23455 réponses à ce sujet

[Holger1405]

Voodoo-j wrote...

In one hand .. the blue pill
The other .. the red pill

Who wants to go down the rabbit hole?

Funny that you mentioned that. The end of this trilogy was my biggest media related disappointment up to today. Still love Matrix (1), great Movie.  

[Voodoo-j]

Holger1405 wrote...

Voodoo-j wrote...

In one hand .. the blue pill
The other .. the red pill

Who wants to go down the rabbit hole?

Funny that you mentioned that. The end of this trilogy was my biggest media related disappointment up to today. Still love Matrix (1), great Movie.  

Yeah my first thoughts were  
Blue - Paragon
Red - Renegade
Err whats the middle??  look it's green!!  I'm a Jedi Consular!! 


 Jedi Consulars, who focused on non-violence, carried green lightsabers to symbolize peace. Jedi Guardians, on the other hand, carried blue lightsabers as a symbol of uniformity and solidarity. 
And of course Red - Sith - angst


I still don't get the color meanings.

[Holger1405]

Voodoo-j wrote...

Holger1405 wrote...

Voodoo-j wrote...

In one hand .. the blue pill
The other .. the red pill

Who wants to go down the rabbit hole?

Funny that you mentioned that. The end of this trilogy was my biggest media related disappointment up to today. Still love Matrix (1), great Movie.  

Yeah my first thoughts were  
Blue - Paragon
Red - Renegade
Err whats the middle??  look it's green!!  I'm a Jedi Consular!! 


 Jedi Consulars, who focused on non-violence, carried green lightsabers to symbolize peace. Jedi Guardians, on the other hand, carried blue lightsabers as a symbol of uniformity and solidarity. 
And of course Red - Sith - angst


I still don't get the color meanings.

Maybe there is no meaning?

Modifié par Holger1405, 08 mai 2012 - 02:17 .

[Blackvista]

Tasteful, Understated Nerdrage: A Tale of Two Companies

...the troubles of belonging to super conglomerate like EA... with a heartfelt conclusion...

Which reminds me...

"Curiously, an edition of the Encyclopedia Galactica which conveniently fell through a rift in the time-space continuum from 1000 years in the future describes the Electronic Arts Corporation as: 'A bunch of mindless jerks who were the first against the wall when the revolution came.'"

Modifié par Blackvista, 08 mai 2012 - 03:32 .

[shai hulud]

I just finished my first ME3 playthrough about 30 minutes ago.  Although the ending is imaginative, I'm amazed that the game forces/routes you to a single situation irregardless of your previous choices across all three games. 

I expected ME3 to offer multiple pathways to success, the paths available depending on what alliances you built, what battles you won, and who you had kept live or killed. 

Disappointed at this point, particularly after all the excitement built up in the first two games.  But hopeful that additional downloadable content will restore the importance of choices made, and thereby restore the appeal of the series.

[AmstradHero]

[quote]Holger1405 wrote...

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...

By common and mundane", I mean that it is a concept that has existed in countless science fiction stories.[/quote]

I know what you meant and I figured that you don't like it. I am, on the other hand, always considered the possibility that the Reapers are tools. After all they are Machines, and someone must have built them.
[/quote]
The fact they are tools isn't the (primary) thing that makes them mundane. It's the rehashing of a tried and overused science fiction theme - particularly one that was mostly absent from the game itself.

[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
If the whole point of Mass Effect is to kill the robots, how do you reconcile this with the fact that the Reapers are the very cause of the problem that they claim to be fixing?

Regardless, that is the objective of the game - "kill all robots" is not a theme. There are countless themes that are presented more strongly throughout the series: strength through unified diversity, the power of trust, the nature of life, the concept of free will, etc.[/quote]

How are the Reapers the cause of the problem that they claim to be fixing?
[/quote]
The Reapers are machines, and they are trying to kill everyone. Heck, they programmed the Geth to actively attack organics - something they did not do without Reaper programming. They are machines that are exterminating life.

