23455 réponses à ce sujet

[3DandBeyond]

sbricca wrote...

Rh4p wrote...

At the end, all of us arrives at ONLY ONE final. All the Shepards (renegades, paragorn, mid-renegade, mid-paragorn,....) stop the Reapers and save the galaxy

oh. are you sure about that?
it seemed to me that the galaxy collapses,
but it's not the point...the point is the incongruences

Essentially the choices we are given are about the degree to which we want to screw up the galaxy and how it happens.

Control-Makes no sense, Shepard is supposed to control reapers, but dies so who's in control.  Reapers leave.  Relays destroyed.  Fleets stranded at Earth.  Billions have no way home, run out of food.  Die.  Joker on some inexplicable planet.  Shepard Dead.
Synthesis-Makes no sense, completely disregards value of individuality, sacrifice of Legion if played that way.  Nobody but Shepard has any choice.  Reapers leave.  Destruction of what makes one human (from a human-centric point of view) or what determines an organic life's soul.  The end of evolution and the end of the need for learning, progress, procreation, and so on.  Life stagnates.  Synthetics suffer too, because they are now tied to organic life which must decay or which introduces increasingly flawed logic.  Systems fail.  Relays destroyed.  Stranded. Death.  Joker on planet.  Shepard dead.
Destroy-Makes no sense.  Reapers destroyed-only good thing.  If you worked hard to save the Geth, promote a Geth/Quarian peace, that meant nothing.  EDI meant nothing.  Geth, dead.  EDI-dead.  Relays destroyed, blah blah stranded, dying.  Joker on planet.  Shepard may die or with high enough EMS rating, Shepard may gasp at the end.  BIG DEAL.  If you have a really low EMS, the Earth gets vaporized.

Neither of these takes into account the choices you made in the game.  The endings mean I could just play 3 games like I don't care about anything, don't amass war assets, don't make friends, don't do sidequests, and I still get basically the same ending as someone that really played the game and took the time to make real decisions.

And you didn't save the galaxy.  The galaxy is royally screwed, even if the relays did not destroy everything which is a player invention-people reading into all this have said it was a different type of explosion than in the Arrival.  This is made up by players and not something ever stated anywhere in 3 games.  It was always stated that the destruction of the relays would be a very bad thing.

But, even if the mass relay explosions were some limited, happy nice explosions and not all mean and bad, and didn't destroy the galaxy, billions still die.  Fleets are stranded at Earth,  The different alien groups cannot all eat Earth food and will die, horribly.  So will some of those on that planet with Joker.  They can't all eat the same food, so someone will be left out.  If your Love Interest is male and the teammate you took on the final push to the beam is male, then you might end up with Joker and 2 other males deciding just when to give in to their basic urges.  But, it won't create life.

If your Love interest is female and ends up with Joker and another male, well try and get that image out of your head.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 23 avril 2012 - 04:39 .

[Deihjan]

RagnarokJ wrote...

I'm not sure if this idea was mentioned before or not but i was thinking that if bioware could make the already existing endings even better where shepard doesn't die and the relays don't explode if your assets are high as 7000 or so.

Well, technically, that ending kind of already exists.
But getting assets that high requires you to play the multiplayer, a lot, and personally I don't want to keep doing that to finish all of my Shep's stories the way I want to.

I tried the green end on my first playthrough, and the red end on my Insanity playthrough. Neither end left me satisfied, because of the whole disregard to "Mass Relays get destroyed, wipes out entire star cluster in the vicinity, universal genocide" as well as the Catalyst suddenly, magically, being an AI of sorts that 'created the reapers'.

Now now, I'm not hacking away at you, I'm just greatly annoyed that Bioware forgot most of the story that we learned from ME1 and ME2. Heck, even the Dark Energy ending would have left me infuriated, because that didn't fit in either.


As for favourite moment in ME3, everything up till the second Harbinger pewpew's Shep with his laz0r. I wasn't as fond of the whole Sanctuary and infiltration of the Cerberus Base, because the whole storyline seemed to jump from one problem to a completely different, never before discussed point of Reaper control.
And I still have no clue what happened to Cerberus from ME1 that went from being a Black Ops branch of the Alliance going rogue to a privately funded organization run by The Illusive Man that is more or less a terrorist, xenophobic cell bend on killing everyone to control a race of sentient machines.

