

are you honestly telling me that you can't see the problems espically if you played the previous mass effects are you kidding me you really got to be pulling my leg

[Thanatos144]

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...



Nope, you're given plenty of choice. The ramifications of these choices play out in the second and third game. When someone dies, another person fulfils their functional role within the story, but the effects of their involvement play out significantly differently. If you'd play the game, you'd know this. Shepard's choices do matter and do affect the lives of many. To say otherwise is complete bollocks.[/quote] Yes they were massive......You , People die, No one dies....SO vastly diffrent then this one huh?

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...


This is your supposition. I don't care when the scene after the credits occurs, but it's obvious since Shepard is now some kind of Space Jesus that it is many hundreds or thousands of years later. To prove my point, I love that Shepard can be killed by the Illusive Man. I think it should have been EASIER for this to happen. Shepard utterly and comprehensively failing should have been more likely. THAT would have been a brilliant, ballsy and artistic ending. That it requires the player to deliberately fail to make two renegade interrupts (if they've failed to convince the Illusive Man) is a weak choice on BioWare's part.
 
[/quote] She became legend...You know like John Henery? Like many things myth gets mixed in with truth. This is again commonsense.

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
The game keeps telling you that the Reapers are incomprehensible. The series reiterates this at every turn. To have this undermined in the final chapter of the series undermines the mystique and authority of the Reapers. They're just a giant galactic cleaning service. That's hardly incomprehensible. Now they're simple and unimpressive. Way to undermine the gravity of the threat that you've spent three games developing.


[/quote] No the reapers tell you and shepard tells you they are stronger and smarter....Which she is correct. But to give them more dimensions they have is not valid.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
I understood the philosophical difference between the three choices and have little problem extrapolating many different possibilities as a result of those choices. As I said, the problem is that it's a weak ending because it's completely at odds with the rest of the series.


[/quote] Excpet it is not. It is actually very much in line with the whole story. Tough decisions in a dirty war.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...

"It's a special explosion". That's what you're saying. It's still an explosion. This is a special magical explosion that doesn't destroy things, unlike every other explosion since the beginning of time? To use your own words: "get freaking real huh?"


[/quote] do you understand what controled means?
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
I agree Liara might have blue babies if you romanced her. So?

.
[/quote] stop asking for them.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
Wait, you just said it wasn't well done but no you're arguing its merits? How long Shepard was out is irrelevant. "
"Everyone was killed by the blast." What, everyone except Shepard, Anderson, and Shepard's two squad mates? All of whom are in a completely open and visible area? It's ridiculous. Also, the "big dang lights destroying crap" - nope - the shockwave doesn't necessarily destroy things. Either Joker managed to see the explosion start and immediately jump into FTL (seemingly unlikely given it takes time to prepare as demonstrated in ME1/ME2) before it hit anything, or he gets out after he sees it hit other ships in the fleet which it presumably doesn't damage in most cases because it doesn't affect technology - just AI.


[/quote]Because something wasnt well done doesnt mean it is wrong.......You dont know if everyone was killed in the blast you are just assuming.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
No, people just want to point out the fallacies in the AI's argument. They're never given the option to do so.


[/quote] Except is isnt one.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
Well, obviously it had foreseen this possibility, otherwise there wouldn't be three convenient devices already pre-existing on the Citadel to provide the necessary technology for these new unforeseen solutions. Unless some Keepers managed to almost instantaneously create them while Shepard was riding the magic space elevator.


[/quote]You really think a computer needs as much time as a human to makeshift
the most important relay into a instrument like this? If so then you truly dont understand computers much.
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...

You mean like, say... the Reaper IFF system that was introduced in ME2? Yeah, that would work just fine. Admittedly EDI would still die, but it wouldn't be wide scale AI genocide. Besides, didn't you just argue above that it's a "controlled explosion"? So... it's controlled, but not really controlled? You can't even maintain consistency in your defence of the ending. Surely that should tell you something.


[/quote] You do the IFF was something like a radar ping our navy uses so we dont sink our own subs right??????It is something that just tells you it is there it does not devert bombs from destroying it.....