[quote]Holger1405 wrote..
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
 There are countless themes that are presented more strongly throughout
the series: strength through unified diversity, the power of trust, the
nature of life, the concept of free will, etc.[/quote]
The themes, and you listed the most important correctly, brought up on the way, but still, imho the endings do not contradict them.
[/quote]
Synthesis forces every being in the galaxy to become a single, homogenuous mass, regardless of whether they want it or not. There goes free will, the nature of life and strength through unified diversity right out the window. That is supposed to be the optimal ending, and it butchers some of the most important games of the series.

Control and destroy are slightly more tolerable, but still take away free will from some of the parties involved.

See what I mean about how the endings contradict these themes?

[quote]Holger1405 wrote..
[quote]AmstradHero wrote...
If you don't take the Star Child's logic as fact but instead consider him unreliable, then the situation is even more heinous and disgusting than any other. In this case, the player is forced to make a choice provided to them by a character potentially attempting to deceive them, or at best, simply making a gross miscalculation.
[/quote]

And again I disagree.  First, I didn't consider Star Child as unreliable, I consider his logic as flawed.
[/quote]
That logic is what is providing the basis for the choices the player is presented. That means that flawed logic undermines the validity of those choices just as much as if he were wilfully unreliable - because it still means that the only options presented to the player are in themselves flawed. Having the game end with flawed choices is neither satisfying nor able to provide a bittersweet victory, it just leaves the player feeling cheated.

If a conclusion is reached based on flawed logic, the conclusion as presented is invalid. People can reach a correct conclusion based on incorrect logic, just as you can mess up multiple steps in a mathematical problem and potentially end up with the right answer, but basing a conclusion to a series on flawed logic is truly terrible writing.

[Archonsg]

Holger1405 wrote...

Archonsg wrote...

CaptFrost wrote...

I'm sorry, but unless the Indoctrination Theory folks are right (in which case, BRILLIANT on BioWare's part), the ending doesn't deserve to be protected as artistic integrity/quality or somesuch silliness.

Why do people keep saying that if Bioware "punked" us by not including a "complete" ending via IT that its "brilliant?" 

I personally find it repugnant that any company intentionally or not, sold a product that does not have what it advertised to have, and instead played a "practical joke" just so to get a rise out of their customers. Even if this wasn't the intention, it implies that the customer would then have to either buy (if it's not clearly stated that it is free) another product to complete the original product he or she paid for, or, wait and hope that said "complete product" becomes available for free. 

Either way, you GOT AN INCOMPLETE product that you paid for and you are applauding the people who sold you the way it is?
I just don't understand the thought process some of you have.

The ending, even when you don't like it, doesn't make ME3 an incomplete product.

Are you saying that because there is an ending, the game is complete? 
If so, you are missing my point.
It isn't about me not liking the ending, which I while I do understand what the person who wrote it was trying to get at, but found contradictions, and forced illogical choices that I caused me to want to reject those choices.

It is about the ending itself not being complete in the essence of the series of the game as previously demonstrated in the past two games in the series. As well as being advertised and greatly hyped that this ending would give each player a "unique" end to his or her game taking into account the past 2 game's choices.

Anyone who has chosen and seen all three choices can tell you, the "ending" as they were, weren't unique. Unless you count the color changes and or minor cosmetic changes from your EMS ratings.
More importantly, these changes mean little to the protagonist, teaser shot of that "breath scene" aside, which isn't a commitment that Shepard is alive. Nothing in game, in the current ending gives you that indication. Shepard could have just immediately died from his wounds. 

[daveyeisley]

Its a sad day when I can read just about any alternate ending fan fictions that, while I might notice some issues/errors in them, I think the intent of their message/content are vastly superior to the ending content published on the game discs.

Hell, I am not an avid or gifted writer, and I am certain that I could have written a half-decent ending that surpasses what we got.

BW could do so much better. They owe it to themselves and the characters they created.

Instead, it seems we are getting a PR 'spin-job', refusal to admit the mistake, and half-measures to placate our displeasure. Its literally a travesty.

The ending would be best served by being totally re-written, and damn near everyone knows it.

[Temporal Loop]

When even a web comic called Marauder Shields can expand and repair the **** storm of an ending, you know you needed longer to rewrite, rewrite, rewrite.