[LiarasShield]

mass effect was a great triliogy because of what you did mattered wether altering certain events or you doing the loyalty missions and making decisions so that everybody survives or dies because your choices is what decided how well or how terrible you did and how you personally would make certain choices if you were shepard or how we can feel that shepard is like ours since we can pretty much throughout the triliogy make him or her do what we want

[vicendor]

My god how can an ending by so bad...the only other ending I can think of that's just as bad or a tad bit worse or better would be the ending of KOTOR 2...

[LiarasShield]

I'm not gonna keep bringing out the plot holes anymore cause I'm really getting tired of having to rexplain them over and over again but yeah no matter what you do you always die the relays are gone everybody is stranded in the sol system so they will most likely kill each other or die in space doesn't matter which ending their all pretty much the same relays go everybody stranded in the sol system and everybody will slowly die inspace without making it back to their core world so they can continue to have a future so what even in synthess ok all organic life is half machine and now all machines are half human ok so they might die slower inspace unless the relays are fixed they will still die and it still won't matter and those of you who think they can easily use ftl to get home your wrong because without fuel they wouldn't be able to keep doing those massive jumps and they aren't as powerfful without the relay pushing the ship forward

plus since the fuel stations were right by the destroyed relays they won't be refueling so even if they did get out of earths system they would still be stranded inspace cause you can't ftl indefinitly that is why you had to refuel in me2

and yes even if you do get some sort of decent victory most of the planets are giganticly destroyed by reapers I mean the only undestroyed area on earth is mostly london right it would still take hundreds or thousands of years to get our earth back to sustaining life everywhere and who even knows if the amount of humans left over would be able to continue to repopulate the earth in time

plus all the other worlds are drasticlly destroyed by the reapers as well the only core worlds that weren't really devastated is rannoch and tuchanka every other core world was either destroyed or near destruction from being overruned by the reapers so even if thee asari and turians make it back home their planets may already be in ruin and may be to late to save them do you really think that this is such a amazingly great ending even for a bittersweet ending

cause I definitly can't see the sweet part

[LiarasShield]

so eh

[LiarasShield]

Still seems like crictical mission failure no matter what color you pick lol

[LiarasShield]

the whole point being here is that their isn't a victory and your actions and choices don't matter the only choice you do get is how you want the galaxy or galactic civilization to be destroyed thats about it

[ryoldschool]

I was just checking this thread again, hoping that they had done something. I completed ME2 over twenty times, but have only been able to complete ME3 once - due to the horrible endings. I have played a lot of multiplayer and I enjoy the combat system. But I've just no interest in grinding through all that effort in the single player game just to have those three terrible choices again.

Its a shame really because they did a wonderful job on just about everything. They probably needed to invest more in writers.

[LiarasShield]

Catalyst: yes choose how to destroy the galaxy the choice is your muahahahah

Me: wtf why would I ever do that....

[darkway1]

LiarasShield wrote...

Catalyst: yes choose how to destroy the galaxy the choice is your muahahahah

Me: wtf why would I ever do that....

Now that we know that the universe is going to explode at the end it does make me wonder about giving the Illusive man a shot at contolling the reapers......maybe he could have done a better job than Shepard.l:O.

[darkway1]

3DandBeyond wrote...

If your Love interest is female and ends up with Joker and another male, well try and get that image out of your head.

Sounds like the start of a sexy adventure to me.....

[Deihjan]

@LiarasShield - technically you don't die in the 'best' red ending. If you have 100% galactic readiness and all possible war assets, your Shepard is implied to survive - kind of like the end of ME1 except you don't actually see him/her walk away from the wreckage. But yeah, that doesn't really matter when the Normandy is stranded on some tropical island god knows where/when (time travel mayhaps) and all of the relays are destroyed, the universe void of life except for on Earth where millions and trillions of aliens are stranded

[Rh4p]

3DandBeyond wrote...


