23455 réponses à ce sujet

[vv238email]

If what BioWare is doing right now is listening, I don't even want to know what it's like when they don't listen.

Modifié par vv238email, 24 avril 2012 - 12:27 .

[LiarasShield]

Simply I'm done debating with people Mr B Tongue will explain in this video to the others

[3DandBeyond]

Benchpress610 wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...



You're loosing your time with this guy. He's beyond any salvation...

Yeah...with that post he just showed his true colors. He's just another troll. The best thing to do is ignore him.

You are correct, both of you.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 24 avril 2012 - 12:35 .

[LiarasShield]

3dand that vid link is gonna be my response from now on since it explains a good amount of stuff

[3DandBeyond]

LiarasShield wrote...

3dand that vid link is gonna be my response from now on since it explains a good amount of stuff

It does seem to explain all the things that I think are wrong with it and people should watch it if they don't understand what many of us are saying.

[LiarasShield]

yup gonna be quoting that vid for a long time to come

[Archonsg]

3DandBeyond wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

3dand that vid link is gonna be my response from now on since it explains a good amount of stuff

It does seem to explain all the things that I think are wrong with it and people should watch it if they don't understand what many of us are saying.

You guys are assuming they have the capacity to understand. 
You know the saying, "You can cure ignorance, but stupidity is a terminal disease."

[3DandBeyond]

Archonsg wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

3dand that vid link is gonna be my response from now on since it explains a good amount of stuff

It does seem to explain all the things that I think are wrong with it and people should watch it if they don't understand what many of us are saying.

You guys are assuming they have the capacity to understand. 
You know the saying, "You can cure ignorance, but stupidity is a terminal disease."

Quite true.  There's so much that's out there, that's been said already.  And it's all just staring you right in the face if you play the game, so it's wasted effort.

[bengolly]

My favorite moment was the thresher maw/reaper battle on Tuchanka.  My jaw literally dropped at the scale of the battle.  It was awesome!!

Which is a nice segue into what I really want to talk about: the ending. 

At about the Tuchanka point I decided that it might be fun to replay the series and make different choices to see what happens.  Imagine my disappointment when it became glaringly obvious that, regardless of any decision I made, regardless of how much effort it took to build my war assets (I completed every single side mission), regardless of how much time I spent bringing my galactic readiness to 100%, all I got was the choice between three endings, none of which were logical and which were all virutally identical in presentation. 

All that work was for nothing, because the endings are all basically the same.  In one fell swoop Bioware ruined over one hundred hours of satisfaction and anticipation.

I played the first two games several times through, but now I don't even want to play any game in this franchise.

What would have made it better?

1.  Make our choices matter.  Make the decisions, war assets, and galactic readiness determine if certain people and races live or die.
2.  Give us dialogue options, including renegade/paragon options, in the ending instead of railroading us into an ending you want.
3.  Triple check your story continuity so there are not so many logical flaws.
4.  Provide closure by explaining what happens to the people and races we are so invested in.
5.  DLC's are fine, but stop nickle and diming us for content that should really be central to the story.
6.  Actually do what you say you will do.  If you say there will be "wildly different conclusions," then give us wildly different endings instead of the same ending with minor nuance changes.  If you say there will not be an A, B, or C ending, then don't give us three (A, B, or C) endings.  If you say all of our questions will be answered, then answer them.
7.  Have people outside of your development circle play the game to get the perspective of someone who has never seen any of the content.

I understand there are rumors of future Mass Effect games.  I am not inclined to care until Bioware demonstates respect for the consumer by humbly admitting its mistake instead of hiding behind "artistic integrity."  It is not a matter of artistic integrity -- it is a matter of poor quality control.

[3DandBeyond]

@bengolly, great post!

Personally, I am someone that does not want ME3 to be the end of Shepard's story, but with this ending, that's a really hard wish to adhere to.

The problem with continuing Shepard's story into and ME4, is first and foremost this ending, but also the logistics of keeping all the actors for the main characters.

They've said that any new ME game would likely take place before or during the events of these ME games.  So, what does that tell you.  My thoughts are that they planned to release an ME4, that would show what you have been going through from someone else's perspective.  They specifically said no new ME game would take place after these events as a sequel.  Of course, they've said a lot of things.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 24 avril 2012 - 02:50 .