See this: http://fc01.devianta...smo-d4u9uny.jpg

Then this: http://fc01.devianta...smo-d4xnyh4.jpg

And then you realise EA and Bioware needed to flesh London out a HELL of a lot more!
(The comics also come with music links, which help the mood for the piece. The latest one is VOICE ACTED by a pretty good actor!)

The rest are here. Not bad for a comic that began as a well written comedy comic turned serious drama!
(Begins to get serious from comic 6.)

http://koobismo.devi...rt.com/gallery/

Modifié par Temporal Loop, 08 mai 2012 - 11:41 .

[Archonsg]

@temporal-loop
I hope the author of that comic sees what we all see. In Shepard / Jack, they are both too badass just to just give up and die. Current ending is a fracking suicide, not sacrifice.

[LiarasShield]

Thanatos144 wrote...

Rex Fallout wrote...

Holger1405 wrote...


Imho the universes isn't gone, only the Mass Relays and these Mass Relays
are build by the Reapers. They are given to the different Races, allowing them
to travel between the Stars, but also to control their development, their whole
progress in sciences and research. (There is a very interesting Conversation between
Legion and Shepard in ME2 about this matter.)

The ME Races did not achieve their Technological progress, (at least not
all of it) it was handed to them, simultaneously this technology was a trap, a
trap that allowed the Reapers to attack them so easily.

I like to belief that the Races of Mass Effect are capable of building new
Mass Relays, Relays they control and in doing so, become stronger then before.

That is lovely and all, but it has already been discussed in canon that if a Mass Relay is destroyed in an explosion, that the amount of energy released is enormous and ends up destroying the entire solar system it happens to  be in.  I like to believe that Tali isn't dead, that creators of such a beautiful universe wouldn't betray canon and that I will one day have a pet Protoceratops.  It's nice to be able to like to believe certain things are true and could happen, even if they can't/shouldn't.  IF what happened at the end of ME3 is canon and actually happened, (unless indoctrination theory is correct) then everyone is dead, Earth is gone and so are the Reapers.  In the end, their are only pockets of sentient life stuck on their respective colonies that aren't in a solar system with a Mass Relay.  And there is a good chance they will starve.  Yay.  

Except clearly showing joker surviving and landing on a planet proves that this didn't happen.

umm thanatos that didn't prove the other races survived or didn't starve because the normandy either went ftl or used the relays before they were destroyed or hit that doesn't prove the other races survived it only proved that the normandy survived on some random planet and that could be jokers grandson for all we know it doesn't prove that the others survived

[Uber Rod]

It really saddens and depresses me that Bioware had this utterly great series and then let it fall apart at the end making me have zero interest in re-plays. The game had been epic up until the badly, badly written ending. I have no hope that the upcoming DLC will do anything to change that.

Bioware should at least admit they ran out of time, or dropped the ball or something. It's inconceivable that they could actually be proud of that crap ending.

The ending doesn't need clarification, it needs to be fixed.

I like the idea of multiple paths to the goal of defeating the Reapers. I could see depending on your past choices you needing to take one of a dozen paths to get to the end. So that if I made choices A, B, and C in the past I would get path #1. But if I had chosen choices B, D, and E, then I would get path 2, etc.. Thus I could end up with radically different approaches that still ended up with the Reapers wiped out.

The replay-ability of this approach would be fantastic. I would want to replay ME1, and ME2 just to try different combinations to see what I came up with.

And destroying the mass relays? Not cool, (or necessary) unless in the game we helped create some other intra-galactic drive system that would circumvent/supplant the mass relays. Perhaps this is a lynch-pin where we help develop this other drive so we can bypass the Reapers. Thus we could safely wipe out the mass relays (assuming they don't go nova), using the mass relays to spread the virus, space magic, etc to kill the reapers. This other drive could allow the various races to run and hide from the Reapers until a way to defeat them is developed. Since the Reapers MO is to shut down the relays to isolate the races so they have time to harvest. Theoretically the Reapers could still do this if they could gain access to the Citadel. Thus the need to find an alternative to mass relays.