How does it make sense that everyone in the end still has the same choices, no matter how they've played the game.  There should be reward and punishment.  Your actions should have consequences.  Did you play ME2?  If you did not get someone's loyalty and then put them in a power position at the end (at the Collector's base), someone would die.  Is this not a punishment for your actions or inaction.  That character then would not exist in ME3.  But, if you went back, got all loyalties, changed up who took key positions, and acted quickly at certain points, you could assure everyone lived on into ME3.  That's something that is missing in ME3 and its ending.

And I think you and I have been playing a different game.  In the end, you don't get an ending that saves everything, kills the reapers, and saves the galaxy.  You get choices that determine just how much you screw up the galaxy.  You might destroy them, but in doing so you totally screw up the Geth, EDI, and the Mass Relays, stranding all these fleets at Earth.  Or, you could pick between the other 2 choices and basically do the same thing in different ways.

We shouldn't all arrive at the same place based upon our decisions, because our decisions in these games, always mattered.  That is what makes Mass Effect, Mass Effect.

Basically, if you run around alienating everyone, they will not work together to stop the reapers and will not be a part of the assembled fleets.  There should be no way then that you could achieve the best ending for you.  Yes, at the end you should still have choices that can help to determine what your good ending is.  It may  be that you see the ultimate sacrifice as a good ending and that's fine.  My thoughts don't preclude that.  What I was saying is that if you have screwed everybody along the way and don't build up the necessary forces, you get a really bad ending.  That should happen.  But, if you work very hard and forge alliances, build up assets, choose  from a selection of options that make your force strong, then there should be a path to a super sappy, happy ending.  Not the only course, but a possible one.

I was not even meaning that all renegade decisions are bad ones-they aren't.  Some are really necessary.  But, there is a point where a renegade decision can lead to TIM killing Anderson which in turn kills you.

This game is all about your choices mattering and meaning who lives and who dies.  Your actions have consequences.  It is definitely not necessarily a good decision to not cure the genophage with Wrex alive and his assurances and maturity at trying to work for peace with other races.  If you try to fake the cure, you have to kill Mordin.  Is this a good decision?  But even not curing the genophage gets you war assets that you would not otherwise get, so it offsets some of those you lose by losing the Krogans.  This is a real world corollary-you can earn allies by alienating others.

Actions have consequences.  The game made that clear throughout.  And sometimes there are right and wrong ones, since if you make a bad decision, you do not gain war assets.  And Bioware isn't telling you how to play the game, they are just creating rules that exist within it, just like in real life there are bad decisions, good decisions, and some that are neither.  You make choices based upon your personal bias and if the ending is not what you hoped for, you play the game again.  A game that has only one ending that comes from hundreds of choices I have made is not a game I want to play again.  My ending will not change, so why play again and make different choices.  I want to create a character that really screws things up and then see what that means.  I want a character that does things, renegade and paragon, that creates a different path and ending, and then see what that means.  Then, I can play the games all again and do it differently and see what the next ending is that I get.

My point was that if you have made decisions that did not improve the cohesion of the races in a fight to the death against the Reapers, then the happy ending gets closed for you.  It makes sense.  Even some Paragon choices can cause problems.  I agree.  But, some choices have more impact on building up assets than do others.  If you killed the Geth in ME2, you may get more Quarians.  If you did not, you may get more Geth than Quarians.  It changes some things, but not necessarily your EMS.

As for having to play multiplay.  I agree you should not have to and I know that as it is a 7000 EMS does require that.  I was pointing out that my EMS is over 7000, but I get no better an ending than someone that did much less.  I'm not saying that 7000 or any score requiring MP should be the determining factor, just questioning why it didn't matter.

In Mass Effect 2 happen almost exact the same than in ME3. U can decide in terms of loyaltis, and this decisions make that in the final some of your group die or survive, but ALWAYS u arrive at the collector's base, even if u don't upgrade anything on Normandy and u don't do any mission of loyalty (only the minimun missions to get to the point to travel to the collector's base), and u ALWAYS decide about destroy or preserve it. No matter if u are a totally paragorn or a totally renegade, u ALWAYS arrive at the same end. In ME3 happen the same, u ALWAYS arrive at the same point, and your decisions affects to your partners, but the end it's the same for everyone (even in the end, u've got the choice of HOW stop the reapers). Maybe u don't apreciate the repercusions of your decisions 'cuz BW don't put a cinematic and say "ey, you do this and this and this" but this not meaning that the decisions don´t count. 