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...

Nope. It doesn't.
[/quote] It does if you dont worry about throwing a tantrum.

[Thanatos144]

zacgodbold wrote...

They need cutscenes showing each and every war asset acquired and how they actually helped in the end.

Yes they do....Or scenes of how the battle is going whole you are in the crucible....If you have a lot of WA the war is going okay if not we are getting our butts kicked. 

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

are you honestly telling me that you can't see the problems espically if you played the previous mass effects are you kidding me you really got to be pulling my leg

Perhaps I just read more Sci-Fi than you to see how well this ending fits.

[LiarasShield]

Even at this point if you liked the ending how the hell can you not see the major problems or plotholes are you guys blind or have adhd cause if then that explains a lot but yeah for those that liked the ending thats cool but telling us to stfu because we have some valid reasons why we don't like the ending isn't gonna make us quiet it is only gonna make us speak even more honestly the shut the **** up tactic beecause we don't agree with you doesn't work on either side of the spectrum

[LiarasShield]

yay thanatos and I read the darth bane knights of the old republic books and episode 6, 7 and 8 of star wars reading about sci fi that has nothing to do with this particular science fiction series does not particularly mean anything

[Huojin]

Dear everyone:
Thanatos144 has been trolling this thread forever. Ignore him. As they say: "do not feed the trolls"

[AmstradHero]

Huojin wrote...

Dear everyone:
Thanatos144 has been trolling this thread forever. Ignore him. As they say: "do not feed the trolls"

I thought maybe with his post explanation his "position" that he was simply deluded, but unfortunately you're right.

I shall resume ignoring him and all of his meaningless and illogical posts.

Modifié par AmstradHero, 18 avril 2012 - 02:25 .

[LiarasShield]

you can like the ending but if you can't see the flaws of how shepard and crew broke character or just the nonsense of the ai spouting off that all the created will destroy their creators when the quarians and geth can make peace and how if this was so the reapers would've either destroyed the catalyst or the plans for the crucible a long time ago it is absurd and no again since I have played both games and have the genesis comic of mass effect 1 the crew never abandon shepard before always fighting by his or her side and even joker came to pick his or her ass off the collector base as they were getting shot at and the base exploding so JOKER JUST ABANDOING SHEPARD WITHOUT KNOWLEDGE OF HIS OR DEATH AND THE CREW LETTING HIM WITHOUT EVEN A FUSS OR A ARGUEMENT no no no let and again how shepard always fought for another way and never gave up in dire situations again shepard becomes a mindless zombie instead of a hero who does make a worthy sacrificee so no I can't accept the characters being broken or the flawed logic presented to me apparently alot of others will but I'm not a zombie I have my own thoughts and feeling and like shepard did in me 1 and 2 I will not submit to anyone

[aprilryan515]

 
It makes me sad, when the press and other media is saying that the fans are mad about the ending, just because it's over. That the fans don't appreciate what they've got, and the fans are ruining the creative vision in development. Most often uttered by people who have never played a game before, let alone Mass Effect. Respectable gaming sites reviewing ME3 with a 10/10 rating. That would most likely hold water, if ME3 was not a part of a trilogy, and all that was said prior release, not said. Sure.

I have recommended Mass Effect to everybody I know, who's even remotely interested in games. You owe yourself that much, I use to say. Even recommended it to a friend who otherwise only plays Lego Star Wars. I went out and bought a copy of the game and put it in his hand and said, play this, you won't regret it. When he, after several months finally played the game, he's reaction was almost not present. Well, he said, it was okay fun, too much dialogue, though. I just skipped over it. And no multiplayer. Amazing to me who admire the complexity and diversity accomplished in Mass Effect.

You can without a doubt play ME3 and think it's the greatest game ever, start to finish. But not as an RPG. Not when you know what it once was. And certainly not as a fan. And for a fan, with an ending like that, replay value is gone. And that means, for a fan, DLC is pointless.

The same reasons many love Mass Effect is the same reasons many avoid it.