But to destroy the mass relays without any viable option right now is not good and is just a pointlesss, collective, kick in the crotch for the races that survive.

I have to agree when any alternative fan fiction can come up with better ideas for the ending than the "professionals," you have a serious problem.

[superflyninja]

 Ive bought the collector's(no pun intended) edition of all three ME games. I loved ME,even the planetary exploration,didnt like the dumbing down of ME2 but from all the PR was hopeful about ME3.

I buy the collector edition, get the DLC, sit down and prepare for the conclusion of the trilogy with dimmed light,wife sent to bed, beer and nuts. And my Shepard's face from ME1 and ME2 wont import to ME3. REALLY bad start.

I finally finished ME3 and im frankly insulted. Clearly EA pushed too much cash toward getting multiplayer running to give a damn about what made ME special in the first place.All that time gathering war assets etc etc for nothing. I do hope that this is an elaborate scheme by bioware to trick the players but to be honest it just looks like EA said get the game out now,tack on some crappy ending, we dont care, just get mulitplayer working. So if this incoming "patch" to fix the ending isnt good i will not purchasing any ME "product" again.
Disgraceful.

[3DandBeyond]

akenn312 wrote...

I don't know I get that we are stuck with the Starchild and I'm really over that part, if Bioware needs him in there so bad fine. I'm just more disappointed in so many missed opportunities, and basically that the endings still doesn't give you the feeling that you won the game. But maybe they can fix that.


Lets drop all the speculation and over the top philosophy analyzation for a sec and break it down to just the three choices.


Control, well this doesn't feel like a win or not betraying Shepard's values because it basically is exactly the main thing he was trying to make sure the Illusive man didn't do. So even if I pick it I still feel like he still won in a way. I'm using his method to save humanity and also making humanity the top dog in all this. Plus becoming master of the Reapers…ugh.

Synthesis. This defiantly does not feel like a win or good choice because Sheppard says this to the Catalyst a few minutes before: “I think we’d rather keep our old form.” So why would I pick that choice? That goes against all I am standing for and that's to stop the cycle, but to also let everyone keep their own form. So humans stay humans, Turians stay Turians, Geth stay Geth...ect ect. Unity was supposed to stop the cycle not start a new unnatural evolution IMO. So again this choice just seems wrong. 

Not to even get started for the 300th time that that is exactly what Saren was trying to do, so If I stopped him back then why turn around years later and do the same thing?

Destroy is basically the only option that makes any sense that you can actually feel like you won the game and didn't compromise your Sheppard's values...if you are a Renegade. But still it sucks for a Paragon playing Shepard. Destroy is perfect for a Renegade Sheppard that put humanity first, always hated the Geth and didn't give a toss about EDI. That Shepard would choose Destroy in a heartbeat but not a Paragon Sheppard. So for all the ruthless players I guess you should like the ending. 


To get this to make sense they have to find a way to twist Control and Syntheses so I don't feel like i'm betraying every bit of the Shepard character has been fighting for choosing these options. At least show that with control Sheppard flys all the Reapers and himself into the sun or something.

Hopefully they can...I just wish everyone would drop all this artsitc ending argument. It's not the problem. Its the fact that Shepard could not find a better way to stop the cycle over the Illusive man's way, Saren's way, the Reaper Creator's way or a ruthless Renagade to stop it. He basically gave in to what they were trying to do. Which Mass Effect kept pushing that thier ways were evil. 

Unfortunately, Destroy also compromises Shepard's values.  Sure, at many points throughout the game Shepard had to decide between the lesser of 2 evils (destroy a few, save a lot), but in choosing Destroy and just going off to make it happen, Shepard doesn't even get to put a hand up to ask a question.  The fact that for many players (but true if it was even one player) the destruction of the Geth and EDI is not some wonderful moment in the sun.  It's horrific and genocidal.

You are right-that the choices boil down to:
Control-TIM's and Saren's preferred choice.  Of course it seems to also make no sense, because Shepard dies in controlling them.  You have to have long discussions of how this would work to make it seem even logical.
Synthesis-Saren's and Sovereign's stated goal.