The decisions have consequences. If u decide not to cure the genophage u condemend an entire race to extinction. That's not need explination at all. And the same with other decissions.

Maybe, the big diference between ME2 an ME3 it's the point that in ME2 really has one way to ruin it all, and it's if Shepard Dies. Maybe in ME3 I put another option, leave the citadel and tell the Catalyst that we fight the reapers "face to face". If someone thinks that it's possible to defeat the reapers, even when the Catalyst and the Reapers tells that it's impossible, let the option to try it. But with the same result everytime: at the end, Shepard dies in field of battle and thousands of Reapers come to do his work. The difference between get 2000 or 7000 EMS was that with more EMS Shepard can defeat 1, 3, 7  or 20 reapers, but at the end always fail and die, 'cuz the only way to stop the Reapers was through the Crucible and the Catalyst.

3DandBeyond wrote... 

Essentially the choices we are given are about the degree to which we want to screw up the galaxy and how it happens.

Control[/u]-Makes no sense, Shepard is supposed to control reapers, but dies so who's in control.  Reapers leave.  Relays destroyed.  Fleets stranded at Earth.  Billions have no way home, run out of food.  Die.  Joker on some inexplicable planet.  Shepard Dead.
Synthesis[/u]-Makes no sense, completely disregards value of individuality, sacrifice of Legion if played that way.  Nobody but Shepard has any choice.  Reapers leave.  Destruction of what makes one human (from a human-centric point of view) or what determines an organic life's soul.  The end of evolution and the end of the need for learning, progress, procreation, and so on.  Life stagnates.  Synthetics suffer too, because they are now tied to organic life which must decay or which introduces increasingly flawed logic.  Systems fail.  Relays destroyed.  Stranded. Death.  Joker on planet.  Shepard dead.
Destroy[/u]-Makes no sense.  Reapers destroyed-only good thing.  If you worked hard to save the Geth, promote a Geth/Quarian peace, that meant nothing.  EDI meant nothing.  Geth, dead.  EDI-dead.  Relays destroyed, blah blah stranded, dying.  Joker on planet.  Shepard may die or with high enough EMS rating, Shepard may gasp at the end.  BIG DEAL.  If you have a really low EMS, the Earth gets vaporized.

 

No. Reapers don't "leave". Reapers are stopped. And the galaxy is saved.

And if fleets are strandend in Earth, ¡Ey that's a War! they assume the possibility of everything go wrong. And if the reapers don't be defeated, stay strandend in one planet was the minor of his problems, because they are condemned to die in hand of the Reapers.

Bye

[Deihjan]

darkway1 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

If your Love interest is female and ends up with Joker and another male, well try and get that image out of your head.

Sounds like the start of a sexy adventure to me.....

Kaidan and Joker with, I think it was EDI in my insanity end.
Not so sexy time unless Kaidan admits to be gay for Joker, since my Shepard has been female until a few days ago when I started a ManShep.

[LiarasShield]

Deihjan wrote...

darkway1 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

If your Love interest is female and ends up with Joker and another male, well try and get that image out of your head.

Sounds like the start of a sexy adventure to me.....

Kaidan and Joker with, I think it was EDI in my insanity end.
Not so sexy time unless Kaidan admits to be gay for Joker, since my Shepard has been female until a few days ago when I started a ManShep.

my whole point being is our planet is so damaged by the reapers already we don't even know if it be enough to support us let alone the rest of the races and hell the bad red ending already makes our pretty muched decimated world a million times worse

[zarnk567]

@Rh4P Actually..... the Reapers do just "leave" in the synthesis ending............ not that it really matters all the endings are the same anyway. In that they break the narrative cohesion of the entire story and break peoples suspension of dis-belief in the universe.

Modifié par zarnk567, 23 avril 2012 - 05:44 .