[ilego]

For the extended cut option i wanted to ask you to please keep the big battle scene over earth but make it longer or show the battle above earth is going more often also i know you have heard this before but from the end of cerbrus to the end it is over all the same sure you can romance samatha instead of tali but you always get the same scenes and you said the romance scenes will be diffrent this time, not really, and during the admiral hacketts speech it is the same sure if you get the geth they are shown during the speech but is the only time, and then when you exit sol relay the same scene everytime the asari's ship (look like the Destiny Asenstion) and more like them appear and then tirans appear if you got them then the quarians ship as long as you didn't kill them appear but even if you keep the geth alive you don't see there ships only turians and alliance i know the main battle is on earth skipping to Hammer Landing you only see alliance ships landing and human soliders then at the FOB you can only talk to your squadmates or former squadmates not the Geth you recuited or aria's army and liara memory what was that all about skipping to leaving FOB same as before except this time you see a korgan or a turian Sorry if i was rude but what is up?

[ilego]

3DandBeyond wrote...

bengolly wrote...

My favorite moment was the thresher maw/reaper battle on Tuchanka. My jaw literally dropped at the scale of the battle. It was awesome!!

Which is a nice segue into what I really want to talk about: the ending.

At about the Tuchanka point I decided that it might be fun to replay the series and make different choices to see what happens. Imagine my disappointment when it became glaringly obvious that, regardless of any decision I made, regardless of how much effort it took to build my war assets (I completed every single side mission), regardless of how much time I spent bringing my galactic readiness to 100%, all I got was the choice between three endings, none of which were logical and which were all virutally identical in presentation.

All that work was for nothing, because the endings are all basically the same. In one fell swoop Bioware ruined over one hundred hours of satisfaction and anticipation.

I played the first two games several times through, but now I don't even want to play any game in this franchise.

What would have made it better?

1. Make our choices matter. Make the decisions, war assets, and galactic readiness determine if certain people and races live or die.
2. Give us dialogue options, including renegade/paragon options, in the ending instead of railroading us into an ending you want.
3. Triple check your story continuity so there are not so many logical flaws.
4. Provide closure by explaining what happens to the people and races we are so invested in.
5. DLC's are fine, but stop nickle and diming us for content that should really be central to the story.
6. Actually do what you say you will do. If you say there will be "wildly different conclusions," then give us wildly different endings instead of the same ending with minor nuance changes. If you say there will not be an A, B, or C ending, then don't give us three (A, B, or C) endings. If you say all of our questions will be answered, then answer them.
7. Have people outside of your development circle play the game to get the perspective of someone who has never seen any of the content.

I understand there are rumors of future Mass Effect games. I am not inclined to care until Bioware demonstates respect for the consumer by humbly admitting its mistake instead of hiding behind "artistic integrity." It is not a matter of artistic integrity -- it is a matter of poor quality control.

@bengolly, great post!

Personally, I am someone that does not want ME3 to be the end of Shepard's story, but with this ending, that's a really hard wish to adhere to.

The problem with continuing Shepard's story into and ME4, is first and foremost this ending, but also the logistics of keeping all the actors for the main characters.

They've said that any new ME game would likely take place before or during the events of these ME games. So, what does that tell you. My thoughts are that they planned to release an ME4, that would show what you have been going through from someone else's perspective. They specifically said no new ME game would take place after these events as a sequel. Of course, they've said a lot of things.

this i agree with

At about the Tuchanka point I decided that it might be fun to replay the series and make different choices to see what happens. Imagine my disappointment when it became glaringly obvious that, regardless of any decision I made, regardless of how much effort it took to build my war assets (I completed every single side mission), regardless of how much time I spent bringing my galactic readiness to 100%, all I got was the choice between three endings, none of which were logical and which were all virutally identical in presentation.

All that work was for nothing, because the endings are all basically the same. In one fell swoop Bioware ruined over one hundred hours of satisfaction and anticipation.

I played the first two games several times through, but now I don't even want to play any game in this franchise.

What would have made it better?

1. Make our choices matter. Make the decisions, war assets, and galactic readiness determine if certain people and races live or die.
3. Triple check your story continuity so there are not so many logical flaws.
4. Provide closure by explaining what happens to the people and races we are so invested in.
5. DLC's are fine, but stop nickle and diming us for content that should really be central to the story.
6. Actually do what you say you will do. If you say there will be "wildly different conclusions," then give us wildly different endings instead of the same ending with minor nuance changes. If you say there will not be an A, B, or C ending, then don't give us three (A, B, or C) endings. If you say all of our questions will be answered, then answer them.
7. Have people outside of your development circle play the game to get the perspective of someone who has never seen any of the content.

Modifié par ilego, 24 avril 2012 - 03:02 .