Shepard isn't just going to do something that people s/he hated say is a good idea.  The only reason Shepard got on board with the Geth (if chosen) was because of Legion and his ability to show that they had already started to evolve.

Destroy-Shepard's goal all along, but...the goal was always destruction of the reapers and depending upon the way you played the game, Shepard may have always thought that expediency had real consequences that had to be taken into account.  The game doesn't allow for this at all.  And I would say that even a Renegade Shepard would at least stop and think, maybe not care about Geth or EDI, but would care about Joker.  In ME2 Dr. Chakwas has dialogue regarding Joker needing her (but Dr. Chakwas will die sometime, and probably before Joker).  This alone wouldn't be a reason to let the reapers live on and not kill EDI and the Geth, but Shepard would still stop and want an explanation.  This was a bit of a discussion in another thread.  It was the idea that you could possibly see a Renegade making a choice, but not so a Paragon-at least not quickly.  The main problem with either of them deciding upon Destroy or any choice without objection is there's no sense of urgency at the time.

You can reasonably consider that just like in The Arrival, Shepard had little time to act and so had to quickly decide between horrible choices or the galaxy becomes Reaperville.  But, the sense of urgency totally stops after Harbinger's (or Bob's) beam hits Shepard.  The game sloooooooows down.  It further slows when Shepard and Anderson sit down.  It literally crawls at points where desperation and gut level reacting should be taking over (and the game wants you to think have taken over).  This is what's wrong with not having that "wait a minute" moment.  You seem to have all the time in the world, but are forced to make a quick decision.  Can't have it both ways.  In order for me to "buy" it, that Shepard would make a choice, I'd have to feel pressed for time and at the end, I don't.

In contrast, people really should go back and look at what a good ending really is.  And they don't have to look further than ME1.  Urgency, there.  Great odds against you, there.  The game literally drives you or propels you forward from the moment you leave Vigil-the race to the conduit, the race to the Tower.  No time to think, you just move.  And when you get to Saren, there is discussion, but you always feel the sense of urgency.  Sovereign is there.  Shepard has to get to the console, but must get past Saren first.  There's a fight, a real fight.  Sovereign even takes control of a dead Saren's guts.  You see Sovereign die, lots of destruction all over, and concerns for Shepard, thought to be dead.  But Shepard like a Phoenix, rises.  Great moment.  And even within the epilogue, you make choices.  It was short, but it was well done.  And ME1 had to funnel events into ME2.  ME3 maybe only ever had to funnel things into DLC.

[LiarasShield]

LiarasShield wrote...

we can go into arrival again once again explaining why the assumption of galactic civilization being destroyed if a destroyed relay can destroy a entire solar system would be avery plausible outcome but like I said I'm not gonna sugar coat a you lose ending with tidbits and speculation when arrival if considered cannon pretty much says a relay can destroy a entire solar system if destroyed even if it is a different supposedly kind of explosion

Again it goes back how the last thing we know is that all the fleets are trapt around a dieing earth I have never played a game with all my heart and have done everything right only to fail hell I can hardly call up another game that brings up a you lose no matter what ending because either

A their are so few of them or B they are not a good thing to give to the player when they seek to succede or win so a completel failure ending after doing everything right wouldn't really be a bright idea

nothing gives us any true facts of the other races surviving and despite doing the loyalty missions and because joker could barely abandon the normandy at the begining of me2 and shepard had to pull his ass out of the cockpit and the collector base or even the diversion during grissom academy joker and crew leaving wasn't acceptable by personal standard nor a military standard neither one was acceptable

again if you think leaving your allies to die or leaving a battlefield is ok then don't join the military because the consequences for those actions are quite severe expect a immeditate dishonorable discharge or excution for pretty much saying **** you to your country or the entire galaxy for that matter

[Purebird]

LiarasShield wrote...