[Benchpress610]

darkway1 wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

Catalyst: yes choose how to destroy the galaxy the choice is your muahahahah

Me: wtf why would I ever do that....

Now that we know that the universe is going to explode at the end it does make me wonder about giving the Illusive man a shot at contolling the reapers......maybe he could have done a better job than Shepard.l:O.

LOL

[3DandBeyond]

Rh4p wrote...


In Mass Effect 2 happen almost exact the same than in ME3. U can decide in terms of loyaltis, and this decisions make that in the final some of your group die or survive, but ALWAYS u arrive at the collector's base, even if u don't upgrade anything on Normandy and u don't do any mission of loyalty (only the minimun missions to get to the point to travel to the collector's base), and u ALWAYS decide about destroy or preserve it. No matter if u are a totally paragorn or a totally renegade, u ALWAYS arrive at the same end. In ME3 happen the same, u ALWAYS arrive at the same point, and your decisions affects to your partners, but the end it's the same for everyone (even in the end, u've got the choice of HOW stop the reapers). Maybe u don't apreciate the repercusions of your decisions 'cuz BW don't put a cinematic and say "ey, you do this and this and this" but this not meaning that the decisions don´t count.

Yes, you arrive at the Collector's Base, but one or more of your teammates will die.  It isn't the same ending because if you don't upgrade the Normandy it has an effect in ME3.  If certain teammates die on that last mission or if you have not gotten their loyalty, it has an effect in ME3.  I do appreciate the consequences of my actions.  The ending of ME3 ignores my actions and means everything I've done has no consequences.  I can arrive at the same ending as you even though we played the game differently.

Rh4p wrote...
The decisions have consequences. If u decide not to cure the genophage u condemend an entire race to extinction. That's not need explination at all. And the same with other decissions.

That's exactly my point.  But, it should matter to the outcome of the game.  If you do not cure the genophage, you may get more Salarian assets-not enough I think to make up for the lost Krogan ones, but close.  I don't need any explanation of it.  The Catalyst ignores this as a choice, the game ignores my decision here.  My ending does not take into account the fact I made a hard, but probably more moral decision in this.  And, who would you want in a down and dirty fight, a Krogan who can't wait to go home and make some babies or a Salarian, considering his next scientific experiment as if it's the move on a chess board?"

Rh4p wrote..
Maybe, the big diference between ME2 an ME3 it's the point that in ME2 really has one way to ruin it all, and it's if Shepard Dies. Maybe in ME3 I put another option, leave the citadel and tell the Catalyst that we fight the reapers "face to face". If someone thinks that it's possible to defeat the reapers, even when the Catalyst and the Reapers tells that it's impossible, let the option to try it. But with the same result everytime: at the end, Shepard dies in field of battle and thousands of Reapers come to do his work. The difference between get 2000 or 7000 EMS was that with more EMS Shepard can defeat 1, 3, 7  or 20 reapers, but at the end always fail and die, 'cuz the only way to stop the Reapers was through the Crucible and the Catalyst.

The main difference is that ME2 is the continuation of a saga and must meet certain plot lines in order to be continued in ME3.  ME3 was said to be the end of Shepard's story.  As such it much more easily lent itself to a variety of endings-great, good, bad, worse, and worst.  Instead, we got one main ending that did ruin not only ME3, but ME2 and ME1 as well.  The main difference in the choices and your EMS was one short gasp.

The problem with the ending is that it's like if you were playing as Batman and the enemy you've been fighting the whole game is The Penguin, but in the last 5 minutes of the game The Penguin waits outside and The Joker says you have 3 choices-destroy the Penguin and everybody else, control the Penguin and still destroy everybody else, turn everyone into part Penguin, but still basically destroy everyone.  Oh, and no matter what, you die, unless you collected a lot of friends along the way.  And the reason for this is because Penguin will always rebel against Batman and friends, so Batman and friends must die, so Penguin can't kill them.  It makes no sense. 

Rh4p wrote..

No. Reapers don't "leave". Reapers are stopped. And the galaxy is saved.

And if fleets are strandend in Earth, ¡Ey that's a War! they assume the possibility of everything go wrong. And if the reapers don't be defeated, stay strandend in one planet was the minor of his problems, because they are condemned to die in hand of the Reapers.