[3DandBeyond]

If I understand correctly, ilego, I think we are in agreement about some things. There are minor cosmetic differences to some scenes, but nothing major. Many of us wanted to see our war assets in action as part of some blockbuster end fight against the Reapers. Some of the romances are just trashy, which sure some people like and that's ok. The FOB options to talk to some teammates is well-done in parts, but pretty awful when you have to "phone" others. I'd hoped to fight alongside my family.

The "gift" Liara gave you, the scene was very touching, but does seem to be cut short. You see a light, in space.

But, then this is somewhat how they treated the Liara relationship in ME2. It was there, briefly and then gone. And this was amazing considering that in the Final Hours iPad app, they talk about how much fans loved Liara in ME1. She was a romantic possibility in ME1 for either sex, and then they intended to leave her out of ME2. But the fans liked her so you got the Shadow Broker content. And then she was left out of the rest of the game.

Wow, I wonder what they do with characters people just hate. You know, characters with hair problems. Oh, that's right, they bring them back.

[ilego]

Finnally got it to say the right things

[3DandBeyond]

ilego wrote...

Finnally got it to say the right things

Fun, isn't it.  The quotes can really mess it up.

[LiarasShield]

This is a cool amv or gmv of shepard and liara I wonder if you all will like it

[LiarasShield]

I said fire to the rain watch me pour as I test your face watch when you burn and I cry cause I knew that this the last time last time

[Andy the Black]

AwefulShot wrote...

Andy the Black wrote...

cindercatz wrote...

This is not in response to the arguements in this thread, but I have no idea where BioWare is reading feedback on the ending, and this is still stickied, so I'll put it here. I responded in another discussion/poll with this post, but I want to make sure it's in the most visible threads. Also in the "suggested changes" thread, I'll post this and a few other things.

" I think it should basically depend on your EMS. It's impossible to save everyone in your squad, but depending on your EMS, you have a choice of who to save in a series of events during the battle. If you have very low EMS, most die, if very high EMS, you sacrifice a few.

Optionally, Shepard can sacrifice him/herself to save more of the squad. If EMS is very low, Shepard dies along with most of the squad. LI survives all scenarios, unless EMS is low and Shepard refuses to sacrifice him/herself to save them.

In all scenarios, Earth takes heavy casualties, as do the allied fleets. If EMS is high, the Battle for Earth is won, and significant survivors remain across all species. The allies go on to win the war. If EMS is very low, the Battle for Earh is lost, casualties are much higher, and the Reapers win. If medium low, the Battle for Earth is lost, but the war eventually won. Medium high EMS, the Battle for Earth is a push (both sides take severe casualties and withdraw), but there are more survivors and the allies win.

*When I refer to squad, I mean the entire squad across all three games. All of the surviving squad members should have visible roles during the final battle, encomposing that "series of events" I mentioned.

**I also reject the idea that this option results in "countless more casualties". It is the better option and therefore should be made clear to be such. Besides, how could any amount of standard warfare equal the destruction of the relays? If BioWare wants to remain consistent with their options, you see that wave basically disintegrating half the normandy, so the destruction of the relays must be a widely destructive event, not a Reaper off switch.

Also, I'd prefer BioWare to basically adopt the indoctrination theory wholesale, and then, if you reject starchild in the dream sequence, this is what results. If you choose "destroy", this still occurs, but there are later repercussions with EDI and the Geth. If you choose "synthesis", Shepard and a number of the human troops are fully indoctrinated and become enemies during the battle. If you choose "control", Shepard is indoctrinated and must be killed by his squad, which also takes a casualty or two in that scene. "

What this dude/dudette said. Though if indoctrination theory is implemented I think destroy should be Shep fighting off indoctrination and synthesis/control is Shep being indoctrinated, in which case the Galaxy boned.

Which is why I think indoctrination is a construct of those seeking 'excuses' for the endings and isn't likely the true meaning of the endings from Bioware.  If indoctrination theory is true then 2/3rd's of the endings are 'you lose'.  I can't see in a million years that Bioware would have decided on a 1 of 3 = win only ending.

Point taken. Thought, I don't think it matters any more anyway, as I don't think Bio are going in that direction. If they were, what would be the point in the extended cut?

Modifié par Andy the Black, 24 avril 2012 - 04:33 .

[BrotherAce]

 Listen you greedy bastards, we the community do not believe you're listening because you guys care more about the money than the actual satisfaction of the people on how the story concludes. When I beat it i thought it was just a dream the whole time, but noooo because I would never believe that my crew would leave earth and go somewhere else. YOU SAY THAT "YOU'RE LISTENING"  which i think its false:bandit:

[ackillian]

My favorite part was when every fleet jumped through the Sol relay and engaged the Reapers. Wish I could have participated a bit more in that engagement... But it was still one of the coolest parts in the game. Double thumbs up Bioware!