So I understand the makeover put on ME3, Action mode and all. Would have prefered if Bioware had waited with all the changes for their next release in the series. And that's it, as long as there's two people on the planet there will be two opinions concerning one matter. Non of them are more right or wrong than the other. ( One man's trash, the other man's treasure).

I still believe it's wrong putting ideas in peoples minds, and building up sky high expectations using empty promises. They might not have been empty to begin with. Ofcause, anybody can change their mind for whatever reason. But, to keep on lying after the development takes a totally different aproach, and can no longer deliver what's been promised, is simply exploitation of loyality. Reminiscent of a political campaign.

If I'm wrong and Bioware deliver what they actually said they would, and this is part of the plan they had from the beginning , I'd still feel run over to some extent.

But hey, Life's like a box of chocolates... somebody once said.

Modifié par aprilryan515, 19 avril 2012 - 07:21 .

[dmcdeavi]

Huojin wrote...

Dear everyone:
Thanatos144 has been trolling this thread forever. Ignore him. As they say: "do not feed the trolls"

Indeed.  please do not add fuel. 

[darkway1]

Huojin wrote...

Dear everyone:
Thanatos144 has been trolling this thread forever. Ignore him. As they say: "do not feed the trolls"

I don't know about that.....I'm starting to think Thanatos is a bit more switched on than the rest of us,after all he's read a lot more scifi books........instead of asking Bioware for answers,maybe we should just ask Thanatos 

[LiarasShield]

in this case I guess you could compare thanatos to either the illusive man or the advanced ai trying to control us to accept flawed logic or breaking of characters but I'm sorry unless I get shot in the forehead or get drugged out to point where I can barely stand then I can't do it I'm sorry

[Thanatos144]

Well I tried to drop knowledge on you all and as normal get called a troll. Perhaps ladies and gents you all need to take a good long look in the mirror to find who the true trolls are.

Modifié par Thanatos144, 18 avril 2012 - 02:31 .

[LiarasShield]

again you are trying to compel us to accept flawed logic and the breaking of characters how they have acted thee entire way through the triliogy I can't accept that that would be like luke automaticlly attacking and killing all the rebels simply because he was bored

Modifié par LiarasShield, 18 avril 2012 - 02:33 .

[LiarasShield]

it would never happen

[3DandBeyond]

AmstradHero wrote...

Huojin wrote...

Dear everyone:
Thanatos144 has been trolling this thread forever. Ignore him. As they say: "do not feed the trolls"

I thought maybe with his post explanation his "position" that he was simply deluded, but unfortunately you're right.

I shall resume ignoring him and all of his meaningless and illogical posts.

Agreed.  If one disagrees with him/her then they have not read Sci Fi-I've been reading, watching, inhaling, playing Sci Fi everything for over 50 years.  This is insulting. 

Or, we just didn't understand the endings-ok, this is stupid.  We get it-we know what the endings mean.  They are so simplistic as to be childish.  That is the problem.  They don't involve any extrapolation whatsoever except to fill in plotholes because they freaking don't make sense and are not satisfactory in light of the ME universe and all the decisions made throughout the game.  They are also not satisfying in the world of great literature because there is no epilog or more appropriately no denouement.  Telling us that we just don't understand the ending is the height of insult.  What's to understand?  We get it, we hate it.

And every explanation that I have read as to why they are great endings or that they make sense have ignored the plotholes or tried to explain them away.  Controlled explosions is just one of them.  None of the so-called explanations actually deal with the reality of the lack of real choice nor do they deal with the inevitability of action that Shepard would or should have at the end. 

[Thanatos144]

LiarasShield wrote...

in this case I guess you could compare thanatos to either the illusive man or the advanced ai trying to control us to accept flawed logic or breaking of characters but I'm sorry unless I get shot in the forehead or get drugged out to point where I can barely stand then I can't do it I'm sorry

They didn't break character. You just imposed your expectations on the
story.  As for the reading part I say this cause most sci-fi story uses
a twist of something news to conclude a ending. Sort of like how Paul Atreides  uses the spice to see the truth.