Bye

Reapers do leave.  In real life war is war, but I don't need my game to end with a depressing commentary on what happens in real life.  In war, it is just as possible to succeed as it is to fail.  Sometimes, the margin for error is very slight or it depends upon putting the right person in the right place at the right time.

And that's the point.  If you do things "right" in the game-maybe make the optimal choice (could be a renegade one) at the right time, there should be an ending that isn't an inevitable worst case scenario ending.  But, all endings except for the Shepard gasp (unreal for a variety of reasons) are worst case scenario endings for many if not most of the beings in the ME universe.  This does not make me want to play it again.  It's depressing, it's illogical, it is incoherent, it does not fit in with the rest of ME3 and ME2 and ME1.  It does not honor all the work players did in the games.  It does not honor the characters and relationships you develop in the game. 

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 23 avril 2012 - 06:18 .

[darkway1]

LiarasShield wrote...

Deihjan wrote...

darkway1 wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

If your Love interest is female and ends up with Joker and another male, well try and get that image out of your head.

Sounds like the start of a sexy adventure to me.....

Kaidan and Joker with, I think it was EDI in my insanity end.
Not so sexy time unless Kaidan admits to be gay for Joker, since my Shepard has been female until a few days ago when I started a ManShep.

my whole point being is our planet is so damaged by the reapers already we don't even know if it be enough to support us let alone the rest of the races and hell the bad red ending already makes our pretty muched decimated world a million times worse

I really do think that's one issue the new DLC will deal with.......having the universe stranded is some thing they have over looked.......but in reality the mass relay exploding should have killed everyone anyway......so nothing really makes sense.......it's up to Bioware to change the goal posts at the last minute........again. 

Modifié par darkway1, 23 avril 2012 - 07:16 .

[Agamoto]

I'm posting this in the hope that someone is in fact still listening ... you never know ...  I haven't posted here before and haven't read extensively in the forums ,so most of this has probably already been said before, but I wanted to chip in my 2 cents anyway  ...

What needs to be changed about Mass Effect 3?  ... well, ... the ending of course. If you really were listening you might have picked up on that, Sadly you seem resolved to stand by "the team's artistic vision for the end of this arc of the Mass Effect franchise." That's a real shame because, as so many people have already pointed out, the ending really is appallingly bad. It's doubly a shame because the rest of the game, up to Shepard's final scene with Anderson, is damn good. The last 10 minutes ruin what would otherwise be a fantastic game.
Basically the whole ending (or at least, everything following Anderson's death-scene) needs a complete re-write, it's irreparably broken and a few extra cut scenes won't fix it, There are plenty of good ideas floating around if you wanted to pick up on them - but of course that's out of the question because you've got your 'artistic vision' to think about. So in a spirit of what I hope is 'constructive' criticism I'd like to offer some thoughts on how to make improvements to the existing ending. I'll try to prioritise these, starting with the most important and working down from there:

1) Get rid of the Crucible Kid, Starchild or whatever you want to call him  ... edit him out, delete him, make him GONE. This in an unavoidable and non-negotiable prerequisite to a functional ending. No ending which includes him or his crazy "We're destroying you for your own good, y'know" pseudo-philosophising will ever work. Apart from that he's 100% superfluous. You don't need to provide a rationale for the reapers. The reapers don't need a rationale. Why do they do what they do? Because they're inscrutable badass alien insectoid killing machines and THEY CAN. End of. THEY DON'T NEED A REASON. And even if they did we don't need to discuss it with a shiny translucent ten year-old ... No, no , no, no, no, no, no, no, NO! Apart from that, as I'm sure you've read a thousand times on the Internet already, introducing new characters and concepts in the last five minutes of a 100-hour story arc is, well ..., awesomely incompetent. So number one priority, get rid of the kid. EDIT HIM OUT. Information brokering and choice selection can be made via the Citadel console, reusing the Prothean VI animation - the Crucible is a Prothean design, after all. Lose the kid and you automatically improve the ending by at least an order of magnitude.