LiarasShield wrote...

we can go into arrival again once again explaining why the assumption of galactic civilization being destroyed if a destroyed relay can destroy a entire solar system would be avery plausible outcome but like I said I'm not gonna sugar coat a you lose ending with tidbits and speculation when arrival if considered cannon pretty much says a relay can destroy a entire solar system if destroyed even if it is a different supposedly kind of explosion

Again it goes back how the last thing we know is that all the fleets are trapt around a dieing earth I have never played a game with all my heart and have done everything right only to fail hell I can hardly call up another game that brings up a you lose no matter what ending because either

A their are so few of them or B they are not a good thing to give to the player when they seek to succede or win so a completel failure ending after doing everything right wouldn't really be a bright idea

nothing gives us any true facts of the other races surviving and despite doing the loyalty missions and because joker could barely abandon the normandy at the begining of me2 and shepard had to pull his ass out of the cockpit and the collector base or even the diversion during grissom academy joker and crew leaving wasn't acceptable by personal standard nor a military standard neither one was acceptable

again if you think leaving your allies to die or leaving a battlefield is ok then don't join the military because the consequences for those actions are quite severe expect a immeditate dishonorable discharge or excution for pretty much saying **** you to your country or the entire galaxy for that matter

If it somehow can be overlooked that a destroyed relay doesnt destroy an entire system, the fact that, if you were able to liberate Rannoch for the quarians, and the whole flotilla was at the final battle at earth, then the quarians themselves will never be able to go back there. I mean what was the point of the Rannoch missions if the quarians wont ever get to see their planet again! I find this very depressing as well as what you stated

[LiarasShield]

turning coward was not acceptable their is no reason good enough because if we lose the battle with the reapers they will harvest or destroy all the advanced forms of civilization so joker leaving us to to either rot or die inspace or be destroyed by the reapers no no no no

Stop trying to act like this is a acceptable thing if their were aliens out their that wanted to destroy us are you really gonna tell me that your not gonna stand and fight so that humanity will continue or are you gonna run the other way with your tail inbetween your legs only to be destroyed by them later come on now I'd take the latter option because if we don't stand and hold our ground then they will annhilate us

[3DandBeyond]

I will unfortunately have to point out here as well that at last I understand that there is some foreshadowing of the star kid.

http://loudmouthedga...-mass-effect-1/

And from the wiki:

"Klencory is famously claimed by the eccentric volus billionaire Kumun Shol. His once-ridiculed visions of "beings of light" protecting organic life from synthetic "machine devils" don't seem quite so far-fetched now. His private army of mercenaries are well-established on the planet, waiting for husks to come knocking in on their door. In all likelihood, they will be obliterated by the molten metal of a Reaper orbital bombardment, on its way to somewhere important."

But, even if it was a given that these beings of light existed and were the basis for the star kid (I am sure they were), the whole thing still was done very badly. The major character at the end of the game that is standing between Shepard and the reapers and victory and all, should have had more than just some obscure references throughout the games. The player should clearly have been given signs of something more and then the ending really still could have played out far better.

The statements on the beings of light are from one eccentric Volus. If they were to be part of a major plot line, then they should have been part of a major plot line and the ending could have reflected that and been spectacular, instead of wimpy, demoralizing, depressing, and incoherent.

[LiarasShield]

accepting the cowards way out is for weak individuals

[LiarasShield]

and I know through constantly playing with my squad that they infact were not weak willed so no I can't possibly accept that

[Voodoo-j]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Destroy-Shepard's goal all along, but...the goal was always destruction of the reapers and depending upon the way you played the game, Shepard may have always thought that expediency had real consequences that had to be taken into account.  The game doesn't allow for this at all.  And I would say that even a Renegade Shepard would at least stop and think, maybe not care about Geth or EDI, but would care about Joker.  In ME2 Dr. Chakwas has dialogue regarding Joker needing her (but Dr. Chakwas will die sometime, and probably before Joker).  This alone wouldn't be a reason to let the reapers live on and not kill EDI and the Geth, but Shepard would still stop and want an explanation.  This was a bit of a discussion in another thread.  It was the idea that you could possibly see a Renegade making a choice, but not so a Paragon-at least not quickly.  The main problem with either of them deciding upon Destroy or any choice without objection is there's no sense of urgency at the time.

While I would have expected more dialogue.. What if the destroy option as it's presented is a lie?
What if the Destroy option only destroys the Reapers?