[cindercatz]

Agreed with that. I was racing right at that point, all into it. Same goes for the prep talks with all the current and former squaddies. The last mission was far, far from all bad. I was very much invested through the vast majority of it, right up until the end.

LiarasShield wrote...

This is a cool amv or gmv of shepard and liara I wonder if you all will like it

LOVE it, and there's also this original song somebody did.. I mean wow, I've never seen somebody do this for a game romance. Love it too, very good. ;-)



@Andy the Black
Extending the end.. with an actual ending.. is exactly what I proposed they do, that and adding the reject option with the other little nuts and bolts changes to make it all work better (divorcing the indoc sequence from EMS and marrying the actual end sequence after to it). That whole thing, if they do go the IT route like they should, is not an ending, and it still needs an ending to follow that, one that takes everybody's choices all the way through into account, one that crescendoes and fades to resolution, not one that sidesteps and fades to black.

Modifié par cindercatz, 24 avril 2012 - 06:27 .

[tenshi_no_hone]

I thought the reason Liara's involvement in ME2 was limited even with DLC was so they had a long-standing character who couldn't be killed before ME3. If you've made reckless decisions throughout and continue into ME3 the only squadmates you'll get are Liara, James, EDI and Javik (with DLC). You can kill the VS in 3, and Tali and Garrus can die in ME2.

[darkway1]

Now that the shock of the ending has passed I feel that I CAN look at the franchise with fresh eye's,I had 3 major expectations from Mass3.

1) I expected this to be the end of Shepard's story,I knew he was going to die.
2)The Rachni Queen from the first game would play a major part of the story.
3)The reason to why Shepard is so important to the story would be explained.

Now that we know how every thing ends (for me at least), it kinda puts the whole story into dispute,it wasn't as clever as I first thought.
Shepard gains an insight in to the reapers via MASS1 but apart from that Shepard is not special at all,other than having dashing good looks and a degree from charm school.The end of Mass3 was about who can simply get to the end button,nothing more.

I saved the Rachni Queen in the first game for what????.........the base at the end of MASS2,I saved it rather than blowing it up ,for what?????.........Did Shepard really need to be rebuilt by Cerberus to recruit a bunch of misfits to lead a suicide mission???......I was expecting a reason of importance to why Shepard had to be rebuilt to be revealed,he was the key to some thing??......the Illusive man after playing such a major roll in the franchise just seemed so insignificant at the end of Mass3.....why???

For me the ending has done far more damage to the franchise than just being rubbish,anyone can create a story full of wonder and mystery (Lost).........but in the end you have to deliver,you have to have the clever solutions to those mysteries......and for me MASS3 just didn't deliver the goods,the overall story didn't have anything clever to offer at all.

Individual stories worked great,the Krogan story line was a highlight but overall the Mass3 ending destroy's the the overall plot beyond repair.

Currently I have no desire to replay Mass3 single player so I'm stuck with muliplayer,in mmorpg terms, multiplayer has become nothing more than a grind for gear,you do the same thing to gain credits to gain gear...........I didn't pay full price for the collectors edition to spend my time playing a limited multiplayer game which offers nothing but horde mode.

Can anyone tell me also why after finishing the single player game I get slung back to before the Cerberus base attack????.........so I can gain more assets??......to get may be get a different ending?.......is that a sick joke?

Bioware.......what the hell have you done?

[MRadway]

darkway1 wrote...

Can anyone tell me also why after finishing the single player game I get slung back to before the Cerberus base attack????.........so I can gain more assets??......to get may be get a different ending?.......is that a sick joke?

Bioware.......what the hell have you done?

I can only hope that it is because they have alternate endings coming in and you need to be at that point for them to work. It's not much but it's a little hope...

[darkway1]

MRadway wrote...

darkway1 wrote...

Can anyone tell me also why after finishing the single player game I get slung back to before the Cerberus base attack????.........so I can gain more assets??......to get may be get a different ending?.......is that a sick joke?

Bioware.......what the hell have you done?

I can only hope that it is because they have alternate endings coming in and you need to be at that point for them to work. It's not much but it's a little hope...

Nope....ain't going to happen.....Bioware needs to stand up and address the table.......and admit....guy's,we screwed up.......a friggin chimp can see how wrong the end is.