2)Lose the synthesis ending. What? Everybody's complaining about there not being enough choice and you want us to lose one of the endings we already have?
Yup.
First up, as things stand, it's not really an ending, it's a colour choice. Secondly, although I'm guessing it's the preferred choice of the development team (it takes the most EMS points to access, it gets pride of place at the centre of the end sequence and it sorta picks up on those conversations you had with EDI and Legion, and, of course, you get to finish with that, *cough*, great 'New Beginning' scene with EDI and Joker watching the sun set on some idyllic garden world) it really is the worst of the three options available. Because  it springs yet another completely novel idea on us in the closing moments of the game.  NOBODY, prior to The Kid, has EVER talked about synthesizing organics and synthetics. Sure we've had those conversations  I mentioned about synthetics evolving and becoming sentient/emotional, but that's hardly the same thing as "Let's fuse organics and synthetics into some weird new hybrid form of life never before seen in the history of the universe. As mentioned above introducing new concepts in the last five minutes of a 100-hour story arc is ... sloppy. Aside from that - you want me to re-write the DNA of every sentient being in the galaxy without their knowledge or consent?  Change who and what they are on the basis of a snap decision on an idea that I've thought about for all of ... a minute? Duh! OK. Nah, doesn't work.
Finally, it's lame and derivative. Is that your "artistic vision for the end of this arc of the Mass Effect franchise"?... "I know, let's make it end like Battlestar Galactica!" Great work there guys. Really outdid yourselves on 'artistic vision'. So, ... another  suggested change, the 'synthesis ending' joins the Starchild on the cutting room floor.

3) Having done away with that great Battlestar Galactica ending, there's really no need to keep the 'Joker flees destruction and crashes the Normandy on an idyllic garden planet' sequence, I mean, it's only really there to line up that 'New Beginning' sunset scene and is incomprehensible when combined with the control or destruction endings. Apart from that, as I'm sure you're tired of hearing, it opens up huge plot holes: How do the crew get back aboard the Normandy? Why is Joker, an Alliance officer, fleeing an ongoing military operation? ... and on, and on and on. Simple answer is - don't open those plot holes. *snip* One more for the cutting room floor. "But, ... but ...  the development team wanted 'a bittersweet ending', if you cut the crew surviving where's the sweetness?." My tip:  You don't get bittersweet by taking ashes and slapping a big glob of sugar on top - the ashes still taste like ashes and the sugar makes you feel sick
I have no pretentions about being a writer, but I could imagine something like :  Activating the Crucible in 'destroy mode'  devastates the planet it is orbiting, in this case Earth  but does  not destroy the relays. To destroy the reapers Shepard must sacrifice himself, his squadmates and his homeworld , (Why did the Reapers move the Citadel to Earth? because they thought Shepard wouldn't be prepared to make the sacrifice). Earth is destroyed (that footage already exists). A final  cinematic  could show Hackett conducting the funeral service for Shepard and his teammates on Eden Prime. During the funeral oration, which is being broadcast live on galactic radio, we  blend to similar scenes at memorial services on battle-scarred Thessia, on Palaven and on Tuchanka; add in a few glimpses of the surviving characters: Jack, Jacob, Wrex; back to Hackett for some final uplifting words on how Shepard has become a legend and cut to fade. Where are we? Shepard and most of the characters we've grown to love are dead, Earth is in ruins but galactic civilization has been saved, Shepard is truly a legend and humanity has gained a place of honor amongst the races of the galaxy.
That's a bittersweet ending.
 Not "galactic civilization is screwed, but hey, Joker gets to play Robinson Crusoe with EDI, so it's all good!"

I'm gonna stop there because this is turning bitter and I've written more than I meant to anyway. Just for the record: I find the current ending to be so bad as to be offensive  Empty platitudes such as 'artistic vision' are just insulting.
Hackett out

[richard_rider]

The main difference between ME1, ME2 and ME3 endings, is the flow.

In ME1 you land on the Citadel, you fight Saren, the Geth, and Sovereign, and that's expected, you were chasing Saren the entire game, a showdown was the pinnacle of the playthrough, you make choices, and they carry on to ME2.