[Voodoo-j]

3DandBeyond wrote...

I will unfortunately have to point out here as well that at last I understand that there is some foreshadowing of the star kid.

http://loudmouthedga...-mass-effect-1/

And from the wiki:

"Klencory is famously claimed by the eccentric volus billionaire Kumun Shol. His once-ridiculed visions of "beings of light" protecting organic life from synthetic "machine devils" don't seem quite so far-fetched now. His private army of mercenaries are well-established on the planet, waiting for husks to come knocking in on their door. In all likelihood, they will be obliterated by the molten metal of a Reaper orbital bombardment, on its way to somewhere important."

But, even if it was a given that these beings of light existed and were the basis for the star kid (I am sure they were), the whole thing still was done very badly. The major character at the end of the game that is standing between Shepard and the reapers and victory and all, should have had more than just some obscure references throughout the games. The player should clearly have been given signs of something more and then the ending really still could have played out far better.

The statements on the beings of light are from one eccentric Volus. If they were to be part of a major plot line, then they should have been part of a major plot line and the ending could have reflected that and been spectacular, instead of wimpy, demoralizing, depressing, and incoherent.

The only problem I have with that, the "being of light" states "we" and "us", infering he is part of the reapers (synthetic).   Either bad writing on the script, or the star kid is not a being of light?

[3DandBeyond]

superflyninja wrote...

 Ive bought the collector's(no pun intended) edition of all three ME games. I loved ME,even the planetary exploration,didnt like the dumbing down of ME2 but from all the PR was hopeful about ME3.

I buy the collector edition, get the DLC, sit down and prepare for the conclusion of the trilogy with dimmed light,wife sent to bed, beer and nuts. And my Shepard's face from ME1 and ME2 wont import to ME3. REALLY bad start.

I finally finished ME3 and im frankly insulted. Clearly EA pushed too much cash toward getting multiplayer running to give a damn about what made ME special in the first place.All that time gathering war assets etc etc for nothing. I do hope that this is an elaborate scheme by bioware to trick the players but to be honest it just looks like EA said get the game out now,tack on some crappy ending, we dont care, just get mulitplayer working. So if this incoming "patch" to fix the ending isnt good i will not purchasing any ME "product" again.
Disgraceful.

Some thoughts here-the face issue bothered me as well.  I finally found the code for my Shepard's face after I was partway through ME3.  It doesn't always show up on the squad screen so when I first looked for it, I thought people were trying to be funny when they said it would be on that screen.  But, this also shows just how attached we all could and often did become to "our" Shepard.  I've seen a lot of great youtube videos showing Shepards, but I always have a real issue with them; they aren't Shepard, because my face is the face of Shepard.  It's silly, but I think the first face you create that you like and the first type of character you create or choose to be, seems to end up being the "true" Shepard for you.  Although, I did create a horrible face Shepard, looks like a clown, because that one would be able to swallow this ending.

Another thing is the state of EA today.  They've suffered profit losses and will be cutting jobs.  This should prove to people that are out there saying, "don't like the end?  Just shut up, don't play the game, don't buy more Bioware/EA games."  Well, this does have an effect and it may mean everyone is less likely to get any ME-like games in the future.  Don't get me wrong-I do believe in voting with your money.  Walk away when companies fail you.  But if you loved the ending and want more from Bioware/EA, stop telling people to just leave.  Encourage them to try and make this game and thus these companies, better.  Because if they become better companies, make better products, they will have more customers and continue to make things.

It also points out that these are businesses and businesses do not act within the vacuum of space.  They must live down here on Earth and respond to both the negative and positive things people say and feel about them.  Or their audience shrinks and business suffers.  I actually think that businesses today tend to do things backwards.  They focus on the profits and ignore the product.  It's really time for the reverse to be true.  Create quality products at good (I don't mean rock bottom cheapo) prices and profits will follow.  But, that also means establishing and maintaining a relationship with your customers.  Maximizing profits due to this insane need to always increase the value for shareholders really can keep companies from just maintaining their profits.  Quality almost always suffers.