In ME2, you invade the Collectors' base, and take the fight to them, your choices count, as your squad's survival depends on it (and once again, the choices are forwarded to ME3), and even though it's inevitable to end up at the Collector's base, it was pretty much a given. You've been gunning for them the entire game.

In ME3, you're gunning for the reapers, and now, at what is supposed to be the ultimate showdown. (Organic vs Synthetic, Survival vs Annihilation, Free Will vs Domination, United vs Divided) You're reduced to a multiple choice, color coded question, not an epic battle, not Shepard and his allies standing shoulder to shoulder, fighting to the last man, but a single color coded question. I was fully expecting my Shepard to die, never had a delusion about it, but I didn't expect him to die like a b**ch!!!

Not once did my Shepard question the little wispy bastard (and he would've), not once did he tell him to ****** off (which he would've) and not once did he tell him, "I'm Commander Shepard, I stopped Saren and Sovereign, I destroyed the Collectors, and stopped Harbinger, you think I'm gonna take this crap from a stupid wispy apparition?! Now F*** OFF!!!" (which he definitely would've, because my choices in all 3 games determined MY Shepard to have that kind of a personality)

Alas, no, my Shepard meekly accepted nonsensical verbal diarrhea, in spite of all my decisions.

[luci90]

 So, I assume we have heard nothing more from BW?


Besides the explanation that won't help much.

[Uncle Jo]

Rh4p wrote...


In Mass Effect 2 happen almost exact the same than in ME3. U can decide in terms of loyaltis, and this decisions make that in the final some of your group die or survive, but ALWAYS u arrive at the collector's base, even if u don't upgrade anything on Normandy and u don't do any mission of loyalty (only the minimun missions to get to the point to travel to the collector's base), and u ALWAYS decide about destroy or preserve it. No matter if u are a totally paragorn or a totally renegade, u ALWAYS arrive at the same end. In ME3 happen the same, u ALWAYS arrive at the same point, and your decisions affects to your partners, but the end it's the same for everyone (even in the end, u've got the choice of HOW stop the reapers). Maybe u don't apreciate the repercusions of your decisions 'cuz BW don't put a cinematic and say "ey, you do this and this and this" but this not meaning that the decisions don´t count. 

The decisions have consequences. If u decide not to cure the genophage u condemend an entire race to extinction. That's not need explination at all. And the same with other decissions.

Maybe, the big diference between ME2 an ME3 it's the point that in ME2 really has one way to ruin it all, and it's if Shepard Dies. Maybe in ME3 I put another option, leave the citadel and tell the Catalyst that we fight the reapers "face to face". If someone thinks that it's possible to defeat the reapers, even when the Catalyst and the Reapers tells that it's impossible, let the option to try it. But with the same result everytime: at the end, Shepard dies in field of battle and thousands of Reapers come to do his work. The difference between get 2000 or 7000 EMS was that with more EMS Shepard can defeat 1, 3, 7  or 20 reapers, but at the end always fail and die, 'cuz the only way to stop the Reapers was through the Crucible and the Catalyst.



No. Reapers don't "leave". Reapers are stopped. And the galaxy is saved.

And if fleets are strandend in Earth, ¡Ey that's a War! they assume the possibility of everything go wrong. And if the reapers don't be defeated, stay strandend in one planet was the minor of his problems, because they are condemned to die in hand of the Reapers.

Bye

It's because of this kind of people (and there are many of them) that I've always thought Bioware was searching for a another audience... They're calling the actual space-magic ending valid/cool/great... And the worst of all, they enjoyed it

Modifié par Uncle Jo, 23 avril 2012 - 08:17 .

[MtOMajorCat0311]

vicendor wrote...

My god how can an ending by so bad...the only other ending I can think of that's just as bad or a tad bit worse or better would be the ending of KOTOR 2...

So true,   KOTOR2's ending at least was more or less consistent - though it still slapped me in the face after such a great story.

It's like the boss at Bioware said:  "5 minutes to deadline guys, I know your not finished but you need to wrap up your story and get it over to the publishers.  Yea, yea, I know.......just throw a slaptastic ending together, use pretty colors and a God in the Machine character and call it good...."