[3DandBeyond]

Voodoo-j wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

Destroy-Shepard's goal all along, but...the goal was always destruction of the reapers and depending upon the way you played the game, Shepard may have always thought that expediency had real consequences that had to be taken into account.  The game doesn't allow for this at all.  And I would say that even a Renegade Shepard would at least stop and think, maybe not care about Geth or EDI, but would care about Joker.  In ME2 Dr. Chakwas has dialogue regarding Joker needing her (but Dr. Chakwas will die sometime, and probably before Joker).  This alone wouldn't be a reason to let the reapers live on and not kill EDI and the Geth, but Shepard would still stop and want an explanation.  This was a bit of a discussion in another thread.  It was the idea that you could possibly see a Renegade making a choice, but not so a Paragon-at least not quickly.  The main problem with either of them deciding upon Destroy or any choice without objection is there's no sense of urgency at the time.

While I would have expected more dialogue.. What if the destroy option as it's presented is a lie?
What if the Destroy option only destroys the Reapers?

Oh, it could be.  But then, I have come to the conclusion that everything's a lie.  The kid shows Anderson choosing Destroy, so it seems the natural choice.  All it does is make the whole "choice" thing seem more stupid. 

I agree there's a lot of evidence for the star kid being synthetic as well.  Maybe it's just a suicidal being that finally found someone willing and able to help it out.  The whole thing just finally comes off as some psychotic nihilistic vision that best belongs in some other game. 

At the point where Shepard gets to the Citadel, it just seems to slowly walk downhill to that "what's the point" final moment where you throw your hands up and figure neither choice matters.  The ending just is despair, on the player's part, on Shepard's part, on the game's part, on the dev's part, and so on.  The star kid basically says that nothing you did mattered, the game finale proves it.  Despair.

Modifié par 3DandBeyond, 08 mai 2012 - 01:56 .

[akenn312]

3DandBeyond wrote...

Voodoo-j wrote...

3DandBeyond wrote...

Destroy-Shepard's goal all along, but...the goal was always destruction of the reapers and depending upon the way you played the game, Shepard may have always thought that expediency had real consequences that had to be taken into account.  The game doesn't allow for this at all.  And I would say that even a Renegade Shepard would at least stop and think, maybe not care about Geth or EDI, but would care about Joker.  In ME2 Dr. Chakwas has dialogue regarding Joker needing her (but Dr. Chakwas will die sometime, and probably before Joker).  This alone wouldn't be a reason to let the reapers live on and not kill EDI and the Geth, but Shepard would still stop and want an explanation.  This was a bit of a discussion in another thread.  It was the idea that you could possibly see a Renegade making a choice, but not so a Paragon-at least not quickly.  The main problem with either of them deciding upon Destroy or any choice without objection is there's no sense of urgency at the time.

While I would have expected more dialogue.. What if the destroy option as it's presented is a lie?
What if the Destroy option only destroys the Reapers?

Oh, it could be.  But then, I have come to the conclusion that everything's a lie.  The kid shows Anderson choosing Destroy, so it seems the natural choice.  All it does is make the whole "choice" thing seem more stupid. 

Exactly, I don't think it was originally meant to be a lie, the kid means what he says. You will destroy all synthetics. That means the Geth Reapers and EDI. Of course Anderson would pick this because he would not think of destroying machines as actual genocide. He would only do what a soldier would do that looks at life down a barrel of a gun and destroy all Synthetic life to save humanity. But again this is the main problem with all the choices. Each one is a mirror of choices on what the Starchild thinks the Illusive Man, Saeren, or Anderson would do. Where is Shepard's choice that he thinks up? Why are these three perspectives the only ideas that exist to destroy the Reapers or stop the cycle?

Where is the abstract choice that goes against these flawed ways of ending the threat?

Maybe that's the problem? Creating synergy was supposed to be that abstract choice but they forgot that they set up Synthesis as Saren's main goal in the first and that goal was considered to be evil.

So I can't for the life of me understand why they would consider Synthesis as the possible best ending when they set up that concept in the first game to be unnatural.

Modifié par akenn312, 08 mai 2012 - 02:38 .